Internet Movie Firearms Database - Guns in Movies, TV and Video Games - User contributions [en]

Talk:Norinco Group

2023-12-12T23:57:45Z

Yocapo32:

=Discussion=
==Many of the guns we call "Norinco" aren't actually manufactured by Norinco==

In my recent research into Chinese firearm manufacturers, I found out that many of the guns that we call "Norinco" guns aren't actually manufactured by Norinco Group. Because gun names are typically prefixed by the names of their designers and manufacturers, the use of "Norinco" in these gun names is thus a misnomer that incorrectly suggests that they are manufactured by Norinco.

* Many historical Chinese guns were manufactured by Chinese state companies before the creation of Norinco (export company, founded in 1980) and Norinco Group (original incarnation founded in 1988).
** Example: The Type 54 pistol, Type 56 assault rifle, Type 64 submachine gun, and Type 64 pistol were all originally and primarily manufactured by Factory 626 ("triangle 66" roll mark factory), and their blueprintes were also originally made by Factory 626 before being shared with other Chinese state factories. Factory 626 was folded into Shougang Group in 1988, and no longer manufactured military ordnances. Though Norinco Group subsidiaries may have manufactured some of these weapons, their primary maker, i.e. Factory 626, never became a part of Norinco Group. ([https://m.sohu.com/n/477017698/ Source])
* Many contemporary Chinese guns assumed to have been designed/manufactured by Norinco Group are actually designed and made by China South Industries Group and its subsidiaries, most notably Jian She.
** Example: The contemporary Chinese service pistol and rifle, the QBZ-95 and QSZ-92, are both actually manufactured by Jian She, a subsidiary of the China South Industries Group. ([https://youtu.be/bKn5zNxheJA Source 1], [https://youtu.be/fAwBz1bPsIk Source 2])

Based on the above reasons, and for the additional reason that most sources outside of IMFDB do not prefix these gun names with Norinco, I would like to propose that we cut all cases of "Norinco" from the names of Chinese guns on IMFDB. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 23:41, 8 December 2022 (UTC)

== Shouldn't China North Industries Co. Ltd.'s exports still be listed? ==

Other manufacturer pages I'm aware of, like [[Springfield Armory, Inc]] and [[Winchester Repeating Arms]], include firearms imported by them in addition to those manufactured directly. Shouldn't stuff still be listed here, even if it's under a separate section of the article? --[[User:VladVladson|VladVladson]] ([[User talk:VladVladson|talk]]) 04:22, 8 March 2023 (UTC)
: There is no hard and fast rule regarding whether or not imported/exported weapons should be included on manufacturer pages. While I see merit in your arguments, personally I believe that Norinco-exported weapons shouldn't be listed on the Norinco Group page because:
# "Manufactured by Norinco" is a widespread misconception, and including those weapons on this page might inadvertently reinforce that belief if people just skim through the page
# "Norinco = Norinco Group" is also a widespread misconception, and including full lists of both Norinco/Norinco Group activities reinforces this misconception. I prefer to limit the page's topic to just Norinco Group (who are known to manufacture some Chinese missile systems)
# I personally don't think imported/exported weapons should be listed on manufacturer pages (incl. things like Springfield Armory Hellion on the Springfield page), as the category name suggests that the guns on these pages are manufactured by the companies, rather than imported/exported by them
--[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 20:13, 8 March 2023 (UTC)

I know being pedantic is the point of this site, but I feel like we've reached a point where it's starting to impede the function of the site, this page is basically useless now. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 23:57, 12 December 2023 (UTC)

Talk:Call of Duty: Modern Warfare III (2023)

2023-12-08T23:52:59Z

Yocapo32: /* AMR9's Handguard */ new section

=Miscellaneous=
==Switchblade 300==
A stylized AeroVironment Switchblade 300 loitering munition is featured as the "Mosquito Drone" killstreak.

==Gut Hook Knife==
A gut hook knife loosely based on Renegade Tactical G4 Claw Gut Hook appears as the "Gutter Knife".

=Attachments=
==Optics==
===Hensoldt ZO 4x30i===
The same Hensoldt ZO 4x30i based "BPZ40 Hybrid" from ''Modern Warfare II'' is seen in the Gamescom gameplay trailer.

===Kobra Red Dot===
The Kobra Red Dot based "DF105 Reflex Sight" from ''Modern Warfare II'' returns as the "Caucasus Reflex Sight".

==="Slate Reflector"===
The "Slate Reflector" from ''Vanguard'' returns due to Sledgehammer Games developing the multiplayer of MWIII.

===Nydar Model 47===
The Nydar Model 47 from ''Vanguard'' returns as the "Nydar Model 2023" due to Sledgehammer Games developing the multiplayer of MWIII.

===Trijicon SRS===
The Trijicon SRS based "SZ Recharge-DX" from ''Modern Warfare II'' returns with the addition of a riser as the "KR V4 1X Riser".

===Trijicon ACOG===
A stylized Trijicon ACOG is featured as the "RQ-9 Recon".

===Barr & Stroud Reflector Gun Sight Mk II===
The Barr & Stroud Reflector Gun Sight Mk II based "Spitfire Mk. 3 Reflector" from ''Vanguard'' returns as the "Mk. 23 Reflector" due to Sledgehammer Games developing the multiplayer of MWIII.

===PK-120===
A stylized PK-120 holographic sight is featured as the "Chrios Holo".

===ITL MARS===
What appears to be a stylized ITL MARS reflex sight is featured as the "QTG Reflex Sight". This name was later changed to "KR V4 1X Riser".

==Muzzle devices==
===SIG SLX suppressor===
The "Bruen Harmonic Suppressor L" is a SIG SLX silencer, custom made for the [[SIG-Sauer MCX-SPEAR]]/"BAS-B".

==Magazines & Ammunition==
===Magpul PMAG D-60===
The 60 round magazine for the ACR is stylized PMAG D-60.

==Lasers==
===ZenitCo Perst-3===
The same ZenitCo Perst-3 based "STOVL DR Laser Box" from ''Modern Warfare II'' returns as the "CS15 Scarlet Mounted Laser".

=Discussion=
==Weapon list from datamine and leaked images==
Assault Rifles:

jup_ar_acharlie = Bushmaster ACR in 5.56

jup_ar_acharlie300 = Bushmaster ACR in .300 Blackout

jup_ar_golf36 = Heckler & Koch G36

jup_ar_bromeo2m = CZ BREN 2 Ms in 7.62×39

jup_ar_bromeo805 = CZ 805 BREN in 5.56

jup_ar_foxtrot2000 = FN F2000

jup_ar_qbravo95 = QBZ-95 in 5.8x42

jup_ar_qbravo97 = QBZ 97 NSR Gen 3 in 5.56

Battle Rifles:

jup_br_acharlie450 = Bushmaster ACR in .450 Bushmaster

jup_br_bromeo2 = CZ BREN 2 BR in 7.62×51

jup_br_xmike5 = MCX Spear(XM7)

Designated Marksman Rifles:

jup_dm_acharlied = ACR DMR (in 5.56?)

jup_dm_bromeop = CZ BREN 2 PPS

jup_dm_slima8 = Heckler & Koch SL8

jup_dm_svictork = Kalashnikov SVK

Machine Guns:

jup_lm_evictor = FN EVOLYS

jup_lm_mgolf36 = Heckler & Koch MG36

jup_lm_pkilob = Bullpup PKP Pecheneg

jup_lm_pkilop = PKP Pecheneg

jup_lm_qbravo95lsw = QJB-95 LSW

Pistols:

jup_pi_glima21 = Glock 21

jup_pi_mike93 = Beretta 93R

jup_pi_rsierra12 = RSh-12

jup_pi_uzulum = Micro Uzi

Shotguns:

jup_sh_pump = ?

jup_sh_semi = ?

Submachine Guns:

jup_sm_coscar635 = Colt Model 635

jup_sm_lwhiskey = LWRC SMG-45

jup_sm_scharlie3 = CZ SCORPION EVO 3

jup_sm_umike = Heckler & Koch UMP

jup_sm_uzulu = Uzi

jup_sm_uzulup = Uzi Pro

Sniper Rifles:

jup_sn_hsierra = Steyr HS .50 M1

jup_sn_svictor = SVCh

Lethal Equipment:

jup_eq_butterfly_mine = PFM-1 mine

Killstreaks:

jup_ks_lrad = Long-range acoustic device

jup_ks_switchblade_drone = AeroVironment Switchblade

Also confirmed from leaked screenshots: Unknown DMR AK in 5.45, AK-101, Cadex Tremor 50 and Beretta ARX-200 (99.99% probability of an ARX-160).--[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 07:30, 22 August 2023 (UTC)

:As well as that very odd bolt action AK receiver seen in the weapon vault preview. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 01:17, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
::I couldn't identify either of the Vault weapons.--[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 03:59, 23 August 2023 (UTC)
:::The bolt action AK is either a Pakistani Khyber Pass conversion or an Armenian K11M.--[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 04:24, 27 August 2023 (UTC)

== ACR vs. MSBS & VHS-2 vs. QBZ ==

Hi,

thanks for correcting my additions. I'm not interested in a conflict. I'm glad my IDs got challenged. But here is my point:

[[File:Modern warfare 3 2023 msbs grot vhs-1 rrt877.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Screen in question]]

The receiver split on the polish soldiers weapon is strait. Every ACR got a hump. So I thought that the MSBS would be a better pick.

[[File:MSBS GROT C16 FB-A0.jpg|thumb|400px|thumb|none|FB MSBS Grot C16 FB-A0 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[File:Remington ACR PDW rifle.jpg|thumb|450px|thumb|none|Remington ACR PDW - 5.56x45mm NATO]]

In case of the other soldier. I thought the large sights would give it away as a VHS-2 and there seems to be something in the caring handle that would bee the VHS-2's charging handle.

[[File:T97.ca.jpg|thumb|450px|thumb|none|Emei Type 97 NSR (Canadian civilian version of the QBZ-97) with T97.ca LHG (Lower Hand Guard) and FTU (Flat Top Upper) modifications - .223 Remington]]
[[File:VHS2.JPG|thumb|400px|thumb|none|HS Produkt VHS-D2 - 5.56x45mm NATO]]

This is just my opinion, time will tell. --[[User:RRT877|RRT877]] ([[User talk:RRT877|talk]]) 17:05, 15 September 2023 (UTC)
:A VHS-2 with Grot bullpup elements is already [[Call of Duty: Modern Warfare II (2022)#HS_Produkt_VHS-K2|in the previous game]], and as we know, the arsenal from ''MWII'' is supposed to be carried over in this game. The stock of the bullpup rifle much more closely resembles the QBZ. As for the ACR, it does appear to have some visual elements of the normal Grot, but we have to wait until the game is actually available to determine this in detail. It does have the Remington ACR style brass deflector.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 18:34, 15 September 2023 (UTC)

I personally think the rifle in the center is a PSA JAKL.[https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-jakl-300bo-pistol-w-o-brace-fde.html] - [[User:KINKI'boy|KINKI'boy]]([[User talk:KINKI'boy|talk]]) 05:09, 30 September 2023 (JST)

== New weapons from beta/launch datamine ==

Assault Rifles:

jup_jp03_ar_aromeo160 = Beretta ARX160

jup_jp25_ar_talpha95 = IWI Tavor X95

jup_jp36_ar_anov94 = AN 94

Battle Rifles:

jup_jp03_br_aromeo200 = Beretta ARX200

Machine Guns:

jup_cp05_lm_halpha = FN HAMR IAR

Shotguns:

jup_jp16_sh_recho870 = Remington 870

jup_jp09_sh_oromeo12 = Origin-12

jup_cp01_sh_aromeo410 = AR 410

Submachine Guns:

jup_jp03_sm_pmike = Beretta PMX

Sniper Rifles:

jup_jp10_sn_cdelta50 = CDX-50 TREMOR

jup_jp36_sn_boscar = The Polish Bor?

Launchers:

jup_jp22_la_dromeo = no idea

jup_jp26_la_mike32 = Milkor MGL/M32(probably not usable in MP again)

jup_jp26_la_cluster = no idea(M32 variant?)

jup_jp26_la_cluster32 = no idea(M32 variant?)

Melee:

jup_jp23_me_knife = a new knife, more bloat

jup_jp23_me_kalpha = Kali Sticks or a Katana?

Image for reference: https://imgur.com/gquFVvI Asking for corrections/help on the unidentified ones. --[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 06:19, 29 September 2023 (UTC)
:The "sn_boscar" is apparently a part of the same weapon platform as the AN-94 (both have the jp36 prefix). I don't know of any "sniper" variant of the AN-94... Also, the only launcher I can think of that would fit the "dromeo" codename would be the M47 Dragon (aka FGM-77). --[[User:MonocledTarantula432|MonocledTarantula432]] ([[User talk:MonocledTarantula432|talk]]) 06:32, 1 October 2023 (UTC)
::My thoughts exactly, weird to have a sniper rifle together with the AN94, the Dragon is the older Javelin so that wouldn't make sense too. The Tavor 7 and the 9mm conversion are pretty much guaranteed to appear too. --[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 00:32, 2 October 2023 (UTC)

==MWIII Beta weapon names==
Images here: https://imgur.com/a/k5iHbdl --[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 01:37, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
:Damn, they really did a number on that poor AN-94. And the .410 AR is apparently full-auto, that's new. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 02:29, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
::That poor AN-94. I can't recall ever seeing a .410 in a game before, but making it the full auto one should hopefully balance well. Putting "Adaptable" in the ACR's description is a nice touch. The G36K thankfully looks pretty decent (by modern CoD standards), and hopefully the rather high top rail means the expected integrated optics option(s) are actually higher like they should be, unlike MW19. Interesting to see .277 Fury referred to by name, somehow I feel that'll be patched out. Still not sure what the heck the thing under the Model 635's barrel is, but we should be able to put normal barrels on it. As much as the (entirely unnecessary) "copyright-free" redesigns bother me, I do kinda like the "plausible alternate variants", like the ACR DMR. Keeping the "Striker" name despite this one being an actual UMP is still dumb, especially if the 9mm one does indeed turn out to be the SMG-9 with an HK-sounding name. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 03:36, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
:::The Longbow is bolt action by default, so it's a totally made up weapon? Still haven't seen it's caliber --[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 03:48, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
::::Thing with the "Striker" is that the model was mostly taken from MW19's SMG-45 blueprints that have a UMP resemblance, but yeah, they really should have used a different name. As for the copyright-free redesigns, I often see comments on the internet stating that they're avoiding promoting real guns due to California laws. Now, whether it's really due to this or simply to avoid lawsuits from real manufacturers, well... I'll leave it up to your imagination. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 12:02, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
:::::Just noticed another funny little detail: if you take a look at the Bren 2 PPS, the "F" position is where "Safe" would be on an AR, and "S" is ''below'' that, so the selector apparently starts out pointed straight down. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 12:45, 5 October 2023 (UTC)
::::::Guess the "boscar" just meants bolt action. The Longbow's caliber is 7.62 Soviet in-game. --[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 14:24, 5 October 2023 (UTC)

==Weird Gun from leaked mastery callling card==
Is this another made up gun? https://imgur.com/wAChurp --[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 00:48, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
:Looks like some kind of rail gun or even further stylized incarnation of [[Call_of_Duty:_Modern_Warfare_II_(2022)#Walther_WA_2000|this]]? --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 01:38, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
::Almost looks like one of those handheld drone jammer devices, if you ask me. Maybe they're planning to add one as a dedicated anti-scorestreak weapon, similarly to the MANPADS secondaries in previous titles. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 04:14, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
:::Yeah could be the "dromeo" for drone jammer or whatever.--[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 04:59, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
Would the drone guns count? Imo I would add them as other for informations' sake but not worth a page. You guys' opinions?--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 08:52, 6 October 2023 (UTC)
:Yeah, that sounds reasonable - I'd call it comparable to, say, the Glock-based laser designator from the MW2 remaster, in that it's a gun-esque piece of military hardware that could be identified, but not an actual gun. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 14:15, 6 October 2023 (UTC)

== "Lockwood 680" ==

If it has enough Remington 870 parts, fair enough; but in regards to the recent edit summary, the ejection port definitely doesn't match it, it's more squared compared to an actual 870. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GfGY8rOEOFw&t=116s Video for reference.] --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 16:57, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
:It's a bit more squared off, but thats par for the course with the stylizations now. I don't see this thing being really ID-able a S&W 3000 or MP-133.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:13, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
::Okay, I took a look at the older 870 MCS model from MW19, and that one also has a more squared ejection port, so eh, I suppose we can let this one slide. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 15:49, 8 October 2023 (UTC)

== 4 Advanced Warfare weapons coming in S3... ==

EM1 (JP32) "emike1", ASM1 (JP33) "asierra1", BAL27 (JP34) "balpha27" and MORS (JP35). This game is downgrade in terms of gunporn. --[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 18:09, 7 October 2023 (UTC)
: I think is to celebrate the 20th Anniversary of Call of Duty. So if that’s the case, then I expect the Galil ARM, SPAS-12, M1 Garand, and even the Model 1887 to return in this game. It will most likely could be some seasonal event from past games. So we could have a AW map, or even Nuketown, which would be ironic for a Modern Warfare game. That’s what I believe, so expect some WWII, Vietnam, or Futuristic Weapons. My wish list would be the Galil, XM177, M1 Garand, and Ballistic Knife (NSP-2).--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 00:02, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
::Seeing as it's for the sake of the celebration and all that I can just do my best to ignore and not personally use the future guns, but some Cold War, Vietnam, and WWII era guns would definitely be neat. :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 03:39, 11 October 2023 (UTC)
:::It really depends on the WWII guns however, because Vanguard has make the weapons from WWII to curse weapons even in CoD standards. The best they can do at this point is to make the weapons tactical, like the M1 Garand with Sage EBR, which did exist. The Thompson with some tactical parts that also exist and developed by Auto-Ordnance, which could be the answer to the ASM-1. Another one is the H-CAR, even though it won’t fire full-auto, Sledgehammer would make it full-auto. Even though it doesn’t make sense, it at least makes more sense than Vanguard’s .50cal BAR.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 05:40, 11 October 2023 (UTC)

== Grenades ==

Since these appear to come straight from the previous game, should they be listed on the page, as done with ''MWII'''s firearms?--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 14:11, 9 October 2023 (UTC)

== More COD2024 weapons found in new datamine! ==

Full list here: https://imgur.com/VBUPVLs

-t10_ar_able18 = AR-18(weird since the Colt Model 723 is still in)

-t10_ar_love85 = L85

-t10_sm_chuck9 = Colt 9mm SMG? (don't have the platforms in this datamine to compare with the AR line)

-t10_sm_pparis90 = PP-90

-t10_sn_love96 = L96A1

-t10_sh_uncle1 = USAS-12? (fits the time period)

-t10_me_halligan = a Halligan which is a multipurpose tool (weird)

-t10_la_stisaac = FIM-92 Stinger

Also worth noting that some weapons changed weapon class like the elusive "rmary2" now being in the Assault Rifle category (the IMI Romat, also known as Rov've Mitta'enn is a battle rifle so no idea what this should be).--[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 01:30, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

:That CoD looks to be getting all the good guns. :( [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 01:43, 12 October 2023 (UTC)

::The full list of weapons from datamine appeared: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/10BwA8Ia-SlnaZgDFLXjdP9AfG9h7ZsWtuVdofTakxHQ/edit#gid=1749315760 Ignore the obvious mistakes of gun identification but also note the ridiculous classe changes like the SIG 550 being a DMR and some guns having their internal names changed or appearing duplicate. Only new guns from this seem to be the SR-2 Veresk(t10_sm_srvalor) and the Leader Dynamics Series T2 MK5(t10_ar_leasy, probably a SAR 80 which explains the addition of the AR-18 as a platform). No further verification can be made because this datamine doesn't contain the weapon platforms numbers but this seems close to launch list of weapons around 50. --[[User:Phillip Graves|Phillip Graves]] ([[User talk:Phillip Graves|talk]]) 21:02, 13 October 2023 (UTC)

==ACR???==
Can we really define the "ACR" as Bushmaster? I'm not knowledgeable on this but is there any visual difference between the Bushmaster and the Remington because if not then considering that the in game gun has full auto behavior wouldn't it make more sense to define it as ''"Remington ACR with Masada/Bushmaster handguard"''? --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 00:43, 21 October 2023 (UTC)
:There are some videos of full-auto Bushmaster ACRs on YouTube (some of them were modified, but still), so I guess the ID should be fine as it currently is. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 11:21, 21 October 2023 (UTC)
::On the other hand, we might have to ID the "MCW 6.8" as a Magpul Masada SPR. The final release shows it with with the latter's long handguard, and after doing some research, I don't think that this handguard was used on the Bushmaster ACR DMR. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 23:38, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
:::It's still got the ACR's forward-mounted charging handle instead of the Masada's more centrally-placed one, though - funnily enough, our Masada SPR reference image also does, which tells me that it might not actually be a Masada SPR (especially given how it looks like a 3D render). [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 23:49, 9 November 2023 (UTC)
::::The first Magpul prototypes had the charging handle in the center, but later ones from 2008 [https://defensereview.com/stories/shotshow2008/BushmasterFirearms_AdaptiveCombatRifle%28ACR%29_3_SHOTShow2008_2-02-08.jpg did actually have] forward-mounted ones. EDIT: interestingly, while the gun in the middle of this image has "Magpul Armament" markings, I just noticed that it's also marked "ACR". This is from [https://defensereview.com/magpul-masada-riflecarbine-becomes-the-bushmaster-adaptive-combat-rifle-acr/ that article] regarding the transition from the Magpul Masada to the Bushmaster ACR. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 00:06, 10 November 2023 (UTC)

== Longbow rifle ==

I believe that the “Longbow” AK sniper rifle is a AK-103 from MW2022 with the bolt action based off the Ukrainian GOPAK straight pull bolt rifle. The real GOPAK is much shorter (lacking a traditional handguard) and has an integral fitted suppressor but the general shape of the gun in game has a AKM/AK-103 receiver AK-74M folding stock. What do you all think? --[[User:MrJDK9412|MrJDK9412]] ([[User talk:MrJDK9412|talk]]) 19:00 AEST, 11 November 2023 (UTC)

== AMR9's Handguard ==

I doubt it was intentional, since Call of Duty's target audience has been fetuses for years now, but the unnecessarily massive handguard housing a laser tube that would've been considered too big in 1992 does remind me somewhat of the Coreburner from [[Escape from L.A.]] --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 23:52, 8 December 2023 (UTC)

Talk:Beretta 92 pistol series

2023-10-30T21:49:37Z

Yocapo32: /* Samurai Edge Correction */ new section

__TOC__ 

=Extra Images=
==Additional Variants==
===92S===
[[File:B92S_right.jpg‎|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92S (right side) - 9x19mm]]
[[File:Beretta_92S-original.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Italian Beretta 92S - 9mm]]

===92SB===
[[File:B92SB.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92SB - 9x19mm Photo courtesy of [[User:Yournamehere|Yournamehere]].]]
[[Image:Beretta92C.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92SB-C with nickel finish and wood grips - 9x19mm]]

===92FS===
[[File:Beretta92FSExtended.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS with extended 30-round magazine - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS compensator.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS with attached SGS compensator - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:RT-BC2-G&RS-Green for B92.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS with Recover Tactical BC2 Grip & Rail System - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Recover-tactical-Beretta-92-Grip-Rail-System-BC2-tan.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS with Recover Tactical BC2 Grip & Rail System - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS suppressed.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Suppressed Beretta 92FS - 9x19mm]]
[[File:Beretta92FS ExtR.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS rendered with extended barrel and magazine to resemble the [[Beretta 93R]] - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta two tone-1-.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Prototype two-tone Beretta 92FS - 9x19mm Parabellum. (This was a prototype before making an all American Beretta two-tone pistols.]]
[[File:B92fs-REVERSE2TONE.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS reverse two-tone (Inox frame, blued slide) - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta92FSCustom.jpeg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS (Custom Reverse Two-Tone) - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS Gold.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Gold Beretta 92FS - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:92FSFusion.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS Fusion - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS wood grips.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Beretta 92FS with wood grips - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:CustomNickelBeretta92FS.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS with nickel plating and custom grips - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS with gold parts.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS with gold external parts - 9x19mm.]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS gold finish.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS with gold finish and black parts - 9x19mm Parabellum]]

===92FS Inox===
[[File:92FS Inox with pearl grips.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS Inox with pearl grips - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS Inox compensator.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS Inox with attached compensator - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:BIH1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS Inox with Hogue wrap-around grips and spare magazine - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS Inox wood grips.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS Inox with wood grips (US made gun with black controls) - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:Beretta 92FS Inox silenced.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS Inox with silencer - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:92FS_Inox_rosewood_grips.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS Inox with rosewood grips - 9x19mm Parabellum]]
[[File:92FS Inox with gold parts.jpg|thumb|none|400px|US made Beretta 92FS Inox with gold parts - 9x19mm]]

===92FS Compact===
[[File:Beretta 92FC-M pistol.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FC-M (Compact - Type M) - 9x19mm]]

===PAMAS G1===
[[File:PamasG1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|PAMAS G1 - 9x19mm]]

===Beretta 92 Billennium===
[[File:BERETTA-BILLENNIUM.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92 Billennium, the commemorative edition for the year 2000. Only 2,000 were made and they are very desirable. Can be differentiated from the Beretta 92 Steel I by the "fish scale"-style slide serrations - 9x19mm]]

===M9A3===
[[File:M9A3 Left.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta M9A3 - 9x19mm]]

===92X===
[[File:Beretta 92X Centurion.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92X Centurion - 9x19mm]]
[[File:Beretta 92X Compact.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92X Compact - 9x19mm]]
[[File:Beretta 92X Compact with Rail.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92X Compact with rail - 9x19mm]]
[[File:92xi.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92XI SAO - 9x19mm Parabellum]]

==Screen Used==
[[Image:BerettaM92FS-DieHard2-4.jpg‎|thumb|400px|none|Screen-used Beretta 92F (9x19mm) wielded by Bruce Willis in ''[[Die Hard]]''. Note the extended mag release and slide release, which were modifications made specifically for [[Bruce Willis]].]]
[[Image:BerettaM92FS DH1&LW1.jpg‎|thumb|400px|none| This well worn Beretta 92FS 9x19mm [[Mel Gibson]] used in the films ''[[Lethal Weapon 2]]'', ''[[Lethal Weapon 3]]'' and ''[[Lethal Weapon 4]]'']]
[[Image:DH3-Beretta92FS.jpg|thumb|400px|none|A Beretta 92FS 9x19mm configured for left-handed firing. This is one of the actual Berettas (Four identical guns were used on set) used by [[Bruce Willis]] in the film ''[[Die Hard with a Vengeance]]'' ]]
[[Image:5.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS fitted with AL-GI-MEC - 9x19mm used by Léon ([[Jean Reno]]) in the film ''[[Léon (The Professional)]]''.]]
[[Image:6.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS fitted with AL-GI-MEC used by Léon in the film with suppressor.]]
[[Image:7.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Upper shot of Beretta with the slide locked back.]]
[[Image:4.jpg|thumb|none|400px|AL-GI-MEC Compensator by LA.RI.A, Italian Manufacturer. Note: This is not the modern SGS compensator.]]
[[Image:Trinity Beretta92C 9and10 4.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS Compact stunt props used in the films ''[[The Matrix Reloaded]]'' and ''[[The Matrix Revolutions]]'' - 9x19mm.]]
[[Image:Blade2-1.jpg|thumb|400px|none|One of the Beretta 92FS heavily customized handguns, with huge blades at the bottom of the barrels, and laser sights were used in the movie ''[[Blade II]]''.]]
[[Image:EQBeretta.jpg|thumb|400px|none|A PhotoShop recreation of the Grammaton Cleric sidearms (heavily modified Beretta 92FS) - 9x19mm used in the film ''[[Equilibrium]]''. (The ones in the film did not have the Beretta logo).]]
[[Image:Screen used equilibrium gun 05.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Screen-used rubber stunt gun. Note that this weapon lacks the selector switch of the detailed Hero gun.]]
[[Image:DSCN0157-1-.jpg‎|thumb|none|400px|The Beretta 92FS pistols modified to fire on full auto with barrel weights attached, and added compensators were used in the movie ''[[Underworld]]'' - 9mm.]]
[[Image:Jamesgeorgopoulosmissionimpossibleimfdb.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92G Elite 1A - 9x19mm. This is the screen-used firearm handled by [[Tom Cruise]] and [[Keri Russell]] in the film ''[[Mission: Impossible III]]''. '''Thanks to [[User:Jimmygcreative|James Georgopoulos]]'''.]]
[[Image:AmericanSniper92FS.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Screen-used stunt (airsoft, made by KWC) Beretta 92FS (Ranger One's) from ''[[American Sniper]]''. Image from Prop Store of London.]]
[[File:Kingsman92FS.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Screen-used stunt Beretta 92FS frame and slide from ''[[Kingsman: The Secret Service]]''. Image from Prop Store of London.]]
[[File:Kingsman92FS2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Opposite side view of the stunt 92FS slide from ''Kingsman: The Secret Service''. Image from Prop Store of London.]]
[[File:BerettaM9A3 24Legacy.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta M9A3 - 9x19mm. Screen used firearm carried by Eric Carter ([[Corey Hawkins]]) in ''[[24: Legacy]]''. Image courtesy of Xtreme Props.]]
[[File:MI2 Beretta.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Screen-used Beretta 92FS Compact stunt prop in ''[[Mission: Impossible II]]''. Note the Centurion marking. Image courtesy of Prop Store Ltd.]]
[[File:Beretta REWTRC.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Two-tone Beretta 92FS with SureFire MR04 adapter and Streamlight weaponlight used by Albert Wesker ([[Tom Hopper]]) in ''[[Resident Evil: Welcome to Raccoon City]]'' - 9x19mm. Image courtesy of Movie Armaments Group.]]
[[File:Beretta 2 REWTRC.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Beretta 92FS pistols used in ''[[Resident Evil: Welcome to Raccoon City]]'' - 9x19mm. Image courtesy of Movie Armaments Group.]]

==Replicas==
[[Image:Bruni928mm.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Bruni Model Beretta 92FS blank firing stage prop - 8mm blank.]]
[[File:Reck_Miami_92F_black.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Reck Miami 92F - 9 mm P.A.K.]]
[[Image:SwordCutlass9mm.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Airsoft replica of Revy's custom nickel Beretta 92F "9mm Sword Cutlass" from ''[[Black Lagoon]]''.]]
[[Image:Hfcm190.jpg|thumb|400px|none|"Beretta M9 CQB Brigadier" Airsoft replica]]
[[File:Umarex Beretta XX-Treme.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Umarex Beretta XX-Treme CO2 airgun - .177 pellet]]
[[File:Tokyo-marui-m9-tac-master.jpg|thumb|none|400px|'''Airsoft''' Tokyo Marui M9 Tactical Master]]
[[File:Western Arms Aria Kinji Beretta.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Western Arms airsoft replica of Kinji Tohyama's custom Beretta 92FS Inox from ''[[Aria the Scarlet Ammo]]''. Note the selector switch in place of the safety lever.]]

===Samurai Edge===
The "Samurai Edge" refers to a series of custom Beretta pistols featured in the ''[[Resident Evil]]'' video game series. In lore, these pistols were custom made by gunsmith Joseph Kendo (brother of Robert Kendo, a character in ''Resident Evil 2'') of Raccoon City for the Raccoon City Police Department's S.T.A.R.S. (Special Tactics And Rescue Service) unit, and are used by S.T.A.R.S. members, including Jill Valentine, Barry Burton, Chris Redfield, Albert Wesker, and Rebecca Chambers. Officially known in-universe as "M92F S.T.A.R.S Custom", they were nicknamed "Samurai Edge" by Kendo. The pistols made their first appearance in ''[[Resident Evil 3: Nemesis]]'' with Jill wielding a 92FS "Samurai Edge" as her sidearm, and an in-game document establishes their name and background. They had since became something of a staple gun of the video game series.

The basic Samurai Edge is a customized [[Beretta 92FS Brigadier]] with S.T.A.R.S. and Samurai Edge markings on the slide, and fitted with custom wood and synthetic grips with the S.T.A.R.S. emblem on it. They also sport target sights, an extended slide catch, and a stainless steel barrel. Variations of the Samurai Edge are used by different characters across the games.
* Jill, Chris, and Rebecca carry largely basic Samurai Edge pistols, though Jill's Samurai Edge has a blue medallion.
* Barry Burton's Samurai Edge features a compensator, extended magazines, an underbarrel rail, full synthetic grips (replaced with standard Samurai Edge wood and synthetic grips in its ''Revelations 2'' iteration), and a red medallion. It is also described as firing .40 S&W, meaning that it is mechanically closer to the [[Beretta 96]]. Barry's Samurai Edge is also further modified between its ''[[Resident Evil (2002)]]'' and ''[[Resident Evil: Revelations 2]]'' appearances. Interestingly, Barry has never canonically used his REmake Samurai Edge; his only appearances with his REmake Samurai Edge are in non-canon Mercenary mini-games/spin-off games.
* Albert Wesker carries a modified two-tone version with a full-length under-barrel rail, a skeletonized hammer, and an extended beavertail. A further modified Wesker special Samurai Edge appears as the "Albert-01" in ''[[Resident Evil 7]]''.

Interestingly, the Samurai Edge has appeared exactly ''once'' in Paul W.S. Anderson's live-action ''Resident Evil'' movies, in ''[[Resident Evil: The Final Chapter]]''. The movie gun clearly has a Samurai Edge grip and a stainless steel barrel, but it differs from the video game gun in many details.

In real life, licensed airsoft reproductions of the in-game models are officially produced by Tokyo Marui. Tokyo Marui had also produced several special limited edition non-canon Samurai Edge models. Two of these models, the "Jill Valentine model" and the "Chris Redfield model", have appeared in the video games as non-canon DLC content.

* The Jill model (officially named "Samurai Edge A1 Jill Valentine Model"; Japanese: サムライエッジA1〈ジル・バレンタインモデル〉), released in 2013, features the underbarrel rail of the [[Beretta M9A1]].
* The Chris model (officially named "Samurai Edge ''Kai'' M92F/S.T.A.R.S. Custom Chris Redfield Model"; Japanese: サムライ・エッジ改 M92F/S.T.A.R.S.カスタム〈クリス・レッドフィールドモデル〉), released in 2000 (and saw a second release in 2011 to commemmorate 15 years of ''Resident Evil'') features a blued slide.

The Jill model appeared in ''[[Resident Evil: Revelations]]'' as a DLC gun (the DLC and the airsoft gun being released around the same time), and both are featured in the 2019 remake for ''[[Resident Evil 2 (2019)|Resident Evil 2]]'' as DLC guns.

Aside from Tokyo Marui, WE Tech have also produced their own copies of the in-game pistols. Making custom airsoft Beretta 92s or ''real'' Beretta 92s to reproduce the in-game models is also fairly popular among the more avid fans.

[[File:RESamuraiEdgeAirsoft.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui airsoft replica of the Beretta 92FS "Samurai Edge" from the ''Resident Evil'' video game series. With close up on the engravings.]]
[[File:STARGun.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui airsoft replica of the Beretta 92FS "Samurai Edge" from the ''Resident Evil'' video game series.]]
[[File:RE3-Samurai-Edge-Jill-Version.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui airsoft replica of Jill Valentine's Beretta 92FS "Samurai Edge" from ''[[Resident Evil 3: Nemesis]]''.]]
[[File:Barry_Burton_Samurai_Edge.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui airsoft replica of Barry Burton's Samurai Edge from ''[[Resident Evil (2002)|Resident Evil]]'' (2002).]]
[[File:BarrySamuraiEdge V2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui airsoft replica of Barry Burton's Samurai Edge from ''[[Resident Evil: Revelations 2]]''.]]
[[File:Samurai Edge A.Wesker model.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui airsoft replica of Albert Wesker's Beretta 92FS "Samurai Edge" from the ''Resident Evil'' video game series.]]
[[File:Re7awp.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui airsoft replica of the "Albert-01" from ''[[Resident Evil 7]]''.]]
[[File:Tokyo-marui-samurai-edge-albert-w-model-01-gbb-limited-model.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The "Samurai Edge Albert W. Model 01" and its components.]]
[[File:Samurai Edge Kai Chris Redfield.jpg|thumb|none|400px|"Tokyo Marui ''Kai'' airsoft replica of Chris Redfield's "Samurai Edge".]]
[[File:Samurai Edge Chris.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui Samurai Edge ''Kai'' M92F/S.T.A.R.S. Custom Chris Redfield Model airsoft pistol.]]
[[File:Samurai Edge Jill.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui Samurai Edge A1 Jill Valentine Model airsoft pistol.]]
[[File:Samurai Edge AW 01P.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Tokyo Marui Albert. W. Model 01P airsoft pistol.]]

=Discussion=
==Correction==
The Boondock Saints characters David Della Rocco and the McManus brothers were incorrectly listed as users of the Beretta 92FS. In the movie, the actual pistols used were the Taurus PT92 with optional suppressors. The Taurus markings are visible in the Carlo Yakavetta execution scene at the end of the movie and was also confirmed by the armorer for the movie and director Troy Duffy.
:Well your correction was wrong. Have you even looked at the page? Here is a screencap. That's definitely a Beretta, it sometimes switches to a PT92 in certain scenes. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 14:08, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
[[Image:BSBeretta92FS-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|"And shepherds we shall be, for Thee, my Lord, for Thee. Power hath descended forth from Thy hand, that our feet may swiftly carry out Thy command. So we shall flow a river forth to Thee, and teeming with souls shall it ever be."]]

==Curious Question==
The Beretta Centurion, is it simply a 92FS with a shortened barrel? Or is there something else I'm missing?

It's essentially got the Compact's barrel and slide, the normal sized frame, and a slightly shorter dust cover that doesn't really fit into either other category. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 10:37, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

==Just a reminder==

When you talk about the Beretta 92F or 92FS, it is not spelled "M92F" (as this page is titled), "M92FS", or even "92 FS" with a space in between the "92" and "FS". It's just Beretta 92F or Beretta 92FS, exactly as I have just spelled it. If you see a page with the older (mis)spelling, please do not hesitate to correct it.

And considering that this page has grown to include all of the 92 variants (including the SB, Brigadier, Centurion, etc.), it might be time to rename it. I would recommend re-titling the page "Beretta 92-series pistols". Anyone else agree? [[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

==...==

Why not have more info on the 93R? Give it its own page?

I propose the following info 9 (and an image if possible; how do I place/upload images here anyway?)

----

The '''[[Beretta 93R]]''' (full name: '''Beretta Model 93R''') is a selective-fire 9mm machine pistol. The "R" stands for "Raffica" which means burst in Italian. It was designed in the 70s and meant for police and military use, offering extra firepower in a small package. It is perfect for concealed carry purposes such as VIP protection, or for close quarters fighting such as room-to-room searches.

A selector switch and the foldable foregrip allows the pistol to fire three round bursts with each pull of the trigger for a potential cyclic rate of 1100 rpm. The designers limited it to three round bursts to allow it to be more easily controlled. The 93R is basically a Beretta 92 series pistol (the Beretta [[92FS]] is designated '''"M9"''' by the US military, and is the standard issue pistol for the US military). But the 93R is single action and outfitted with a muzzle brake, an optional detachable shoulder stock and a 20-round magazine that also allowed for a firmer grip. It is currently out of production.

The gun has been used in several movies:

* [[Face/Off]] a 1997 action movie starring John Travolta and Nicolas Cage and directed by John Woo.

* [[Equilibrium]] a 2002 action/science fiction film written and directed by Kurt Wimmer with Christian Bale, Taye Diggs, Christian Kahrmann, Emily Watson and Sean Bean.

==Title change==
I hope no one minds that I changed the page name, "pistol series" matches more of the titles on other pages and is easier to remember than "Series Pistols". Agreed? -GM

==Why separate INOX?==
I was just wondering if there were any technical differences between the 92FS and the INOX, other than the slide being stainless.

:Good question. Only because there are so many movies featuring the 92F Inox that if we didn't separate it from the regular 92F, we'd have to put notes about "Inox finish" in parentheses near each. Whereas most of the other Berettas with Inox finishes don't appear in nearly as many movies. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

What happened to the other Inox pic that was posted a few days ago? Could you send it to me, please? - [[User:Taurus96]]

==Die Hard and Lethal Weapon==
I've looked at a few of the Die Hard and Lethal Weapon pages, and there seems to be some confusion about which of the two Berettas on this site was used in each film. So, for future reference: which Berettas were used in the Die Hard films and the Lethal Weapon films? I'll put them up. Thanks. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 02:10, 23 September 2009 (UTC)
[[Image:BerettaM92FS-DieHard2-4.jpg‎ |thumb|350px|none|]]
[[Image:BerettaM92FS DH1&LW1.jpg‎|thumb|350px|none|]]

:What the Beretta page says is pretty much accurate. The first gun was used in both the first ''[[Die Hard]]'' and ''[[Lethal Weapon]]''. See how it has a custom extended slide release (due to Willis being a leftie)? In ''[[Die Hard]]'', there are plenty of scenes where it's possible to see that same extension on the slide release (most notably, during the scene where McClane is about to wander through the shattered glass). The second gun was used in the other three ''Die Hard'' movies and ''[[Demolition Man]]''.

:Also, I don't know why people keep putting the ''[[Die Hard]]'' Beretta on other pages for movies which didn't feature that '''particular''' gun. It should only be used for pages on movies in which it's actually appeared, no more. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

::Ok, so the first one was in the first ''Die Hard'' and the first ''Lethal Weapon'', while the second was used in the other three ''Die Hard''s. Was the second also used in the other ''Lethal Weapons''?

::It's interesting how the ''Lethal Weapon'' pistol was the same one from ''Die Hard''. Obviously it was modified for Bruce Willis to use, but didn't ''Lethal Weapon'' come out a year prior to ''Die Hard''?

::As far as using the ''Die Hard'' image goes, I think people are doing that to pages that have the Beretta 92F and not the 92FS. This is probably because the Beretta 92F from ''Die Hard'' is the only image of a Beretta 92F on this site. Thanks for your help, MT. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 05:00, 23 September 2009 (UTC)

:::Also, the Beretta used in the first Lethal Weapon was different from in the subsequent films because it had a gold Beretta logo on the grips instead of the black one that matches the grips on the Berettas shown here. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 06:05, 23 September 2009 (UTC)

::::''the second was used in the other three ''Die Hard''s. Was the second also used in the other ''Lethal Weapons''?''

::::I'm not really sure. When MoviePropMaster took the pictures of these guns, he said he may have got confused what movies they appeared in. But here is a picture of the second Beretta (and its "stunt double") in their display case at Stembridge & Cinema Weaponry:

::::[[Image:DisplayCase01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

::::You can see that the label next to the gun only mentions ''Die Hard II'' and ''Demolition Man'' as its movie appearances. But MPM '''did''' say he was specifically told that they also brought this Beretta out of "retirement" from the glass case so that it could have a cameo appearance in ''[[Live Free or Die Hard]]'' (as we mentioned on the page for that movie). I'm not sure if it was in ''[[Die Hard with a Vengeance]]'', but that strikes me as unlikely because that movie was filmed in New York and a different armory supplied the weapons for it. I'm also not sure if it was in any of the other ''[[Lethal Weapon]]'' movies or not. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

::::''As far as using the Die Hard image goes, I think people are doing that to pages that have the Beretta 92F and not the 92FS. This is probably because the Beretta 92F from Die Hard is the only image of a Beretta 92F on this site.''

::::Hmmm, to me, that's kind of stupid because there is so little difference between the 92F and 92FS. Not to mention that it's rather hard to be sure when one or the other is being used (the 92FS replaced the 92F in production very quickly, after all). But I would prefer that the ''[[Die Hard]]''/''[[Lethal Weapon]]'' Beretta only be used on pages for movies in which it actually appears. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

:::::I think they do this to movies that featured the Beretta that were made in the 80s. If I'm not mistaken, the Beretta 92FS came out in 1990, so they probably think it would be inaccurate to post a picture of the 92FS when the movie obviously used a 92F. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 23:47, 23 September 2009 (UTC)

::::::Well that's all a moot point. I Just uploaded two shots of early Beretta 92Fs which can be used generically as opposed to the hero movie guns. Thank you thank you thank you, just leave a tip in the jar........ [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 07:34, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

MPM2008, you deserve a cookie. I have replaced the 92FS image and the Die Hard 92F in a few 80's films. But what is the best year to stop using the 92F? Lethal Weapon 2 came out in '89 and Die Hard 2 '90, they both feature the 92FS. Anything prior to '88? -[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 16:16, 30 September 2009 (UTC)
:The 92FS actually came out in either late 1988/early 1989, so these guns were purchased IMMEDIATELY and used right away, which is rare unless it's a hot and 'hip/trendy' gun like the 92. Prior to 1989 there ARE no 92FS guns. PRior to 1983 there are no 92F guns (The ones in 1983 were actually 92SB-F guns which were the same weapon. There is NO stop use date for the 92F or even the 92S/92SB guns. As you've seen people still grab them from inventory as recently as now in films. Just because the Walther P38 technically stopped production at the end of WW2 (Walther's post war versions were actually named differently) we still see the P38 in films for the past 65 years. So in essence we're just taking a wild guess. The only things we can be sure of is when they are NOT being used (i.e. the year of production is too early for the model to have been sold). But any gun of any age can be used at any time. When in doubt and it looks the same, opt for the 92FS from 1990 on unless you can get a really good look at the shiny grips, then it's a 92F. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 19:42, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

Awesome work on the new Beretta 92F pictures, MPM2008, they look great!--[[User:Alienqueen11|Alienqueen11]] 20:12, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

I get what you mean about the 92F still being used today. But like you said unless you can really see the shiny grips or have a really great shot of the slide. You pretty much have to go when the film was made. I haven't handled that many Beretta's I didn't even notice the grips being different F shiny vs FS flat.
Here is a pic of my 92F. While the grips look flat, they're shiny it is just my crappy photo skills.
[[Image:PRE20-BER92F.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
Also wouldn't a history timeline of the changes on the 92 be a good thing for the page? -[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 22:02, 30 September 2009 (UTC)

==Distinction==
What exactly is the distinction between the Beretta 92F and the 92FS?
:The FS models have a slide retention device on the frame. Here is a pic showing the slide differences. The FS on top, F on the bottom. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 19:03, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
[[Image:Slide.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

== Variations we don't have ==

We are lacking:

Beretta 92A1: 17 round mag, and a Picattiny-Similar rail under the barrel

Beretta 96A1: Same as above but is chambered in .40 S&W and haves a 12 round mag

Beretta 92FS type M9A1: Basically a civilian M9A1 --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 01:30, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

:Unless those weapons have appeared in any movies or TV shows, I'm not sure we need them on this page. Our goal is to document what appears in movies, not to make a comprehensive list of every variant that Beretta has ever made. As a general guideline, we don't add variants/pictures to a page if we have no evidence that they've appeared in any media. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:54, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

Ok --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 00:17, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

== Custom Grips? ==

I'm in the process of customizing my Beretta, and I've found something that I really like, but I don't know the name of the product. It's the kind of grip in the picture used for the Brigadier Inox, and similarly seen in this image here: http://lh4.ggpht.com/_fP72_yZL4Yk/Sseqpb4zlsI/AAAAAAAAAZQ/1IvokqYHl30/s800/DSC_1636.jpg though I'm not sure they're the same brand of grips. Either way, though, does anyone know a company that sells grips like these for the 92FS? Hopefully at a relatively low price? [[User:Acora|Acora]] 06:05, 6 August 2010 (UTC)
:Those look like Hogue grips. They are pretty common. Fairly inexpensive too. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 08:56, 6 August 2010 (UTC)

== Could be better ==

I just personally think "why would they not do that?" Like getting rid of the rounded trigger guard, or not giving it a M1911A1 style safety. Not to mention they could add about half of an inch to the barrel. I have never been able to find someone who would customize my old 92F, half the time the telling after I told them what I wanted, they would say, "It can't be done." Of course, being I'm stubborn as hell, I kept looking until I just gave up. Are these custom features too much or just can't happen except in my dreams? - [[User:Kilgore|Kilgore]] 05:58, 22 August 2010 (UTC)
:If you want the "M1911A1 style safety" wouldn't you be better off with an original 92 that has the frame mounted safety versus the slide mounted safety of all the later variants. The trigger guard could probably be reshaped, no problem. But not sure if the alloy frame would cause problems. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 15:17, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Or just get a Taurus, they are good guns.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 14:12, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

== Could someone explain this to me? ==

What is the benefit of purchasing a Brigadier over a typical 92fs? I have been attempting to research it, and can find no definitive answer.
:Stronger slide. The Brigadier slide is beefed up where the 92fs slide weak point is, at the the locking block area. That's the most common area for them to crack at.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 15:12, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
[[Image:Beretta-Inox.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Beretta 92FS INOX - 9x19mm.]]
[[Image:BrigadierInox.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Beretta 92FS Brigadier Inox 9x19mm.]]

Thank you!

