Talk:Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker: Difference between revisions
Talk:Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker: Difference between revisions - Internet Movie Firearms Database - Guns in Movies, TV and Video Games
Talk:Metal Gear Solid: Peace Walker: Difference between revisions
== This game was rated and marketed for an "E" audience in Japan ==
You'd think that a game focussed on the workings of what is essentially a mercenary unit whose recruiting opportunities are largely filled via kidnapping, full of realistically modelled guns that almost always kill ingame NPCs, and contains a torture sequence, would be rated higher than "E", but not in Japan. Two official Japanese TV commercials found [http://youtu.be/Ew4TRnWZg1I here] and [http://youtu.be/ATy1Fl2X_ag here] even show how the game was marketed to schoolchildren. Guess you're never too young to have fun with ''Militaires Sans Frontieres''. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 20:38, 19 February 2015 (EST)
:Don't forget the praising of Che Guevara, the references to the drug trade an prostitution (heck, that's how Miller was conceived. He was a bastard, and I mean the accurate terminology, not the insulting kind), the references to the depraved free love movement of May 1968, and the like. Regarding the torture sequence, though, the Japanese version censored that bit actually. Apparently, in the Japanese version, Strangelove, instead of electric batons, just uses laughing rods to effectively tickle Snake for info (which is actually a bit humorous, if in a slightly dark manner since it's still implied a high enough frequency will have Snake die laughing), and they don't directly allude to the torture later on (specifically, when Strangelove makes peace with Big Boss, Strangelove's apology came across as just being her treatment of Snake in general, not anything specific she did to him unlike the English version where she specifically apologized about the torture she gave him). [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 21:15, 19 February 2015 (EST)
Guys, this is Japan we're talking about. It'll take more than a game about the darkness of war for them to bat an eye. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 22:24, 19 February 2015 (EST)
Peace Walker is rated T in the US, the lowest ESRB rating of any MGS game, but it's not rated "E" in Japan. For one Japan doesn't use the ESRB ratings so there is no E, they use the CERO ratings https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_Entertainment_Rating_Organization and every photo I see of the Japan version of the Peace Walker box has a C rating on it, roughly corresponding to a T rating. And of course you have to remember this was a game for the PSP originally, if you don't market your handheld game to teens you might as well just burn all the copies, it makes about as much financial sense. [[User:S3anyBoy|S3anyBoy]] ([[User talk:S3anyBoy|talk]]) 12:20, 20 February 2015 (EST)
:Actually, C corresponds with "E". Even Portable Ops Plus, the only other MGS game to get a T rating, got a significantly higher rating than a "C" in Japan, closer to some of the more mature rated games even. And Kojima explicitly stated he was marketing towards children, not teens or especially adults, it's in fact why Yellow was a primary color of the game, since it corresponds with School POP, or school bus colors.
[[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 12:48, 20 February 2015 (EST)
You have any citation for C being the same as E? The ratings classification clearly states that C is "Ages 15 and up". As far as the bus theory, there are lots of non-yellow buses, especially in Japan, and you also ride school buses into high school where teenagers, the intended audience of the game, usually go. [[User:S3anyBoy|S3anyBoy]] ([[User talk:S3anyBoy|talk]]) 13:45, 20 February 2015 (EST)
:Here's the link, and Kojima specifically stated that he wanted the ESRB system to be rated "E", not "T" in this link, which would in fact mean CERO's rating of C is equivalent to E since he wouldn't need to complain about that if "T" was "C"'s closest rating: http://www.siliconera.com/2010/03/03/metal-gear-solid-peace-walker-is-t-kojima-wishes-it-was-e-for-everyone/, and besides that, he also mentioned in an FAQ for the official Metal Gear site that he wanted the game to be geared towards "school kids," which implies an age range closer to grade school or primary school, NOT middle or especially high school. He also said in the same FAQ that the color yellow in the game being a major color dealt directly with their intended audience, specifically citing POP style as their main inspiration and intended message. [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 16:51, 20 February 2015 (EST)
::He says "wish it could have been" which could just as easily have meant he never thought it was actually going to be rated E because of the subject matter ("wish it could" indicating resignation rather than a declaration of intent). I've changed it to just "younger audiences" since that gets the point across well enough. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 17:17, 20 February 2015 (EST)
:::Okay, but this article makes explicit and under no ambiguous terms that he intended for the game to be played by school kids: http://gdn9.com/story-16337-MGS-Peace-Walker-Q-A-Plus-Other-Details.html [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 17:29, 20 February 2015 (EST)
::::Well yeah, but fifteen year olds ''are'' schoolkids. The previous games were rated more for college-age. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 17:32, 20 February 2015 (EST)
:This discussion is going off the rails. If you want to discuss politics, there are better places for it. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 13:56, 20 February 2015 (EST)
I've added another version of the commercial to the initial post in this thread. By the way, wasn't the idea of "laughing to death" first widely spread by the comic-book version of the Joker (and his "Joker Venom") from the [[Batman]] franchise? Of course, "tickle rods" might not leave a rictus grin on your face after you expire, but the idea and the horror behind it should be largely the same. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 18:24, 20 February 2015 (EST)
:Tickle-torture is one of those hard-to-understand fetishes the internet will let you discover the existence of. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 18:43, 20 February 2015 (EST)
The example I mentioned about the Joker and how he leaves his poisoned victims laughing before they die with a hideous grin on their faces certainly predates the internet becoming mainstream. So "laughing to death" is not that new as a concept (which is what they dressed up the torture sequence in this game as for the Japanese version).--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 00:14, 26 February 2015 (EST)
== Cleaned up the mess ==
This page needs some spell checking, badly!
