Talk:Battlefield 1: Difference between revisions
Talk:Battlefield 1: Difference between revisions - Internet Movie Firearms Database - Guns in Movies, TV and Video Games
Talk:Battlefield 1: Difference between revisions
:::::[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8aAXsJRzTM This recent ForgottenWeapons video is rather relevant here.] [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 18:32, 3 February 2018 (EST)
:::::[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z8aAXsJRzTM This recent ForgottenWeapons video is rather relevant here.] [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 18:32, 3 February 2018 (EST)
::::::Although I am a big fan of Forgotten Weapons Ian's definitions in that video have a some problems, chiefly due to the fact that he is attempting to create a scale using terminology that did not all exist in the same period. There are also some obvious holes, such as in this case the 08/15 does not fit into any of the categories based on his criteria. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 18:54, 3 February 2018 (EST)
::::::Although I am a big fan of Forgotten Weapons Ian's definitions in that video have a some problems, chiefly due to the fact that he is attempting to create a scale using terminology that did not all exist in the same period. There are also some obvious holes, such as in this case the 08/15 does not fit into any of the categories based on his criteria. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 18:54, 3 February 2018 (EST)
:::::I'm not sure how you're defining LMG, Commando, they're usually crew-served (gunner + ammo carrier, the main difference is the ammo carrier isn't carrying the tripod), isn't it the more vague "automatic rifle" concept where it can conceivably be operated by a single soldier rather than LMG? I mean the Chauchat was specifically designed to have an ammo carrier, and the Lewis wasn't exactly portable. And hell, the exemplar of the GPMG, the MG42, would happily kick your ass if you tried to fire it offhand, the M60 wasn't based on it because they wanted it shoulderable like the BAR. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 01:36, 4 February 2018 (EST)
Seriously. This is a good change for once, other than Battlefield mod and fictional "Iron Storm" (2002). This is a first World War 1 FPS comes from a major game publisher.Alex Vostox (talk)
Yeah, it's got some nice Steampunk elements (ala Dishonored) too, but tbh im more pumped about this than Infinite Warfare, even the CoD 4 remaster looked better imo.--Death Shadow20 (talk) 13:00, 7 May 2016 (EDT)
I was really hoping to see 1944 next, but I gotta say that this looks amazing. Perhaps the first after this is 1944. --CnC Fin (talk) 13:27, 7 May 2016 (EDT)
It looks alright, the graphics are damn good though, that's for sure.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 13:28, 7 May 2016 (EDT)
Let's hope they bring one of the MANLIEST element of the World War 1..The MUSTACHE! Alex Vostox (talk)
Every time you rank up your character's moustache gets slightly bigger? Evil Tim (talk) 14:42, 7 May 2016 (EDT)
I'm going to be really disappointed if they don't have this in the game--John Ryder (talk) 03:34, 8 May 2016 (EDT)
You've reached Rank 100. You've unlocked... The Handlebar.--Bad Boy (talk) 01:50, 9 May 2016 (EDT)
It's gonna be a good year for FPS games. I can't wait for this and Infinite Warfare (that must be illegal). As some of you guys mentioned, World War I games are rarely done and it's nice to see a triple A publisher try their hand at it. WWI is such a sorely underused setting, so much potential too. And I love space and science fiction, so Infinite Warfare has me covered there. --PyramidHead (talk) 02:24, 9 May 2016 (EDT)
This game reminds me that i want to see a CoD of BF that takes place during the korean war.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 02:46, 9 May 2016 (EDT)
Italian Rifle
It does look like it's designed after a Carcano 1891 Cavalry Carbine, but the rifle is way too long. Mr. Wolf (talk) 23:09, 7 May 2016 (EDT)
Maybe it's a inaccurately sized model? Judging from DICE's rendering accuracy (cough cough ARX 160), it could be the case.
Is that cough getting in the way of you signing your posts, mysterious contributor?--AnActualAK47 (talk) 16:43, 8 May 2016 (EDT)
It isn't a Carcano, the stock is the wrong shape, there is no external magazine, no folding bayonet, and the end cap on the stock is wrong. C&Rsenal did a brakdown of the trailer and their oppinion on this rifle is that it is just a place holder and will eventually be a Carcano Cavalry Carbine, but it seems that currently the model is a modified Mauser 1898. --commando552 (talk) 18:34, 8 May 2016 (EDT)
Hrm, interesting. Mr. Wolf (talk) 19:26, 9 May 2016 (EDT)
And, though it's just me, the barrel on it seems extremely too long and thin. This leads me to believe it IS supposed to be the Carcano, but just absurdly disproportionate. Jaxxons11 (talk) 19:38, 15 May 2016 (EDT)
I agree, it looks like they have mistaken the length of the Carbine for the full length M91 --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 20:20, 15 May 2016 (EDT)
MG 15?
So, there was a short teaser released few days ago, and it showed Bergmann MG 15nA light machine gun. I came here to add that to the images but it appears that someone inserted MG 15 instead of MG 15nA. I changed the name/image and added new screenshot, but if there is an image that contains MG 15 as well as MG 15nA, feel free to add that again. Zzang1847 (talk)
What's this rifle
EA just had their E3 stream. It was really lame and not enough ME: Andromeda footage (i've been waiting 3 years for some gameplay, move yer butts!) There was a new trailer for BF1 though showing DICE's lack of taste in music. There's gonna be a livestream of bored looking people playing to soon.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 17:09, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
I assume it was used during WW1?--AnActualAK47 (talk) 18:09, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
I don't if it was or was not. Mr. Wolf (talk) 18:25, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
I just hope that the Winchester 1895 shows up.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 18:40, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
It was used by France, and is limited by Russia and by the United Kingdom. Some French versions have been converted into a full-auto and are equipped with extended magazines. --Slon95 (talk) 18:57, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
What I really hope doesn't happen with this game is have tons of rare and little used semi auto rifles and SMGs inexplicably in the hands of common infantrymen, just so the game can still have the feel of Battlefield without modern automatic weapons. --PyramidHead (talk) 19:32, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
I hope they keep it authentic with the Nagant jaming all the time.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 20:17, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
More gameplay here.--Quarax (talk) 23:33, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
About the only thing that makes me worried so far is the aircraft seem ludicrously tough, in these alpha games you have people slamming them headlong into the ground and flying them through buildings without destroying them. I guess that might be a balance thing because they're slower and so easier to hit from the ground, but still. Evil Tim (talk) 12:07, 1 July 2016 (EDT)
I don't think the collision physics for airplanes has been finalized yet, but I do hope they stay more resilient when touching the ground than BF4's instantly-dead jets. Alex T Snow (talk) 18:04, 1 July 2016 (EDT)
Back in Battlefield 1942: Desert Combat the AC-130 was kind of infamous for having so much health it could actually fly straight through the chimneys on the El Alamein map and survive. It might be they just jacked up their health for the early builds because they wanted people who had no idea how to fly them to still have fun. Evil Tim (talk) 21:25, 1 July 2016 (EDT)
So I added bunch of new weapons that came out from the second gameplay trailer, and I need some help identifying this shotgun. I know that there is a confirmation that Winchester M1897 "Trench Gun" is going to be in the game, but this gun is shown very briefly in first person view, and I am not sure whether it's M1897 or not. If this gun is from WW1 then Winchester Model 12 might be another possible candidate, but that I cannot guarantee. What do you guys think? Zzang1847 (talk)
Those sights are throwing me off. Mr. Wolf (talk) 22:34, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
I could be wrong, but that could be either the Stevens Model 520 or the Remington Model 10. --SeanWolf (talk) 23:40, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
I think you are right about Remington Model 10. If you look closely on the top of receiver, there is a bulged rail-looking part for mounting attachments(like the optic in the image) and I haven't seen that thing on M1897/M520. Now Winchester Model 12 also has that part on top of the receiver, but when I looked at the footage frame by frame, there were no shells ejecting on the right side, which fits the description of Model 10's bottom feed/ejecting mechanism. Unless I see any other suggestion of what that shotgun might be by tomorrow, I will update it to Remington Model 10. Thanks for the suggestion! Zzang1847 (talk)
A quick update to my previous comment. I just checked the new multiplayer gameplay footage from Jackfrags and kill-feed confirms that it is Remington Model 10(It says Model 10-A-HE, which I assume it is one of the pre-set customization options). I will update the main page right away! Zzang1847 (talk)
Wow...so I actually knew something right about a gun being shown!--SeanWolf (talk) 14:37, 13 June 2016 (EDT)