I have a question as well . i was on a page before and they refered to the 92FS as a "Lane And Weston" what dose that mean? simmons 8492
:Reread [[Monk#"Lane & Westen" (Fictional name for Beretta)|that page]], it says what it means pretty clearly.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 02:25, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

==Beretta 92SB vs. Beretta 92FS==
Aside from the shape of the trigger gaurd, what are the differences between the Beretta 92SB and the Beretta 92FS? -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
:The SB still had the traditional bluing while the 92F has the Bruniton finish.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 17:06, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
::Could you give more information about the two finnishes? Pros and cons of each, the finnishing process, why they switched?
:::The Bruniton finish has the matte black look, it's supposed to be more durable than bluing as most other finishes are. My 92F is a former police gun, made in '87 I think. While it's got some wear. The Bruniton finish has done its job. The finishing process I have no idea. The finish on the frames looks to me like they stayed the same.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 17:52, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
[[Image:PRE20-BER92F.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]

==Grey's Anatomy==
In grey's anatomy, season 6 ep 23~24 it looks like the shooter was using either the 92 or the 96 I am not sure which. Can anybody verify? - [[User:teckchris|teckchris]]
:More likely a 92. 9mm pistols work better with blanks than .40s, and since so many blank-firing 92s are available for use, it doesn't seem likely they would use a 96. I saw the episode in question, but can't remember what the bore size looked like. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

I've created a page for the show, and put in a few entries from the episode. Posted a number of images of the Beretta, as well. [[Grey's Anatomy]] [[User:S. Wolf|S. Wolf]]

==LAPD version==
Does anyone know if the LAPD (or California Law enforcement in general) is required to abide by the 10rd limit they impose on civilians? I'm pretty sure the LAPD adopted this weapon before the limit was instated, however since it was passed are the uniformed patrol officers required to use the restricted capacity magazines civilians are forced to make due with? -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

: It varies/depends on the particular state somewhat but generally no, law enforcement isn't limited by the same restrictions as civilians. After all, they do have selective-fire, short-barreled and/or suppressed weapons, and even access to restricted ammunition and other things. I'm pretty sure extra-loaded mags for their service semiautos are part of the deal. In some gun catalogs it states certain capacity magazines are available only to law enforcement. So, yes they can have full 15 (10+) round magazines. I'm not positive as to whether this applies to CA specifically, but I would think so. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 23:00, 7 November 2010 (UTC)

::I find that appalling. SWAT officers certainly should not be required to abide by the same restrictions as civilians as they are more highly trained, do not interact with the public often, and are only called when things really get hairy, but I don't believe patrol officers should be permitted to possess weapons that are forbidden to private citizens, as any situation they might encounter a civilian could be faced with as well, and, because they interact with the general public more, there is greater potential for abuse if the balance of power is too much in their favor. I don't want to sound like some kind of paranoid anarchist, however in principal I don't think the average cop on the street should be able to outgun every citizen he may encounter. Sure 10rds vs. 15rds may not be that big a deal, but it's a slippery slope. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

::: Again, I'm not too specific about all the uh, specifics. And some vary depending on which state you live in. Some civilians are allowed 'restricted' stuff, though not in many cases from what I gather. Still, I agree with you whole-heartedly. Granted I wouldn't mind so much about them getting a few extra rounds in their semiautos (one of the reasons they went to semiautos in the first place was higher capacity), but I hear you about the rest. 'Special' weapons of the sort SHOULD only be issued/used by SWAT teams and other 'special' units. Unfortunately, some cities/departments don't seem to care much in that regard, especially these days. The LAPD you're talking about is also the same LAPD that issued hundreds of military-surplus M16 rifles to regular patrolmen as a knee-jerk reaction to the 1997 North Hollywood Shootout, a decision that still holds effective to this day I believe. And other departments have followed suit (I have seen an episode of 'COPS' with a regular patrolman holding an M4-type rifle on a suspect). Anyway, I still haven't given you a definitive answer about your initial question, so before we continue preaching further, perhaps we should wait until we get one, though I'm pretty sure what the answer will be. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 00:31, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

::::What do you mean that "they" impose on civilians? LAPD are law enforcers, not lawmakers. And no, I don't think LAPD deserves to be subject to the same idiotic laws that civilians are subjected to. Just because legislators in CA are stupid doesn't mean the LAPD needs to be impeded from doing their jobs. And contrary to what you seem to think, LAPD officers are not going to encounter the same situations that civilians encounter. It is their '''job''' to put themselves out on patrol in dangerous areas on a daily basis, which means that they are statistically more likely to be at risk than civilians. I realize you hate CA's gun laws, but taking your anger out on law enforcement officers is hardly a rational response. You do sound like a "paranoid anarchist". -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 03:31, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

:::::They may not make the laws, but by enforcing them they give them credibility. Complacency is complicity, after all. And yes, the LAPD(with exception of SWAT) deserve to be subject to the same laws as civilians. Here in California, a Ruger Mini-14 is not an assault weapon, but an AR-15 is, despite both being functionally identical, save for a few ergonomic and cosmetic features. And when you consider that Assault Weapons Ban Supporters claim that the only purpose of Assault Weapons is killing lots of people(their words, not mine), it makes you start to wonder why every patrolcar has one in it. I didn't realize that it was the police's job to kill lots of people. 10 round limits are fine, but not the rest of it. As for the original question, I walk by a police station every other day, and I see in each patrolcar an AR-15 type SBR with a 20 round magazine(in addition to a riotgun). I've never looked closely enough to know whether they are full-auto though. So no, even regular police are not governed by the same restrictions as civilians here in CA.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 06:23, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

::::::It's their job to enforce the law. They don't have a choice. Plenty of people work in professions where they have to do stuff that they don't necessarily agree with. By your definition, anyone in California who obeyed the law (and doesn't buy 15-round magazines) must also be "complicit". Just because you disagree with CA's magazine capacity limits doesn't mean police deserve to suffer the same restrictions. And in case you've forgotten, at least civilians have the option of fleeing from scenes of violence, whereas a police officer's job is pretty much to run towards it. Take your ire out on politicians and their idiot constituents. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 14:17, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

==92FS Late Version==
I noticed that while we have separate images of most major weapons in each of their development stages, yet we don't have any images of post '03 models (the ones with the miscellaneous polymer parts and [http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/images/D11/39/39954.jpg a tapered forward frame]). I browsed through all of the movies on the 92FS list that had a listed date after 2003, and the the only one that I could tell was definitely using one of the newer makes was ''[[Taken]]'' (you can see Neeson using one with the distinctive slanted frame in the second screenshot for the "factory black" 92F listing). To the various armorers on this site; are these just not that common in movie armorer stocks?--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 06:52, 4 February 2011 (UTC)
::It's just not economically feasible to run out and buy every variant that comes down the pike and put into the armory. Especially since California is going out of it's way to make getting newer models of any type of firearm more difficult or more expensive (completely due to regulations and NOT the free marketplace), armories maintain many older firearms because there is no real upside in not only buying new guns and blank adapting them, but also the cost has to be filtered down to the customer, and very rarely does it make a difference to the story. Also, even if you're an FFL and have other permits and paperwork, many business are just not doing ANY business with the state, another facet which makes it more difficult [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 07:01, 4 February 2011 (UTC)

:::Coincidentally, the Beretta 92FS used by [[John Leguizamo]]'s character in ''[[Waco]]'' appears to be a post-2003 model. When David Koresh ([[Taylor Kitsch]]) examines the gun, it's possible to see that it has the hex screws of the current production models. This means that it is anachronistic for the time period in which the events depicted in the series took place (1993). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] ([[User talk:MT2008|talk]]) 13:52, 10 November 2018 (EST)

==INOX?==

Technically speaking, should it be "INOX" or "Inox"? And how do you pronounce it: ''ee''-nox, ''ih''-nox, in-ox or spelled out? Thanks [[User:MrOshimida27|MrOshimida27]] 23:37, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

:The term "Inox" is short for "inoxidizable", which is a fancy way of saying the weapon has a stainless finish. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 14:24, 11 July 2011 (CDT)

==Just an amateur question==
I have a blank Beretta 92F pistol. Is there any way to tell that it is a blank gun? (I do not wish to rob a bank or anything like that, I just want to know how many changes did they make compared to the original model... :D ) [[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] 20:10, 3 March 2011 (UTC)
[[Image:BlowF92.jpg|thumb|none|700px|My "precious" replica.]]

:It may just be the angle of the first photo, but it looks like they either gave it a skeleton hammer or set it further inward. It also looks like they removed some of the curvature from the rear of the slide. The magazine foot is thicker in the front, the lanyard loop is thicker and the extractor is longer.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 20:15, 16 March 2011 (CDT)

== Early Beretta 92? ==

Can someone tell me what exactly this pistol is? (pic from [http://www.berettaworld.com Beretta World])
[[File:92Maxi.jpg|thumb|none|400px|]]
The site has it as the picture for the Beretta 92, but it has a couple of differences. Firstly, it has different grips that do not feature the Beretta logo, but I understand that these can be easily changed so could be spurious. Secondly though, the gun in question features a taper/step down in the slide just in front of the ejection port that I have never seen before. My assumption is that this is a very early or prototype Beretta 92 with a slide that was too weak, so the front was widened to the same thickness as the back for future models. I wouldn't normally care, but have found a pistol that matches the above one exactly, so want to know what it is:
[[File:UF 303 116.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]
--[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 05:25, 14 July 2011 (CDT)

What film is the screenshot from? --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 06:45, 14 July 2011 (CDT)
:Its from the TV series [[Ultimate Force]], am just getting ready to do a big update. They use the exact pistol multiple times, but the odd thing is that they use it in both blued and stainless versions (shown below). It had been suggested that it might be an early Taurus PT92, which apparently lacked the finger step (never heard of this though) but after finding the pic of the Beretta 92 shown above with the exact grips and slide, am pretty sure that is what it is. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 16:39, 14 July 2011 (CDT)
:[[File:UF 102 35.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

Ah right. The picture has a higher angled hammer than a standard 92 style hammer. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 17:57, 14 July 2011 (CDT)

== Pronunciation Help ==

How does one actually prononuce Inox? Is it Eyenox? Innox? And does it change depending on the country? [[User:TheHeartbreakKid15|TheHeartbreakKid15]] 17:51, 14 October 2011 (CDT)
:"In ox". It's short for "inoxidizing".--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 20:09, 14 October 2011 (CDT)

==Question about M9==

Is there actually a difference between the M9 and the 92FS, or is it simply a matter of a different designation, because the M9 is a military weapon? [[User:Sentient6|Sentient6]] 19:55, 13 November 2011 (CST)
:From the Beretta forum.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 22:55, 13 November 2011 (CST)
* The M9 usually has a straight dustcover and non-radiused backstrap (Contract Pistols will always be straight/straight)
* The 92FS (recent model) has a radiused backstrap and angled dustcover (The older 92FS pistols did not have the slanted dustcover.)
* M9 markings (including proof markings and cage # markings)
* M9 lacks the warning to read owner's manual
* The rear sight of the 92FS has 2 dots, whereas the M9 has a single half-moon
* M9 (unless special or limited edition) comes in cardboard box, with no plastic hard case

Thanks! [[User:Sentient6|Sentient6]] 08:00, 14 November 2011 (CST)

== m9a1 ==
why does this mention the reversible mag release as if it were new? the 92fs had a reversible mag release, and i'm pretty sure the m9 does too.
--[[User:Gtcsmc|Gtcsmc]] ([[User talk:Gtcsmc|talk]]) 03:04, 28 December 2012 (EST)

The original M9 was based on the 92F, the FS was a later 92 variant however everything I find online shows the M9 (including Beretta's own site on the M9) mentions it does indeed have it. [[User:Pepper|Pepper]] ([[User talk:Pepper|talk]]) 12:26, 17 December 2014 (EST)

== How many? ==

In how many movies/films was Beretta 92FS shown? [[User:TitaniumAlloy|TitaniumAlloy]] ([[User talk:TitaniumAlloy|talk]]) 12:12, 7 July 2013 (EDT)

:That number could easily be in the thousands due to how ubiquitous the 92FS is. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 02:41, 24 November 2013 (EST)

== Slide safety ==

Does anyone know why the safety was moved from the frame to the slide? I've heard complaints about the slide safety, how it gets in the way while working the slide, and seeing how keeping it on the frame would simplify transitioning from the M1911, why the change? Was it Beretta's idea or the US military's? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 15:00, 16 February 2015 (EST)
: Despite my liking for some semiautos like the older Rugers and the 3rd Gen S&Ws I find the slide safeties on those to a be a bit of a potential drawback. Firing my bro-in-law's Px4 was wonderful and it is a great gun except that safety is a bit awkward to deal with, especially when working the slide. So I have to say I can see their point, and even agree to an extent. As for why, well, I have a feeling it might have been more a manufacturing expedient; it may have been a bit simpler to produce guns with slide safeties - A lot of pistols around that time and later (and indeed, many semiautos period) seem to have them, so that may be it. It also may be because those safeties act as decockers as well, necessitating making them at the slide nearer to the hammer to facilitate their purpose and again, be easier to make. In any event I'm sure it was all Beretta, and not something asked for by the DoD - It was done back on the 92S, which I think predates those pistol trials - Plus there isn't a slide safety on the P226 (or any SIGs, for that matter), which came to within a hair of winning itself, so again, doubt it was in their criteria (nor disallowed, obviously). Just some observations, they might be a bit silly to suggest it but there they are. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 16:55, 16 February 2015 (EST)
::The change was at the request of Italian police I believe, who wanted a combined safety/decocker (with the original the options were cocked and locked which some police forces do not like, an empty chamber which is far from ideal if the pistol needs to be used, or having to manually decock by riding the hammer down with the safety off which is a very bad idea for a general issue police pistol). I don't know if the change of position was also part of this request or it was just what they needed to do to get it to work (I imagine the former as Taurus PT92s can have a frame safety/decocker so it can physically work). Although I really do not like frame safeties as I am paranoid about engaging them when racking the slide (particularly in gloves), there are some advantages to the slide safety. With the slide safety the way it works is that it rotates the firing pin out of line with the hammer meaning that there is absolutely no way that the gun could fire and is a very simple and reliable system. Also, the way that the frame safety on the original 92 worked meant that with the safety engaged the slide was locked closed, meaning that in order to load, clear or check the gun you had to take the safety off which could have been a problem for police. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 19:56, 16 February 2015 (EST)

== 92 (M9A1) Compact With Rail ==

Basically it's a short version of M9A1 and it's featured in upcoming Killing Floor 2, but this version is not present in the article. It's not Beretta 92FS Compact. Should I add it?

The model on the manufacturer page: http://www.beretta.com/en-us/92-compact-with-rail/
92 Compact in-game: [[Image:KillingFloor2-M9A1-1.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Note the short barrel of and the tactical rail]]

P.S. Even though it got the rail, the trigger guard is neither from M9A1 or 92 Compact. Could Beretta enthusiasts help me to determine the exact model of this weapon in-game?
:Beretta 92G Elite 1A? And please sign your posts. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 14:04, 9 April 2015 (EDT)
::Thanks for the tip, I am a new guy. No, it definitely not a Beretta 92G Elite 1A. 92G Elite 1A got custom hammer, Beretta from KF2 and 92 Compact do not. Grip pattern is also different on both guns. 92G Elite 1A got straight front sight, Beretta from KF2 and 92 Compact got curved front sight. Magazine floor plate shape is different on Beretta from KF2 and 92G Elite 1A.--[[User:Blondie|Blondie]] ([[User talk:Blondie|talk]]) 14:16, 9 April 2015 (EDT)

== Question ==

How can tell the difference of pronunciation between 92 and 90Two in English? In Italian make sense but in English? --[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 05:42, 29 January 2017 (EST)
:My best guess is that you either emphasize the space between "90" and "two" ("Ninety-two" versus "Ninety two", respectively), or you just spell it out if someone gets confused ("nine two", or "ninety two/ninety T-W-O", respectively). Yeah, it seems like a really confusing naming choice. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 20:11, 28 March 2017 (EDT)
::I suppose you could call the second "nine-oh-two?" [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 01:00, 14 September 2017 (EDT)

== Rearming of the United States Armed Forces ==

At the moment the USA are phasing out the Beretta-pistol and replace it with the Sig Sauer P320. My question is, what for a impact will have this on the articles in the IMFDB? I suppose we have to add in many articles that the Beretta was the sidearm of US-soldiers only in a specific timespan, right? Some movies are very concrete about the time in which the production is set while in other it's unclear! --[[User:Exodianecross|Exodianecross]] ([[User talk:Exodianecross|talk]]) 11:51, 13 September 2017 (EDT)
:Not really, in any case when it's "standing in for the military M9" it's still doing that. Unclear timeframe it's still supposed to be an M9, and having an M9 won't necessarily be incorrect until the M17 and M18 have been fully adopted (while that's almost certain to happen, stupider things have happened before, and it would look a little silly if we change all the entries and then the M17 / M18 procurement somehow gets cancelled). [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 15:25, 13 September 2017 (EDT)
::Are there any particular pages that you are worried about where it causes confusion? The entry would have to be worded in a very specific way for anything to need to be changed. As Tim said, if it says it is "standing in for the military M9" it is still doing that, and if it doesn't say that and just says "US soldiers carry Beretta 92FS pistols" then there is no need to change anything IMHO. The only entries that would need to be changed is if it said something like "US soldiers carry Beretta 92FSs standing in for the M9, which is the current standard issue sidearm", but from a quick look I could not find any pages that worded it like this so it doesn't appear that this would be a huge problem. Regardless, even if we go with the assumption that the M17/M18 pistol will be adopted with no further issues there is no need to say anything about it until it actually starts being mass issued, and even then it will still probably be a decade until all M9s are removed from service. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 17:12, 13 September 2017 (EDT)
:::Depends. How is the use of the M1911A1 addressed?--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 21:00, 14 September 2017 (EDT)
:::::The difference is that the M1911A1 has not been the standard issue sidearm of the US armed forces when any of our articles were written, so there is nothing that would imply that the M1911A1 was the current sidearm. Any article would already say stuff like "standard issue sidearm during the period in which the film is set" so there is no ambiguity with that. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 12:38, 18 September 2017 (EDT)
::::It was just a thought, but maybe I was wrong. I had an eye on the articles about the rearming of the armed forces, and just for example, in the "Painkiller Jane"-article we have this: "During her escape from her military escort, Jane takes a full-size Jericho 941 R from one of her guards and subsequently uses it for most of the film. Apparently, the Jericho is supposed to be the standard sidearm of the U.S. military personnel in the movie, even though in real life the U.S. service sidearm is the Beretta 92FS/M9." Therefore I thought that changes in articles like this will be, or become, necessary, to point out that the Beretta was only the sidearm in a specific timeperiod. --[[User:Exodianecross|Exodianecross]] ([[User talk:Exodianecross|talk]]) 12:12, 18 September 2017 (EDT)
:::::In the case of that article, it would be worth changing it to something like "in real life the U.S. service sidearm was the Beretta 92FS/M9 at the time the film was made" or something like that. I wouldn't suggest we need to do that yet though as the Beretta M9 is still the standard sidearm and still will be for some time, and it isn't worth changing pages to say that the SIG P320 has been selected for adoption to replace the M9 as then these pages will be out of date and need changing anyway in the future. I imagine that the majority of pages that would become incorrect are like this one where a pistol other than a Beretta is being used and the author is pointing out what it should be, which complicates the issue of finding pages that would need updating as they probably do not even actually feature Beretta 92s. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 12:38, 18 September 2017 (EDT)

In that theme, well I have seen few pages, which are setting in a future setting, (Post-2017) which have a different pistol than the [[SIG-Sauer P320]]. However some user says that is not a functional way. But I have seen this in the MGS2 page about the [[AN-94]].

''In-universe, the AN-94 had been adopted as the "official rifle of the Russian Army" by the time when the Plant Chapter occurs in 2009. In reality, the AK-74M would still remain as standard Russian Army assault rifle in 2009. ''

So when editing this pages, (with the green light of course) that would be my idea. So to the user ultimate94ninja, I just would say that was my intention in the BO2 page, because there's a precedent example.--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 13:41, 10 November 2018 (EST)

== Samurai Edge Correction ==

I know this is extremely pedantic, but I feel like I should point out that all models of the Samurai Edge are canonically Beretta 92F models, not 92FS, they've been consistently (Most of the time when they don't reuse a 92FS model) shown without the little gobbledygook in the back of the slide that prevents a Hitchcock Special when the back of the slide shears off, with Kendo adding the reversible magazine release from the 92FS because of the requirements of the STARS pistol trials --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 21:49, 30 October 2023 (UTC)

Hunt: Showdown

2023-02-22T03:57:20Z

Yocapo32: "Masuer" changed to "Mauser"

{{WIP}}
{{Infobox Video Game|{{PAGENAME}}
|name = ''Hunt: Showdown''
|picture = Huntshowdown.jpg
|caption =
|series=
|date= 2018
|developer=Crytek
|platforms=PC Xbox One PlayStation 4
|publisher= Crytek
|genre=First-person shooter, Survival horror
}}
'''''Hunt: Showdown''''' is a multiplayer survival horror video game developed and published by Crytek. The game was originally created by Crytek USA, who wished to create a spiritual successor to ''Darksiders''—a video game series developed by their predecessor, Vigil Games—under the title ''Hunt: Horrors of the Gilded Age''. After the initial announcement in June 2014, Crytek USA was shut down due to financial issues, and the development was brought to the Crytek headquarters. The game, under the new title ''Hunt: Showdown'', was re-announced in May 2017. ''Hunt: Showdown'' was launched on Steam in early access on February 22, 2018, and was officially released on August 27, 2019.

The game is set in a supernatural late 19th century, where bounty hunters enter the Louisiana swampland to hunt down dangerous monsters and collect their bounty. The game is PvPvE, with players fighting AI monsters to claim bounties and also fighting each other to take over others' bounties.

{{VG Title}}
__TOC__ 

=Overview=
Set in the late 19th century, ''Hunt: Showdown'' takes place in an area of rural Louisiana, where a mysterious illness has turned much of the local population into mindless monstrosities. Most rise as zombie-like "Grunts", but others are twisted into more inhuman creatures by unknown forces. To make matters worse, demonic creatures from other realms are leaking into the real world. To solve this issue, players control hunters contracted by the mysterious American Hunters Association who enter monster-infested area, track down, and then kill a powerful "boss" creature. However, other players are also present in the game map, either solo or in groups of up to three people. Player-controlled hunters may kill other hunters and compete for the chance to be the first to track and kill the boss.

Once a boss is killed, they must be "banished", a process that takes a few minutes. During this time, all players are informed of the boss's location. The hunter or hunters that killed the boss must grab a bounty token and then find an exit. Other players may kill them and take the bounty for themselves.

Firearms are divided into different categories based on their size and further by the type of ammunition they use. There are five ammo types:

*Compact, which represents most pistol-sized cartridges.
*Medium, representing larger rifle-type rounds.
*Large, which comprise full-sized rifle rounds.
*Shells, which are shotgun shells.
*Special, a term used for ammunition that may be seen as rare or exotic for the setting, like the 7.63x25mm Mauser rounds used by the Mauser C96 or the Nitro Express ammunition used by the double rifle.

The player can take two primary weapons into a match. Weapons fit into one of three size slots- Small, Medium, or Large. Every weapon has at least one variant, which usually add some sort of attachment. These include bayonets, scopes, or suppressors. Other variants may decrease the size of a weapon, allowing the player to take what would normally be considered a "large" weapon into a "medium" slot. Weapons can also use alternate ammunition types, which include explosive ammo, incendiary ammo, shotgun slugs, and high-velocity rounds. Players may equip their hunter with a variety of different weapons, tools, and consumables that best suit their play style. However, if the player's hunter dies during a match, they will lose any equipment bought into the match and that hunter will be permanently removed from the player's roster.

=Handguns=

==Colt Open Top==
The [[Colt_1871-72_Open_Top|Colt Open Top]] revolver appears as the "Caldwell Conversion Pistol", with an octagonal barrel reminiscent of the earlier [[Colt 1851 Navy]]. It unlocks at Rank 22, offering slightly more accuracy and power than the other sidearms on offer, while still using very common "Compact" ammunition. In the "Book of Weapons", an in-game lore book and progress tracker, it is stated to be chambered in .44 caliber (most likely .44 Henry) and was invented by Henry Samuel Caldwell, the ''Hunt: Showdown'' universe's apparent stand-in for Samuel Colt. It's also implied to have been used during the Civil War, a strange inclusion but probably referring to it being a conversion of earlier Colt black powder revolvers.

There are three variants of the gun in-game, including the standard model and the "Chain Pistol" which uses a series of 17 chambers like the Treeby Chain Gun instead of a normal cylinder. On one hand, you have to reload all 17 from empty if you run out of ammo. On the other hand, you now have 17 rounds of Compact ammo to dump into targets. The "Chain Pistol Pair" allows for dual-wielded revolvers, allowing players to effectively carry around a suppressive device. It's difficult to hit things, but with 34 rounds, you can certainly scare, suppress and eventually shoot a lot of enemies.
[[Image:Colt 1871-72 Open Top.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Colt 1872 Open Top - .44 RF]]
[[File:HuntCaldwell.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Caldwell Conversion" as seen in the store. Note the Colt 1851-influenced barrel.]]
[[File:HuntCaldwell1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter wanders down a road with his "Caldwell Conversion".]]
[[File:HuntCaldwellReady.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Pointing the revolver down the road, wary of any potential threats.]]
[[File:HuntCaldwellAim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Colt's iron sights- as one would expect for such a revolver, they're rather small and hard to read.]]
[[File:HuntCaldwellReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the revolver. The ejector rod is never touched, with the casings simply falling out on their own; this is incorrect, as brass cases expand in their chambers upon firing, which necessitates the use of additional force to remove them (hence the ejector rod being there in the first place). Also note that the hammer is cocked, which would realistically render the cylinder unable to rotate- in reality, the hammer must instead be placed into the half-cock position to allow it to spin freely.]]
[[File:HuntCaldwellChain.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Chain Pistol" as seen in the store. Reloading that ponderous chain is much the same as the standard revolver- the hunter manually advances the chain and "ejects" (gestures around the ejector) spent casings and inserts new ones.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownChainPistol.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter holds the "Chain Pistol" on an Armored enemy before showing it how 17 rounds of .44 RF feel.]]

==Colt Walker Cartridge Conversion==
The other variant of the "Caldwell Conversion Pistol" is quite a bit more interesting. The "Caldwell Conversion Uppercut" is a version with an elongated cylinder that allows the pistol to use "Long" rifle cartridges, greatly increasing its damage at a cost of increased recoil. This stretched out revolver bears a resemblance to the [[Colt Walker]].
[[Image:ColtWalkerConversion.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Colt Walker Conversion - .45 Colt]]
[[File:HuntWalkerStore.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A chunky "Uppercut" in the store.]]
[[File:HuntWalkerHold.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter wields his "Uppercut" while sneaking up on some feasting "Grunts".]]
[[File:HuntWalkerAim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The revolver's iron sights. Much like the base variant's sights, these are best used in combination with an electron microscope.]]
[[File:HuntWalkerReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the Walker. As with the Open Top, the ejector rod is never used. The hunter notably gives the "Uppercut" a rather vigorous shake when ejecting cartridges, however.]]

==Colt Single Action Army==
An update added the [[Colt Single Action Army]] to ''H:S'''s arsenal, going by the name "Caldwell Pax" ("Pax" being Latin for "Peace", an allusion to the SAA's nickname of "Peacemaker") and unlocked at Rank 18. In the "Book of Weapons", the Pax is mentioned as sometimes being referred to as the "Single Action Army". A decent all-rounder, the SAA holds 6 rounds of "Medium" ammunition, and behaves rather like a somewhat tamer version of the cartridge-converted [[Colt Walker]] "Uppercut". As with the rest of the game's gate-loading revolvers, the player character incorrectly ignores the ejector rod when reloading.

The SAA has one variant to its name, the "Claw"; this has broken grip panels and a blade attached to the base of the grip, with its main advantage being stronger pistol-whipping.
[[File:ColtSingleActionArmy.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Colt Single Action Army w/5.5" barrel - .45 Long Colt]]
[[File:HuntPaxMenu.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The model of the "Caldwell Pax". In a nice little bit of detail, the revolvers of ''Hunt: Showdown'' have cartridges fully modeled in their chambers. You can barely make out the brass casings of the .45 LC cartridges at the rear of the cylinder.]]
[[File:HuntSAANew.jpg|thumb|none|600px|While approaching Pitching Crematorium, a hunter carefully watches for any angry locals with her SAA.]]
[[File:HuntSAAReady.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The hunter readies the SAA, informing the nearby Grunt that they've just yee'd their last haw. ]]
[[File:HuntSAASights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Aiming the "Pax" reveals that it has a fairly wide sight notch.]]
[[File:HuntSAAReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading reveals the modeled ejector rod- not that it's actually used, as is demonstrated here after dealing with the local Grunt.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownPaxClaw.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter stumbles upon the "Claw" version of the Pax at a local armory. Note the broken grip and knife haphazardly shoved into the lower grip frame.]]

==Colt Model 1892==
The [[Colt New Army & Navy|Colt Model 1892]] was added in Update 1.8.1 as the "Caldwell 92 New Army", making it the second double-action revolver available in the game. Compared to the Nagant M1895 Officer, the M1892 deals slightly more damage and has a slightly greater effective range, but has a noticeably lower muzzle velocity and a slightly lower rate of fire. The swing-out cylinder also gives it a much faster reload than most other available revolvers. It is unlocked at Rank 12 and currently has no variants.
[[Image:Hc-9289.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Colt New Army & Navy/Colt M1892 - .38 Long Colt]]
[[File:HuntM1892Store.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The M1892 in the store. One can only hope that your hunter doesn't run into the same problems with .38 caliber as US soldiers in the Philippines did, as the [[M1911]] is still about 17 years away.]]
[[File:HuntM1892-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter gets on the double-action life.]]
[[File:HuntM1892Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Aiming- it's a 19th century revolver, so we're pretty sure you know what kind of sights to expect by now.]]
[[File:HuntM1892Partial.jpg|thumb|none|600px|When performing a tactical reload, the cylinder is swung out and any spent cartridges are manually removed and replaced, similar to what happens on the Schofield revolver.]]
[[File:HuntM1892Empty.jpg|thumb|none|600px|If you're completely out though, the ejector rod is used. No speedloaders in the bayou, however (which is period-accurate, as speedloaders were not widespread until the 1970s).]]

==Nagant M1895==
The Russian [[Nagant M1895]] appears in-game under its real name, a rarity given the game's usage of pseudonyms for popular firearms. It's unlocked at Rank 1, loaded with "Compact" rounds. There are two basic models of the Nagant in-game, the normal SAO version and the DAO "Officer's Model" and four variants for each.

For the normal Nagant, there is the stock version alongside the "Precision" model. This version is a Nagant fitted with a shoulder stock similar to the [[Colt Army Special]] revolver. There is also the "Deadeye" which fits the Precision version with a small mid-range scope. And fittingly, there is a "Suppressed" model, fitted with a homemade suppressor on the end of the barrel.

The Officer's Model versions follow a slightly different path. Beyond the normal version, there is the "Brawler" which fits a large knuckle duster like appendage to the front of the trigger guard and grip for increased melee damage. Then there's the "M1895 Carbine" which, as the name suggests, converts the revolver into a carbine with a longer barrel and the shoulder stock of the "Precision" revolver. And if that wasn't enough, there's also an "Officer's Carbine Deadeye" as a confusing albeit potent short to mid-range sniper rifle.
[[Image:Nagant-1895.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Nagant M1895 Revolver - 7.62x38R Nagant]]
[[File:Colt-stocked.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Colt New Service with stock - .45 ACP]]
[[File:HuntNagantStore.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Your basic Nagant M1895 revolver. The trusty sidearm of beginner hunters everywhere. The markings bear "Em. & L. Nagant", referencing the Nagant M1895's creators, brothers Émile and Léon Nagant.]]
[[File:HuntNagantSilencer.jpg|thumb|none|600px|As any good IMFDB browser would know, the Nagant 1895 is one of the few revolvers ever made that can accept a suppressor. The suppressor here, though, looks more like a car muffler than a firearm silencer. Note the homemade front sight to compensate for the increased bulk.]]
[[File:HuntNagantPrecision.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Nagant Precision" fitted with the New Service stock.]]
[[File:HuntNagantOfficer.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Officer" variant is much the same cosmetically, save for the off-white grip.]]
[[File:HuntBrawler.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Officer's "Brawler" variant, however, is a different story. It's like an [[Apache Pepperbox Revolver]], except somewhat more practical.]]
[[Image:Nagant 1895 carbine.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Russian Nagant 1895 carbine version (12 inch barrel) - 7.62x38R Nagant. It is curious that the in-game version will continue to use a Colt-pattern holster instead of a wooden stock.]]
[[File:HuntOFficerCarbine.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Pistol-Caliber Carbine, 1890s style.]]
[[File:HuntNagantHold.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter holds his new-fangled Russian Nagant M1895 revolver.]]
[[File:HuntNagantAim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Iron sights of the "Nagant M1895", mildly better than the Colt Open Top, but not by much.]]
[[File:HuntNagantReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Nagant M1895". Like the other revolvers, the ejector rod is never used. The spent casing seems to correctly be a 7.62x38R casing though. Interestingly, the entry for the Nagant in the Book of Weapons describes the 7.62x38R rounds as "strange bullets, tucked up inside like they were afraid to come out".]]

==Sharps Pepperbox==
The [[Sharps Pepperbox]] appears as the "Quad Derringer", unlocked at Rank 66 and equipped as a tool rather than a legitimate firearm. Using its own "Derringer" ammo type, this pistol has a small but simple niche. It's a gun for fast firing, low damage output. It holds four rounds in four chambers and fires single-action. Twelve additional rounds are carried and ammunition for it cannot restocked during a match. Another added perk is that the Quad Derringer is one of the quietest non-suppressed firearms, so shots from it will not give away your position to hunters who may be some ways off.
[[Image:Sharps_Model_1.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Sharps Model 1C - .22 Short]]
[[File:HuntPepperboxStore.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The original concealed carry.]]
[[File:HuntDerringer.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter enjoys a scenic bayou view with his Quad Derringer.]]
[[File:HuntDerringerReady.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Readying the "Quad Derringer", wary of angry water demons that will eat his shoes.]]
[[File:HuntDerringerSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Iron sights of the "Quad Derringer", incredibly tiny but given its intended role, make sense.]]
[[File:HuntDerringerReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Quad Derringer", the barrels are moved forward and topped off two at a time.]]

==Smith & Wesson Schofield Model 3==
The [[Smith & Wesson Schofield Model 3]] was added in Update 1.6.2 as a Rank 1 unlock under the name "Scottfield Model 3", now joining the Nagant M1895 as the player's first handgun upon arriving in ''Hunt''. While it lacks the many variants that the Nagant has, and only has two special ammo types to its name, the Scottfield is a powerful piece in the right hands. While it has slightly lower damage than the earlier "Pax" pistol, accurately showing the slightly lower performance of .45 Schofield in comparison to .45 LC, it makes up for with very tight sights, good accuracy and a relatively fast rate of fire especially when combined with fanning. Not to mention the advantage of ejecting all of its rounds in one go.

Update 1.7.2 added three variants of the Schofield: the "Scottfield Model 3 Spitfire", which has a shortened barrel and trigger guard spur often seen on the [[Smith & Wesson No. 3 Russian Model]]. This variant features a higher rate of fire, at the cost of worse accuracy. The "Scottfield Model 3 Precision", which fits the Schofield with the ''very'' rare stock featured on a batch of Model 3s made for the Australian Colonial Police. And finally, the "Scottfield Model 3 Swift", which is the same as the base variant, but utilizes a speedloader for even faster reloads. The trade-off is that a tactical reload can no longer be performed, and that any unfired rounds are discarded and six rounds will always be loaded.

[[Image:Schofield.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Smith & Wesson Schofield Model 3 with nickel finish - .45 Schofield]]
[[File:WellsFargoSchofield.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Smith & Wesson "Wells Fargo" Schofield with barrel cut down to five inches - .45 Schofield]]
[[File:12221242 1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|One of approximately 250 New Model No. 3 revolvers made for the Australian Colonial Police - .44 Russian]]
[[File:HuntSchofield.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Schofield in the store.]]
[[File:HuntSpitfire.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Spitfire" variant. The barrel length on this variant appears to be between the lengths of the 5" barreled "Wells Fargo" variant and 3.5" barrel version.]]
[[File:HuntSchofieldPrecision.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Precision" variant with its very rare shoulder stock. A hunter with one of these should keep it around as a retirement fund.]]
[[File:HuntSchofield1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter approaches his target with the ''other'' iconic revolver of the American West at the ready.]]
[[File:HuntSchofield Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The hunter aims the Schofield, hopefully not to [[Assassination_of_Jesse_James_by_the_Coward_Robert_Ford,_The#Smith_.26_Wesson_New_Model_No.3|shoot Jesse James in the back]].]]
[[File:HuntSchofieldReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|When performing a tactical reload, the hunter will put the pistol into half-cock and gently open the revolver without ejecting all the cartridges. They will then proceed to remove any fired rounds one-by-one and replace them manually.]]
[[File:HuntSchofieldEject.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Upon emptying the revolver, the hunter will fully break open the Schofield, sending up a satisfying rain of brass. No moon clips or speedloaders for you, however, so all six rounds are loaded manually... unless of course, you invest in the "Swift" variant.]]

==Mauser C96==
The German [[Mauser C96]] appears as the "Dolch 96", unlocked at Rank 68 as the improved semi-auto pistol option over the latter mentioned "Bornheim" that boasts more damage and slight improvements on accuracy at a cost of being much more expensive and using "Special" ammo instead of the more plentiful "Compact". There's only one variant of the gun, fittingly the "Dolch 96 Precision" that fits the gun with the shoulder stock.
[[Image:M712.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Mauser C96 - 7.63x25mm Mauser]]
[[File:HuntC96Store.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The C96 in the store. The markings are much the same as the ones found on a real C96, except with Mauser being swapped out for fictional manufacturer "Dolch".]]
[[File:HuntC96Percision.jpg|thumb|none|600px|With the "Precision" variant, one may be able to make better use of the C96's rather optimistic 1,000 meter sight calibration setting.]]
[[File:HuntC96 1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter takes her brand new Dolch out for a test run.]]
[[File:HuntC96Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Iron sights of the "Dolch 96", big and roomy, good for close or in this case, medium range shooting.]]
[[File:HuntC96Reload1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After expending 10 (probably very expensive) 7.62x25mm rounds, the hunter uses a stripper clip to re-up.]]
[[File:HuntC96Reload2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Dolch 96" with individual rounds. As with ''[[Battlefield 1]]'', the individual round reload is a gameplay artistic liberty; the C96 is nearly impossible to reload mid-magazine in reality, since it uses the magazine guide as its bolt hold open, meaning that its bolt cannot lock back mid-magazine for topping off.]]

==Bergmann 1896==
The [[Bergmann 1896]] was added to the game in Update 5.0 as the "Bornheim No. 3", unlocked at Rank 30 as a new and more interesting sidearm option. In comparison to the gate loader revolvers, it offers a clip loaded, fast firing albeit weak secondary option. It comes with two specific variants. The "Extended" fits the gun with a home-made extended magazine, bumping the capacity from 5 shots to 8. And if that wasn't enough, there's also a "Match" version with an elongated barrel and wire stock.

Of note is that the weapon is one of the few weapons capable of being affected by the "Bulletgrubber" trait, which recovers rounds ejected (when opening the action) in partial reloads.
[[File:Bergmann.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Bergmann 1896 - 6.5x22mm Bergmann]]
[[File:HuntBergmannStore.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Bergmann 1896. Usually a hunter's first foray into the realm of self-loading pistols.]]
[[File:HuntBergmannExtended.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Extended" variant with its DIY extended mag. The trade-off here is that the weapon can no longer load with a clip and must be loaded round-by-round.]]
[[File:HuntBergmannMatch.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Match" variant, ready for some long-ish range shooting.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownBergmann.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter strikes it lucky by finding a "Bornheim" pistol. The reason he's holding the gun so high is due to Hunt's combat system, with guns having the ability to bash opponents unless you hold down the RMB to actually aim.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownBergmanAim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|And actually aiming brings the Bergmann closer to the shooter's face, hitting Shift will allow you to use the iron sights.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownBergmannReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After dealing with an "Immolator" with a combination of 6.5 Bergmann and girlish screaming, the hunter reloads the Bergmann by opening the magazine hatch...]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownBergmannReload2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Before inserting a fresh 5 round clip, closing the hatch and charging the gun.]]

==Webley & Scott No. 1 Mk. III*==
The "Flare Pistol" in-game appears as a [[Webley & Scott No. 1 Mk. III*]], albeit with a somewhat strange hexagonal chamber profile rather than the real flare gun's round one. Like the earlier Sharps, this is classified as a "tool" than a proper firearm. It's primarily used for illuminating dark areas, a rarity for any video game flare gun and fitting ''H:S''''s very dark maps. It can also be used to set flammable objects on fire, which allows for flammable creativity.
[[File:Webley Signal Pistol.JPG|thumb|none|350px|Webley & Scott No. 1 Mk. III* - 1" flare]]
[[File:HuntSignalGun.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Flare Gun as seen in the store; note the hexagonal chamber profile and a nick in the muzzle flare as a ersatz iron sight. Also the "Wesley and Schrott" stamp on the frame.]]

==LeMat 1861==
Added in Update 6.0, the "LeMat Mark 2 Revolver" is a fictitious cartridge conversion of the [[LeMat 1861]]; a rather strange choice, given that actual cartridge-firing versions of the LeMat did actually exist. It is correctly depicted with a 9-round capacity plus an additional shotgun shell, with the lever on the hammer being appropriately moved up or down to fire pistol-caliber rounds (of the "Compact" variety; this presumably makes it a .36-caliber version, though with how vague the in-game calibers are one can't really be sure) or shotgun shells. Unlocked at Rank 46, the LeMat is a wonky gun at first, with middling accuracy for both the shotgun and pistol barrels. But in close quarters, the LeMat can be a powerful tool. And the game doesn't stop you from dual wielding them either.

The cylinder is reloaded through a side-mounted gate (with there not even being an ejector rod for the player character to ignore this time around, though the cap-and-ball version's loading/ramming lever is still alive and well), and the shotgun is reloaded through a completely fictitious method wherein the player character grabs the barrel and breaks the weapon open; exactly why this method can't be used to reload the cylinder as well isn't clear, apart from the usual "balance reasons".

[[File:Lemat.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Reproduction LeMat 1861 (Cavalry version) - .36 or .44 caliber.]]
[[File:HuntShowdownLeMat 2.jpeg|thumb|none|600px|The model of the LeMat.]]
[[File:HuntShowdownLeMat 3.jpeg|thumb|none|600px|A view of both barrels, as well as the loading lever.]]
[[File:HuntLeMat1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter with a "new-to-me" LeMat.]]
[[File:HuntLematSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Aiming down the sights, done through the use of the hammer itself and the front post.]]
[[File:HuntLeMatReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the LeMat after firing some pistol rounds, which involves scratching the gun in the general region of the loading lever and letting spent brass fall out.]]
[[File:HuntLeMatShotgun.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Later, the hunter uses his LeMat, now in shotgun mode, to interrogate a local wagon. Note the hammer positioned to strike the shotgun's chamber.]]
[[File:HuntLeMatShotgunReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the LeMat's shotgun, breaking it open like a break-action shotgun and shoving a shell into the breech in the center of the gun.]]

=Rifles=

==Winchester Model 1873==
The [[Winchester Model 1873]] appears as the "Winfield M1873", albeit in two forms. A version with a 7-shot magazine tube appears as the "Winfield M1873C", which is unlocked at Rank 1, while the "M1873" model with the full length 15 round magazine unlocks at Rank 20. Potent mid-range bruisers of rifles, these two boast the largest pool of alternate versions in the entire game. According to the "Book of Weapons", the "Winfield M1873" was known to Confederate soldiers during the American Civil War as "that damned Yankee rifle that they load on Sunday and fire all week"- an adage which was actually used to describe the earlier [[Henry 1860]], not to mention the Model 1873 was first produced eight years after the conclusion of the Civil War.

For the "M1873C", there is the "M1873 Silencer" which fits the rifle with a large rectangular home-made suppressor. Then there's the "M1873C Marksman", fitting the rifle with a scope. If that rifle isn't small enough, then there's the "M1873 Vandal" which cuts the rifle down to a Mare's Leg length, allowing it to fit in a "Medium" weapon slot instead of a large one. And if that wasn't enough, there's two more variants of the "Vandal", the "Vandal Deadeye" fitted with a short scope and the "Vandal Striker" fitted with a short bayonet to increase its melee damage.

The "M1873" is a tad shorter, but not any less creative with its versions. Beyond the normal rifle, there is the "M1873 Aperture" which fits the rifle with a Vernier style peep sight that makes it a little more accurate at mid-range. Then there's the "M1873 Talon" which fits a large knife like assembly to the stock to allow the rifle to double as an axe. The "M1873 Swift" takes a neat twist by modifying the rifle to accept speed loader tubes, shortening the reload time. And finally is the "M1873 Musket Bayonet", taking cues from the rarely-seen Model 1873 Rifle Musket, this long rifle boasts an increased capacity of 17+1, as well as a permanently fixed socket bayonet.
[[File:Winchester1873short.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Winchester Model 1873 - .44-40 WCF]]
[[File:1873shortmag.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Winchester Model 1873 with short tube magazine - .44-40 WCF]]
[[File:WinchesterM1873Musket.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Winchester Model 1873 Musket with socket bayonet - .44-40 WCF]]
[[File:HuntM1873Full.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The basic, full-length Model 1873.]]
[[File:HuntM1873Compact.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The basic short-magazine tube Model 1873. As seen in the hands of many a wide-eyed new hunter to the bayou.]]
[[File:HuntM1873Musket.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A sight you don't see every day- the Winchester Model 1873 Musket with included socket bayonet. The term "Musket" was not to denote that this rifle is a muzzleloader with a single-shot capacity, but rather refers to the rifle's length, which is comparable to the military-issue muzzleloading muskets of the day.]]
[[File:HuntM1873Silenced.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A silenced Model 1873, fitted with a homemade suppressor that's much bulkier than the Maxim Silencer that would later appear in the early 1900s. The rear ladder sight of this variant has also been flipped up to facilitate aiming.]]
[[File:HuntMaresLeg.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A compact Model 1873 "Mare's Leg", for all your compact cowboy needs.]]
[[File:HuntM1873New.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter wanders the woods with his trusty M1873.]]
[[File:HuntM1873Sights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Iron sights of the "Winfield M1873", a skinny front post and a wide rear notch.]]
[[File:HuntM1873Reloading.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Winfield M1873", an animation shared between it and the later Vetterli.]]

==Winchester Model 1876==
Added in Update 1.5, the [[Winchester Model 1876]] appears as the "Winfield M1876 Centennial" (a reference to a marketing name of the real weapon, which was in turn a reference to the 100th anniversary of the signing of the US Declaration of Independence). It unlocks at Rank 58, and serves as a harder-hitting alternative to the 1873 above - it uses Medium ammo (rather than the 1873's Compact), with higher damage, penetration, and muzzle velocity, at the cost of, well, cost (substantially higher than any 1873 variant), along with a lower fire rate, and a 9+1 capacity. It currently has one variant- a long scope equipped "Sniper" variant.
[[File:Centennial.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Winchester Model 1876 (in musket-carbine configuration) - .45-60 WCF]]
[[File:Hunt M1876Right.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Model 1876, covered in fresh mud.]]
[[File:HuntM1876Hold.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Marshall Phoebe Brewer goes for a stroll through the bayou with Model 1876 in hand.]]
[[File:HuntM1876Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Aiming the Model 1876 reveals a sight picture not too different from its less beefy cousin, the Model 1873.]]
[[File:HuntM1876Reload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Loading also reuses the Model 1873's animation, minus the addition of the much larger cartridge, which appears to correctly be a .45-60 round.]]

==Sharps 1874==
The [[Sharps 1874]] appears as the "Sparks LRR" (Long Range Rifle) chambered in .45-70 and unlocked at Rank 26. A large piece for the bayous, the "Sparks LRR" serves as the king of long ranged combat in the game, with a damage range of 250 meters and high damage to boot. Don't get too scared, it's a slow gun to reload and not too good up close, so it's not too potent in close-quarters. It comes with only two versions, those being the "Sparks LRR Sniper" which fits a scope, and the "Sparks LRR Silencer" which is a bit self-explanatory. Prior to the version 1.5.2 (released for testing on May 11th 2021), the rifle was set to half-cock during reloading. While appropriate for an earlier, percussion, Sharps rifle this behavior was inaccurate for later cartridge firing models. This was corrected after the error was mentioned by Jonathan Ferguson (Keeper of Firearms & Artillery at the Royal Armouries museum), whose feedback was cited in the patch notes.

Released with the "Serpents Moon" update, the "Sparks Pistol" was added as another variant, albeit one whose name makes it stand out from the rest of the versions on offer. A standard Sparks rifle sawn down to a pistol length, it sacrifices much of its range and sight options for a close range 1-2 shot blast on any hunters unfortunate to run into you.
[[Image:Sharps_1874_Buffalo.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Sharps 1874 - .45-70]]
[[File:HuntSharpsStore.jpg|thumb|none|601px|The basic Sharps in the store.]]
[[File:HuntSharpsSilencer.jpg|thumb|none|601px|The suppressor-equipped variant also apparently cuts down the barrel quite a bit. The suppressor model here is the same one used on the Winchester Model 1873's suppressed variant, and also features a raised ladder sight at the rear.]]
[[File:HuntSharpsSniper.jpg|thumb|none|601px|A "Sniper" variant, the king of long-ranged bayou combat. The scope used here appears to be based on the Civil War-era William Malcolm telescopic rifle scope. Its model is used on several other rifles with "Sniper" variants.]]
[[Image:HuntSharps1.jpg|thumb|none|601px|A hunter carries around his Sparks rifle before realizing he isn't in Kansas anymore.]]
[[Image:HuntSharps2.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Aiming the "Sparks LRR" towards a faraway foe.]]
[[Image:HuntSharps3.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Iron sights of the "Sparks LRR", fairly small and not adjustable outside of the raised sights of the Silenced version.]]
[[Image:HuntSharps4.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Reloading the "Sparks LRR" by lowering the breech, sliding in a .45-70 cartridge, and closing the breech.]]

==Vetterli M1869/71 Carbine==
The Swiss [[Vetterli Rifle|Vetterli M1869/71 Carbine]] appears as the "Vetterli 71 Karabiner", unlocked at Rank 6. The Vetterli is a punchier upgrade from the starter "M1873C", with more damage and a little more accuracy as a trade off for a slower rate of fire. There's three versions to this rifle, the "Vetterli 71 Deadeye" which adds a scope, and the later "Vetterli 71 Bayonet" which adds a large sword bayonet for melee combat. The third and newest version (added alongside the Schofield Model 3) is a suppressed Vetterli, added after the community campaigned for a new Vetterli type on Reddit.
[[Image:VetterliShortRifle.JPG|thumb|none|450px|Vetterli M1869/71 Carbine - 10.4mm]]
[[File:HuntVetterliStore.jpg|thumb|none|601px|The basic Vetterli in the store.]]
[[File:HuntVetterliBayonet.jpeg|thumb|none|601px|Showing off the titular blade of the "Bayonet" variant, which appears to be based on a style of bayonet used on the Italian Vetterli-Vitali rifle.]]
[[File:HuntVetterliSilencer.jpeg|thumb|none|601px|The suppressed variant gains a rusty, very much homemade-looking suppressor that seems to be held on with household bindings and faith.]]
[[Image:HuntVetterli1.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Having realized that water demons aren't scared by tiny derringers, the hunter switches over to his Vetterli.]]
[[Image:HuntVetterli2.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Aiming the "Vetterli 71 Karabiner" in an attempt to keep the water devils away.]]
[[Image:HuntVetterli3.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Iron sights of the "Vetterli 71 Karabiner", small but serviceable.]]
[[Image:HuntVetterli4.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Reloading the "Vetterli 71 Karabiner", like the Winchester before, although with a properly modeled 10.4mm Swiss round.]]

==Mosin-Nagant M1891==
The [[Mosin Nagant M1891]] appears under its real name, a rarity in this game and unlocked at Rank 72. It appears to be mostly based on the 3rd configuration of the M1891 infantry rifle due to having a front sling swivel, an upper handguard, and an open blade front sight. It also has a rear sight similar to a M1891/30 and a turned down bolt handle. While most games treat the Mosin as average, the rifle is anything but in ''H:S''. Powerful, relatively long ranged, and fast-firing, this gun turns heads real quick when it shows up in a fight.

Being the top-tier rifle, it comes with a large mix of variants. There's the "Mosin Bayonet" which adds the classic socket bayonet, the "Marksman" adds a scope and the most kooky is the last major version, the "Avtomat". Taking cues from the WWI-era [[Huot Automatic Rifle]], this is a 15 round capacity, automatic conversion of a Mosin that is as inaccurate and terrifying up close as you're imagining. Interestingly, the "Avtomat" variant fires a minimum of three rounds when fired. Tapping the fire button on your controller or briefly clicking your mouse will not produce single shots. While devastating in close range, the Avtomat is balanced by being nearly uncontrollable when firing even a single burst and its habit of rapidly chewing through ammo. Beyond that, the player's hunter carries no reserve ammunition for the weapon ''at all''. A single engagement will most likely have the Avtomat's user scrambling for an ammo box (considering that ammo boxes also give out miserly amounts of ammo upon use, they will most likely be scrambling for several ammo boxes).

And before you think this is over, there is also the sawn off Mosins. Yes, this game has an "Obrez", allowing you to put a Mosin in a "Medium" sized slot, but that's not all. There's the "Mace" version that bundles up the end of the stock into a makeshift whackey stick and even more fun, the "Drum" which gives an Obrez around 15 rounds of 7.62x54R to deal with problems.
[[File:Mosin18913rd.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Russian Mosin Nagant M1891 3rd configuration - 7.62x54mmR]]
[[File:HuntMosinBasic.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A basic Mosin. While modern gun enthusiasts view the Mosin-Nagant as a relic of an earlier time, ''Hunt: Showdown'' is set in a time when the Mosin was among the most advanced infantry weapons in the world.]]
[[File:HuntMosinBayonet.jpg|thumb|none|600px|For a few dollars more, you can get a Mosin equipped with a handy socket bayonet. Bayonet charges are a viable tactic, useful for rushing unprepared enemy hunters. Shouting "URA!" while doing so is preferred.]]
[[File:HuntObrez.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A sawed-off "Obrez". ''Hunt: Showdown'' may encourage stealthy tactics, but this weapon is for when the situation... gets a bit loud.]]
[[File:HuntObrezDrum.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Obrez Drum" variant adds (of all things) what appears to be an [[MG42]] drum magazine to the weapon. This magazine is not detachable; rather, rounds are fed into the top of the receiver like normal until you fill the drum with 15 rounds. This makes the drum magazine function similarly to the "trench magazine" used on the [[Gewehr 1898]].]]
[[File:Huot Automatic Rifle.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Huot Automatic Rifle - .303 British]]
[[File:HuntAvtomat.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The final evolution of the Mosin- the "Mosin-Nagant M1891 Avtomat". The design influence from the Huot is clearly evident. Given that the Huot worked primarily because the weapon it is based on, the [[Ross rifle]], is a straight-pull bolt-action, one must assume that the inventor of the Avtomat must have also somehow converted the base Mosin into a straight-pull rifle. The lore entry for the Avtomat in "The Book of Weapons" actually touches on this, mentioning that the Mosin-Nagant is nearly impossible to convert to fully-automatic fire and remarks that the inventor of the weapon "was an adept, if mentally unstable person". The "Book of Weapons" also states the Avtomat is gas-operated. Presumably, gas is trapped when the weapon is fired and then forced backwards, pushing a rod that automatically works the bolt back and forth. Further lore entries imply the weapon is a custom-made item modified by hand, and extremely crude, but effective nonetheless.]]
[[File:HuntMosinNew.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter skulks around a farm with her bayonet-equipped Mosin-Nagant M1891.]]
[[File:HuntMosinSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The iron sights of the Mosin, which are about as small as the real M1891's. Note the down-turned bolt handle. In pre-release versions, scopeless variants of the Mosin had a straight bolt handle.]]
[[File:HuntMosinReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the rifle with a stripper clip full of bottle-nosed rounds; this is accurate, as the more familiar pointed-tip spitzer bullets wouldn't come into widespread use until a few years later. Incidentally, Update 1.5 added spitzer rounds as an unlockable alternate ammo type for the Mosin, which increase muzzle velocity and are better at penetrating surfaces, but add slightly more recoil with every shot.]]