This page needs some spell checking, badly!
:Fixed for spelling and grammar. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]
:Fixed for spelling and grammar. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]]
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:FIM-92A
:FIM-92A
== Cleaned up the mess ==
Tidied up and removed old information (most of them were based on demo version). Somebody should add more text 'cause I'm not good at typing stuff.
Tidied up and removed old information (most of them were based on demo version). Somebody should add more text 'cause I'm not good at typing stuff.
--[[User:SilentwarriorX|SilentwarriorX]] 05:34, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
--[[User:SilentwarriorX|SilentwarriorX]] 05:34, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
Line 32:
Line 59:
:thatsgood work and all and ive added some words will do a more in depth one soon but you deleted the XM177E2 pictures --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 17:23, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
:thatsgood work and all and ive added some words will do a more in depth one soon but you deleted the XM177E2 pictures --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 17:23, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
There wasn't any pics of XM1772 in the first place... I'm not even sure if that gun exists in this game. I've played this for over 40 hours and haven't seen one. --[[User:SilentwarriorX|SilentwarriorX]] 06:35, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
There wasn't any pics of XM177E2 in the first place... I'm not even sure if that gun exists in this game. I've played this for over 40 hours and haven't seen one. --[[User:SilentwarriorX|SilentwarriorX]] 06:35, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
there definatly is, ive got it, it looks similar to the M4 but has a telescopic stock and sometimes has a m203 and suppressor --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 17:05, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
sorry, your right i mistook the other rifle for it, yeah its not on the game i'll delete it --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 17:06, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
== M16 ==
The description says that the M16 comes with a 30 round clip. I'm not going to post the whole rant about how it's not called a clip here, but I'm going to fix that obvious discrepancy. Hopefully whoever wrote that part just had a minor slip up. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 08:22, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
Good, less rant, just make the correction. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:50, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
Do you want a medal and bucket full of cookies too? --[[User:SilentwarriorX|SilentwarriorX]] 16:03, 22 July 2010 (UTC)
:Yes. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 17:02, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
== New screenies needed ==
I suggest someone try pulling some of the weapon screenshots from the US version. I would try it but I can't seem to get RemoteJoy working on my CFW'd PSP. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 17:19, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
Pics are fine, but japanese letters are kinda on way, why whoever took those left them on when there's an option to remove them?
== Shotgun attachment ==
Can anyone identify the shotgun attachment for the M16 and 653? My bet is either the Mossberg 500 or Remington 870 but I can't tell the difference from the model viewer.
:I think it's a 870[[User:Sate2801|Sate2801]] 06:51, 3 September 2010 (UTC)
::It's a shortened Ithaca 37. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:08, 23 May 2011 (CDT)
== M18 smoke grenade ==
That's not an M18; whatever it is, it's the same as the flashbang / chaff model from MGS4 that I've got down as "unknown stun grenade." I think it's actually something like an airsoft "distraction device" grenade, such as this: http://www.fire-support.co.uk/product/gbtech-td-distraction-device--gas-charger- . [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:26, 7 June 2011 (CDT)
:I know I saw a picture of an M18 that looked very similar to what was shown in-game. It was either on Google images or Bing images. [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] 16:54, 20 August 2011 (CDT)
:Okay, I found them, and design wise, it's pretty clearly intended to be the M18. Here are some comparison pics from MGS4 and MPW:
[[File:MGS4-M18.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M18 regular in ''Metal Gear Solid 4'']]
[[File:PEACEWALKER-SMOKE.jpg|thumb|none|350px|M18 regular in ''Peace Walker'']]
:As you can see here, they both share the same stripe, which makes identifying it easy. [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] 13:02, 12 July 2012 (CDT)
== Anachronisms ==
I think we really need to clean up on the Anachronisms a bit. Yes, the game does technically take place in 1974, but there were some hints that the game does indeed have time passing. For starters, Miller references Sir Eric Gairy, the Prime Minister of Grenada, requesting for the UN to set up a facility to study extraterrestrial occurances thanks to Chico. The only time something like that happened was in 1977 (and trust me, I checked). Besides, several of the weapons were developed using design specs, which are implied to be blueprints of the weapons in question, so it was likely that they just developed them earlier than usual. [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] 17:12, 20 August 2011 (CDT)
I would like to mention that the G11 is listed as anachronistic but it isn't that much anachronistic since the development started in 1968 and the modeled prototype variant is very close to prototype 2 wich was made around 1975. So 1975 is 5 years away from the 80s and the text is at the moment wrong. Prototype 2 even was tested by the Bundewehr. --[[User:DAN11|DAN11]] ([[User talk:DAN11|talk]]) 12:27, 30 November 2012 (EST)
:NVGs are pretty impressive, I think they're AN/PVS-7 from 1985. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 05:52, 9 January 2015 (EST)
== MGS:HD Update? ==
So with the release of the MGS:HD Collestion, will the current page be refinished to include the 720p resolution screenshots and english descriptions, or will it more than likely just stay the way it is now?
