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Talk:Full Metal Jacket: Difference between revisions
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The Tet Offensive took place on January 31, 1968, so I believe the equipment would be correct. | The Tet Offensive took place on January 31, 1968, so I believe the equipment would be correct. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] ([[User talk:Ben41|talk]]) 05:50, 28 October 2012 (EDT) | ||
:Yeah, thanks DUH! (slap head), I forgot that the Tet Offensive was shown in the movie. It's been that long since I've seen it. But as I recall, all of the Marines I saw in actual combat footage of the Tet offensive still wore the old M58 flak vests (with the rib on the shoulder to hold the rifle sling), so these 'marines' in the movie are getting their gear BEFORE the Army, lol! [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 16:46, 5 April 2010 (UTC) | :Yeah, thanks DUH! (slap head), I forgot that the Tet Offensive was shown in the movie. It's been that long since I've seen it. But as I recall, all of the Marines I saw in actual combat footage of the Tet offensive still wore the old M58 flak vests (with the rib on the shoulder to hold the rifle sling), so these 'marines' in the movie are getting their gear BEFORE the Army, lol! [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 16:46, 5 April 2010 (UTC) | ||
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I thought the sniper has a rifle with scope? Every sniper has a rifle with scope I thought, but the VC sniper seems to shoot very accurate on big distances? Or has she got a scope? | I thought the sniper has a rifle with scope? Every sniper has a rifle with scope I thought, but the VC sniper seems to shoot very accurate on big distances? Or has she got a scope? | ||
:No, she didn't have a scope. They called her a sniper because they didn't know or give a damn what kind of gun she was using. - [[User:Kilgore|Kilgore]] 23:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC) | :No, she didn't have a scope. They called her a sniper because they didn't know or give a damn what kind of gun she was using. - [[User:Kilgore|Kilgore]] 23:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC) | ||
Not all snipers have a scoped rifle. Its not the rifle that makes the person a sniper.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:32, 29 June 2011 (CDT) | |||
:Yeah, the original snipers didn't have scopes. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 01:59, 30 June 2011 (CDT) | |||
:: Simo Hayha had 505 confirmed kills with Finnish M/28 version of the Mosin Nagant. He preferred using iron sights because he could present a smaller target, without having to raise his head to the scope, as well in the cold climate of the Winter War, scopes could fog up. He also would pack the snow down infront of his position so the shot wouldnt disturb the snow around him, as well as keeping snow in his mouth to keep his breath from giving away his position. | |||
::A sniper is someone who shoots from cover at distance to kill with accuracy and efficiency. Atleast thats how i always saw it. -MissySummers- 20:50, 8 January 2012 (CST) | |||
What makes a sniper rifle a sniper rifle? The person using it. | |||
:What makes a sniper rifle a sniper rifle is the rifle being designed to deliver precision fire over long distances. If I handed a Mossberg 590 or MP5 to a sniper, that wouldn't make those respective long arms "sniper rifles", would it? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 17:52, 21 January 2014 (EST) | |||
:: ^ Indeed. I agree. But a trained sniper not having a specifically designed sniper rifle and instead having a regular infantry rifle doesn't make them NOT a sniper if they can still deliver effective, long-range, well-aimed fire, as shown in this film. The main debate here is terminology and more in terms of an individual, not the weapon - And again, since the shooter here is delivering well-aimed fire at a bit of a distance she could still easily be called a sniper, even if she isn't using a specifically-designed sniper weapon. Especially by marines who are under fire from her, can't see her and are being picked off by her well-aimed fire. What would you call her in that situation? Just a shooter? Sharpshooter? Marksman? Bah, this is really just a debate over semantics. To answer the original, frankly silly, query, No - A sniper doesn't necessarily have to have a sniper rifle or even just a scoped rifle to be a 'sniper' in that context. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 21:44, 21 January 2014 (EST) | |||
== Blank cartridges? == | == Blank cartridges? == | ||
It seems to me, that in the scene Joker uses the M60 at the enemy assault on the marine base, he only has blank cartridges in his ammo belt. | It seems to me, that in the scene Joker uses the M60 at the enemy assault on the marine base (Timecode 55:30), he only has blank cartridges in his ammo belt. | ||