==Double Rifle==
A double rifle, possibly a [[Holland & Holland Double Rifle|Holland & Holland]], appears as the "Nitro Express Rifle" and is unlocked at Rank 88. The final weapon unlocked, the "Nitro Express Rifle" is a heavy hitter in every department. A borderline one-shot on enemy Hunters from close to medium range, and can easily tear up boss monsters if you're careful. However, the iron sights are cramped and hard to use, the gun kicks like a mule and it carries little ammo into battle. Furthermore, ammo can only be restocked at "Special" ammo boxes and crates, which are much harder to come by than regular ammo supplies. But, you can also rock it with explosive ammunition (because there's no such thing as overkill). The double rifle is also one of the loudest weapons in the game and shots from it are discernable from upwards of 1,000 meters away.
[[Image:Royal-double-rifle.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Holland & Holland 'Royal' Double Barrel Rifle - various calibres]]
[[Image:HuntNitro1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter stalks his prey with his "Nitro Express Rifle".]]
[[Image:HuntNitro2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Vernier sights of the Express Rifle, easy to read especially when blasting grunts from 10 feet away.]]
[[Image:HuntNitro3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Nitro Express Rifle" after a job well done, identical to the Colt M1878's animation.]]

==Lebel 1886==
The [[Lebel 1886]] was added to the game in Update 6.0 under its real name, unlocked at Rank 52. The Lebel serves as a line of demarcation between the previous black powder rifles and the smokeless ones, because it flips a lot on its lid. A little clunky with the RoF, but deadly in damage and especially in muzzle velocity. You don't know how much lead you need with black powder until you snipe someone with the Lebel without even thinking about aiming for windage. It holds 10 rounds, representing the Lebel's ability to hold eight rounds in the magazine, one on the elevator, and one more in the chamber.

The Lebel's variants are fairly modest. There's the "Marksman" version that fits it with a scope, alongside the "Talon" version that fits the stock with blades to allow you to use the gun as a sort-of axe, and the "Aperture", which adds a Vernier peep sight.
[[File:Modele1886Lebel.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Lebel Model 1886 - 8x50mmR Lebel]]
[[File:Hunt LebelRight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The right side of the Lebel, splattered with mud not from the trenches of Verdun, but from the bayou of Louisiana.]]
[[File:Hunt LebelLeft.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The left side.]]
[[File:HuntLebel.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter takes his newfangled smokeless powder rifle out for a spin. The markings indicate this rifle is the improved M93 variant.]]
[[File:HuntLebelSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The sights, small and precise like the Mosin's and many other bolt-actions of the era.]]
[[File:HuntLebelReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|"''Sacre bleu!''" the hunter cries when he realizes he's out of ammo. Cartridges are first loaded into the internal magazine. The Lebel's tubular magazine means it cannot use a stripper clip to quickly reload- so we advise that one gets comfortable if they've expended all 10 rounds...]]
[[File:HuntLebelReloadEnd.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Once he's loaded up, the hunter gives the bolt a firm pull to set a cartridge on the elevator before closing the bolt to chamber the rifle.]]

==Berthier Modèle 1892 Artillery Carbine==
Update 1.7 added the [[Berthier Mle 1892 Artillery Carbine]] as a "Long" ammunition weapon. It performs similarly to the Lebel 1886, with a smaller magazine capacity of three rounds, but much faster reload speed. It is unique among the Long ammo rifles in its use of an en bloc clip to reload. It is unlocked at Rank 62. It currently has two variants, a short-scope equipped "Deadeye" variant and a bayonet-equipped "Riposte" variant, and can use incendiary or spitzer ammo.
[[Image:Berthier Artillery Carbine Mle 1892.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Berthier Mle 1892 Artillery Carbine - 8x50mm R]]
[[File:Hunt Berthier.jpg|thumb|none|600px|"''Hi guys, thanks for tuning in to another video on Forgotten Weapons dot com. I'm Ian McCallum and today...''"]]
[[File:HuntBerthier1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Tiring of uncouth American rifles, the hunter grabs a fancy French rifle. The markings indicate this rifle was made by ''Manufacture d'Armes de Saint-Étienne'' (MAS). Note the marking of "Mle 1890", indicating that this rifle is rebuilt from an Mle 1890 Cavalry Carbine into the Mle 1892 pattern. This practice, however, first began in the First World War.]]
[[File:HuntBerthierSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The sights of the Mle 1892 are small, precise, late-19th century, you get the idea by now.]]
[[File:HuntBerthierReloadPartial.jpg|thumb|none|600px|When performing a tactical reload, the en bloc clip is ejected, as illustrated by the clip with one remaining round flying past the hunter's face. Reloading a partially-empty magazine will result in the loss of up to two unfired cartridges when not used with the Bulletgruber trait. Performing a tactical reload also takes longer than an empty reload due to the need to eject the clip.]]
[[File:HuntBerthierEmpty.jpg|thumb|none|600px|In the event you used all three rounds, the hunter simply needs to insert a fresh three-round en bloc clip. In a nice bit of detail, the clip will audibly eject from the bottom of the magazine and even be present as a physical object on the ground after the last round is chambered.]]

==Martini-Henry IC1==
The somewhat obscure IC1 (Interchangeable Carbine Mark 1) variant of the [[Martini-Henry]] (so named due to its ability to swap between artillery and cavalry configurations) was added to ''Hunt'' in the 1.1.3 patch. It serves as an alternative to the [[Sharps]], with the main tradeoff being a faster reload in exchange for a slower muzzle velocity and poorer long-range effectiveness, and is unlocked earlier at Rank 16 instead of the LRR's requirement of Rank 26.

Aside from the standard variant, there is a "Riposte" version with a bayonet (showing that the IC1 is in its artillery configuration, as the cavalry setup lacks a bayonet lug), and a "Deadeye" variant with a low-powered scope.
[[File:MH IC1 Artillery.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Martini-Henry IC1 in artillery configuration - .577-450 Martini]]
[[File:HuntMartiniModel.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The left side of the Martini-Henry's model.]]
[[File:HuntMartiniRiposte.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Riposte" variant with the attached sword bayonet, in the truest form of the name. This particular rifle is more of a sword with a free rifle attached.]]
[[File:HuntMartini1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter takes the high ground, his Martini-Henry at the ready.]]
[[File:HuntMartiniSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The hunter takes aim, confident that some good ol' fashioned British marksmanship will take proper care of this whole "monsters emerging from alternate dimensions" business.]]
[[File:HuntMartiniReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The hunter loads a fresh .577 cartridge into the breech.]]

==Springfield Model 1866==
Also added in the 1.1.3 patch was a Springfield Model 1866, an early variant of the [[Trapdoor Springfield Rifle]] chambered in .50-70 Government (a fact which is mentioned directly in-game, where it uses generically-named "Medium" ammunition). Unlocked at Rank 1, it serves as the first long-ranged rifle in the game with decent accuracy, damage and range. Nothing too spectacular, but nothing overtly bad. A good feeler gun for gauging how you want to play the game.

And if that wasn't enough, it comes with four whole variants. There's the obvious for a gun like this, a "Marksman" version fitted with a scope. And then there's the not-so-obvious like the "Compact" version which saws off a majority of the gun to let it fit in a "Medium" slot and work as a pocket handcannon. And if that wasn't enough, there's also a "Striker" version that fits the gun with a tiny and mildly adorable bayonet, and hilarious a "Deadeye" version that fits a sawn off rifle with a tiny little scope.
[[File:Springfield Model 1866.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Model 1866 - .50-70 Government]]
[[File:HuntTrapdoor.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The 3D model of the Model 1866, the older brother of the venerable Springfield Model 1873.]]
[[File:HuntStriker.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Striker" variant. Calling the blade attached to the end a bayonet is rather generous, considering its a homemade knife strapped on to the end of the barrel. Still, it certainly gets the job done.]]
[[File:HuntCompactTrapdoor.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The creator of the "Deadeye" variant was certainly not conforming to the typical idea of a sniper rifle.]]
[[File:HuntTrapdoor1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter slinks toward a Ghoul-infested dockyard with a Springfield Model 1866 at the ready.]]
[[File:HuntTrapdoorSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Archetypical tiny muzzleloader sights, now with the trapdoor mechanism cluttering part of your view.]]
[[File:HuntTrapdoorReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After blasting an ominous cypress tree, the hunter loads a new .50-70 Gov't round.]]

=Shotguns=
==Browning Auto-5==
The [[Browning Auto-5]] appears as the "Crown & King Auto-5", unlocked at Rank 82 as one of the last unlockable weapons in the game. Fitting the creep in RoF that the shotguns in ''H:S'' have, the Auto-5 is the absolute king of that mountain. Fast firing and potent, this will cause you to chew through your stockpile of shotgun shells if you're not careful.
[[Image:BrowAut5.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Browning Auto 5 - 12 gauge]]
[[File:HuntAutoLeft.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The 3D model of the Auto-5.]]
[[File:HuntAutoNew.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter eyes a suspiciously quiet path with her Auto-5 at the ready.]]
[[File:HuntAutoSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Iron sights of the "Crown & King Auto-5", simple bead and rear markings that say that the shotgun was produced around 10 years prior to the actual Auto-5.]]
[[File:HuntAutoReloadNew.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Crown & King Auto-5", this is mildly inaccurate as pre-1950 Auto-5s required the user to hold the bolt release button to actually load shells. In pre-release versions, the hunter would hold up the Auto-5 with their right hand and load shells with their left hand.]]

==Colt Model 1878==
The [[Colt Model 1878 Coach Gun]] appears as the "Caldwell Rival 78", unlocked at Rank 18. In comparison to the earlier "Romero 77", the "Rival" functions more as a close quarters shotgun intended for blasting targets at very close range. Its damage output struggles the farther you get from a target, so it's best to make sure you can see the whites of your enemies eyes when using this. The fact its only other variant is a sawn-off "Handcannon" version reinforces this idea.
[[Image:Colt1878.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt Model 1878 - 12 gauge]]
[[File:HuntSXSMenu.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The model of the Colt Model 1878. Although lore states it is manufactured by Caldwell (a stand-in for [[Colt's Manufacturing Company]]), the markings on the Rival 78 indicate it was manufactured by "Eden & Sons".]]
[[File:HuntSawedOffMenu.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The sawed-off "Handcannon", which may or may not have been the favored weapon of legendary Australian hunter [[Mad_Max#Sawed-off_VG_Bentley_Double-Barreled_Shotgun|Max Rockatansky]].]]
[[File:HuntSXSNew.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter wields his Rival 78 while staring into the water, watching for any Water Devils.]]
[[File:HuntSXSReady.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Aiming the Rival after scaring said Devils away with a bit of buckshot.]]
[[File:HuntSXSSights.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Iron sights of the Caldwell Rival 78; a set of half-moon posts on the rear and a front bead. The sights of the pre-release Rival were misaligned, with the rear sights being unused.]]
[[File:HuntSXSReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Caldwell Rival 78" consists of breaking it open, replacing the shells, and cocking the hammers. There is a separate animation for firing a single shot, which is always nice to see.]]

==Spencer 1882==
The [[Spencer 1882]] appears as the "Specter 1882", unlocked at Rank 24. The gun is faithfully rendered, albeit with a 4+1 capacity in comparison to the real gun's 5+1. After getting into the routine of break action boomsticks, the "Specter" breaks that routine and runs with it. No longer are you doomed from not being able to double tap a target, now that all you have to do is rack another shell into the gun to be on your merry way murdering your enemies with gusto. Keep in mind that it doesn't work like modern pump shotguns, and its reload is one complicated series of hand gestures to pull off.

The "Specter" boasts a very short but interesting list of variants. The first is a "Compact" model that cuts down the stock, barrel, magazine tube to make a compact repeater shotgun, reducing it to a "Medium" slot blaster. There's also the "Bayonet" model which fits the shotgun with a bayonet mount similar to WWI era trench guns, alongside a legitimate bayonet.
[[Image:SpencerShotgun.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Spencer 1882 - 12 gauge]]
[[Image:HuntSpencer1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter wanders the bayou at night with his Specter.]]
[[Image:HuntSpencer2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Aiming the "Specter 1882" at the other kind of specter.]]
[[Image:HuntSpencer3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Iron sights of the "Specter 1882", a small bead way out in front.]]
[[Image:HuntSpencer4.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Specter 1882". The reload procedure is depicted correctly, with the new shells being loaded into the open action after pulling back the pump. This also unfortunately ejects the chambered shell, but that shell can be recovered if the hunter has the "Bulletgrubber" trait. The empty reload process will fill up the tube magazine to its in-game capacity of 4, then work the action to chamber one round. Reloading again will then fill it up to capacity.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownSpencerSuperShorty.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A wander around a small bayou churchyard yields the Specter Compact, or the Spencer Super Shorty.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownSpencerShortyAim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Hearing a bunch of loud groaning, the hunter aims, revealing the detail in both fake Spencer markings and the scratch made pump handle.]]

==Single Barreled Shotgun==
A [[Single Barreled Shotgun]] appears as the "Romero 77" (possibly a reference to director [[George A. Romero]]), unlocked at Rank 1 and serving as the first shotgun available to the player in ''H:S'''. Just because it's the first doesn't mean you should get comfortable though, because the Romero is a potent gun in the right hands. Nothing will instantly humble you as losing your run to a Cajun bayou dweller who one taps you with one of these.

Likewise, the Romero boasts three major variants to itself. There's the obvious of a sawn-off version, the "Handcannon", that allows you to carry an entire shotgun in a medium slot for pennies. The "Talon" allows you to pull melee and close range duty in one package, and if that's too big for you, then there's the "Hatchet" version. Yes, you read that right. The Handcannon version with an elongated stock so you can use it as a hatchet. Creativity at its finest.

Added in the Serpent Moon update alongside a rework to shotgun damage models is the "Romero Alamo", a variant based on the Alofs Repeating Shotgun system. Like its real life counterpart, it's a large magazine fed contraption bolted onto the side of the Romero, anachronistic to the 1890's era of ''H:S'' as the Alofs system wasn't patented until 1924. Beyond being one of the cheapest repeating shotguns in the game, the Alamo also has the ability to be topped up fully without Bulletgruber, and with high accuracy and damage given the long barrel. It is also the slowest repeating shotgun in the game, with a rate of fire of a withering ''22'' rounds per minute making it slower than even its normal single shot counterparts, and its wonky magazine system makes reloading even slower.
[[Image:MontgomeryWardTxRanger.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Montgomery Ward Texas Ranger - 12 gauge]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownRomero.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Romero 77's base model in the 3D viewer.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownRomeroHandcannon.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Romero 77's "Handcannon" variant leaves only about a quarter of the barrel.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownRomeroHatchet.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Romero 77's absurd "Hatchet" variant.]]
[[Image:HuntShotgun1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter goes Deadite hunting with his Romero 77.]]
[[Image:HuntShotgun2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Aiming the "Romero 77" at a particularly threatening bush.]]
[[Image:HuntShotgun3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Iron sights of the "Romero 77"; it's exactly what you'd expect from a single barreled shotgun.]]
[[Image:HuntShotgun4.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the "Romero 77" by grabbing the old shell, placing a new one in before tossing the old away, closing the shotgun and cocking the hammer. This animation was replaced with one that shows the Romero operating with an automatic ejector thus shortening the reload time.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownRomeroSawnOffReload.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The new animation being demonstrated with the sawn off model, the gun is opened up and the shell is ejected.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownRomeroReload2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Before replacing the shell, closing the action and recocking the hammer.]]
[[Image:HuntShowdownRomeroWhack.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Hilarously, the bash animation for the sawn-off Romero has it being used as a sort of hammer, here being used to keep a "grunt" at bay.]]
[[Image:AlofsShotgun.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Alofs Repeating Shotgun mechanism on an Iver Johnson shotgun - 12 gauge.]]

==Winchester Model 1887==
The [[Winchester Model 1887]] was added in Update 1.5, named the "Winfield 1887 Terminus" (presumably a reference to its iconic appearance in ''[[Terminator 2: Judgement Day]]''); it serves as a more expensive, slower-firing, harder-hitting alternative to the Spencer (the latter being explained by its chambering - 10 gauge, according to the markings on the barrel). Interestingly, it has a 6+1 capacity; while the nominal capacity of an 1887 is 5 rounds in the tube and one in the chamber, an additional round can be placed on the lifter; this detail is replicated in its in-game reload animation. It is unlocked at Rank 64.

A sawn-off, Medium-slot variant called the "Handcannon" is also available; aside from a cut-down stock and barrel, this also has a shorter 4-round magazine tube.
[[File:PaulNewmanShotgunActual.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Winchester Model 1887 - 10 gauge. This is the actual screen gun used by [[Paul Newman]] in ''[[The Life and Times of Judge Roy Bean]]''.]]
[[File:HuntM1887.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The basic Model 1887 in the store. Hey, this isn't the Model 1887 as it usually appears in pop culture...]]
[[File:HuntTerminus.jpg|thumb|none|600px|...now that's what we're talking about!]]
[[File:HuntM1887 1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter holds the "1887 Terminus", struggling to not make more ''Terminator 2'' jokes on an IMFDB entry about the Model 1887.]]
[[File:HuntM1887Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Wide sights, not particularly useful for ranged combat, but useful for ''terminating'' targets at close range.]]
[[File:HuntM1887Load1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading, part 1. The breech is opened, and shells are loaded into the magazine tube.]]
[[File:HuntM1887Load2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|''Hunt'''s detailed reloads ensures that a shell is also placed directly into the barrel.]]

==Winchester Model 1893==
Update 1.8.1 also added the [[Winchester Model 1893]] as the game's second pump-action shotgun, under the name "Winfield 1893 Slate". It us unlocked at Rank 48 and currently has no variants. The Model 1893 is the somewhat obscure, ill-fated predecessor to the much more prolific [[Winchester Model 1897]], designed to use black powder 12 gauge shells. ''Hunt: Showdown'' marks what is possibly the first popular media appearance of this shotgun. It is equipped with a 20" Riot barrel, which was not a standard option, but available as a special order through Winchester. It correctly holds five shells plus one in the chamber.

Compared to the earlier Spencer 1882, the "Slate" has a higher rate of fire and much faster reload speed.
[[File:Winchester Model 1893.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Winchester Model 1893 - 12 gauge]]
[[File:HuntM1893Store.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The M1893 in the store. In a few years, hunters who buy one of these will be able to send it back to Winchester/Winfield and upgrade to a Model 1897.]]
[[File:HuntM1893-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A hunter wanders around with his M1893, feeling that this pump-action trend might not be a fad after all...]]
[[File:HuntM1893aIM.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Aiming through a shallow cutout at the rear and a simple brass bead at the muzzle.]]
[[File:HuntM1893Chamber.jpg|thumb|none|600px|On an empty reload, the hunter chamber-loads the first shell, inserting it from the top through the distinctive circular cutout on the top of the receiver.]]
[[File:HuntM1893Load.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Subsequent shells are loaded through the bottom in an animation reused from the Auto-5. Being a more modern weapon lacking the Spencer 1882's fiddly and complex action, the Bulletgrubber trait is not needed to ensure shells are not wasted during a tactical reload.]]

=Other=
==Dynamite==
Dynamite is available as a throwable weapon in four flavors.
[[File:HuntDynamiteStick.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A basic Dynamite Stick, for blowing up things.]]
[[File:HuntWaxedDynamite.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A waterproof Waxed Dynamite Stick, for blowing up things in the water or in Choke Bomb gas clouds.]]
[[File:HuntDynamiteBundle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Dynamite Bundle, for blowing up several things.]]
[[File:HuntBigDynamite.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Big Dynamite Bundle, for blowing up many things.]]

==Molotov Cocktail==
Referred to as "Fire Bombs", Molotovs are available as a throw weapon. They come in three variations.
[[File:HuntFireBomb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The basic Fire Bomb. Fire in ''Hunt'' is useful for many things, besides simply destroying multiple enemies at once. Crafty players can block off areas from enemy hunters with well-placed Fire Bomb, while setting a downed enemy hunter's body ablaze will prevent them from being revived by their partners.]]
[[File:HuntLiquidFireBomb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Liquid Fire Bomb, which can (somehow) burn on water.]]
[[File:HuntHellfire.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Hellfire Bomb explodes upon impact ''and'' spreads fire over a large area- fun!]]

==Frag Bomb==
An apparently homemade explosive device, the "Frag Bomb" functions like a traditional fragmentation grenade. Its basic construction is reminiscent of stick grenades like the [[Model 24 Stielhandgranate]]. Compared to dynamite sticks, the Frag Bomb has a slightly larger damage radius and trades raw damage for additional "Rending" damage, which inflicts severe bleeding (and subsequent rapid health depletion) upon hunters caught in the blast radius, representing the lacerating effect of shrapnel.
[[File:HuntFragBomb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Frag Bomb in the store. "Potato Masher" isn't quite appropriate for the setting of the game- maybe we can call it a Crawfish Masher?]]

==Flash Bomb==
The "Flash Bomb" is essentially a late 19th century take on flashbang grenade. A homemade device containing a mercury filling, the Flash Bomb detonates in a blinding flash of light, predictably disorienting any hunter caught in its blast radius.
[[File:HuntFlashBomb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Flash Bomb. While the first flash grenades were created in the 1960s by the British SAS, the Flash Bomb is a homemade contraption very much ahead of its time.]]

==Choke Bomb==
The "Choke Bomb" is a gas grenade that releases a cloud of black smoke, which prevents any fires from being lit in its radius and extinguishes existing flames. Hunters caught in the smoke cloud will also cough heavily, potentially revealing their position.
[[File:HuntChokeBomb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Interestingly enough, the Choke Bomb looks a bit more refined and "mass produced" than the other throwable weapons on offer.]]

==Sticky Bomb==
The "Sticky Bomb" is a single stick of dynamite enclosed within a barbed metal frame. As the name suggests, it will stick to most surfaces it makes contact with. The fuse time is eight seconds, double from the four second fuse time of dynamite, however.
[[File:HuntStickyBomb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Book of Weapons describes the Sticky Bomb as a "particularly cruel modified explosive device".]]

==Chaos Bomb==
A "Chaos Bomb" is another homemade explosive, composed of firecrackers and various cartridges. When triggered, the Chaos Bomb cooks off these rounds to simulate gunshots. This device is useful for simulating a firefight to confuse or distract other hunters.
[[File:HuntChaos Bomb.jpg|thumb|none|601px|The bayou is truly a source of ingenious equipment.]]

==Poison Bomb==
Yet another stick grenade-like offering, the Poison Bomb is apparently a medical device repurposed into delivering a cloud of poison gas upon impact with a surface.
[[File:HuntPoisonBomb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Unlike other throwables, the Poison Bomb's handle is composed of a haphazardly broken wooden shaft, as opposed to the nicely cut and sanded handles of other bombs.]]

[[Category:Video Game]]
[[Category:First-Person Shooter]]
[[Category:Horror]]
[[Category:Zombie]]

Talk:MAC-10

2022-02-12T10:39:14Z

Yocapo32: /* Ingram Mark III, IV, and V */ new section

__TOC__ 

=Additional Variants=

==Screen-Used Variants==
[[Image:TrueLiesMAC-10.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MAC-10 was used by [[Jamie Lee Curtis]] in the film ''[[True Lies]]'' - 9x19mm Parabellum. When the gun fell down the flight of stairs, wire was wrapped around the trigger to get the effect.]]
[[Image:Blade mac11.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Blade's MAC-11 - .380 ACP. It is a rubber stunt version.]]
[[Image:Blade2-8-1-.jpg|thumb|none|400px|The heavily modified MAC-10 used in the film ''[[Blade II]]''.]]
[[File:Jamesgeorgopoulosjokermac10.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MAC-10 - .45 ACP. This is the screen-used firearm seen in ''[[The Dark Knight]]''. '''Thanks to [[User:Jimmygcreative|James Georgopoulos]]'''.]]
[[Image:McQMAC-10.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MAC-10 used by [[John Wayne]] in the film ''[[McQ]]''- chambered in 9x19mm Parabellum. Suppressor is not the original. Image supplied by Long Mountain Outfitters.]]

==Other Variants==

===MAC-10/11===
[[File:Jaws_m10_45.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MAC-10 fitted with the Jersey Arms Works collapsible buttstock - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Ingram MAC 10.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MAC-10 with detachable barrel extension - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:MAC-11Compact.jpg|thumb|none|400px|A MAC-11 of unknown make with a grip safety and 16-round magazine - .380 ACP]]
[[Image:US Ingram M10 9x19mm submachine gun by Military Armament Corp with barrel extension.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MAC-10 with barrel extension - 9x19mm]]
[[File:M11A1 no stock.jpg|thumb|none|400px|RPB M11A1 with no stock - .380 ACP]]
[[File:MGC MAC-11 suppressed.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MGC suppressed Ingram MAC-11]]

===Other derivatives===
[[File:MPA10SST.jpeg|thumb|none|400px|MasterPiece Arms MPA10SST semi-auto civilian "mini pistol" - .45 ACP]]
[[File:MPA10SST-2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MasterPiece Arms MPA10SST with safety extension - .45 ACP]]
[[File:MPA930T.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MasterPiece Arms MPA930T semi-auto civilian "mini pistol" with "safety extension" - 9x19mm]]
[[File:MPA930SST.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MasterPiece Arms MPA930SST semi-auto civilian "mini pistol" - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BXP Early Version.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Armscor/Mechem BXP, early version - 9x19mm]]
[[File:Sca m11.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Stonycreek Armory Suomi upper installed on a SWD M11/9 SMG - 9x19mm]]
[[File:MPA30DMG.jpg|thumb|none|450px|MasterPiece Arms MPA30DMG - 9x19mm]]
[[File:T77.jpg|thumb|none|450px|T77 - 9x19mm]]
[[File:MPA300DMG.JPG|thumb|none|450px|MasterPiece Arms MPA300DMG - 9x19mm]]

===Airsoft Images===
[[File:GP221-L.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Airsoft Mac 11 with G&P scope mount]]

=Discussion=
Such a silly looking gun. :D - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 15:57, 4 November 2011 (CDT)
:Clearly, ergonomics or controllability were not high on Gordon Ingram's list of priorities when designing this weapon, otherwise this oversized machine pistol wouldn't be missing a more convenient place to put your non-trigger hand out of the box, or be saddled with an inconveniently fast firing rate. There is [http://www.max-11.com/ a conversion kit] that fixes those problems, however, and something like that would be nice to see in a movie one day. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:16, 4 November 2011 (CDT)
::Um, I was talking about the MasterPiece Arms MPA930T. :\ Even though it's not that good I still think the regular MAC-10 looks fairly cool.

[[Image:MPA930SST.jpg|thumb|none|400px|MasterPiece Arms MPA930SST semi-auto civilian "mini pistol" - 9x19mm]]
Had the wrong version, but I'll leave the old one up too since it has discussion. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 05:29, 7 November 2011 (CST)
:Still a silly looking gun. :D - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 15:25, 7 November 2011 (CST)
What round capacity is that extended magazine on the MPA9305? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 12:33, 9 November 2011 (CST)
:30 [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 12:35, 9 November 2011 (CST)

==Vietnam==
I'm not sure, but a website claimed that the MAC-10 saw service in the Vietnam War. Is that true? - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 17:14, 18 August 2009 (UTC)

It's true that the original MAC-10 did see some limited use by Special Forces over the years. Basically it was considered a throwaway weapon that could be used and then ditched if one needed to. The suppressor it had at the time was great for that era and it ended the lives of a few sentries. Still the Uzi was a superior weapon that ended up way more popular. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 05:10, 27 June 2010 (UTC)

I remember a long time ago reading an article in ''Soldier of Fortune'' which included some pics of SOF founder Robert K. Brown from his 5th SF Group days wearing the MAC-10 in a hip holster arrangement. The article included something which stated that the US military allegedly was considering replacing the M1911 with the MAC-10 and how Brown, among others, was grateful that such a thing never happened. --[[User:Charon68|Charon68]] 06:34, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

== Congo ==

How come there isn't a link to Congo

== New links ==

Can anyone add Congo 1995 on to the site. beggarsclan

Ok, sign your posts, and be more specific about what you want. Do you mean the [[Congo]] page? If you mean something else, you can make it yourself. --[[User:Jackbel|Jackbel]] 08:44, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

== MAC-10 used by german special forces ==

Hello,

the article claims that the MAC-10 was used by West-German special-ops at one time. I'm quite familiar with the german military and police forces, and I have never heard of the MAC-10 being used by either of them execpt maybe for evaluation. Can somebody specify which unit is supposed to have used the gun? Thank you in advance.

[[User:Gmb|Gmb]] 01:36, 5 March 2012 (CST)

==Possible deletion?==
[[Image:US Ingram M10 9x19mm submachine gun by Military Armament Corp with barrel extension.jpg|thumb|401px|none|MAC-10 with a similar barrel extension - 9x19mm]]

The updated picture on this file is clearly not a MAC-10 but rather most likely a Cobray since it has the lengthened receiver. I tried to revert it to the older pic (which is an Ingram) but it seems that might not have worked.. If need be, there's another picture of this type anyway - I'd be happy to replace this pic with the other one on the pages it's used on (there ain't that many) if someone thinks this can be deleted. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 14:44, 17 October 2013 (EDT)
: The update of an image becomes visible only after some time. Or you can change the size of the thumb for 1 px, and the new version of the image would be seen immediatly (like I've done with the image above). [[User:Greg-Z|Greg-Z]] ([[User talk:Greg-Z|talk]]) 15:22, 17 October 2013 (EDT)
::: Yeah I see it now, it's cool. I didn't think about the 1px thing. Anyway, since the reversion went fine deleting the 'real' pic is now kinda optional, either way. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 20:55, 17 October 2013 (EDT)
::::Deleted. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 20:59, 17 October 2013 (EDT)

== Difference between MAC-10/11 in terms of appearance? ==

Is there a way to tell them apart? [[User:Ominae|Ominae]] ([[User talk:Ominae|talk]]) 04:41, 27 November 2017 (EST)
: Mainly just size - the receiver on a 11 is not as tall as that on a 10 and components like the front sight, cocking knob and the regular folding stock appear larger on the 11 opposed to the 10. It is pretty subtle though. The stock is probably your best bet - notice how when it looks folded 'normal' it has a gap between it and the rear sight, as opposed to the MAC-10 where it actually touches the sight, an above MAC-11 image shows it folded to where it touches the sight, note there how it has a steeper angle that that of the 10 because of the shorter receiver. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 12:55, 27 November 2017 (EST)
:::The MAC-11 is pretty much just a baby version of the MAC-10 so it is pretty difficult to tell them apart. Pretty much the only reliable difference is that the MAC-11 is much smaller, being not much bigger than a regular pistol as oppsoed to the MAC-10 which is more like a brick. [http://arniesairsoft.co.uk/news2/wp-content/uploads/2007/11/MAC10%20vs%20MAC11.jpg These] guns are airsoft, but the comaprison shows the difference in size between the two models. The reason I say that size is the only "reliable" indicator that I am aware of is that there are other indicators, but the problem is that the features of these guns vary a lot with manufacturer and when they were made. For example, a lot of MAC-10s have a flared sections on each size of the bottom of the magazine well, but not all. However, I beleive that this feature is never present on MAC-11s, so if you see this it is safe to say that it is a MAC-10. Similarly, I have never seen a MAC-10 without the holes in the sight protectors, so if there is a gun without holes it is a MAC-11, however not all MAC-11s have these holes. If it is hard to judge the size of a gun, the best you can really do is look at the proportions. For example, on an 11 the stock release button will be closer to the grip than the back of the receiver and on a 10 it is the other way round, and the back of the ejection port on 11s tends to be farther forward relative to the back of the magazine well, stuff like that. Another rough sort of guide is that on a 10 the ejection port is kind of the same size as the opening of the trigger guard, as opposed to the 11 where it is noticeably smaller. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 13:07, 27 November 2017 (EST)
:::: Yeah, the stock is a good option to use. But in some media, the ones using them fire them without showing the stock, so that makes it a bit harder to examine. [[User:Ominae|Ominae]] ([[User talk:Ominae|talk]]) 00:46, 28 November 2017 (EST)

== "Barrel Extensions" ==

[[File:Ingram MAC 10.jpg|thumb|none|450px|MAC-10 with detachable barrel extension - .45 ACP]]
I've noticed that these guns (and some others) are often seen with shrouded "barrel extensions". Does this mean that they just have a smooth tube attached to the end of the barrel, or that the extension is an actual piece of rifled barrel screwed onto the existing one? And, if not the latter, would such a thing be feasible? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 09:26, 15 June 2020 (EDT)

== Ingram Mark III, IV, and V ==

So, I came across a picture of a supposed catalog that allegedly was sent to Spanish speaking countries during the 80s in that weird time when Ingram tried branching out to global militaries, and found some absolutely ridiculous offerings, like a carbine sized version of the MAC-10 in ''.45 Winchester and .50 Ingram Magnum.'' I tried looking info online, and I could only find basic information, and some dude making jokes about compensation, would anyone happen to have any more information about them?
Here are the photos I managed to snag from an auction and a forum.
https://imgur.com/a/D9xVjzJ
I'm fairly certain the photos are the wrong way around, since what it's calling the Mark IV which is chambered in .45 ACP is smaller than the one chambered in .22 Winchester Magnum. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 05:39, 12 February 2022 (EST)

Talk:Baikal Semi Auto Shotgun Series

2021-12-22T06:18:50Z

Yocapo32: /* Interesting story on the MP-155 Ultima */

== Now that's something you don't see everyday ==

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eQsp34zo6aE --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 15:49, 2 September 2020 (EDT)

== Interesting story on the MP-155 Ultima ==

[https://www.ign.com/articles/stolen-gun-kalashnikov-oceanic-mp-155-ultima-ward-b According to IGN], a game company named Ward B is accusing the Kalashnikov Concern of stealing the design of one of their fictional guns for the design of the MP-155 Ultima. Ward B, who are developing this game called Oceanic, was contacted by a "producer of industrial projects" for multiple companies, including Kalashnikov Concern, for their fictional EPM28 Mastodon shotgun to be made into a real gun kit for the MP-155. The discussions didn't result in a deal, but the appearance of the MP-155 Ultima convinced Ward B that Kalashnikov copied their design.

I would also like to use this opportunity to ask: why the fuck does the MP-155 Ultima even exist? Who is it designed for? --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 21:15, 7 December 2021 (EST)

:Yeah, I see [https://www.artstation.com/artwork/v1oq4E their point]. Obviously, Kalashnikov took inspiration from this thing but the key word here is "inspiration". Their design has enough differences to be considered non-infringing such as different trigger guard, different stock shape, different rear sight, handguard and so on. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 22:19, 7 December 2021 (EST)

::That, my friend, is called "legally distinct differences", it's how Rockstar gets away with making the cars in GTA V look almost exactly the same as the real ones ''without'' getting sued. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 01:18, 22 December 2021 (EST)

Talk:Cat Shit One

2021-10-24T23:57:24Z

Yocapo32:

This page has been deleted. If you don't like it, tough shit. All of the code has been saved however, so it can instantaneously be ressurrected, however, with all of the comments, NO ONE has demonstrated that this title conforms to IMFDB rules, so away it goes.
[[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]]
:The problem was it being a web-release, right? would [http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2010-10-22/cat-sh-t-one-dvd/bd-to-include-english-dub-in-japan a DVD and BluRay release] change things?--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 15:38, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
::It was said that a DVD that is self distributed by the company only that it doesn't comply with IMFDB rules. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 16:58, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
:I don't know what's got your panties in a bunch - I ordered my copy from Amazon and it showed up. I think that should make it qualify. But, haters gonna hate.
::It's not about "hating", it's about the film not conforming to IMFDB rules, just like MPM stated. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 04:55, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
:::After finally getting to see the English dub... I really don't care about this page getting deleted.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 07:29, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
::::The original Japanese dub was bad enough, but was the English dub ''that'' bad? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 11:45, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
:::::It was the worst kind of bad; the bad that's not good enough to be bearable, but not bad enough to be cheesy entertainment. Packy's voice sounded about four octaves above where it should have been, and most of the time the acting felt like ''very'' obvious line reading. I prefer English dubs, and I'm willing to sit through 95% of the English dubs out there, but this one I could not.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 13:32, 10 February 2011 (UTC)
::::::Yeah, I just saw (and heard) for myself on YouTube. I was crossing my fingers hoping it was the good kind of bad (like Resident Evil 1 and 2)... boy, was I disappointed. Not to mention Packy's and Botasko's (or whatever the sniper guy's name was lol) rifles both sounded identical to the AKs. I've never actually heard an SR-47 being fired, but I assume it would have the same ringing sound to it as an M4 does being that it's simply an M4 modded to chamber 7.62 M43. And I think most everyone here already knows an M14 sounds a lot beefier than an M4 or AK. Hell, being that the plot wasn't all that bad, I could have forgiven the VA if they'd gotten the firearms SFX right. And that was a perfectly good Aimpoint Botasko had sitting on top of his scope, why ditch it? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 14:08, 10 February 2011 (UTC)

If this was violating the professional distribution rule, it's available on Amazon on [both DVD and Blu-Ray]. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 14:02, 22 October 2012 (EDT)

So is this page allowed or not? --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 20:35, 5 November 2019 (EST)

Amazon is technically a distributor, so I guess it should be. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 19:57, 24 October 2021 (EDT)

Talk:Ghost in the Shell Stand Alone Complex

2021-05-17T02:59:07Z

Yocapo32: /* Togusa's Backup Gun */ new section

==Progress==
I will be updating this page as I go through and screencap the series, and I will be making use of the official S.A.C. artbook to fact-check the page as I go. However, I have already encountered a few weapons that are not covered in the book and are, as far as I know, fictional designs. All of these will be left with generic names. If anyone has any information about any of these (or if they are real designs and I simply do not recognize them) your help would be appreciated.

Screencap Progress: Episodes 26/26

--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 00:41, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

:Done, done, and done.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 04:51, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
==GE M134 Minigun==

Batou fields a man-portable [[GE M134 Minigun]] to slow down the incursion of Umibozu troops into Section 9's headquarters in episode 24. The Tachikoma sentient multiped tanks can also be fitted with compact .50 calibre multibarreled machineguns, if their standard 50mm grenade launcher is swapped out.

[[Image:M134.JPG|thumb|none|350px|GE M134 Minigun 7.62x51mm NATO]]
[[Image:Gits-sac20.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Batou opens up with his hand-held GE M134 Minigun]]

:--This looks a little too big for a minigun... I think it might actually be a M61 Vulcan.
::Batou's big, but not ''that'' big. Besides, look at the ejecting brass - surely not meant to be 20mm?
Could it be a six barreled version of the [[General Dynamics GAU-19/A]]?

(i copied this whole section from the article)

:According to the '''Ghost in the Shell S.A.C. Visual Book (Arms Report Section 9)''' ISBN4-89425-341-0 page 33 it is a GE M134 (or ar least it is intended to be one ;)[[Special:Contributions/84.152.126.131|84.152.126.131]] 13:47, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

== Saito's AMR ==

I'm pretty sure the AMR Saito uses to snipe the quadruped tank is a Lahti L39, not an NTW-20. It really looks nothing like an NTW-20 other than it is a really big sniper rifle and shares more with the L39, in particular, the top loading magazine, stock shape and "ski legs."

==Screencaps==
I am currently re-watching the series, and screencapping as I go. Hopefully this page will be up to snuff withing a week or two.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 16:06, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
: On the topic of Ghost in the Shell, Should i add Solid State Society to the site? --[[User:FirearmsNewbie|FirearmsNewbie]] 00:34, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
::You can, but you don't have to. I plan on watching it after I'm done with both TV series, and if there are any non-fictitious firearms, then I'll do it as well. Of course, if it's nothing but Seburo stuff, don't make it.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 01:16, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
:::I just rewatched and screencaped SSS. All of the weapons in it are either fictional (like the C26A) or are fictional variants of real guns (like Motoko's P90 in a futuristic shell). I'll keep the images saved, but unless an admin says to put it up, it's best not to.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 19:05, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

==FLASHPOINT: "Run, Jamie, Run"==

This is interesting... the episode is about a rebellious hacker/armed robber who rips off the rich and privileged and has a major web following, and he has a stylized "JD" logo that morphs into something uncannily resembling the Laughing Man symbol from Ghost in the Shell: Stand Alone Complex, with the same half-circles for eyes above the D as a laughing mouth, and the J resembling the cap shape (although moved a bit to the left). And I doubt it's a coincidence that the character here goes by "JD" (short for Jamie D) and the Laughing Man logo includes a quote from Catcher in the Rye by J. D. Salinger. Plus Jamie D is a hacker who engages in misdirection and hides his true face, while the Laughing Man hacked cameras and cyberbrains to replace his face with his logo. There's no way all of that could be a coincidence -- I'd say we've got an intentional GitS:SAC homage in a place I never would've expected to see one. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 23:00, 16 November 2012 (EST)

== "Unidentified Pistol" ==

The "unidentified pistol" appears to be based on a short-barreled M1911 variant with adjustable sights. Compensating for the fact that the weapon is hand-drawn, most of the details seem clearly based on the model 1911 (such as the distinctive slide shape and trigger). Even the rear sight appears to be an approximation of the popular L-shaped adjustable sight commonly seen on 1911 variants. The only components that do not fit the 1911 diagnosis are the slide lock and the safety catch (not to mention the lack of a spring tube for both). The slide lock appears to be a flipped version of the normal 1911 lock, while the safety catch is a much simpler design and seems similarly flipped. I have so far been unsuccessful in finding a 1911 clone that has anything even vaguely resembling the flipped slide lock / safety catch, so I would tentatively suggest that these are mistakes by the artist rather than a depiction of a yet-unknown gun.
<gallery>File:GITSSACTT331.jpg
File:ColtCombatCommander.jpg</gallery>
[[User:MiPod|MiPod]] ([[User talk:MiPod|talk]]) 08:08, 4 February 2013 (EST)

==Updating screenshots with Blu-Ray stuff==

Is it game for anyone to do so? [[User:Ominae|Ominae]] ([[User talk:Ominae|talk]]) 03:15, 5 December 2018 (EST)

== Togusa's Backup Gun ==

I was thinking, considering the shape and pattern of the grips, plus some other details that line up, isn't it actually the 2007M from the movie, rather than just a normal 2006M? The barrel ''is'' shorter, but everything else seems pretty similar. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 22:59, 16 May 2021 (EDT)

Talk:Resident Evil (2002 VG)

2021-04-30T10:19:03Z

Yocapo32: /* S.T.A.R.S. */

== S.T.A.R.S. ==

Special Tactics And Rescue Service. The name was apparently derived from a special police team in Singapore called S.T.A.R. The word "Service" is game canon, not "Squad" - if you want proof, boot up RE2 and look at the huge mural in the STARS office, or the PSX/PC (1996) version of RE1 and look at the newspaper headline in the opening FMV. The wording "Special Tactics And Rescue Squad" was incorrectly used by author S.D. Perry in her (sanctioned by Capcom, but considered non-canon) novels.

- On the back of the original RE1 (PSX) box, it's Squad. Ingame, it's Service. Simple lack of proper communication between the various groups involved in making the game.

*Barry Burton´s Samurai Edge isn´t a beretta 96, due to it´s chambered in .40 s&w?

:The Beretta 96 ''is'' .40 S&W. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 05:53, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

:Yes, but the page says custom 92...; that means the page is wrong, and barrys gun is a custom 96

How is the page wrong by saying it's a 92? Because it is a 92. The normal gun is 9mm, Beretta 92FS custom "Samurai Edge". Always was, allways will be. Barry's gun could possibly be a 96, which is exactly the same as a 92 just in .40 S&W.

:Barry's Samurai Edge, from my point of view, would more or less be a Beretta 96FS converted to select fire (much like many "Beretta 93Rs" in movies are just converted Beretta 92s. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:18, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

:I feel like I should say, back in these games the Samurai Edges were all 92F, not 92FS, they didn't have the thing that makes the slide fly over your head when it shears in half, I'm guessing the news ones have that because no one knows what the difference between the two guns are and they just got whatever was available. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 19:21, 28 March 2021 (EDT)
::Correction, they're probably 92FS now because they reused the model from RE5 to make Wesker's pistol, and no one bothered to check if it was correct because of the minimal differences, so now they're all based on that. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 18:24, 1 April 2021 (EDT)
::Correction to my correction, I'm an idiot, the guns always were all 92F, the SE being called a 92FS here threw me off. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 06:19, 30 April 2021 (EDT)

==Samurai edge==
We don´t have a decent pic of barry´s samurai edge or the silver serpent eighter. Playing with paint i made those two images. They arent perfect, but they´re close to the guns, do I upload those images? (please, tell me how)-I don´t speak english very well, so please be patient-.

*sigh*. Just go here for images [http://residentevil.wikia.com/Category:Weapons]. I'm an admin there, and you have my permission to use information, images, blah blah blah. We have several pics of both guns. Same goes for all other RE articles. I really don't care about people jacking info from us. This is the internet, after all.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 05:14, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

:I ment this picture:
[[Image:Samurai_edge.JPG]]
, it´s kinda low res, because i made it with paint, what do you think. (If you wanna use this, no problem, I´d be glad).

Damn, that's a cool picture

I made too this one:

the silver serpent

[[Image:Silver_serpent2.JPG]]

The airsoft Barry model works better, seeing as it has the correct grips.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 06:00, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

== Magnum ==

The model seems to be much closer to the Colt King Cobra, because the in-game model has solid construction where the ribbing would be on the Anaconda and would have similar aftermarket grips.
:It's just a Python customized with a new heavier barrel, a smooth cylinder, and a custom wooden grip. And did you mean Python not Anaconda. Python and King Cobra = .357 magnum, Anaconda = .44 magnum. Plus, the bottom of the Python's trigger guard is flat and bottom of the King Cobra's (and the Anaconda's) guard slants forward and downward a bit. That's one of the easiest ways too tell the difference between the Python and King Cobra besides just the barrel, look at pictures of them side by side to see what I mean. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]]

It's a damn Anaconda or a gun completely made up. there is no fucking .44 magnum Python. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]

Everyone has accepted that this gun is an Anaconda. Even the game says it's an Anaconda. You can't just refuse that it is and keep changing it back to a Python after I correct it because of your opinion. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]

:First off, please sign your posts. Second, like I said earlier, we go on visual evidence here. It doesn't matter what it was intended to be, it matters what it is. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 02:11, 19 January 2013 (EST)
::Also, there's no need for profanity. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 02:20, 19 January 2013 (EST)

So, because ONE person (aka YOU) thinks that the gun is a Python, that makes it so? Okay let's present the evidence here; Anaconda: the game itself refers to the gun as an Anaconda, the gun is .44 Magnum like the Anaconda and there is no .44 Python, the revolver cylinder is clearly .44 caliber, the same fingergrooves as the Anaconda that the Python doesn't have. Python: screw above the trigger and wood grips. I'm not denying your logic, but the gun clearly was not intended to be a Python. I'm sure we can come to a conclusion... just put that it's some kind of phony Anaconda/Python hybrid design. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]
:First off, it's not just one person, as I wasn't the one who initially IDed it as a Python. I suggest you go look up how to distinguish Python from an Anaconda. No one is disputing what the dialogue says it is, and I've added that to the entry, but the simple fact of the matter is, the developers used a model of a Python to portray an Anaconda. If you've looked at any of the other pages for games here, you'd know that it's a fairly common occurrence. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 16:36, 21 January 2013 (EST)

== flamethrower ==

The flamethrower is really a puzzle becuse it seems like it been built by a assultrifle trigger and the rest i dont know

Its a completely fictional design. Isn't based on any existing firearms, as far as I can tell. So don't try to make too much sense of it. --<BIG>''-Chris'''</BIG><BIG>'''J-''</BIG> [[Special:Contributions/Chris_Jeremic|''' CONTRIBUTIONS''']] 20:11, 21 January 2013 (EST)

Seems to me like there might be some inspiration from the M240 Incinerator Unit from [[Aliens]], primarily in the handguard and gas canister placement.
[[Image:M240Flamethrower.jpg‎ |thumb|none|450px|M240 Flamethrower]]
[[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 17:01, 27 November 2014 (EST)

==Assault Shotgun==
Is it just me, or does the Assault shotgun resemble the [[FN Tactical Police]] more than the Benelli as listed?!? [[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 21:49, 30 January 2015 (GMT)

==Grenade==
I honestly don't see where the supposed inspiration from the M7 came from. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 12:29, 14 March 2021 (EDT)

Talk:Resident Evil (2002 VG)

2021-04-01T22:24:41Z

Yocapo32: /* S.T.A.R.S. */

== S.T.A.R.S. ==

Special Tactics And Rescue Service. The name was apparently derived from a special police team in Singapore called S.T.A.R. The word "Service" is game canon, not "Squad" - if you want proof, boot up RE2 and look at the huge mural in the STARS office, or the PSX/PC (1996) version of RE1 and look at the newspaper headline in the opening FMV. The wording "Special Tactics And Rescue Squad" was incorrectly used by author S.D. Perry in her (sanctioned by Capcom, but considered non-canon) novels.

- On the back of the original RE1 (PSX) box, it's Squad. Ingame, it's Service. Simple lack of proper communication between the various groups involved in making the game.

*Barry Burton´s Samurai Edge isn´t a beretta 96, due to it´s chambered in .40 s&w?

:The Beretta 96 ''is'' .40 S&W. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 05:53, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

:Yes, but the page says custom 92...; that means the page is wrong, and barrys gun is a custom 96

How is the page wrong by saying it's a 92? Because it is a 92. The normal gun is 9mm, Beretta 92FS custom "Samurai Edge". Always was, allways will be. Barry's gun could possibly be a 96, which is exactly the same as a 92 just in .40 S&W.

:Barry's Samurai Edge, from my point of view, would more or less be a Beretta 96FS converted to select fire (much like many "Beretta 93Rs" in movies are just converted Beretta 92s. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:18, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

:I feel like I should say, back in these games the Samurai Edges were all 92F, not 92FS, they didn't have the thing that makes the slide fly over your head when it shears in half, I'm guessing the news ones have that because no one knows what the difference between the two guns are and they just got whatever was available. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 19:21, 28 March 2021 (EDT)
::Correction, they're probably 92FS now because they reused the model from RE5 to make Wesker's pistol, and no one bothered to check if it was correct because of the minimal differences, so now they're all based on that. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 18:24, 1 April 2021 (EDT)

==Samurai edge==
We don´t have a decent pic of barry´s samurai edge or the silver serpent eighter. Playing with paint i made those two images. They arent perfect, but they´re close to the guns, do I upload those images? (please, tell me how)-I don´t speak english very well, so please be patient-.

*sigh*. Just go here for images [http://residentevil.wikia.com/Category:Weapons]. I'm an admin there, and you have my permission to use information, images, blah blah blah. We have several pics of both guns. Same goes for all other RE articles. I really don't care about people jacking info from us. This is the internet, after all.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 05:14, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

:I ment this picture:
[[Image:Samurai_edge.JPG]]
, it´s kinda low res, because i made it with paint, what do you think. (If you wanna use this, no problem, I´d be glad).