Could go either way, but just out of curiosity. The current pictures have quite a bit of aliasing xD -- Long Fallen 00:04, 24 November 2011 (CST)
:Problem with that is it isn't out over here until February 2012. :( [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 01:13, 24 November 2011 (CST)
::Do we have people who can grab screens from consoles? [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 07:08, 24 November 2011 (CST)
:::We have me, yes. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 13:28, 24 November 2011 (CST)
== Missing Hidden Weapon ==
I saw a hidden weapon in the game, Musket. you forgot to add it [[User:ReikoKotobuki|ReikoKotobuki]]
== Ejecting rounds during reload ==
There's a discontinuity between how Big Boss reloads his weapon compared to MGS3. Example was with the M16. In MGS3 he would slap the release when he reloads a fresh mag, but in this game, he racks the charging handle back ejecting a live round like Solid Snake did in MGS4. And he does this with every rifle in the game except the pistols...like MGS4 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:16, 2 June 2012 (CDT)
This was made after MGS 4 [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 17:56, 12 June 2012 (CDT)
I know. My point was...why? It's like they somehow took the reload animation from MGS4 and downgrade the graphics to PSP quality and have Big Boss do it here [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:28, 12 June 2012 (CDT)
Doesn't the bolt release degrade everytime it's used? So wouldn't it be a better idea to use the charging handle instead if you're going to be out in the field for quite a while and expecting quite a few firefights? And isn't it also believed (but unproven) that the charging handle is more reliable than the bolt release? Pretty sure if that was the case, then Snake would use the most reliable method to reload his weapons, the M16 in MGS3 is most likely a special case since from the dialogue you get when calling The Boss or Sigint seem to imply that it's the first time Naked Snake gets his hands on an M16 type rifle.[[User:Kornflakes89|Kornflakes89]] 13:33, 13 August 2012 (CDT)
:I'm fairly sure the bolt release is not the most likely moving part of a gun to break down, and most people would rather have a busted bolt release than waste a bullet every time they reload. It's probably just some weird shooting technique that only Operators and people who got shot when they ran out of bullets from wasting them all would understand. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 13:43, 13 August 2012 (CDT)
::Personally, i'd rather know i have a round in the chamber than risk miscounting how many shots i fired before reloading, and the ejected live rounds can be picked up for later use after all the shooting is done (which would be kinda funny IMO, reloading then an M16 ammo box pops out of the chamber with one bullet), but that's just my way of thinking about it, you guys are the experts here. [[User:Kornflakes89|Kornflakes89]] 04:46, 15 August 2012 (CDT)
::Its irrelevant that the bolt release may degrade or be less reliable, if it is the case that when he racks the charging handle after a reload a round ejects that mean the bolt hold open itself is being ignored. There is no choice being made here, the developers have ignored part of how a gun works. If you fire an M16 empty, the bolt will hold open and if you pull the charging handle no round will be ejected as all that will happen is the bolt will move forward chambering the first round from the new magazine. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 14:39, 13 August 2012 (CDT)
:::I see what you're saying, but i don't personally see any evidence that it's being ignored, Snake in MGS3 is pretty much a noob, yeah he's seen some combat, but not enough to make him the totally battle scared man he becomes when he takes on the name Big Boss, he could just simply be making sure there's always a round in the chamber ready to fire, and i don't see how it's irrelevant whether the bolt release degrades or is less reliable, if it degrades then it degrades, i'm pretty sure one would rather use the charging handle as much as possible and only use the bolt release when reloading fast is needed than risk having it not work if it does degrade. [[User:Kornflakes89|Kornflakes89]] 04:46, 15 August 2012 (CDT)
::::I believe that Commando is saying that once you load a mag into an empty M16, pulling the charging handle will just chamber the first round in the mag and not eject a round, because you can't eject a round before it is even chambered in the gun itself. --[[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]] 10:24, 15 August 2012 (CDT)
:::::I guess he could be putting the gun in battery and then pulling the charging handle afterwards, which might make ''some'' sense the first time you pick a weapon up to ensure it isn't jammed or broken and can actually cycle. I remain unsure why you'd actually do that all the time, though. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 10:30, 15 August 2012 (CDT)
Going back on this subject since I decided to play the HD version of this game. In the Marine Corp when you pick up an enemy's weapon after disarming him and need to immediately use it against them, you rack the charging handle or slide to ensure a live round is chambered. Solid Snake did that in MGS4 when he disarmed Johnny. The whole tac reload and racking to eject a live round is a practice that is usually done on pistols not long guns. For continuity sake, it seems Solid Snake, not Naked Snake is the one who likes this practice. In MGS3, Naked Snake even points out Ocelot being kinda stupid for practicing such method with his Makarov, which induced a double feed. Throughout MGS3, when you reload a partially empty mag, you get an extra round count because the game recognizes there is still one in the chamber and the bolt does lock back on the M16 in MGS3. In fact in MGS4, and in Peacewalker, all guns that have a bolt hold feature locks back. Snake in MGS4 just seem to eject a live round and it isn't like some games like Far Cry 2 where you see the racking animation during a tac reload and nothing comes out. The designers intentionally wanted us to see a live round eject. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 23:10, 7 March 2013 (EST)
Also a gun is made of metal and other parts that will degrade over time...a LONG time, but I have yet to see a gun that has been used so much even guns that were hand me down to the National Guards being around for 10 years of use being so old that they don't work anymore. Proper maintenance and the gun will be fine. The bolt/slide release of a gun won't degrade that fast even if you use it a hundred times. Otherwise, you'd see metal shavings all over your hand every time you release the slide. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 23:10, 7 March 2013 (EST)
:Minor note, but he doesn't criticise Ocelot for the technique itself, but for the fact that he was trying it out for the first time in a combat situation. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 11:51, 23 December 2014 (EST)
== Sturmpistole/Kampfpistole ==
I changed the Kampfpistole Z to Sturmpistole because here in the screenshot obviously a Sturmpistole is shown. Then somebody changed my edit back to Kampfpistole with the explanation that it starts out as a Kampfpistole and then can be upgraded to Sturmpistole As those are different versions, could somebody please post a screenshot of the Kampfpistole so I can add both? -Hchris
OK I added both, can somebody please post a screenshot of the Leuchtpistole/Kampfpistole? Thanks -Hchris
:Haven't got a shot yet, but it's the same gun model minus the stock, including the Z marking. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:26, 10 January 2015 (EST)
== Anyone still playing this on PS3? ==
If so, I might eventually be calling on you guys to help out with some screenshots, the guy I usually play co-op with (my good friend Kats, who's in a bunch of the co-op screenshots for the Call of Duty games) is going off to start his pilot training next year.
