Talk:Tokarev SVT-40 - Revision history

Mateogala at 17:19, 24 July 2023

2023-07-24T17:19:08Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:19, 24 July 2023
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			=Additional Images=
			[[File:SVT-40 with Bubnov and Skvortsov drum mag.jpg\|thumb\|none\|500px\|Tokarev SVT-40 with Bubnov and Skvortsov drum magazine - 7.62x54mmR]]

			=Discussion=
	==SKT-40/AKT-40==		==SKT-40/AKT-40==
	So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)		So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)

Pyr0m4n14c: /* SKT-40/AKT-40 */

2022-04-01T21:53:09Z

SKT-40/AKT-40

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:53, 1 April 2022
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	== SKT-40/AKT-40 ==		==SKT-40/AKT-40==

	So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)		So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)
	:"Automatic (AKT-40) and self-loading (SKT-40) carbines - carbines of various modifications (from '34 to '41 years), produced in automatic, self-loading and sniper versions. The normal type of fire is single, firing bursts and continuous fire (for the automatic version), according to the instructions (as for the automatic version of the SVT), it can be conducted in exceptional cases (when repelling an attack, with a lack of machine guns, etc.). Sector sight, open, 10 divisions are notched on it, each at a cost of 100 m. There is a muzzle brake, a gas regulator. Double-row magazine, 10 rounds. During the WWII, from the SVT-40 and AVT-40 rifles that failed for one reason or another, surrogate carbines were made in the troops. The presence of both a surrogate and possibly the original Tokarev carbine in the troops is also indicated by the index of captured weapons assigned to the carbine by the Wehrmacht - SiGewehr 259/2 (r), where it passes like a shortened SVT-40 rifle. A small batch of automatic and self-loading sniper carbines was released in 1941 in a special gift version."		:"Automatic (AKT-40) and self-loading (SKT-40) carbines - carbines of various modifications (from '34 to '41 years), produced in automatic, self-loading and sniper versions. The normal type of fire is single, firing bursts and continuous fire (for the automatic version), according to the instructions (as for the automatic version of the SVT), it can be conducted in exceptional cases (when repelling an attack, with a lack of machine guns, etc.). Sector sight, open, 10 divisions are notched on it, each at a cost of 100 m. There is a muzzle brake, a gas regulator. Double-row magazine, 10 rounds. During the WWII, from the SVT-40 and AVT-40 rifles that failed for one reason or another, surrogate carbines were made in the troops. The presence of both a surrogate and possibly the original Tokarev carbine in the troops is also indicated by the index of captured weapons assigned to the carbine by the Wehrmacht - SiGewehr 259/2 (r), where it passes like a shortened SVT-40 rifle. A small batch of automatic and self-loading sniper carbines was released in 1941 in a special gift version."
	:"They were produced in small batches at the Mednogorsk Arms Plant No. 314 at least until 1943 inclusive and, in some quantities, were present in the troops".		:"They were produced in small batches at the Mednogorsk Arms Plant No. 314 at least until 1943 inclusive and, in some quantities, were present in the troops".
	:In the bottom line, in 1940 - 1943, more than ~1000 "original" Model 1940 carbines (not rework) were hardly produced. It was non-standard weapon, given to snipers, and like that.		:In the bottom line, in 1940 - 1943, more than ~1000 "original" Model 1940 carbines (not rework) were hardly produced. It was non-standard weapon, given to snipers, and like that.
			::So, a mix of field-expedient jobs and some low-production field-issued examples? Huh, good to know. Thanks for the info! (And don't forget to sign your posts.) [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 17:53, 1 April 2022 (EDT)