Damn, that's a cool picture

I made too this one:

the silver serpent

[[Image:Silver_serpent2.JPG]]

The airsoft Barry model works better, seeing as it has the correct grips.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 06:00, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

== Magnum ==

The model seems to be much closer to the Colt King Cobra, because the in-game model has solid construction where the ribbing would be on the Anaconda and would have similar aftermarket grips.
:It's just a Python customized with a new heavier barrel, a smooth cylinder, and a custom wooden grip. And did you mean Python not Anaconda. Python and King Cobra = .357 magnum, Anaconda = .44 magnum. Plus, the bottom of the Python's trigger guard is flat and bottom of the King Cobra's (and the Anaconda's) guard slants forward and downward a bit. That's one of the easiest ways too tell the difference between the Python and King Cobra besides just the barrel, look at pictures of them side by side to see what I mean. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]]

It's a damn Anaconda or a gun completely made up. there is no fucking .44 magnum Python. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]

Everyone has accepted that this gun is an Anaconda. Even the game says it's an Anaconda. You can't just refuse that it is and keep changing it back to a Python after I correct it because of your opinion. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]

:First off, please sign your posts. Second, like I said earlier, we go on visual evidence here. It doesn't matter what it was intended to be, it matters what it is. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 02:11, 19 January 2013 (EST)
::Also, there's no need for profanity. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 02:20, 19 January 2013 (EST)

So, because ONE person (aka YOU) thinks that the gun is a Python, that makes it so? Okay let's present the evidence here; Anaconda: the game itself refers to the gun as an Anaconda, the gun is .44 Magnum like the Anaconda and there is no .44 Python, the revolver cylinder is clearly .44 caliber, the same fingergrooves as the Anaconda that the Python doesn't have. Python: screw above the trigger and wood grips. I'm not denying your logic, but the gun clearly was not intended to be a Python. I'm sure we can come to a conclusion... just put that it's some kind of phony Anaconda/Python hybrid design. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]
:First off, it's not just one person, as I wasn't the one who initially IDed it as a Python. I suggest you go look up how to distinguish Python from an Anaconda. No one is disputing what the dialogue says it is, and I've added that to the entry, but the simple fact of the matter is, the developers used a model of a Python to portray an Anaconda. If you've looked at any of the other pages for games here, you'd know that it's a fairly common occurrence. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 16:36, 21 January 2013 (EST)

== flamethrower ==

The flamethrower is really a puzzle becuse it seems like it been built by a assultrifle trigger and the rest i dont know

Its a completely fictional design. Isn't based on any existing firearms, as far as I can tell. So don't try to make too much sense of it. --<BIG>''-Chris'''</BIG><BIG>'''J-''</BIG> [[Special:Contributions/Chris_Jeremic|''' CONTRIBUTIONS''']] 20:11, 21 January 2013 (EST)

Seems to me like there might be some inspiration from the M240 Incinerator Unit from [[Aliens]], primarily in the handguard and gas canister placement.
[[Image:M240Flamethrower.jpg‎ |thumb|none|450px|M240 Flamethrower]]
[[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 17:01, 27 November 2014 (EST)

==Assault Shotgun==
Is it just me, or does the Assault shotgun resemble the [[FN Tactical Police]] more than the Benelli as listed?!? [[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 21:49, 30 January 2015 (GMT)

==Grenade==
I honestly don't see where the supposed inspiration from the M7 came from. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 12:29, 14 March 2021 (EDT)

Talk:Resident Evil (2002 VG)

2021-03-28T23:21:55Z

Yocapo32: /* S.T.A.R.S. */

== S.T.A.R.S. ==

Special Tactics And Rescue Service. The name was apparently derived from a special police team in Singapore called S.T.A.R. The word "Service" is game canon, not "Squad" - if you want proof, boot up RE2 and look at the huge mural in the STARS office, or the PSX/PC (1996) version of RE1 and look at the newspaper headline in the opening FMV. The wording "Special Tactics And Rescue Squad" was incorrectly used by author S.D. Perry in her (sanctioned by Capcom, but considered non-canon) novels.

- On the back of the original RE1 (PSX) box, it's Squad. Ingame, it's Service. Simple lack of proper communication between the various groups involved in making the game.

*Barry Burton´s Samurai Edge isn´t a beretta 96, due to it´s chambered in .40 s&w?

:The Beretta 96 ''is'' .40 S&W. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 05:53, 7 December 2009 (UTC)

:Yes, but the page says custom 92...; that means the page is wrong, and barrys gun is a custom 96

How is the page wrong by saying it's a 92? Because it is a 92. The normal gun is 9mm, Beretta 92FS custom "Samurai Edge". Always was, allways will be. Barry's gun could possibly be a 96, which is exactly the same as a 92 just in .40 S&W.

:Barry's Samurai Edge, from my point of view, would more or less be a Beretta 96FS converted to select fire (much like many "Beretta 93Rs" in movies are just converted Beretta 92s. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:18, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

:I feel like I should say, back in these games the Samurai Edges were all 92F, not 92FS, they didn't have the thing that makes the slide fly over your head when it shears in half, I'm guessing the news ones have that because no one knows what the difference between the two guns are and they just got whatever was available. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 19:21, 28 March 2021 (EDT)

==Samurai edge==
We don´t have a decent pic of barry´s samurai edge or the silver serpent eighter. Playing with paint i made those two images. They arent perfect, but they´re close to the guns, do I upload those images? (please, tell me how)-I don´t speak english very well, so please be patient-.

*sigh*. Just go here for images [http://residentevil.wikia.com/Category:Weapons]. I'm an admin there, and you have my permission to use information, images, blah blah blah. We have several pics of both guns. Same goes for all other RE articles. I really don't care about people jacking info from us. This is the internet, after all.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 05:14, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

:I ment this picture:
[[Image:Samurai_edge.JPG]]
, it´s kinda low res, because i made it with paint, what do you think. (If you wanna use this, no problem, I´d be glad).

Damn, that's a cool picture

I made too this one:

the silver serpent

[[Image:Silver_serpent2.JPG]]

The airsoft Barry model works better, seeing as it has the correct grips.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 06:00, 14 February 2010 (UTC)

== Magnum ==

The model seems to be much closer to the Colt King Cobra, because the in-game model has solid construction where the ribbing would be on the Anaconda and would have similar aftermarket grips.
:It's just a Python customized with a new heavier barrel, a smooth cylinder, and a custom wooden grip. And did you mean Python not Anaconda. Python and King Cobra = .357 magnum, Anaconda = .44 magnum. Plus, the bottom of the Python's trigger guard is flat and bottom of the King Cobra's (and the Anaconda's) guard slants forward and downward a bit. That's one of the easiest ways too tell the difference between the Python and King Cobra besides just the barrel, look at pictures of them side by side to see what I mean. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]]

It's a damn Anaconda or a gun completely made up. there is no fucking .44 magnum Python. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]

Everyone has accepted that this gun is an Anaconda. Even the game says it's an Anaconda. You can't just refuse that it is and keep changing it back to a Python after I correct it because of your opinion. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]

:First off, please sign your posts. Second, like I said earlier, we go on visual evidence here. It doesn't matter what it was intended to be, it matters what it is. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 02:11, 19 January 2013 (EST)
::Also, there's no need for profanity. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 02:20, 19 January 2013 (EST)

So, because ONE person (aka YOU) thinks that the gun is a Python, that makes it so? Okay let's present the evidence here; Anaconda: the game itself refers to the gun as an Anaconda, the gun is .44 Magnum like the Anaconda and there is no .44 Python, the revolver cylinder is clearly .44 caliber, the same fingergrooves as the Anaconda that the Python doesn't have. Python: screw above the trigger and wood grips. I'm not denying your logic, but the gun clearly was not intended to be a Python. I'm sure we can come to a conclusion... just put that it's some kind of phony Anaconda/Python hybrid design. --[[User:TheREwiz|TheREwiz]]
:First off, it's not just one person, as I wasn't the one who initially IDed it as a Python. I suggest you go look up how to distinguish Python from an Anaconda. No one is disputing what the dialogue says it is, and I've added that to the entry, but the simple fact of the matter is, the developers used a model of a Python to portray an Anaconda. If you've looked at any of the other pages for games here, you'd know that it's a fairly common occurrence. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 16:36, 21 January 2013 (EST)

== flamethrower ==

The flamethrower is really a puzzle becuse it seems like it been built by a assultrifle trigger and the rest i dont know

Its a completely fictional design. Isn't based on any existing firearms, as far as I can tell. So don't try to make too much sense of it. --<BIG>''-Chris'''</BIG><BIG>'''J-''</BIG> [[Special:Contributions/Chris_Jeremic|''' CONTRIBUTIONS''']] 20:11, 21 January 2013 (EST)

Seems to me like there might be some inspiration from the M240 Incinerator Unit from [[Aliens]], primarily in the handguard and gas canister placement.
[[Image:M240Flamethrower.jpg‎ |thumb|none|450px|M240 Flamethrower]]
[[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 17:01, 27 November 2014 (EST)

==Assault Shotgun==
Is it just me, or does the Assault shotgun resemble the [[FN Tactical Police]] more than the Benelli as listed?!? [[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 21:49, 30 January 2015 (GMT)

==Grenade==
I honestly don't see where the supposed inspiration from the M7 came from. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 12:29, 14 March 2021 (EDT)

Talk:Call of Duty: Black Ops Cold War

2021-03-06T06:16:40Z

Yocapo32: /* Magnum identification */ new section

= Miscellaneous =
== US Air Force Pilot Survival Knife ==
A US Air Force Pilot Survival Knife issued to US Air Force jet pilots flying over Vietnam is carried by Sims and Adler during their time in Vietnam and Sims' knife is even featured as evidence for the campaign mission "Fracture Jaw". Woods and Adler also carry such knives, presumably their own knives from Vietnam, in the 1981 segments of the campaign.

== Vietnam War Period US Military Tomahawk ==
A tomahawk based on those used by US forces during the Vietnam War is available in multiplayer.

== Hybrid AK Bayonet ==
What appears to be a hybrid between the basic AK-47 bayonet and the AKM Type II Bayonet is tossed by operators in the multiplayer lobby. A proper AKM Type II Bayonet also appears as the "Anime Assassin" blueprint for the knife and the same model is also used by Kravchenko in the zombie mode cutscenes.
[[Image:AKM type 2 bayonet.jpg|thumb|none|400px|An AKM type 2 bayonet with scabbard.]]

== Shtrafbat Knife ==
What appears to be a Russian Shtrafbat knife is used by Spetsnaz operatives to dispatch the walkman using US soldier in the multiplayer reveal trailer and is carried by multiplayer operator Stone inaccurately in a [http://monkeyedgeblog.com/cool-guy-kit-the-raf-aircrew-knife-as-used-by-the-sas/ RAF aircrew knife sleeve sewn sheath]. It is most likely anachronistic.

== Vietnam War Period MACV-SOG Knife ==
A Vietnam War period MACV-SOG knife is carried by multiplayer operatives Sims and Stone.

== Ontario SP1 Marine Combat Knife ==
The same Ontario SP1 Marine Combat Knife from ''Modern Warfare Remastered'' is reused in the campaign. Mason takes one from a dead enemy operative at the beginning of "Nowhere Left to Run" and can use it throughout the mission. Adler can potentially also use one on Bell in "Ashes to Ashes". It's appearance in the 1980s is anachronistic.
[[Image:Ontario SP1 Marine Combat Knife.jpg|thumb|none|400px|An Ontario SP1 Spec Plus Marine Combat Knife.]]

== Unidentified Knife ==
The basic knife of the game is of unknown model but appears to be based on vintage [https://www.ebay.com/itm/293732635691 Swimaster diving knives].

== Tru-Bal Throwing Knife ==
A Tru-Bal throwing knife is used by Bell to eliminate Vietcong fighters in the Vietnam War flashbacks.

== Tessina Camera ==
A 35mm Tessina L camera is used in the campaign to take photos of various objects of interest. The Tessina was introduced in 1957 and was [https://petapixel.com/2011/03/11/actual-spy-cameras-used-by-the-cia/ actually used by the CIA].

== R-77 Missile ==
Fictionalized R-77 missiles are delivered by MiG-23 jet fighters as the "Cruise Missile" scorestreak.

== M1942 Machete ==
An M1942 Machete is carried by Adler in "Fracture Jaw".

= Attachments =
== Optics ==

=== "Microflex LED" ===
The "Microflex LED" is loosely based on the Docter or Noblex quicksight red dot for shotguns with the lens having a more conventional shape similar to the traditional Sightmark Sureshot Reflex Sight/Adco SOLO Sight. All of these red dot models are heavily anachronistic.

=== C79 Optical Sight ===
The C79 Optical Sight appears as the "Visiontech 2x". It is slightly anachronistic as it was introduced towards the end of the Cold War, in 1989.

=== Colt Scope ===
The Colt scope appears as "Axial Arms 3x".

=== Elbit Falcon ===
The Israeli Elbit Falcon sight appears as the "Millstop Reflex", and its description describes that it is produced in the USA instead of Israel. Unlike in the first Black Ops, however, this time its appearance might not be anachronistic since this game has 1980s segments.

=== Kobra Red Dot Sight ===
The anachronistic Russian Kobra red dot sight appears as the "Kobra Red Dot" and its description mentions inaccurately that it is of Soviet origin; the real Kobra was developed in the 1990s or 2000s, after the collapse of the Soviet Union. This time it is depicted with its proper circular tube unlike the earlier ''Black Ops'' iteration which had a fictional squareish shape.

=== "Sillix Holoscout" ===
The "Sillix Holoscout" appears to be inspired by the Steiner Optics CQT and DRS 1X. However, this is anachronistic as the CQT was unveiled at Shot Show 2019 and the overall design is too modern for the Cold War era.

=== SUIT Sight ===
The SUIT sight appears as the "Royal & Kross 4x". The real scope's right side is depicted being on the left in game.

=== Tasco Red Dot Scope ===
On handguns, the "Millstop Reflex" sight takes the form of a Tasco Red Dot Scope. It's anachronistic considering the fact that it was first released in 1994.

=== "Quickdot LED" ===
The "Quickdot LED" appears to be inspired by the C-More red dot sight. This is anachronistic as the C-More was introduced in 1993.

=== "Hawksmoor" ===
The "Hawksmoor" appears to be a fictional and generic machinegun red dot sight combining elements from DCL110AD-3X and Trijicon MGRS Machine Gun Reflex Sight and a battery compartment resembling Meprolight Mepro M5 red dot sight. Even though it is based mainly on MG red dot sights, which are typically larger, the in game sight is depicted as being significantly smaller as to pass for a regular red dot sight. All of the referenced models and the concept of an MG red dot sight itself are heavily anachronistic.

=== Rusak Red Dot Sight ===
The "Diamondback Reflex" is loosely based on the Russian Rusak red dot sight which appears to be anachronistic as these were produced in the early 90s. It is also depicted with an English on/off switch, suggesting that it is a Western bloc equipment rather than an Eastern bloc equipment in-fiction. It is available only to SMGs.

=== OKP-7 ===
A stylized Russian OKP-7 red dot appears as the "Fastpoint Reflex". It's appearance is most likely anachronistic.

=== SUSAT Scope ===
The SUSAT scope appears as the "SUSAT Multizoom".

=== AN/PVS-4 ===
The AN/PVS-4 appears as the "AN/PVS-4 Thermal". In reality, the AN/PVS-4 is a night vision device that doesn't have thermal capabilities and as such can't work during day time. It is depicted with a non standard reticle while its proper one is inaccurately used on the game's depiction of the 1PN58 scope. The colors used with its fictional thermal mode appear to be based on the thermal mode of the biomasks from the ''Predator'' franchise.

=== 1PN58 ===
The 1PN58 scope appears as the "Noch Sova Thermal". In reality, the 1PN58 is a night vision device that doesn't have thermal capabilities and as such can't work during day time. It is depicted with the fine crosshair reticle of the AN/PVS-4 instead of its proper one and the colors used with its fictional thermal mode appear to be based on the thermal mode of the biomasks from the ''Predator'' franchise.

== Muzzle devices ==
=== "Agency Choke" ===
The "Agency Choke" ("Agency Whisper Choke" previously) is based on the SilencerCo Salvo 12 shotgun suppressor. Its depiction in the 1980s is anachronistic as it was introduced in 2014.

=== "Sound Suppressor" ===
The "Sound Suppressor" is based on the A-Tec A12 shotgun suppressor. It is anachronistic as the aforementioned SilencerCo Salvo 12 introduced in 2014 is the first dedicated shotgun suppressor and the A12 was likely introduced after that.

=== Sionics Two-Stage Sound Suppressor ===
The Sionics Two-Stage Sound Suppressor appears as the "Agency Suppressor". Strangely, it can't be attached to the MAC 10 but is attachable to rifles which is dubious to work in reality.

=== PBS-4 ===
The PBS-4 appears as the "GRU Suppressor" ("Agency Silencer" previously) for Eastern bloc weapons and the FARA 83.

=== PBS-1 ===
The PBS-1 appears as the "Suppressor" ("Silencer" previously) for Eastern bloc weapons and the FARA 83.

=== .45 ACP Knight's Armament Suppressor ===
The .45 ACP Knight's Armament Suppressor appears as the "Agency Suppressor" for handguns.

=== Wilson Combat Multi-Comp Bushing Compensator ===
The Wilson Combat Multi-Comp Bushing Compensator appears as the "Muzzle Brake .45 APC" for the M1911. It is anachronistic as it was introduced at some point in the late 2000s.

=== "Flashguard 5.56" ===
The "Flashguard 5.56" used on western assault rifles is based on the old M16 3 prong flash hider but it's incorrectly depicted with 4 prongs.

== Foregrips ==
=== A1 Pistol Grip ===
A slightly modified A1 pistol grip is featured as the "SFOD Speedgrip" ("MI6 Ergonomic Grip" in the alpha) for Western weapons and the "Spetsnaz Speedgrip" for the FARA 83. Using A1 grips as foregrips was actually something done by the MACV-SOG during the Vietnam War so this can be considered the only foregrip that is period appropriate in the whole game.

=== XM148 grenade launcher grip ===
An [[XM148 grenade launcher]] grip appears as the "Infiltrator Grip" (known as "Marshal Foregrip" in the alpha) and "Red Cell Foregrip" for western weaponry.

=== BS-1 grenade launcher grip ===
A [[BS-1 grenade launcher]] grip appears as the "Infiltrator Grip" (known as "Marshal Foregrip" in the alpha) and "Red Cell Foregrip" for eastern bloc weaponry.

=== "Front Grip" ===
The "Front Grip" is essentially a chopped AIM grip.

=== "Patrol Grip" ===
The "Patrol Grip" used on western weapons is a modified FN Minimi style grip.

The "Patrol Grip" used on eastern bloc weapons is an AKM-63 foregrip.

=== "Foregrip" ===
The "Foregrip" appears to be inspired by the aluminum Kley Zion or LMT grip.

=== "Field Agent Grip" ===
The "Field Agent Grip" used on western weapons is an FN FAL grip.

=== Knight's Armament Vertical Grip ===
A stylized Knight's Armament vertical grip appears as the "Field Agent Grip" and "Foregrip" for the QBZ.

=== "Bruiser Grip" ===
The "Bruiser Grip" resembles Delrin Vertical Grip but depicted smaller as a stubby style grip.

== Magazines ==
=== SureFire MAG5-60 ===
The SureFire MAG5-60 appears as the "STANAG 50 Rnd" and "STANAG 54 Rnd" magazines for the western assault rifles and the M16A2 respectively. Presumably due to gameplay balancing, instead of the proper 60 rounds they hold only 50 and 54 respectively. The SureFire MAG5-60 is anachronistic for the 1980s as it was introduced in 2010 and the concept of a quad stack STANAG magazine didn't exist back then.

=== Airsoft 850 round FAT magazine ===
A fictional magazine which is essentially a standard STANAG modified into airsoft 850 round FAT magazine appears as the "40 Rnd" magazine for western assault rifles. This is technically anachronistic as the concept of a quad stack STANAG magazine didn't exist back then.

=== 7.62x39mm steel 40 round magazine ===
A 7.62x39mm steel 40 round magazine appears as the "40 Rnd" magazine for the AK-47. It is notably one of the few extended magazine attachments in the game to hold correct amount of rounds.

=== 7.62x39mm Drum (converted) ===
A [http://forum.militaryparitet.com/viewtopic.php?id=27940 7.62x39mm drum magazine converted to accept 5.45x39mm] ammunition is used as the "40 Rd Drum" and "STANAG 50 Rd Drum" magazine attachments for the AKS-74U. In reality these drums typically hold 75 rounds while the game's attachments incorrectly have only 40 and 50 rounds respectively, presumably for gameplay balance. The conversion of 7.62x39mm drums to 5.45x39mm can be considered to be anachronistic as this appears to be a modern practice done by civilian vendors and gunsmiths.

=== Gurttrommel 34 ===
A stylized, backwards facing ''Gurttrommel 34'' is used as the "40 Rd Drum" magazine attachment for the QBZ rifle, including a magazine column and a feed system as the actual drum is just a belt container. It still has the latch for locking into German MG belt feed trays.

[[File:BOCW QBZ drum.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The attachment's description further implies it is a ''helical'' magazine...]]

=== RPD Drum (modified) ===
The QBZ's "STANAG 50 Rd Drum" appears to be a fictionalized and shrunken RPD drum magazine.

=== MPA22-T Magazine ===
The MAC 10's "43 Rnd Speed Mag" and "Salvo 53 Rnd Fast Mag" appear to be based on the Masterpiece Arms MPA22T pistol. This is anachronistic as the MPA22T was only prototyped in January 2010.

=== Suomi Magazine (converted) ===
A 9x19mm 72-round Suomi drum magazine converted to be used with Uzi appears as the drum magazine attachments for the Socimi and MAC-10. Presumably due to gameplay balancing, instead of the proper 72 rounds they hold 45 or 55 for the Socimi and 43 or 53 for the MAC-10. In reality, these conversions are made by Vector Arms and C&S Metall Werkes using preban (1994) Suomi drums which means that they are most likely anachronistic for the game.

=== Magpul 7.62/.308 10 round Gen 3 PMAG ===
A Magpul .308 Gen 3 PMAG is available as the "STANAG 9" magazine for the LW3 "Tundra". The "Salvo 9 Rnd Fast Mag" is also the same model but somewhat shortened. It is heavily anachronistic.

=== X-Products 9mm 50 round drum ===
An [https://www.tactical-life.com/gear/x-products-mp5-drum-mag/ X-Products 9mm 50 round drum] is available as the "STANAG 50 Rnd Drum" magazine for the MP5. The "40 Rnd Drum" is also the same model but with its front part being hybridized with a Beta-C magazine. It is heavily anachronistic as it was introduced in 2014.

== Barrels ==
=== TEC-9 barrel & shroud ===
A TEC-9 style barrel and shroud are used as the "Cavalry Lancer" and "Paratrooper" barrel attachments for western SMGs.

=== Fluted AR barrel ===
Custom AR pattern fluted barrels appear as the "Cavalry Lancer" and "Strike Team" barrel attachments for western rifles. This is most likely anachronistic as fluted AR barrels appear to be a modern thing.

=== AK "Swiss Grater" Upper Handguard ===
What is known as "Swiss Grater" Upper Handguard for AK weapons appears as "Cavalry Lancer" and "Paratrooper" barrel attachments for the AK-74u. Similar devices can also be installed on the Remington and Arctic Warfare as the "Ultralight", "Tiger Team" and "Hammer Forged" barrel attachments.

=== MAC-10 barrel extension ===
A MAC-10 barrel extension is used as the "Takedown" barrel attachment for western SMGs.

=== M249 heat shield ===
An M249 machine gun heat shield can be installed on the Remington and Arctic Warfare as the "Cavalry Lancer", "Reinforced Heavy" and "Rapid Fire" barrel attachments. It is depicted with incorrect number of vent holes when used on the Remington but it is correct when used on the Arctic Warfare. It's appearance is slightly anachronistic as it was introduced after 1985.

== Laser Sights & Flashlights==
=== Generic Laser Sight ===
The "Steady Aim Laser" and "SWAT 5mw Laser Sight" used on eastern bloc weapons appear to be a fictional and generic design loosely based on modern laser pointers with adjustment knobs. Such a compact and practical laser design is anachronistic for the setting, as the earliest laser sights of this kind were 90s laser sights such as the SureFire L70 or L75, which were introduced in 1990 and 1991 respectively.

=== AN/PAQ 4C Laser Sight ===
The "Steady Aim Laser" used on western weapons is loosely based on the Insight Technology AN/PAQ 4C laser sight. It is anachronistic as it was produced in 1993-1999.

=== "SWAT 5mw Laser Sight" ===
The "SWAT 5mw Laser Sight" used on western weapons is loosely based on the Steiner DBAL and the Steiner Offset Tactical Aiming Laser, which is heavily anachronistic.

=== Maglite Flashlight ===
A small Maglite C-cell flashlight appears as the "Mounted Flashlight". The C-cell Maglite itself is period appropriate as it was introduced in 1981, however, it is mounted via a SureFire barrel clamp. A SureFire flashlight being mounted to the barrel was a configuration which was actually utilized in the 90s for example by Delta operators during the Battle of Mogadishu in 1993.

=== Revolver laser sights ===
The various laser sights for the "Magnum" revolver appear to be inspired by the LaserLyte and LaserMax side mounted lasers for revolvers. This is anachronistic as neither the technology nor the concept for such compact side mounted revolver lasers existed back in the 80s.

=== Imatronic LS45 laser sight ===
The "Ember Sighting Point" is based on the Imatronic LS45 laser sight but is depicted as being somewhat smaller than in reality.

== Stocks ==
=== "SAS Combat Stock" ===
The "SAS Combat Stock" for the MAC-10 is based on the stocks of Masterpiece Arms MAC-10 style carbines and Leinad Cobray CM-11/TM-11.

=== ACE Skeleton Entry Stock ===
The ACE Skeleton Entry Stock appears as the "Duster Stock" for the XM177E1 and M16A2. Most likely anachronistic.

=== AR-15 Wire Stock ===
The M231 firing port weapon wire collapsible stock appears as the "Wire Stock" for the XM177E1 and M16A2. It is depicted as being non-collapsible in game.
[[Image:Stock M231.jpg|thumb|none|400px|An M231 firing port weapon wire collapsible stock.]]

=== AK Wire Stock ===
An East German/Romanian style AK wire stock appears as the "Wire Stock" for the AK-47, Ak 5 and the AKS-74U. It has a cheek riser when used on the AK-47 and Ak 5.

=== Custom M60 Wood Stock ===
A wood stock based on the [https://www.reddit.com/r/airsoft/comments/4p98l8/wanted_wood_furniture_for_my_m60_so_i_made_it/ custom M60 oak wood stock made by reddit user Automobilie] appears as the "Tactical Stock" and "SAS Combat Stock" for the M60.

= Live Action Trailers =
== "Teaser" Trailer ==
===Thompson SMG===
Carried by a US soldier deploying from a chopper in Vietnam.
===M1 Garand===
===M1 Carbine???===
===M14===
===Unidentified US Rifle===
An unknown rifle carried by US troops during anti Vietnam War protests. Possibly Springfield M1903?
===Unidentified Russian Rifle===
Unknown rifles are being paraded by Soviet troops. Possibly Mosin Nagants or some of the Soviet semi auto rifles?
===M1 flamethrower===
Used by a US soldier probably in Vietnam.

= Discussion =

== Weapons I Saw ==

I saw the AK47, or I not so sure if it's an AKM or Type 56. Then I saw an RPD LMG, a FN FNC battle rifle, XM177E2 with a flattop, although to be fair, flattop was around in the 80's. Then I saw a Colt 1911A1, a Remington 700 sniper rifle, and a AKS-74U Carbine. I'm not sure if the M16 appears to be a M16A1 or XM16E1. This "Commando" however does have a forward assist, but it has a A1 pistol grip, making this gun not the Colt 733.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 15:13, 26 August 2020 (EDT)
:The AK looks like an AKM, I think. The XM177 appears to be based on the Commando from the first Black Ops, but we'll see. Also, nice work getting on this page so quick! I was ready to start it later tonight, you beat me to it. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 15:29, 26 August 2020 (EDT)
::For clarification, I'm the one who started the page, not the guy above :P Anyway, the AK is actually an AK-47 (but with an AKM's slant compensator); note the gas block and the front sight, and the milled receiver is also seen in the trailer, though the specific shot is flipped. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 15:41, 26 August 2020 (EDT)

:As for the "SOCIMI Type 821", that looks like MW's Uzi without the stock. I think a lot of the guns are supposed to be shared between these two games, judging by the Warzone integration and other cross-era guns like the AK-47, M1911, SKS ect.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 16:11, 26 August 2020 (EDT)
::Naw, the rear sight's position and the folding stock mechanism below it indicate that it's a SOCIMI. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 16:33, 26 August 2020 (EDT)
:::I see now, though it still looks a bit Uzi-like. Maybe it is new attachments/furniture; I guess time will tell. --[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:32, 26 August 2020 (EDT)
::::I'm replacing the screencaps by 4K ones; the relevant image now shows more details about the SOCIMI. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 13:43, 27 August 2020 (EDT)

A couple leaked images I found from the game's Reddit page (may not reflect content in final version or even open beta/pre-alpha/etc.):

Multiplayer screen showing a customized LMG: https://preview.redd.it/yap84l0silj51.jpg?width=2208&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=08e974eb33d15ceec5988ed578cd913930ee053f

Campaign screen showing an M16 (called M16A1): https://preview.redd.it/a8gvpo0silj51.jpg?width=2208&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=09a14d017bef3e5e54ba18c69e13a90ec22e076e

In addition, from what I've heard from a few content creators on YouTube who managed to see some campaign gameplay footage, other appearing weapons include an MP5, G3 (known as Krieg-6), Type 63 assault rifle, SPAS-12, the China Lake grenade launcher, and a recurve bow or crossbow. As said earlier, these may not necessarily be in the final game, so take them with a grain of salt.
--[[User:MJ79|MJ79]] ([[User talk:MJ79|talk]]) 09:08, 28 August 2020 (EDT)
: A type Type 63 would be an interesting addition. Was it mentioned specifically as a Type 63 or could it be someone confusing it with an SKS with a 30 round detachable magazine? --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 09:22, 28 August 2020 (EDT)
: I can't exactly tell; it said "Type 63" in a list of leaked stuff somewhere, but there's nothing visual to confirm this yet. It's all speculation. --[[User:MJ79|MJ79]] ([[User talk:MJ79|talk]]) 09:34, 28 August 2020 (EDT)

== Finally ==

Well, took them long enough. After all the super secret projector puzzles and Warzone scavenger hunts. Look pretty cool, though. I love the 1980s Cold War, it was a pretty aesthetic time for weapons and military hardware.

So, what's on everyone's wishlists? Because I'm weird, I went and [https://docs.google.com/document/d/10Pq9qxz1gL8aJj5ckvSpUClZ3lbruD4e53HjJziTQ8M/edit?usp=sharing made my dream weapons list] shortly after speculation about this game's existence started. I'm just hoping for period-appropriate weapons that actually make sense for the setting; I thought ''Modern Warfare'' was pretty good with that. Like, can we finally have a standard AK-74? Please? --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 16:04, 26 August 2020 (EDT)

:Wouldn't mind seeing the Czech Vz. 58, that rifle is really underrepresented in games and would fit in well in this setting. I did notice the shorty AK that is shown being suppressed in the trailer has a correct AKS-74U rear sight, which hopefully is retroactively made a usable variant in ''MW''.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:47, 26 August 2020 (EDT)
::Looks like a properly sized AKS-74u barrel instead of the weirdo short barrel from MW2019 too, which is nice. I'm disappointed they went and made a faux Huey though, and the Tomcat also has some issues like vertical stabilizers having too much cant and intake scoops not being slanted forward enough. Also, the infamous backwards Troy BUIS from BLOPS1 makes a return, albeit actually facing the correct direction.--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 01:24, 27 August 2020 (EDT)
:::I would expect such guns as vz. 61 and vz. 23, and perhaps Stechkin APB. And may be could see the MTs 21-12 autoloader as an Easter egg. But wait, we have the "first results in google pictures" guys, so what am I talking about. --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 19:45, 29 August 2020 (EDT)
That's too realistic and accurate selection. If it is a true Black Ops game, then it should contain exotic, anachronistic and unheard of weapons. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 18:56, 26 August 2020 (EDT)
[[File:M4 Carbine First Model (1984).jpg|thumb|none|450px|January 1984 - XM4 Carbine]]
My wish list to have the XM4 Carbine (Colt 720), but it should be more like a gunsmith attachment for the XM177E1. The gun was first made in 1983 by the US Army as a customize XM177E2 with a A1 flash hider and fires M16A2 rounds. Later in January 1984, the 14.5 inch barrel and a A2 pistol grip was add it to the gun referring to as the XM4 Carbine.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 18:21, 27 August 2020 (EDT)

Inb4 they bring back hyper-anachronistic guns like the L96A1 and the infamous FELIN version of the FAMAS again just to troll us. Anyways, I hope they brought back the "Death Machine" handheld minigun, "Grim Reaper" M202 rocket launcher and the underbarrel "Masterkey" shotgun and flamethrower attachments from the original Blops. --[[User:MJ79|MJ79]] ([[User talk:MJ79|talk]]) 09:08, 28 August 2020 (EDT)

Hope, they learned the lesson and did the research this time. Maybe this was the original Black Ops plot before was scapped? (Which explained guns anhachronism). Hope that will be possible to fight both NVAs, the Vietnam one and the German one. The perfect weapons for them would be FB PM63 and SKS. For the Ossies, hope for a MPi-K74 configuration (which already used by Farah in MW2019). The hype and expectation after huge after MW...--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 03:26, 8 September 2020 (EDT)

== Steiner CQT ==
I don't think the reflex sight on the Stoner is a Steiner CQT, the housing for the lens goes all the forward, there's an elevation knob on the left side and a windage knob at the rear.--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 02:04, 27 August 2020 (EDT)

:This is the closest match I found. Also I believe they are going the same "modern warfare stylization" route and therefore changing some of the details. Another thing that makes me pretty convinced that they used the Steiner CQT as reference is the fact that I simply googled "Cold War holographic sight" and it popped up. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 10:35, 27 August 2020 (EDT)

==XM177 promotional image==
Just linking this high quality image, for reference's sake: [http://www.gamereactor.eu/media/51/callduty_3245163b.png]. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 11:24, 27 August 2020 (EDT)
:Rick Zeng told me the real reason why they add a flat top and a combination of an XM177 hider and an A1 flash hider is because of legal reasons. You also have to keep in mind that flattop was actually done in the 80s by Olympic Arms, even though back in E3 for Black Ops I, the Commando appears to have a MIL-STD-1913 Picatinny rail, that was introduced in 1993 when Colt developed the M4A1.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 14:05, 27 August 2020 (EDT)
::I think they should definitely drop this whole "change it so they don't sue us" attitude considering they won the humvee lawsuit. As for the chopping of the carry handle, unlike in BO1, this time it is not so anachronistic, however, considering that the campaign is set in 1981 and the practice of using chopped ARs by the actual military, as far as I have read, became a thing in the early 2000s most likely during the invasion of Iraq, then it might be considered anachronistic. As for the rail, it appears that both in the OG BO1 and this new one, it is based on something like the [[Predator_2#Magnum_Research_Inc._Mark_VII_Desert_Eagle|rail seen on the Predator 2 Deagle]], which I cannot find any info about after many hours of research, I'd wager it is some kind of 80s proto picatinny/weaver rail? --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 14:20, 27 August 2020 (EDT)
:Isn't this rifle closer to a 933 [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:Colt_m4_commando_03.jpg] than an XM177? [[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]])
::No, it isn't. The in-game gun has a shorter 10" barrel, an earlier A1 forward assist, and no case deflector. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 17:22, 28 August 2020 (EDT)

Is it so hard for them to make period accurate weapons? They are so fixated in giving the players the capability to add optics that it doesn't even make sense. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 01:18, 29 August 2020 (EDT)
:Even then, it's not like you can't mount optics to a carry-handled AR or anything; hell, I'd wager that it even looks cooler that way. I'm just holding out hope that the XM16E1 can mount optics without hacksawing the carry handle, but that hope isn't high. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 08:16, 29 August 2020 (EDT)
::The carrying handles were designed to mount optics. Special Forces were the first to do it. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 21:22, 29 August 2020 (EDT)
:To be fair, optics attached directly onto the carry handle kinda take a lot of space on the screen and thus it is not quite practical from gameplay perspective. Also, it is clear that after MW2 they adopted kind of a "let's insert modernism and tacticoolism into everything" attitude which is clearly evident in all the anachronistic and tacticool stuff added to BO1 and now this one. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 09:58, 31 August 2020 (EDT)
::Eh, I don't think they take up enough space to really cause problems (not to mention that that'd be a neat balancing feature). But more to the point, it's not like they haven't had optics on carrying handles before (e.g. the FAMAS, the QBZ and USAS in ''MW3'', etc.). I just hope that they've learned from their mistakes. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 15:35, 31 August 2020 (EDT)
:::The basic FAMAS in ''MW''2019 is held lower when scopes are equipped. This thing's upper would also be neat to see as well, rather than a modern-looking flat top.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:04, 31 August 2020 (EDT)[[File:model 656.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Colt Model 656 M16A1 Special Low Profile fitted with scope and 20-round magazine - 5.56x45mm NATO]]

== Military ARs or civilian? ==

Does the semi-auto only selector markings on the "XM177E1" mean that it was actually modeled after some civilian version? Also I think the faux XM16E1 might be based on the same M16A1 "Retro Reissue" from BO3/4. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 09:52, 31 August 2020 (EDT)
:We'll see about that. Maybe they will make some changes in final game, you never know. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 10:13, 1 September 2020 (EDT)

== More Weapons! ==
[[File:BOCW Weapons Wall.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 13:51, 1 September 2020 (EDT)
I see the M16A2, finally!!! The AK47, a shotgun which I believe is either the Stevens Model 77E or the Winchester Model 1200 (I hope).--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 14:05, 1 September 2020 (EDT)
:I'm blind, I look closely and it looks like a bolt-action rifle. Possibly the Remington 700.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 14:26, 1 September 2020 (EDT)
::There's also a Beretta 93R on the gun wall. Also nice to see that the M16A2 gets a nice carry handle optic mount instead of lazily slapping a flat top upper on it like the Commando--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 14:41, 1 September 2020 (EDT)

== CAR-15 Variants ==

Now the only reason why I'm doing this is because I have have a feeling that they are going to add some stuffs for the Commando, and possibly the M16A2 soon as gunsmith attachments, so I want to make sure you guys got the whole CAR-15 variants right.

M16A1 Carbine - They are 4 types of M16A1. The first two models are the Colt 651 and 652. These guns have an M16 fix stock rather then a XM177 stock, and it has a 16.5 inch barrel. It was mad in 1971, and later around the early 70s, Colt made the 653 and 654, which have a XM177 stock. Now remember, these guns could have a 14.5 inch barrel, and they have an A1 pistol grip.
[[File:ColtM653Carbine.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt 653]]

XM4 Carbine - Now, if you know me, you know that I love the M4 sense I first know about guns, but I'm not going to be like back then and name every single AR-15 carbine the M4. The XM4 was first made in 1983 from the US Army as a XM177E2 with an A1 flash hider and it fires M16A2 rounds. In January 1984, the gun have a 14.5 inch barrel and a A2 pistol grip. Later in 1985, the USMC tested the XM4, and in 1986, they add the M16A2 receiver to keep it as a modern designed, consider that they are a huge fan of the M16A2 rifle. In May 1986, Colt made a new M4 barrel and a new M4 handguard, and test results were not really good at the time. Colt ignore the XM4 until 1990, when Bushmaster joined the XM4 Program. In 1991, the gun was renamed the M4 Carbine, and in 1993, the gun have a flattop and it fires full-auto making it the M4A1. So basically the M4 is a modern version of the XM177E2. There are a lot of mythical stories about the XM4.
[[File:M4 Carbine First Model (1984).jpg|thumb|none|450px|January 1984 - XM4 Carbine]]

M16A2 Carbine - Also known as the Colt 723, this weapon was made around 1985, but it didn't appear in service until 1987. Here's some myths that people are saying. The Colt 723 came from the XM177E2, which is not true. It actually came from the M16A1 Carbine. This weapon was very popular of the Delta forces, and it was used in the Invasion of Panama. A short version called the Colt 733 also consider to be a M16A2 carbine.
[[File:Colt-M-16-A-2-m723.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt 723]]

M16A2 Government Carbine - Also known as the Colt 727. Okay, first of, the Colt 727 is not the father of the M4 or M4A1. The XM4 is even older than the Colt 727, because this gun was made in 1988, 4 years after the XM4 was made. I don't get why people are saying the Colt 727 is the father of the XM4! It's not! it's a improve variant of the Colt 723. Now then, mini rant out of the way, it does looks similar to the XM4, but here's the different. It fires full-automatic. The XM4 fires three-round burst. This could be not historically accurate, consider that the game take place in the early 80s.
[[File:Coltm727ima.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt 727]]

So there you go, the CAR-15 variants. Now you know about these weapons, and now you know how can we describe these guns. Like I said, I'm only doing this because of gunsmith attachments refence, so I hope you guys get all of these and understand what we going to see for this year's Call of Duty.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 13:58, 2 September 2020 (EDT)

:For more AR variants we also have the [[Colt AR-15 Identification Guide]]. As for why people talk about the 727 leading to the M4, I think this is sort of true as I believe that the first AR variant that introduced the "M4" profile barrel was actually the 727. Before that the XM4 prototypes had either a straight barrel, or a stepped barrel that was thicker at the front but still narrow in front of the front sight. Also, part of this lore about the 727 probably comes from the fact that at its inception the XM4 was intended as a rear echelon weapon not intended for front line combat troops, but a lot of special forces used the 723 and 727 and got a lot of utility from it so when the M4 was finalised it was as a front line combat weapon. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 13:55, 10 September 2020 (EDT)

==Leaked Multiplayer Alpha Footage==
From the official Reddit: https://www.reddit.com/r/blackopscoldwar/comments/imaxuo/full_6_minute_gameplay_of_cold_war/

From the given footage shown there’s the AKS-74U (as “AK-74U”), the M16A2 (as “M16”), the MP5A2 (as “MP5”), the CAR-15 (as the “XM4” with flat-top receiver wrapped in slings like the Commando from BO1), the Stoner 63 and the SPAS-12 (as “Gallo 12”). In-game names aren’t necessarily final and may change in the final game like in COD:WWII and MW (2019). --[[User:MJ79|MJ79]] ([[User talk:MJ79|talk]]) 01:28, 5 September 2020 (EDT)
:I'm actually pretty excited, proper AKS-74u barrel/handguard/sight, jungle mags, the gun audio seems nice and punchy, and the animations don't seem too bad either. Foregrip on that CAR-15 looks like a BCM Gunfighter vertical grip though, which is about 30 years too early, lol.--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 04:22, 5 September 2020 (EDT)
::It looks alright for an early leak, though I have little doubt that it'll be getting more polish before it gets released. Also, for those who actually have social media, would you mind spamming IW to please put an "S" in "AKS-74U"? I know it's a minor thing and all, but still... gives me conniptions. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 11:41, 5 September 2020 (EDT)
:::In this case it's Treyarch, although IW were the first ones guilty of that with their weird airsoft shorty AK. But no matter how many times people tell them such things, I doubt the devs will care. It would also be appreciated if they learn to properly capitalize the "U". --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 07:19, 9 September 2020 (EDT)

== One thing that I’m considering about ==

There’s a attachment for the M16A2, and it showcases a 14.5 inch barrel with an Colt 607 handguard. It is that an AR-15 type variant or maybe an weird bizarre XM4 (1986 model) with an Colt 607 handguard, or it a some type of Colt Government AR-15 weapon, but considering that it has a 14.5 inch barrel, it’s not right.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 09:51, 10 September 2020 (EDT)
:If it has a 607 handguard but is not a 607 or 607A it is made up, pretty sure that handguard is unique to those models. Do you have a link to a picture of it? --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 13:51, 10 September 2020 (EDT)
::[[File:BOCW M16.jpeg|thumb|none|600px]]
That’s all I have, but I do have a screenshot on my phone, but it’s not jpg.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 14:47, 10 September 2020 (EDT)
:That isn't a "real" 607 handguard, to me it looks like they just cut the front half off of an M16A1 model to make something carbine-ish. Firstly, this has 5 vent holes whereas a 607 has 6. Secondly, a real 607 handguard has a new collar piece at the rear as they were made from cut down A1 handguards so they needed to give them a new back end, but the pictured handguard just looks like the rear of a factory A1 handguard. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 13:43, 11 September 2020 (EDT)
:: I had to say for now that this is a XM4 with a A1 handguard, but then we need to see the full game or at least the beta to see if the gun is going to equip with an attachment that is a CAR-15 telescopic but stock, or else this gun will be a bizarre XM4 Carbine. The gun have a 14.5 inch barrel and it’s a three round burst.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 17:06, 11 September 2020 (EDT)
:::[https://youtu.be/imhvfSylDQ8?t=189 Here] you can get a better look at the pseudo carbine handguard. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 22:02, 11 September 2020 (EDT)

It's like the developers for these games don't understand the time period. I want to use something that looks like Larry Vicker's Delta Carbine, not this bullshit [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 12:32, 12 September 2020 (EDT)

=="would've been a better choice"==
I'm just gonna say this out loud right here: I don't think these "better alternatives" information are necessary. The page should document why a gun is inapprorpiate within the game' setting, but it has no need to try to offer "possible solutions" to "rectify" these errors. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 08:57, 18 September 2020 (EDT)
:I concur with this sentiment. As much as it is "neat" to see what could've been used instead of what they did, it's clear they don't know nor care. More than likely this game is going to go Modern Warfare's route of using Franken-guns to make sure they DO NOT get sued. Even though they won that court case, I doubt Activision is in the mood to repeat history on something like that again. Just bite the bullet and deal with the anachronisms and Franken-guns and move on. [[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]] 10:38, 18 September 2020 (EST)
::Eh, I always thought that it was neat as information/trivia, but if the court of public opinion says no, then I won't start a fight over it. Better to keep the peace in situations like this. (Even if I still firmly believe that the M2 Carbine is an assault rifle...) [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 15:03, 18 September 2020 (EDT)
:::Well, if the M2 Carbine thing hasn't been settled yet, I suggest that you directly message an admin (such as commando552) and ask their opinion about it :P --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 16:13, 18 September 2020 (EDT)
::::I have moved the discussion about the M2 being an assault rifle to the [[Talk:M1_Carbine#Is_the_M2_Carbine_an_assault_rifle.3F|M1 carbine discussion page]] as it is no longer relevant to this page and can be continued over there. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 07:04, 20 September 2020 (EDT)

== Black ops get advanced weapons excuse ==

I've seen too many commons overestimating or believing in the myth that military technology is always 10 years ahead of what they adopt or because these guys are some for of ultra secret black ops, they'd get advanced weapons not available at the time. It annoys me [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 20:10, 26 September 2020 (EDT)

:We all know that this is just an excuse to add fancy weaponry and stuff to the games. It is obvious that even the most tacticoolest spec ops units cannot get ''weapons that haven't been created yet''. It's just that the "vintage" Black Ops games always come after some COD game that introduced something groundbreaking in terms of weapon customization, so naturally the BO game has to follow suit. Think about it, BO1 came after MW2 which introduced a great variety of attachments, this essentially made it impossible for them to shy away from the red dots and fancy weapons and in turn effectively turning the rather bland 60s setting into a modern and tacticoolized reimagining of the 60s. Now after MW19, BO Cold War is going through the same process of tacticoolizing the 80s in order to be able to compete with the gunsmith of the previous game. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 20:31, 26 September 2020 (EDT)

::They really haven't clarified how Warzone is going to work between the two games in a non-confusing way, but given apparently it's supposed to be staying on the MW19 engine with its mechanics/etc (Yay!), I'm ''hoping'' this means we'll be getting MW19 versions of CW guns, as in with IW's drastically superior modelling/animation/sounds/etc. I ''reaaaaally'' want the FNC / Ak 5 and Arctic Warfare in MW19. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 20:40, 26 September 2020 (EDT)

==KSP-45 = Carl Gustav M/45?==
The name are similar, they are both Swedish, and the appearance is similar... maybe the M/45 is inspiration but is modified as per CoD habit. Or maybe is hybrid between a UMP and a CG M/45...--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 08:41, 11 October 2020 (EDT)
:I mean, the names are similar, sure, but they look absolutely nothing alike. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 10:58, 11 October 2020 (EDT)
::That's basically what I noted on the page, although "Kpist" is the more accurate designation for a submachinegun. --[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 11:35, 11 October 2020 (EDT)
:::Personally, I think it fits more along the lines of a modified Chiléan FAMAE SAF. When you look at the fixed stock version that’s being exported to Canada, the fact that does have a three round burst fire setting, and it lacking the H&K-style of charging handle like that on the UMP makes me think that it fits more along those lines then that of the UMP. It also fits more in line with the timeframe as well. Upon closer inspection, I think they just switched out the handguard and added different features to it like on the SOCIMI 821 (they modelled the gun with a side mounted charging handle akin to the Uzi Pros).--[[User:Bosoxboy521|Bosoxboy521]] ([[User talk:Bosoxboy521|talk]]) 11:16, 16 October 2020 (EDT)
:The pistol grip reminds of Jatimatic SMG and the stock looks very familiar though I can't recall it right now. Also the handguard and bolt release look like Taurus SMG. BTW here is [https://youtu.be/Ra3-KfmTy58?t=492 some gameplay of the thing]. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 17:58, 17 October 2020 (EDT)

Isn't it is modified MP5/40? --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 10:22, 30 October 2020 (EDT)

Yeah, saw the pic... definite UMP!--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 10:41, 9 November 2020 (EST)

== SWAT 5mw = Steiner DBAL ??? ==

Here is my dissection on why the SWAT 5mw is inspired/based on the Steiner DBAL. As we already know, since MW19 and the whole Humvee thing Activision is trying its best to base its items on real things but modify them so it can make their depiction in the games lawsuit proof. I presume that's why we don't have exact 1:1 depictions in the games. Anyway, here are the clues. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 20:44, 12 October 2020 (EDT)

[[File:BO CW DBAL.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

It appears to me to be based mostly on the Offset Tactical Aiming Laser.[https://sep.yimg.com/ay/alternateforce/steiner-otal-a-green-50mw-15.gif] [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 06:21, 1 November 2020 (EST)

:It appears to be a hybrid between the two, it is added now. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 22:00, 4 November 2020 (EST)

== Marking on the side of QBZ-83 ==

I've read from a comment that the side of the QBZ-83 is marked with "T97NSR-PWC-5.56cal". Is this true? I can't check this myself because I don't have the game, and most of the videos and screenshots I can find are too low quality. The Type 97 NSR is the canadian semi-auto export version of the QBZ-95; if this is true then this most likely means that Treyarch based the whole thing on a Canadian Type 97 NSR. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 07:26, 17 October 2020 (EDT)
: Yes. Note: the handle selection screen is the only one with most zoomed in picture. --[[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 16:20, 17 October 2020 (EDT) [[File:BOCW QBZ-83 Beta.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
:: Hmm. The slot behind the selector switch is also marked with some Chinese characters; from what I can discern, they seem to say "名字叫宫梦想", which is complete gibberish meaning something like "name is called Gong / dream". Not sure what's happening here. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 02:05, 18 October 2020 (EDT)

==Attachment descriptions==
These are probably worth a laugh, or cry: https://imgur.com/gallery/lVJPVUt
--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 14:46, 22 October 2020 (EDT)
:I... I have no words. This is so many levels of embarrassing. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 19:07, 22 October 2020 (EDT)
::Did they try to use an AI to make these damn things? I mean, seriously, it seems like they just played Mad Libs with a bunch of random gun-related terms. I think my personal favorite has to be the "27.2" Recon" barrel for the M700 - aside from clearly not being that long, it somehow both is and is not rifled. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 22:06, 22 October 2020 (EDT) P.S.: Oh, and let's not forget the revolver cylinder that somehow holds 12 rounds despite still having 6 chambers.
:::Yeah, it really, really reads they like had a neural network compose descriptions off of Wikipedia's firearms articles. My favorite is the 1911 Cavalry Lancer, "Anti-''infantry'' barrel increases damage against enemy ''vehicles''."--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 15:04, 23 October 2020 (EDT)
::::I do love the sniper rifle barrel that's smoothbore ''and'' rifled? Must be one of those .366 TKM rifles popular in Russia. The "STANAG 55 Rd Drum" for the Type 821 is pretty interesting, too. It describes having its ammo arranged side-by-side and being a single-stack. Wouldn't the ammo being side-by-side make it double-stack? Oh, but my favorite has to be the "13.7" Ranger" barrel for the XM4. The description states that it somehow cools off bullets and this also somehow makes them go faster.--[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 15:23, 23 October 2020 (EDT)
:::::Heck, even CoD Mobile bothered to model an actual 8-round cylinder for the relevant attachment on the "J358" revolver (not properly lined up with the barrel, but still). Also, "''Anti-infantry barrel increases damage against enemy vehicles''"... WHAT? Did I read that correctly? --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 17:39, 26 October 2020 (EDT)
This makes me almost wanna buy the game just to read those descriptions. Anybody knows of a youtube video or something showing off all attachments?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:46, 19 November 2020 (EST)

== RC-XD is fast enough to catch a plane? ==

Not really a firearm-related question at all, but having rewatched the gameplay footage from the campaign trailer, I can't help ask out of curiosity: is it possible for a tiny remote-controlled car to catch up with a plane during a high-speed chase? I reckon the plane has much greater acceleration even when it's still on the ground, so do the cars. Otherwise, that must be a really powerful tiny engine powering the thing.--[[User:MJ79|MJ79]] ([[User talk:MJ79|talk]]) 09:25, 30 October 2020 (EDT)
:That whole sequence calls to mind the Fast & Furious movie where they had a cargo plane attempting to takeoff down an endless runway while being chased (I think Uncharted 3 has the same phenomenon). Honestly the campaign is not looking good, it seems to be a return to the over-the-top action movie hijinks and explosions when the best-received parts of MW2019 were the slow-paced nightvision room clearing segments.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 14:57, 30 October 2020 (EDT)
::Most likely it's not fast enough. I also think that one won't be able to go on unscathed after being rolled over by a vehicle in the manner shown in that same scene but hey that's COD after all. Also if you don't make over the top and cringy scenes in a game set in the 80s then I don't know when you will :D --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 20:03, 30 October 2020 (EDT)

== Zombies trailer WWII weapons ==

Are these available to use in the Zombies mode? If not then I think they should be added to a "Misc" section or to this page.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 19:58, 13 November 2020 (EST)

==Anachronistic weapons broke my immersion ==

Just started the Vietnam mission and 2 things literally distracted me. The first was the M16 has a 20 round mag but the ammo count is 30 and I picked up an AKS74U...This game is stupid [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 01:51, 15 November 2020 (EST)
:Outside of the (disappointing yet expected) anachronistic weapons and attachments, I thoroughly enjoyed the campaign, thought it was far more ambitious with its gameplay and narrative than MW2019. Only real complaint is the lack of missions, short campaign in general, like MW2019.--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 02:16, 15 November 2020 (EST)
:::East German Stasi using MP5s and the AK5s is annoying. They should be using whatever East German SMGs and MPi-KMS. How hard is that? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 12:18, 15 November 2020 (EST)
::::What about the M1911 everywhere? They could recicle the Makarov. Seriously they should add more sidearm options given the fact that they have a Last Stand mechanic.--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 04:35, 9 December 2020 (EST)

== Mountain Dew ads ==

Should we have a section here for the [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V1Xt9aetdFQ Mountain Dew ads] as they feature guns or just mention them on the main page? This might be cringe but we mentioned things like this for example with BO2's "LG Cinema Trailer". --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 19:21, 20 November 2020 (EST)

== Bullfrog's grip ==
Now here is the Bullfrog grip analysis. Obviously the thing is not a literal 1 to 1 depiction of anything real and is essentially a fictional grip but they had some inspiration when making it and that's why I say "inspired by... based on... influenced by... etc." --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 20:27, 20 December 2020 (EST)

[[File:BOCW bullfrog grip.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

:The grip pattern does look a lot like the Skorpion's so I guess that's worth mentioning, although the overall shape doesn't match the Kiparis enough IMO. --[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 12:23, 2 January 2021 (EST)

== A rare photo of the M16A2 and XM4 ==

So I found something from Rock Island Arsenal Museum, and what do I found is a rare photo of the XM4 Carbine and the M16A2 Rifle.
[[File:XM4 Carbine & M16A2 (1982).jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

Now this photo was made in 1982, before the M16A1E2 was presented by Colt to the US military. The name "M16A2" was from the USMC dates back to the late 70s when they ask Colt to developed a new rifle after their experience in Vietnam. The M16A1E1 was made in December 1981, but it would still be anachronistic as the game takes place before December 1981, let alone the game's M16A2 is the M16A1E2. So the M16A1E2 was made in November 1982, and it introduces the three round burst on this rifle (not the first burst firing M16 as the Colt 605B is the first one made in 1964). The XM4 on the other hand was start to developed as early as 1982, and it start off as the XM177E2 that fires M855 NATO rounds. The XM4 start to developed before the M16A1E2 was made. So why I put this in Black Ops Cold War? Because there an attachment that give the "XM4" a 11.5 inch barrel, and the facts about the M16A2 to know that the game takes place in 1981 and the gun was developed in early as December 1981, even though is slightly anachronistic.--[[User:Treliazz|Treliazz]] ([[User talk:Treliazz|talk]]) 13:36, 24 December 2020 (EST)

== IMFDB Opinions on BOCW's gameplay and assets realism ==

I just can't help but be disgusted by the lame step back in authenticity of BOCW from MW19. Weaponry, Ordnance and Vehicles really feels, looks, sounds trash to me.(exception for the Harrier's MGs which sounds impressively scary)

== The worst thing about Cold War ==

...isn't the extremely anachronistic weapons and attachments, its the fact that I can't access the DLC weapons and all their unlocks in offline custom matches anymore like MW2019! Now I actually have to grind the battlepass to screencap each new gun every season. Total pain in the ass considering how unfun core 6v6 is this year.--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 22:19, 24 January 2021 (EST)
:[https://www.joblo.com/newsimages1/wiw-saving-private-ryan-salute.jpg] - you can still progress the battlepasses in MW, although I realize that having both games installed may be pushing hard drive limits.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 09:50, 25 January 2021 (EST)
::Play Plunder and just go for recons or scavenger contracts to level up your weapons. As for the game, the more free play days we have, the less I actually want to buy the game. I know the game was rushed, so I understand why it lacks the polish and details of MW2019, but it's just not as fun. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 11:12, 25 January 2021 (EST)

Honestly, capping the weapons in Warzone won't do it, and it's actually wrong since they are in the MW19 engine and not BOCW one.I have the Groza and MAC-10 by the way
--[[User:Solarriors|Solarriors]] 04:42 28 January 2021 (GMT+1)
:Warzone weapons XP will carry over to CW. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 14:08, 28 January 2021 (EST)

You can actually access all DLC and attachments in online private/custom matches ---[[User:Solarriors|Solarriors]]
:Doesnt seem to work on my end, tried setting up a custom private match and they're still locked--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 03:47, 25 February 2021 (EST)

== Firebase-Z AK "Wonder Weapon" ==

[https://youtu.be/INmAzI7C9M8?t=78 So this is a thing.] I tried to save an image but for some reason it wouldn't upload, so that'll do.