Also, google up "Convair Model 49," it's kind of fascinating. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 00:48, 24 December 2014 (EST)
:'''Big Boss has been used in the following videogames by the following state bodies, individuals and conspiracies:''' [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:41, 10 January 2015 (EST)
::Isn't that something that's been talked about before in the earlier MGS games? I seem to recall Raiden being called "nothing more than a weapon" in MGS2. So were the three "Les Enfants Terribles" in their own right. Have you tried poking around on MGS forums for fellow PW players who could help you with screenshots?--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 00:18, 11 January 2015 (EST)
:::Eh, I'd rather not play with total strangers. Just need to get the patience to grind that LAV's support troops down, I guess. And the same to get my guy to notice that Rathalos has two wings. They're right there on the sides of him. Idiot. >:( [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 00:38, 18 February 2015 (EST)
::::Well, finally got the wing and I now have a minigun after discovering that the bandana doesn't stop you getting S ranks (which is odd) and using the Fulton Carl Gustav to shoot the 36 mans who were apparently crammed inside a pocket dimension in that Cougar as soon as they got out. Probably won't get a pic of the EMW gun since that's a tank battle and it's much harder to cheesevacuate soldiers who spawn randomly. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 04:58, 19 February 2015 (EST)
:::::Since you're making significant edits to the article (good job so far, BTW), can you try to ID the nuclear missile Peace Walker (and later, ZEKE) prepared to launch at Cuba (and later the East Coast of the United States), as well as the catapults and those missiles on the far left and far right of Mother Base's Support Section, and if allowed note them? [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 09:46, 21 February 2015 (EST)
::::::I think Peace Walker is using a rejigged version of the Sabre launch tube from the Shagohod, but it's a non-standard tube so there's nothing to really ID; realistically it would probably be carrying a Minuteman I or II with a W56 warhead (1.2 megatons); I don't think it's long enough to contain a Titan (101ft, Minuteman is 60). I might put the mother base missiles in a caption, I ''think'' the ones in the wide view are supposed to be Scuds, but they messed up scaling them so they're tiny when you see them in the Mother Base map and don't look like anything. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 04:07, 22 February 2015 (EST)
:::::::Don't they actually briefly show the missile when you fail to stop the launch in time with Peace Walker? You could try failing to stop the launch on purpose so you can actually see the missile in the resulting cutscene. You can also find the missile launch pads if you have a Level 4 Support Unit during the battle with ZEKE (either the battle with Paz or the Mock battle doesn't matter, though I'd personally suggest Mock Battle just to be on the safe side). In fact, those are pretty much as high-res as one can get. I don't know if you can find them in the Miller ending cutscene, but considering the Harpoon systems were present despite not likely being available when first getting the Level 2 Support section (which is required alongside building ZEKE and foiling all six of Zadornov's escape attempts) to even fight Paz/ZEKE, I wouldn't be surprised if it DID appear in that cutscene. [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 07:55, 22 February 2015 (EST)
:::::::::I'll take a look, but do have a level 4 support section, and they're not scaled correctly in the in-game Mother Base, they're tiny stumpy little things whereas on the menu they're most of the height of the gantries next to them.
:::::::::[[Image:Peace Walker-Missiles-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Here they're tiny little missiles with tiny gantries...]]
:::::::::[[Image:Peace Walker-Missiles-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|...while here they're giant ballistic missiles attached to massive radar towers.]]
::::::::::I see. And I would personally suggest doing the Peace Walker 2 mission on the main ops menu and letting Peace Walker launch, since Peace Walker's already in launch mode by that time unlike the Extra Ops Peace Walker battles. It would also save you some grief since it won't fire on you so long as you don't fire on it. One last thing, what are the makes of the catapults on Mother Base (they're the ones on the far left strut of Support Section that launches cardboard boxes when prompted, or far right if you're using Mother Base Menu)? [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 09:08, 22 February 2015 (EST)
:::::::::::Unless I'm missing something, the only thing on that platform is two more Harpoon launchers. The supply consoles have the boxes come in from the right. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 18:26, 24 February 2015 (EST)
::::::::::::I was meaning "left" as in facing the Support Section from the ZEKE deck. From left to right while facing that section from ZEKE Deck is the supply boxes, the M269 Launcher Loader Module launchers, the Harpoon missile launchers, and the missile pads. [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 19:50, 25 February 2015 (EST)
:::::::::::::Yeah, that module just has two boxes on the far left and two Harpoon launchers. You can see they're Harpoons in the background of this shot: http://metalgear.wikia.com/wiki/File:110126034300.JPG [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:44, 25 February 2015 (EST)
::::::::::::::Eh, fair enough. So, have you managed to identify the missile from Peace Walker yet? [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 18:54, 13 March 2015 (EDT)
== About Suppressors ==
I gotta know. What is the point of the indentations on the side of the suppressors for the custom M1911? And what is with the weird shape of the suppressor for the Rank 5 Mk. 22? [[User:Ookami91|Ookami91]] ([[User talk:Ookami91|talk]]) 22:49, 29 March 2015 (EDT)
:Just aesthetic differences as far as I know. --[[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 04:09, 30 March 2015 (GMT)
::I could see the ones on the M1911 being useful if, say, your hands are wet and you're trying to screw it on in a hurry, or you're wearing thick gloves. I think the other is just trying to look all future-y. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 07:04, 30 March 2015 (EDT)
== Peace Walker nuke. ==
Hi.
