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Talk:Rough Riders: Difference between revisions
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You're quite correct that Roosevelt carried a Colt DA raised from the Maine, presented to him by his brother-in-law W.S. Cowles. My understanding is that Roosevelt did own a nickel plated Colt SAA with ivory grips embossed with the the large TR on them, so it's not completely out of whack to have him shown with it in Cuba; even though he didn't carry it there. But there are several historical inaccuracies in the film (and it's a great movie) such as showing William Tiffany being shot dead on Kettle Hill when in reality he died from Yellow Fever on Long Island after the regiment was moved out of Cuba, the fictional presence of German military advisors (there were none), the presence of Maxim machine guns on the San Juan Heights (the Spanish army had them but they were not deployed on the San Juan Heights). Also, while I enjoyed Gary Busey's portrayal of Joe Wheeler, he needed to get down to his "Buddy Holly" weight to accurately portray Wheeler, who was a slight physical figure, but a great cavalry leader. Also Frederick Funston was not in Cuba at this time and did not participate in the war there, he'd been in Cuba with the revolutionaries in 1896 but contracted malaria and his weight dropped to about 95 pounds, the Cubans granted leave and he returned to the U.S. Funston was commissioned as a colonel in the 20th Kansas Infantry, U.S. Army, a month after war was declared and landed in the Philippines and fought there during the "Insurrection". He was not in Cuba during the war. [[harleyguy]] | ==Fiction vs. History== | ||
You're quite correct that Roosevelt carried a Colt DA raised from the Maine, presented to him by his brother-in-law W.S. Cowles. My understanding is that Roosevelt did own a nickel plated Colt SAA with ivory grips embossed with the the large TR on them, so it's not completely out of whack to have him shown with it in Cuba; even though he didn't carry it there. But there are several historical inaccuracies in the film (and it's a great movie) such as showing William Tiffany being shot dead on Kettle Hill when in reality he died from Yellow Fever on Long Island after the regiment was moved out of Cuba, the fictional presence of German military advisors (there were none), the presence of Maxim machine guns on the San Juan Heights (the Spanish army had them but they were not deployed on the San Juan Heights). Also, while I enjoyed Gary Busey's portrayal of Joe Wheeler, he needed to get down to his "Buddy Holly" weight to accurately portray Wheeler, who was a slight physical figure, but a great cavalry leader. Also Frederick Funston was not in Cuba at this time and did not participate in the war there, he'd been in Cuba with the revolutionaries in 1896 but contracted malaria and his weight dropped to about 95 pounds, the Cubans granted leave and he returned to the U.S. Funston was commissioned as a colonel in the 20th Kansas Infantry, U.S. Army, a month after war was declared and landed in the Philippines and fought there during the "Insurrection". He was not in Cuba during the war. [[User:harleyguy]] | |||
==Screencaps coming== | ==Screencaps coming== | ||
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==Screencaps HAve Arrived== | ==Screencaps HAve Arrived== | ||
Okay so this wasn't the | Okay so this wasn't the ''very next'' page I screecapped, but I was close. Of course I have to now caption the photos and add more info, but at least I finally got the screencaps completed. Whew. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 19:14, 27 March 2010 (UTC) | ||
==On the set pics== | |||
I have some great on the set pics of this mini-series shoot, but I can't find them! Yes, I'm already kicking myself. When I find them I'll post them. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 04:07, 14 May 2010 (UTC) | |||
Those would be great. Looking forward to them. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 22:17, 14 June 2010 (UTC) | |||
==Fun Fact== | |||
:I have been to the Menger Hotel bar, where President Roosevelt recruited many of the Rough Riders-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 01:05, 15 June 2010 (UTC) | |||
==Personal weapons== | |||
Alot of the soldiers in the show carry weapons other than the standard issue army rifles of the period. I know that soldiers, especially state volunteer troops, during the Civil War carried personal weapons but was this practice still allowed during the Spanish American War? Also, how long was it before the old trapdoor springfields were completely removed from service? | |||
:I know that the practise was maintained in the Rough Riders (the Winchester 95 carbine was apparently a particular favorite of officers) to a greater degree than the rest of the army - it being a pretty unconventional unit to begin with. I suspect it would have been alot less common in the regular army, maybe moreso in the National Guard and standing state militas. The trapdoor Springfield wasn't used in front-line service again after 1898, in fact the majority of US Krag production was post Spanish-American War. The said there were trapdoor Springfields brought out of storage and used for defence of stateside ports in WW1. - [[User:Nyles|Nyles]] | |||
Officers were allowed more freedom in weapon choice during the time in period in question (19th century). The idea being that officers weren't as likely to be using their weapons all that much anyway. their job was to direct the battle not fight in it like a "common" infantryman. I've read that the biggest restriction was that the rifles should be in the same caliber as what the troops were using. Which makes sense of course. Things were stricter for the enlisted men. However in terms of handguns (which usually only officers carried) the caliber wasn't that important. For example it is believed that Custer was carrying a British Webley Bulldog revolver when he was killed at Little Big Horn. You can bet that his revolver was not chambered for the Colt 45 cartridge which was what the issued Colt 1873 SAA fired. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 15:28, 17 August 2010 (UTC) | |||