About the names and presets, it seems every gun has a two-letter bit at the end of its name denoting the different presets, but I haven't figured out what they actually mean. About the sights, it seems the game as some sort of early dual-lens system where the front and rear sights are replaced with lenses that give the player what is effectively a 2x scope. Keep this in mind if you're trying to ID something and the sights are like this. Alex T Snow (talk) 17:25, 14 June 2016 (EDT)
On a sidenote, I think that the picture of the shotgunner getting hit with a shovel should be moved under the Model 10, as the model clearly lacks a hammer. Now, granted, the pump handle is shoved under the receiver, so you could argue that the same applies to the other moving parts, including the hammer, but I'm more inclined to believe that the victim of a shovel attack has (or rather, had) a Model 10. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 08:45, 2 July 2016 (EDT)
How come they didn't include the extra round chambering on this shotgun in the closed alpha. Maybe they will fix it in the final release? --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 06:28, 18 July 2016 (EDT)
Probably trying to use WW1 era gun handling techniques. Notice how handguns are now held with one hand? I don't think chambering a shell, then loading the tube was a common military practice for shotguns back then. I could be wrong though.--Aidoru (talk) 15:13, 18 July 2016 (EDT)
This is likely it. From my not-super-educated-on-the-era perspective, BF3/4's loading the chamber first, then the tube definitely feels more "modern" and "tactical", while loading the tube first and ending with a pump feels more "classic" and "old school". Also, another fun fact is that you can cancel/shorten reloads if you need to ready the gun quickly. Mag-fed guns can't do this of course, but anything that uses stripper clips and single-round loading can. If you hit the fire button while reloading, the round/clip currently being inserted will finish loading, then you'll rechamber the gun right after, so for rifles you'll close the bolt and shotguns you'll pump them, and I assume this will apply to revolvers in the full game as well. Alex T Snow (talk) 15:26, 18 July 2016 (EDT)
You should therefore also expect to see a lot of terrible trigger discipline since the military didn't teach it to soldiers back then. Evil Tim (talk) 00:10, 20 July 2016 (EDT)
Makes sense. Only time will tell if an extra round can at least be chambered by reloading the Model 10 a second time after an empty reload (like mag-fed weapons do). Btw Call of Duty 3 made two interesting things regarding this topic: an empty reload of the Winchester M1897 involved loading 5 shells, pumping and then automatically inserting an extra one, and while loading two stripper clips into the Lee-Enfield you could actually interrupt the process and fire the weapon after loading only one. It's extremely silly that such features weren't carried on in any of the 10 following games. --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 19:49, 19 July 2016 (EDT)
Weapon identifications by Forgotten Weapons
Forgotten Weapon uploaded a few videos analyzing the different guns that appeared in the teaser trailer and the gameplay trailer. Inceptor57 (talk) 22:41, 12 June 2016 (EDT) [1] - Teaser Trailer analysis [2] - Gameplay Trailer analysis
I also will run the assumption that no matter if it was introduced at the beginning or end of the war, we will be seeing any gun that existed during this time period regardless if it served in actual combat. Like I bet the BAR will be an awesome weapon. Excalibur01 (talk) 16:29, 13 June 2016 (EDT)
I am fearing that the game designers will put sights that are the closest thing there will be to "optics" because gamers and kids these days just love their red dots and can't seem to want to play period pieces without their red dots. Greatest example is COD black ops where red dots galore before red dots were even thought possible for long guns. Excalibur01 (talk) 16:25, 13 June 2016 (EDT)
Holy damn, they added a Cei-Rigotti, I may have to buy this game. :P --Slon95 (talk) 19:32, 13 June 2016 (EDT)
Well, you do have things that look pretty close to modern optics like this thing, which is a rare Zeiss-made 2.5x prismatic magnifier. Also reflex sights are a bit older than you think, they just didn't really catch on at first. Even some WW1 fighter planes had red-dot reflector gunsights, in fact, though you'd never see them officially because they were top-secret: as late as WW2 the RAF was still messing around with photographs to replace reflector sights on Spitfires with old wire bullseye sights.
Also, regarding the mystery scope on the Beretta M1918, I found this image of a Lee-Enfield with what looks like some kind of magnifying rear sight, but I couldn't find any sites describing it or giving it a name. Anyone know? Evil Tim (talk) 18:49, 28 June 2016 (EDT)
It looks like Parker-Hale aperture backsight, most likely Model 4 (though it was used with No.4 Mk I rifle). Greg-Z (talk) 06:46, 29 June 2016 (EDT)
https://imgur.com/gallery/QV6Fc
Speaking of ForgottenWeapons, apparently he took a trip to DICE's LA studio, and assisted them. Dunno how, but it gives me faith that the weapons will at least be modelled and animated as close to authentic as possible.--Aidoru (talk) 01:42, 25 July 2016 (EDT)
I can't be the only one who, if I was the one picking the teams for the livestream, would have invited him to play?--BlackHawk510 (talk) 12:24, 6 August 2016 (EDT)
Reloading rifles that require opening the action
Despite my initial concerns due to how terrible Youtube compression is, making it hard to see details, the round ejected when opening the action is actually accounted for. And by "accounted for", I mean your character covers the ejection port with their left hand as you open the bolt, putting the ejecting round back into the internal magazine. Thought you guys would find this interesting. Literally the only inaccuracy I'm finding with weapon reloading is the C96, but the alternative is not allowing reloads unless empty, so I can let that one slide. Alex T Snow (talk) 18:20, 16 June 2016 (EDT)
Love it when animators put details like that into reload animations. That's why i like MoH: Warfighter, delicious animations.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 18:37, 16 June 2016 (EDT)
But in the B1 has a realistic reloading (with half-empty magazine replaced by a full magazine no jerks once again charging handle); as well as the balance between the stripper clips and the individual rounds to rifles (insert a stripper clip when you can insert a five ammo to the rifle's magazine, and the pre-load with the individual cartridges) - something that is very rarely see in the video games, and already is an achievement in itself. As for the animations, I hope that they will correct their later, as now the game is only in alpha stage. --Slon95 (talk) 18:57, 16 June 2016 (EDT)
Considering the attention to detail and the selection firearms, this is looking to be atleast interesting to play just to see all the guns.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 19:58, 16 June 2016 (EDT)
I wonder if they'll have the dafter stuff like the catapults and grenade-launching crossbows they developed before everyone came to their senses and started using rifle grenades? Evil Tim (talk) 18:29, 28 June 2016 (EDT)
Your post reminds me of that knife with a bipod from BF4, that was fun.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 12:52, 1 July 2016 (EDT)
5 bucks says that they include the Blanch-Chevalier. For those that don't know, it was basically a Martini-Henry with the barrel replaced with a setup that allows for the use of proprietary muzzle-loading grenades and blank cartridges, fired from the shoulder just to make it more ridiculous. Only 1 exists, but given the Cei-Rigotti, it seems likely. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 21:55, 1 July 2016 (EDT)
You get 5 bucks, Pyr0! Evil Tim (talk) 14:31, 26 January 2018 (EST)
I was wondering if anybody was going to notice that. Thanks for the money, Tim. Maybe I'll go buy a soda. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 14:41, 26 January 2018 (EST)
He was seen in the pre-alpha. At first I thought it was the Colt Model 1895; but it seems to be something other. --Slon95 (talk) 12:27, 28 June 2016 (EDT)
Actually it's not a machine gun, it is an anti-tank weapon 1.59-inch Breech-Loading Vickers Q.F. Gun, Mk II. There are some BF1 videos where it is being used against, well, tanks. --CnC Fin (talk) 12:51, 28 June 2016 (EDT)
As I understand, it will replace the rocket launchers from WWII shooters. --Slon95 (talk) 11:59, 30 June 2016 (EDT)
A list of all the weapon names obtained from the Alpha files. Temp89 (talk)
That's definitely a list of weapons from singleplayer, though that said the odds of SP-only guns should be pretty low. I'm excited for some of those pistols. Alex T Snow (talk) 14:42, 2 July 2016 (EDT)
Heh, Mars pistol in there as the game's Desert Eagle. Wonder if it costs health to shoot it like the real one? Evil Tim (talk) 14:59, 2 July 2016 (EDT)
This is clearly not a complete list. There are missing the many weapons, that are already in the game. --Slon95 (talk) 15:06, 2 July 2016 (EDT)
Well, this is pulled out of the files (probably for SP) so it's entirely possible some of the MP weapons don't appear in SP. It's also entirely possible some of the weapons on that list will only ever be on that list.
I'm a little confused as to what use a 2.7mm smoothbore pistol with an almighty 3 foot-pounds of muzzle energy is going to be in-game, though. The Kolibri makes a .22LR look like a cannon. In fact given the Kolibri is this big (that's a .50 AE round beside it), it's going to be hard to even see it in your character's hand.
