Talk:Aliens: Difference between revisions
Talk:Aliens: Difference between revisions - Internet Movie Firearms Database - Guns in Movies, TV and Video Games
Talk:Aliens: Difference between revisions
A Gerber Mark II fighting knife was memorably used in the knife game scene with Bishop and Hudson.
= Discussion =
==acid blood==
==acid blood==
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==The VP70 is not VP70Z ?==
==The VP70 is not VP70Z ?==
I do not seem to [[Heckler & Koch VP70|VP70]] was the standard type in the movie.This is the type of the figure below?
I do not seem to [[Heckler & Koch VP70|VP70]] was the standard type in the movie.This is the type of the figure below?
[[File:Vp70v1.jpg|300px|thumb|none]]
[[Image:ALSF-VP70.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Atherton displays one of the VP70's.]]
[[Image:ALSF-VP70.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Atherton displays one of the VP70's.]]
--[[User:KINKI'boy|KINKI'boy]] 16:03, 9 April 2013 (JST)
--[[User:KINKI'boy|KINKI'boy]] 16:03, 9 April 2013 (JST)
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==Ithaca in ''The Professionals''==
==Ithaca in ''The Professionals''==
Is it safe to assume [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Professionals_(TV_Series),_The#Ithaca_37_Shotgun this] Ithaca used in ''The Professionals'' is the same one used in ''Aliens''? I can't imagine it's a very common configuration.--19:09, 3 March 2015 (EST)[[User:Quarax|Quarax]] ([[User talk:Quarax|talk]])
Is it safe to assume [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Professionals_(TV_Series),_The#Ithaca_37_Shotgun this] Ithaca used in ''The Professionals'' is the same one used in ''Aliens''? I can't imagine it's a very common configuration.--19:09, 3 March 2015 (EST)[[User:Quarax|Quarax]] ([[User talk:Quarax|talk]])
:It was also used in ''[http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Dempsey_and_Makepeace#Custom_Ithaca_37 Dempsey and Makepeace]''.--[[User:Quarax|Quarax]] ([[User talk:Quarax|talk]]) 20:01, 3 March 2015 (EST)
==Ithaca 37 Hunting version photo==
Should we include a photo of the Ithaca 37 hunting variant, since the prop gun was cut down from one, or is there enough thumbnails as it is? --[[User:Maxman|Maxman]] ([[User talk:Maxman|talk]]) 11:54, 10 January 2016 (EST)
[[Image:IthacaM37.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Ithaca 37 long barrel hunting version - 12 gauge.]]
== Smartgun battery ==
It was also used in ''[http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Dempsey_and_Makepeace#Custom_Ithaca_37 Dempsey and Makepeace]''.--[[User:Quarax|Quarax]] ([[User talk:Quarax|talk]]) 20:01, 3 March 2015 (EST)
I've tracked down an image of the actual popgun used for this (http://www.harryharris.com/popgun.htm), shot off an email to the owner of the site asking permission to use it since it's watermarked and all. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 16:41, 22 August 2017 (EDT)
:Aaaaand dead email. :( [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 16:45, 22 August 2017 (EDT)
::NVM, found another pic. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 16:50, 22 August 2017 (EDT)
A Gerber Mark II fighting knife was memorably used in the knife game scene with Bishop and Hudson.
Discussion
acid blood
Trivia Note: In the Aliens series of movies this weapon always seems to be a hazard. i.e. shooting an alien with this weapon would cause a character to get splattered with acidic blood. This event happens a lot in AVP: Requiem. However, in reality, a direct shotgun blast would NOT splatter any blood "towards the shooter" or "to the sides". The force alone would direct all brain and blood splatter AWAY from the shooter. All one has to do is look a real life crime scene photos of shotgun blasts to the head. All particles or viscera are blown away from the barrel, none are to the front and very little if any is to the sides.
Additional Trivia Note: As the previous trivia note says, little 'splashback' if any would be expected. That said, the Aliens are well known to be extremely tough beasties, so who's to say parts of the body were not damaged very much by the shotgun blasts? This could have resulted in the 'splashback' as softer tissue and blood rebounds off harder bone / chitinous tissue...