Has anyone IDed the nuke Peace Walker launched yet in the game over? If so, can someone note it on the article? [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 08:06, 3 April 2015 (EDT)
:Hello? We need an ID the nuke Peace Walker launched during the game over. Can someone do so? [[User:Pokeria1|Pokeria1]] ([[User talk:Pokeria1|talk]]) 08:43, 8 August 2016 (EDT)
I don't think many users here would recognize different nuke types. Given all the anachronisms and less-than-fully-realistic weaponry in this game it's perfectly plausible that the developers cooked up a fictional design to save time and disc space (why else would they go with "motion comics" instead of 3D-rendered cutscenes for this game?). --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 21:06, 8 August 2016 (EDT)
This game was rated and marketed for an "E" audience in Japan
You'd think that a game focussed on the workings of what is essentially a mercenary unit whose recruiting opportunities are largely filled via kidnapping, full of realistically modelled guns that almost always kill ingame NPCs, and contains a torture sequence, would be rated higher than "E", but not in Japan. Two official Japanese TV commercials found here and here even show how the game was marketed to schoolchildren. Guess you're never too young to have fun with Militaires Sans Frontieres. --Mazryonh (talk) 20:38, 19 February 2015 (EST)
Don't forget the praising of Che Guevara, the references to the drug trade an prostitution (heck, that's how Miller was conceived. He was a bastard, and I mean the accurate terminology, not the insulting kind), the references to the depraved free love movement of May 1968, and the like. Regarding the torture sequence, though, the Japanese version censored that bit actually. Apparently, in the Japanese version, Strangelove, instead of electric batons, just uses laughing rods to effectively tickle Snake for info (which is actually a bit humorous, if in a slightly dark manner since it's still implied a high enough frequency will have Snake die laughing), and they don't directly allude to the torture later on (specifically, when Strangelove makes peace with Big Boss, Strangelove's apology came across as just being her treatment of Snake in general, not anything specific she did to him unlike the English version where she specifically apologized about the torture she gave him). Pokeria1 (talk) 21:15, 19 February 2015 (EST)
Guys, this is Japan we're talking about. It'll take more than a game about the darkness of war for them to bat an eye. Excalibur01 (talk) 22:24, 19 February 2015 (EST)
Peace Walker is rated T in the US, the lowest ESRB rating of any MGS game, but it's not rated "E" in Japan. For one Japan doesn't use the ESRB ratings so there is no E, they use the CERO ratings https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Computer_Entertainment_Rating_Organization and every photo I see of the Japan version of the Peace Walker box has a C rating on it, roughly corresponding to a T rating. And of course you have to remember this was a game for the PSP originally, if you don't market your handheld game to teens you might as well just burn all the copies, it makes about as much financial sense. S3anyBoy (talk) 12:20, 20 February 2015 (EST)
Actually, C corresponds with "E". Even Portable Ops Plus, the only other MGS game to get a T rating, got a significantly higher rating than a "C" in Japan, closer to some of the more mature rated games even. And Kojima explicitly stated he was marketing towards children, not teens or especially adults, it's in fact why Yellow was a primary color of the game, since it corresponds with School POP, or school bus colors.
You have any citation for C being the same as E? The ratings classification clearly states that C is "Ages 15 and up". As far as the bus theory, there are lots of non-yellow buses, especially in Japan, and you also ride school buses into high school where teenagers, the intended audience of the game, usually go. S3anyBoy (talk) 13:45, 20 February 2015 (EST)
Here's the link, and Kojima specifically stated that he wanted the ESRB system to be rated "E", not "T" in this link, which would in fact mean CERO's rating of C is equivalent to E since he wouldn't need to complain about that if "T" was "C"'s closest rating: http://www.siliconera.com/2010/03/03/metal-gear-solid-peace-walker-is-t-kojima-wishes-it-was-e-for-everyone/, and besides that, he also mentioned in an FAQ for the official Metal Gear site that he wanted the game to be geared towards "school kids," which implies an age range closer to grade school or primary school, NOT middle or especially high school. He also said in the same FAQ that the color yellow in the game being a major color dealt directly with their intended audience, specifically citing POP style as their main inspiration and intended message. Pokeria1 (talk) 16:51, 20 February 2015 (EST)
He says "wish it could have been" which could just as easily have meant he never thought it was actually going to be rated E because of the subject matter ("wish it could" indicating resignation rather than a declaration of intent). I've changed it to just "younger audiences" since that gets the point across well enough. Evil Tim (talk) 17:17, 20 February 2015 (EST)
Well yeah, but fifteen year olds are schoolkids. The previous games were rated more for college-age. Evil Tim (talk) 17:32, 20 February 2015 (EST)
This discussion is going off the rails. If you want to discuss politics, there are better places for it. --Funkychinaman (talk) 13:56, 20 February 2015 (EST)
I've added another version of the commercial to the initial post in this thread. By the way, wasn't the idea of "laughing to death" first widely spread by the comic-book version of the Joker (and his "Joker Venom") from the Batman franchise? Of course, "tickle rods" might not leave a rictus grin on your face after you expire, but the idea and the horror behind it should be largely the same. --Mazryonh (talk) 18:24, 20 February 2015 (EST)
Tickle-torture is one of those hard-to-understand fetishes the internet will let you discover the existence of. Evil Tim (talk) 18:43, 20 February 2015 (EST)
The example I mentioned about the Joker and how he leaves his poisoned victims laughing before they die with a hideous grin on their faces certainly predates the internet becoming mainstream. So "laughing to death" is not that new as a concept (which is what they dressed up the torture sequence in this game as for the Japanese version).--Mazryonh (talk) 00:14, 26 February 2015 (EST)
Tidied up and removed old information (most of them were based on demo version). Somebody should add more text 'cause I'm not good at typing stuff.