SO, apart from looking like something Vladof would make, what we have here is...to my best understandng an AK mated with the DG-2. Weird to have a Wonder Weapon we could actually put on the page, if it's eligable. It's got a GP launcher and everything. According to offical sources it's called the RAI K-84, or the Reactorniy Avtomat-Izluchatel Kuhlklay-84 in full.

'''UPDATE:''' Never mind, it's already on the page. My bad.--[[User:Gunmaster2011|Pez-Dispenser]] ([[User talk:Gunmaster2011|talk]]) 10:18, 1 February 2021 (EST)

==Reload timer adjustmnent in patch notes==
Just wanted to pass this on, [https://www.treyarch.com/game-intel/2021/02/Warzone_Season_One_Midseason_Patch_Notes today's patch notes] give the absolute most vague, unspecific note possible about this: "Adjusted the timing of ammo replenishment during empty reloads for BOCW weapons". No idea if this is a good or bad change. :P [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 18:58, 5 February 2021 (EST)
:I'd assume that they're changing the point during the reload animation when the game decides that the gun is finished reloading (since these have had a habit of being rather off in CoD games - the gun often counts as reloaded before your character has finished reloading it). Hopefully, they're making the timing match the animations better. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 21:19, 5 February 2021 (EST)
::That's what I assume too, but I don't have any hands-on experience with the CW weapons, so I have no idea how well they matched (or didn't) before or after the patch. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 14:56, 6 February 2021 (EST)
:::[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSjfSkw5hJM Tested by TheXclusiveAce]. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 04:06, 17 February 2021 (EST)
::::Holy hell, I can't believe Treyarch managed to make the guns EVEN WORSE than they already were. The changes make it so you can skip the rechamber part of the animation on empty reloads now. :| This dev team really needs be kept far away from any future games, this is just embarrassing. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 18:17, 17 February 2021 (EST)
:::::All changes in Warzone are made by Raven Software ([https://www.reddit.com/r/blackopscoldwar/comments/l876an/applying_the_3x_scope_to_the_m82_causes_the/glbfz4y?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3 referenced by u/FoxhoundFPS]). Weapon balancing (including changing reload add time) was probably done by Raven themselves to address CW weapons' long after-reload pauses specific only to Warzone. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 02:13, 18 February 2021 (EST)

== Season 2 Trailer ==

It just dropped, and showed off a few new guns - I spotted what looks like a screwed-up [[Walther MPK]], a probably-fictional crossbow, and (of all things) a [[FARA 83]]. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 19:54, 16 February 2021 (EST)
:Yay more ''Upotte!!'' guns! :D In all seriousness, that would be a neat addition, I love when more obscure things show up in games. Though at this point I'm also sad all these guns aren't getting MW's much better treatment (and that we can't use them there). [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 21:57, 16 February 2021 (EST)
:Nice ID work. Sadly people gonna call it "Galil" anyway. As for speculation about that sawed-off gun in the holster - I think it's just a China Lake blueprint. I mean M79. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 02:50, 17 February 2021 (EST)
::Huh. I thought that thing was a Galil. Maybe it'll end up being a Galil ARM with elements of the FARA 83 thrown in? Because as we've seen so far, this game isn't too big on having guns that are what they say they are. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 16:42, 17 February 2021 (EST)
:::It looks like [http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-KdnsXcQb_Tk/VnaJyrrI1rI/AAAAAAAB3CE/YGD2AfZC4V8/s1600/CampoHerrajecombatejunio1934.jpg this] variant, which has a bipod and FAL Para/Galil type stock, basically a discount ARM. --[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 16:56, 17 February 2021 (EST)

==Questionable captions==
Those two edits ([http://www.imfdb.org/index.php?title=Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops_Cold_War&diff=1400455&oldid=prev 1] - DE and Strife captions, [http://www.imfdb.org/index.php?title=Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops_Cold_War&diff=1400456&oldid=prev 2] - RAI K-84 caption) need to be toned down. [[IMFDB Style Guide#Media titles]] and [[Rules, Standards and Principles#No sarcastic or insulting Commentary]]. --[[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 18:00, 21 February 2021 (EST).
:Those seem perfectly acceptable to me. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 19:02, 21 February 2021 (EST)
::I'm fine with captions describing the contents of images and weapon details. But there's no real need for comments about developers and writers choices for ZM characters. Including such commentary in the main game's wiki page doesn't make this wiki any more "informative" about firearms and sounds more like a point for discussion on talk page or other resources. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 20:29, 21 February 2021 (EST)
:::Comments like those are pretty much par for the course when it comes to VG pages. People've been doing it for a while, so I think it's safe to call it a ''de facto'' acceptable thing to do. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 20:34, 21 February 2021 (EST)
::::I know. Still it can be done more tastefully even for IMFDB with less projecting. Or we could just comment on every frustration and missed opportunity of developers, like saying which weapon would be more era-appropriate on every weapon. I'm not all "anti-sarcasm caption" since there are really good comments people come up with on pages, but they at least assume that not all visitors are in "the know" or familiar with behind-the-scenes of the development. I've come around at the Strife commentary I should say. Operators being absolutely non-characters or related to ZM story is something that I dislike about CW too, but I'm not sure if there's need to over-explain who is holding the weapon in that picture on the gun wiki. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 21:04, 21 February 2021 (EST)
:::::Just to point out, the rule about sarcastic comments doesn't really apply to video games. It was mainly implemented for movie pages, to avoid insulting real actors and filmmakers. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 06:14, 22 February 2021 (EST)
::::::Point is acknowledged, even though those rules could be improved to include VG. Insulting real developers or writers is an issue too, it doesn't need to be downplayed because of different artform or media. As for my gripes about initial edits, I'm no longer pursuing to change that. Just to summarize, I got the clear message from this thread - captions can be used for everything related not only to weapon present in the image, but to include information about who is holding the weapon even if gloves are the only thing we can see from first person and this can be used to include all in-game or out-of-game facts including developer's choice for characters in one mode. In a gun wiki. I can understand the frustration about era-appropriate weapons on gun wiki, but I'm still questioning if not including Richtofen should be used as a starting point of caption for what is essentially "RAI K-84 in idle" image with nothing happening on it. After inspecting it again it seem like that remark was made to pad the caption's word count to be consistent with adjacent images. There's really nothing to call for it in that image too, so that's why it seems very strange among other comments. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 08:41, 22 February 2021 (EST) '''Edit:''' added to be less vague about a point. I'm okay with DE and Strife captions and they seem to follow IMFDB style of captions. "Grumbling at the fact that Primis and Ultimis were replaced by literal nobodies, of which he is one of them, the Requiem Operator in Firebase Z consoles himself by looking at his shiny space AK" is a good comment about BOCW. But I'm not sure if it is a good point to make in a gun wiki for "wonder weapon held by a pair of unique gloves" screenshot without any other information on it and inspecting it with all other weapon captions in the BOCW page seems uncalled for. Or it means it's OK to use any criticism valid for a game no matter the contents of image. As I wrote this, I found this [https://i.redd.it/pqrgt528tpg61.jpg image] (but used with mil-sim operators and equipped with RAI K-84s) would be an ideal fit for that caption and even justified in my opinion. That would be peak IMFDB and not de so detached from the commentary like a current one. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 09:12, 22 February 2021 (EST)
Wait wait wait, let's be clear : What are your complains about exactly?
[[User:Solarriors|Solarriors]] ([[User talk:Solarriors|talk]])

:If your issue is the comments, then you're at least a few years late to that whole discussion on the rules. As stated prior, the rule about sarcastic comments is kept for movies to keep people from throwing their personal opinions at whatever actor they don't like. Games normally don't follow that same rule, and if anything it's mostly done to give the page a form of flow. Reading the same "RAI K-84 in idle", "RAI K-84 firing", "RAI K-84 reloading 1" and so on is brain melting, and allowing an editor to jazz it up a bit with some sarcasm and dry humor is not a bad thing by any metric. The comments fit tonally with almost every other video game page on this site, bar the ones that are so old and forgotten that no one's bothered to edit them in the same style. --[[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]] 18:58, 22 February 2021 (EST)
::Agreed, especially due to the visual repetitiveness inherent to video game pages. For example, the [[Far Cry 2]] page is absolutely hilarious and witty, and very amusing to read even if you've never played the game. I ''do'' think there's a thin, but very important line between "witty" and "snarky" though, and it's definitely best if we all don't cross that and end up with pages that actually sound insulting/harassing, in a demeaning sort of way. But back on the flip side again, the more glaring and facepalm-inducing goofs/oversights are, the more calling those out with a bit of flair feels justified. So yeah, it's all a bit subjective and case-by-case, I guess. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 19:53, 22 February 2021 (EST)

==Official ZRG 20mm footage and LC10's lore==
Treyarch's YouTube channel uploaded [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0krEGBnWEag Season Two Studio Broadcast] detailing all S2 features. Includes gameplay footage of upcoming ZRG 20mm with developer's commentary (at 17:12). Interesting note about LC10: at 15:10 it is stated that "fictionally this is a weapon that was designed by the same manufacturers as the LW3 - Tundra … submachine gun version of that weapon." --[[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 19:14, 26 February 2021 (EST)
:Well, that would explain why it used to be called the "AI LC10" (and why it looks like that) - it's supposed to be made by Accuracy International. I can't help but feel like making a high-quality, precision-oriented SMG during the 1980s would be a rather stupid thing for a company to do (since the Cold War was the heyday of simple, cheap, stamped/tube-receiver subguns), but at least there's reasoning behind it, even if it's not particularly sound. Hell, it's also closer to an AW than the game's actual AW, given the one-piece handguard, stock and trigger guard shapes, and now-totally-redundant magazine well cutout.

:Oh, and they've mirrored the NTW-20. Because... reasons, I guess. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 21:40, 26 February 2021 (EST)
::Funkier weapon designs could probably be their unique way of avoiding licensing and also doing "Cold War is prequel to Black Ops 2 and 3" thing. Like FFAR 1 being an earliest prototype of FFAR from BO3. But, as you point out, it is still interesting how LC10 was modelled with more accurate parts from a gun... which is already available in the game. I was ready for ZRG to be Kraber-AP with side-loading magazine in first-person view at all times as a unique trait, but they subverted that by mirroring the whole model for some reason. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 22:14, 26 February 2021 (EST)

Does anyone feel like the LC10 kinda looks like the Parker Hale IDW prototype? --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 13:06, 27 February 2021 (EST)
:: Oh god, not the NYAAAAAAA. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] ([[User talk:HashiriyaR32|talk]]) 18:42, 27 February 2021 (EST)
:Eh, kinda, but not all that much - the features it has in common with the IDW/PDW aren't exactly unique to it, and I still think it's closer to the MPK in overall proportions. Plus, it lacks some of the features that we'd want if we wanted to cite the IDW as source of inspiration (e.g. the really long magwell). [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 22:21, 27 February 2021 (EST)

== Magnum identification ==

Now, the design doesn't line up one-hundred percent, but I'm pretty sure it was based on a G&G G733 airsoft revolver, the thin fluting in the cylinder, the weird half-full rod housing, and the long body match up to the G&G almost exactly, with the only difference being that the trigger sits ''way'' behind the cylinder in the in-game revolver. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 01:16, 6 March 2021 (EST)

Talk:Ghost in the Shell (1995)

2021-01-14T02:46:09Z

Yocapo32: /* HV Ammo */

==Guns==

I had a good going over of this page; I feel that apart from being severely lacking in information and with several errors, using one page for three films and two TV series occupying two parallel continua was somewhat silly. I've studied the guns from the GITS series in depth; I fully intend to make pages for each film and each series in the future, and populate all of them with far more than I've cropped from here. In the meantime I'm using this to store this paragraph.

In the Stand Alone Complex TV series, Togusa carries a fictional Mateba 2006M, which quite closely resembles the real Mateba Unica-6 autorevolver, a semiautomatic revolver with uses the recoil of firing to revolve the cylinder and cock the hammer. The most visible difference from the Unica-6 is a ventilated rib that the 2006M lacks, although the grip is also different.

Sadly I'm 5500 miles from my DVDs presently so I can't really back this up with screenshots as good as I'd like to, but I'll do what I can. [[User:YourMessageHere|YourMessageHere]] 16:44, 30 March 2009 (UTC)

== Mateba 2006M vs. Mateba 6 Unica ==

Togusa's revolver is modeled after the Mateba 2006M. This is a real gun and it is different from the Mateba 6 Unica Autorevolver. To reload 2006M you swing out the cylinder upwards to the left, just like in the movie. The 6 Unica's cylinder moves downward instead. Also, the top of the Unica's frame is open, which is clearly not the case for Togusa's gun.

Hence Togusa's Mateba/Matever resembles a 2006M and not a 6 Unica.

Youtube video comparing both revolvers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0zxgyim_g4

02:12, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

== Another rant about Togusa's gun ==

The article currently states: "Togusa carries yet another fictionalized version of a real gun, the Mateba 2008M, a spinoff of the 2006M variant of the Mateba model 6 Unica." This is incorrect. The 2006M is not a variant of the 6 Unica, they are very different models. In fact the 2006M was built starting from the early 80s while the 6 Unica became available as recently as the late 90s. The biggest difference between those two guns is that the 6 Unica has a slide and is capable of semi-automatic fire while the 2006M can only be fired as single- or double action.

One thing I'm not sure about is the naming. Does anybody have an official source saying that this particular gun from the movie is supposed to be called 2008? I have seen the artbooks for SAC and they call Togusa's gun from SAC a 2008, but that is a different gun. It would be strange if the creators gave the same number to two different guns. Also there is an airsoft replica which calls itself 2007 and claims to be officially licensed: http://www.marushin-kk.co.jp/itemmateba.html
21:43, 23 May 2010 (UTC)

== The P90 does not field strip like the M22 ==

According to one of the caps, it shows them field stripping an M22 where it swings open forward like an AR-15. The FN P90 that the M22 is based off of does not open forward and tilt on a hinge. The front of of a P90 just comes apart forward from the rest of the body. Here's a vid of a PS90 (The civi P90) being field stripped. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-IhG1o1bz_I [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

== M22 vs. M23 ==

Motoko Kusanagi calls her weapon M23 (you can hear her pronouncing it as "ni-san", meaning "two-three") and it is translated as M-23 in all english subtitles that I have. Why does the article call this weapon M22? 
: バトー「装備は？」
: 草薙「M23とユニットB。」
: Batou: Equipment?
: Kusanagi: M23 and UnittoB
Also: What's a Unit-B?
19:18, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

It's an M22 because the official manual calls it an M22. What the voice actor pronounces is a different matter. I checked, there is no M23 in the Ghost in the shell universe [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

What is this official manual and comprehensive list of all guns in the GitS universe that you are talking about? 22:53, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

I can't read Japanese, but it's written in the official guide to the Ghost in the Shell universe a friend of mine has. In it listed most things like guns in English including numbers. I have read in other sources online that it is called M-23, but most places has M22 written down. A site that makes airsoft shells of anime guns and it is a Japanese site, calls it M22 or the 9Weapon. So, unless we find some way to ask the creator what the official designation, I'm sticking with M22 because it's the most hits on a search engine over M23. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

== HV Ammo ==

While the article featuring the Micro Uzi is correct in asserting that High Velocity ammunition wouldn't foul the gun's bore, '''HV''' stands for '''Hyper-Velocity''' in GITS canon, the next logical step in pushing performance of conventional ballistics. Even so, a gun would disassemble itself long before sliding its firer backwards along the ground due to the party-pooper known more commonly as 'physics'. A clear demonstration of the distinction between High and Hyper-velocity is the effect the rounds have on the armored van Togusa and Kusanagi arrive in, discharging an incredible amount of energy into the body of the vehicle before the explosive charges take effect. Unless, of course, the explosion was a dramatically-delayed, cinematic result of a fuel-tank puncture, which still speaks volumes of the rounds' impossible penetrating power. [[User: AnomylousAnonymous]]

wat? In order for rounds to have more velocity without changing barrel lenghts or without adding a silencer is to make the rounds hotter, in other words more powder. Adding too much can damage the gun, for example the bolt slamming back and forth too fast and damaging the frame, upper reciever, etc.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 13:29, 5 September 2010 (UTC)

^ That sounds like a more compact version of my statement. Not sure what you mean about adding a silencer increasing a round's velocity, though. That's just... wrong. [[User: AnomylousAnonymous]]
::Which is why you don't load fancy schmancy ammo types in older style guns. You're just asking for the gun to blow up in your hands. [[User: Young Gun]]

The Hypervelocity Ammo should be addressed at some point. Unfortunately, it's never shown in the film, but the 9mm HV ammo are actually bottlenecked 9mm cartridges to be fitted with a 4-5mm pointed-tip penetrator round, but use a sabot ring around the projectile, so it can still be fired in a 9mm gun. It's kinda goofy-looking and I don't know if it could work in real life. --[[User:Blitzen|Blitzen]] ([[User talk:Blitzen|talk]]) 07:43, 20 July 2013 (EDT)
:This concept exists in real life, at the very least there have been 12.7mm round with a 7.62 bullet in a sabot, and 7.62x51mm rounds with a 5.56mm in a sabot. I think they were developed in the 80s, but only the 12.7mm was successful with the 7.62mm one having issue (I heard the sabot could break apart in the barrel waking the bullet go crazy and in same cases wrecking the gun). I have a 7.62mm one in my bullet collection, it has a steel case for some reason, might be higher pressure or something. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 14:25, 20 July 2013 (EDT)

It's probably just +P+ ammo with saboted penetrators, probably similar to the SLAP, except on a... I suppose ''bigger'' scale, since 9mm is thicker than 7.62, but you know what I mean. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 21:46, 13 January 2021 (EST)

Talk:Ghost in the Shell (1995)

2021-01-14T02:41:01Z

Yocapo32: /* HV Ammo */

Talk:House of the Dead, The

2020-06-14T17:47:41Z

Yocapo32: /* Official drawing of the AMS EATER */

If this is the only gun in the game, and it doesn't look like ANY real gun, much less a BHP, then I'm not sure this title qualifies. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 09:59, 5 November 2015 (EST)
:I know about this problem. but in the "The House of the Dead Official Guide" page 12, it written as "modified Special Ops Browning Hi-Power". So I wrote independent HOD1 article than integration to HOD2 article. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 04:15, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::A third party article doesn't override the visual evidence. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 08:17, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::Take your cellphone out back and shoot it. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:23, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::I take a picture of these evidence. It's written as Japanese, though.[[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_1.jpg|thumb|none|300px|主人公ローガンの所持する「AMS EATER 改」は、所属のAMSで使用されている銃のフレームを基にカスタマイズされた代物。9mmパラベラムから50AEの大口径にする事で、凄まじいまでの破壊力を実現させた。その代償として、巨大な弾丸を収納するスペースを捻出できず、装弾数はダブルカラムの15発から、わずかシングルカラム6発になっている。セイフティレバーやマガジンキャッチは左右対称のまま使いやすく大型化、ワンオフのカスタムグリップ、内蔵型のハンマーによるストライカーシステムを採用するなど、多岐に渡ってカスタマイズされている。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_2.jpg|thumb|none|300px|一説にはブローニングハイパワーの某特殊部隊仕様を製作したガンスミスの手でチューンアップされたといわれ、命中精度、耐久性、操作性全ての面で優れている。使用する弾丸も通常は「フルメタルジャケット｣と呼ばれる、銅でコーティングした先の尖った物がほとんどだが、対ゾンビ系の生物兵器用として「シルバーチップ」という弾頭自体がひしゃげて破壊力が増すタイプを使用している。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_credits.jpg|thumb|none|300px|]][[Image:Hod_guncontrolloersticker.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Actual arcade version's "EATER" sticker.]] --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 10:26, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::I read carefully this article, '''It look like My identification was WRONG. EATER is actually a heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS.'''Its tuned up by some gunsmith who made Spec ops Browning Hi-Power. '''I'm so sorry about this.''' I'll change the main page description. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 11:37, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::If it's a fake handgun and it's the only weapon in the game, the page doesn't qualify. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 12:04, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::"the page doesn't qualify" hmm... so, if this page are deleted, HOD1 information are will be include to HOD2 article? --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 12:24, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::The same gun appears to be in HOD2, so it looks like it's already included. But if you can't finish HOD2, that will be gone as well. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 18:59, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::Hmm. Can't we stick the four main games onto a single page like what was with Devil May Cry?--[[User:Gunmaster2011|Gunmaster2011]] ([[User talk:Gunmaster2011|talk]]) 13:05, 8 November 2015 (EST)

=Page=
{{Infobox Video Game|{{PAGENAME}}
|name=The House of the Dead
|picture=hod_arcadeflyer.jpg
|caption=''The House of the Dead (1996)''
|series=The House of the Dead
|date=4 March 1997 (Arcade International Release) 31 March 1998 (Sega Saturn) 1998 (PC)
|developer=SEGA AM R&D DEPT#1 (Currently known as SEGA Interactive R&D#1)
|platforms=Arcade Sega Saturn PC
|publisher=SEGA
|genre=Light gun shooter
}}

{{VG Title|The House Of The Dead}}

[[Image:hod_saturnboxart.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''The House of the Dead (1998)'']]

__TOC__ 

=Pistols=

==Fictional Handgun==
AMS agents Thomas Rogan and "G" uses fictional handgun called "AMS EATER Custom" (In the Sega Saturn Magazine, It was incorrectly called "BDR Custom .45 Auto"). 
According from "The House of the Dead Official Guide", It's heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS. with modified to striker fired, change caliber 9×19mm to 50.AE rounds. It's also equipped with enlarged ambidextrous safety lever, magazine release and single-column 6 rounds magazine. 

"EATER" is also planned to appear as game's gun controller, which have air compression recoil system and It's actually uses in Location Test of 1996, 
But plan is later cancelled. because these recoil are possibly damage to player's hands and production cost is much higher then Virtua Cop's gun controller. 
Although final version's gun controller are each have specially made sticker. It written as "EATER 1 ANNEX ARMS JPN "ZMB" special package type -Thomas- model" for 1 player's gun (It written for 2 player's gun as "EATER 2 type -G- model").

[[Image:hod_eater.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Official render and Official illust of "AMS EATER Custom" (Taken from USA Sega Saturn Magazine). Note This article is mentioned above.]]
[[Image:hod_Rogan.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent Thomas Rogan posing with his "AMS EATER Custom 1" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_G.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent "G" aiming with his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterfiring.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Thomas firing his "AMS EATER Custom 1" to locked door in first stage. Note slide is actually moved and discharged cartridge.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterreload.jpg|thumb|none|500px|"G" reloading his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in second stage. Note bullet in the magazines are actually modeled and textured.]]

==Official drawing of the AMS EATER==
I was looking through old articles of SEGA light guns just to kill time, and I found one explaining how the original mechanics of House of The Dead were going to work (originally it was gonna have two screens, one behind the player at all times, proved too costly and bulky to work), and I found a sketch that, according to the article at least, is meant to be a modeller's reference for the pistols.
[[File:Who_the_hell_approved_the_only_jpeg_rules.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Here it is.]]
What I find most interesting is that the porting in the slide goes all the way forward, the USP style rail, and that it was not only going to be 9mm, but also called the BDR Custom instead. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 11:00, 3 June 2020 (EDT)

* I can't get the image to work, here's an Imgur link https://i.imgur.com/EMoA1R8.png --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 11:04, 3 June 2020 (EDT)
::Rather oddly, it says "9mm x 8" (which presumably means that it has a single-stack 8-round magazine), but also says "BDR CUSTOM 45AUTO". So, I'm really not sure if they knew what they were doing. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 11:35, 3 June 2020 (EDT)
:::Probably an early design before the specs were finalized, I'm guessing. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 13:47, 14 June 2020 (EDT)

Talk:House of the Dead, The

2020-06-03T15:04:55Z

Yocapo32: /* Official drawing of the AMS EATER */

If this is the only gun in the game, and it doesn't look like ANY real gun, much less a BHP, then I'm not sure this title qualifies. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 09:59, 5 November 2015 (EST)
:I know about this problem. but in the "The House of the Dead Official Guide" page 12, it written as "modified Special Ops Browning Hi-Power". So I wrote independent HOD1 article than integration to HOD2 article. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 04:15, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::A third party article doesn't override the visual evidence. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 08:17, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::Take your cellphone out back and shoot it. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:23, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::I take a picture of these evidence. It's written as Japanese, though.[[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_1.jpg|thumb|none|300px|主人公ローガンの所持する「AMS EATER 改」は、所属のAMSで使用されている銃のフレームを基にカスタマイズされた代物。9mmパラベラムから50AEの大口径にする事で、凄まじいまでの破壊力を実現させた。その代償として、巨大な弾丸を収納するスペースを捻出できず、装弾数はダブルカラムの15発から、わずかシングルカラム6発になっている。セイフティレバーやマガジンキャッチは左右対称のまま使いやすく大型化、ワンオフのカスタムグリップ、内蔵型のハンマーによるストライカーシステムを採用するなど、多岐に渡ってカスタマイズされている。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_2.jpg|thumb|none|300px|一説にはブローニングハイパワーの某特殊部隊仕様を製作したガンスミスの手でチューンアップされたといわれ、命中精度、耐久性、操作性全ての面で優れている。使用する弾丸も通常は「フルメタルジャケット｣と呼ばれる、銅でコーティングした先の尖った物がほとんどだが、対ゾンビ系の生物兵器用として「シルバーチップ」という弾頭自体がひしゃげて破壊力が増すタイプを使用している。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_credits.jpg|thumb|none|300px|]][[Image:Hod_guncontrolloersticker.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Actual arcade version's "EATER" sticker.]] --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 10:26, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::I read carefully this article, '''It look like My identification was WRONG. EATER is actually a heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS.'''Its tuned up by some gunsmith who made Spec ops Browning Hi-Power. '''I'm so sorry about this.''' I'll change the main page description. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 11:37, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::If it's a fake handgun and it's the only weapon in the game, the page doesn't qualify. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 12:04, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::"the page doesn't qualify" hmm... so, if this page are deleted, HOD1 information are will be include to HOD2 article? --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 12:24, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::The same gun appears to be in HOD2, so it looks like it's already included. But if you can't finish HOD2, that will be gone as well. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 18:59, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::Hmm. Can't we stick the four main games onto a single page like what was with Devil May Cry?--[[User:Gunmaster2011|Gunmaster2011]] ([[User talk:Gunmaster2011|talk]]) 13:05, 8 November 2015 (EST)

=Page=
{{Infobox Video Game|{{PAGENAME}}
|name=The House of the Dead
|picture=hod_arcadeflyer.jpg
|caption=''The House of the Dead (1996)''
|series=The House of the Dead
|date=4 March 1997 (Arcade International Release) 31 March 1998 (Sega Saturn) 1998 (PC)
|developer=SEGA AM R&D DEPT#1 (Currently known as SEGA Interactive R&D#1)
|platforms=Arcade Sega Saturn PC
|publisher=SEGA
|genre=Light gun shooter
}}

{{VG Title|The House Of The Dead}}

[[Image:hod_saturnboxart.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''The House of the Dead (1998)'']]

__TOC__ 

=Pistols=

==Fictional Handgun==
AMS agents Thomas Rogan and "G" uses fictional handgun called "AMS EATER Custom" (In the Sega Saturn Magazine, It was incorrectly called "BDR Custom .45 Auto"). 
According from "The House of the Dead Official Guide", It's heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS. with modified to striker fired, change caliber 9×19mm to 50.AE rounds. It's also equipped with enlarged ambidextrous safety lever, magazine release and single-column 6 rounds magazine. 

"EATER" is also planned to appear as game's gun controller, which have air compression recoil system and It's actually uses in Location Test of 1996, 
But plan is later cancelled. because these recoil are possibly damage to player's hands and production cost is much higher then Virtua Cop's gun controller. 
Although final version's gun controller are each have specially made sticker. It written as "EATER 1 ANNEX ARMS JPN "ZMB" special package type -Thomas- model" for 1 player's gun (It written for 2 player's gun as "EATER 2 type -G- model").

[[Image:hod_eater.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Official render and Official illust of "AMS EATER Custom" (Taken from USA Sega Saturn Magazine). Note This article is mentioned above.]]
[[Image:hod_Rogan.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent Thomas Rogan posing with his "AMS EATER Custom 1" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_G.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent "G" aiming with his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterfiring.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Thomas firing his "AMS EATER Custom 1" to locked door in first stage. Note slide is actually moved and discharged cartridge.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterreload.jpg|thumb|none|500px|"G" reloading his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in second stage. Note bullet in the magazines are actually modeled and textured.]]

== Official drawing of the AMS EATER ==

I was looking through old articles of SEGA light guns just to kill time, and I found one explaining how the original mechanics of House of The Dead were going to work (originally it was gonna have two screens, one behind the player at all times, proved too costly and bulky to work), and I found a sketch that, according to the article at least, is meant to be a modeller's reference for the pistols.
[[Image:http://www.imfdb.org/images/c/c3/Who_the_hell_approved_the_only_jpeg_rules.jpg]]
What I find most interesting is that the porting in the slide goes all the way forward, the USP style rail, and that it was not only going to be 9mm, but also called the BDR Custom instead. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 11:00, 3 June 2020 (EDT)

* I can't get the image to work, here's an Imgur link https://i.imgur.com/EMoA1R8.png --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 11:04, 3 June 2020 (EDT)

Talk:House of the Dead, The

2020-06-03T15:03:22Z

Yocapo32: /* Official drawing of the AMS EATER */

If this is the only gun in the game, and it doesn't look like ANY real gun, much less a BHP, then I'm not sure this title qualifies. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 09:59, 5 November 2015 (EST)
:I know about this problem. but in the "The House of the Dead Official Guide" page 12, it written as "modified Special Ops Browning Hi-Power". So I wrote independent HOD1 article than integration to HOD2 article. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 04:15, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::A third party article doesn't override the visual evidence. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 08:17, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::Take your cellphone out back and shoot it. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:23, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::I take a picture of these evidence. It's written as Japanese, though.[[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_1.jpg|thumb|none|300px|主人公ローガンの所持する「AMS EATER 改」は、所属のAMSで使用されている銃のフレームを基にカスタマイズされた代物。9mmパラベラムから50AEの大口径にする事で、凄まじいまでの破壊力を実現させた。その代償として、巨大な弾丸を収納するスペースを捻出できず、装弾数はダブルカラムの15発から、わずかシングルカラム6発になっている。セイフティレバーやマガジンキャッチは左右対称のまま使いやすく大型化、ワンオフのカスタムグリップ、内蔵型のハンマーによるストライカーシステムを採用するなど、多岐に渡ってカスタマイズされている。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_2.jpg|thumb|none|300px|一説にはブローニングハイパワーの某特殊部隊仕様を製作したガンスミスの手でチューンアップされたといわれ、命中精度、耐久性、操作性全ての面で優れている。使用する弾丸も通常は「フルメタルジャケット｣と呼ばれる、銅でコーティングした先の尖った物がほとんどだが、対ゾンビ系の生物兵器用として「シルバーチップ」という弾頭自体がひしゃげて破壊力が増すタイプを使用している。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_credits.jpg|thumb|none|300px|]][[Image:Hod_guncontrolloersticker.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Actual arcade version's "EATER" sticker.]] --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 10:26, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::I read carefully this article, '''It look like My identification was WRONG. EATER is actually a heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS.'''Its tuned up by some gunsmith who made Spec ops Browning Hi-Power. '''I'm so sorry about this.''' I'll change the main page description. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 11:37, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::If it's a fake handgun and it's the only weapon in the game, the page doesn't qualify. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 12:04, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::"the page doesn't qualify" hmm... so, if this page are deleted, HOD1 information are will be include to HOD2 article? --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 12:24, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::The same gun appears to be in HOD2, so it looks like it's already included. But if you can't finish HOD2, that will be gone as well. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 18:59, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::Hmm. Can't we stick the four main games onto a single page like what was with Devil May Cry?--[[User:Gunmaster2011|Gunmaster2011]] ([[User talk:Gunmaster2011|talk]]) 13:05, 8 November 2015 (EST)

=Page=
{{Infobox Video Game|{{PAGENAME}}
|name=The House of the Dead
|picture=hod_arcadeflyer.jpg
|caption=''The House of the Dead (1996)''
|series=The House of the Dead
|date=4 March 1997 (Arcade International Release) 31 March 1998 (Sega Saturn) 1998 (PC)
|developer=SEGA AM R&D DEPT#1 (Currently known as SEGA Interactive R&D#1)
|platforms=Arcade Sega Saturn PC
|publisher=SEGA
|genre=Light gun shooter
}}

{{VG Title|The House Of The Dead}}

[[Image:hod_saturnboxart.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''The House of the Dead (1998)'']]

__TOC__ 

=Pistols=

==Fictional Handgun==
AMS agents Thomas Rogan and "G" uses fictional handgun called "AMS EATER Custom" (In the Sega Saturn Magazine, It was incorrectly called "BDR Custom .45 Auto"). 
According from "The House of the Dead Official Guide", It's heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS. with modified to striker fired, change caliber 9×19mm to 50.AE rounds. It's also equipped with enlarged ambidextrous safety lever, magazine release and single-column 6 rounds magazine. 

"EATER" is also planned to appear as game's gun controller, which have air compression recoil system and It's actually uses in Location Test of 1996, 
But plan is later cancelled. because these recoil are possibly damage to player's hands and production cost is much higher then Virtua Cop's gun controller. 
Although final version's gun controller are each have specially made sticker. It written as "EATER 1 ANNEX ARMS JPN "ZMB" special package type -Thomas- model" for 1 player's gun (It written for 2 player's gun as "EATER 2 type -G- model").

[[Image:hod_eater.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Official render and Official illust of "AMS EATER Custom" (Taken from USA Sega Saturn Magazine). Note This article is mentioned above.]]
[[Image:hod_Rogan.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent Thomas Rogan posing with his "AMS EATER Custom 1" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_G.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent "G" aiming with his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterfiring.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Thomas firing his "AMS EATER Custom 1" to locked door in first stage. Note slide is actually moved and discharged cartridge.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterreload.jpg|thumb|none|500px|"G" reloading his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in second stage. Note bullet in the magazines are actually modeled and textured.]]

== Official drawing of the AMS EATER ==

I was looking through old articles of SEGA light guns just to kill time, and I found one explaining how the original mechanics of House of The Dead were going to work (originally it was gonna have two screens, one behind the player at all times, proved too costly and bulky to work), and I found a sketch that, according to the article at least, is meant to be a modeller's reference for the pistols.
[[Image:http://www.imfdb.org/images/c/c3/Who_the_hell_approved_the_only_jpeg_rules.jpg]]
What I find most interesting is that the porting in the slide goes all the way forward, the USP style rail, and that it was not only going to be 9mm, but also called the BDR Custom instead. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 11:00, 3 June 2020 (EDT)

Talk:House of the Dead, The

2020-06-03T15:01:53Z

Yocapo32: /* Official drawing of the AMS EATER */

If this is the only gun in the game, and it doesn't look like ANY real gun, much less a BHP, then I'm not sure this title qualifies. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 09:59, 5 November 2015 (EST)
:I know about this problem. but in the "The House of the Dead Official Guide" page 12, it written as "modified Special Ops Browning Hi-Power". So I wrote independent HOD1 article than integration to HOD2 article. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 04:15, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::A third party article doesn't override the visual evidence. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 08:17, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::Take your cellphone out back and shoot it. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:23, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::I take a picture of these evidence. It's written as Japanese, though.[[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_1.jpg|thumb|none|300px|主人公ローガンの所持する「AMS EATER 改」は、所属のAMSで使用されている銃のフレームを基にカスタマイズされた代物。9mmパラベラムから50AEの大口径にする事で、凄まじいまでの破壊力を実現させた。その代償として、巨大な弾丸を収納するスペースを捻出できず、装弾数はダブルカラムの15発から、わずかシングルカラム6発になっている。セイフティレバーやマガジンキャッチは左右対称のまま使いやすく大型化、ワンオフのカスタムグリップ、内蔵型のハンマーによるストライカーシステムを採用するなど、多岐に渡ってカスタマイズされている。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_2.jpg|thumb|none|300px|一説にはブローニングハイパワーの某特殊部隊仕様を製作したガンスミスの手でチューンアップされたといわれ、命中精度、耐久性、操作性全ての面で優れている。使用する弾丸も通常は「フルメタルジャケット｣と呼ばれる、銅でコーティングした先の尖った物がほとんどだが、対ゾンビ系の生物兵器用として「シルバーチップ」という弾頭自体がひしゃげて破壊力が増すタイプを使用している。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_credits.jpg|thumb|none|300px|]][[Image:Hod_guncontrolloersticker.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Actual arcade version's "EATER" sticker.]] --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 10:26, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::I read carefully this article, '''It look like My identification was WRONG. EATER is actually a heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS.'''Its tuned up by some gunsmith who made Spec ops Browning Hi-Power. '''I'm so sorry about this.''' I'll change the main page description. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 11:37, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::If it's a fake handgun and it's the only weapon in the game, the page doesn't qualify. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 12:04, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::"the page doesn't qualify" hmm... so, if this page are deleted, HOD1 information are will be include to HOD2 article? --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 12:24, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::The same gun appears to be in HOD2, so it looks like it's already included. But if you can't finish HOD2, that will be gone as well. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 18:59, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::Hmm. Can't we stick the four main games onto a single page like what was with Devil May Cry?--[[User:Gunmaster2011|Gunmaster2011]] ([[User talk:Gunmaster2011|talk]]) 13:05, 8 November 2015 (EST)

=Page=
{{Infobox Video Game|{{PAGENAME}}
|name=The House of the Dead
|picture=hod_arcadeflyer.jpg
|caption=''The House of the Dead (1996)''
|series=The House of the Dead
|date=4 March 1997 (Arcade International Release) 31 March 1998 (Sega Saturn) 1998 (PC)
|developer=SEGA AM R&D DEPT#1 (Currently known as SEGA Interactive R&D#1)
|platforms=Arcade Sega Saturn PC
|publisher=SEGA
|genre=Light gun shooter
}}

{{VG Title|The House Of The Dead}}

[[Image:hod_saturnboxart.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''The House of the Dead (1998)'']]

__TOC__ 

=Pistols=

==Fictional Handgun==
AMS agents Thomas Rogan and "G" uses fictional handgun called "AMS EATER Custom" (In the Sega Saturn Magazine, It was incorrectly called "BDR Custom .45 Auto"). 
According from "The House of the Dead Official Guide", It's heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS. with modified to striker fired, change caliber 9×19mm to 50.AE rounds. It's also equipped with enlarged ambidextrous safety lever, magazine release and single-column 6 rounds magazine. 

"EATER" is also planned to appear as game's gun controller, which have air compression recoil system and It's actually uses in Location Test of 1996, 
But plan is later cancelled. because these recoil are possibly damage to player's hands and production cost is much higher then Virtua Cop's gun controller. 
Although final version's gun controller are each have specially made sticker. It written as "EATER 1 ANNEX ARMS JPN "ZMB" special package type -Thomas- model" for 1 player's gun (It written for 2 player's gun as "EATER 2 type -G- model").

[[Image:hod_eater.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Official render and Official illust of "AMS EATER Custom" (Taken from USA Sega Saturn Magazine). Note This article is mentioned above.]]
[[Image:hod_Rogan.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent Thomas Rogan posing with his "AMS EATER Custom 1" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_G.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent "G" aiming with his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterfiring.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Thomas firing his "AMS EATER Custom 1" to locked door in first stage. Note slide is actually moved and discharged cartridge.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterreload.jpg|thumb|none|500px|"G" reloading his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in second stage. Note bullet in the magazines are actually modeled and textured.]]

== Official drawing of the AMS EATER ==

I was looking through old articles of SEGA light guns just to kill time, and I found one explaining how the original mechanics of House of The Dead were going to work (originally it was gonna have two screens, one behind the player at all times, proved too costly and bulky to work), and I found a sketch that, according to the article at least, is meant to be a modeller's reference for the pistols.
[[File:http://www.imfdb.org/images/c/c3/Who_the_hell_approved_the_only_jpeg_rules.jpg]]
What I find most interesting is that the porting in the slide goes all the way forward, the USP style rail, and that it was not only going to be 9mm, but also called the BDR Custom instead. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 11:00, 3 June 2020 (EDT)

File:Who the hell approved the only jpeg rules.jpg

2020-06-03T15:01:44Z

Yocapo32:

Talk:House of the Dead, The

2020-06-03T15:00:08Z

Yocapo32: /* Official drawing of the AMS EATER */ new section

If this is the only gun in the game, and it doesn't look like ANY real gun, much less a BHP, then I'm not sure this title qualifies. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 09:59, 5 November 2015 (EST)
:I know about this problem. but in the "The House of the Dead Official Guide" page 12, it written as "modified Special Ops Browning Hi-Power". So I wrote independent HOD1 article than integration to HOD2 article. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 04:15, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::A third party article doesn't override the visual evidence. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 08:17, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::Take your cellphone out back and shoot it. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:23, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::I take a picture of these evidence. It's written as Japanese, though.[[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_1.jpg|thumb|none|300px|主人公ローガンの所持する「AMS EATER 改」は、所属のAMSで使用されている銃のフレームを基にカスタマイズされた代物。9mmパラベラムから50AEの大口径にする事で、凄まじいまでの破壊力を実現させた。その代償として、巨大な弾丸を収納するスペースを捻出できず、装弾数はダブルカラムの15発から、わずかシングルカラム6発になっている。セイフティレバーやマガジンキャッチは左右対称のまま使いやすく大型化、ワンオフのカスタムグリップ、内蔵型のハンマーによるストライカーシステムを採用するなど、多岐に渡ってカスタマイズされている。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_eaterdetail_2.jpg|thumb|none|300px|一説にはブローニングハイパワーの某特殊部隊仕様を製作したガンスミスの手でチューンアップされたといわれ、命中精度、耐久性、操作性全ての面で優れている。使用する弾丸も通常は「フルメタルジャケット｣と呼ばれる、銅でコーティングした先の尖った物がほとんどだが、対ゾンビ系の生物兵器用として「シルバーチップ」という弾頭自体がひしゃげて破壊力が増すタイプを使用している。]][[Image:Hod_officialguidebook_credits.jpg|thumb|none|300px|]][[Image:Hod_guncontrolloersticker.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Actual arcade version's "EATER" sticker.]] --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 10:26, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::I read carefully this article, '''It look like My identification was WRONG. EATER is actually a heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS.'''Its tuned up by some gunsmith who made Spec ops Browning Hi-Power. '''I'm so sorry about this.''' I'll change the main page description. --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 11:37, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::If it's a fake handgun and it's the only weapon in the game, the page doesn't qualify. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 12:04, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::"the page doesn't qualify" hmm... so, if this page are deleted, HOD1 information are will be include to HOD2 article? --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 12:24, 6 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::The same gun appears to be in HOD2, so it looks like it's already included. But if you can't finish HOD2, that will be gone as well. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 18:59, 6 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::Hmm. Can't we stick the four main games onto a single page like what was with Devil May Cry?--[[User:Gunmaster2011|Gunmaster2011]] ([[User talk:Gunmaster2011|talk]]) 13:05, 8 November 2015 (EST)

=Page=
{{Infobox Video Game|{{PAGENAME}}
|name=The House of the Dead
|picture=hod_arcadeflyer.jpg
|caption=''The House of the Dead (1996)''
|series=The House of the Dead
|date=4 March 1997 (Arcade International Release) 31 March 1998 (Sega Saturn) 1998 (PC)
|developer=SEGA AM R&D DEPT#1 (Currently known as SEGA Interactive R&D#1)
|platforms=Arcade Sega Saturn PC
|publisher=SEGA
|genre=Light gun shooter
}}

{{VG Title|The House Of The Dead}}

[[Image:hod_saturnboxart.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''The House of the Dead (1998)'']]

__TOC__ 

=Pistols=

==Fictional Handgun==
AMS agents Thomas Rogan and "G" uses fictional handgun called "AMS EATER Custom" (In the Sega Saturn Magazine, It was incorrectly called "BDR Custom .45 Auto"). 
According from "The House of the Dead Official Guide", It's heavily modified unknown handgun which was adopted by AMS. with modified to striker fired, change caliber 9×19mm to 50.AE rounds. It's also equipped with enlarged ambidextrous safety lever, magazine release and single-column 6 rounds magazine. 

"EATER" is also planned to appear as game's gun controller, which have air compression recoil system and It's actually uses in Location Test of 1996, 
But plan is later cancelled. because these recoil are possibly damage to player's hands and production cost is much higher then Virtua Cop's gun controller. 
Although final version's gun controller are each have specially made sticker. It written as "EATER 1 ANNEX ARMS JPN "ZMB" special package type -Thomas- model" for 1 player's gun (It written for 2 player's gun as "EATER 2 type -G- model").

[[Image:hod_eater.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Official render and Official illust of "AMS EATER Custom" (Taken from USA Sega Saturn Magazine). Note This article is mentioned above.]]
[[Image:hod_Rogan.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent Thomas Rogan posing with his "AMS EATER Custom 1" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_G.jpg|thumb|none|500px|AMS agent "G" aiming with his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in attract demo.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterfiring.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Thomas firing his "AMS EATER Custom 1" to locked door in first stage. Note slide is actually moved and discharged cartridge.]]
[[Image:hod_eaterreload.jpg|thumb|none|500px|"G" reloading his "AMS EATER Custom 2" in second stage. Note bullet in the magazines are actually modeled and textured.]]

== Official drawing of the AMS EATER ==

I was looking through old articles of SEGA light guns just to kill time, and I found one explaining how the original mechanics of House of The Dead were going to work (originally it was gonna have two screens, one behind the player at all times, proved too costly and bulky to work), and I found a sketch that, according to the article at least, is meant to be a modeller's reference for the pistols.
[[File:https://i.imgur.com/EMoA1R8.png]]
What I find most interesting is that the porting in the slide goes all the way forward, the USP style rail, and that it was not only going to be 9mm, but also called the BDR Custom instead. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 11:00, 3 June 2020 (EDT)

Talk:Rainbow Six Siege

2020-03-07T03:22:43Z

Yocapo32: /* Void Edge */

=Miscellany=
==Redundant CSRX 300 Screenshots==
[[File:R6S CSRX300 1.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]
[[File:R6S CSRX300 ingame1.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]
[[File:R6S CSRX300 ingame2.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]
[[File:R6S CSRX300 ingame3.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]
[[File:R6S CSRX300 ingame4.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]

[[Image:R6S_CSRX3002.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Reloading the CSRX 300.]]