Remember reading in a book or online when I was in school that the aliens had extremely high "blood pressure" resulting in them pretty much exploding when shot and in effect turning them into a walking anti personnel mine.
Even if they are under pressure, the blast would blow the blood AWAY. I shot a pressurized Paint balloon with a shotgun for a demo once. Sure it flew everywhere EXCEPT where I was because the blast of the shotgun forced the particulate matter in the other direction. I am very wary of any theory that has the alien blood at such high pressure that it can overcome the kinetic energy of a shotgun blast. Wouldn't happen.MoviePropMaster2008 21:09, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
I really love it when folks say "wouldn't happen" when referencing a science fiction movie with big fake ships, fake alien creatures, and giant fantasy guns that weigh about 45 pounds each. It's fantasy guys. Come on. They tear a synthetic person in half, would his blood splatter the way it did when his body flew in 2 different directions? Aliens are not real. How do we know they fake fantasy high pressure acidic blood isn't magnetic for 5 seconds once it is exposed to oxygen? I mean, it's acid right? Would that happen?
In accordance with the statement above mine, the aliens blood is in fact, highly pressurized. Coincidence? I think not. I'd think of it as more of a natural deterrent, or biological "fail-safe" due to the fact that if a Xenomorph is attacked and killed, or even injured, the aggressor will pay the price.
Physicist's note: According to the character Bishop, the creatures' blood completely oxidizes as of their death. Presumably, this is due to direct exposure to external atmospheric conditions, but that's just a moot guess at a fictitious alien. In any case, oxidation, along with its reduction counterpart, is the neutralization of an acidic compound of a which results in the release of chemical energy (also known as redoxing).
Familiar examples of this in the real world include the process in cellular respiration that oxidizes glucose to carbon dioxide and the corresponding reduction of oxygen to water. An example of a counterpart to the process is its inverse in photosynthesis. In agriculture, ammonia is oxidized into nitric acid--which, incidentally, is also useful as an explosive, but I'll get to that. It's the fundamental reaction behind an electrochemical battery. In some cases, it releases an enormous amount of heat.
Suppose all of the glucose and oxygen in your blood were to suddenly redox. You would have a lot of energy on hand, and I suspect it would really hurt. The impression that our android hero gives me is that these aliens are walking fertilizer bombs, which is hardly the worst thing I can think of (we've got the equivalent and worse in many insect species on Earth), but still an excellent defense mechanism. I don't think it's the shockwave of the shotgun that is causing the backsplash of acid, it would be the onset of the oxidation of the acid itself.
Basic rational thinking requires some reason to believe in the truth of a premise before believing in it: sure, it's possible xenomorphs are walking bombs (though it wouldn't really be much of a survival trait since it would mean even minor injuries had ridiculous fatality rates, and high-pressure blood would probably rupture their organs while providing no meaningful advantage) but there's no reason to believe it is anything but a mistake. If we were explaining it as if we were scientists who lived within the movie's world then sure, we'd have to treat the splashing acid as a direct physical observation which required some kind of explanation, but we treat the movie as a movie made by human beings who aren't necessarily trying to come up with a physically possible world. If the aliens' blood is simply acid that functions as blood, it should not behave the way it does.
The other problem would be, if the aliens' blood is already undergoing an extremely energetic chemical reaction due to their death, how would it remain the incredibly reactive universal solvent it's shown as? Are we supposed to believe it's a special non-conservation-of-energy reaction? I mean never mind that real acids aren't the Hollywood anti-existence fluid that xenomorphs are apparently filled with. Evil Tim (talk) 14:10, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
As stated in another discussion below, I think this is something being (seriously) over-thought about. StanTheMan (talk) 22:39, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
let me add another sunny point about trying to kill the alien with a flame thrower a chemist friend of mine and this was also covered in the aliens colonial marines technical manual that if the acid blood contained hydrofluorocarbons it would be like throwing a can of deodorant into a fire a nasty boom would ensue and then the acid blood splatter would cover the aggressor remember flamethrowers are at best short ranged weapons --Seekerdude (talk) 18:48, 26 November 2014 (EST)
Hydrofluorocarbons are stable chemicals used as refrigerants, what would those be doing in the Aliens' blood in the first place? And a decent RL flamethrower (as in a liquid pump rather than a Hollywood gas-thrower) has a range of several hundred yards.