--SilentwarriorX 05:34, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
thatsgood work and all and ive added some words will do a more in depth one soon but you deleted the XM177E2 pictures --Smish34 17:23, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
There wasn't any pics of XM177E2 in the first place... I'm not even sure if that gun exists in this game. I've played this for over 40 hours and haven't seen one. --SilentwarriorX 06:35, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
there definatly is, ive got it, it looks similar to the M4 but has a telescopic stock and sometimes has a m203 and suppressor --Smish34 17:05, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
sorry, your right i mistook the other rifle for it, yeah its not on the game i'll delete it --Smish34 17:06, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
M16
The description says that the M16 comes with a 30 round clip. I'm not going to post the whole rant about how it's not called a clip here, but I'm going to fix that obvious discrepancy. Hopefully whoever wrote that part just had a minor slip up. Acora 08:22, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
Good, less rant, just make the correction. Excalibur01 17:50, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
Do you want a medal and bucket full of cookies too? --SilentwarriorX 16:03, 22 July 2010 (UTC)
I suggest someone try pulling some of the weapon screenshots from the US version. I would try it but I can't seem to get RemoteJoy working on my CFW'd PSP. --HashiriyaR32 17:19, 20 July 2010 (UTC)
Pics are fine, but japanese letters are kinda on way, why whoever took those left them on when there's an option to remove them?
Shotgun attachment
Can anyone identify the shotgun attachment for the M16 and 653? My bet is either the Mossberg 500 or Remington 870 but I can't tell the difference from the model viewer.
I think it's a 870Sate2801 06:51, 3 September 2010 (UTC)
It's a shortened Ithaca 37. - Mr. Wolf 17:08, 23 May 2011 (CDT)
I know I saw a picture of an M18 that looked very similar to what was shown in-game. It was either on Google images or Bing images. Pokeria1 16:54, 20 August 2011 (CDT)
Okay, I found them, and design wise, it's pretty clearly intended to be the M18. Here are some comparison pics from MGS4 and MPW:
As you can see here, they both share the same stripe, which makes identifying it easy. Pokeria1 13:02, 12 July 2012 (CDT)
Anachronisms
I think we really need to clean up on the Anachronisms a bit. Yes, the game does technically take place in 1974, but there were some hints that the game does indeed have time passing. For starters, Miller references Sir Eric Gairy, the Prime Minister of Grenada, requesting for the UN to set up a facility to study extraterrestrial occurances thanks to Chico. The only time something like that happened was in 1977 (and trust me, I checked). Besides, several of the weapons were developed using design specs, which are implied to be blueprints of the weapons in question, so it was likely that they just developed them earlier than usual. Pokeria1 17:12, 20 August 2011 (CDT)
I would like to mention that the G11 is listed as anachronistic but it isn't that much anachronistic since the development started in 1968 and the modeled prototype variant is very close to prototype 2 wich was made around 1975. So 1975 is 5 years away from the 80s and the text is at the moment wrong. Prototype 2 even was tested by the Bundewehr. --DAN11 (talk) 12:27, 30 November 2012 (EST)
NVGs are pretty impressive, I think they're AN/PVS-7 from 1985. Evil Tim (talk) 05:52, 9 January 2015 (EST)
MGS:HD Update?
So with the release of the MGS:HD Collestion, will the current page be refinished to include the 720p resolution screenshots and english descriptions, or will it more than likely just stay the way it is now?