=Discussion=
==Already...==
It seem that the M1911 Variant has an incorrect 10 rounds in a 8 rounds magazine. There is IN FACT a 10 rounds magazine for M1911s but it seem it's not in this one --[[User:James Dalcan|James Dalcan]]
[[File:10roundsm1911.jpg|thumb|600px|none|10 Rounds magazine .45 ACP for M1911 and Variants]]

== New footage ==

Numerous new features can be seen clearly here: the MP5 ingame is referred to as the MP5F and has an unusual crooked stock (12:17), there is a USP for the terrorists, various attachments for the G36C including an oddly-reticuled ACOG scope, and the identification (at least ingame) of the 1911 as the M45 MEUSOC. At this stage it would appear that the MP5 has replaced the Mac-10 as the terrorists' weapon of choice. [[User:Sandymon|Sandymon]] ([[User talk:Sandymon|talk]])

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SN9CMGuyGvQ

== Alpha weapons ==

Someone leaked some footage of the Alpha so we can't "use" it, but it showed a FAMAS G2, P90, UMP, Mossberg 591A1, P226, HK33A2, S&W M586, FNP-9, and a stand-alone M320

There's also a MAC-11. Don't know if that's the same gun as what's labeled as the MAC-10.[[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]])

:I am still waiting for the alpha key... Although I did answer that I don't play CoD, BF, nor Titanfall so maybe they won't even send the key... :( - [[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] ([[User talk:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|talk]]) 03:32, 22 March 2015 (EDT)
::I watched this trailer on [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EWgOSimxoPs YouTube] and I screencapped an the UMP, FAMAS F1 and an assault rifle I didn't recognize. At first I thought it was an HK416 but then I noticed it has a charging handle on the right side of the gun. --[[User:CnC Fin|CnC Fin]] ([[User talk:CnC Fin|talk]]) 16:44, 22 March 2015 (EDT)
[[File:R6Siege assault rifle 01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Unknown assault rifle]]
[[File:R6Siege Famas.jpg|thumb|none|600px|FAMAS F1]]
[[File:R6Siege UMP.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Untextured UMP]]
They released a bunch of official footage today. FMG9, 5-7 USG, HK417, SA80 with DD rails, SG 556 XI, Remington R4. I think a Glock was briefly shown in a loadout window. FAMAS G2 is an F1 despite the name.[[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]])
:Here's a screencap from the official site, the same picture also appears in the end of some videos, and I think there's MPX with a suppressor as in the MPX-SD variant, but the weapon itself is about the same length as the basic variant. Perhaps we see it in a future video. --[[User:CnC Fin|CnC Fin]] ([[User talk:CnC Fin|talk]]) 16:03, 31 March 2015 (EDT)
[[File:R6siege mpx.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

== Unidentified firearms ==

I'm entirely certain that the unidentified ''VSN'' is a ''Vityaz-SN'', [https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/d/d8/OSN_Saturn_special_purpose_unit_%28506-20%29.jpg a 9mm Parabellum submachine gun] in use with the Russian special units that belong to the Ministry of Internal Affairs, MVD. It is also used by some specialized police detachments, such as [http://77rus.smugmug.com/Military/Interpolitex-2013/i-tF82bS7/0/O/Interpolitex2013part01-17.jpg Grom] of the Federal Drug Control Service.

The unidentified machine gun with a canted ammo box is actually a relatively well represented (as of late) ''PKP'' general purpose machine gun in an [http://i.imgur.com/gnAgMhX.jpg updated bullpup kit] by the Russian company Zenit. It was supposed to be used by special forces in close quarter urban combat apparently, but it didn't quite catch on. Still the initial batch was retained and could see limited action. Interestingly enough, Zenit is the same company that made the rail system and stock used by the Vityaz-SN. Ultimately, [http://www.zenitco.ru/files/pulemet2_1.jpg Zenit dropped the exotic bullpup kit] and went for something more conventional. --[[User:BeloglaviSup|BeloglaviSup]] ([[User talk:BeloglaviSup|talk]]) 10:06, 30 July 2015 (EDT)

: Thanks, those all seem correct. [[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]])

== The M590A1 ==
I'm pretty sure that the M590A1 is the Blackwater variant as it has a picatinny rail on the receiver and it appears that the ghost ring is part of the rail. The inventory image also shows that it has the "Speed Feed" stock and the tri-rail handguard; both standard on the Blackwater variant. [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 22:21, 15 September 2015 (EDT)

== Vepr-12? ==

Are we absolutely certain that's a Molot Vepr and not actually a Saiga? It's missing the elongated magazine well typical of the Vepr. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 17:39, 30 November 2015 (EST)

== Flash-hiders ==

Am I the only the one noticed that every gun that has a flash-hider, sans the P90, has an A2 flash-hider? [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 00:15, 1 December 2015 (EST)

== Weapons actually used ==

How many of the weapons in this game are actually used by special forces (of whatever they are called) in real life? I've seen some GIGN guys use revolvers and SAS have used the MP5, but the L85, AK12 etc seems rather out of place.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 05:29, 1 December 2015 (EST)
:The L85 and AK12 fit the SAS and Spetsnaz factions respectively.....given said weapons origins. They may not be standard issue but it's safe to assume that high tier counterterrorist units have access to almost any weapon they want.[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 13:04, 1 December 2015 (EST)
::The SAS never use L85s, they use L119A1s (Colt Canada C8 SFW, basically M4A1s), The Spetsnaz using AK-12s in not outlandish, as the AK-12 is going through field-trials now. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 18:46, 1 December 2015 (EST)

==MasterPiece Arms MPA10SST==
It seems the "MAC-11" is a MPA10SST [[User:James Dalcan|James Dalcan]] ([[User talk:James Dalcan|talk]]) 05:25, 4 December 2015 (EST)
[[File:MPA10SST.jpeg|thumb|none|400px|MasterPiece Arms MPA10SST]]

== Noticed something on the wall of the armory in Club House ==

[[File:Tom Clancy's Rainbow Six® Siege_20160110214429.jpeg|400px|thumb]]
Spotted a Bizon, an RPG-7 and a very low resolution model of what it seems to me an AK-103 with wood furniture similar to the one in Far Cry 3^^

--[[User:Death Shadow20|Death Shadow20]] ([[User talk:Death Shadow20|talk]]) 15:45, 10 January 2016 (EST)DH20
:Nice picture, contains a lot of words.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:40, 10 January 2016 (EST)

Damn, sorry Its my first time posting in here, i was trying to get a screencap off my PS4 with the share button but couldn't do it, it seems :( but trust me i know what i saw AK.
--[[User:Death Shadow20|Death Shadow20]] ([[User talk:Death Shadow20|talk]]) 16:49, 10 January 2016 (EST)DH20
:Those are some shitty models, looks like the game is running on ultra low or something.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:58, 11 January 2016 (EST)

== P12/USP Tactical ==

Game says it's chambered in .45ACP, however weapon capacity is 15+1. Should it be 9mm, not .45ACP which has capacity of 10 or 12 in a mag? --[[User:-Sentinel-|-Sentinel-]] ([[User talk:-Sentinel-|talk]]) 15:29, 7 February 2016 (EST)
:I'd put "though it says it's a .45 it incorrectly holds 15+1 like a 9mm USP instead of 12+1 like a real USP45." [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 23:03, 7 February 2016 (EST)

== Leaked operator with SIG MPX ==
[[File:rainbow6siegeleakedoperator.jpg|500px|thumb]]
A friend linked me a leaked picture of an upcoming operator, supposedly a Navy SEAL, that seems to be wielding a [[SIG-Sauer MPX]] --[[User:Jaffaceksi|Jaffaceksi]] ([[User talk:Jaffaceksi|talk]]) 18:50, 13 February 2016 (EST)

==Browning Hi-Power==
The in game Hi-Power has an odd serrations on the slide, one side are all tight like in the ones pictured on the Hi-Power page, and the other side has them thicker and widely spaced similar to the one seen in [[Call_of_Duty:_Black_Ops_2#Browning_Hi-Power|Call of Duty: Black Ops II]], is this an error, or is there a newer version that is like this? The only Hi-Power I've ever used was my Grandfathers old service piece from the 50's, and that one didn't have the variation between sides.--[[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 12:59, 5 March 2016 (EST)

== Delta gun ==

From one of the Idris vids

http://s23.postimg.org/bg73fjsmj/ddd.png

Has an Army of Two style shield on the gun and the rail cover extends past the end of the barrel.[[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]])

==The MPX doesn't look right to me==
Look at the MPX's magazine well, it looks much too big for its round, and looks like it doesn't seat properly. By the way, is the article going to be updated soon to add the Operation: Dust Line weapons?

[http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/rainbowsix/images/6/68/R6S-mpx.jpg/revision/latest?cb=20160511193901 Rainbow Six Siege MPX] [[User:CloversCorner|CloversCorner]] ([[User talk:CloversCorner|talk]]) 15:57, 11 May 2016 (EDT)
:Looks more like the magazine is misporportioned, wait until the final release. I'm kinda bummed that the new characters have super trope-y weapons like the Deagle and SPAS-12.....[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 23:01, 11 May 2016 (EDT)
::I'm more than bummed by the Desert Eagle. Rainbow Six Siege is supposed to be a realistic squad based game inspired by real units and the weapons and equipment they use. And then they stick a frigging Desert Eagle as a Navy SEAL sidearm. Pandering to the COD crowd. I'm rather pissed off that they did that. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] ([[User talk:Cool-breeze|talk]]) 05:11, 12 May 2016 (EDT)
:::Yeah, I just don't get it. I mean, the SCAR and the MK. 11 make sense, the MPX is okay with me, and the SPAS-12, well, it's not the most practical thing in the world, but it's not necessarily bad (although, with the 6+1 capacity, they may as well have used the compact model to fit in with the CQB theme). Still, seriously? A Desert Eagle? I mean, if you wanted a big, imposing handgun, you could go with a Mk. 23, which is infinitely more practical than the DE (though, granted, that's not exactly saying much), has been in previous R6 games, and was actually meant for the US military. Seriously, it's just downright illogical. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 17:19, 2 September 2016 (EDT)
::Looks like the magazine size is off. Took this myself. http://www.imfdb.org/images/4/4d/SIEGE_MPX.jpeg [[User:Zombiedrd|Zombiedrd]] ([[User talk:Zombiedrd|talk]]) 10:58, 12 May 2016 (EDT)

:::The mag-well's a bit bigger than it should be, the mags are a bit too short, and they are placed in the mag-well a bit too forward instead of in the center. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 12:56, 25 May 2016 (EDT)

== C8 barrel length ==

Not sure what to make of it, as it falls in between the SFW and CQB models. Looks to 11.5in..?
[[File:101-rifle-c8fthb-carbine-6.jpg|thumb|none|450px]]
[[File:Cc-r6.siege-c8sfw-001.jpg|thumb|none|450px]]
[[File:ColtCanada C8CQB.jpg|thumb|none|450px]]
:It doesn't help that like all the assault rifles in the game, it has an A2 birdcage flash hider. When in doubt, I say it's closer to the CQB do to the short barrel, even if it's a little longer. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 12:48, 25 May 2016 (EDT)
::11.5" barrel would make it a Colt 933. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 19:59, 1 September 2016 (EDT)

== Other unusable wall weapons in Kafe Dostoyevsky ==

[[Image:R6SKafe.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Potato-quality because Xbone.]]
Presumably a pair of Colt SAA's, flintlock pistols, and some three barreled pepperbox revolver. These can be found in the room next to the train exhibit.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 12:19, 12 June 2016 (EDT)

:I'll also leave the Dust Line background image here:
:[[File:RSSKeymodAR.jpg|thumb|none|600px|C-Clamp™]]
:--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 12:20, 24 June 2016 (EDT)

On the subject of unusable guns in menu screens, some menus include M6290 flashbangs. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 09:12, 1 September 2016 (EDT)
:And, for that matter, there's a Jericho 941 on the logo of Operation <s>No Refunds</s> Health. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 12:43, 31 July 2017 (EDT)

::[[File:RSS Villaweapons.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]] Also, there's a Vetterli and some simple looking rifle in the armory of the Villa level.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 23:38, 1 July 2018 (EDT)

== New guns in Skull Rain ==

Ok, so we are getting a Beretta M12, Spas-15 for the defender operator Caveira, while the offensive gets a M249, DSA SA58 and for sidearm there is a Beretta 92 series pistol (not sure on the model yet, probably a Taurus PT)

What are your thoughts? Personally i think we have enough of these shotgun-wielding gals but that's just me°-°
:It's nice to see a SPAS-15 pop up, but hopefully it isn't a copy-paste of Valkyrie/Frost's shotguns. I was kinda hoping one of them would shootdodge like Max Payne lol.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:09, 28 July 2016 (EDT)
:The M249 seems to fire at an unrealistically slow 690 RPM (probably lowered for balance reasons). Caveira's PT92 gets a super cool suppressor sleeve and apparently fires "non-lethal" ammo (despite her visibly killing someone during the gameplay demo...).

== Spotted a new gun ==

There is a S&W M&P in one of the posters seen in oregon, in the first set of beds on the dormitory, next to the west window, i'd love to upload the picture but i don't have the necessary means to do it :( Sorry.--[[User:Death Shadow20|Death Shadow20]] ([[User talk:Death Shadow20|talk]]) 15:41, 31 August 2016 (EDT)

== Next DLC ==

So... the next DLC will consist of Japanese operators. I've heard speculation of a P229 or P220, a Benelli Supernova, a Howa Type 89, and a Mineba PM9. I'd also expect a Howa Type 64, and maybe an AR-18. Thoughts? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 17:23, 13 November 2016 (EST)
:It's been confirmed as the Supernova for both operators, the Type 89 for Hibana, and a MP5SD4 for Echo. Sidearms are the P229 and PM-9.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:59, 13 November 2016 (EST)

== SVU question ==

I played this for the free weekend that just concluded, and when I played the "Cold Zero" situation I saw no such red tint through the SVU's magnifier as the section for that gun mentions. I'm assuming it was removed at some point, given one of our screenshots shows it, and [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_mhlFXZO98 this video] from just after release still has it, but [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KeLYNI_r3Ik this one] from a month ago lacks it. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 18:36, 13 November 2016 (EST)
:It looks like it is still there, just toned down a bit (similar to in the initial release, your vision went very greyscale at low health).--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 19:32, 13 November 2016 (EST)

==Spanish Operators==

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hTke6uUPvNw

Looks like a Kriss Vector, Fabarm STF 12, Fabarm STF 12 Short, POF PSG, and Diemaco C7E. Can't tell if that USP is a new Compact model.[[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]])
:are you sure it is a POF PSG and not an UDP-9? You can tell by the trigger guard but then again the PSG is in Ghost Recon: Wildlands and there it looks like a complete different model than the one portrayed in Siege.--[[User:Death Shadow20|Death Shadow20]] ([[User talk:Death Shadow20|talk]]) 10:27, 6 February 2017 (EST)
::Looks like you're right. It has that tiny hole running through the boltcatch on the left, and the icon has that distinct strip just above the magwell.[[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]])
Somebody mentioned Diemaco C7 as NLD on reddit. Probably Colt Canada C7NLD. --[[User:-Sentinel-|-Sentinel-]] ([[User talk:-Sentinel-|talk]]) 11:19, 7 February 2017 (EST)
:Undoubtedly.--[[User:BlackHawk510|BlackHawk510]] ([[User talk:BlackHawk510|talk]]) 12:28, 7 February 2017 (EST)

==Question==

Why this game stopped having updates?--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 11:32, 27 June 2017 (EDT)
:Except it's still being updated and current operation is [https://rainbow6.ubisoft.com/siege/en-us/news/152-289775-16/year-2-season-2-operation-health Operation Health]. It was updated in June 7, 2017 to 2.2.1 and next patch 2.2.2 is scheduled to sometime in July 2017. The point is: this operation doesn't bring any content updates like operators, weapons or maps (it will introduce Alpha Packs though aka lootboxes) and instead focuses on matchmaking and bug fixes. For new ops and maps you need to wait for August (if not September). --[[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 12:30, 27 June 2017 (EDT)

Thank you Terramax. It just looked weird that no Operations were made in almost 1 year.I dont own the game so I cant knew it.--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 13:12, 27 June 2017 (EDT)

== Grzmot mines ID ==

Them look like a Polish WW2 mines, which I dont remember the names, any idea?
--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 09:47, 1 September 2017 (EDT)

== White Noise ==

Damn, we're going to need some new weapon images. They really made some odd picks- I don't even know what the SMG-2 ''is'', although I think it's based on an Uzi Pro pistol. On a different note, what do you guys think about these new operators? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 17:02, 20 November 2017 (EST)
:The "SMG-12" seems to be some sorta amalgamation of a Masterpiece Arms MAC variant with the folding stock of a Mini Uzi. The K1A is listed in game as an SMG, despite very clearly being a carbine (probably due to Daewoo referring to it as such), and the "M762" is more than likely a full length Beryl 7.62 with a ''disgusting'' thumbhole stock. Interestingly enough, it uses Western optics instead of Ruskie ones, which makes me question why they even gave her an AK to begin with. And, of course, that stupid airsoft gun from Wildlands has reared its head again. Thanks Canada. As for the ops themselves, I'm gonna go ahead and say real quick that Zofia is stupidly powerful. She gets all the utility of Ash, and she can revive herself. Why? Great question. But either way she's definitely gonna see a lot of combat time by high level teams. Vigil is certainly a fun choice, as he's especially good against teams who are on their drones a lot, and I really love his design in general. And then we have Dokkaebi who, while definitely being a very strange operator in nature, could be a cheeky pick of casual matches, like Caveira. Though she is unfortunately saddled with a DMR and shotgun, so, as with Echo, you're probably gonna be using her machine pistols more than her primaries. --[[User:Patfast|Patfast]] ([[User talk:Patfast|talk]]) 17:48, 20 November 2017 (EDT)

Western optics on Polish-made rifle made after the '90s made sense, Patfast. Poland is on NATO side now.--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 10:11, 29 November 2017 (EST)

::The Beryl stock looks like a Hera Arms CQR, despite that not being normally intended for AK-type rifles. I don't quite get why they gave Zofia that Krytac gun, or why they gave the South Koreans a tactical O/U. I mean, sure, asset recycling is a factor, but they could've given her a dozen other machine guns that they already had models for (the KAC LMG, the HK121, etc), or maybe created a more appropriate model, like a UKM-2000 (considering that she is a Pole). And as for the shotgun, they could've used a KSG (which that group apparently actually uses), or even a proper South Korean shotgun, the USAS-12 (as hard as that would be to balance). Generally speaking, they made some odd choices with the weapons here. I do think that Zofia's gadget is going to be a force to be reckoned with, considering the quick breaching potential of the impact grenades (and the infuriation potential of the concussion grenades), but I don't think that the self-revive thing is going to be that big of a deal. I mean, she gets up with ''one'' hitpoint. Someone breathes on her too hard and she'll be down for the count. I frankly just think that they included that for the sake of one-in-a-million dramatic clutches that people pull off on Twitch streams (y'know, 1 HP and a dream), but I might be proven wrong. All we can do is wait and see. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 19:01, 20 November 2017 (EST)
:::I was hoping to see the whole Daewoo family - K7 SMG, K3 SAW and K5 pistol, but I guess the hipster-operators (seriously, did they hire Tumblr artists to create the characters and abilities for this season?) we got have to go with weird weapon choices. Although its cool to see the Rock Island M14, that variant never really shows up in anything. --[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 19:22, 20 November 2017 (EST)
::::I agree, I think this is the worst match of equipment and CTU, I don't understand the reasoning behind choosing weapons for CTU. You don't even need to hire active/former CTU member/veteran for that kind of info (MoHW was great though), even Wikipedia has information about it mostly with sources. To me it looks like "k2,k1,k7 - they're another c8-sfw,c7nld,416c,sr25" and I hope it's not the case. Maybe I'm glad I'm not getting Israel CTU for now, I don't want them to receive the same treatment as GROM (writing-wise) and them having no Galil, ACE or MTAR. Like IMFDB, I'm looking forward for more weapon representation in games. Also, [[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] thank you for rearranging and formatting new weapons properly. I was almost triggered how Ubisoft gave [[AK-12]] to Polish operator first time I saw it in TTS, but then I noticed the fixed rear sight and, just like [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] said, it's HERA Arms CQR stock with some "aftermarket dust cover?" and handguards. And... it's almost certain their design team visited [http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/12/30/hera-arms-cqr-stock-ak-rifle/ this page] for "inspiration" for "M762" (and not actual "Beryl M762" from Google Search or FB page). [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 06:06, 21 November 2017 (EST)

== "Beryl M762" ==

Here's material for you guys who want to identify or try to explain what this gun actually is (like how "C8-SFW" and "C7E" were explained previously to be other guns completely or heavily modified). First: [http://fabrykabroni.pl/en/produkty/karabiny/beryl-m-7-62/ here's official Beryl M762] from FABRYKA BRONI "ŁUCZNIK" RADOM. Second: [https://www.flickr.com/photos/stickgunner/21074884113/ here's original non-photoshopped image] by Stickman. The handguard is Midwest Industries Extended Handguard and magazine is US PALM (not depicted in-game anyway). And third one is the "inspiration" image: [http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/12/30/hera-arms-cqr-stock-ak-rifle/ here's the same image, but photoshopped with HERA Arms CQR stock] by TFB blog. The in-game model is probably "inspired" by the third one with the addition of custom railed dust cover (can't identify it properly, it still resembles new production AK-12/AK-15 one, but maybe not) and new in-game vertical grip model. [[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 15:47, 7 December 2017 (EST)
:I personally see it as an M762 in name only. I'm gonna give a physical description and mention the inspirations but not directly call it a Beryl M762.--[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 07:57, 22 February 2018 (EST)

== Looks like p226 and p229 both have DA only triggers in the game. ==

Their hammers are uncocked not like other pistols, is it a mistake or intended?

== Apparently they changed USP40 to a DAO version in TTS ==

Does DAO USP Compact exist?

== GSG-9 Shotgun ==

Hey guys, as some of you noticed, I changed the info for the GSG-9 shotgun, because I found out that it is actually based off of the G&P M870 RAS with some wonky rail attachments. I am glad to see that people have worded it better, as I word things in the most stupidest way possible.

Best Regards,
[[User:Burga|Burga]] ([[User talk:Burga|talk]]) 17:27, 16 March 2018 (EDT)

== SASG-12 ==
Looks like the "SASG-12" shotgun is based on the customized Saigas by the Hatcher Gun Company.

[https://www.hatchergun.com/saiga_custom.htm] Should I mention it? [[User:Lunar Watcher|Lunar Watcher]] ([[User talk:Lunar Watcher|talk]]) 07:56, 27 April 2018 (EDT)
:You should mention it if there's nothing closer out there. The in-game model seems to still have some differences with these custom Saigas. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 08:15, 27 April 2018 (EDT)

== Trivia ==

[https://i.redd.it/a8z3c7qp8sk01.jpg Finka's] early concept art shows her holding an [[A-91]]. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 01:19, 29 April 2018 (EDT)

:That reminds me that I have these things from Operation Outbreak floating around still-
:[[file:R6S G36art.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]
:[[file:R6S Mk18ishart.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]
:[[file:R6S PPSh.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 22:26, 30 April 2018 (EDT)

[https://www.reddit.com/r/Rainbow6/comments/814f6x/the_abandonment_of_realism_a_long_post_on/ This reddit rant] had some extra trivia info on some stuff around the game, like the laser sight models and Glaz's new thermal imager. I don't want to talk about their opinions, but I do find some of the details they pointed out interesting.

I also found via artstation that all weapons have tactical lights in Outbreak mode, and one of the artists had to [https://www.artstation.com/artwork/kJBAl make up a flashlight model] for some pistols that lack attachment points of any kind. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 01:19, 9 May 2018 (EDT)

:Wow, does that guy have a stick up his ass. Frankly, I'd kill for the amount of realism Siege has in Ghost Recon Wildlands. Seriously, Ubi, just point to your preferred sacrifice. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 06:58, 9 May 2018 (EDT)

== 7.62x54mmR Suppressor ==

Anyone know if there's a real equivalent of this?
[[File:RSS 7.62x54mmR suppessor.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 21:28, 6 August 2018 (EDT)
It reminds me about the PBS-4. But in-game suppressor isn't fully identical to it so maybe I'm wrong. [[User:Lunar Watcher|Lunar Watcher]] ([[User talk:Lunar Watcher|talk]]) 01:59, 10 August 2018 (EDT)

== Operation Grim Sky ==

Clash has a B&T MP9 and a CZ P10C (first appearance in anything?!). Maverick has an "M4" in 5.56, another AR-15 but in .50 Beowulf and a 1911 Tacops (SIG?). I like these additions and I'm glad since I was expecting recycled guns like in Chimera. ---P226 17:47, 19 August 2018 (EDT)
:I wonder if Maverick will be a true ''maverick'' and use the bolt releases on his ARs.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 19:58, 19 August 2018 (EDT)
::The TTS is starting today I believe, so I'll post some pics and can describe full reload animations (he'll probably just rack the charging handle like the rest of them...)---P226 11:55, 20 August 2018 (EDT)

== What Stock is this? ==

Blackbeard's SR-25 has this weird-looking stock that doesn't appear on any of our SR-25/M110 images. Since I know nothing about stocks, does anybody know what stock is this?--[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 18:42, 10 November 2018 (EST)

[[file:R6S-sr25.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]

:UBR Collapsible Stock by Magpul. --[[User:Nanomat|Nanomat]] ([[User talk:Nanomat|talk]]) 18:48, 10 November 2018 (EST)

== Wind Bastion - Moroccan operators ==

Seems like Kain has an AUG A3 Para 9mm and Nomad has some AK variant with Magpul furniture. We'll see the full loadout on the 18th once they are fully premiered. ---P226 12:06, 15 November 2018 (EST)

-The Attacker has an ak74m and a arx200, the defender has an aug a3 9mm and a "tcsg12" shotgun (not sure what gun it is} i can get pictures of the when the new technical test server comes out.
[[File:Kaidr6s.jpg|thumb|none|700px]] can anyone identify this gun? ---Azure 1:24 , 17 November 2018 (EST)

::Seems to be some Turkish AR-styled shotgun, likely Derya though I am not sure since the length looks kinda short. I say we should wait for the model to come out . Also Azure, can you next time use some other screencapping option? Using the Uplay screenshot option repeatedly will leave the screenshot saved mark on the image, which is a big no-no on IMFDB. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 13:34, 17 November 2018 (EST)
:::It’s a stubby Akdal Mka 1919 I think.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 16:35, 17 November 2018 (EST)
:::Yeah sorry i was unaware ill use something else.--[[User:Azure|Azure]] 7:25 November 17 2018 (EST)
The ops also use an Automag .44 AMP with a scope attached for their secondary... just when I thought Ubisoft couldn't make the weapon selection more mental, they outdo themselves lol---P226 13:17, 18 November 2018 (EST)

::Sorry about the whole "Auto Mag can't have +1 in the chamber thing" I've actually now completely forgot where I got that from and I hadn't watched the Forgotten Weapons video on the Auto Mag in a long while since I got that weird false info, hahaha. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:31, 18 February 2019 (EST)

== burnt Horizon weapons ==

An m249 SAW with a quad stack AR mag instead of belt box, a F90 assault rifle, Super shorty, roni smg, Colt 9mm smg, and the SDP9 handgun - Feb 17th 3:03 pm

:That's a CZ P-09 in that RONI, despite it saying it's a P-10. The Serbu Super Shorty is actually a Remington 870 MCS Masterkey and their pistol in full is a KRISS/Sphinx SDP Compact Duty Krypton. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 01:04, 18 February 2019 (EST)

== Three-round burst options ==

I was cross-referencing weapon stats between the Rainbow Six wiki and IMFDB, when I realized that the wiki apparently lists the "P10 RONI" as having 3-round burst and semi-automatic modes. This felt weird to me, and I wondered if any of the other weapons have weird burst options or something. Because I'm not 100% confident with the burst setting documentation on the wiki (burst settings are so minor things could easily carry over when copypasting wiki templates), and because I don't have access to the game right now (and it would be tough to try to find info about this from YouTube videos; one Rogue-9 video about burst modes was made during Operation Health so it doesn't cover any current weapons), can anybody please check the firing modes of weapons in-game and see if there are anything interesting of note? Thanks. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 22:03, 18 February 2019 (EST)

:R6 wiki info is accurate. P10 RONI features auto/3-rnd burst/semi fire modes (as of Test Server at least). --[[User:Terramax|Terramax]] ([[User talk:Terramax|talk]]) 12:59, 20 February 2019 (EST)
::OK then. If the wiki is accurate, then some of the weird/incorrect stuff I'm seeing include:
::*Commando 9 having a burst option in addition to full auto (I think the Colt 9mms are either full-auto or three-round burst like the M4s, though 4-position AR-15 selectors exist out there and so there's that, I dunno)
::*Mx4 storm having a burst option
::*Maverick's M4 having burst and full auto (4-position shenanigans, which could possibly also explain the C7E situation but I'm not sure)
::*CS/LS2 having a burst option
::*"AK-74M" having a burst option (which I know some of the AKs like the Beryl have, just not the AK-74M and the AKM, two of the weapons currently identified as the "base" of the in-game weapon)
::*QBB-95 having a three-round burst
::*ARX200 having a burst option
::*F90 having a burst option
::*P10 RONI having select fire, even though as far as I see it it doesn't have a selector switch
::I think that's all I noticed for now. I might have missed something so it might be a good idea to check again later. Also, for trivia, apparently the AR-15.50 is an "Assault Rifle", not even a DMR. --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 13:32, 20 February 2019 (EST)

== Operation Phantom Sight ==

Operation Phantom Sight appears to have no new weapons, as the new operators all use guns already present in the game. However, some of them seems to have new animations when used by the new Operators, and Nokk's D50 has a suppressor option.

Also, can somebody finish up the Burnt Horizon weapons? --[[User:Wuzh|Wuzh]] ([[User talk:Wuzh|talk]]) 19:43, 19 May 2019 (EDT)

== Void Edge ==

They've released some info about the new operation, with one of the main headlines being a Tachanka rework: he now gets to carry around his DP-28 (apparently replacing his other selectable primaries), and gets what looks like a Kulakov grenade launcher (a rotary launcher based on the Mosin's receiver) that's incorrectly semi-auto and fires timer-detonated incendiary grenades. This also means that, between his WWII-era rejected prototype grenade launcher, his sidearm, and his also WWII-era LMG, he's got 54+ pounds of guns on him, plus ammo, plus armor, and plus all his other equipment, too. No wonder people call him a god... [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 18:38, 16 February 2020 (EST)
:According to [https://assets-prd.ignimgs.com/2020/02/16/tachanka-launcher-3-1581881135373.jpg this] image there's some sort of dubious semi-auto conversion going on. At least the receiver and the stock is cut appropriately though.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 22:54, 22 February 2020 (EST)
::Seems to be based on this semi-auto conversion of the Mosin: https://forums.gunboards.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2757410&stc=1&thumb=1&d=1514696139. Apparently, it was Tokarev's competitor for the AVS-36, but as Abraham Lincoln once said: "Don't believe everything you read on the internet just because a famous person is attached to it". --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 22:22, 6 March 2020 (EST)

Talk:Devil May Cry Series

2019-02-22T22:27:23Z

Yocapo32:

"Unknown" for Lady's pistol is as in "I'm too busy to look up other images for it right now." This whole article is just a placeholder for now while I go though looking for weapons. Anyone know if Blue Rose is supposed to be anything other than "revolver the size of a house?" [[User:Vangelis|Vangelis]] 08:36, 13 July 2009 (UTC)

The Blue Rose is basically the Smith and Wesson Model 500, or similar, but with six chambers instead of five, and with two barrels.--[[User:Zblayde|Zblayde]] 02:57, 20 February 2010 (UTC)

== Hybrid Guns ==
Dante's Ebony and Ivory are NOT [[M1911 pistol series|Colt M1911s]]. They're hybrid guns, combining features from the Colt M1911a and the [[Heckler & Koch USP|Heckler & Koch USPs]]. This is apparant in the slide, area around the recoil spring, and the fact that Ebony and Ivory has pivto-style triggers, like the H&K USP, but unlike the M1911. The same trick of combining two guns was used by Capcom in [[Resident Evil 4]], when they combined an H&K USP, [[Heckler & Koch Mark 23|Mk. 23s]], and a [[Smith & Wesson Sigma]]. If you think I am wrong, please argue for your point of view, but please do not just delete this entry without an explanation. Thank you.--[[User:Zblayde|Zblayde]] 21:56, 25 February 2010 (UTC)

Ebony and ivory ARE 1911 based pistols, no matter what anyone says. I own 4 1911's and are very familiar with them, Before I've ever seen the game guns I built a 1911 with a compensator attached to the rail and after seeing them it looks extremely similar. The trigger difference is far from a good reason. People have trimmed the bottom of a 1911 trigger to look hindged and functions just as normal. As I said I'm writing from experience not because I play a lot of games and THINK I know because I've seen them in fps.
:You're a little late to the party, dude. Look at the article, this issue was resolved months ago.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 22:42, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

I only saw it today. I'm viewing it on the imfdb website and the only post says it was a 1911/USP mix 'n match. I couldn't leave an incorrect statement without leaving behind the correct one.
:This is just the talk page. The article, the part that matters, is correct.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 02:25, 23 December 2010 (UTC)

== Lady's Sidearm ==

It's not a 1911, it looks more like a custom EAA Witness with a longer barrel and a longer and heavier slide with a compensator. Try looking at it in-game for the shape of the grip, the higher profile frame (which has the milling cuts found on the CZ 75), and the shape of the trigger guard (but in the end it might just be a hybrid gun). If you watch the cut-scene before level 9, it shows a close-up of a casing from Lady's handgun and it says 9mm on it (also she has ONE pistol, not two). On a side note, Lady's Vz.61 Skorpion has much larger than normal magazines, but all in all it's sill just a Vz.61 Skorpion (it also has a large bayonet mounted on it).

PS: Dante's handguns are NOT 1911/HK USP hybrids, they're just heavily customized 1911s. Just because the milling on the slides looks like the USP (and also the Sig P220), does not make it part USP. I've seen a mod for 1911s called Hi-Power Cuts, which mills the front of the slide to make it look like the milling on a Browning Hi-Power's slide. As for the triggers, they're also just custom additions, they don't look like USP triggers at all in-game.

I see nothing on here to state any resolution. I see one person who put it was a 1911/USP mix 'n match. I only saw this today, and couldn't leave an incorrect statement without letting people know what's right.

== The new DMC reboot ==

Dear God, I really hate that they reboot the franchise and gave Dante this emo young punk look [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:17, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Dante always kinda looked like an emo punk. [[User:Mattattack07|Mattattack07]] 20 September 2010 (UTC)

You misunderstand how I see Dante. Sure he has the white hair and anyone in real life with that kind of hairstyle would be sorta emo or punk like, but for Dante, it's different. He's a tough guy. An asshole and a douchebag. He looks at everything as a joke and has fun at the risk of his own life and even the faith of the human race as long as he's amused. That's not really the trait of an "emo punk". His powers during the cutscenes are only defined on how hilarious the results are and his dialogue are anything but emo. He's smug, but likeable. He's does not take anything seriously and would laugh at the face of death itself and most likely did from time to time. Everything around him has this dark demonic goth look about it, but Dante is the shining light that makes even the most grim situations laughable. That is what Dante of the Devil May Cry series is about.

Now this reboot, he doesn't even have the white hair. He's too skinny, too young looking, I mean younger than Devil May Cry 3 Dante. He looks like he's in high school trying to be a rebel without a cause oh yeah and a smoker. The creator of Dante always felt that Dante not smoking made him more badass and now we got this punk kid pretending to be Dante. I've always believe that a character who smokes isn't a badass unless he is already a badass without the smoking. The smoking only enhances the badassery of a character that already is bad ass without it. There's nothing funny or amusing about this reboot Dante. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:53, 20 September 2010 (UTC)

Well,Excalibur,I agree. If it was like Bond,where he was smoking from the beginning,and then stopped in later progressions(With reason other than actor change),it'd be understandable. this guy just began to turn into a loser with an awful look without reason why or how. ANd the smoking thing is stupid. I liked the pizza thing from DMC 3(at the beginning),and the strawberry sundae thing from the animated series. Things like that seemed to crop him out from most other protagonists. But now he's just conformed face in a crowd of hundreds of other bad ass protagonist badasses who aren't even badass.--[[User:Pump Shotty Justice|Pump_Shotty_Justice]] 16:25, 20 July 2012 (CDT)

:Ebony and Ivory got turned into Desert Eagle knockoffs and therefore DMC does not exist. Except [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPKHxbOg19s that Youtube video where they set the language to Spanish, gave Donte a moustache and added in random Mariachi music], that exists. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 06:36, 4 November 2014 (EST)

I may get flack for this, and it's kind of late in the game, but I liked the reboot. He doesn't smoke in it and he's still a jokester, who just uses some vulgar language now. If you pay attention to detail, he has the same face model, just skinnier. I mean honestly, other than a reboot, there wasn't much else they could do with the storyline after 4. I could of done without them using a DE for Ebony & Ivory, but it's Capcom. That's just my opinion though. [[User:Rotncorpse|Rotncorpse]] 06:36 1 May 2015 (EST)

:There's a lot they could have done. How about cover Vergil's career before DMC3, or Dante's career after DMC3 but before DMC1? Or even hand the reins over to Nero in another sequel so we can get some definitive answers regarding his origins? Or remake DMC2 into the game it might have been, but with DMC3's motion capture and voice actors and improved gameplay? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 11:53, 1 May 2015 (EDT)

:Donte isn't a jokester, he's a tiresome emo brat, Donte looks nothing like Dante, and the correct answer to "I can't think of an original story" isn't "I'll just use this one that someone else wrote already." You don't need to constantly reboot things at arbitrary intervals to keep things fresh, you just need writers who are good at writing stories rather than telling people that Fox News are meanieheads and stealing the Slurm Worm bit from Futurama. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 15:19, 1 May 2015 (EDT)

:...WOW, Tim. You're being incredibly immature about this. You're basically saying "The guns aren't on this page because I think it sucks WAAAAAAAA". That's not really you. Actually, come to think of it, the whole DMC page ''sucks''. Needs a massive retool me-thinks. WITH those Deagle E/I Pistols, I may add." --[[User:Gunmaster2011|Gunmaster2011]] ([[User talk:Gunmaster2011|talk]]) 11:30, 2 May 2015 (EDT)

::No, they can go on a separate page, since unlike the other DMC games, <s>reskinned Heavenly Sword 2</s> DmC doesn't have most of the same guns in it as the others (in fact it doesn't have any of them).

::''I'm'' not adding it because the last time I tried playing it, it ended up wiping my PS3's hard drive somehow (I think it stands for "destroy my console") which lost me, among other things, all my save data for two ''Armoured Core'' games, and I think it's a completely stupid game, but you shouldn't just randomly assign motives to people based on statements that are obviously not completely serious. If I were really like that I'd have deleted the page for the completely fictitious movie ''Highlander 2'' by now, for a start. :P

::More to the point, DmC fails the single gun rule (the only others seem to be [http://devilmaycry.wikia.com/wiki/Revenant a fictional semiautomatic sawed-off shotgun] and [http://devilmaycry.wikia.com/wiki/Kablooey whatever this is]) and so it doesn't really qualify for inclusion anyway. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 15:08, 2 May 2015 (EDT)

I will say, other than the DE's, the only other gun, that's not fictional, is the FN F2000 that Virgil uses for brief moment. I really don't think the game needs a page either, that time could be used for something else. If I remember correctly, Virgil's beginning is covered in a graphic novel, which they would have to add a bunch of filler into to make a decent game. DMC2 had a terrible story line and would not be worth the time, effort, and money for a remake in my opinion. Nero's gameplay was decent, but the character was just a Dante clone with a bigger ego, and not really warranting his own game to me. Maybe the creators felt the original series was played out, wanted to go in a different direction, or frankly didn't give a flying F@#$ about what some fans/gamers might have wanted. I only chimed in because I thought the game was fun, not to start some internet pissing match. Besides, I'm just some random person on the internet voicing my opinion, so what do I know. Rotncorpse 08:11 3 May 2015 (EST)

:Well, the creator of the original series already went in a different direction. That's what Clover / Platinum Games is. DMC4's main problem is it is literally not finished, Capcom cut the game's budget down to something like a third of what it was supposed to be, that's why Dante just goes through the exact same levels and fights the exact same bosses. And 2 wasn't even a DMC game, it was a Bloodrayne / Tomb Raider knockoff starring Lucia that they had the team put Dante in because they hadn't expected DMC1 to be a success and wanted a quick sequel, that's why it's so heavy on shooting compared to the others. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 14:55, 3 May 2015 (EDT)

== Ebony & Ivory uses ==

On the Devil May Cry wiki page for Ebony and Ivory, it has the following quote:

The right-handed white gun, Ivory, was custom built for rapid firing and fast draw times[5], while the left-handed black gun, Ebony, has been modified for long-distance targeting and comfort.[6]

My question: aside from the fact that Dante is part-demon and could easily just infuse Ebony's bullets with more energy so they go farther, are there any real-life modifications that could make a handgun with a near-identical partner have "long-distance targeting" capabilities?

[[User:SIGman|SIGman]] ([[User talk:SIGman|talk]]) 15:09, 4 April 2013 (EDT)

:A heavier barrel with more defined rifling, as well as a lighter trigger and target sights, I guess. Devil May Cry 5 does imply the guns are chambered in different calibers, or at least different loads, with Ebony having much sharper recoil and a slower rate of fire than Ivory, so it's possible he's using match grade bullets as well, if not a caliber more suited to long range shooting. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 17:27, 22 February 2019 (EST)

Talk:Payday 2

2017-10-26T04:50:52Z

Yocapo32: /* about the new gun */

== Getting Started ==
Well I'm not the best at coding but I just wanted to get this page started. Anyone is free to help. --[[User:eelikay|eelikay]] 10:23, 2 August 2013 (CDT)
:Gimmie some time, I can get default screenshots for most every beta game. --[[User:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 00:34, 3 August 2013 (GMT)

==Not a Heat reference==

Just because the game has a 733, doesn't mean it's a reference to Heat. Also it isn't even using the curved 30 round magazine. It's like a badly rendered stretched 20 round mag like in COD Black Ops. Also Payday 2's 733 also has a modern M4 3rd gen stock and A2 rear sight while the 733 in Heat had a gen 2 stock and an A1 rear sight. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 00:17, 3 August 2013 (EDT)
:I guess they add the 20 round mag as a balancing thing. The stock and sight differences are odd, would that change the model? Also, I can't show you it yet, as the beta hasn't opened up that far, but it also seems like the game has the [[FN FNC]], if menu art is anything to go by. That is most certainly a Heat reference, and the developers have already stated it was an influence on the game. [[user:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 11:27, 3 August 2013 (GMT)
::It's really moot point since we're just robbing banks in a modern setting, so I'd use a more contemporary weapon than a design that's a bit dated. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 11:28, 3 August 2013 (EDT)

== The AUG is MASR STG ? ==

AUG's Magazine is not original. Do This Made MASR ? Assuming this is MASR made AUG ? - [[User:KINKI'boy|KINKI'boy]] ([[User talk:KINKI'boy|talk]]) 13:46, 3 August 2013 (JST)
:Looks like a Magpul PMAG, as for the rifle, it's not uncommon for game devs to model their guns off of airsoft or civilian versions of guns. So it could be a MASR STG instead of a true AUG, I don't know how to tell.--[[User:Crazycrankle|Crazycrankle]] ([[User talk:Crazycrankle|talk]]) 09:46, 3 August 2013 (EDT)
::Also the foregrip is the KAC vertical grip instead of the folding grip [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 11:29, 3 August 2013 (EDT)

== All beta weapons added ==

That's every single weapon from the beta capped, and added. [[user:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 17:27, 3 August 2013 (GMT)
:You can't access the P90 or HK416 in the beta? There are silhouettes for them on the second pages of primary and secondary weapons.[[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]]) 17:28, 4 August 2013 (EDT)
::No, you can't. The level cap is 30. The only weapons not on the page are the FN FNC, at 33, the M16A2, at 39, A double barrel shotgun at 39, the P90 at 36, and the Deagle at 36. (Those are just guesses as to what they are. They might be slightly different once I see the 3D models. [[user:Dannysaysnoo|Dannysaysnoo]] 01:40, 4 August 2013 (GMT)

== Screenshots ==

I think we should use view mode for the majority of the screen shots. The models have more detail than thirdperson and you can see more of it than in first person
ex: http://imageshack.us/a/img203/7945/0tfc.jpg
(This is just a photo since I can't screenshot on a PS3 and don't have a computer version of the game)

[[User:Kona|Kona]] ([[User talk:Kona|talk]]) 17:31, 21 August 2013 (EDT)

== Weapon Variants ==

So I was thinking the gun customization in this game means a lot of guns have different variants that are worthy of article mention- here's what I've found:

CAR-4 (M4A1- furniture mods can turn it into a LR300.

UAR (AUG A2)- A3 forend mod.

M308 (M14)- Jae 100 chassis, the EBR chassis is already shown in the article.

Ak5- FNC handguard and Ak5C stock + forend, no ability to give it a proper "C" carbine barrel though.

AMR-16 (M16A4)- can get the A1 handguard.

Compact 5 (MP5)- the MP5K can be unlocked for use in addition to being used in the Sentry gun.
[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 13:53, 13 September 2013 (EDT)

This ist LR 300 ??
[[File:Payday2 lr300 previu 1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Lr300 ???]]
--[[User:Mateogala|MTOOO]] ([[User talk:Mateogala|talk]]) 14:17, 13 September 2013 (EDT)

:I agree with mentioning this in the main article. I have also found that the Colt Model 733 is turned into a Colt Model 933 if attaching an optical sight. --[[User:RaNgeR|RaNgeR]] ([[User talk:RaNgeR|talk]]) 14:37, 13 September 2013 (EDT)

==Finish==

Article finished. Make any other screenshots? --[[User:Mateogala|MTOOO]] ([[User talk:Mateogala|talk]]) 11:01, 15 September 2013 (EDT)

== Anyone know what rifle this is? ==

[[File:Payday2SR.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

This is the picture from the sniper asset you can buy on Watchdogs day 2. Anyone know what rifle he's carrying? Looks like a Remington 700 variant, but I'm having trouble identifying the specific model.--[[User:Lynx|Lynx]] ([[User talk:Lynx|talk]]) 12:09, 12 October 2013 (EDT)

== DLC weapons ==

A DLC has been released including 3 new guns and in two days another DLC will release adding yet another 3 new guns. So if anyone feels inclined to properly identify the real life models and add screenshots, I would appreciate it. I would do so myself but having played the game all my guns are heavily customized at this point.

Armored Transport DLC includes a SIG 551-A1 SBR (From what I can tell, might be a different model), a Walther PPK and a Carl Gustav M/45 sub machine gun (Which is erroneously stated to be .45 cal on the DLC page).

http://www.overkillsoftware.com/armoredtransport/

The DLC to be released will include a FN SCAR-H, a HK MP7 and a handgun I can't identify.

http://www.overkillsoftware.com/gageweaponpack01/

- [[User:Mutant1988|Mutant1988]] ([[User talk:Mutant1988|talk]])

The unidentified handgun seems to be a Sig Sauer P226.

I've started uploading screenshots of the weapons in the first DLC. Won't be uploading any for the second pack, as I have no intent of buying it right now. Would appreciate it if someone wrote some
descriptions and correctly identify the Sig Sauer model. - [[User:Mutant1988|Mutant1988]] ([[User talk:Mutant1988|talk]])

I got both DLCs so I'll upload the screencap a when I get the chance. [[User:Kona|Kona]] ([[User talk:Kona|talk]]) 11:46, 28 December 2013 (EST)

The most recent update (Death Wish) added a new difficulty and in that difficulty, we have two more weapons featured in the hands of NPCs (The guns are currently unavailable to players). The guns being the HK UMP and the Benelli M4 (Which seems to be based on the H2O model, but with a solid instead of a telescoping stock). Both seen featured here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8CMPB03-pw&feature=player_detailpage#t=45 - [[User:Mutant1988|Mutant1988]] ([[User talk:Mutant1988|talk]])

Another DLC pack incoming - 3 sniper rifles to add to the arsenal, all featured in this video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sNs9yQcc5ew

Pictures and in-game names are scheduled to be revealed tomorrow. So far though, I've identified one of them as a Barret M95. [[User:Mutant1988|Mutant1988]] ([[User talk:Mutant1988|talk]])
:Looks like the other two are the Blaser R93 LRS2 and a Remington 700 with verious chassis mods (wooden M40A5 and MSR, it looks like). Barret seems weirdly semi auto.[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:24, 6 May 2014 (EDT)
"Barret seems weirdly semi auto.". Well, it is a video game bolt action rifle. I think the limited FOV cuts off the actual bolt operation animation. If you look closely, you can see that the right hand isn't holding the grip after shooting (At about 26,5s in the video). --[[User:Mutant1988|Mutant1988]] ([[User talk:Mutant1988|talk]]) 20:53, 6 May 2014 (EDT)

I am very lazy. I apologize for that. Anyway, I uploaded inventory screenshots of the shotguns from the "Gage Shotgun Pack" DLC. --[[User:Mutant1988|Mutant1988]] ([[User talk:Mutant1988|talk]]) 03:13, 4 September 2014 (EDT)

== MP5A2/A3/KN? ==

Now, correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't the presence of a burst fire option in the selector make them MP5A4, A5, SD5, SD6 and KA4 respectively? --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 15:15, 8 June 2014 (EDT)
:Actually the texture is kinda goofed, the selector has no Safe option, it doesn't have a crossed out white bullet pictogram, instead it has a white Semi pictogram, so technically it has no Safe mode, it just has Semi/Burst/Auto. :\ [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 00:24, 4 July 2014 (EDT)
[[File:PAYDAY2 weird MP5 fire selector.jpg|thumb|none|400px]]

== Missed lots of guns, MP7, and FAL's pic, three new shotguns DLC which include Benelli M4 , STRIKER12, and KSG, anyone wants to work with me? ==

I m newbie, so don't know too much about it.....

== FN FNC ==

The "Belgian Heat" handguard changes the AK5 to a FNC. Could someone in possession of the mod add it on please?

[[User:Kona|Kona]] ([[User talk:Kona|talk]]) 22:14, 21 August 2014 (EDT)

== PSG-1 from Modded G3? ==

I have noticed that modding Gewehr 3 with DMR Kit, Precision foregrip, grip and stock will create a gun that heavily resembles H&K PSG-1, should it be included in the list?
and if so, under what category should it be in?, since the ridle is not a proper sniper rifle in game so to speak

Here's the said rifle:
[[File:2014-10-05 00001.jpg|800px|thumb|none|alt text]]

--[[User:Pyronite|Pyronite]] ([[User talk:Pyronite|talk]]) 00:50, 5 October 2014 (EDT)

It looks like [[Heckler & Koch SR9TC]].
[[File:HKSR9TC.jpg|600px|thumb|none|H&K SR9(TC) rifle with tropical forearm and bipod - 7.62x51mm. The TC version has the PSG buttstock as well as the trigger pack.]]
--[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]] ([[User talk:Seganamcofan|talk]]) 10:40, 5 October 2014 (EDT)

It actually uses the original PSG-1 parts so it's not a SR9TC, even though, I'd say it's more a hybrid than other. --[[User:James Dalcan|James Dalcan]]

:That gun is a total mongrel, it is no real G3 variant. Firstly, there is a paddle mag release which rules out the SR9 and PSG-1. The combination of a front sight post and the PSG style handguard might suggest an MSG90A1, however it has a plain barrel, the trigger pack is the original metal type rather than the polymer Navy type used on the MSG90, and the rear sight is a normal diopter rather than the one used on the MSG90. Technically, I would say that it is a G3 fitted with a PSG-1 handguard, butt and trigger shoe, and a plain heavy barrel (it is not the normal PSG-1 one though, it is too short). --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 20:27, 5 October 2014 (EDT)

::That is exactly what it is in game, it's essentially G3 modded with PSG-1 parts (possible in reality or not aside), now the question is that is it worth mentioning somewhere in the main article or not, even as Modded variant and another gun itself. --[[User:Pyronite|Pyronite]] ([[User talk:Pyronite|talk]]) 21:27, 5 October 2014 (EDT)

== John Wick DLC ==

OVERKILL released a new DLC based on [[John Wick]], which added John as a playable character, a Glock 26, three new accessories for the pistols, two new grips for the Glocks, and the ability the dual wield the Glock 26, the Operator, the Beretta 92 (a shout-out to Matrix, perhaps?) and the Desert Eagle.

They added another weapon, a SPAS 12, with it's own sets of mods and all.