In general it's best not to try to subject Alien blood to real chemistry. It's Hollywood Acid, which is liquid fire when it touches people and anti-existence fluid when it touches things. Evil Tim (talk) 19:59, 26 November 2014 (EST)
Actually, that's it! Alien blood is phlogiston. Mystery solved. Evil Tim (talk) 20:14, 26 November 2014 (EST)
Keep existing or change to new ones?--Predator20 16:26, 15 December 2009 (UTC)
-I'd say keep the existing M41A, if only because I uploaded it, and I like seeing the receivers.-protoAuthor 01:56, 16 December 2009 (UTC)
Those are two of my favourite fictional weapons.
I really don't like the picture of the M41A that we have on the page. It is an airsoft replica (I saw it on an airsoft site once), not one of the real guns. Whereas this picture...
...is one of the actual screen-used M41As from the series (even though it's still painted black from being used in Alien³, unlike the ones in Aliens which were still green). I realize it's low-res, but the pic was taken by Dan Shea in 2002 (when most people were still on 56K and everything loaded slower). As best I know, this is the only one of the pulse rifles that Bapty & Co. has kept in its original configuration. -MT2008 16:13, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
The second pic the one labeled M41A new I took it from the DVD. Same thing with the M240 Flamethrower.--Predator20 16:16, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
Ah, OK. Then we should at least use that one, I think. Screen-used gun pictures are always preferable to stuff like airsoft replica pictures. Though I wonder if we should take the LMO picture and use it on the Alien³ page? (since it's still in the same color scheme seen in that movie) -MT2008 16:18, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
Sounds good to me. --Predator20 16:42, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
All of the pictures in this section are screen used. I took mine from the DVD as well.-protoAuthor 02:22, 14 December 2010 (UTC)
Hicks or Hudson
In the description of the Ithaca Stakeout, it says that it was Hicks that shot the alien in the mouth as they were trying to close the door of the APC. But wasn't it Hudson who did that? Wouldn't it make more sense considering it was Hudson that got burned? I thought Hicks was busy trying to close the door. Or did I "misremember" it? Can someone confirm?
Michael Biehn is Hicks. Hudson got splashed, even though he didn't fire the gun.-protoAuthor 22:12, 18 December 2009 (UTC)
Hicks initially tried to close the door himself, then Vasquez and Hudson go to help. --Predator20 22:19, 18 December 2009 (UTC)
Error creating thumbnail: File missingHicks after shooting the alien, Hudson was on the left and Vasquez was on the right (whose hand you see in the screenshot on the main page.) Hicks does gets sprayed later when one tries to get in the elevator.
Advertising?
Can we please remove the tasteless advertising from the Pulse Rifle? This is a DB, not a forum, if anything it belongs in the discussion tab. Scratch that I AM removing it, it will be in the discussion tab. --Furious Oyster
Lage Mfg
Lage Manufacturing in currently working on a real live fire replica called the Max-41A. The MAX-41A is a combination submachinegun in 9mm and short barreled 12 gauge shotgun designed to resemble the M-41A Pulse Rifle from the movie.
Submachinegun component is a NFA registered SWD M-11/9 with an Anthony Smith style Suomi upper receiver. Magazine used is a Suomi "Coffin" magazine that holds 50 rounds of 9mm. Shotgun component is a NFA registered Remington 870 short barreled shotgun and holds two rounds in the magazine and one in the chamber.
BATFE letter was obtained confirming this is a legal configuration, prior to manufacturing.
The MAX-41A is a prototype that is currently being tested. My main concern is durability when fired with 12 guage buckshot and slugs. So far, most testing has been with light birdshot loads. The subgun component has run flawlessly.
