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Talk:Metal Gear Solid 2: Sons of Liberty: Difference between revisions
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::what?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 11:52, 10 December 2015 (EST) | ::what?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 11:52, 10 December 2015 (EST) | ||
:You were complaining about the size of the railgun entry, so I told you why it's so long. Railguns are ballistic weapons currently undergoing real-life research, so they're included in this wiki. Fortune's railgun might actually be plausible, except it's got no place to load in new ammo. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 21:57, 23 December 2015 (EST) | :You were complaining about the size of the railgun entry, so I told you why it's so long. Railguns are ballistic weapons currently undergoing real-life research, so they're included in this wiki. Fortune's railgun might actually be plausible, except it's got no place to load in new ammo. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 21:57, 23 December 2015 (EST) | ||
::That and that if it was made of anything more substantial than plywood a human being could not reasonably be expected to either pick it up or operate it :P Anyway, the reason I let it stay is because it was an actual physical prop, it gets a lot of screentime, and there's a lot to say about it. By the definition you're using we'd have to include just about any fictional gun that fires bullets using chemical propellants since guns that fire bullets with chemical propellants are real. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 04:59, 24 December 2015 (EST) | |||
Latest revision as of 09:59, 24 December 2015
There is also a FAMAS in a flashback sequence later in the game.--74.177.135.148 19:09, 21 March 2010 (UTC)
- Yep, when Solid Snake recounts what happened on the Tanker to Raiden in the Plant chapter. For some reason it's a higher-res model than the one in PS1 version of MGS1, which is odd since the Twin Snakes (which features high-res models of guns used in MGS1) wouldn't be released until 2004. Maybe the footage from that sequence is from an internal alpha or beta before the game was completed?
- Guess you might be bit too young to remember -- the MGS2 trailers from 2000 showed Snake, and ONLY Snake, on board the tanker, and at one point using a FAMAS. Throughout the final release of Sons of Liberty and Substance, these trailers were used in several places, like the Tanker Incident as Pliskin explained it. Other footage from VR Missions (1999) (or Special Missions, depending on where you lived in the world) was featured as well. -- Orca*
Also one reason why it was taken of, was that there is no reason to have FAMAS in Tanker. Only Genome Soldiers used it as their primary weapon in MGS1 and marines in tanker used M4A1. But it would have been cool easter egg though --SilentwarriorX 02:35, 29 June 2010 (UTC)
- Well, to a lesser extent, maybe, but one could also point out that Olga uses a USP; a german-made sidearm that is incompatible with the rest of the Gurlukovich soldiers' gear. It was most likely a tech demo piece; a virtual weapon that provided a frame work on which to build the M4A1 and AKS-74u's automatic fire and FPV animations. Totaly would've been a fun easter egg. --Orca*
- Strictly speaking she had the USP as a backup weapon; Snake makes her toss a Makarov over the side. The Wierd It 11:57, 29 January 2011 (UTC)
- Never mind how using a subcompact pistol like the Makarov as a primary with a full-size USP equipped with a UTL backing it up makes little sense. Spartan198 21:13, 27 June 2011 (CDT)
- Hey, it's better than designing a giant robot that has twin M61s it can't fire both of at once and has to throw itself completely off balance to aim at anything. Poor RAY. Evil Tim 21:28, 27 June 2011 (CDT)
- Yep, Metal Gear RAY would have been better had it mounted the the M61s in its "shoulders" as well, so it could use them against enemies at the front. Otherwise, I would think that RAY's water cutter (which has infinite ammunition for as long as the pumping equipment can hold out while the unit is immersed in water) was intended to be the primary mode of attack against enemies in the front and the M61s are meant to provide harrassing/covering fire to the sides. The missiles that RAY carries are supposed to supplement firepower in any direction. The awkward positioning of the M61 only becomes apparent when fighting a single opponent. --Mazryonh 01:21, 28 June 2011 (CDT)
Fun Fact
The game was originally to have featured the Russian SPP-1M Underwater pistol, since the game originally intended to have an higher emphasis on water segments. However, since the water gameplay in relation to sneaking gameplay proved to not work at all, the water segments were just about totally axed and as a result, the game shrank significantly in size and need for a underwater gun was terminated. Some code indicating the gun's inclusion to game can be found in the infamous MGS2 demo that the Zone of The Enders came with. The code seems complete enough to fire four rounds in quick succession (as SPP-1 has 4 barrels with a cartridge in each), but still uses reload animation of USP.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5k0XEU-hYo#t=1m19s
TrickShotFinn (talk) 08:19, 14 January 2015 (EST)
- I know I would have appreciated an SPP-1M during the swimming sessions in the Shell 2 Core Basement levels, if only to get rid of the annoying underwater mines. Still, it's disappointing how much was cut from MGS2 (such as two members of Dead Cell, Chinaman and Oldboy, the latter of whom became The End in MGS3). Kojima Productions should look into releasing an uncut version on a more modern engine. --Mazryonh (talk) 23:47, 14 January 2015 (EST)
- Shame a lot of those weapons got cut out (though I'm a bit surprised Fatman apparently planted a bomb onboard the Discovery. Guess he's even crazier than we thought). BTW, What's the "M spray?" The only thing I can gather is that apparently using it on the soldiers has them reacting as if they were shot in the head. Pokeria1 (talk) 14:45, 19 February 2015 (EST)
- Mace Spray? TrickShotFinn (talk) 04:57, 20 February 2015 (EST)
- Shame a lot of those weapons got cut out (though I'm a bit surprised Fatman apparently planted a bomb onboard the Discovery. Guess he's even crazier than we thought). BTW, What's the "M spray?" The only thing I can gather is that apparently using it on the soldiers has them reacting as if they were shot in the head. Pokeria1 (talk) 14:45, 19 February 2015 (EST)
Sound suppressors in this game
Does anyone know who might sell or make the "totally radical" suppressors seen in this game? I don't think a suppressor with its own iron sights (as the one used by the M9 tranquilizer variant seen in this game) or one with its own underslung laser-sight mounting (as seen on the AKS-74U suppressor in this game) is exactly "standard issue." Furthermore, is the iron-sight-suppressor/slide lock combo really a Knights Armament Corporation item?