== Gage Historic Pack DLC ==

OVERKILL is making a new weapon pack full of WWII era weapons. The weapons are, at least by my guess, to be a MG42, a Mauser C96, either a Sten gun or a Sterling, and a sniper version of the Mosin-Nagant. So apparently with the purchase of the pack, you get to murder cops with an 100 year old handgun. ([[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]])
: http://overkillsoftware.com/gagehistoricalpack/ [[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 19:18, 11 November 2014 (EST)

Well, I was close, the weapons in it are an MG42, named the Buzzsaw 42, a Sterling, named the Pratchett L2A1, the C96 is named the Broomstick, and the Mosin 91/30 is named the Mosin-Nagant. Even so, you get to murder cops with WWII-era weaponry. ([[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]])

== Chicago Typewriter ==

A M1928 was added the game to celebrate two million people joining the PAYDAY Steam Group.

http://www.overkillsoftware.com/2million/

Still haven't unlocked any mods since they're dropped in the Payday instead of being unlocked via achievements, but still, it's pretty neat. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 21:22, 4 December 2014 (EST)

== L85 is upcoming , in Clover Character Dlc ==

http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/thediamond/

== The Bomb Heists DLC Weapons ==
The HS Produkt VHS-2 and HS Produkt HS2000 40SW model is added on The Bomb Heists DLC. Its named "Lion’s Roar rifle" and "LEO pistol". --[[User:Seganamcofan|Seganamcofan]]

It's an Springfield Armory XDM, actually. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 03:22, 26 January 2015 (EST)

== XDM/HS2000 ==

I'm a bit perplexed by the XDM, since it has the serrations of a XDM, and yet they still went out of their way to label it HS. It appears that Springfield just markets the HS2000 in the US, everything is still manufactured in Croatia. Is there an international version of the XDM that HS sells? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 23:03, 1 February 2015 (EST)

== Why do the images have the weapons' actual names in quotes? ==

It seems kind of weird having image descriptions that state things like; 'The player holds the "Brügger & Thomet TP9-US".' despite the fact that those are the actual names of the weapons. Wouldn't it be more fitting to say; 'The player holds the "CMP".', or at least remove the quotes? The way that it's set up just really bothers me.
--[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 00:38, 2 February 2015 (EST)
:It's standard practice to include the name of the actual weapon, and there's nothing wrong with having the alias in quotes. I see nothing wrong here. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 07:11, 2 February 2015 (EST)
:: Well, I gotta admit seeing the quoted weapon name on almost every in-game thumbnail does look a bit annoying, not to mention a wee bit redundant perhaps. But as said, there's nothing actually wrong with it. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 13:04, 2 February 2015 (EST)
::Oh, you mean in the captions. Yes, that's a bit annoying. I wouldn't object if someone took them out. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 13:44, 2 February 2015 (EST)
:::I think it's an artifact of Mateogala not really speaking English, he puts the in-game weapon name in quotes I guess because he saw a page where that was done with a fictional or hybrid weapon. If anyone's doing a find / replace for that, could they also swap "player" for "player character?" That one always bugs me, the player isn't the guy in the game. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 17:55, 2 February 2015 (EST)
::::Yeah, I was referring to the captions, should've been a bit more concise. There's nothing inherently wrong with it, it's just ever so slightly bothersome to me personally. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 22:18, 3 February 2015 (EST)

== We are getting a Minigun and AT4 ==

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EWpeEe6qxHc But one thing confuse me is in the video, it shows an AT4, but in store page, the introduction says it's RPG.

== We are going to get a MAC 11 ==

http://media.overkillsoftware.com/2015/02/hlm2_jacket_gun_screen.png

Unlock it through purchase Hotline Miami 2 digital pack on March 10.

It's a MAC 11, right?

Looks more like a Cobray M11/9. [[User:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|Hi, My Name Is GameZone]] ([[User talk:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|talk]]) 18:07, 25 February 2015 (EST)

== OVERKILL DLC ==

The weapons have been announced for the DLC. They are a handheld M134 Minigun and an RPG-7. This is gonna be fun. [[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]] 12:29, 6 March 2015 (EST)

== M134 Barrels ==

The article mentions that they don't move, but they actually do, at least with the short and Vulcan-esque barrels. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 09:21, 7 March 2015 (EST)

Okay, I just checked, the default and Aerial Assault barrel definitely move, but I'm still not sure about the short ones, I have no money in game at the moment, so I can't check right now. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 09:40, 7 March 2015 (EST)

I just read a lot of people saying they didn't spin on the forums and reddit, I didn't actually check myself. I just watched a video and they were spinning in first person, so maybe they just don't spin in 3rd person or maybe those people were wrong. [[User:S3anyBoy|S3anyBoy]] ([[User talk:S3anyBoy|talk]]) 14:25, 7 March 2015 (EST)

After some testing, I managed to find out that if your game is running at 30, 60 or 120 FPS the barrels appear to not rotate due to the monitor not being able to actually register the spin before it refreshes. In 45, 50, 75, and 135 the barrel jumps around, but some rotation can be seen. So in conclusion, yeah, they do spin. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 01:01, 8 March 2015 (EST)

Do you know if the 3rd person model spins as well? [[User:S3anyBoy|S3anyBoy]] ([[User talk:S3anyBoy|talk]]) 14:44, 8 March 2015 (EDT)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hS6h4NTd3w&feature=youtu.be --[[User:Mateogala|Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr]] ([[User talk:Mateogala|talk]]) 17:26, 8 March 2015 (EDT)

:I have a feeling this might be the same optical illusion that causes car wheels to stop spinning or rotate backwards: if the barrels are in the same position every time the screen refreshes, the minigun will appear to not be turning even though it actually is. The reason it appears to be totally stopped is the lack of motion blur on them, I think. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 17:33, 8 March 2015 (EDT)

:: If I knew how to record at around 600-1200 FPS (Which can be done) I could make a video showing the barrels rotating. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 01:00, 9 March 2015 (EDT)

I've seen videos of first person showing them spinning (I don't have enough to buy the weapon myself yet.) What I'm asking is if the 3rd person model spins as well. Payday 2 (like lots of games) has separate models for first person and 3rd person, the 3rd person models are significantly lower quality and the animations for them are less precise (look at this mod that replaced the 3rd person models with the 1st person ones to see https://steamcommunity.com/app/218620/discussions/15/558754900072790886). The only person I saw using the minigun ingame only had it for a few seconds and I didn't get a chance to see if the barrels spun in 3rd person. Regardless I removed the part about them not spinning, but may add a note if they don't spin in 3rd person. [[User:S3anyBoy|S3anyBoy]] ([[User talk:S3anyBoy|talk]]) 13:16, 9 March 2015 (EDT)

==P30L?==
I'm thinking of buying this game since it's on sale on Steam (along with it's ludicrous amount of DLC). BUT, didn't Overkill really add H&K P30Ls with the John Wick update? I was kinda hoping I'd see them in the game. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 08:10, 10 March 2015 (EDT)

They added a Glock 26 (Chimano Compact) with John Wick as his signature gun. [[User:S3anyBoy|S3anyBoy]] ([[User talk:S3anyBoy|talk]]) 10:03, 10 March 2015 (EDT)

There isn't a P30L in the game, but there are pistols in the game that you can mod to look similar to it, like the USP (Interceptor .45 in game) with either the Facepunch Compensator or the Match slide, the Signature .40 (SIG P226) modified with the Facepunch compensator also looks similar, then the Chimano Custom (Glock 22C) kinda sorta but not really looks like it with the Facepunch again. But your best bet would be the Interceptor .45[[User:Kornflakes89|Kornflakes89]] ([[User talk:Kornflakes89|talk]]) 22:34, 12 March 2015 (EDT)

:I got the game a couple of days ago. I'm fine with the USP Expert, but they are not the same as P30Ls. Oh, and I've never been a fan of modifying my weapons in games, and I haven't modified the Expert yet. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 04:53, 13 March 2015 (EDT)

::Modifying most of your guns to be useful is a pretty key feature in PayDay 2. Most of the weapons are not at their highest capability stock, and some of them are even detrimental as so. It does suck at times, because you often have to make your gun look ridiculously stupid in order for it to be useful, but that's just the way the game works. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 06:49, 13 March 2015 (EDT)

:::I know, right. I've played the first one, which honestly felt a bit frustrating at times (partially because every enemy took almost 15+ rounds to kill depending on the weapon), and the Payday 2 beta. This one is less frustrating. I'm currently using the SCAR-H and the Expert, or the 1911, 'cause they take only a couple of shots to kill the enemies (well, cops, let's be honest) even without any modifications. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 07:31, 13 March 2015 (EDT)

== New Over-Under Shotgun ==

[[File:PD2-OU-Side.jpg|thumb|500px|none|]]
[[File:PD2-OU-Front.jpg|thumb|500px|none]]

Introduced with (free) Bonnie character pack March 13th. A 12 Gauge Over-Under. Anyone know what kind? I think a Beretta, but not sure.[[User:S3anyBoy|S3anyBoy]] ([[User talk:S3anyBoy|talk]]) 20:28, 16 March 2015 (EDT)

:Beretta 682 Gold E. [[User:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|Hi, My Name Is GameZone]] ([[User talk:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|talk]]) 20:53, 16 March 2015 (EDT)

Looks like a Beretta S3 O/U and CZ Redhead Deluxe O/U hybrid so I added it as such. [[User:Kona|Kona]] ([[User talk:Kona|talk]]) 01:39, 19 March 2015 (EDT)

== Butcher Mod pack ==

There's new mods for most of the old weapons (And a stealth mod for the saw, thank God), the new lower reciever for the AUG turns it into a EF88, the CQC barrel for the Ak 5 turns it to an Ak 5c and I haven't bought them yet, but there's mods for both the MP5 (An straight magazine that rechambers it to 10mm), and a barrel jacket and suppressor for the P90. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 18:04, 19 March 2015 (EDT)
<gallery widths="300px" heights="169px">
File:Payday_2_EF88_left.jpg|Left side.
File:Payday_2_EF88_right.jpg|Right side.
</gallery>
Oh, and Big Boss' M1911's suppressor for Metal Gear Solid 3 was added. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 18:16, 19 March 2015 (EDT)

== AA12, M32 grenade launcher is coming soon ==

http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/bbq/

Don't know what the Flamethrower is, looks cool

In the very articulate words of Hiimdaisy's rendition of Yosuke from Persona 4: "Dude, dude, dude, duuude[...]" Also, the flamethrower is a prop made by the special effects artist of the studio where Overkill recorded this and the Overkill Pack trailer. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 01:17, 27 March 2015 (EDT)

== Animation update ==

Not only did they add new animations for practically everything, the P90, G36, AUG and the Expert Mag have bullets that are removed when you fire them. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 18:52, 16 April 2015 (EDT)

== Butchers Western Pack & Butchers BBQ Pack ==

"Make your bullets count with the Peacemaker .45 Revolver where six bullets is enough to see six helmets fly. For those who need a few bullets more there is the Repeater 1874 Sniper Rifle. The Plainsrider Bow if you need no bullets at all. An arrow kills and doesn't make a sound. Unless you attach a pack of dynamite to it, which you can. The dynamite also comes as a throwable so you don't need to go through the potential hassle of having a bow. Ride off into the sunset with four new masks, patterns and achievements. Giddy up!"

The revolver appears to be the Colt Single Action Army and the lever action rifle appears to be based on the Winchester Model 1894.

"• Piglet Grenade Launcher, 12G Steakout Shotgun
• Did we mention the Flamethrower Mk.1"

The Piglet Grenade Launcher is the M32 MGL, the Steakout 12G is the AA-12 (though the Ithica Stakeout would have been more suitable, no?) and the

[[User:Kona|Kona]] ([[User talk:Kona|talk]]) 03:30, 9 May 2015 (EDT)

--flamethrower is entirely fictional. Based off of the prop used in the BBQ Pack trailer. And the rifle is actually based on the [[Winchester Model 1873]]. [[User:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|Hi, My Name Is GameZone]] ([[User talk:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|talk]]) 18:00, 9 May 2015 (EDT)

== Alesso heist ==

So far, there's only one weapon added, a Mateba 2006 which, probably intentionally, is called Matever, like in the English translation of Ghost in the Shell. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 22:37, 20 May 2015 (EDT)

== My word this is a huge article ==

There's room to pack it down. Given the unholy assload of guns and variants and combinations that's not going to get any shorter, I think it'd be a good idea to arrange the guns not in absolute alphabetical order, but rather ordered, bunched and combined according to the game's own lists - the article for [[Far Cry 2]] already shows it works. The screenshots can also show off and tell much more with a way smaller amount of images, not to mention cutting out the HUD crap and bringing them up to date with the animation overhaul.

I've redone the AMCAR (Colt Model 733) and AK5 (Bofors Ak 5, FN Herstal FNC) sections in the way I mean, although I'd still double-stack all those thumbnails. Let me know if this doesn't fly. --[[User:AVK|AVK]] ([[User talk:AVK|talk]]) 16:38, 16 June 2015 (EDT)

:While a change like that would be drastic, maybe removing all those screenshots and sub-articles about guns (like how the Mosin-Nagant can be modified into the carbine and sniper version) and just have "here is gun X" a few screenshots of that gun, and then some text saying "Gun X can be modified into gun Y and Z" Doing that would save a lot of space and time.

::I think you're right, blowing up the main index can wait and see. I don't know how austere you're aiming for with the subtypes, though. There's tons of trivia and other stuff to tell and the subtypes/showcase of minor mods can all be packed into the screenshots showing off the unique stuff like reloads and sight pictures. The AK5 pileup is a good indicator of what I'm going for (and I mean to stay the course for now), but that can always be stripped down further if it's still too heavy a read. --[[User:AVK|AVK]]

::: I also think we should remove the "modified versions of {gun modified to look like a variant of the gun)", because, Jesus Christ, it's already modified. [[User:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|Hi, My Name Is GameZone]] ([[User talk:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|talk]]) 14:24, 17 June 2015 (EDT)

::::What you did with the Ak5 was really good AVK. Maybe the entire article should be restructured in that style? I'm not the one to decided but it would be a good idea.
:::::I don't really see why having a long page is that big of an issue if there indeed that many guns in the game. Unless users are having issues loading the page, and AFAIK no one is, then there's no point worrying about it. And why would the FNC be under the Ak5? Isn't the Ak5 a variant of the FNC and not the other way around? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 17:55, 17 June 2015 (EDT)
:::::: The Ak5 is the base weapon unlocked in game, which can be modified into a suedoFNC with attachments. I think the page should be cleaned up in the above manner.[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 19:12, 17 June 2015 (EDT)
::::::: If I can put my two cents into this, I like the way that AVK has structured the AK5 and AMCAR sections, it is both nice to read, injects some humor into the page and is much more nicer than having ten pictures per entry detailing everything about the weapon. I say restructure the article. --[[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]] 19:48, 17 June 2015 (EST)
::::::::Lose the right justification on the weapon image. We don't have that anywhere else on the site, and there's no reason to start now. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 20:02, 17 June 2015 (EDT)
:::::::::It's an exception, but so is the bizarre imaginary halfbreed end result itself - hence it being listed after all the relevant Ak 5 stuff. The placement follows the game's logic and considering the spiritual status of the gun (major role in Heat), it doesn't deserve to be smooshed down into a sidenote in the captions either. It may be a breach of order, but I think that's the way it makes the most sense. --[[User:AVK|AVK]] ([[User talk:AVK|talk]]) 13:53, 18 June 2015 (EDT)
:::::::::Wait no you were talking about the formatting. Works for me. --[[User:AVK|AVK]]

== New guns in yet another DLC pack. ==

Alright, two new DLC'ssss came out yesterday (date: 25-6-15) The gold grin casino heist adds this new gun called the Cavity 9mm (referencing The Dentist contractor in game)
<gallery widths="300px" heights="169px">
File:Cavity 9mm payday2.jpeg
File:Cavity 9mm ditto payday2.jpg
</gallery>

So what is this gun based of? I think it might be a Kel-Tec weapon but im not sure.

Also the AS Val (i think, correct me if im wrong) was added with the Sokol character DLC. Sokol is some russian hockey dude. Really, the gun is what im hear for. It is possible to modify the gun with a wooden stock similar to the sniper variant of the weapon.
<gallery widths="300px" heights="169px">
File:AS val rightside PD2.jpg
File:AS Val leftside PD2.jpg
</gallery>

Give me the proper names for the guns and i'll put it up on the PD2 article.
:It's Kel-tec Sub2000, and another user already added it yesterday. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 13:50, 26 June 2015 (EDT)
::Well that was quick. But the other gun, is it a AS val?
:::Yes, it is an AS Val, can be modded to resemble the VSS Vintorez. [[User:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|Hi, My Name Is GameZone]] ([[User talk:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|talk]]) 17:02, 26 June 2015 (EDT)
::::Alright.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:11, 26 June 2015 (EDT)

== Reformatting ==

This page REALLY needs someone to reformat it. It has around 3 different formatting styles on it as well as an abundance of links and some empty entries. As I said earlier with this topic, I think we should let AVK reformat and redo this page. His additions are really good, rather funny and would cut the size of the article down by quite a substantial bit as it would eliminate all the seperate sections for guns that only exist if you mod one of the base weapons. (The Mosin Nagant section is a prime example of that). I know my word doesn't mean much in the eyes of the higher-ups, but I'm being real here, this page NEEDS reformatting. --[[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]] 02:07, 7 July 2015 (EST)
:I agree, excuse my language here but this page is a real clusterf**k. As you mentioned with the Nagant, sure you can modify the weapon so it looks like some other variant of it, but it is still the same weapon with slightly different stats. Someone (i assume AVK) reformatted the CAR-4 page so instead of having a billion entries, it now just shows the basic M4A1, which is much better.

:What we should do here is either just have a few pictures of the basic gun, and then point out in text and not additional sections or even more pictures, it should something like "X gun can be modified to look like the X1A4 version" Either that or just have something like 4 pictures (one form the menu, in game idle and 2 for reloading) and with each picture have the gun in a different setup, kinda like how the AK5 entry is like now.

:I personally think we should straight up delete some entries that are superfluous. Also, one last note, a few entries here are outdated, im going to delete some pictures here and there (beginning with the Socom 16) and replace the pictures with the up to date ones--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:57, 19 August 2015 (EDT)

== Gage Ninja Pack ==

Now that everyone's favorite money hoarding gun launderer is back, Overkill added a new weapon pack to the game, titled the Ninja Pack.
http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/ninjapack/
Obviously, it's based on melee, poisonous and throwing weapons, but there's already three projectile weapons confirmed, a crossbow, an TDI Vector, and a WA-2000, which I'm assuming it's a reference to Hitman 2, where the ninja snipers used customized versions of it.

Also, a semiautomatic sniper rifle, freaking finally. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 17:15, 14 July 2015 (EDT)

:Unless they decide to portray it as a bolt-action rifle for consistency. [[User:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|Hi, My Name Is GameZone]] ([[User talk:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|talk]]) 18:24, 14 July 2015 (EDT)

::The trailer made it seem like it was semiauto, albeit firing ''very'' slowly, although faster than the other sniper rifles. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 23:56, 14 July 2015 (EDT)

I finally got the DLC, and to be honest? I think it's bugged. The Crossbow has two arm options that do exactly the same thing, and two grip options, where one is inherently better than the other because one gives you +1 concelament, and the other, well, doesn't. The WA-2000 has three grips, (One ivory, one ebony, and one walnut), but the ivory and walnut one do the exact same thing, which is giving a +3 in stability, but a -3 in concealment. Maybe OVERKILL wanted to make the players be able to choose between those, I'm not sure.

The KRISS, however, is pretty much a sidegrade to Jacket's Piece, a bit more damage and accuracy for lower stability. It even has exclusive attachments that do the exact same thing as JP's ones do.

Overall, though, a very fun addition to the game. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 01:48, 18 July 2015 (EDT)

== Deleting unnecessary entries ==

As anyone who visited this page now, it has a ''ton'' of entries, many of which are just superfluous. For example, the MP5 in the game can indeed be modified to look like a bunch of different MP5's, but it's still the same gun but with different stats, so the additional entries are just excessive. So what im proposing is that someone (me, for example) delete all these additional entries for guns that have way to many of em', like the MP5, FAL, P90, AA-12 etc. Then i will just have one entry for each gun and within that entry showing the different versions with pictures or mentioning them in text.

Although before i start doing any of this, i must ask if i can just straight up delete entries. Can i just do that or will the ban hammer fall?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:47, 20 August 2015 (EDT)

:Bear in mind, that we catalogue the appearances of different guns. It is irrelevant whether in the game universe it is simply a "Compact-5" fitted with a "Ninja Foregrip" and the "Adjustable Stock", in actuality the game model is that of an MP5SD6 so in my opinion it should be listed as such. I think there is an argument to be made for collecting together the firearms that are built from the same gun, like the AK5 section currently is, but I think that any real gun that is built by modifying a base gun should be properly listed. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 13:41, 20 August 2015 (EDT)

::That's is what im proposing however, collect the entries into one instead of having a whole slew of different ones, delete the additional entries and mash em' all together.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:04, 21 August 2015 (EDT)

== More DLC means more guns ==

So a new character pack was just announced (here's the trailer https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0A1Zb_HX-6g) Gun wise we're gonna get a Micro Uzi. So that's cool. No pictures of it yet however, but if the outline of it in the trailer is to be believed then it has the stock unfolded it seems--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:04, 20 August 2015 (EDT)

== SWAT van turret ==

[[File:SWAT van turret PD2.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

Anyone know what this gun is? Looks like some type of Browning thing.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 20:01, 2 September 2015 (EDT)

:M2 Browning. [[User:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|Hi, My Name Is GameZone]] ([[User talk:Hi, My Name Is GameZone|talk]]) 20:17, 2 September 2015 (EDT)

::Deep--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:55, 3 September 2015 (EDT)

:::Added an entry and used that screenshot. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 00:13, 1 April 2016 (EDT)

== New machine gun (M240?) ==

So on Crimefest day 5 they added a new machine gun (for free!) called the KSP 58. Now, it seems to be a M240, but the name and the stampings made me wonder if it is actually the machine gun used by the swedish army (which is still an M240 but :/) The name KSP might be a short for Kulspruta (machinegun in swedish) and i recognize that 58 designation from somewhere.
[[File:PD2 M240 left.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]
[[File:PD2 M240 right.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]
[[File:PD2 M240 stampings.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

If you look closely at the markings one of them says Svea Rike (a fancier way of saying sweden in swedish) Mind you, stampings aren't always true to life in Payday 2, as evident on this very weapon where it says it was manufactured by Snusk (filth) manufacturing.

Anyhow, what i wonder is what this weapon is called by the swedish military.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:14, 20 October 2015 (EDT)
:It is called the "Ksp 58" by the Swedish military, google it. The original Belgian designation is FN MAG58,too.[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 13:24, 20 October 2015 (EDT)
::Alright then, too bad i don't use google :/--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:51, 20 October 2015 (EDT)
: I believe it's an M240 with an FN MAG stock, as it has a picatinny rail on the receiver, a feature (to my knowledge) that is not on the FN MAG. [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 19:14, 22 October 2015 (EDT)
::It seems to be a mix between an M240, FN MAG and the KSP58. But im not to sure.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:40, 23 October 2015 (EDT)

== Point break heist (!) ==

Apparently Overkill is gonna promote the Point Break remake nobody asked for with a new heist in Payday 2. (Here's the [http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/pointbreak/ minisite] and [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rCtAFwx5ak trailer])

Along with it comes this new gun (and some sniper rifle with the new character, can be a Remington 700 but it's hard to tell)
[[File:PD2 newgun.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

What's the name of that gun? Isn't it some modernized CZ?

And to answer the question you didn't ask, i'll buy all of it.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:28, 1 December 2015 (EST)

:Looks like a modern Jericho 941 variant --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 17:29, 1 December 2015 (EST)
::I looked it up and it actually seems to be just that!--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:48, 1 December 2015 (EST)
:::Interestingly I got a chance to shoot that same Jericho in .45 not that long ago. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 18:30, 1 December 2015 (EST)
[[File:PD2 newgun sniper.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]
Here's the new rifle they're adding with the free character pack. No idea what it's supposed to look like. Here's the [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tKo8fFv7x5E trailer]--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:09, 2 December 2015 (EST)
:Going by the name and the shape of the front of the foregrip, I want to say it's a [[Winchester Model 70]], but with the trigger guard and magazine slightly projecting from the bottom like that I'm not so sure. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 18:08, 2 December 2015 (EST)
::Here's a real fancy [https://sketchfab.com/models/d7872f33b73d42239b55569f9a5c1ab1 render] of it. --[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:24, 2 December 2015 (EST)
:::Anyhow, it might be a M70, since that gun was in Point Break, albeit briefly.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:25, 2 December 2015 (EST)
:::Yeah, I don't know a whole lot about bolt-action rifles beyond the history of use for a handful of models, but after getting a good look at that render and noticing the safety lever behind the bolt handle, I'm convinced it's a Model 70 with FN's [http://www.midwayusa.com/product/932445/fnh-tbm-trigger-guard-and-detachable-box-magazine-fn-spr-pbr-tsr-winchester-model-70-short-action-with-5-round-and-10-round-magazine Tactical Box Magazine adapter]. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 19:38, 2 December 2015 (EST)
:Tacticool for all operators...Anyhow, thanks for the help!--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 19:49, 2 December 2015 (EST)
::I wouldn't really say a detachable box magazine is tacicool, but yeah it is a Winchester Model 70 with a FN Tactical Box Magazine adapter. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 20:42, 2 December 2015 (EST)
:::It has tactical in its name so it has to be!--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 20:49, 2 December 2015 (EST)

== About the 1911 LO's 10 round mag ==

Mind you, im no expert on this, but according to the page, the 10 round capacity is wrong, however, the magazine clearly has an extended base plate, would that allow for 10 rounds? Additionally the extended magazine mode for the weapon, is called 12rnd mag although its in-game capacity is 16 rounds, but according to the page the actual capacity of that mag is 10 rounds, is that true?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:01, 28 December 2015 (EST)

== Organizing ==

Unless anyone objects, im planning on reorganizing this page so weapons are shown more in order, for example, the entry for the sniper riles is a bit of a mess, showing the last unlocked sniper first and the nagant in the middle and so forth.

Also they added a full size ithaca 37 shotgun in the latest DLC, screens incoming.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:07, 14 January 2016 (EST)

:It's already in alphabetical order, so I personally don't think it should be reorganizing. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 07:14, 15 January 2016 (EST)
::Should it be in alphabetical order or in order of appearance?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:01, 15 January 2016 (EST)
::: I've always preferred ordering by appearance/prominence; alphabetical listings seem rather arbitrary unless the weapons have all relatively equal showcasing. That said, a bigger thing for me would be condensing and splitting some sections, mainly splitting the handguns into pistols and revolvers and the combined rifles section into separate Assault Rifles/Carbines and other (Battle) rifles sections. Also need to check where some weapons are listed - The TEC-9 is in the handguns section but really should be in the SMG section (we generally categorize machine pistols with SMGs on pages, even semiautomatic-only ones that fit the 'legal' definition of a pistol - we don't regard that in terms of classification). Likewise also put the minigun in the machine gun section (should omit 'light' from it, since that's a bit too specific and some of the MGs in there may not be considered 'light' MGs, it's argumentative, better to be more general and inclusive in that regard). [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 14:06, 15 January 2016 (EST)
::::Sounds like a good idea, should i start doing sections like that? Or will the admins just undo it?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:24, 15 January 2016 (EST)

== Wolf Pack ==

The ride never ends with DLC. The Wolf Pack has been announced and is gonna be released on 2/11. Free for whoever bought the original Wolf Pack for PAYDAY: The Heist. It has two new "Classic" heists, which are remakes of "Counterfeit" and "Undercover". Also is a new grenade launcher, which is a China Lake, as if the Piglet wasn't enough. --[[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]], 9 February 2016 (EST)
:More DLC for me to buy, yey.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:30, 9 February 2016 (EST)

== Revenge of the Reformatting 4: Return of the Reloaded Resurrection ==

Alright, so I've been doing some thinking on how to reformat this damn page. There has been a whole lot of words but a lack of action, so here's what I'm purposing.

'''First:''' Split the categorizes so we have individual sections for AR's and BR's to give the page more breathing room.

'''Second:''' Put the guns in order of the level you unlock them at. With the pistols for example, the section should begin with the Glock 17, the first pistol unlocked, and end with the last pistol unlocked. the Desert Eagle. Then after the base game guns, we go with the community weapons in the order they were added. Lastly we go with the (paid) DLC pistols in the order they were added.

'''Third:''' Mark the community weapons with this (*) and the DLC weapons with (**). The other way around could work too.

Unless someone objects and think we should have the page in the clustertruck state it is in right now, I'll go ahead and start changing it.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 11:19, 12 February 2016 (EST)

:Go nuts. I would attempt to update this page, but it's so elaborate and convoluted it makes my eye hurts. It took me around 1-2 hours to sort out Darkest of Days and that was only text editing. So this is just a project to end all projects. That's what we get for having 4-5 different editing styles on one page. --[[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]] 13:16, 12 February 2016 (EST)
::Alright, I'll get to it. Probably gonna start with the pistols.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:57, 12 February 2016 (EST)

== About adding screenshots of modified versions ==

I have dropped that habit and i recommend to any future contributors that aren't me to NOT add pics of modified versions either.

However, if it is possible to mod a weapon into some different variant of the same weapon, like how it is possible to make the AKMS an AKM, the FAL an DSA SA58, the USP Tactical an USP Match etc etc, then i recommend adding pics of said additional variants. But don't fill up this page with even more screenshots than necessary of some mallninja abomination.
:Hear, hear, please continue with your work here.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 19:18, 18 March 2016 (EDT)
::I will, don't worry. There's a LOT to do but I'm working on it.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 19:36, 18 March 2016 (EDT)

== Another movie DLC collaboration ==

...and this time it's for the movie Hardcore Henry. Here's the [http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/hardcorehenry-trailer/ site] with the stuff. The guns added this time looks like those SR-2 Veresk subguns. They can be dual wielded.

Also, Sharlto Copley is voice acting his character, which is cool, unlike the John Wick DLC.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:25, 30 March 2016 (EDT)
:FOOKIN' P̶R̶A̶W̶N̶S̶ PIGS. Also, apparently "Heather" is what Veresk translates to in English.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:50, 30 March 2016 (EDT)
::Part 2 was released today and they added the Kalashnikov Concern PL-14 Lebedev prototype pistol. Gonna add a rough draft on the page. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:30, 31 March 2016 (EDT)
:::Nice work Wolf, leave the screenshots to me if you don't mind. Also, the copy and paste stats could possibliy be placeholder stats, we'll see.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:58, 31 March 2016 (EDT)
::::Regardless, it's a badass, almost sci-fi looking Russian pistol. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 23:31, 31 March 2016 (EDT)
:::::It's cool alright. Nice to see the russians are developing more modern weapons.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:34, 1 April 2016 (EDT)
::::::It looks kind of ridiculous when you're using the Prototype Barrel and a muzzle brake, though, since you have a compensator on top of another compensator. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 23:20, 2 June 2016 (EDT)

== New Stuff ==

So now that OVERKILL has freed PAYDAY away from 505, they've released Update 100 in an attempt to appease the angry masses. Besides changes to the safe system, they added a free version of the M67 known as the HEF Grenade. It's the same as the standard model, except it's painted black with generic grenade text and their logo stuck on the pin. They also updated the sentry guns, so now instead of a MP5K briefcase with a bunch of generic technical junk in it, it's now a FN P90 in a more home-made looking set up. They even added suppressed versions for some reason. --[[User:PaperCake|PaperCake]] 13:44. 3 June 2016 (EST)
:Yeah i saw that stuff yesterday. The suppressed turret has a smaller chance to be targeted by enemies, making it less likely to be exploded.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:08, 3 June 2016 (EDT)

== DLC, DLC never changes. ==

MOAR GUNS!! We got a M1887 and some CZ 805 BREN variant incoming.

Here's the [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HvJaX70QwzM trailer] for the new guns. Ron Pearlman in it for some reason.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 21:41, 12 June 2016 (EDT)
:Can anyone identify this exact 805 model?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:04, 15 June 2016 (EDT)
[[File:PD2 CZ805 misc1.jpg|thumb|400px|none|It's categorized as an SMG for some reason.]]

::Ron Perlman apparently voices the Biker character, since he was Clay Morrow and all... --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 17:08, 15 June 2016 (EDT)
:::It was a joke. Back to the point, the rifle, which model?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:29, 16 June 2016 (EDT)
::::If I were to hazard a guess, it looks like the CZ 805 BREN A2 model. --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 13:57, 16 June 2016 (EDT)
:::::Do anyone have any good pics of the A2 model lying around? I can't find any. (yes i know there's a pic of the A2 model here on the site but that's the carbine version)--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:05, 16 June 2016 (EDT)
::::::That should be a base 805, the A2 refers to the carbine version. There is a newer CZ807 if that is what you're thinking (it has a waffle patter magwell and different stock.)--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 01:56, 17 June 2016 (EDT)
So they don't have different "generations" of the 805, glock style?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 08:08, 17 June 2016 (EDT)
:It's just this but with CZ's STANAG compatible magwell. [[File:CZ805BRENA1 adjustablestock.jpg|none|500px|thumb|CZ 805 BREN A1 with newer adjustable stock - 5.56x45mm NATO]] [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 03:42, 20 June 2016 (EDT)
:That model lacks the mag release buttons however.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:38, 20 June 2016 (EDT)
::It's still the same gun, it just doesn't have a STANAG magwell installed. I couldn't find a image that matched that configuration. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 00:55, 21 June 2016 (EDT)
::This image has the magwell, but the finish and flash hider are wrong. http://www.armadninoviny.cz/domains/0023-armadninoviny_cz/useruploads/files/c4.jpg [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 01:05, 21 June 2016 (EDT)

== New Safehouse ==

Looks like Chains might be [http://i.imgur.com/fno7IQX.jpg thinking of getting the gang a new shotgun]. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 22:37, 8 October 2016 (EDT)
:It's a [[Pancor Jackhammer]], I really hope we're not getting the shotgun that was produced in more numbers in video games than the two that were ever made in real life again. What is this Overkill? The early 2000's? (I could say the same about DICE and the "DAO-12" in BF3.) [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 08:53, 9 October 2016 (EDT)
::Maybe the Payday Gang has a mission where they kidnap Ian McCollum to get access to "forgotten weapons."--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 09:11, 9 October 2016 (EDT)
:::Maybe they 3D print all those rare-ass guns with that thing from KF2.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:15, 9 October 2016 (EDT)
Either I wasn't paying very much attention over the last two weeks, or [http://i.imgur.com/AbZmFYa.jpg Chains put up another new blueprint after the party ended]. Looks like a COP .357 Derringer, specifically an image from the patent filing available on Wikipedia, same as the one for the Jackhammer above. Dunno if that's saying anything about what we could get in the future, considering we saw the Jackhammer picture then ended up with a Six12 - and, as mentioned, I have no idea when the COP blueprint actually showed up in the safehouse. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 22:27, 23 October 2016 (EDT)
:[[File:Payday2derringer.jpg|thumb|none|600px]] Here's a screen of it, I uploaded this before I read through this thread again, ah well....
:also, anyone else notice the rear MBUIS looks really wonky?--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 00:05, 4 November 2016 (EDT)
::Might be cuz you use mods, or maybe not...--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:43, 4 November 2016 (EDT)
:::It's like that too on the KSG.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 16:54, 5 November 2016 (EDT)

== John Wick Weapon Pack DLC ==

Latest Weapons DLC got [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w7qssrNuMOs released]. From the trailer, I noticed a SRS-A1, a pistol of sorts (Might be a .45, but I'm thinking a USP), and the UMP-45.--[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 14:29, 18 October 2016 (EDT)
:It's his compensated P30, which actually is already in the game (Wick can be seen shooting it in the new shooting range).--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 16:02, 18 October 2016 (EDT)
::The weapons included were apparently leaked some time ago, and yeah, the pack is going to include the SRS, P30L, and UMP45. Personally, I'm really happy to finally have a UMP. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 23:18, 18 October 2016 (EDT)
:::Same. Now lets see how long it'll take for them to bring this update to Xbox One and PS4 *chuckles* --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 23:22, 18 October 2016 (EDT)
Imma buy it with funds i've gotten from selling those retarded safes.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 05:45, 19 October 2016 (EDT)
:Alright shits, here's the [http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/jwweaponpack/ website] showing of the guns in more detail.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:24, 19 October 2016 (EDT)
::Nice sexy guns, only gripe is that the UMP45 doesn't hold 25 but eh, at least the P30 holds 15 and isn't another Desert Eagle clone. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:21, 19 October 2016 (EDT)
Can't say im a big fan of the low ammo pools. You're gonna go through the ammo on that UMP in a sec. Still, gotta say that the weapon models (atleast for later guns) in this game are really slick.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:18, 19 October 2016 (EDT)
:::On another note, police snipers have also been updated to use a scoped G3 that looks like it's trying to be a MSG90.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 17:14, 19 October 2016 (EDT)
Gonna take a closer look at that, thanks for the heads up.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:06, 19 October 2016 (EDT)
:[http://i.imgur.com/4zIGw0J.jpg I grabbed my own shot a couple days ago]. I figure one of you are going to get your own picture for it, though - are NPC weapons supposed to be that low-detail? [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 22:27, 23 October 2016 (EDT)
::Your screenshot is pretty good so we might as well use it. And yes, NPC weapons are that low res, no way to change it, aside from mods perhaps...--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 03:01, 24 October 2016 (EDT)

:::Another heads up with snipers, the snipers in Boiling point carry SVDs, and one can be found in Chains' armory. --[[User:Revolverman|Revolverman]] ([[User talk:Revolverman|talk]]) 21:24, 27 October 2016 (EDT)
Yeah, i've seen that, gotta get some screens.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 11:31, 28 October 2016 (EDT)

== FAL question ==

Is the config of the FAL below just some random custom thing using various aftermarket parts or is it something sold as a finished product? I only managed to find one image of a real FAL in a similar configuration.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:03, 3 November 2016 (EDT)
[[File:PD2 FAL misc1.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]
[[File:FAL whatisthis.jpg|thumb|600px|none|]]
:I think DSA made a FAL that looked like that, called a "Precision FAL" or something like that (the handguard definitely looks like a DSA free-float tube). It is slightly different though, DSA made Precision FALs that I have seen tend to have the adjustable rear sight and a heavy barrel with no muzzle device, whereas the game gun has the flip rear sight and a flash hider. My guess is that they were going for a Precision FAL, but these parts are left over from the fact they just modified the standard model rather than building one from scratch. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 14:28, 3 November 2016 (EDT)
::Thanks for the info!--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:03, 3 November 2016 (EDT)

== Gage Spec Ops Pack DLC ==

Ah, more [http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/specops/ DLC]. Shockingly, it only comes with one new weapon: The Arbiter which appears to be the Heckler & Koch XM-25 that's missing its scope.--[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 19:23, 24 November 2016 (EST)
:Guess who's buying more DLC.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 05:42, 25 November 2016 (EST)
::Just got me mits on it. It's kinda cool. Haven't gotten the XM25 yet, requires you to hunt for stuff.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:24, 25 November 2016 (EST)
:::Speed pull mag is causing some waves, as for most, its a pure upgrade with no downsides, with only the quadstacks being worth to take besides them, also there still isn't a free GL, which kinda sucks. --[[User:Revolverman|Revolverman]] ([[User talk:Revolverman|talk]]) 23:29, 25 November 2016 (EST)
:::EDIT: Oh, big change, cop flashbangs are now actually objects and not just a effect. I think they are just the concussion grenades but I can't really tell, got to run on lowest setting to get decent frames so its a blur. --[[User:Revolverman|Revolverman]] ([[User talk:Revolverman|talk]]) 23:33, 25 November 2016 (EST)
I can't say i ever pay any attention to the PD2 community, im just here to shoot things mindlessly for an hour or two then leave. And yes, i've seen those new grenades. The model is the same as the player usable flashbang.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:29, 26 November 2016 (EST)

== Scarface DLC ==

More [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRBvuUDPtS8 DLC] on the way, this time called Scarface. From the description, looks like we are getting a Chainsaw, a Rocket Launcher called the Commando 101 (I'm thinking this will be the M202 Flash), a new character and his signature weapon, the 'Little Friend' which will probably be the Colt AR-15. --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 18:13, 13 December 2016 (EST)
:Fucking hell, more DLC to buy...--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:21, 13 December 2016 (EST)
::At least it's not as bad as Train Simulator 2017 ($6,000 worth). --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 18:27, 13 December 2016 (EST)
:::Little Friend is suspected to be the M203 Underslung GL. Code for it has been dug up a while ago. I'd also find it really redundant to add the AR-15, when the M16 is one of the van ilia guns in the game. --[[User:Revolverman|Revolverman]] ([[User talk:Revolverman|talk]]) 20:17, 13 December 2016 (EST)
And there's two packs, goddamn. Well, i'll buy it as always. Wish imfdb was paying me for wasting my time on this.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 04:13, 14 December 2016 (EST)
:One of the new guns is the [https://sketchfab.com/models/0b5eb195d58a48878315e458099f2d0b "Little Friend 7.62 Rifle"]. Looks like it's an HK417 with a fixed stock and an attached M203. Considering what I've read regarding limitations in the engine regarding animations and attachments, I guess that's going to be exclusive to this one gun for now. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 17:07, 14 December 2016 (EST)
::Whoa, that looks sick! Actually looking forward to this now.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:37, 14 December 2016 (EST)
:::Well, assuming its stats are on par with the SCAR-H, thats going to be a beast of a rifle. --[[User:Revolverman|Revolverman]] ([[User talk:Revolverman|talk]]) 20:07, 14 December 2016 (EST)
::::You're right, the stats given on the site are pretty close matches for the SCAR-H. Main difference is twice the damage in return for only two full mags' worth of ammo and slightly lesser concealment (although I'm expecting it to take CAR/AMR attachments that can boost that higher than the SCAR can). [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 20:29, 14 December 2016 (EST)
::::You've really gotta appreciate the detail they give these things - the thing's even got finger print marks visible over the dust on the receiver. Do have to wonder why they picked a fixed M16 stock as the default for the gun, though. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 06:44, 15 December 2016 (EST)
I assume it has that stock to give it more of an M16 appearance. And yeah, the detail on the weapon is really good, Overkill has gotten better and better at making weapon models and animations.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 08:00, 15 December 2016 (EST)
:The Commando weapon is indeed the Flash. I'll get to adding entries and screenshots in a couple of hours...--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 06:08, 16 December 2016 (EST)
::Doing superb work AAAK. --[[User:Revolverman|Revolverman]] ([[User talk:Revolverman|talk]]) 07:57, 16 December 2016 (EST)

== John Wick heists DLC ==

Here's the [http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/johnwickheists/ website]. The new rifle is some kind of AR-10, looks like it's styled similarly to the Taran Tactical rifle in the movie.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:19, 7 February 2017 (EST)
[[File:PD2 AR10thingithink.jpg|thumb|600px|none|Here's the rifle.]]
Soooo, what could this rifle be?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:54, 8 February 2017 (EST)
:My best guess so far is a [https://www.smith-wesson.com/firearms/mp-10-308-win-optic-ready Smith & Wesson M&P10]. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 05:25, 9 February 2017 (EST)
::This gun has a VLTOR MUR upper, which I do not believe exists for AR-10 type rifles, so my guess is that this is just a TTI TR-1 that has had the lower bubba'd to turn it into a sort of .308. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 05:50, 9 February 2017 (EST)
:::So it's some sort of frankengun? Alright.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 06:09, 9 February 2017 (EST)
::::Quite a strange idea to name the rifle, as [[Smith & Wesson Model 10|more famous revolver]]. --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 07:31, 9 February 2017 (EST)
:::::First image I saw of a TR-1 looked almost exactly like the in-game weapon, and the "CL-3" written on the receiver in that sketchfab preview does look like it could be a fake name for a TR-1, so I'd have to agree they probably based it on that. Just to note, though, another look around did show me [http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/cc137/addax/AddaxSPR20.jpg~original a custom .308 AR with a VLTOR MUR upper] (combined with a JD Machine lower, even has the exact sort of curve to the bottom of the trigger guard), so I suppose it's at least possible that they could have based the weapon on an actual .308 AR rather than just taking a .223 one and shoving a .308 mag into it. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 17:59, 10 February 2017 (EST)
::::::That rifle is a .223, not a .308. To quote from [http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=518252 the source] it is a "Custom Addax 20" 5.56 Upper with Fluted Addax-BHW Polygonal 1:8 twist barrel, VLTOR MUR Upper receiver, mounted to a customers JD Machine Lower." Also, just to add the trigger guard is a removable changeable part on most lowers so that can't really be used for an ID. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 18:40, 10 February 2017 (EST)
:::::::Weird, I could have sworn it said that one was a .308 when I found it. Guess that's what I get for expecting Google to show me results with the words I looked for being anywhere near each other for once in its damned life. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 18:52, 10 February 2017 (EST)
Does anyone know what that AFG thing is called? Also, not sure where to put the entry for this rifle, should it be under sniper rifles or ARs?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 08:00, 9 February 2017 (EST)
:The AFG looks like a Strike Industries Cobra grip.--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 00:13, 10 February 2017 (EST)
::It lacks the wings that wrap up the side, so to me it is closer to an Extreme Arms Tactical or a Veriforce angled grip. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 05:15, 10 February 2017 (EST)
This might help you guys out: https://sketchfab.com/models/14ba40fe71474270ae08d9ec4bd7a963 --[[User:BlackHawk510|BlackHawk510]] ([[User talk:BlackHawk510|talk]]) 00:22, 10 February 2017 (EST)
:That's a dead link for me. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 05:15, 10 February 2017 (EST)
::It was due to his signature not being separated from the link; I fixed it. --[[User:Ultimate94ninja|Ultimate94ninja]] ([[User talk:Ultimate94ninja|talk]]) 06:34, 10 February 2017 (EST)

== Holy f***ing s**t! ==

Yet another DLC pack is out that has the latest variant of the AK 12, an SVD and that wonky AK SMG thing--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:27, 23 March 2017 (EDT)
:Mostly liking the idea of it, but I'll have to check what attachments are available for them before I make any solid decision (especially since I've got friends who want me to get ''[[Day of Infamy]]'' instead). PP-19 and especially an SVD would be fun to play with regardless, but unless it gets a decent selection of unique mods and/or can be concealed better than the others, I'm not seeing much point to another AK variant when we've already got three or four that can be modified for just about any situation. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 23:25, 23 March 2017 (EDT)

== New revolver ==
Looks like there's yet another new Heister, Sangres, who comes with dual Dan Wesson PPCs. Thankfully, this one is supposed to be free.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 13:55, 4 May 2017 (EDT)
:Nice to have a Model 29, it's surprisingly rare in video games considering its fame. Really fun to use here, too, although I do wish it had a few more unique attachments. Maybe a Competitor barrel from the 629; not that Overkill particularly cared about redundancy considering both grip options for it cost the same and do the same thing, but maybe that could have had a lesser accuracy bonus in favor of boosting stability a bit more. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 21:15, 6 May 2017 (EDT)

== Another WWII weapon pack ==

Seems we've got a set of side jobs to progressively unlock a new set of weapons, in recognition of the RAID: World War II closed beta or something to that effect. Ten kills with new punch-daggers everybody gets unlocks a Luger, fifty kills with that unlocks an MP40, and a hundred kills with ''that'' finishes off with a Garand. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 16:58, 31 August 2017 (EDT)

== Locke and Load new weaponry ==

The new update that came out today added a Saiga-12 on a Center Balanced Systems bullpup chassis as a secondary weapon, and an akimbo version as a primary.
http://www.overkillsoftware.com/games/lockeandload/
It's pretty damn good, but you need to invest on the shotgun damage perks, as it only does 18 damage. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 20:36, 23 October 2017 (EDT)
*And now they added what seems like a Springfield EMP. I say "seems like", because it has the same damage as the PPK, it's DAO, and has a 17 round magazine. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 17:00, 25 October 2017 (EDT)

== about the new gun ==

wow can't believe overkill made this mistake on a 1911! DOA? Really?
*It may have been a Para-Ordnance at some point, but they either got lazy, or couldn't get it too look different enough for them not to get a cease and desist. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 00:50, 26 October 2017 (EDT)

Talk:Payday 2

2017-10-25T21:00:19Z

Yocapo32: /* Locke and Load new weaponry */

Talk:Payday 2

2017-10-24T00:36:08Z

Yocapo32: /* Locke and Load new weaponry */ new section

Talk:Far Cry 5

2017-08-01T22:30:20Z

Yocapo32: /* Screenshots */ new section

Looks like UbiSoft will be revealing the gameplay on Friday (May 26th) but, for now, they have released a teaser image. Looks like the game is set in Montana and the villains are a crazy, religious cult (Like the Westboro Baptist Church, I guess).--[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 14:42, 24 May 2017 (EDT)

[[File:FarCry5_Teaser_Poster.jpg|thumb|none|500px|]]

:Wonder if the enemies will all still be running around with AK-103s and P416s as they have been in the last two games...., also, I hope they paid the NFA tax on those short-barreled carbines or we'll be ATF simulator-ing that dog.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 15:42, 24 May 2017 (EDT)
::I bet it'll be full auto weapons all around because Ubisoft, a French company with developers in Canada thinks every American is a white red neck with full auto M16s in their back yard [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 17:48, 24 May 2017 (EDT)
:::To be fair, a combination of black market usage, home gunsmithing/machining, and theft could net one a fair amount of fully-automatic weaponry (especially if, as seems to be the case here, the group in question effectively operates without any law enforcement supervision), but still, there have to be some limits. Full-auto converted AR-15 carbines and Luty-style SMGs I could understand; FAMASes and QLZ-87s, well, I'd be a fair bit less forgiving. Then again, this is Far Cry, so it's not exactly meant to make a whole lot of sense. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 21:27, 24 May 2017 (EDT)
::::Ubisoft just doesn't care all that much about realism and prefers to include cool guns in their games. I can't imagine the weapon set in Far Cry 5 will be any attempt at a political statement at all, though people will certainly take it as such given the new setting. It's gonna be a big amalgamation of different cool to use but ultimately probably not very realistic weapons. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 18:29, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
To be serious, aside from how this may be a dumb story plot, I do hope they use different weapon templates. I will be pissed if I see the same AK, POF 416, SIG and for the love of God, there better not be any FAMASs in this game set in America. Also, the image already confirmed RPGs...even though really no one can get them here [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 17:48, 24 May 2017 (EDT)
:Nah, man, they're totally gonna keep reusing weapons from previous games. I mean, it's apparently not an Ubisoft game these days if it doesn't have the Far Cry 3 P416 model in it somewhere (I'm legit surprised they haven't thrown it into R6 Siege yet), plus there's all these other models from Watch_Dogs 2 and Wildlands just begging to be put into another game or two... [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 05:54, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
::in all seriousness though I would love at least a different AK model or something. This one's gonna be set in America, give us a 5.56mm AK. Wouldn't even need much work to turn the AK-103 model into a believable AK-101, I'd like to imagine. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 05:56, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
:::The P416 actually [http://cdn.edgecast.steamstatic.com/steam/apps/359550/header.jpg?t=1495046645 shows up] in the initial startup screen of Siege, lol. Also, there's no reason why an AK in America has to be 5.56; it just shouldn't be an AK-100 series since those aren't exactly imported in America (Arsenal SLR is probably the closest thing).--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 10:43, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
I'm just hoping they're let you use more than 3 attachments in the single player.
:Honestly, it's not even the "3 attachment" trope that pisses me off the most, but it's the fact that Ubisoft actually locks some attachments to multiplayer only and you have to download a patch to be able to use them in SP. (Like the SPAS-12 suppressor and the SVD illuminated sight). Nobody even plays Far Cry multiplayer, so why even bother doing that??? --[[User:Patfast|Patfast]] ([[User talk:Patfast|talk]]) 14:25, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
::On the subject of attachments, here's hoping that extended magazines actually change the weapon models now. Now, a lot of these changes that we hope for aren't likely, but hey, a man can dream. [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 20:08, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
To be fair, the RPG-7 is one of few (common) reusable rocket launcher out there, so if they're gonna include any at all (which they will, because it's Far Cry, come on), is not a poor choice. The Desert Eagle and MP5 will also likely return, seeing as how they've been in every major Far Cry game to date. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 18:23, 25 May 2017 (EDT)

I hope they really switch up the current Far Cry formula of "you must defeat le psychotic bad guy by capturing ALL the radio towers", but knowing Ubisoft, probably not. Also, $50 on there being at least one Buford T. Justice caricature of a southern police officer. --[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 01:22, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
:Nice job out there! Only 5 more bell towers to go and you can buy an RPG from an unsuspecting gun store, because obviously that's how it works in America! --[[User:Patfast|Patfast]] ([[User talk:Patfast|talk]]) 14:16, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
::They're going to set it in an Amish community, so all this will be new to them. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 14:22, 25 May 2017 (EDT)
:::I can't find the pic, but someone did photoshop the image so it said Duck Dynasty 5 instead. That made me chuckle.--[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 01:02, 26 May 2017 (EDT)

Grrrrhhh it will be a Far Cry 3/4 just with a different skin (hero join a La Resistânce group for defeat the Bad Guy/Guys)... they should had done something revolutionary like they did Far Cry 3. It didnt look the same to Far Cry 2, and if werent for the title you won't even assume they were same series...--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 09:42, 29 May 2017 (EDT)