See http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Blank_cartridge_7.62_x_51mm.jpg to compare. | See http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Blank_cartridge_7.62_x_51mm.jpg to compare. | ||
Might this be possible? | Might this be possible? | ||
:It's very possible, movies use blanks instead of live ammunition for safety, and because blank rounds on belts can't hide the fact they're blanks because they're out in the open. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]] | |||
It's also illegal to use live ammo on a film set due to health and safety as well isn't it? --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 09:17, 13 April 2011 (CDT) | |||
:I don't think it's ''illegal'', but I imagine the studios' respective insurance departments would have a cow. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 17:40, 21 January 2014 (EST) | |||
== M16? Accurate? == | |||
The original M16 wasn't used by the Marines, Only by the Air Force. The Marines and Army (not sure about Navy) used the XM16E1 and M16A1, and since the film takes place in 1968, they should be using the M16A1, not the original M16(SP1). Unless the M16 was the only one they could find then thats acceptable. --[[User:Gunner5|Gunner5]] | |||
== "Jungle Style"? == | |||
Want to make sure this right before I post but on this page it says that "Jungle Style" originated in the 'Nam war with the M16, correct if I'm wrong, but wasn't it World War II with the 20 round Thompson mags that caused the creation of "Jungle Style"...? | |||
[[User:theocd]] | |||
:Makes sense. The earliest reference I found here was in ''[[Battleground]]'', which came out in 1949. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 08:34, 2 February 2012 (CST) | |||
::Why do they call it jungle style if it originated during WWII?--[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 17:57, 2 February 2012 (CST) | |||
:::Much of the war was fought in the jungles of the Pacific. And even if the term didn't originate in WWII, that doesn't mean the practice didn't. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 18:22, 2 February 2012 (CST) | |||
::::I keep forgetting that US forces didn't join the war until 1942, being British I'm used to most of WWII being fought in the European and African Theaters of war. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 19:00, 2 February 2012 (CST) | |||
== Spare caps == | |||
There's a screencap that's pretty much identical to this production image, so there's no point having both on the page. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 16:17, 10 July 2013 (EDT) | |||
[[Image:FullMetalJacket MGC16.jpg|thumb|none|500px|A production image of [[Matthew Modine]] as Pvt. Joker holding a Model Gun Corp MGC M16.]] | |||
== M41 Walker Bulldogs? == | |||
Are the M41s accurate? I thought only South Vietnam used them by the film's setting and the US used M48s. --[[User:Maxman|Maxman]] ([[User talk:Maxman|talk]]) 03:04, 23 October 2015 (EDT) | |||
: The tanks in the film definitely look to be M41s. Which were probably easier to acquire for the film as they were much older. That said, I believe it's still correct though - Marines still used Walker Bulldogs in 'Nam (or, rather, during during that time at least) IIRC, while the Army had/used M48s (and later, M60s). The USMC was generally stuck with using the next older-tier of vehicles/etc. Marine armor in the first Gulf War still consisted of older M60A1s and M60A3s, as opposed to the Army which rolled around with Abrams tanks, for example. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 14:42, 23 October 2015 (EDT) | |||
::I was also under the impression that M41s were not deployed in Vietnam by US forces, however they were used in large numbers by the ARVN. The closest thing to an M41 that was used by US forces would have been the M42 Duster. Bear in mind, it isn't like the M48 was a replacement for the M41, the M41 was a light tank which replaced the Chaffee and was replaced by the Sheridan, as opposed to the M48 which was a medium tank replacing the M47 and was replaced by the M60. I'm pretty sure the US didn't actually use the M60 in Vietnam either, with the exception of specialist vehicles like combat engineering and bridgelaying variants. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 18:02, 23 October 2015 (EDT) | |||
::: Well, like I said, USMC generally got stuck with using older and sometimes smaller stuff. That said I was referencing more of a period and not actual deployment in the war (should have wrote that better but I was in a rush). That said, I honestly do remember hearing/reading Marines using Walkers in the war, I could be wrong though. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 23:14, 23 October 2015 (EDT) | |||
Latest revision as of 03:15, 24 October 2015
Timeframe?