The bullet counter has a minor problem when firing in full auto, only counts half of the rounds fired. When firing singles, there is no problem. Should be fixable.
The test phase is expected to take about a year.
The Bullet counters do add some tension in the combat scenes
Link to photo's and video in use. Not going into production so will remain a concept gun. If many law enforcement agencies around the world hadn't up-gunned to 5.56mm, it could have had a market as a dual weapon, 9mm lethal load and 12 gauge less lethal such as baton round, gas round or TASER round.
Pulse Rifle Sound
Mainly a trivial question, but does anybody know how they obtained the sounds for the pulse rifles? I've always wanted to know...
Original Pulse Rile
The original plan was to use an MP5 for the Pulse Rifle, but James Cameron didn't like the muzzle flash. The Thompson gave the look he wanted. I haven't seen the movie in years, but one of the Marines is suppose to be wearing a t shirt with the MP5 Pulse Rifle on it. The dvd extras has a drawing of the MP5 Pulse Rifle. David.
I noticed that when I saw The DVD extras too and saw the drawing of the Pulse Rifle, I noticed a MP5A3 stock, but didn't know they were originally going to use a MP5. That's a cool bit of trivia. :) - Mr. Wolf 22:06, 25 April 2011 (CDT)
Colonial Marines
is there really a branch of the military called the Colonial marines? I cant seem to get a staight answer from anybody. I know that probably means no, there isnt, but for the sake of making myself look less like an idiot, i had to ask.--Gunner5
The British used to have a Corps Of Colonial Marines in the 1800s, but as far as I know, there's no such thing in the world today.--Leigh Burne 02:36, 29 February 2012 (CST)
i belive they use the term colonial as they protect the intrests of america ie there colonlys in deep space the Colonial marines techinal manual goes into great detail over this (User:Seekerdude 29/02/2012 16:23 GMT )
In fiction, Battlestar Galactica had Colonial Marines as well, but they were less of an expeditionary force and assumed more traditional Marine roles, like security, boarding parties, etc. --Funkychinaman 10:34, 29 February 2012 (CST)
Sulaco's turrets
While not really worth noting on the page, the guns on the top and bottom of the Sulaco are technically dressed-up 35 mm Oerlikon KDA autocannons, since the turrets are made from the guns of a 1/35 Tamiya Flakpanzer Gepard model stuck on a Tamiya M60A2 tank turret (top) and the original Gepard turret (bottom). Evil Tim (talk) 10:57, 27 November 2012 (EST)
The VP70 is not VP70Z ?
I do not seem to VP70 was the standard type in the movie.This is the type of the figure below?
Recently spotted that there are partially stripped Lewis guns with the barrel shroud removed - revealing the cooling vanes - in the armoury racks.
--Sidewinder Forge (talk) 13:48, 8 January 2014 (EST)
In the initial pan across the weapons rack before the crew wakes, the camera passes in front of the area where they are but it's too dark to see anything. Later in the Readyline scene just after Frost passes out the Flamethrowers you can glimpse them behind Drake (Smartgunner).
Here's one stripped showing the 'radiator' that's clearly visible in the film along with the distinctive receiver bottom shape.
Hicks' shotgun
Does anyone know what's going on with Hicks' shotgun? The receiver is definitely from a hunting variant since it has engravings in it, but the barrel is apparently not a field barrel (no ribbing). It's also got an elaborate front sight. There's pictures of it here.Quarax (talk) 16:33, 26 August 2014 (EDT)
Could just be a cobbling together of several guns, much like how many M16s/ARs will actually be a mish-mash of several pieces and components from various and differing rifles. Of course it's seen sometimes in other guns as well (FALs and the SIG P226 in 2 Fast 2 Furious being a couple of other examples). I will grant in the case of this kind of weapon it's a bit unusual, but certainly not something beyond the realm of possibility I would think. Movie armorers seem to build-up firearms that are hybrids of several components put together whenever needed/desired plenty, so again, I think that's all it really is here. StanTheMan (talk) 22:04, 26 August 2014 (EDT)
Do you have any idea where the barrel is from?Quarax (talk) 22:07, 26 August 2014 (EDT)
Launchers?
