Talk:Air Force One - Revision history

Spartan198: /* MiG-29 scene */

2023-07-30T16:01:05Z

MiG-29 scene

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:01, 30 July 2023
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	::::Wow, the film was sort of the last hurrah for motion control SFX, wasn't it? --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 18:19, 24 September 2013 (EDT)		::::Wow, the film was sort of the last hurrah for motion control SFX, wasn't it? --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 18:19, 24 September 2013 (EDT)
	:::::Unfortunately, a lot of the film was done with bad CGI (especially the final crash). --[[User:Ben41\|Ben41]] ([[User talk:Ben41\|talk]]) 17:27, 25 September 2013 (EDT)		:::::Unfortunately, a lot of the film was done with bad CGI (especially the final crash). --[[User:Ben41\|Ben41]] ([[User talk:Ben41\|talk]]) 17:27, 25 September 2013 (EDT)
	:::::Yeah, the crash was downright ''terrible* CGI, but the dogfight between the F-15s and MiGs still holds up pretty well today, IMO. [[User:Spartan198\|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198\|talk]]) 16:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC)		:::::Yeah, the crash was downright terrible CGI, but the dogfight between the F-15s and MiGs still holds up pretty well today, IMO. [[User:Spartan198\|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198\|talk]]) 16:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

	== The Hind ==		== The Hind ==

Spartan198: /* MiG-29 scene */

2023-07-30T16:00:36Z

MiG-29 scene

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:00, 30 July 2023
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	::Wasn't the vertical stabilizer hit with cannon rounds? (Sorry, it's been a while.) --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 17:52, 24 September 2013 (EDT)		::Wasn't the vertical stabilizer hit with cannon rounds? (Sorry, it's been a while.) --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 17:52, 24 September 2013 (EDT)
	::: Actually the MIGs DID fire at AF1, but it still also got damaged by pieces of one of the exploding jets (the F15 that sacrificed itself), which is what I was thinking. But the MiGs did fire their cannons - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJS6icRaOq8 So yep, you're right FCM. [[User:StanTheMan\|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan\|talk]]) 17:59, 24 September 2013 (EDT)		::: Actually the MIGs DID fire at AF1, but it still also got damaged by pieces of one of the exploding jets (the F15 that sacrificed itself), which is what I was thinking. But the MiGs did fire their cannons - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJS6icRaOq8 So yep, you're right FCM. [[User:StanTheMan\|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan\|talk]]) 17:59, 24 September 2013 (EDT)
			:::One MiG took out an engine with cannon fire. The stabilizer was damaged by debris from Halo 2. Either way, we still include them as "gun platforms." As far as the F-15 sacrificing itself, the odds of being able to be in the right place at the right moment are slim to none. But it's noble, which is what the filmmakers were going for. Wish we could have a president like Marshall or [[Independence Day\|Whitmore]] IRL :( [[User:Spartan198\|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198\|talk]]) 16:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
	::::Wow, the film was sort of the last hurrah for motion control SFX, wasn't it? --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 18:19, 24 September 2013 (EDT)		::::Wow, the film was sort of the last hurrah for motion control SFX, wasn't it? --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 18:19, 24 September 2013 (EDT)
	:::::Unfortunately, a lot of the film was done with bad CGI (especially the final crash). --[[User:Ben41\|Ben41]] ([[User talk:Ben41\|talk]]) 17:27, 25 September 2013 (EDT)		:::::Unfortunately, a lot of the film was done with bad CGI (especially the final crash). --[[User:Ben41\|Ben41]] ([[User talk:Ben41\|talk]]) 17:27, 25 September 2013 (EDT)
			:::::Yeah, the crash was downright ''terrible* CGI, but the dogfight between the F-15s and MiGs still holds up pretty well today, IMO. [[User:Spartan198\|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198\|talk]]) 16:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

	== The Hind ==		== The Hind ==

MT2008: /* M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers */

2023-07-30T14:33:50Z

M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:33, 30 July 2023
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	::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)		::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

	:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I tried using Wayback Machine to look at LDI's web site in the late-90s, but not seeing a model that matches - the earliest AR-2 lasers (predecessor to the Steiner AR-2A, which is still produced today) looks kinda similar to the lasers in ''[[Air Force One]]'', and has a similar mount, but it's still mounted vertically, not horizontally, and it also doesn't have the same style of tailcap switch. See [https://web.archive.org/web/19980422063349/http://laserdevices.com/ar-2.htm here] for a picture. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. ~~But I~~'~~m still guessing that the most likely explanation is~~ that this is some type of prototype LDI-manufactured laser sight that was never widely produced, but if it wasn't, I don't know why it has those warning labels (those labels are a requirement that the U.S. FDA imposes on manufacturers for all consumer ~~labels~~ - if this thing wasn't sold as a consumer product on the U.S. market, it wouldn't have them). -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)		:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I tried using Wayback Machine to look at LDI's web site in the late-90s, but not seeing a model that matches - the earliest AR-2 lasers (predecessor to the Steiner AR-2A, which is still produced today) looks kinda similar to the lasers in ''[[Air Force One]]'', and has a similar mount, but it's still mounted vertically, not horizontally, and it also doesn't have the same style of tailcap switch. See [https://web.archive.org/web/19980422063349/http://laserdevices.com/ar-2.htm here] for a picture. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. It's possible that this is some type of prototype LDI-manufactured laser sight that was never widely produced, but if it wasn't put on the market, I don't know why it has those warning labels (those labels are a requirement that the U.S. FDA imposes on manufacturers for all eyesafe consumer lasers - if this thing wasn't sold as a consumer product on the U.S. market, it wouldn't have them). -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

	== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==		== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==

MT2008: /* M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers */

2023-07-30T14:30:47Z

M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:30, 30 July 2023
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	::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)		::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

	:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I tried using Wayback Machine to look at LDI's web site in the late-90s, but not seeing a model that matches - the earliest AR-2 lasers (predecessor to the Steiner AR-2A, which is still produced today) looks kinda similar to the lasers in ''[[Air Force One]]'', and has a similar mount, but it's still mounted vertically, not horizontally, and it also doesn't have the same style of tailcap switch. See [https://web.archive.org/web/19980422063349/http://laserdevices.com/ar-2.htm here] for a picture. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. But I'm still guessing that the most likely explanation is that this is some type of prototype LDI-manufactured laser sight that was never widely produced. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)		:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I tried using Wayback Machine to look at LDI's web site in the late-90s, but not seeing a model that matches - the earliest AR-2 lasers (predecessor to the Steiner AR-2A, which is still produced today) looks kinda similar to the lasers in ''[[Air Force One]]'', and has a similar mount, but it's still mounted vertically, not horizontally, and it also doesn't have the same style of tailcap switch. See [https://web.archive.org/web/19980422063349/http://laserdevices.com/ar-2.htm here] for a picture. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. But I'm still guessing that the most likely explanation is that this is some type of prototype LDI-manufactured laser sight that was never widely produced, but if it wasn't, I don't know why it has those warning labels (those labels are a requirement that the U.S. FDA imposes on manufacturers for all consumer labels - if this thing wasn't sold as a consumer product on the U.S. market, it wouldn't have them). -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

	== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==		== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==

MT2008: /* M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers */

2023-07-30T14:22:43Z

M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:22, 30 July 2023
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	::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)		::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

	:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I tried using Wayback Machine to look at LDI's web site in the late-90s, but not seeing a model that matches - the earliest AR-2 lasers (predecessor to the Steiner AR-2A, which is still produced today) looks kinda similar to the lasers in ''[[Air Force One]]'', and has a similar mount, but it's still mounted vertically, not horizontally, and it also doesn't have the same style of tailcap switch. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. But I'm still guessing that the most likely explanation is that this is some type of prototype LDI-manufactured laser sight that was never widely produced. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)		:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I tried using Wayback Machine to look at LDI's web site in the late-90s, but not seeing a model that matches - the earliest AR-2 lasers (predecessor to the Steiner AR-2A, which is still produced today) looks kinda similar to the lasers in ''[[Air Force One]]'', and has a similar mount, but it's still mounted vertically, not horizontally, and it also doesn't have the same style of tailcap switch. See [https://web.archive.org/web/19980422063349/http://laserdevices.com/ar-2.htm here] for a picture. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. But I'm still guessing that the most likely explanation is that this is some type of prototype LDI-manufactured laser sight that was never widely produced. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

	== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==		== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==

MT2008: /* M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers */

2023-07-30T14:21:36Z

M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:21, 30 July 2023
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	::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)		::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

	:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)		:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I tried using Wayback Machine to look at LDI's web site in the late-90s, but not seeing a model that matches - the earliest AR-2 lasers (predecessor to the Steiner AR-2A, which is still produced today) looks kinda similar to the lasers in ''[[Air Force One]]'', and has a similar mount, but it's still mounted vertically, not horizontally, and it also doesn't have the same style of tailcap switch. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. But I'm still guessing that the most likely explanation is that this is some type of prototype LDI-manufactured laser sight that was never widely produced. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

	== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==		== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==

MT2008 at 13:53, 30 July 2023

2023-07-30T13:53:19Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:53, 30 July 2023
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	::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)		::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

			:::::::::::::I've noticed that the markings on this laser - particularly the over-use of the laser warning symbol - appear to have been very common on the packaging of laser sights manufactured by Laser Devices, Inc. (now Steiner), which makes me think that this is an LDI laser of some kind. Still coming up empty on search results, though. I might try emailing Steiner and seeing if their customer service can refer me to the product team and provide an ID. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 13:53, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

	== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==		== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==

MT2008: /* M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers */

2023-07-19T02:51:44Z

M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:51, 19 July 2023
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	::::::::::::''It is too miniaturized, I'm skeptical they had such tech back in the 90s'' - Trust me; they did have lasers this small back in the 1990s (I'm old enough to have been around and remember them). Solid state visible light laser diodes have existed and been widely available for civilian uses on the commercial market since the early-90s. (Infrared lasers are another story - those didn't start to get compact until early/mid-2000s.)		::::::::::::''It is too miniaturized, I'm skeptical they had such tech back in the 90s'' - Trust me; they did have lasers this small back in the 1990s (I'm old enough to have been around and remember them). Solid state visible light laser diodes have existed and been widely available for civilian uses on the commercial market since the early-90s. (Infrared lasers are another story - those didn't start to get compact until early/mid-2000s.)
	::::::::::::''No info on the net'' - Valid - another possibility (that I mentioned to you years ago) is that these are a manufacturer's prototype laser sight design that they never wound up putting into production, and that they sold to the movie industry to recoup some development costs.		::::::::::::''No info on the net'' - Valid - another possibility (that I mentioned to you years ago) is that these are a manufacturer's prototype laser sight design that they never wound up putting into production, and that they sold to the movie industry to recoup some development costs.
	:::::::::::''No buttons to turn on/off???'' I ~~told you~~ - there is a button. It has ambidextrous pressure switches - that laser warning symbol (in bright red) is where the switch is located.		::::::::::::''No buttons to turn on/off???'' I mentioned in my last post - there is a button. It has ambidextrous pressure switches - that laser warning symbol (in bright red) is where the switch is located.
	::::::::::::''No brand name, manufacturer etc. Never seen military hardware lacking these'' - The brand name might be somewhere that we can't see. We know that the lasers on the M4s in ''[[Air Force One]]'' have a white label on top (which is hidden beneath the barrel on the Mossberg from ''[[Broken Arrow]]'', and not visible in the auction photos). Unfortunately, we just can't read it without higher-resolution pics.		::::::::::::''No brand name, manufacturer etc. Never seen military hardware lacking these'' - The brand name might be somewhere that we can't see. We know that the lasers on the M4s in ''[[Air Force One]]'' have a white label on top (which is hidden beneath the barrel on the Mossberg from ''[[Broken Arrow]]'', and not visible in the auction photos). Unfortunately, we just can't read it without higher-resolution pics.