What I'm really hoping is somewhere in the DLC they do a Battle of Jutland map where every squad leader can spawn a Dreadnought or something. Evil Tim (talk) 15:24, 2 July 2016 (EDT)
Why am I getting the vibe with this is that they just watched any Forgotten Weapons video with a gun from before 1918 and just said, sure let's put that in. I mean the Kolibri's are rare, the Mars were effectively relics by WWI, Howdah's were hunting guns and their military uses were more in India and South Africa, Bulldog's were sort of petering out in popularity with civilians and next to none were in military hands. --PaperCake 10:26, 4 July 2016 (EST)
Well it's not like it's ever not been like that given Battlefield's tendency towards things like Pancor Jackhammers and MagPul PDRs and such. Even the first one had you fighting with the StG-44 before it had been invented and with the HMS Prince of Wales after she'd been sunk. Evil Tim (talk) 13:44, 4 July 2016 (EDT)
Yeah, the Battlefield series is known for taking artistic liberties in their games. Don't forget the Tiger I in Operation Battleaxe a year before they entered service. Then of course you have the Secret Weapons pack and all they added. DICE likes to use low production or even just prototypes for their games, and keeping them to the correct chronological point isn't their concern. Zombiedrd (talk) 14:47, 4 July 2016 (EDT)
I gotta say, I quite like that they put these rare or low production weapons in their games, makes the games more interesting and shows of weapons people might never heard of before. If i want historical accuracy, I'd play Red Orchestra or something.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 16:52, 4 July 2016 (EDT)
I'll second this entirely. There are so many very cool and interesting guns (and vehicles and other tech) I'd never heard of before, I love it! And really, every Battlefield's weapon list is like this. Alex T Snow (talk) 17:10, 4 July 2016 (EDT)
Yeah, it makes it more interesting then just having everyone run around with Nagants and Mausers and whatnot.--AnActualAK47 (talk) 21:02, 4 July 2016 (EDT)
Something I see there besides the Auto-5 and MG15, I also see the Remington Model 8 as well. Currently an image of it is being used to showcase the Auto-5 which is incorrect as I do not believe the Auto-5 ever held 8 rounds. Draco122 (talk) 08:51, 6 August 2016 (EDT)
Well, the Model 8 could be running the 15-rounder, and just isn't fully loaded. Also, we saw the M1918 Mauser 13.2mm, and an icon of the Webley-Fosbery autorevolver (which, by the way, YES) for a split-second. Cheers, Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 18:52, 6 August 2016 (EDT)
I am thoroughly surprised the Chauchat has yet to be revealed. Here's to hoping the French's 8x50mmR Lebel makes it into the game over the US's .30-06 version. Jaxxons11 (talk) 21:12, 15 August 2016 (EDT)
The Borchardt C-93, Steyer M1912, and Frommer Stop machine pistol are in some of the recent videos from Gamescon.--AgentGumby (talk) 21:23, 15 August 2016 (EDT)
I'd bet the Chauchat will be in the France DLC. Alex T Snow (talk) 15:12, 16 August 2016 (EDT)
Selbstlader M1916 in the hands of an desert infantryman? O_o. I understand everything, but in real life Mauser Selbstlader and the desert - the things, I think, very poorly compatible. Where it would be logical, if it would the pilot's choice of weapon. -Slon95 (talk) 19:01, 21 August 2016 (EDT)
Beta Data Mine, Full Weapon List
Unlike the previous one, this looks to be a full, proper list of all weapons, including their presets. As a Canadian, I will absolutely be rocking the Huot Automatic Rifle. Edit: I made an easier to read version. Alex T Snow (talk) 15:02, 10 September 2016 (EDT)
>holy moley a Kolibri pistol
Forgotten Weapons: The Game is really shaping up well.--AgentGumby (talk) 18:43, 10 September 2016 (EDT)
Again, I'm surprised that the Chauchaut hasn't been confirmed yet. I mean, it was the first widely used, man portable, fully automatic rifle. Jaxxons11 (talk) 16:27, 14 September 2016 (EDT)
Probably all the French weapons are supposed to be in the first DLC.--AgentGumby (talk) 16:34, 14 September 2016 (EDT)
I'd bet anything the France DLC will have the RSC 1917, Chauchat, Lebel (and an Assault gun), while the Russia DLC will have the Fedorov Avtomat and Mosin-Nagant (and Assault/Support guns). Alex T Snow (talk) 00:30, 15 September 2016 (EDT)
French Assault class automatic will most likely be Ribeyrolles Mle. 1918, calling it now! I really wonder what they could bring in the Russian DLC, maybe more Winchester self loading rifles?--BeloglaviSup (talk) 09:09, 15 September 2016 (EDT)
Figured you guys would want to see this. :3 Alex T Snow (talk) 16:31, 30 September 2016 (EDT)
Imagine it serves as a melee weapon that behaves akin to an extreme choking hazard.--BeloglaviSup (talk) 17:27, 30 September 2016 (EDT)
Maybe it's for the yet-to-be-revealed Ant class. On a more serious note, my best guesses for the French DLC are an Mle. 1892, a Star Ruby (along with a possible Plus Ultra variant), a Savage pistol, and maybe an 1873 Chamelot-Delvigne as a joke (with a muzzle velocity of about 2 m/s), a Ribeyrolles 1918, a Chauchat, an RSC 1917 or 1918, a Lebel, a Berthier, and maybe a Remington Rolling Block. Only time will tell. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 19:13, 30 September 2016 (EDT)
Hopefully after you've emptied the weapon and dirtied someones shirt you can throw it at them. --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 15:50, 2 October 2016 (EDT)
On a slightly less related note, we've got confirmation of the M1889 Bodeo, based on some early footage of the cinematic tools available ingame, along with the BAR. It's in this video. Cheers, Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 20:14, 8 October 2016 (EDT)
Nice to finally see some revolver gameplay, though I do want to see their reloads, what with most of them using loading gates. Also, the Avanti Savoia teaser, with a shot of a rather unique weapon in it. :3 Alex T Snow (talk) 17:47, 10 October 2016 (EDT)
Hey, it seemed to me, or I saw this there: --Slon95 (talk) 19:56, 13 October 2016 (EDT)
Found this video here of a guy showcasing some weapons and weapon skins. Added the ones that I saw, also I'm not liking many of those skins at all in my honest opinion. The flashy gold engraving is not too bad but most of them are pretty bad. Draco122 (talk) 16:53, 12 October 2016 (EDT)
It's a WWI game, you don't need skins. It looks quite ironic when a gold plated BAR gets muddy in St. Quentin Scar.--AgentGumby (talk) 17:21, 12 October 2016 (EDT)
It's not like this is a game about realism. Prototypes and experimental designs being used as standard issue and all. Not to mention tactics not seen until the Second World War(Literally saw a combined armed blitzkrieg assault using RE8s and Mark IV tanks). Zombiedrd (talk) 17:40, 12 October 2016 (EDT)
Nice to see that DICE have acknowledged the M1897's slam fire capability.--Aidoru (talk) 01:14, 13 October 2016 (EDT)
Some more weapons can be seen from gameplay in Jackfrags video, Sentry Destruction which includes a new Sawn Off Shotgun for the Tank Hunter class Draco122 (talk) 14:43, 14 October 2016 (EDT)
I just watched the early footage of the game yesterday and watching the player go through the first couple missions, I'd noticed that the creators of this game really can't get away from everything modern warfare style games have done to the genre of shooters. You first start off with the broom handle, sure that's ok. Churchill himself used one in his youth but then, you can tell the progression of the player as he picked up the "essentially an assault rifle" and going to town, then switching up to full auto weapons. It's cool to use those types of guns, but the historical inaccuracy is just painful and we know why they did it. They designed this game to feel like modern warfare with guns close enough to today's automatic guns in a time period that didn't have a lot of that in the actual feel. It's like if they make a Civil War game and we constantly see Henry rifles even though they weren't that prominent on the battlefield, despite being game changers. It's like the designers think it'd be too boring for the Brits to use a bolt action Enfield with a Webley as his sidearm. Excalibur01 (talk) 12:02, 13 October 2016 (EDT)
"It's like the designers think it'd be too boring for the Brits to use a bolt action Enfield with a Webley as his sidearm." Yes, that is the point. This is an AAA game trying to compete on the shooter market with the mass of gamers, not a game made for people who want realism. Using tactics of the Great War, with common weapons of the Great War, would be too slow for the average shooter player(Look at the insanity of Titanfall). To be a big seller, you have to have intense fast paced action, and bolt actions and trench warfare doesn't do that. Instead of have a gamer closer to a World War 2 game, because fast mechanized warfare is what the average gamer wants. Remember, this game isn't for us older people into the historical lore of the firearms of the period, but for that range from 15-25. Zombiedrd (talk) 12:02, 13 October 2016 (EDT)
I've noticed exactly that watching some of the game-play videos out now. In one of the story modes the character has a bolt-action for about 30 seconds before switching to a semi-auto rifle and then picking up a portable machine gun. Based on a lot of weaponry it seems the game developers based most of it on the Forgotten Weapons youtube channel https://www.youtube.com/user/ForgottenWeapons/videosbrasco (talk) 15:16, 13 October 2016 (EDT)
Well, in this sort of situation, there's always a balance between realism and fun. On one hand, you can't just throw realism out the window and have people running around with AUGs and SPAS-12s like it's Black Ops, but on the other hand, were it to be completely realistic, you'd spend about a month of your time sitting in a trench with a bolt-action rifle, waiting to get trenchfoot or die of an infection. Sure, it's not terribly historically accurate, but I'm fine with them fictionalizing the available armaments of the war (at least to the extent of things that existed, but weren't issued in large numbers/ at all) in exchange for a more enjoyable game. If you want a more realistic WW1 shooter, go get a copy of Verdun. But anyway, that's just the opinion of Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 16:03, 13 October 2016 (EDT)
Well said. Also, you're free to use or not use whatever weapons you want in campaign, so it's not like you have to use something out of place if you don't want. Alex T Snow (talk) 19:09, 13 October 2016 (EDT)