:According to Garry James from Guns & Ammo it was most likely a 1st model RIC in .442 Webley, but of course the Bulldog is just a snub-nosed RIC with short grips. I know the Rough Riders were issued the "Artillery Model" refurbed SAAs with 5 1/2" barrels but (as you know) ironically Roosevelt himself was carrying a Colt M1889 salvaged from the Maine - so his "personal" weapon was actually the regular army's standard issue gun. - [[User:Nyles|Nyles]] | |||
Latest revision as of 15:45, 11 March 2018
Fiction vs. History
You're quite correct that Roosevelt carried a Colt DA raised from the Maine, presented to him by his brother-in-law W.S. Cowles. My understanding is that Roosevelt did own a nickel plated Colt SAA with ivory grips embossed with the the large TR on them, so it's not completely out of whack to have him shown with it in Cuba; even though he didn't carry it there. But there are several historical inaccuracies in the film (and it's a great movie) such as showing William Tiffany being shot dead on Kettle Hill when in reality he died from Yellow Fever on Long Island after the regiment was moved out of Cuba, the fictional presence of German military advisors (there were none), the presence of Maxim machine guns on the San Juan Heights (the Spanish army had them but they were not deployed on the San Juan Heights). Also, while I enjoyed Gary Busey's portrayal of Joe Wheeler, he needed to get down to his "Buddy Holly" weight to accurately portray Wheeler, who was a slight physical figure, but a great cavalry leader. Also Frederick Funston was not in Cuba at this time and did not participate in the war there, he'd been in Cuba with the revolutionaries in 1896 but contracted malaria and his weight dropped to about 95 pounds, the Cubans granted leave and he returned to the U.S. Funston was commissioned as a colonel in the 20th Kansas Infantry, U.S. Army, a month after war was declared and landed in the Philippines and fought there during the "Insurrection". He was not in Cuba during the war. User:harleyguy
Screencaps coming
This movie is the next one on my list that I intend to do screencaps for. It does have some historical inaccuracies, but it's true to the spirit of the time in my opinion. Plus Milius uses historical accuracy for style. He's good at that. See The Wind and the Lion. Which I'm sure you have already. --Jcordell 23:29, 13 February 2010 (UTC)
Screencaps HAve Arrived
Okay so this wasn't the very next page I screecapped, but I was close. Of course I have to now caption the photos and add more info, but at least I finally got the screencaps completed. Whew. --Jcordell 19:14, 27 March 2010 (UTC)
On the set pics
I have some great on the set pics of this mini-series shoot, but I can't find them! Yes, I'm already kicking myself. When I find them I'll post them. MoviePropMaster2008 04:07, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
Those would be great. Looking forward to them. --Jcordell 22:17, 14 June 2010 (UTC)
Fun Fact
- I have been to the Menger Hotel bar, where President Roosevelt recruited many of the Rough Riders-S&Wshooter 01:05, 15 June 2010 (UTC)
Personal weapons
Alot of the soldiers in the show carry weapons other than the standard issue army rifles of the period. I know that soldiers, especially state volunteer troops, during the Civil War carried personal weapons but was this practice still allowed during the Spanish American War? Also, how long was it before the old trapdoor springfields were completely removed from service?
- I know that the practise was maintained in the Rough Riders (the Winchester 95 carbine was apparently a particular favorite of officers) to a greater degree than the rest of the army - it being a pretty unconventional unit to begin with. I suspect it would have been alot less common in the regular army, maybe moreso in the National Guard and standing state militas. The trapdoor Springfield wasn't used in front-line service again after 1898, in fact the majority of US Krag production was post Spanish-American War. The said there were trapdoor Springfields brought out of storage and used for defence of stateside ports in WW1. - Nyles
Officers were allowed more freedom in weapon choice during the time in period in question (19th century). The idea being that officers weren't as likely to be using their weapons all that much anyway. their job was to direct the battle not fight in it like a "common" infantryman. I've read that the biggest restriction was that the rifles should be in the same caliber as what the troops were using. Which makes sense of course. Things were stricter for the enlisted men. However in terms of handguns (which usually only officers carried) the caliber wasn't that important. For example it is believed that Custer was carrying a British Webley Bulldog revolver when he was killed at Little Big Horn. You can bet that his revolver was not chambered for the Colt 45 cartridge which was what the issued Colt 1873 SAA fired. --Jcordell 15:28, 17 August 2010 (UTC)
- According to Garry James from Guns & Ammo it was most likely a 1st model RIC in .442 Webley, but of course the Bulldog is just a snub-nosed RIC with short grips. I know the Rough Riders were issued the "Artillery Model" refurbed SAAs with 5 1/2" barrels but (as you know) ironically Roosevelt himself was carrying a Colt M1889 salvaged from the Maine - so his "personal" weapon was actually the regular army's standard issue gun. - Nyles