MT2008: /* M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers */

2023-07-19T02:50:55Z

M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:50, 19 July 2023
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	::::::::::::''It is used with a rubber prop gun'' - This means nothing; I see real steel accessories used on rubber guns in Hollywood all the time (e.g., I recently saw on Movie Armaments Group's IG account some rubber prop MP5s fitted with real Surefire lights that they made for a show).		::::::::::::''It is used with a rubber prop gun'' - This means nothing; I see real steel accessories used on rubber guns in Hollywood all the time (e.g., I recently saw on Movie Armaments Group's IG account some rubber prop MP5s fitted with real Surefire lights that they made for a show).
	:::::::::::''It is too miniaturized, I'm skeptical they had such tech back in the 90s'' - Trust me; they did have lasers this small back in the 1990s (I'm old enough to have been around and remember them). Solid state visible light laser diodes have existed and been widely available for civilian uses on the commercial market since the early-90s. (Infrared lasers are another story - those didn't start to get compact until early/mid-2000s.)		::::::::::::''It is too miniaturized, I'm skeptical they had such tech back in the 90s'' - Trust me; they did have lasers this small back in the 1990s (I'm old enough to have been around and remember them). Solid state visible light laser diodes have existed and been widely available for civilian uses on the commercial market since the early-90s. (Infrared lasers are another story - those didn't start to get compact until early/mid-2000s.)
	:::::::::::''No info on the net'' - Valid - another possibility (that I mentioned to you years ago) is that these are a manufacturer's prototype laser sight design that they never wound up putting into production, and that they sold to the movie industry to recoup some development costs.		::::::::::::''No info on the net'' - Valid - another possibility (that I mentioned to you years ago) is that these are a manufacturer's prototype laser sight design that they never wound up putting into production, and that they sold to the movie industry to recoup some development costs.
	:::::::::::''No buttons to turn on/off???'' I told you - there is a button. It has ambidextrous pressure switches - that laser warning symbol (in bright red) is where the switch is located.		:::::::::::''No buttons to turn on/off???'' I told you - there is a button. It has ambidextrous pressure switches - that laser warning symbol (in bright red) is where the switch is located.
	:::::::::::''No brand name, manufacturer etc. Never seen military hardware lacking these'' - The brand name might be somewhere that we can't see. We know that the lasers on the M4s in ''[[Air Force One]]'' have a white label on top (which is hidden beneath the barrel on the Mossberg from ''[[Broken Arrow]]'', and not visible in the auction photos). Unfortunately, we just can't read it without higher-resolution pics.		::::::::::::''No brand name, manufacturer etc. Never seen military hardware lacking these'' - The brand name might be somewhere that we can't see. We know that the lasers on the M4s in ''[[Air Force One]]'' have a white label on top (which is hidden beneath the barrel on the Mossberg from ''[[Broken Arrow]]'', and not visible in the auction photos). Unfortunately, we just can't read it without higher-resolution pics.

	:::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)		::::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

	== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==		== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==

MT2008: /* M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers */

2023-07-19T02:48:30Z

M4 barrel-mounted kajiggers

← Older revision		Revision as of 02:48, 19 July 2023
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	:::::::::::This is all I can add for now, and that this thing haunts me. --[[User:Nanomat\|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat\|talk]]) 23:14, 18 July 2023 (UTC)		:::::::::::This is all I can add for now, and that this thing haunts me. --[[User:Nanomat\|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat\|talk]]) 23:14, 18 July 2023 (UTC)

			::::::::::::Very good extra find! I missed that iCollector listing. Here's the close-up that they posted showing the other side:

			::::::::::::[[Image:BrokenArrow-Mossberg590-4-HeritageAuction.jpg\|thumb\|none\|450px\|]]

			::::::::::::Now I know what the label on the other side of the laser says - the Heritage Auction didn't show it, so I was wondering if there were better pics somewhere. Sadly, still no brand name. I don't agree with you that the laser is not real - I think that they just added a real (functioning) laser to the rubber shotgun. Rebuttals:

			::::::::::::''It is used with a rubber prop gun'' - This means nothing; I see real steel accessories used on rubber guns in Hollywood all the time (e.g., I recently saw on Movie Armaments Group's IG account some rubber prop MP5s fitted with real Surefire lights that they made for a show).
			:::::::::::''It is too miniaturized, I'm skeptical they had such tech back in the 90s'' - Trust me; they did have lasers this small back in the 1990s (I'm old enough to have been around and remember them). Solid state visible light laser diodes have existed and been widely available for civilian uses on the commercial market since the early-90s. (Infrared lasers are another story - those didn't start to get compact until early/mid-2000s.)
			:::::::::::''No info on the net'' - Valid - another possibility (that I mentioned to you years ago) is that these are a manufacturer's prototype laser sight design that they never wound up putting into production, and that they sold to the movie industry to recoup some development costs.
			:::::::::::''No buttons to turn on/off???'' I told you - there is a button. It has ambidextrous pressure switches - that laser warning symbol (in bright red) is where the switch is located.
			:::::::::::''No brand name, manufacturer etc. Never seen military hardware lacking these'' - The brand name might be somewhere that we can't see. We know that the lasers on the M4s in ''[[Air Force One]]'' have a white label on top (which is hidden beneath the barrel on the Mossberg from ''[[Broken Arrow]]'', and not visible in the auction photos). Unfortunately, we just can't read it without higher-resolution pics.

			:::::::::::Otherwise, I agree with you that ID'ing these lasers is haunting me, too. -[[User:MT2008\|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008\|talk]]) 02:48, 19 July 2023 (UTC)

	== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==		== Is the M4A1 really M4A1? ==

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:00, 30 July 2023
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	::Wasn't the vertical stabilizer hit with cannon rounds? (Sorry, it's been a while.) --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 17:52, 24 September 2013 (EDT)		::Wasn't the vertical stabilizer hit with cannon rounds? (Sorry, it's been a while.) --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 17:52, 24 September 2013 (EDT)
	::: Actually the MIGs DID fire at AF1, but it still also got damaged by pieces of one of the exploding jets (the F15 that sacrificed itself), which is what I was thinking. But the MiGs did fire their cannons - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJS6icRaOq8 So yep, you're right FCM. [[User:StanTheMan\|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan\|talk]]) 17:59, 24 September 2013 (EDT)		::: Actually the MIGs DID fire at AF1, but it still also got damaged by pieces of one of the exploding jets (the F15 that sacrificed itself), which is what I was thinking. But the MiGs did fire their cannons - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJS6icRaOq8 So yep, you're right FCM. [[User:StanTheMan\|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan\|talk]]) 17:59, 24 September 2013 (EDT)
			:::One MiG took out an engine with cannon fire. The stabilizer was damaged by debris from Halo 2. Either way, we still include them as "gun platforms." As far as the F-15 sacrificing itself, the odds of being able to be in the right place at the right moment are slim to none. But it's noble, which is what the filmmakers were going for. Wish we could have a president like Marshall or [[Independence Day\|Whitmore]] IRL :( [[User:Spartan198\|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198\|talk]]) 16:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC)
	::::Wow, the film was sort of the last hurrah for motion control SFX, wasn't it? --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 18:19, 24 September 2013 (EDT)		::::Wow, the film was sort of the last hurrah for motion control SFX, wasn't it? --[[User:Funkychinaman\|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman\|talk]]) 18:19, 24 September 2013 (EDT)
	:::::Unfortunately, a lot of the film was done with bad CGI (especially the final crash). --[[User:Ben41\|Ben41]] ([[User talk:Ben41\|talk]]) 17:27, 25 September 2013 (EDT)		:::::Unfortunately, a lot of the film was done with bad CGI (especially the final crash). --[[User:Ben41\|Ben41]] ([[User talk:Ben41\|talk]]) 17:27, 25 September 2013 (EDT)
			:::::Yeah, the crash was downright ''terrible* CGI, but the dogfight between the F-15s and MiGs still holds up pretty well today, IMO. [[User:Spartan198\|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198\|talk]]) 16:00, 30 July 2023 (UTC)

	== The Hind ==		== The Hind ==