I don't subscribe to the belief of, "don't play or watch it if it is bad" logic. That kind of thinking only encourages bad things instead of bringing it up. I wasn't expecting full on trench warefareExcalibur01 (talk) 16:46, 25 October 2016 (EDT)
If you want a game that combines realism and fun, Red Orchestra is probably your best bet. I think it's computer only, but it's pretty realistic. For example, when firing your bolt action rifle, which the majority of players will get, one mouse click fires the weapon and a second one cycles the bolt. There's also no reticle, and you need to use your iron sights to fire accurately). Tank crews have specific jobs like driver, gunner, commander, etc, and a driver will only drive the tank (but can switch to other positions). So none of this "I'mma drive the tank and fire it while I'm moving" stuff. It's available on Steam if anyone is interested, and there are mods available to allow you to play as Americans or Brits as well as the original Russians or Germans. Cozmo (talk) 12:49, 10 January 2017 (EST)
Villa-Perosa 1915
There was a Villa-Perosa 1915 in one of the recent gameplay videos on YouTube. It could be picked up from weapon boxes spread around the maps. Should this be added?--Hchris (talk) 14:57, 16 October 2016 (EDT)
Of course. Also, it should be noted that though the HUD shows it holding "25", that's shots, not individual rounds. It fires two at once, thus is correctly 50 rounds. Alex T Snow (talk) 16:56, 16 October 2016 (EDT)
I believe it's available as an alternate weapon for the Sentry Elite Class. It trades firepower for added mobility I believe. Draco122 (talk) 18:22, 16 October 2016 (EDT)
Kolibri
Seriously, this cute little pistol actually existed? How do you actually use that thing though (in terms of practicality)? - Kenny99 (talk) 20:16, 17 October 2016 (EDT)
It's adorable and does 5 damage at point blank, 25 for a headshot. Also, while we're on this topic, it's capacity of 7+1 looks to be correct (whoever wrote otherwise). While Ian of Forgotten Weapons did say it didn't like loading all seven, the magazines were clearly designed for seven. Alex T Snow (talk) 20:21, 17 October 2016 (EDT)
It's actually half as powerful as the UK muzzle energy cutoff for an air pistol to be considered a firearm. Given the designer was a watchmaker (and you basically have to load the thing with tweezers because the rounds are so dinky), it was probably more a "look what I can do" thing. Or a pistol so that your actual pistol can defend itself. Evil Tim (talk) 09:07, 18 October 2016 (EDT)
Welp. I loved it when how the player hands reacts when receiving this pistol for first time. And how gently the player hands pulled the slide and shoot it like holding a tiny tea cup. Alex Vostox (talk)
Everything feels so weak... and it is
Seriously since playing for the past few days (Early Enlister) everything Ive used thus far feels so incredibly weak barring Scout weapons and Shotguns that nearly everybody I've faced feel like bullet sponges what with the developers infamous netcode issues on bullet registeration. The LMG's you'd believe to be fairly powerful but they are so misleading because they do the exact damage as most of the SMG's, some examples are the BAR M1918, M1909 and Lewis Gun which do the same damage as the M1918 Automatico at 21 per shot and the Madsen and MG15 do around 23 per shot within 20 meters. Some of the Medic's rifles take nearly 3-4 bullets just to down a single soldier making most of the Medic's rifles such as the Model 8 .35 and Luger 1906 (which is a level 10 final unlock for the Medic) useless because their magazine sizes are so small, only the Mondragon and Selbstrader M1916 kill in a consistent three shots at all ranges and M1907, Cei Rigotti and Model 8 .25 kill in about 3 shots at 25 meters and 4 at everything else. The pistols aren't too bad because they have the highest variety in damage in my opinion however the M1911 makes almost all but the Revolvers and specility pistols obsolete thus far because it simply outshines them in every way. Draco122 (talk) 15:30, 22 October 2016 (EDT)
Most MGs are not supposed to be used within 20m and are therefore rather ineffective at it; mid-long range is where they shine. They're among the best weapons in the game if you can make the most of them, they just have a steeper learning curve. The Lewis does feel a bit average, and the Low Weight (no attachment) MGs will almost certainly be getting a buff (as the benefits of no attachments don't really apply to the MGs' spread mechanics). SLRs being 3-4 hits makes perfect sense to me; use them as "rifles" not "DMRs", if that differentiation makes sense to you. The Remington .35 is one of my favourite guns, but it's hard to master, I most definitely haven't yet. It has the highest RoF in the class and the accuracy to make use of that RoF, with good damage, but only five rounds. It has among the fastest kill time potential, but making every shot count, reloading as much as possible, and having a solid sidearm are all musts. It's a technically demanding, but highly rewarding rifle. And it shows off your emblem much better than most guns do. :3 Alex T Snow (talk) 16:44, 22 October 2016 (EDT)
This is exactly why I have such a problem getting into Battlefield games. Every gun just feels so weak and every soldier is a bullet sponge. --PyramidHead (talk) 19:04, 27 October 2016 (EDT)
I hear what you're saying (the bullet sponge thing is why I stay away from Halo and Destiny mp) but I like it because, for me, it's not about the kills. My multiplayer FPS skills are very mediocre. For me, having a break even K/D ratio in a round is a success. Playing as a medic and healing or resurrecting teammates is just as fulfilling as getting kills.--John Ryder (talk) 22:37, 28 October 2016 (EDT)
Suppressed weapons
It's cool that I've never seen a suppressed 03 Springfield but...it's a suppressed 03 Springfield with a Warner & Swasey Scope....it's just weird. Everything from how plentiful SMGs and semi-auto rifles are. What surprised me is during the only American mission, you don't get any BARs if this was their point Excalibur01 (talk) 16:44, 25 October 2016 (EDT)
Placeholder Rifle
Does anyone know what happened to it? --Slon95 (talk) 08:18, 26 October 2016 (EDT)
It left the game, moved to Wisconsin, and got a job in insurance. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 20:16, 12 December 2016 (EST) Hey look you can type after your post's signature. Neat.
Found this random wallpaper image that shows the alleged Carcano a bit clearer; it looks like the G98 without the Lange visier and the front end of the stock removed.
Also you can see it here: [4]. It seems that the developers just too lazy (?) to make later a normal Carcano replacement for this placeholder, and even abandoned this (Carcano) rifle. -Slon95 (talk) 08:09, 7 March 2017 (EST)
Rifle grenades?
I have been playing the game now for a few days and I think I saw someone using rifle grenades. Can anybody confirm that they are ingame? For which weapons are they available? Which types of rifle grenades are ingame? Can someone please cap Screenshots and add them to this page? I haven't unlocked them yet.--Hchris (talk) 16:18, 27 October 2016 (EDT)
Yes, there are rifle grenades in both the single-player campaign and multiplayer. In multiplayer, they can be used only by the Medic class in the Gadget Slots. The three types are: Fragmentation, High Explosive, and Smoke. They can be bought with 60 War Bonds each. --John Ryder (talk) 17:16, 27 October 2016 (EDT)
Weapon Variants
I added a Weapon variants section to the front page to better explain the various weapon variants you get in Battlefield 1. I'll leave it upto a mod whether or not it deserves being placed in the main page or being moved to the Discussion page. Also added additional details to a few sections to better describe how the weapon function in-game. Draco122 (talk) 23:11, 30 October 2016 (EDT)
All the new info there looks fantastic and correct, thank you! :D Alex T Snow (talk) 21:11, 31 October 2016 (EDT)
I've noticed that the shotgun customization typically allows for you to choose between a heat shield or barrel rib for the sights, but were ventilated barrels a thing around WWI?--AgentGumby (talk) 00:47, 11 December 2016 (EST)
Giant's Shadow
So, the Giant's Shadow DLC is coming out soon, and it apparently includes a new Support gadget: a crossbow. Now, I know that we normally don't include such things, but I think this one might be a bit different. You see, in practical terms, it's less of a crossbow and more of a grenade launcher. It has a fixed cup attached to the string, into which hand grenades (Millis Bombs, I'm fairly certain) are inserted, then fired. Any thoughts? Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 20:14, 12 December 2016 (EST)
I'd just mention it on the Mills bomb section, could add some screens whenever.--AgentGumby (talk) 21:17, 12 December 2016 (EST)
Well, if it's a Sauterelle or something we should ID it. Evil Tim (talk) 09:02, 13 December 2016 (EST)
Doesn't seem like it, seeing as this thing's man-portable, unlike the Sauterelle. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 17:06, 13 December 2016 (EST)
Frommer Stop Auto
Is there a particular designation for this fully-automatic variant? I don't think that the current "Frommer Stop Auto M1912" title on the page is the most appropriate (from what I've seen online, this seems to be a generic name for the original weapon). The full-auto version that is dual-mounted upside down on a tripod is the M1917, but I'm not sure if this designation also applies to the single machine pistol seen in-game. --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 15:47, 13 December 2016 (EST)
"Dual-mounted upside down on a tripod". World War 1 was a strange, strange time period. On a more serious note, I don't see why it wouldn't be called an M1917, as it's just half of an M1917 without a tripod, but I think that I'm probably not the best person to ask (I'm also not the best person to ask as to why I even bothered writing this). Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 17:09, 13 December 2016 (EST)
Well, after doing more research, the two pistols of the "strange" M.17 mount kinda differ from the variant that I'm talking about. The in-game full-auto weapon is apparently an M1912 like the standard semi-auto one, we might just have to change the section heading to "Frommer Stop machine pistol" or something (I took care of it for now). --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 17:31, 13 December 2016 (EST)
Vive la France!