Could go either way, but just out of curiosity. The current pictures have quite a bit of aliasing xD -- Long Fallen 00:04, 24 November 2011 (CST)
Problem with that is it isn't out over here until February 2012. :( Evil Tim 01:13, 24 November 2011 (CST)
Do we have people who can grab screens from consoles? BeardedHoplite 07:08, 24 November 2011 (CST)
We have me, yes. Evil Tim 13:28, 24 November 2011 (CST)
Missing Hidden Weapon
I saw a hidden weapon in the game, Musket. you forgot to add it ReikoKotobuki
Ejecting rounds during reload
There's a discontinuity between how Big Boss reloads his weapon compared to MGS3. Example was with the M16. In MGS3 he would slap the release when he reloads a fresh mag, but in this game, he racks the charging handle back ejecting a live round like Solid Snake did in MGS4. And he does this with every rifle in the game except the pistols...like MGS4 Excalibur01 17:16, 2 June 2012 (CDT)
This was made after MGS 4 BeardedHoplite 17:56, 12 June 2012 (CDT)
I know. My point was...why? It's like they somehow took the reload animation from MGS4 and downgrade the graphics to PSP quality and have Big Boss do it here Excalibur01 21:28, 12 June 2012 (CDT)
Doesn't the bolt release degrade everytime it's used? So wouldn't it be a better idea to use the charging handle instead if you're going to be out in the field for quite a while and expecting quite a few firefights? And isn't it also believed (but unproven) that the charging handle is more reliable than the bolt release? Pretty sure if that was the case, then Snake would use the most reliable method to reload his weapons, the M16 in MGS3 is most likely a special case since from the dialogue you get when calling The Boss or Sigint seem to imply that it's the first time Naked Snake gets his hands on an M16 type rifle.Kornflakes89 13:33, 13 August 2012 (CDT)
I'm fairly sure the bolt release is not the most likely moving part of a gun to break down, and most people would rather have a busted bolt release than waste a bullet every time they reload. It's probably just some weird shooting technique that only Operators and people who got shot when they ran out of bullets from wasting them all would understand. Evil Tim 13:43, 13 August 2012 (CDT)
Personally, i'd rather know i have a round in the chamber than risk miscounting how many shots i fired before reloading, and the ejected live rounds can be picked up for later use after all the shooting is done (which would be kinda funny IMO, reloading then an M16 ammo box pops out of the chamber with one bullet), but that's just my way of thinking about it, you guys are the experts here. Kornflakes89 04:46, 15 August 2012 (CDT)
Its irrelevant that the bolt release may degrade or be less reliable, if it is the case that when he racks the charging handle after a reload a round ejects that mean the bolt hold open itself is being ignored. There is no choice being made here, the developers have ignored part of how a gun works. If you fire an M16 empty, the bolt will hold open and if you pull the charging handle no round will be ejected as all that will happen is the bolt will move forward chambering the first round from the new magazine. --commando552 14:39, 13 August 2012 (CDT)
I see what you're saying, but i don't personally see any evidence that it's being ignored, Snake in MGS3 is pretty much a noob, yeah he's seen some combat, but not enough to make him the totally battle scared man he becomes when he takes on the name Big Boss, he could just simply be making sure there's always a round in the chamber ready to fire, and i don't see how it's irrelevant whether the bolt release degrades or is less reliable, if it degrades then it degrades, i'm pretty sure one would rather use the charging handle as much as possible and only use the bolt release when reloading fast is needed than risk having it not work if it does degrade. Kornflakes89 04:46, 15 August 2012 (CDT)
I believe that Commando is saying that once you load a mag into an empty M16, pulling the charging handle will just chamber the first round in the mag and not eject a round, because you can't eject a round before it is even chambered in the gun itself. --SmithandWesson36 10:24, 15 August 2012 (CDT)
I guess he could be putting the gun in battery and then pulling the charging handle afterwards, which might make some sense the first time you pick a weapon up to ensure it isn't jammed or broken and can actually cycle. I remain unsure why you'd actually do that all the time, though. Evil Tim 10:30, 15 August 2012 (CDT)
Going back on this subject since I decided to play the HD version of this game. In the Marine Corp when you pick up an enemy's weapon after disarming him and need to immediately use it against them, you rack the charging handle or slide to ensure a live round is chambered. Solid Snake did that in MGS4 when he disarmed Johnny. The whole tac reload and racking to eject a live round is a practice that is usually done on pistols not long guns. For continuity sake, it seems Solid Snake, not Naked Snake is the one who likes this practice. In MGS3, Naked Snake even points out Ocelot being kinda stupid for practicing such method with his Makarov, which induced a double feed. Throughout MGS3, when you reload a partially empty mag, you get an extra round count because the game recognizes there is still one in the chamber and the bolt does lock back on the M16 in MGS3. In fact in MGS4, and in Peacewalker, all guns that have a bolt hold feature locks back. Snake in MGS4 just seem to eject a live round and it isn't like some games like Far Cry 2 where you see the racking animation during a tac reload and nothing comes out. The designers intentionally wanted us to see a live round eject. Excalibur01 (talk) 23:10, 7 March 2013 (EST)
Also a gun is made of metal and other parts that will degrade over time...a LONG time, but I have yet to see a gun that has been used so much even guns that were hand me down to the National Guards being around for 10 years of use being so old that they don't work anymore. Proper maintenance and the gun will be fine. The bolt/slide release of a gun won't degrade that fast even if you use it a hundred times. Otherwise, you'd see metal shavings all over your hand every time you release the slide. Excalibur01 (talk) 23:10, 7 March 2013 (EST)
Minor note, but he doesn't criticise Ocelot for the technique itself, but for the fact that he was trying it out for the first time in a combat situation. Evil Tim (talk) 11:51, 23 December 2014 (EST)
Sturmpistole/Kampfpistole
I changed the Kampfpistole Z to Sturmpistole because here in the screenshot obviously a Sturmpistole is shown. Then somebody changed my edit back to Kampfpistole with the explanation that it starts out as a Kampfpistole and then can be upgraded to Sturmpistole As those are different versions, could somebody please post a screenshot of the Kampfpistole so I can add both? -Hchris
OK I added both, can somebody please post a screenshot of the Leuchtpistole/Kampfpistole? Thanks -Hchris
Haven't got a shot yet, but it's the same gun model minus the stock, including the Z marking. Evil Tim (talk) 09:26, 10 January 2015 (EST)
Anyone still playing this on PS3?
If so, I might eventually be calling on you guys to help out with some screenshots, the guy I usually play co-op with (my good friend Kats, who's in a bunch of the co-op screenshots for the Call of Duty games) is going off to start his pilot training next year.
