Talk:Smith & Wesson 3000 Shotgun

This is a real gun??? I always thought the "S&W 3000" was just some dumb made up name for crappy spring airsoft shotguns -User:AdAstra2009

So did I-S&Wshooter 04:12, 15 August 2009 (UTC)

That's what happens when a lot of your gun knowledge comes from the craptactular world of airsoft versus real guns!! LOL!! ;) I get irritated when I talk about a real gun and all the guys I talk to look mystified and then someone says "Oh, he's talking about the (insert BS Airsoft name here) and they then all know what I'm talking about. Arggghhhh. The REAL guns of the world aren't built by Tokyo Marui, G&G, Classic Army, et. al but tons of the guys today only know information about those guns. I love it when I get a new handgun and the first thing people ask me is 'how many feet per second?" WTF? The only time I would even remotely know that is PERHAPS if I was handloading a round for a sniper rifle, but not a handgun! LOL!. ;) MoviePropMaster2008 01:37, 10 September 2010 (UTC) PS Just kidding you guys! :D mpm

Actually, some less scrupulous airsoft distributors like Cybergun tack real manufacturer names to things that barely resemble real firearms or, worse yet, things that are something entirely different, ie. the airsoft "S&W 3000" is in fact closer to a Remington 870 (note straight barrel and magazine nut) and what Cybergun tries to pass as Zastava CZ-99 is in fact a replica of a SIG P226. --Seriously Mike (talk) 07:15, 6 December 2012 (EST)

Speaking of airsoft compared to real guns, Im getting really ticked off when you search for a gun on youtube or google only for the video to be some 11 year old giving a 'review' on his stupid airtoy. --AdAstra2009 02:08, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Hello, Yes, the S&W Model 3000 was a real Shotgun. I gave a small detailed history under the Discussion Page of "Sudden Impact" - BC2009

The OP has a valid point: I don't partake or know about airsoft at all, and I was confused when I was reading about the FBI 1986 Shootout on wiki. They referred to the shotgun the perp used as an S&W M3000. Googling it only came up with the airsoft gun. Googling Smith and Wesson Model 3000 came up with only the real shotgun. (recently edited the shootout page for clarity) When talking about this gun, I think the name should really be differentiated (m3000 vs model 3000)--Geckcgt (talk) 19:20, 26 May 2013 (EDT)

Smith & Wesson 3000 Info

Reposted from the Sudden Impact Discussion Page.

A little history of the Smith & Wesson Model 3000 (later Mossberg Model 3000) 12-gauge Pump-action Shotgun. I hope that this will help add a little to the online history of the Smith & Wesson Model 3000 Shotgun, which seems lacking.

Smith and Wesson long held a strong police presence in the firearm market with their line of revolvers, their "Military & Police" model, aka Model 10 was long a standard sidearm for many officers. Smith & Wesson offered a broad market of Police-oriented gear as well as ammunition, adding Shotguns in the mid-to-late 1970s. The Model 3000 was a companion piece to the semi-automatic Model 1000, a gas-operated design, in their product line.

In the April 1983 issue of EAGLE Magazine, a bi-monthly Publication of Command Publications, then Sergeant Gary Paul Johnston reviewed a sample of the then new shotgun. For comparison, it was to be shot next to the Remington Model 870 Pump-action, considered the standard by which new shotguns were being judged.

Where were these differences in the two? Using a fairly new Remington, both shotguns were equipped with 20" rifled sights. This would help reduce friction on critical parts. Where Remington used flat springs, the S&W used coil springs. Parts were simplified, the ejector being mentioned. The S&W's barrel was hammer forged for both strength and precision, with a "taper bore" vs a conventional choke method as found in the 870's barrel.

The one, well-known problem with the Model 870 was being stoppage-prone, when a cartridge would fall onto the carrier and create a frustrating jam. According to the Sales Manager Johnston spoke too, this was specifically engineered out of the 3000's design.

Johnston replicated (with some difficulty he noted) these stoppages with both shotguns, to see how they compared to one another. On the Remington, he had to use both hands on the pump and have the buttstock on the ground to get it cycle. The S&W, he reported cycled and chambered the "jammed" round with relative ease.

So, he went to the next part of the test, comparing S&W's "taper bore" with a Remington Improved Cylinder choked barrel. Given poor weather (gusting wind) at 50yds, he felt they were at a draw using the Federal rifled slugs. Later testing indoors netted 3" groups at 100ft. Moving on to buckshot, was to be of more interest to him as he felt that slugs had limited use in the majority of Police usage. Tight patterns, given that each pellet becomes accountable, was paramount. Again using Federal-brand buckshot, firing four rounds at 50yds, using the standard B-21 large silhouette the Remington put 16 of 36 pellets onto the silhouette body. Repeating with the Smith & Wesson, it put 11 of 36 on the body. Things changed when distance was moved in to 25yds. Both Federal and Remington "00" buckshot was used and performed well, as the full 36 pellets stayed on the paper, but the patterns the S&W printed were tighter overall.

Having used a Remington Model 870 both personally and professionally as a Police Officer, the question would be asked, which is the better gun. He felt it was hard to answer, but winning factor was the "Jam-free" engineering.

At the time, the gun was offered with Blued and Parkerized finishes, could come with a regular stock, or the optional Choate-manufactured (for Smith & Wesson) Pistol-gripped stock or a folding-stock.

That, as I mentioned was in 1983. The movie tie-in of Sudden Impact was obvious, the Smith & Wesson revolver carried by Clint Eastwood was a stand-out co-star, and had been from the beginning. Albert Popwell, the man who played "Horace King" in Sudden Impact, of course had been in all of the previous "Dirty Harry" movies. He finally got to be "The Partner" and was well-rewarded with a Smith & Wesson firearm of speciality, their new Shotgun. Many look at the AutoMag used by Eastwood, and it did stir press back then, but the shotgun was looked over by most.

How is it I believe it was a S&W Model 3000 and not a Mossberg Model 500? Several reasons. I have a Mossberg Circular from an old gun magazine in my files, it has the Model 3000 series in it. This circular was the "New for '86" guns. Mossberg, I believe, acquired the rights from Smith & Wesson, but it didn't stay in their line very long.

A brief summary of the Model 3000 can be found in Leroy Thompson's guide on "Combat Shotguns," (Greenhill Military Manuals, 2002)

Now, for the nitty gritty. If you have the DVD, you can slow-frame through Horace's approach to Harry from the car. The shotgun is "profiled" and you can look at the bolt through the ejection port. It looks more like an 870 rounded bolt than the Model 500 Mossberg, with it's flatter design.

Also, you get an opportunity to look at the feeding port. If you look closely, you'll see the shell elevator is shiny and at the bottom of the port, not recessed into the flat of the bolt like the Mossberg design.

Added by BC2009.

StanTheMan 00:06, 10 September 2010 (UTC)

Airsoft Replica

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Airsoft Smith & Wesson M3000 shotgun

It appears that the same gun is listed on the Remington 870 page. It's an airsoft shotgun listed as a S&W 3000 and a Remington 870, while marked as a Mossberg 590. --Funkychinaman (talk) 02:14, 27 May 2013 (EDT)

Additional Images

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Customized Smith & Wesson 3000 used in Miami Vice (TV Series).