French Army would appear in DLC They Shall Not Pass. So what we can see on concept art:
Chauchat at the left looks a little strange, as it seems to lack the grip below the magazine. An officer at the right holds a pistol, possibly a Star Ruby that is also predictable (nevertheless he carries a revolver holster). Rifles are nondescript, but the general shape tend to Berthier rather than Lebel. Greg-Z (talk) 02:49, 18 December 2016 (EST)
Will they include a gameplay mechanic where everyone playing a French character in MP can immediately surrender the moment a round starts? Spartan198 (talk) 12:43, 18 December 2016 (EST)
Looks like a fortress, I'm guessing Verdun? Evil Tim (talk) 12:47, 18 December 2016 (EST)
This is WW1 France, not WW2. Dudes were hardcore.--Mandolin (talk) 23:44, 29 December 2016 (EST)
Spartan198 I will give the bad news. No. Look at Italian faction... can they change side while fighting? XD --Dannyguns (talk) 10:17, 10 January 2017 (EST)
An interesting thing to note about "K bullets"
What I've noticed is that, unlike a normal reload, when switching to K bullets, the character lets the unfired normal round eject from the rifle, and when you switch back to the normal rounds, there will be one round missing from your mag. that being said, the K bullet that is ejected when switching back to normal rounds is not accounted for (likely for gameplay reasons, as we only get 5, but maybe we're supposed to assume that the character catches it offscreen after he racks the bolt). Another thing that I will have to try out is the feature where holding down the trigger prevents the character from cycling the action on manual weapons. maybe switching to K bullets while the trigger is being held after firing will make the spent casing be ejected instead of an unfired round?--BlackHawk510 (talk) 12:24, 29 December 2016 (EST)
You do indeed lose a round from your magazine when switching to K-Bullets and back, but you don't lose it from your inventory, it's simply transferred to spare ammo, and K-Bullets work the same. I just tried to check what ejects, and you're going to need to freeze-frame it to catch it. I'd figure anything that ejects is always a spent case, just for simplicity since it's really not noticeable at all. Alex T Snow (talk) 17:24, 29 December 2016 (EST)
Great, now I want one with smoother animation. Speaking of Doom, I kind of wish the reboot had reload animations for all its guns like Doom 3 did. --Mazryonh (talk) 01:39, 23 January 2017 (EST)
But, um, the joke is that it has the same number of frames that the animation in Doom did. And I guess, though only if you just had a button to reload them but never actually had to. Evil Tim (talk) 10:18, 23 January 2017 (EST)
There's also one for the .25 Model 8 that's lifted straight from the AN-94- flicking the old magazine out with the new one, then turning the gun over and pulling the charging handle. I hope that they include some more, preferably at least as many as Hardline. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 13:18, 23 January 2017 (EST)
Yes, I knew the joke was to make it look like it came straight out of Doom II, but with polygons. Speaking of the reboot, it's clearly of the run-and-gun genre like the early Quake titles where you only have to let go of the trigger after everything around you is dead or if you're out of ammo and need to switch to another weapon. Doom 3's magazine system at least forced you to be a little more conservative with your ammunition. --Mazryonh (talk) 23:35, 23 January 2017 (EST)
There's also this amazing Kolibri easter egg reload. You have to be prone, and it only shows in third person. AnimationMerc, DICE LA's weapon animator, has a few comments there. Alex T Snow (talk) 01:41, 24 January 2017 (EST)
The Magic Slide returns with a vengeance
I'm rather impressed with most of the reloads in this game, as they do portray some rather rare guns with some realism. However a lot of the pistols don't get the same treatment. Many of these guns lack hold opens, such as the M1915, the Colt Hammerless and the FN 1903. While some of these guns do have magazine hold opens, that would only keep the gun locked open for as long as the empty magazine was in the gun. As soon as it would be removed, the slide would be released. I've noted these on the page, though I don't know if the Mauser Pocket Pistol has the same problem. -PaperCake 11:52, 4 February 2017 (EST)
The FN has a slide lock so it's fine, the Hammerless isn't supposed to lock open at all, and you're right that the Beretta would lock open on its mag then drop forward when the mag is removed. I passed on the Hammerless to LA's animator, along with a list of other stuff including the Beretta's slide locking waaaaay too far back, but when I mentioned that he pointed out to me that the slide should actually only be locking on the mag. I know a bunch of this sort of stuff has been fixed for the patch this month, but I don't know exactly what. Alex T Snow (talk) 15:29, 4 February 2017 (EST)
The FN doesn't have a slide lock, it's basically a scaled up Hammerless. Also the Mauser Pocket Pistol suffers from the same problem. --PaperCake 17:13, 4 February 2017 (EST)
Actually, the Mauser not only stays locked open when the magazine is released, it also automatically drops the slide when it's re-inserted, both of which are correctly simulated in the game. That being said, I'm still a bit disappointed at the C96 reloads w/ magic slides, and the oversimplification of rifle grenades. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 19:06, 4 February 2017 (EST)
Apparently, the next DLC will contain an MG14/17. So... um, yeah, I don't have anything else to say why am I still talking this is really goddamned awkward bye. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 16:41, 6 March 2017 (EST)
It's already in the game, just mounted on the German biplanes.--AgentGumby (talk) 19:05, 28 March 2017 (EDT)
I know, I meant that it'll be available as an infantry-portable weapon. In other news, it is actually impossible to manually type out the signature, even if you replicate the wikitext perfectly. You have to use the 4-tilde method, or else you get an error. I don't know why I tried, but I did. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 20:21, 28 March 2017 (EDT)
Optics
Does anyone have an ID on the two black/brass rifle scopes? I'm trying to figure out the correct reticles for everything, but I'm not sure what these two are. The larger one is used on Scout's Sniper-variant rifles, while the smaller of the same style is used on Medic's Marksman/Sniper variants. EDIT: The "Sniper" scope for the bolt actions is a Periscopic Prism Company scope designed for the SMLE, while the smaller version does look to just be the same in-game model with the front brass bit removed and rear brass part swapped to a different one. It seems there were a lot of scopes of similar size/shape to the Medic one (especially German) back then, but I'm pretty sure BF1's is just an altered P.P.Co. scope. But I can't find its reticle. I even found a guide on how to disassemble it, but not its sight picture. Can anyone help? Alex T Snow (talk) 23:14, 22 April 2017 (EDT)
Limpet Charge missing
The limpet charge is missing on this page. As it is a real explosive device, I think it should be added. Anybody want to add it? Otherwise I can do it.--Hchris (talk) 16:49, 29 May 2017 (EDT)
I have no idea what the real one is named or anything, so please do! I do agree it should be on the page. Alex T Snow (talk) 18:34, 29 May 2017 (EDT)
I added a separate gun page for the Limpet Charge and added the entry to this page. Would you please be so kind and add the ingame screenshots? --Hchris (talk) 14:47, 30 May 2017 (EDT)
Some pre-release stuff
I'll just leave it here: [5] --Slon95 (talk) 13:23, 5 June 2017 (EDT)
Meanwhile, the first trailer of the new DLC came out: [6]. The double-barreled shotgun and MG-14/17 is confirmed, also seen the Mosin-Nagant. -Slon95 (talk) 20:02, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
It looks like the MG-14 has a non-disintegrating belt, neat!--AgentGumby (talk) 20:45, 10 June 2017 (EDT)
Funny, the double barrel shotgun is twice incorrect. First, in reality Russian Army never used such weapon. The only shotgun that had a chance to be used by Russian troops (and exclusively auxiliary forces) was Berdan rifle converted to shotgun (so called "Berdanka"). In theory it could be fitted with bayonet and used for training and varyous auxiliary duties. But this idea did not come true. And the second, nearly all double barrel shotguns that were produced in Russia or imported from abroad had exposed hammers, unlike the hammerless in-game weapon. Greg-Z (talk) 12:53, 11 June 2017 (EDT)
Nothing wrong with that, not all of the weapons are Russian-used, rather like the Sjögren and Mle 1903 carbine in the France DLC. It's even named "Remington M1900", clearly not trying to be Russian. I fully expect the C93 carbine to be in this DLC too, also very obviously not Russian. Alex T Snow (talk) 14:34, 11 June 2017 (EDT)
Of course, Russian Army used a lot of weapons, purchased abroad, like Mauser C96 and Star Ruby pistols, Arisaka, Gras and Vetterli rifles, Lewis, Colt-Browning and Chauchat machine guns. But I only mentioned that double barrled shotgun, nevermind of what origin, doesn't match the reality as army weapon. Greg-Z (talk) 14:52, 11 June 2017 (EDT)
So any depiction of a double-barreled shotgun in military hands in WWI or WWII media is incorrect? --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 16:51, 11 June 2017 (EDT)
Not universally, for example the German army issued a large number of double barrel shotguns and drillings to troops during WW1. The thing is though that they were not intended for combat, they were for hunting game to supplement rations. There are however photos of them being carried by sentries, so they may have been used in combat but I am unaware of any proof of this. --commando552 (talk) 20:48, 11 June 2017 (EDT)
I'd still like to know, did vented barrel ribs exist at this time?--AgentGumby (talk) 21:19, 11 June 2017 (EDT)
Yeah, they existed back then. Here is an example of a shotgun with a vented rib from 1892. --commando552 (talk) 16:50, 12 June 2017 (EDT)
The General Liu rifle seems to have the same schtick as the M1891/30 when reloading with one round left, where the chambered round is pocketed and a new clip is stripped into the rifle. --HashiriyaR32 (talk) 19:27, 8 August 2017 (EDT)
C&Rsenal
I must point out this YouTube channel and article website, as they have incredibly useful insights to the weaponry of WWI (the objective of the YouTube channel) and beyond, even going so far to do one hour episodes for certain guns such as the Mannlicher 1886, The Lee-Enfields, and the Lewis gun.