This game is probably also the one of the few games of its fame level to actually feature sound suppressors on most everyone who has to use a gun indoors (in real life you do this to protect your hearing), and quite a lot of people who patrol outside do so as well. Even so, I find it odd that several of the clearing teams don't use suppressors at all, unless something in the helmets they wear acts as hearing protection. Was the widespread deployment of sound suppressors on most guards who patrol indoors a conscious design choice on the development team's part? Anyone got some interviews that specifically say this? --Mazryonh 17:37, 2 April 2010 (UTC)
Erm... Ear defenders are a pretty standard bit of military kit; it's not too hard to assume they're wearing them underneath the helmet. The Wierd It 09:19, 3 April 2010 (UTC)
Article
This one's on my To Do list with the other MGS games, so don't worry too much about it being abysmally formatted: I'm going to fix that when I get around to screencapping it. Evil Tim 21:34, 27 June 2011 (CDT)
- That's good news. I'm looking forward to it. Don't forget to include the strange guns of the Cypher UCAVs or the turret guns in this game; are they just M4A1s with Beta C-Mags attached or something else? --Mazryonh 01:21, 28 June 2011 (CDT)
- No idea, last time I played MGS2 was long before I'd be looking for something like that, I'm afraid. Evil Tim 01:26, 28 June 2011 (CDT)
Laser sight on Snake's XM9
Hey guys,
Can anyone here identify the laser sight model fitted on Snake's XM9?
The main cover art shows it rather clearly. I have not been able to identify it though I am sure it exists because Yoji Shinkawa always uses exisitng weapons.
Thank you.
Source of new screenshots?
Which version of MGS2 are the new screenshots coming from? Are they being taken with a capture card connected to a PS2 running the original PS2 version, or the HD re-release on an HD console? If they are from the PC version (possibly Konami's worst PC port of all time, compared to the one they released for Silent Hill 3), then I must applaud the uploader for getting it to work so well, since that version had minimal keyboard-and-mouse support, and had many graphical bugs (such as some VR enemies missing many textures, beams from laser sights not being visible in 3rd person--I'll admit this is more realistic for low-power lasers under most conditions but this wasn't the case in the original PS2 release--and the black "cinematic bars" being translucent rather than opaque). Anyway, it's good to see this game's selection of screenshots finally being fleshed out. Any chance screenshots from the VR missions will be included too?--Mazryonh (talk) 14:06, 29 June 2014 (EDT)
- I'm running the HD version on a 360 to a capture card. I dunno about doing VR Mission stuff, but I'll try.-protoAuthor 12:26, 30 June 2014 (EDT)
Good to hear. If at all possible, could you make and upload screenshots of the following things?
- The "too close to a wall or other obstruction while trying to aim" animation for both handguns and long guns.
- Guards using tactical flashlights that cause Raiden/Snake to cast shadows through a wall or other intervening barrier.
- Clearing teams and their unique gear (this is likely the only way you can get to see the SPAS-12 in this game without playing VR missions).
- P90s in the hands of Arsenal Tengus (one cutscene prominently features this, and you could just stand around in Arsenal Gear's Jejunum section blocking shots with Raiden's HF blade to get a good shot of Tengus using them). You could also take a screenshot firing his explosive-round-equipped P90 at Ocelot only to have the rounds veer off and explode in the distance. It would also be funny if you took a shot of a P90-equipped Tengu while spraying him in the face with the coolant spray--I always did think it funny how their gas masks were apparently fake.
- The Bravo Team of the SEALs emptying their M4s full-auto into Fortune, which is very unrealistic given how limited full-auto is for real-life applications most of the time, especially if it's not a dedicated machine gun or SAW.
- Raiden following Snake with his SOCOM pistol as they are surrounded by Arsenal Tengus (this highlights how strange it is for him not to be shown with his AKS-74u instead).