ARWEN 37
In the dropship, Ripley runs past a rack of ARWEN 37s on the way to her seat as she's carrying Newt.
I took a look and there didn't seem to be any. --Ben41 (talk) 01:47, 27 August 2014 (EDT)
Are you sure? According to this guy, it's "real dark and its real quick".--Quarax (talk) 13:43, 27 August 2014 (EDT)
Alright, I just looked myself and I think they're on the wall right next to the cockpit door and some Pulse Rifles.--Quarax (talk) 13:54, 27 August 2014 (EDT)
Thanks. I thought it was those things to the right of Pulse Rifles in the first picture. You can see what looks to be a drum magazine.--Quarax (talk) 19:34, 27 August 2014 (EDT)
Nope, those are flamethrowers, never mind then. If it's in the movie, you can't see it. There are some behind the scenes pictures of it though. I guess they at least considered using it.--Quarax (talk) 19:36, 27 August 2014 (EDT)
M40 grenades
If a button on the tip activates the detonator when pressed, how do users keep from blowing the gun and themselves up when loading the launcher? Spartan198 (talk) 02:47, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
They did think of this, as there's a green safety cap that must be removed before the button can be depressed. --Ben41 (talk) 03:32, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
I distinctly remember Gorman flipping off the cap with his thumb before he and Vasquez detonate the round. So is the cap designed to crush on impact and hit the detonator? Because that assumes you'd only be using it on armored targets. --Funkychinaman (talk) 11:18, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
Eh, depending on how interplanetary rules of war work, that might even be a deliberate feature. Doubt that was the idea, mind you. But if the cap isn't removed on loading, it's probably an inertial detonator to stop it exploding if it hits an unarmoured target or light cover. If it is removed before loading, then it would have some serious not-blowing-up issues. Evil Tim (talk) 13:23, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
That's the other thing, does it have a safety that prevents it from arming itself before it flies a certain distance, like 40mm grenades do? --Funkychinaman (talk) 15:08, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
The more I think about it, the more I get the distinct feeling whoever wrote that scene didn't quite get that UBGLs don't fire hand grenades. Evil Tim (talk) 15:13, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
And we're just over thinking it. They just wanted something they use to dramatically commit suicide with. --Funkychinaman (talk) 15:27, 22 September 2014 (EDT)
No, over thinking it would be questioning why a corporal (Hicks) would have the authority to order use of the Sulaco's nuclear weapons. Spartan198 (talk) 12:10, 26 November 2014 (EST)
Well, it was a military ship, and he was the highest ranking military... person left. Let me put it this way, otherwise, would it make more sense to give the control of the nukes to Lieutenant Gorman? --Funkychinaman (talk) 20:58, 26 November 2014 (EST)
Interesting factoid
So as might be known by some, James Remar was originally cast as Hicks but was fired after he was caught in possession of illegal substances. Anyway, apparently a live round ended up on set and in one of the weapons somehow and Remar subsequently blew a hole into an adjacent stage where Little Shop of Horrors was being filmed.[1] (scroll down to Apone's bio for the brief story) Spartan198 (talk) 04:22, 6 October 2014 (EDT)
Ithaca in The Professionals
Is it safe to assume this Ithaca used in The Professionals is the same one used in Aliens? I can't imagine it's a very common configuration.--19:09, 3 March 2015 (EST)Quarax (talk)
Should we include a photo of the Ithaca 37 hunting variant, since the prop gun was cut down from one, or is there enough thumbnails as it is? --Maxman (talk) 11:54, 10 January 2016 (EST)
I've tracked down an image of the actual popgun used for this (http://www.harryharris.com/popgun.htm), shot off an email to the owner of the site asking permission to use it since it's watermarked and all. Evil Tim (talk) 16:41, 22 August 2017 (EDT)
Aaaaand dead email. :( Evil Tim (talk) 16:45, 22 August 2017 (EDT)
NVM, found another pic. Evil Tim (talk) 16:50, 22 August 2017 (EDT)