You can tell that the devs really put a lot of effort into the game, especially now with some of these ITNOTT animations. I, frankly, just can't wait to see this game's version of the BF4 DICE LA camo easter egg, or the BFH Lewis Gun/Merkel Drilling easter eggs. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 21:50, 18 September 2017 (EDT)
Turning Tides weapon list
No point adding anything to the page yet, but I figured you guys would find this interesting. Here.Alex T Snow (talk) 19:36, 14 October 2017 (EDT)
I wonder if the M1917 is confirmed to be the machine gun (which it isn't really all that portable by a single man), or I hope it really ends up being the M1917 revolver, because moon clips would be great to see in the game. The Webley 1912 pistol would be awesome to have as well, I'd assume maybe some of the Royal Marines probably carried them.--AgentGumby (talk) 22:45, 14 October 2017 (EDT)
Well, that apparently wasn't the full list, considering what just happened recently. DICE gave a sneak-peek at the DLC, complete with 6 new weapons: the Carcano and Arisaka for the Scout, the Browning M1917 for Support (even though it weighs like a hundred pounds), the Farquhar-Hill for the Medic, and the C96 Trench Carbine for the Assault, along with something else interesting: a full-auto Steyr M1912 (referred to as the M1912P16, but that's just a file name, like the rest in this build). I pretty much knew that that thing was coming, but I figured it'd be for the pilot/tanker classes. Well, DICE does always have a way of surprising people. Considering how there are 2 Assault weapons and 2 Scout ones, I'd guess that we're getting a new Medic rifle and Support machine gun, as well as possibly a new vehicle-class weapon, some new melee weapons, and possibly new sidearms. Thoughts, anybody? Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 18:07, 16 October 2017 (EDT)
The Steyr machine pistol's full designation is "M1912/P.16" so that's where the "P16" comes from. I don't really think they need to add anymore pilot/tanker weapons because of how un-often those actually end up used (unless the vehicle crewman class is somehow made more prevalent). And yeah, just John Basilone that Browning 1917 around, why not.--AgentGumby (talk) 21:43, 16 October 2017 (EDT)
The medic's getting the Farquhar-Hill automatic rifle. --HashiriyaR32 (talk) 22:24, 16 October 2017 (EDT)
Like the two TSNP Assault weapons, these pairs of Assault and Scout weapons are not getting variants, while the Medic and Support guns are, so it's six guns total, but two options for each class. The Farquhar-Hill comes in Storm or Optical, the Browning M1917 comes in Low Weight and Telescopic (and it does not weight 100 pounds, that's the weight with the huge full emplacement tripod and stuff; it's comparable to the MG08/15 and Perino), and the two bolt actions are both iron sights only (though it seems the Carcano may be a Carbine variant in stats, but with iron sights, which would be fantastic). Looks like a very cool selection or weapons, I'm quite excited about all of them. Oh and we're also getting a flak-round variant of the Rocket Gun, for AA use; about damn time we get an infantry-based AA option. Alex T Snow (talk) 00:15, 17 October 2017 (EDT)
Howdah Sweeper
What caliber could the "Sweeper" variant of the Howdah pistol possibly use? For shotgun-type shells, I've read 20 and 28 gauge, but these are apparently only for modern double-barreled reproductions. --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 06:12, 20 October 2017 (EDT)
It could just be firing the standard .476 cartridges (which the unchanged model and animations would suggest), but loaded with a snakeshot-style cluster of pellets wrapped in paper or something. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 07:10, 20 October 2017 (EDT)
The .577 version wouldn't be that hard to do it with since it's very close to 24 gauge (to the point you can apparently make fireable .577 ammo by cutting down 24 gauge brass shotgun cases) but I think the .577s were double barrel. Evil Tim (talk) 12:28, 20 October 2017 (EDT)
The one in BF1 uses .455, and thus has the exact same damage and ballistics as the Webley-Fosbery. If you're ever curious as to what projectile any BF1 gun uses, go to Symthic's Weapon Info section and pick a gun, then look at the "Projectile" line; the Howdah uses "455WebleyMkII". Alex T Snow (talk) 13:29, 20 October 2017 (EDT)
Yeah, but it doesn't necessarily follow that the gun is visually or conceptually based on a .455 gun just because it uses the ballistic model that's called .455, see also the ".700 Nitro" rifle in Far Cry 4 that fires .600 Nitro Express, games where you can fire "9mm ammo" out of pistols that aren't 9mm, or various games where pistols eject bottlenecked rifle casings. Visually, that ammo he's putting in doesn't look much like .455 Webley MkII. Evil Tim (talk) 13:51, 20 October 2017 (EDT)
Yeah, Symthic isn't always accurate in terms of (at least) ammo listing. For example, it states that BF Hardline's Saiga 308 is chambered in 7.62x39mm and that the HCAR is in 7.62x51mm. --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 15:37, 20 October 2017 (EDT)
Maybe I should have phrased that differently; .455 Webley MkII is what the gun uses in BF1 in a gameplay sense, that's DICE's file name for that projectile (Symthic does not invent or alter projectile names), which is used in this and the Fosbery. Whether the real pistol is supposed to use that, I have no idea. Looking at that comparison image, MkII and MkVI are nearly identical (different bullet finish/material, and that little dimple mark being different), so if you had put on the main page that it looks more like the MkVI due to the bullet colour (because the dimple part is entirely absent in BF1, so that's the only difference), please keep in mind that weapon skins (which that image has) also recolour cartridges (camo skins give camo rounds too). Alex T Snow (talk) 17:00, 20 October 2017 (EDT)
Or, they simply aren't detailed enough to include the dimple from either version. Calling out the lack of detail is fine, but trying to claim this means they're actually MkVI is really stretching things, and doesn't do anyone any favours. They're MkII without the dimple modelled. Alex T Snow (talk) 15:28, 21 October 2017 (EDT)
That's like saying a Glock 18C without the fire selector or compensator ports modelled is still a Glock 18C rather than a Glock 17. We call it what it is, not what it ought to be. Evil Tim (talk) 15:40, 21 October 2017 (EDT)
And I'm telling you that without either dimple pattern modelled it could be either Mk. Alex T Snow (talk) 21:48, 22 October 2017 (EDT)
...Except I showed you a picture of inert MkVI rounds without either. Come on, we already have them throwing WW2 stick grenades in WW1, it's not like this would be a one-off error. Evil Tim (talk) 12:55, 23 October 2017 (EDT)
Whoops, sorry, I missed that image. >.> Alex T Snow (talk) 22:35, 23 October 2017 (EDT)
Apocalypse DLC
So, I'm calling it now, you heard it here first, but the final DLC is going to be the Somme. If you read the description for it, it talks about being the most notorious battle of the war. We already have Verdun and it looks like Turning Tides will cover Gallipoli. What else could it be?--That's the Way It's Done (talk) 23:17, 8 November 2017 (EST)
Vimy Ridge and/or Passchendaele? For weapons, I'm betting on the Annihilator, Howell, Burton, and Ross. Alex T Snow (talk) 22:01, 12 November 2017 (EST)
For MGs, the Burton seems likely, along with either a Lewis Assault Phase Rifle or a pre-Vickers Berthier light machine gun prototype. The Ross seems like a likely choice (and it would be absolutely hilarious if there was an Easter-egg animation where the bolt comes clear of the receiver and just straight-up kills you), and it could be accompanied by an M1917/P14 Enfield, or perhaps a Berthier. For the Assault, the Thompson Annihilator could be chosen, but it would be infuriatingly overpowered; from what I've heard, it fired at 1,000+ RPM, so that coupled with it being in .45 ACP (i.e. being a 3-shot-kill up close, assuming they keep the M1911's damage model) would essentially make it an Automatico on MLB-level steroids, and nobody wants that. Instead, I think that that one U.S. prototype SMG that had a rotary rack of 10 M1911 magazines that basically nobody knows anything about could be neat, as the fact that it's so obscure means that they could take some interesting liberties in the name of balance- say, manually rotate the rack every 7 rounds, M1911 damage, moderate fire-rate, replace magazines one at a time during the reload, etc. The accompanying shotgun will probably be an M1887, because they already have the assets from Hardline, but it could be something else, like a Burgess. For SLRs, the Howell is another solid choice, and would allow for recycling of parts of the SMLE model; it could be accompanied by a Meunier rifle or carbine. As for pistols, there are plenty of options to pick from, and I'd rather not make this comment any more unnecessarily long. Unless, that is, you want that for some reason. Anyways, see you later. Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 16:53, 13 November 2017 (EST) P.S.: I know that there's no chance of it whatsoever, but I still for some reason keep hoping that the DLC will be focused around the Battle of Husiatyn Woods.