If you want to get clear shots of the FAMAS rather than just take them from the somewhat-blurred cutscene images, you'll have to take one from the Genola bosses. --Mazryonh (talk) 17:22, 30 June 2014 (EDT)
- Hmm, good progress so far. Here's a small tip; if you want to get a screenshot of a guard using a Makarov PM without going through the hassle of engaging them in combat or getting the Stealth Camo, you have a couple options. First up is when Raiden is wearing a Gurlukovich guard's BDU disguise. While disguised, you can go down to the lowest level of the Shell 1 core and cause a disturbance. Make sure someone doesn't see you making that disturbance, or it'll lead to an Alert rather than a Caution phase (the latter of which is what you want). Once a Caution phase is triggered (make sure your cover isn't blown), the game will spawn in a couple guards with ballistic shields and Makarovs. As long as your cover isn't blown you can stand beside them and use your FPV to get a good look at their Makarov pistols. The only disadvantage about this is that your FPV at this point is covered with the silhuoette of the BDU's balaclava, unless you opt to use the Stealth Camo.
- Another option can be found in the Tanker Chapter. Once you make it over to the Port side of the Engine Room (and have not taken out all the guards patrolling in the middle of the Engine Room) you can look out towards the Starboard side of the Engine Room and cause a disturbance to get the game to spawn in guards with Makarovs and Shields. As long as you took out the guard who repaired the door to the Port side of the Engine Room, no guards will spawn in behind the vantage point I mentioned. You can keep taking out guards spawned by the Caution phase, one or two at a time, to spawn in more (since MGS2 spawns infinite extra guards during Alert phases and Caution phases if corpses are discovered), and you can get a good look at the Makarovs with Snake's binoculars that way. --Mazryonh (talk) 21:47, 2 July 2014 (EDT)
If possible, could you upload screenshots with caption of Snake identify Gurlukovich soldier using AKS-74u in the beginning of Tanker Chapter? I think it will make a nice trivia. -- Johnny Akiba (talk) 10:50, 5 July 2014 (EDT)
about the railgun
isn't there some rule about how you can't (or shouldn't or something) add articles about fictional weapons? Railguns do kinda exsist in real-life but they aren't close to what's seen in MGS2, so why is there a long-ass entry here about it?--AnActualAK47 (talk) 09:23, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- That's "articles" as in entire gun pages for them. Since it's only one weapon, it's reasonably convincing looking and there was a physical prop made, and there's plenty we can say about it, it's good enough to include for trivia purposes. Evil Tim (talk) 09:48, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- I don't really mind the entry, i was just asking. Really though, it doesn't seem like all the rules are followed anyway, with all the snark you know?--AnActualAK47 (talk) 09:50, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- That rule is mainly about not making fun of live-action actors, it doesn't really apply to videogames. But yeah, it's OK to feature a fictional weapon if there's something worth saying about it, as long as at least some of the weapons are real. Evil Tim (talk) 09:53, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- Does that mean i can't make fun of, for example, Nolan North on the Uncharted page?--AnActualAK47 (talk) 10:52, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- Well, it's not like the things he does in the game are his idea. Not sure how a voice actor would really come up anyway, unless you're doing something like pointing to two men in the same corridor voiced by Steven Jay Blum (which isn't making fun of the actor himself anyway, just stupid choices related to him :P) Evil Tim (talk) 22:10, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- Does that mean i can't make fun of, for example, Nolan North on the Uncharted page?--AnActualAK47 (talk) 10:52, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- That rule is mainly about not making fun of live-action actors, it doesn't really apply to videogames. But yeah, it's OK to feature a fictional weapon if there's something worth saying about it, as long as at least some of the weapons are real. Evil Tim (talk) 09:53, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- I don't really mind the entry, i was just asking. Really though, it doesn't seem like all the rules are followed anyway, with all the snark you know?--AnActualAK47 (talk) 09:50, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- The entries on this page are long because screenshots for the HD version of this game aren't forthcoming yet. There are parts of the text in each entry that would normally go into the captions for screenshot thumbnails. So in effect the long text is a placeholder for the screenshots. Fortune's Railgun lacked any way to reload ammunition in this game though. --Mazryonh (talk) 22:35, 9 December 2015 (EST)
- what?--AnActualAK47 (talk) 11:52, 10 December 2015 (EST)
- You were complaining about the size of the railgun entry, so I told you why it's so long. Railguns are ballistic weapons currently undergoing real-life research, so they're included in this wiki. Fortune's railgun might actually be plausible, except it's got no place to load in new ammo. --Mazryonh (talk) 21:57, 23 December 2015 (EST)
- That and that if it was made of anything more substantial than plywood a human being could not reasonably be expected to either pick it up or operate it :P Anyway, the reason I let it stay is because it was an actual physical prop, it gets a lot of screentime, and there's a lot to say about it. By the definition you're using we'd have to include just about any fictional gun that fires bullets using chemical propellants since guns that fire bullets with chemical propellants are real. Evil Tim (talk) 04:59, 24 December 2015 (EST)