Also, google up "Convair Model 49," it's kind of fascinating. Evil Tim (talk) 00:48, 24 December 2014 (EST)
Big Boss has been used in the following videogames by the following state bodies, individuals and conspiracies:Evil Tim (talk) 08:41, 10 January 2015 (EST)
Isn't that something that's been talked about before in the earlier MGS games? I seem to recall Raiden being called "nothing more than a weapon" in MGS2. So were the three "Les Enfants Terribles" in their own right. Have you tried poking around on MGS forums for fellow PW players who could help you with screenshots?--Mazryonh (talk) 00:18, 11 January 2015 (EST)
Eh, I'd rather not play with total strangers. Just need to get the patience to grind that LAV's support troops down, I guess. And the same to get my guy to notice that Rathalos has two wings. They're right there on the sides of him. Idiot. >:( Evil Tim (talk) 00:38, 18 February 2015 (EST)
Well, finally got the wing and I now have a minigun after discovering that the bandana doesn't stop you getting S ranks (which is odd) and using the Fulton Carl Gustav to shoot the 36 mans who were apparently crammed inside a pocket dimension in that Cougar as soon as they got out. Probably won't get a pic of the EMW gun since that's a tank battle and it's much harder to cheesevacuate soldiers who spawn randomly. Evil Tim (talk) 04:58, 19 February 2015 (EST)
Since you're making significant edits to the article (good job so far, BTW), can you try to ID the nuclear missile Peace Walker (and later, ZEKE) prepared to launch at Cuba (and later the East Coast of the United States), as well as the catapults and those missiles on the far left and far right of Mother Base's Support Section, and if allowed note them? Pokeria1 (talk) 09:46, 21 February 2015 (EST)
I think Peace Walker is using a rejigged version of the Sabre launch tube from the Shagohod, but it's a non-standard tube so there's nothing to really ID; realistically it would probably be carrying a Minuteman I or II with a W56 warhead (1.2 megatons); I don't think it's long enough to contain a Titan (101ft, Minuteman is 60). I might put the mother base missiles in a caption, I think the ones in the wide view are supposed to be Scuds, but they messed up scaling them so they're tiny when you see them in the Mother Base map and don't look like anything. Evil Tim (talk) 04:07, 22 February 2015 (EST)
Don't they actually briefly show the missile when you fail to stop the launch in time with Peace Walker? You could try failing to stop the launch on purpose so you can actually see the missile in the resulting cutscene. You can also find the missile launch pads if you have a Level 4 Support Unit during the battle with ZEKE (either the battle with Paz or the Mock battle doesn't matter, though I'd personally suggest Mock Battle just to be on the safe side). In fact, those are pretty much as high-res as one can get. I don't know if you can find them in the Miller ending cutscene, but considering the Harpoon systems were present despite not likely being available when first getting the Level 2 Support section (which is required alongside building ZEKE and foiling all six of Zadornov's escape attempts) to even fight Paz/ZEKE, I wouldn't be surprised if it DID appear in that cutscene. Pokeria1 (talk) 07:55, 22 February 2015 (EST)
I'll take a look, but do have a level 4 support section, and they're not scaled correctly in the in-game Mother Base, they're tiny stumpy little things whereas on the menu they're most of the height of the gantries next to them.
See? Evil Tim (talk) 08:26, 22 February 2015 (EST)
I see. And I would personally suggest doing the Peace Walker 2 mission on the main ops menu and letting Peace Walker launch, since Peace Walker's already in launch mode by that time unlike the Extra Ops Peace Walker battles. It would also save you some grief since it won't fire on you so long as you don't fire on it. One last thing, what are the makes of the catapults on Mother Base (they're the ones on the far left strut of Support Section that launches cardboard boxes when prompted, or far right if you're using Mother Base Menu)? Pokeria1 (talk) 09:08, 22 February 2015 (EST)
Unless I'm missing something, the only thing on that platform is two more Harpoon launchers. The supply consoles have the boxes come in from the right. Evil Tim (talk) 18:26, 24 February 2015 (EST)
I was meaning "left" as in facing the Support Section from the ZEKE deck. From left to right while facing that section from ZEKE Deck is the supply boxes, the M269 Launcher Loader Module launchers, the Harpoon missile launchers, and the missile pads. Pokeria1 (talk) 19:50, 25 February 2015 (EST)
Eh, fair enough. So, have you managed to identify the missile from Peace Walker yet? Pokeria1 (talk) 18:54, 13 March 2015 (EDT)
About Suppressors
I gotta know. What is the point of the indentations on the side of the suppressors for the custom M1911? And what is with the weird shape of the suppressor for the Rank 5 Mk. 22? Ookami91 (talk) 22:49, 29 March 2015 (EDT)
Just aesthetic differences as far as I know. --RedRobinAlpha (talk) 04:09, 30 March 2015 (GMT)
I could see the ones on the M1911 being useful if, say, your hands are wet and you're trying to screw it on in a hurry, or you're wearing thick gloves. I think the other is just trying to look all future-y. Evil Tim (talk) 07:04, 30 March 2015 (EDT)
Peace Walker nuke.
Hi.
Has anyone IDed the nuke Peace Walker launched yet in the game over? If so, can someone note it on the article? Pokeria1 (talk) 08:06, 3 April 2015 (EDT)
Hello? We need an ID the nuke Peace Walker launched during the game over. Can someone do so? Pokeria1 (talk) 08:43, 8 August 2016 (EDT)
I don't think many users here would recognize different nuke types. Given all the anachronisms and less-than-fully-realistic weaponry in this game it's perfectly plausible that the developers cooked up a fictional design to save time and disc space (why else would they go with "motion comics" instead of 3D-rendered cutscenes for this game?). --Mazryonh (talk) 21:06, 8 August 2016 (EDT)