Anyone know the actual YEAR this is supposed to take place? I noticed that the 'Marines' are wearing the M69 flak vests, which came out in late 67-early 68, and Marines got everything later than the Army did. MoviePropMaster2008 15:12, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
The Tet Offensive took place on January 31, 1968, so I believe the equipment would be correct. --Ben41 (talk) 05:50, 28 October 2012 (EDT)
- Yeah, thanks DUH! (slap head), I forgot that the Tet Offensive was shown in the movie. It's been that long since I've seen it. But as I recall, all of the Marines I saw in actual combat footage of the Tet offensive still wore the old M58 flak vests (with the rib on the shoulder to hold the rifle sling), so these 'marines' in the movie are getting their gear BEFORE the Army, lol! MoviePropMaster2008 16:46, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
Ranks
By the Vietnam sequence (set a couple years after Boot Camp), Joker is Sergeant and Cowboy is a Corporal, the page continually still refers to them as Pvt though.
- Cowboy is a Staff Sergeant or so. Crazy Earl is a Gunnery Sergeant and Touchdown is a Lt. I don't think Joker is supposed to be an sergent though.-Oliveira 20:40, 6 August 2009 (UTC)
- I definitely recall Joker referring to himself as a 'Sergeant' in the film (I believe when he talks to the Lt. after finding the mass grave, right before he gets chewed out by that Colonel.) StanTheMan 16:46, 5 April 2010 (UTC)
VC Sniper (Ngoc Le)
I thought the sniper has a rifle with scope? Every sniper has a rifle with scope I thought, but the VC sniper seems to shoot very accurate on big distances? Or has she got a scope?
- No, she didn't have a scope. They called her a sniper because they didn't know or give a damn what kind of gun she was using. - Kilgore 23:47, 13 August 2010 (UTC)
Not all snipers have a scoped rifle. Its not the rifle that makes the person a sniper.--FIVETWOSEVEN 22:32, 29 June 2011 (CDT)
- Yeah, the original snipers didn't have scopes. - Mr. Wolf 01:59, 30 June 2011 (CDT)
- Simo Hayha had 505 confirmed kills with Finnish M/28 version of the Mosin Nagant. He preferred using iron sights because he could present a smaller target, without having to raise his head to the scope, as well in the cold climate of the Winter War, scopes could fog up. He also would pack the snow down infront of his position so the shot wouldnt disturb the snow around him, as well as keeping snow in his mouth to keep his breath from giving away his position.
- A sniper is someone who shoots from cover at distance to kill with accuracy and efficiency. Atleast thats how i always saw it. -MissySummers- 20:50, 8 January 2012 (CST)
What makes a sniper rifle a sniper rifle? The person using it.
- What makes a sniper rifle a sniper rifle is the rifle being designed to deliver precision fire over long distances. If I handed a Mossberg 590 or MP5 to a sniper, that wouldn't make those respective long arms "sniper rifles", would it? Spartan198 (talk) 17:52, 21 January 2014 (EST)
- ^ Indeed. I agree. But a trained sniper not having a specifically designed sniper rifle and instead having a regular infantry rifle doesn't make them NOT a sniper if they can still deliver effective, long-range, well-aimed fire, as shown in this film. The main debate here is terminology and more in terms of an individual, not the weapon - And again, since the shooter here is delivering well-aimed fire at a bit of a distance she could still easily be called a sniper, even if she isn't using a specifically-designed sniper weapon. Especially by marines who are under fire from her, can't see her and are being picked off by her well-aimed fire. What would you call her in that situation? Just a shooter? Sharpshooter? Marksman? Bah, this is really just a debate over semantics. To answer the original, frankly silly, query, No - A sniper doesn't necessarily have to have a sniper rifle or even just a scoped rifle to be a 'sniper' in that context. StanTheMan (talk) 21:44, 21 January 2014 (EST)
Blank cartridges?
It seems to me, that in the scene Joker uses the M60 at the enemy assault on the marine base (Timecode 55:30), he only has blank cartridges in his ammo belt. See http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Datei:Blank_cartridge_7.62_x_51mm.jpg to compare. Might this be possible?
- It's very possible, movies use blanks instead of live ammunition for safety, and because blank rounds on belts can't hide the fact they're blanks because they're out in the open. - Gunmaster45
It's also illegal to use live ammo on a film set due to health and safety as well isn't it? --cool-breeze 09:17, 13 April 2011 (CDT)
- I don't think it's illegal, but I imagine the studios' respective insurance departments would have a cow. Spartan198 (talk) 17:40, 21 January 2014 (EST)
M16? Accurate?