That's a fantastic list and reasoning, I have to agree with all of that. :D
Hellriegel capacity
Here you go, Pyr0m4n14c. Btw it's not like it's never been that way, the Ares-16 MCR used to hold 99+1 in BF4 until it was later patched. --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 05:04, 13 November 2017 (EST)
Well I'll be damned. Thanks for finding that, U94N. By the way, how long did that take you to find? Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 16:39, 13 November 2017 (EST)
I saw the 59+1 listed somewhere a long time ago and found a video confirming this (I don't remember how long it took me, but I don't think it was hard), and then I added the info to the page. Today it didn't take me much time either; just select the duration filter for the YouTube search to "Short (< 4 minutes)", sort by upload date to make sure it's sort of recent gameplay where the weapon wasn't patched or something, aaaaand profit. --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 17:26, 13 November 2017 (EST)
You guys say this like none of you actually play the game. xD Since the Hellriegel capacity is downscaled from the real one, really any value at all could be correct; 59+1 is just less "intuitive" than a nice round number +1. From that same line of thought, it's possible they went with 59+1 because people are very rarely going to run it empty, so it will almost always show a clean, pretty, round 60 on the HUD. Alex T Snow (talk) 23:26, 13 November 2017 (EST)
Limpet Mines
I tried my best to do research about this mine, but I don't have any conclusive evidence that the thing shown in the picture is the prototype limpet mine described in the linked sources. It's an educated guess since the earliest prototypes were made in 1939 and this picture, as described on Wikipedia (& Wikimedia Commons), says that it was taken in 1939. I'm also not sure if (one of) the production version of the thing looks just like it. If anybody could provide more helpful research I would be incredibly glad.
Also a note to self for a primary source written by one of the inventors: Winston Churchill's Toyshop --Wuzh (talk) 09:35, 11 December 2017 (EST)
SMLE carbine
The SMLE carbine could be based on the New Zealand Carbine or the Royal Irish Contabulary Carbine.
That's a possibility but given both of those are technically Lee-Metford and original Lee-Enfield rifles I doubt it. Given the pile of prototypes in-game, they probably found the prototype SMLE carbine and just added it thinking no one would care. --PaperCake 19:10, 12 December 2017 (EST)
The game gun just appears to be a standard SMLE that has had the barrel and handguard chopped down and the standard nose-cap refitted. The thing is, there are real guns that actually match this configuration. However, I do not think that they are WW1 guns. The "combat" use that I have heard for these guns is that they were WW2 era conversions done by the Australians, and another "non-combat" supposed source of these guns is that post WW1 some schools and cadet forces converted them for use by smaller youngsters (supposedly drill purpose only). --commando552 (talk) 20:17, 16 December 2017 (EST)
More so it could be the Lee–Enfield Cavalry Carbine Mk I. --KuronoX (talk) 20:35, 16 December 2017 (EST)
Even by then I do doubt it. The whole front of the Cavalry Carbine Mk 1 is entirely different from the in-game version. It really does look like they just took the standard SMLE model and chopped a few inches down so there is a British version to the M.95 and M.95 carbines. While the game has some older firearms, including some very obsolete ones, I doubt they'd include a specific carbine version that had been declared obsolete before the war even began. --PaperCake 21:05, 16 December 2017 (EST)
Can we change it from the Jungle Carbine, though? I feel like listing it under that entry is wrong since the in-game carbine hardly resembles it.--AgentGumby (talk) 23:45, 16 December 2017 (EST)
If you want technical game terms, all of the shorter variants (1895, M.95, SMLE) have a front end "attachment" that simply differs between the two variants; just compare any two to see where the main model and front-end model splits, it's really obvious. Have you ever seen the K-Bullets glitch where you get an 1895 with no sights and no front end? That's because the 1895 is coded as the default, and that's how it appears with no "attachments" (modular parts in game terms). It's the same BF1 SMLE with a shorter front end, in game terms it's that simple. Alex T Snow (talk) 23:11, 18 December 2017 (EST)
According to Milsurps, the British did experiment a shortened SMLE in 1916 and it looks similar to the BF1 SMLE carbine without the globe sight. so can we change the Jungle carbine to this? I don't know if milsurps approve using photos from their site.--KuronoX (talk) 17:46, 21 December 2017 (EST)
Unless I am misreading it, they do not come to the conclusion that this rifle was an experiment from 1916. They only have theories about where these rifles came from with no actual conclusion due to the total lack of information. The only fact is that the rifle was originally manufactured in 1916, but due to the fact that at some point the rifle was downgraded to only "drill purpose" that would suggest that the modification was done when the rifle was already rather old (so not WWI). As for what they were going for when they modelled this gun I don't think they were really basing it on anything real, they just chopped down the existing model so I would guess that any resemblance to a real gun is more luck than judgment. --commando552 (talk) 18:08, 21 December 2017 (EST)
This thread page said In the Imperial War Museum Review No.6, pages 4-15 is an article by Bryn Hammond - Professionals and specialists: military mining on the Western Front. It describes combat underground and a cut-down version of the .303 rifle is mentioned.--KuronoX (talk) 18:42, 21 December 2017 (EST)
The problem is that there is no image of that gun so we do not know what it actually looked like, and all examples of shortened SMLEs that exist were most likely post war modifications. In fact, the one that you mention there I'm pretty sure is totally different, if you google "sapper's SMLE" or "tunneler's SMLE" you will find what this gun looks like and you will see it is VERY different. These guns are also a little mysterious as they appear like they would be basically unusable, and another possible use I have seen for them is that they were actually a firing method for improvised trench mortars. That being said, I think there is a reference to them out there from someone in a Canadian unit where they talk about doing this due to the fact that they couldn't get any pistols and they were better than nothing. There are some sources that make reference to WW1 era experiments into shortened SMLEs (in the 18-20 inch barrel range rather than these pistol things), but again, we have no images of them to know if they would actually be a match for what they did in this game. --commando552 (talk) 19:17, 21 December 2017 (EST)
I was saying that there was no image in that thread of the sawed off tunneler's gun that the quote you posted was describing (for the record, it is this sort of thing), and that image you posted is of a different gun. Specifically, that particular one was originally made in 1916 but then at some point downgraded to drill purpose (which happens when guns are old and knackered) before being converted into this carbine, which all suggests that this conversion was not done during WW1 so provides no evidence as to what the supposed WW1 era experiments (if they happened) would have actually looked like. --commando552 (talk) 05:26, 22 December 2017 (EST)
Good to see the game simulating the less well-known engagements of the war. Evil Tim (talk) 15:45, 23 December 2017 (EST)
*insert Wat grandma meme* --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 16:38, 23 December 2017 (EST)
It is obvious, that BF1 just a sequel of Bioshock Infinite. --Slon95 (talk) 16:43, 23 December 2017 (EST)
"We are being reinforced by Lord Bowser's Airship" (Somehow, Churchill must be responsible for this).--AgentGumby (talk) 17:19, 23 December 2017 (EST)
Madsen question
I swore this thing used to track +1 in the chamber, does anyone know when they corrected that?--AgentGumby (talk) 23:11, 26 December 2017 (EST)
The most recent patch, the December / Turning Tides one a couple weeks ago. I passed that error on about a month or so ago, not long after Ian of ForgottenWeapons did a video on it, which is where I learned it actually fires from an open bolt. Back during the Beta I had also pointed out the brass incorrectly ejecting out the side, as someone mistook the flappy bolt part for an ejection port (which isn't unreasonable), but despite looking into the rifle then, what I came across seemed to say it fired from a closed bolt. So my bad it stayed with a +1 for over a year. >.> Alex T Snow (talk) 03:44, 27 December 2017 (EST)
M1909 Reload
The current description for the Hotchkiss Mle 1909 says "The reloading animation for the non-empty reload is inaccurate." What is this line talking about? (I guess that the player character just shoves the strip out without disengaging the lock, but I'm not sure) --Wuzh (talk) 05:42, 8 January 2018 (EST)
I've been wondering the same thing. Can't say no to that best-in-class non-empty reload speed though! Alex T Snow (talk) 23:21, 8 January 2018 (EST)
Apocalypse
Well, they've had a small playtesting session, and so now we know about some of the weapons and maps. The Somme, Passchendale, and Caporetto are confirmed as maps, an AA version of the AT Rocket Gun and an MAV-like pigeon with a camera are proposed gadgets, and the Gaswurfminen (a giant mortar-ish thing that volley-fires gas grenades) will be available on at least the Caporetto map. As for weapons, we're getting a Webley Mk. VI (which, interestingly enough, had to have its name censored in the released footage, 'cause apparently DICE forgot that Webley is still a company) as an all-class sidearm, the Howell for the Assault, the M1917 Enfield and Ross Mk. III for the Scout, the MG08/18 for the Support, and the "CSRG SMG" (the Chauchat-Ribeyrolles automatic carbine/submachine gun apparently being its full name), an odd experimental French thing that fired full-auto and used an 8-round en-bloc clip of 8x50R Lebel stuck in the bottom. Fingers crossed that this still turns out like ITNOTT, with 2 variants per weapon and 2 weapons per class. Thoughts? Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 17:02, 18 January 2018 (EST) P.S.: So much for the Battle of Husiatyn Woods...