Slon95: /* SKT-40/AKT-40 */

2022-04-01T21:43:39Z

SKT-40/AKT-40

← Older revision		Revision as of 21:43, 1 April 2022
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	So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)		So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)
			:"Automatic (AKT-40) and self-loading (SKT-40) carbines - carbines of various modifications (from '34 to '41 years), produced in automatic, self-loading and sniper versions. The normal type of fire is single, firing bursts and continuous fire (for the automatic version), according to the instructions (as for the automatic version of the SVT), it can be conducted in exceptional cases (when repelling an attack, with a lack of machine guns, etc.). Sector sight, open, 10 divisions are notched on it, each at a cost of 100 m. There is a muzzle brake, a gas regulator. Double-row magazine, 10 rounds. During the WWII, from the SVT-40 and AVT-40 rifles that failed for one reason or another, surrogate carbines were made in the troops. The presence of both a surrogate and possibly the original Tokarev carbine in the troops is also indicated by the index of captured weapons assigned to the carbine by the Wehrmacht - SiGewehr 259/2 (r), where it passes like a shortened SVT-40 rifle. A small batch of automatic and self-loading sniper carbines was released in 1941 in a special gift version."
			:"They were produced in small batches at the Mednogorsk Arms Plant No. 314 at least until 1943 inclusive and, in some quantities, were present in the troops".
			:In the bottom line, in 1940 - 1943, more than ~1000 "original" Model 1940 carbines (not rework) were hardly produced. It was non-standard weapon, given to snipers, and like that.

TheExplodingBarrel at 06:07, 31 March 2022

2022-03-31T06:07:33Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:07, 31 March 2022
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	~~== Additional Images ==~~

	== SKT-40/AKT-40 ==		== SKT-40/AKT-40 ==

	So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)		So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)

Pyr0m4n14c: /* SKT-40/AKT-40 */ new section

2022-03-31T03:00:37Z

SKT-40/AKT-40: new section

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:00, 31 March 2022
Line 1:		Line 1:
	== Additional Images ==		== Additional Images ==

			== SKT-40/AKT-40 ==

			So, there's not much to go on for the carbine variants of these things, but it seems like a confusing mess from everything I've seen people say. There are claims that they were a rare field-trialed pattern, claims that they were the result of field armory repairs/modifications, claims that they were just a proposal and that no significant number were actually built (and various claims mixing and matching bits of all these), there are a couple sheets of drawings showing the things but most of them look slightly different, it just goes on. About the only thing it seems most people can agree on is that many of the supposed "SKT-40s" on the market aren't real - that they were either cut down after the fact by Canadian importers, or that they're custom one-offs by people trying to peddle their personal hack-jobs as fancy rare prototypes, hence why they often vary from one rifle to another (similar to how, say, most of the supposed "tanker" carbines out there aren't real - the T26 Garand was a prototype, but most of the ones on the market are post-war conversions for the civilian market). Does anyone have any reference books/access to primary-source documents that could help shed some light on the issue? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c\|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c\|talk]]) 23:00, 30 March 2022 (EDT)

Mateogala: /* Additional Images */

2022-01-27T09:03:42Z

Additional Images

← Older revision		Revision as of 09:03, 27 January 2022
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	== Additional Images ==		== Additional Images ==

	~~[[Image:AVT-40.jpg\|thumb\|none\|500px\|Tokarev AVT-40 with 15-round magazine - 7.62x54mmR]]~~
	~~[[Image:AKT-40.jpg\|thumb\|none\|500px\|Tokarev AKT-40 - 7.62x54mmR]]~~

Mateogala: /* Additional Images */

2021-09-27T20:24:01Z

Additional Images

← Older revision		Revision as of 20:24, 27 September 2021
Line 2:		Line 2:

	[[Image:AVT-40.jpg\|thumb\|none\|500px\|Tokarev AVT-40 with 15-round magazine - 7.62x54mmR]]		[[Image:AVT-40.jpg\|thumb\|none\|500px\|Tokarev AVT-40 with 15-round magazine - 7.62x54mmR]]
			[[Image:AKT-40.jpg\|thumb\|none\|500px\|Tokarev AKT-40 - 7.62x54mmR]]

Slon95: /* Additional Images */ new section

2019-04-29T14:27:49Z

Additional Images: new section

New page

== Additional Images ==

[[Image:AVT-40.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Tokarev AVT-40 with 15-round magazine - 7.62x54mmR]]