The original M16 wasn't used by the Marines, Only by the Air Force. The Marines and Army (not sure about Navy) used the XM16E1 and M16A1, and since the film takes place in 1968, they should be using the M16A1, not the original M16(SP1). Unless the M16 was the only one they could find then thats acceptable. --Gunner5
"Jungle Style"?
Want to make sure this right before I post but on this page it says that "Jungle Style" originated in the 'Nam war with the M16, correct if I'm wrong, but wasn't it World War II with the 20 round Thompson mags that caused the creation of "Jungle Style"...? User:theocd
- Makes sense. The earliest reference I found here was in Battleground, which came out in 1949. --Funkychinaman 08:34, 2 February 2012 (CST)
- Why do they call it jungle style if it originated during WWII?--cool-breeze 17:57, 2 February 2012 (CST)
- Much of the war was fought in the jungles of the Pacific. And even if the term didn't originate in WWII, that doesn't mean the practice didn't. --Funkychinaman 18:22, 2 February 2012 (CST)
- I keep forgetting that US forces didn't join the war until 1942, being British I'm used to most of WWII being fought in the European and African Theaters of war. --cool-breeze 19:00, 2 February 2012 (CST)
- Much of the war was fought in the jungles of the Pacific. And even if the term didn't originate in WWII, that doesn't mean the practice didn't. --Funkychinaman 18:22, 2 February 2012 (CST)
- Why do they call it jungle style if it originated during WWII?--cool-breeze 17:57, 2 February 2012 (CST)
Spare caps
There's a screencap that's pretty much identical to this production image, so there's no point having both on the page. --Funkychinaman (talk) 16:17, 10 July 2013 (EDT)
M41 Walker Bulldogs?
Are the M41s accurate? I thought only South Vietnam used them by the film's setting and the US used M48s. --Maxman (talk) 03:04, 23 October 2015 (EDT)
- The tanks in the film definitely look to be M41s. Which were probably easier to acquire for the film as they were much older. That said, I believe it's still correct though - Marines still used Walker Bulldogs in 'Nam (or, rather, during during that time at least) IIRC, while the Army had/used M48s (and later, M60s). The USMC was generally stuck with using the next older-tier of vehicles/etc. Marine armor in the first Gulf War still consisted of older M60A1s and M60A3s, as opposed to the Army which rolled around with Abrams tanks, for example. StanTheMan (talk) 14:42, 23 October 2015 (EDT)
- I was also under the impression that M41s were not deployed in Vietnam by US forces, however they were used in large numbers by the ARVN. The closest thing to an M41 that was used by US forces would have been the M42 Duster. Bear in mind, it isn't like the M48 was a replacement for the M41, the M41 was a light tank which replaced the Chaffee and was replaced by the Sheridan, as opposed to the M48 which was a medium tank replacing the M47 and was replaced by the M60. I'm pretty sure the US didn't actually use the M60 in Vietnam either, with the exception of specialist vehicles like combat engineering and bridgelaying variants. --commando552 (talk) 18:02, 23 October 2015 (EDT)
- Well, like I said, USMC generally got stuck with using older and sometimes smaller stuff. That said I was referencing more of a period and not actual deployment in the war (should have wrote that better but I was in a rush). That said, I honestly do remember hearing/reading Marines using Walkers in the war, I could be wrong though. StanTheMan (talk) 23:14, 23 October 2015 (EDT)
- I was also under the impression that M41s were not deployed in Vietnam by US forces, however they were used in large numbers by the ARVN. The closest thing to an M41 that was used by US forces would have been the M42 Duster. Bear in mind, it isn't like the M48 was a replacement for the M41, the M41 was a light tank which replaced the Chaffee and was replaced by the Sheridan, as opposed to the M48 which was a medium tank replacing the M47 and was replaced by the M60. I'm pretty sure the US didn't actually use the M60 in Vietnam either, with the exception of specialist vehicles like combat engineering and bridgelaying variants. --commando552 (talk) 18:02, 23 October 2015 (EDT)