Also two new planes on Caporetto, the Hansa Brandenburg GI and Airco DH10, which I'm guessing are Light Bombers. This is definitely all the weapons, and as a whole I'm quite happy with them. The lack of an ironsight Ross is major disappointment, but otherwise they look very fun. Alex T Snow (talk) 17:11, 18 January 2018 (EST)
I think, that most likely, after the Apocalypse there will be at least one more DLC. Since, in my opinion, they have not exhausted all ideas; and there are still some interesting things from WW1, that they have bypassed. --Slon95 (talk) 14:25, 26 January 2018 (EST)
Disintegrating links on MG08/15
I noticed that the MG08/15 (the Sentry LMG) seems to use disintegrating links. All sources I read say that it uses cloth ammo belts, which are non-disintegrating. The disintegrating links in the weapon seems to be from the Bergmann MG15 nA or the MG34/MG42 (I'm not that good at identifying things, so I'm not sure if the disintegrating links are anachronistic or not). Is it possible in real life to use 7.92x57mm Mauser with disintegrating links on the MG08/15? Or is it artistic license so DICE can animate reloading easier (before they figured out how to do dynamic reloads with rewinding belts later on). --Wuzh (talk) 08:11, 22 January 2018 (EST)
I think disintegrating links are a post-WWII development, but you are probably right about them not having a proper animation for a cloth belt until the release of the Russian DLC. --AgentGumby (talk) 08:43, 22 January 2018 (EST)
Disintegrating belts existed in WW1 for aircraft machine guns. In fact, I believe that they were invented by the Germans for their MG 08s, and the British captured them and copied them. These original links did not work well though and the Germans went back to cloth (partly due to function, but also due to a shortage of necessary quality steel). However the British persevered with them eventual coming up with the Prideaux link (named after the inventor William de Courcy Prideaux who also lends his name to the "Prideaux" speedloader for the Webley revolver) which was used by the British and I believe Americans as well. --commando552 (talk) 09:15, 22 January 2018 (EST)
I know that disintegrating links existed during WWI, I just want to know can the MG08/15 use them or not. So are we saying yes here?--Wuzh (talk) 22:07, 24 January 2018 (EST)
Its one of those things where the answer is technically yes, but practically no. They did have disintegrating links for aircraft MG08s but they were pretty much experimental and very short lived. I doubt that they were ever used on ground MG08/15s, if the belts had been working this probably would have been a good use for them though as you wouldn't have to deal with the trailing cloth belt whilst moving. --commando552 (talk) 12:08, 25 January 2018 (EST)
On another note, does the MG08/18 technically fall under LMG? (seeing as it's air-cooled and lighter than the MG08/15, and has a non-quickly changeable barrel) Or is it still a medium machine gun like the /15? --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 11:42, 3 February 2018 (EST)
The MG08/15 was a light machine gun in terms of usage, given it was designed to be fired from a bipod rather than a tripod and was designed specifically to take over the role of the Madsen since the latter was too expensive. Evil Tim (talk) 12:36, 3 February 2018 (EST)
Ah, I remembered discussion and sort of ran with its outcome, but after reconsidering things such as the bipod and the like, yeah I believe you're right, they're both LMGs. I suppose the Browning M1919A6 is considered as an LMG as well, eh? --Ultimate94ninja (talk) 12:53, 3 February 2018 (EST)
Yeah, they all sort of fall under the category of "not very light machine guns". Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 15:59, 3 February 2018 (EST)
To answer your original question about the 08/18, the period correct designation would possibly be to call it a light machine gun as it does at least get rid of the water cooling of the /15 and is hence less awkward and possibly could be operated well by one individual. I still don't think that you can call the 08/15 an LMG, if for no other reason than it pretty much has to be crew served. You could potentially argue that the /15 might even fall into the realm of being a GPMG (albeit not a very good one) as it could operate from a bipod or tripod, but I would personally say it isn't as you can't fire it offhand very well like an LMG. I would say the M1919A6 also falls into this gray area of being a sort of GPMG as it can be used off of the bipod or tripod, and semi well offhand. You have the extra confusion with the MG08 that the aircraft variants were called the lMG08 and lMG08/15 (lower case "L" at the front) which makes people think it is aa Light Machine Gun, but in this case the "l" stands for "luftgekühlt" meaning air-cooled. Regardless, you are pretty much always on a course for failure if you want to come up with hard and fast rules for categorising early machine guns as definitions varied so much with country, time period and context, and there will always be exceptions to any rule. --commando552 (talk) 18:28, 3 February 2018 (EST)
Although I am a big fan of Forgotten Weapons Ian's definitions in that video have a some problems, chiefly due to the fact that he is attempting to create a scale using terminology that did not all exist in the same period. There are also some obvious holes, such as in this case the 08/15 does not fit into any of the categories based on his criteria. --commando552 (talk) 18:54, 3 February 2018 (EST)
I'm not sure how you're defining LMG, Commando, they're usually crew-served (gunner + ammo carrier, the main difference is the ammo carrier isn't carrying the tripod), isn't it the more vague "automatic rifle" concept where it can conceivably be operated by a single soldier rather than LMG? I mean the Chauchat was specifically designed to have an ammo carrier, and the Lewis wasn't exactly portable. And hell, the exemplar of the GPMG, the MG42, would happily kick your ass if you tried to fire it offhand, the M60 wasn't based on it because they wanted it shoulderable like the BAR. Evil Tim (talk) 01:36, 4 February 2018 (EST)
Recoil direction side note
I've noticed this for a while, but thought some others might find this interesting: whenever you alter the recoil direction on most of the automatic weapons, the muzzle model will change. In most cases, the leftward orientation removes the default Madsen MG-like compensator, while the rightward recoil adds a Cutts compensator.--AgentGumby (talk) 15:22, 26 January 2018 (EST)
Dammit, I forgot that I never shared that over here. Yeah, for SMGs neutral has no device, left has the Madsen's WWII-era flash hider, and right has the custom Cutts-style comp from one of the Dillinger Gang's M1907s (which ironically cannot alter recoil, despite the Sweeper being full auto). LMGs swap neutral/left, which means all LMGs that get devices have the Madsen flash hider by default. This is exactly why I set my Hotchkiss, Madsen, MG15, BAR, Parabellum, Perino, and Browning to left recoil, to get rid of it. I tried bugging a dev about it, but he said that the dev behind this swap felt the MGs looked too "naked" without a muzzle device, so it's not gonna get fixed. :( Alex T Snow (talk) 19:11, 26 January 2018 (EST)
Maxim SMG rate of fire buff
It's being changed from 450rpm to 770rpm! Finally it won't be useless! Here's a quote from Chad Wilkinson / DICE-RandomDeviation, their main weapon designer: "About the SMG08/18, we found some information that makes the new version seem much more like how the real one probably would have worked. [someone asks: "From Tula?"] From physics, and from some features on the real weapon. The Maxim action scaled down to 9x19 would need like 1/3 the bolt travel distance and could use much lighter parts with the weaker cartridge; both of those imply a much higher fire rate than the full size MG of the same action. Also, the real one has a pintle mount on the pistol grip, which implies it was probably intended as an aircraft observer's gun, where high fire rate would be very desirable." Alex T Snow (talk) 15:34, 2 February 2018 (EST)
Nice! It's good to see that they're taking efforts to encourage people to use the game's lesser-used weapons, while also implementing features aimed at realism. Although, it makes me wonder if that's just going to sort of invalidate the MP18. I mean, higher fire rate, same damage, higher capacity... maybe the recoil will balance it out? Pyr0m4n14c (talk) 17:57, 2 February 2018 (EST)
I've been playing around with it in CTE today, and oh boy it's a ton of fun, but it's even less controllable than the Hellriegel. The MP 18's freshly buffed status as best all-round SMG isn't in any danger. :) Alex T Snow (talk) 02:15, 3 February 2018 (EST)
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