== Trailer Dropped ==
Well, [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kdaoe4hbMso UbiSoft] dropped the trailer and it looks good. In terms of weapons, I don't think I saw any from the previous games (thankfully), but I did see two shotguns I couldn't ID, what looks to be a PDW, an AK-74, and a VERY quick shot of a revolver. --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 13:18, 26 May 2017 (EDT)
: Looks like there's a Remington 870 with wooden furniture as well, and another short-barreled "cruiser" pump-action with polymer furniture, Browning M2HBs on the technicals, a MAC-10/11. According to the Far Cry website, the game's AR-type gun is called the "AR-C", and doesn't look to be based on any particular AR variant (that I know of), though the selector switch looks kind of like an HK's. The sawed-off "D2 Shotgun" from Far Cry 4 appears to be returning, but with a new model this time (thank god it's not the cut down Double Rifle.) Though this time around it looks like it was manufactured that way, seeing that it has front sights and a proper finish, making it technically not "sawed-off" at all. The 1911 is also back, and also has a new model. Looks to be an amalgamation of several M1911 variants (Springfield Armory, Kimber, etc.) rather than a single one.
--[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 16:44, 26 May 2017 (EDT)

::I've never been particularly good at telling pump-action shotguns apart (unless it's a SPAS-12 or maybe an Ithaca they really all look nearly the same to me), but taking a close look at the shotgun in the trailer and comparing it to screenshots from Far Cry 4, I think it ''might'' possibly be the FC4 M133 model. Again. Damnit. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 04:15, 27 May 2017 (EDT)
:::If you watch the character trailers, you can see it's not the same model (it's especially clear at the end of the one set in the bar.) It's got a much longer barrel and a shorter magazine tube than the MP133. Which is good, because not only is reusing the models dumb, but the Baikal is also a pretty bad choice in rural America when you have the equally common and near-identical M870. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 18:09, 28 May 2017 (EDT)
::Here's an amalgamation of several trailers into one, giving some good shots of some of the weapons: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxav5An1sAs [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 16:53, 26 May 2017 (EDT)
Luckily Ubi decided to get it together and give most of the weapons new models this time around. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 02:27, 28 May 2017 (EDT)
::I think that the reason the AR and 1911 don't seem to be based on any particular model might be intended to reflect how people will custom build their AR's and 1911's rather than just buying a full one off the shelf A LOT nowadays, which is something I've been wanting to see in a game for a while.--[[User:BlackHawk510|BlackHawk510]] ([[User talk:BlackHawk510|talk]]) 14:35, 28 May 2017 (EDT)

== Gun Wishlist ==

What do you folks want? --[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 09:24, 29 May 2017 (EDT)

: Well already there appears to be some kind of high caliber lever gun from what I see from the trailer. Guide gun maybe? I'd love a Browning BLR, maybe a BAR Safri as a Hunting/Sniper Rifle too. I'm fully expecting some kind of AK as well, whether it be a video game mashup or maybe even a civi variant like a Romanian WASR converted for full auto, because I highly doubt FC5 will have fire controls for selective fire. Also expecting some more Revolvers too, although I'm hoping for a more traditional .357 revolver over the .44 Magnum. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] ([[User talk:Draco122|talk]]) 12:08, 29 May 2017 (EDT)

:I'm just hoping we get a few of the "American classics" in there - Single Action Army, Thompson, M1 Garand, etc. Older American movie guns like the TEC-9, MP5A3, Winchester 1887, and Desert Eagle, all of which have been in FC games in the past, hopefully will reappear as well (some, like the MAC-10 are already confirmed.) --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 13:11, 29 May 2017 (EDT)

:The Coonan, though that's probably hoping for too much, considering how obscure the damned thing is. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 15:17, 29 May 2017 (EDT)
::Aaaand cue this random guy listing off a bunch of stuff that's varying degrees of strange, and will never get into the game: A Ruger PMR-30, a Chiappa Rhino, literally anything made by Mateba, a COP 357, a Taurus Judge, a Thompson Center Contender, a Magnum Research BFR, a Remington XP-100, an Arsenal AF2011A1, an HK VP70M, a Ruger 10/22, with a 25-round BX-25 magazine and an aftermarket full-auto trigger pack (yes, those exist, and they are absolutely hilarious), an American-180, an AR-18, an M2 Carbine, an STGW-57, an Ithaca MAG-10 Roadblocker, a Chiappa Triple Threat, a DP-12, an SRM M1216, a K31 with an optional aftermarket scope mount, a Mossberg 464 SPX, a Hadar II, an HK SL8, the .700 Nitro side-by-side from FC4, a Kel-Tec RFB, a Lahti L-39, an M2 Flamethrower (to replace the jury-rigged LPO-50 from the earlier games), a Manville Gas Gun, a Gyrojet, a Hawk MM1... on one hand, listing off all these random-ass weapons makes me happy; on the other hand, realizing that they'll never be in this game (and, most likely, a fair amount of them won't be in many/any games at all) makes me sad. Yours truly dishonestly, [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 17:45, 29 May 2017 (EDT)

:I'd kill for not the Colt Python, but its more obscure just-as-cool cousin the [[Colt Trooper Mk III]] ( 4in. blued is a must ). Pistols I would like would be the [[SIG P210]], a [[First Model CZ 75]], the [[AMC Auto Mag Pistol]], the [[Smith & Wesson 39]], and a [[Mauser HSc]]. The only other thing is to have a [[Federal Gas Riot Gun]] as a launcher. -[[User:SeptemberJack|SeptemberJack]] ([[User talk:SeptemberJack|talk]]) 20:55, 29 May 2017 (EDT)
::An M9A3, Browning Hi Power, Glock 19, the Judge someone mentioned earlier, the M500 (because ''Far Cry''), and the M29 for handguns/magnums. A good old tried and true AR-15 as a basic rifle would be nice, along with the Mini-14 and maybe a full-size M14 for DMRs, the expected AK and M16 variants for assault rifles, an M1903 (ala ''Far Cry 2''), M1 (which you can upgrade into an M1-C), and some form of Barret rifle for snipers, the 870, Ithaca (with mods for making it a Stakeout), KSG, and some form of Armsel drum-fed shotgun for shotguns, and the tried and true M249, M60, and M2 for machine guns of various flavors. I'd also like to see the M79 come back from ''Far Cry 2'' because it adds such a new dynamic to gunplay. --[[User:Godzillafan93|That's the Way It's Done]] ([[User talk:Godzillafan93|talk]]) 22:30, 29 May 2017 (EDT)
:::For the record, the M79 was also in ''Far Cry 4'', and it was awesome there too, I'd love for it to make another return. Personally, I'd also like to see a FAL of some variety (preferably a full-size model just so they at least have to put ''some'' work into it instead of just copying over the ''Future Soldier''/''Blacklist'' SA58 and calling it a day) and some more revolvers. Maybe a Charter Arms Bulldog, they could make the Signature version into the ''Blade Runner'' gun. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 00:34, 30 May 2017 (EDT)
::::If they do that, it needs to fire rifle rounds, ''a la'' ''Fallout New Vegas.''--[[User:Godzillafan93|That's the Way It's Done]] ([[User talk:Godzillafan93|talk]]) 22:52, 3 June 2017 (EDT)

They should add civilian variants of military guns like the [[ARX-160|ARX-100]], the Texan-buiod [[MSBS]],[[SCAR-L]], the [[SIG-Sauer P320]] that is now standard of US Army,Glocks,[[SR-47]]...--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 07:51, 30 May 2017 (EDT)

I wish for an actual regular Glock. G17, or G19 and it isn't a full auto Glock as the default. Make the full auto Glock a special gun you get later. For handguns, an M&P series, maybe in .40 since your character will be a cop of sorts or LEO. For new gun flavors, I want to see the MPX, Scorpion Evo 3, MDR. Let's see some Kel-tec guns like their KSG, even though it isn't really a new hotness anymore or the RFB or the RDB. There are so many guns in America to choose from. I want to see an SKS or something [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 10:43, 30 May 2017 (EDT)

Personally I'd love to see some factual basis for the guns in this game. Having the likes of say an ultimax or PKP say just doesn't fit. I'd also like say a Krebs or Rifle Dynamics AK. Both are good US made platforms and not seen in a VG before. Also ditch the staple weapons. No desert eagle, no P416, no AK103 variant.
A decent domestic AR15 variant would be nice as opposed to the standard M4/M16 we see from typical VG. Also add a glock, a SIG and a SCAR H/RFB instead of the ACE.--[[User:Forrest1985|Forrest1985]] ([[User talk:Forrest1985|talk]]) 13:26, 2 June 2017 (EDT)
:The Desert Eagle would make more sense in the American setting than any of the other Far Cry games, ironically enough. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 14:10, 2 June 2017 (EDT)

The 2016 version would be awesome.--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 15:11, 2 June 2017 (EDT)

I wouldn't mind them bringing back the Tec-9. Add a MAC-10 with the big old suppressor would be cool. I seriously doubt a non-American company like Ubisoft to be aware of specific custom gun makers like Rifle Dynamics or Taran Tactical unless those companies reach out to Ubisoft to have their guns represented or someone on the design team reach out to them [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 15:56, 2 June 2017 (EDT)

Mac-10 in place of tec9 from FC4 wold be nice with the huge suppressor as the signiture edition. With regards to desert eagle, its really accurate but for me its an overused hollywood wonder weapon bit like Glock 18. I'd prefer a nice S&W or Colt revolver in the classic VG "hand cannon" slot instead. With regards to RD, Krebs, or TT I am sure Ubisoft have google? Activision seems to make great use of it for their weapon choses. It was my personal wishlist hence the addition of an american based AK designer. If they wanted an authentic setting rather than just re-use guns from R6 siege and watch dogs then perhaps they could have done some research? I do love Ubisoft but they are definitely following the COD rinse and repeat when it comes to firearms. A classic 1911 would be nice perhaps with the back story that it was the main characters Grandads piece from WW2. --[[User:Forrest1985|Forrest1985]] ([[User talk:Forrest1985|talk]]) 16:24, 2 June 2017 (EDT)

== Screenshots ==
https://postimg.org/image/jatr0x2id/ & https://postimg.org/image/hkapzfkz9/

Ubisoft uploaded a few screenshots to their website, these are high def variants. They look doctored to me, but assuming this is anything like what the game will be (ha ha), there are a few things that stick out: the WW2 plane in the second image is definitely a frankenplane, a bastard child of a Ju 87 and Bf 109 by the looks of it. It looks like the rear facing MG15 has been replaced by a Browning M2, or maybe an AN/M2 (something I'm okay with, because an actual firing MG15 would make very little sense.) Also, in the first image, you can see the ally on the right has an AR-type that's very similar to the one the player & enemies are holding, but it's a longer-barreled variant and has a custom paint job (and no sights at all, ugh.) This, combined with the fact that there are even more AR-types shown in promo images or trailers makes me think that weapon customization will actually be somewhat extensive in this game, rather than the "two attachments per gun" thing Far Cry 3 & 4 had going. It COULD just be a signature rifle or something, but I'm willing to bet it might be more. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 11:44, 2 June 2017 (EDT)

I can already tell the AR has the front sight on backwards...like the last game. The rail kinda reminds me of Daniel Defense's new M-Lok rail [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 15:57, 2 June 2017 (EDT)

== E3 footage ==

There's a revolver, AR-15-based assault and sniper rifles, a shotgun, an AK, and several pistols from what I can see: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNbtgJreV80 --[[User:MJ79|MJ79]] ([[User talk:MJ79|talk]]) 18:01, 12 June 2017 (EDT)
:No video anymore, it's been taken down. --[[User:DeltaOne|DeltaOne]] ([[User talk:DeltaOne|talk]]) 23:02, 12 June 2017 (EDT)
::https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WX_h8rneDxU Pretty sure this is the same video as the one taken down.--[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 00:36, 13 June 2017 (EDT)
: Said sniper rifle has a telescoping that's fully retracted. What exactly did the developers think the lever was for? --[[User:VladVladson|VladVladson]] ([[User talk:VladVladson|talk]]) 04:08, 13 June 2017 (EDT)
: Well, the chick shooting it does look kinda short, maybe it sits better on her shoulder like that. I mean, that ''is'' the idea behind adjustable stocks after all. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 04:44, 13 June 2017 (EDT)

== Sad News... ==

New firearms confirmed are : Fabarm FP6,M4A1(yeah),M11A1 variant,MBP.50 (high caliber rifle).
Sad News?

Suspance...

Another bit..

Most of them are recycled. So we get the usual arsenal. AGAIN. So pissed.--[[User:Dannyguns|Dannyguns]] ([[User talk:Dannyguns|talk]]) 05:11, 12 July 2017 (EDT)

:: Where did you get any of this information? I haven't seen anything recycled thus far, except for the Vz.61 Skorpion on the game's expanded cover which is clearly the same as the one in Ghost Recon: Wildlands (or at least rendered the same.) But even that doesn't confirm it'll be ingame that way, or in the game at all for that matter. --[[User:Sergeant Simpleton|Sergeant Simpleton]] ([[User talk:Sergeant Simpleton|talk]]) 10:18, 22 July 2017 (EDT)

== Screenshots ==

https://ubistatic19-a.akamaihd.net/ubicomstatic/en-US/global/media/FC5_Screenshot_E3_car_293319.jpg
I can't figure out what the hell the gun in the technical is, though it kinda looks like an M60D, and the guy in the Mustang has what looks like a FABARM with wood furniture and rifle sights.

https://ubistatic19-a.akamaihd.net/ubicomstatic/en-US/global/media/FC5_Screenshot_E3_coop_293329.jpg
That looks like the original 9mm MAC-10, and the guys on the ground are probably using the AR-C they mentioned earlier.

https://ubistatic19-a.akamaihd.net/ubicomstatic/en-US/global/media/FC5_Screenshot_E3_dog_293337.jpg
Once again, the AR-C and a guy with only one kneecap.

https://ubistatic19-a.akamaihd.net/ubicomstatic/en-US/global/media/FC5_Screenshot_E3_cult_293335.jpg
And the M1911 again, I thought it had a tan frame, but that's just the lightning.

Question, since the trailer dropped already, shouldn't we make the page and not just stick around here? --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 18:30, 1 August 2017 (EDT)

Talk:Far Cry 5

2017-06-13T08:44:47Z

Yocapo32: /* E3 footage */

Talk:Far Cry 5

2017-05-29T19:17:41Z

Yocapo32: /* Gun Wishlist */

Talk:Far Cry 5

2017-05-28T06:27:11Z

Yocapo32: /* Trailer Dropped */

Talk:Fallout 4

2017-04-26T08:22:30Z

Yocapo32: /* 5mm */

__TOC__ 

=Discussion=
Once you upgrade the Combat Rifle with long barrel, .308 receiver, and full stock, it's pretty much a BAR. And the Hunting Rifle is probably based on a real rifle. as well. The Assault Rifle looks a bit like the Lewsi Gun, but I haven't got one yet.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 10:05, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:Oh, yeah, there's a .44 revolver as well.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 10:08, 13 November 2015 (EST)
::The revolver is similar to the S&W M29, which would make sense since they used that model in the previous games. The character in first person is always shown cooking the hammer between shots, but that isn't actually animated in third person.
::There's something i wonder btw, in the live action intro (which doesn't have Ron Pearlman narrating for some reason :() you can see a chinese soldier holding a rifle that kinda looks like a Galil, is that the case?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:10, 13 November 2015 (EST)

::Haven't gotten that far in the game myself, but yeah, the Galil looks like it has the folding bipod equipped (seen below), making it the Galil ARM. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 12:58, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:::Have the chinese ever used Galil's or is that a stand in for whatever weapon they were using in the 50's?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:25, 13 November 2015 (EST)
[[Image:Fallout4Galil.jpg|thumb|none|500px|A Chinese soldier holds a Galil ARM in the live-action intro.]]
:No the Chinese never used Galils, the Galil went into service with the Israelis in 1972, and the Chinese used Type 56 Carbines aka the Chinese SKS and the Type 56 Chinese AKs in the 50's. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 14:57, 13 November 2015 (EST)
::Struck me as a bit odd for them to use that weapon in that intro. Then again, this is a game where you can have laser pistols so i guess i can gloss over it.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:07, 13 November 2015 (EST)
Maybe as a stand-in for the Type 81? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 15:20, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:Type 81's came out in the 1980's. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:25, 13 November 2015 (EST)
You can't put real timeline on a Fallout game, they have a parallel history, where a lot of technology came early, and some of it more advanced than ours right now. Realistically the rifle is probably not meant to be a galil but just a generic rifle that in that universe is used by them, they just chose the Galil because it would be relatively unknown to gamers and it looks like a bad guy gun. AK on the other hand would be known by most --[[User:Iceman|Iceman]] ([[User talk:Iceman|talk]]) 09:04, 17 November 2015 (EST)

::Oh, and I just saw a Walther PPK (or a PPK/S) on a loading screen today. Haven't seen one in the game yet, though. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 15:33, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:::It would('ve) be nice to have one of those in the game. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:41, 13 November 2015 (EST)
The Combat Rifle looks like a PPSh-41 but with a small mag and apparently chambered in. 45 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 22:36, 15 November 2015 (EST)
: Looks a bit like the BAR with the long barrel, full stock, and .308 receiver--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 06:22, 16 November 2015 (EST).

What do you say about these guns?

Combat rifle: [http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/6/67/Fallout4_Combat_rifle.png/revision/latest?cb=20151111133727]

Flare pistol: [http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/c/c1/Fallout4_Flare_gun.png/revision/latest?cb=20151122152815]
--[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 14:38, 28 November 2015 (EST)
:The combat rifle kinda looks like a BAR (and is also really similar to the combat shotgun) I also recognize that Flare Pistol design but i can't remember the name for it. If you have good screenshots of em, ad them.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:44, 28 November 2015 (EST)
::[http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Kampfpistole The Flare gun is this thing]--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:22, 28 November 2015 (EST)
== Pipe weapons: Total fiction? ==

Anyone who has played this game has probably come across one of the many pipe weapons in game, weapons that have been crudely built from (as you might have guessed) pipes, sticks and other junk. What i wonder is if these types of weapons even would work in real-life.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:30, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:I know you can build a zip gun using pipes. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 16:43, 13 November 2015 (EST)
::To some extent, yes, it is entirely possible to make working firearms out of scrap materials but of course they always have inherent flaws. I doubt you'd be able to make 'em like anything in Fallout 4 but I know that many third world militia's and criminal elements in the world sometime make use of home-made firearms ranging from revolvers and pistols to sub-machine guns and rifles all made out of pipes and scrap metal. While I wouldn't believe that the design of the Pipe Pistol (and its upgrades from pistol to rifle) could work, the most realistic "home-made" weapon I've found thus far appears to be the Pipe Revolver. It's chambered in .45 caliber and is single action only. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] ([[User talk:Draco122|talk]]) 17:21, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:::Well, there are some guns like the Sten that are specifically designed to be made with as little specialised tooling as possible, too. Though I do like the pipe-FG42 you can build, that's suitably silly. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:35, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::::Building a pipe-weapon is possible, but AFAIK it would only be good for like one or two shots. A fully-automatic pipe weapon, especially the ones in game that are built out of a wood block, springs, screws and piping wouldn't be good for more than a few shots before they either caught fire, jammed, exploded or broke. Making a weapon out of that stuff that can feed, extract and fire .38s and .45s with no problems constantly (and do it fully automatic) is in the realm of fantasy. Its a nice touch though, really fits into the universe and gives it a very "Metro 2033" vibe. [[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 01:04, 18 November 2015 (EST)
:::: not quite total fiction. You really should check out some of the weapons that have turned up on Improguns. Some of the stuff rivals factory quality while other stuff I'm surprised it didn't explode. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] ([[User talk:Rockwolf66|talk]])
:::::With modern machining and resources, I have no doubt its possible to make functioning firearms like zip guns or makeshift shotguns. But if the weapon is literally a block of wood tied to a piece of metal with zip ties, with a pipe for a barrel and chamber, a screw for the firing pin assembly, another screw and spring that functions as a charging handle and two more circular pipes for the grip and stock and said weapon is capable of chambering .38 Special or .45 ACP, feed them flawlessly without a jam or extractor failure and fire them in fully automatic without the wooden block catching on fire or the weapon catastrophically failing, I have to say that's incredibly impressive. Doubly so because this is 210 years after a nuclear apocalypse. [[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]])

== Weapons thus far ==

So my journey's into Fallout 4 and the vast number of weapons have made me try and find the most realistic looking ones so far the ones I have found are:
* .44 Revolver - Like someone above has said it resembles the S&W Model 29, however certain mods and even a unique version make it look very similar to some Dan Wesson PPC Revolvers.
* Walther PPK - Is a unique 10mm Pistol called the "Deliever", it has a permanatly affixed suppressor and uses 10mm
* Flare Gun - Appears to be based off the german Kampfpistole Z, works similar to the Radio in FNV, fire it in the air and it will summon allies to your position if they are nearby.
* Hunting Rifle - Appears to be based off the early Remington 700, a unique version called Reba II uses .50 caliber and a synthetic polymer stock and can also be modified into a pistol form
* Combat Rifle/Combat Shotgun - Both seem to use the same model, except the Combat Shotgun uses a different magazine. Initially it chambers the .45 Round, which made me think it was like supped up Reising SMG but can later be converted to .308 and function similar to a BAR.
* Double Barrel Shotgun - Mods really change this weapon, initially it appears as a short barrelled shotgun with a pistol grip but can feature sawn off barrels for increase spread (and better critical damage) or a full wooden stock and a long barrel for more concerntrated fire.
* Sniper Rifle - Haven't found one yet but it appears to be based on a Semi-Auto sniper platform.
[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] ([[User talk:Draco122|talk]]) 17:47, 13 November 2015 (EST)
::So far, the weapons that i've come across that's called sniper rifle was just the hunting rifle with a scope. The names of the weapons change depending on what mods they have.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 07:32, 14 November 2015 (EST)
:::You can also get it to call your weapon a sniper rifle if you give a "pipe" weapon some combination of long barrel / marksman stock / scope. It seems to work out the name of the weapon a bit like Borderlands does, only it doesn't only give the weapon the highest-order prefix. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:38, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:::Also having seen the model for the .44 revolver, the huge beefy barrel isn't really Dan Wesson, it's just a really weirdly re-proportioned vented rib barrel turned upside-down. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 10:48, 15 November 2015 (EST)

== Remington VTR ==
If you upgrade the hunting rifle with the final stock and a certain barrel which makes the barrel into a triangular shape, it strongly resembles a VTR. Worth mentioning? [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 09:40, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:Got a screenshot? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:41, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:: I can get one uploaded once I'm off work, I can also do some 1st person ones of the others as well. Also, could someone move the mural guns to a non-usable section? [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 09:46, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:::We don't normally do that, weapons are usually documented by type rather than if you can use them or not. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:51, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::: Alright, one last thing, the Assault Rifle in-game instantly reminded me of an MG-08 or something along those lines, even more so since it can take a drum mag. It also has a unique compensator that someone might be able to narrow it down. [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 10:02, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::::Haven't seen it yet, been too busy pratting around turning my pipegun into an FG42-thing :) [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 10:06, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:::::Also, I think I have now seen that barrel you're talking about for the hunting rifle, it looks more like it's a squashed FAL handguard. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 10:52, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::::::I checked it, it is a VTR based stock and triangular barrel. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:24, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::For Tim. http://i.imgur.com/ghSou9r.jpg [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 20:19, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::Huh, ok. Didn't look like it did that from the side. Guess I was figuring that from their propensity to make custom parts by randomly stretching and squashing things, like the MP7 bits on the rocket launcher. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:41, 15 November 2015 (EST)

== Minor Edit ==
Just a quick edit to the page, but you can remove the Walther PPK aka The Deliverer' surpressor by going to the Weapons Workbench in-game. --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 23:06, 16 November 2015 (EST)
:Didn't know that--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 06:49, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::I only just found out last night you can do that (Though, am I the only one hearing the silencer sound-effect from the N64 Goldeneye 007 when firing that gun while it's surpressed?). --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 12:43, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::Actually just got it, can't say it sounds like that though--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:06, 17 November 2015 (EST)

== Acronym for player character. ==

So i was just wondering if we should use an acronym for the player character, like PC, Since the PC doesn't have any catchy name like "The lone wanderer" or "The courier" this time around.
Not a huge deal really but constantly writing player character just seems a bit dull.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:13, 17 November 2015 (EST)
: Your character is the Sole Survivor.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 14:25, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::In that case.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:00, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::Which is a bit of an odd name for them since the whole point of their quest is that they're looking for a second survivor. As long as you don't call them "the player" since the person in the game isn't the player: you end up with extremely silly sentences like "this weapon can easily kill the player" if you do that which make it sound like the game has a high chance of leaving you lying dead on the sofa. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 15:12, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::(un)Funny thing is that i just did that. Call the "Sole Survivor" the player. Oh well, such is the life of the mac--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:27, 17 November 2015 (EST)

== Name of rifle ==

The generic name for the Remington appears to be "rifle:" "hunting" is the prefix for short versions and "sniper" the prefix for long ones. "Sniper" might also require a scope to be fitted, but I know it does require a long barrel:

[[Image:Fallout4-10mm-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|"Scoped Powerful Hunting Rifle" can be seen in the list (I didn't highlight it because I already had a shot of the Obrez version and didn't think I needed another).]]
[[Image:Fallout4-Remington-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Since I didn't have enough screws or duct tape to make a long barrel (um...) I didn't have one at that point, but the title changes when it's selected. Since it doesn't say "scoped," "sniper rifle" probably requires rifle + scope + long barrel, but I haven't checked what it's called if you deselect the scope yet.]]
:Interesting hunting rifle on the first pic there. Is it a unique weapon?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:50, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::Naw, it's just the name there because I didn't have it highlighted. Look two up from the cursor. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 15:52, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::Crazy--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:08, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::Also, now that i think about it, should the 10mm pistol even be on this page? Considering it doesn't really look like any actual gun (atleast not any gun that i can think of)
::::It doesn't really have any resemblance to the Desert Eagle anymore.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:18, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::::It's worth pointing out that it's changed from being loosely based on a real gun to just being based on the previous version of itself; we covered that version, so we should probably include it here too. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 17:21, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::::Is it just me or does it looks as a mutated [[Colt M1911]]? --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 00:53, 18 November 2015 (UTC+2)
:::::::I guess i can see some resemblance to the 1911, some.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:50, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::It reminds me of that prototype stamped steel 1911.http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2013/01/02/the-mystery-of-the-stamped-steel-1911/ --[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 19:27, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::Yeah, but that's largely a coincidence, it's a deagle slide with the safety removed because we have the past games to refer to. Given how obscure that pistol is, I doubt the devs knew about it. Also check out the Liberator on that page, someone plated one of those silly contraptions? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 19:34, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::::I know some people are weird about it, but we include completely fictional guns (as long as that's not all the game has) to inform people that look up the game or the weapons what they are and are not. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 20:44, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::::Yeah, as long as it's not something nobody would think was real in the first place like the laser muskets, it's ok. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:46, 17 November 2015 (EST)

== About screenshots ==

If you're playing the PC version of the game and want to take some fancy screenshots for the site (or just in general) You can use the console and type in tfc, this will allow you to move around the camera freely, type tfc 1 and it will also pause time. Then you can just hide the HUD by writing in tm and/or change the FOV via typing in fov 90 for example (the default FOV is 70)--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:53, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:I prefer in-game shots where possible, and you can usually get some nice views in VATS so that isn't really all that necessary. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 19:38, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::They are still in-game, VATS have HUD all over the place and the camera angles are random.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 19:53, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::Well, the HUD is kind of supposed to be there, you know, that's what the game looks like. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:08, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::It doesn't look very good in a screenshot, something that's supposed to show the gun, not the HUD, less clutter is preferable.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 20:09, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::::Eh, my feeling on it is that it should look as normal as possible (subject to some sacrifices like turning off motion blur to make things clearer) to show what the weapon looks like while you're playing the game. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:45, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::::I guess i have a flare for the dramatic then.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 21:10, 17 November 2015 (EST)

If the HUD seriously obscures the image to the point of making a positive ID difficult or something, that'd be one thing, otherwise I'm with Tim - In-game shots should remain in as normal/default a state as possible. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 01:24, 18 November 2015 (EST)

== Fallout 4 Assault Rifle=Not an assault rifle, but a machine gun? ==

The more I stare at Fallout 4's Assault Rifle (which IMHO looks weird and terrible, what happened to Fallout 3's amazing design?), the more its design and designation as an "assault rifle" bothers me. What exactly was Bethesda thinking when designing it?

*It has a liquid cooling jacket wrapped around the barrel, like an early Maxim gun or Lewis gun. In fact its barrel reminds me of an M1917 Browning.
*It has a machine gun style carrying handle to the right of the receiver.
*It feeds from the side, like an FG42.
*Its grip is directly taken from an MG42.
*The overall bulky shape and profile seems to suggest "machine gun" more than "assault rifle"

Its basically a mishmash of various machine guns, with the "assault rifle" tacked on. Fallout 3 had its G3 based assault rifle, so this feels like a step back.[[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 01:18, 18 November 2015 (EST)
:I wouldn't say the gun design in Fallout 3 (or New Vegas for that matter) was "amazing" some guns were alright but for the most part they looked like crap and the animations were awful. Thank god for modders. But anyhow,one thing i've noticed to is that, when firing the AR, while the weapon has its ejection port on the right, the brass actually goes through the gun and ejects to the left. Also, when reloading, you simply remove and insert another magazine.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 05:22, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::Fair point, Fallout 3's designs weren't stellar, but they sort of fit in the universe and made sense, the animations were awful though. [[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 16:41, 18 November 2015 (EST)
Can I see some screenshots? [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 13:12, 18 November 2015 (EST)
:I think the 'Assault Rifle' is designed to be held by someone in power armor, hence the bulky design, although I agree it seems more like a Machine Gun. --[[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 18:36, 18 November 2015 (GMT)
::I can get some pic.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:56, 18 November 2015 (EST)

Here you go, Mr. Wolf. Have never posted a picture here before, so I may have formatted it wrong. Direct from the Fallout 4 page here on IMFDB.[[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 16:50, 18 November 2015 (EST)
[[File:F4 AR left.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

:::Remember to sign your post buddy. Anyhow, pics are up on the page, take a look.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:42, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::::My bad, forgot. I'll make the necessary edits.[[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 16:50, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::You live you learn.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:54, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::It's highly like [[Lewis gun]]. Must be an upgraded version similar even more? --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 16:59, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::Funny that you mention that because there is! You can put a long barrel on it which makes it look very similar to a Lewis gun.
::Seriously though, what kind of gun is this to include in the game anyway? It looks dumb--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:30, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::See what I mean? It just looks weird and off, and looks like something from an alternate WW2. [[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]])
:::An M16/CAR-15 like in NV or a M14 would of been better... [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 20:45, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::::There was an M14 in the live action Wanderer trailer. It got my hopes up for a little bit. The closest thing we have to a practical assault rifle is the Combat Rifle, which reminds me of a BAR somewhat. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 17:32, 19 November 2015 (EST)
I just want to remind everyone that the cover on the Lewis gun is not a water jacket, the Lewis is air-cooled. The description on the page right now seems to suggest that the Lewis is also water cooled. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 22:27, 18 November 2015 (EST)
:Yeah, it's got the fin array from the Lewis barrel jacket at the base and ''also'' has a coolant line going in like a Maxim. Just a note, with a water jacket this would never be a GPMG, it'd be too heavy to use in the light role. It's a medium machine gun. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 00:38, 19 November 2015 (EST)
::Then again, it's fed by a box magazine rather than a belt and is missing a bipod. What a train wreck. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 07:39, 19 November 2015 (EST)
:::It's really either a heavy light machine gun or no-purpose machine gun :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:39, 19 November 2015 (EST)
::Sorry. :V [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 01:22, 19 November 2015 (EST)

Here is another pic: [http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/1/17/Fo4_assault_rifle.png/revision/latest?cb=20150616142923]. Here, similar to the Lewis gun even more. --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 08:57, 19 November 2015 (EST)
:Is that a drum mag? At least that would make more sense. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 09:02, 19 November 2015 (EST)
::It's a drum mag. Also, could i ask why your pictures are so small? What are you playing the game on? A phone?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:35, 19 November 2015 (EST)
:::Different guy, it's wikia doing that this time, they only display a thumbnail if you direct-link to an image on their servers. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:38, 19 November 2015 (EST)

Anyone think that the Assault Rifle looks like a MAS AA-52 with a Lewis Gun Barrel Jacket on it?--[[User:Insertjjs|Insertjjs]] ([[User talk:Insertjjs|talk]]) 13:16, 24 November 2015 (EST)
[[File:AA52.jpg]]

Kinda--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:32, 24 November 2015 (EST)
:Looks more like a [[Maxim MG08/15]] than anything else to me. --[[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 16:09, 01 December 2015 (GMT)
::That's even more clunky than the gun in the game. :P [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 18:37, 1 December 2015 (EST)

What about this gun? Does anyone see any similarities with the Fallout 4 Assault Rifle? I know this might not have the other features that were taken from the aforementioned guns, but it seems to be more closely representing this particular oddboy than anything else. [[User:50AEDeagle|50AEDeagle]] ([[User talk:50AEDeagle|talk]]) 8:30, 23 March 2017 (EST)
[[File:MClean machine gun.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Mclean Automatic Musket. This odd-looking machine gun was the "baby step" in the development of the Lewis gun. (File from [https://www.slideshare.net/tcattermole/lewis-machine-gun-a-game-changer here])]]

== Section for the Discussion of Old/Beta weapons ==

I added into the Galil ARM section about how a Galil ARM-Look alike with a different barrel(?) can be seen in the Teaser Trailer wielded by one of the Diamond City Guards.

Hopefully there are files left for it in the game, would be nice IMO to have a PROPER ASSAULT RIFLE instead of that wannabe MG-08 Assault Rifle/Lewis Gun/M249 SAW mutant.

[[Image:Beta_Fo4_Galil.jpg]]

--[[User:Morayus1|Morayus1]] ([[User talk:Morayus1|talk]]) 03:43, 19 November 2015 (EST)

:Um...Is the reader supposed to determine this with a microscope? 89 pixel thumbnails aren't really good enough to make an ID from. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 04:20, 19 November 2015 (EST)
::What is this? A picture for ants? Really though, the gun on that tiny pic kinda looks like the Battle Rifle BAR thing with a curved mag, i don't think it's some weapon that never ended up in the game.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 08:12, 19 November 2015 (EST)
:::It's probably just the Chinese Assault Rifle used as a placeholder. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 13:29, 23 November 2015 (EST)
::::Actually, i just found [http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/2455/?tab=1&navtag=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nexusmods.com%2Ffallout4%2Fajax%2Fmoddescription%2F%3Fid%3D2455%26preview%3D&pUp=1 this] on the Fallout 4 nexus. Apparently there was going to be a Chinese Assault Rifle in the game but they cut it. Kinda like that Harpoon gun. Too bad, since it looks much better than the "assault rifle" that we got. Maybe we'll see it return in some future DLC--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:12, 24 November 2015 (EST)

== .44 Pistol Third Person Cocking ==
"The player character will always cock the hammer after each shot, this animation is however only present in first-person." You sure? Cause I fired this gun in-game in third person and it does look like he cocks the hammer. --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 12:48, 22 November 2015 (EST)
::I'm fairly sure.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:29, 22 November 2015 (EST)
:::I just checked again and he does cock the hammer when in third person.--[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 00:27, 23 November 2015 (EST)
::::Change it then--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 04:43, 23 November 2015 (EST)
I've changed it now. The player character does fire it in single action in third person too. It's more visible if you use VATS and power armor, but it does happen. Also, the minigun seems to spin clockwise in 1st person but counter-clockwise in 3rd person for some reason, so I added that too.--[[User:Xarex|Xarex]] ([[User talk:Xarex|talk]]) 05:25, 31 January 2016 (EST)

== G3 ==

I dont know if those count but there are two G3's on a weapon shop sign in Diamond city. - [[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] ([[User talk:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|talk]]) 14:29, 24 November 2015 (EST)
:Might as well ad them since someone added the weapons seen on that wall in that museum. Very specific i know.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:33, 24 November 2015 (EST)
::If they're there and we know what they are, we should identify them. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 17:57, 24 November 2015 (EST)

== New Firearms Seen in Far Harbor DLC Trailer ==

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0wSCFBJcSs A New trailer has been released for the next DLC for the game, titled "Far Harbor"], and two new conventional firearms can be seen in the trailer, a lever-action rifle, and a new assault rifle that appears to resemble the Volkssturmgewehr from the end of World War 2.

[[Image:Fallout4LeverActionRifle.jpeg|thumb|none|500px|The Lever-Action rifle held by the old man.]]
[[Image:Fallout4NewRifle.jpeg|thumb|none|500px|The Rifle resembling the Volkssturmgewehr.]]

--[[User:QueenSasha24|QueenSasha24]] ([[User talk:QueenSasha24|talk]]) 18:10, 4 May 2016 (EDT)
:Like the look of that levergun, but as a guy i know said; "Fallout 4 is worse than blighttown"--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 22:42, 4 May 2016 (EDT)

So here's some pics of the "Lever Action Rifle" if anyone wants to use them for the page or identifying. It fires 45-70 (not that Fallout 4 cartridges are ever accurate), and has a five round magazine. I know next to nothing about lever actions rifles, but it seems to be most similar to a Marlin 336. I'd rather not make the entry until I can get some more informed opinions, though.

[[Image:Fallout4_Lever_Action_Rifle.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The base rifle.]]
[[Image:Fallout4_Lever_Action_Rifle_with_ mods.jpg|thumb|none|500px|With stock and scope.]]
[[Image:Fallout4 Lever Action Rifle first person.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The player prepares to save Open Mic Night from McCready's awful jokes.]]
[[Image:F4_Lever_Action_Rifle_3rdPerson.jpg|thumb|none|500px|I miss New Vegas.]]
[[Image:F4_Lever_Action_Rifle_3rdpersonEx.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Much to the Brotherhood of Steel's chagrin, the player re-enacts a scene from Cowboys vs Aliens.]]

Had to use my phone for these pics, so I apologize if they're lower quality or something.
--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 03:13, 21 May 2016 (EDT)

Looks like Sasha was right about the Volkssturmgewehr; it appears in game as the "Radium Rifle".

[[Image:F4Volkssturmgewehr.jpg|thumb|none|500px|With the extended mag and full stock mods.]]
[[Image:F4Volkssturmgewehr1stperson.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The Volkssturmgewehr user takes aim at his least favorite painting.]]
[[Image:F4VolkssturmgewehrADS.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Aiming down the sights.]]
[[Image:F4Volkssturmgewehr3rdperson.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Gute Nacht.]]
--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 03:44, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:Seriously, Bethesda's weapon design in horrible! Hate the weapons in this game. I really hope Obsidian makes the next Fallout (heard some rumors about that) since they seem to have slightly more knowledge about guns. Slightly.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:01, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::These weapons seem a lot better than the ones in the base game; have to give them kudos on actually knowing about the VG.51. Perhaps people are really paying attention to Forgotten Weapons.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 10:27, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:::They are still committing the mortal sin of mirroring the weapon models.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:37, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::::Yeah, I forgave them the first time, but they really need to knock that off. Still, it's a fun gun. Anyway, should I create a gun page for the Volkssturmgewehr when I make the entry for the "Radium Rifle"? There doesn't seem to be one existing. --[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 13:31, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:: I have to agree with that statement. Going from AKs and G3's (Fallout 3) to M16s, M4s, and RO933s (Vegas) to these is pretty disappointing. [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 13:39, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::: I agree- Fallout is better with more real world weapons. It feels more believable and immersive. I just really can't get behind the weird guns in this game. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 14:48, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::::I'm with ya'. It doesn't help that the first person animations suck too.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:00, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
I very much agree that the animations just suck. The levergun, for example, has only ONE reload animation: insert five rounds into the tube regardless of current ammo state. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] ([[User talk:HashiriyaR32|talk]]) 20:19, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:::::I'm kinda hoping that they will add a pump action shotgun. Something with a magazine tube and not some weird box mag.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 21:36, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
Also, there's a Harpoon Gun, but I have no idea if it's based off of any real weapon. If it is, I'm guessing it's late 19th century.
[[Image:F4Harpoongun.jpg|thumb|none|500px|."Got a whale of a tale to tell ya, lads, a whale of a tale or two!"]]
--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 21:06, 21 May 2016 (EDT)

Well, I added the VG 1-5. Let me know if I need to change anything (or just make the changes you see fit). P.S., after some quick Google searching, I think the Harpoon Gun is an original design loosely inspired by a handful of early harpoon guns (found a few pictures and drawings). Should we bother including it?--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 02:05, 22 May 2016 (EDT)
:Is Far Harbor similar to Point Lookout from Fallout 3? Cuz i loved Point Lookout.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:25, 22 May 2016 (EDT)
::I have to admit, I never played that DLC. But Far Harbor is better than I expected (not saying much) so far. I'm still pretty early into it, but what I like most is the environment. It's a little bit swampy in places, it's foggy, it got a forest that looks great, and the sounds are the best part. Real insect and frog sounds that are probably supposed to be creepy, but felt kind of serene to me. This DLC has made me miss camping. Anyway, there's really no new features so far, but the theme is alright, the environment is good, and there's some cool new enemies like the giant hermet crabs. I haven't played enough of it to know if I should recommend it, though.--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 06:59, 23 May 2016 (EDT)
:::I'll probably buy it just for that lever-action rifle, love those.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:55, 23 May 2016 (EDT)

== Not an M1911 ==
I noticed that the gun on the poster didn't look right for a 1911, then I noticed that it seemed a bit weird for a WW2 soldier to be using such a grip. It was at that point I remembered [[http://www.wearethemighty.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Browning-HP-British-soldier-e1459175767900.jpg This image]] that I'd seen awhile ago of a British soldier with a Hi-power in Basra. Perfect match.--[[User:BlackHawk510|BlackHawk510]] ([[User talk:BlackHawk510|talk]]) 23:00, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:How about that!--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 23:05, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::Damn- good catch! It's funny, I remember thinking when I picked up that magazine "huh, that grip seems surprisingly...modern". But I didn't even think to check the gun. It's always cool when you find the exact picture that video game artists used. It is a shame there seems to be almost no artists that know much about guns, though. Will you be changing the entry, or should one of us?--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 23:44, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:::Eh, I'll do it.--[[User:BlackHawk510|BlackHawk510]] ([[User talk:BlackHawk510|talk]]) 00:14, 22 May 2016 (EDT)
::::It's a real shame that gun and caliber aren't present in this game; I love the fact ''New Vegas'' has more handguns than there are guns in this game. --[[User:Godzillafan93|That's the Way It's Done]] ([[User talk:Godzillafan93|talk]]) 22:02, 27 May 2016 (EDT)

== Art of Fallout 4 and Assault Rifle ==

The official Fallout 4 artbook states that the "assault rifle" was intended to be a machine gun that would look large in the oversized hands of power armor. During development, it eventually morphed into the assault rifle we see now. It was also one of the first weapons created for the game, as well as being a way to test the modular weapon customization. So that kind of confirms our theories on why that thing is called an "assault rifle." --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 00:46, 27 May 2016 (EDT)
:What's interesting is that someone found an unfinished model for the Chinese AR in the game's files and uploaded it to the Fallout 4 [http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/2455/? Nexus]. Too bad Bethesda never added it to the game.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 08:45, 27 May 2016 (EDT)
::Yeah, it is a shame. I would've really appreciated a true AR in this game. The combat rifle is a good gun, but aesthetically I don't really like it. An I'm pretty sure the Assault Rifle is the only 5.56 gun in the game. Seems like a waste. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 22:19, 28 May 2016 (EDT)
:::A G3 would be nice--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:21, 29 May 2016 (EDT)
::::Or a M16 and a CAR-15 like in New Vegas since this is still in the US. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 12:28, 29 May 2016 (EDT)
:::I can't stand how the Assault Rifle looks. To the point I modded in the rifles from the previous games--[[User:Zombiedrd|Zombiedrd]] ([[User talk:Zombiedrd|talk]]) 12:42, 29 May 2016 (EDT)
::Now AK series appear in the new trailer for Fallout 4. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIneiOpuS2M Youtube]--[[User:PaulD21x|PaulD21x]] ([[User talk:PaulD21x|talk]]) 00:41, 16 August 2016 (EDT)
:::Interesting, the AK doesn't have the top cover on. Maybe i should buy this despite the fact that it looks stupid as shit. Atleast we got Far Harbor before this.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 06:50, 16 August 2016 (EDT)
:::I'm currently playing through the DLC and you can mod the rifle to have the top cover, along with making it look like other AK varietals (And one that makes it look like something Hello Kitty would shoot).--[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 00:41, 30 August 2016 (EDT)

==Nuka World on PC is a bitch==

If my game doesn't keep on crashing every 10 minutes, I'd be able to enjoy it. All I know is that they based the new gun design off of that famous photo of an AK built with a shovel as the stock. Which is pretty funny [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 14:55, 2 September 2016 (EDT)

Looks more like a [[Galil AR]] stock to me. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 15:25, 2 September 2016 (EDT)
:One variant has the shovel stock. The "Best stock" is the folding Galil looking stock. There's also an SVD type stock as well [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]])

:That's Bethesda's handiwork for you, making the modders fix everything.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:41, 2 September 2016 (EDT)

Shovel Stock OP https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/215491751459291137/219975615984566282/unknown.png --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] ([[User talk:HashiriyaR32|talk]]) 23:21, 2 September 2016 (EDT)
:Rifle is fine.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 23:41, 2 September 2016 (EDT)
Fire selector on the wrong side (as always). And it seems to be based on the early "Type I" AK-47. -[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 08:39, 4 September 2016 (EDT)
:Is the ejection port on the wrong side as well?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:40, 4 September 2016 (EDT)
::Yep. I'm pretty sure every gun in FO4 has the controls and whatnot on the wrong side. There's also a modification for the AK that removes the receiver cover. Can't imagine that's very good for the gun. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 21:32, 5 September 2016 (EDT)

I think the charging handle on the wrong side is so they can be lazy with animation and recycle the animation from another gun like the Combat Rifle. Why they couldn't animate the brass still going the other way is beyond me. The Combat Rifle is left side charging handle but brass ejects to the right. The base gun doesn't start out with a top cover on it but later on, you can add one as you upgrade it. Even though I couldn't play the DLC, I was able to get the ID code for the gun itself and mess around with it. Awesome gun, more powerful than the "Assault Rifle" and takes up less room on the screen. Funny thing, when mounting the red dot, it has a side mount similar to the real AK but on the other side to accommodate the left side ejection. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]])

Also despite this being an AK...they didn't want to call it an AK or even the Chinese Assault Rifle like in Fallout 3. I keep wondering is the reason why no real world guns is because of some weird legal copyright issue or are they so incompetent that they can't imagine good mods for real guns? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 09:54, 6 September 2016 (EDT)
:I assume that the lack of any real guns is a stylistic choice or something along those lines. Which is lame (if that's the case) as previous Fallout games contained a nice combo of made-up guns along with real ones, didn't Fallout 2 have P90s and those SA80 prototypes?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:54, 6 September 2016 (EDT)

A lot of guns in Fallout 3, which was also a Bethestha game had mostly real guns. Even the 10mm handgun is partly based off a Desert Eagle. There's the G3 type, the AK type. In Vegas, Obsidian took it a step further with AR type rifles, a Browning HP and 1911s in the DLC with direct ties to John Browning with the guy claiming an ancestor of his designed them and tommy guns. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 14:22, 6 September 2016 (EDT)
:Well, yeah, but why did they decided to stop doing that and make a whole lot of disgusting abominations as in this game? --[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:25, 6 September 2016 (EDT)
::Maybe they are fueled by the "cool kids" that don't like any actual real world guns and wanted to design some fakey guns of the faux future...despite that the sniper rifle is still pretty much a Remington 700 and there is a Tommy Gun. And now they added an AK most likely because of modders making actual real guns in the game. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 13:40, 7 September 2016 (EDT)
Maybe they think it's tasteless or something to feature real guns in their ultra-violent game. Whatever the reason is, it's lame.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:04, 7 September 2016 (EDT)
:Yeah, I call BS on that logic. I think it was either a matter of copyright issue for using real world gun images like this or because the lack of imagination on modding real world guns. I seriously think the AK in Nuka World was placed here in response to the tons of mods of real world guns being used and it isn't even correctly placed in here. Left side charging handle with rounds ejecting the wrong way is so early 2000s FPS. It used be the rage with games to mirror guns and have the brass all over your face when you shoot. To me, it just bothers me. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 17:56, 7 September 2016 (EDT)
::I'm with ya'. I can't stand mirrored models like that either. Even when the weapons are fictional it makes zero sense.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 04:03, 8 September 2016 (EDT)
::Goes to show these guys just don't understand how guns work. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 10:06, 8 September 2016 (EDT)

== So, I was browsing Forgotten Weapons... ==

And I came across the [http://www.forgottenweapons.com/other-handguns/volkspistole-walther/ Volkspistole], a German made pistol that was designed to be a cheap "last ditch" weapon during the last days of the Second World War.

Now, maybe I'm crazy but I can really see the Fallout 4 10mm Pistol in this gun. The last image on the page is what really made me see the resemblance.

Am I the only one? I can kinda see it in the general shape of the slide, mostly. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 14:48, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
:I can sorta see what you're going for, question is if they actually based it of this gun or it's just mere coincidence....--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:59, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
::I'm leaning more towards coincidence. It just really reminded me of the 10mm for some reason. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 16:22, 12 September 2016 (EDT)

Nope. the grip angle is wrong and the slide really isn't anywhere close [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 15:01, 12 September 2016 (EDT)

: Yeah, doesn´t look at all like the 10mm from the game. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 01:51, 13 September 2016 (EDT)

== 5mm ==

What is the 5mm round actually modeled after? I've never heard of any 5mm in real life.

Here's a [https://imgur.com/46kzrzU? comparison]between some other calibers in-game (not my pic).

I wondering about this cuz there's a [http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/18047/? mod] trying to change the names for the various rounds in the game.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:19, 16 October 2016 (EDT)

:That is defiantly not a "5mm round", it looks closest to .460 Steyr http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-6IvtI00pxmg/Vmjm4w4fv5I/AAAAAAAAOzQ/ErQO9GO6R6o/s1600/Standard-Obsolete-Big-Bore-bp.jpg. Also all the bullets look to be the same bullet at different scales, Oh Bethesda... What gun is it for anyway? [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 12:05, 16 October 2016 (EDT)

The 5mm is chambered (exclusively, if I'm not mistaken) for the minigun.--[[User:H3nry8adger1982|H3nry8adger1982]] ([[User talk:H3nry8adger1982|talk]]) 10:56, 24 March 2017 (EDT)H3nry8adger1982
:I think the question was about what it's modeled after and not which weapon used it.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 11:03, 24 March 2017 (EDT)

Yes, but he asked, 'What gun is it used for anyway?' That's what I answered.--[[User:H3nry8adger1982|H3nry8adger1982]] ([[User talk:H3nry8adger1982|talk]]) 13:31, 24 March 2017 (EDT)H3nry8adger1982
::No, he literally asked "What is the 5mm round actually modeled after?" In any case, I'd say it's somewhat analogous to either 5.7x28mm FN (which if I recall the "More Calibers" mod changes it to) and the 5.45mm round the Russians use. New Vegas gave us the Assault Carbine to fire it as well (naturally Bethesda then removed it from this game because we can't have nice things) which further solidifies my belief it's supposed to be an intermediate PDW round (though why something like that would exist when there's already 5.56mm in the game and further why on earth you'd chamber a minigun in it is beyond me). If I recall, one of the AK variants in one of the pre-Bethesda games also uses this round, so it may be a holdover from then, although the rifle it was for has not shown up since, to my knowledge. --[[User:Godzillafan93|That's the Way It's Done]] ([[User talk:Godzillafan93|talk]]) 00:07, 24 April 2017 (EDT)
:::I didn't look at that picture before I commented above; I don't think Bethesda's scaling on this is correct, but that's really absurd for the 5mm round to be so big. I remember in ''New Vegas'' shot for shot it was in the high ROF, low DPS weapons like the Assault Carbine (which was the traditional FPS assault rifle) and the minigun, so it logically should be smaller. Also if I recall the Assault Carbine used regular 20-round STANAG magazines, which makes this even more bizarre. --[[User:Godzillafan93|That's the Way It's Done]] ([[User talk:Godzillafan93|talk]]) 00:10, 24 April 2017 (EDT)
If I remember my lore correctly, the 5mm is the Fallout equivalent of Project SALVO's 5.6mm, but with a spitzer bullet with a steel core instead of a flechette. The massive size difference in comparison to previous titles is, once again, Bethesda not giving half a petrified turd about lore and just making it up as they go along. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 20:22, 24 April 2017 (EDT)
:If you ask me, it just seems to be an analogue for things like 5.7x28mm or 4.6x30mm- a small-diameter, extremely high-velocity round meant for dealing with armor. Now, I'm going mostly by FA:NV here, but this is further supported by its use in small, compact carbines, presumably intended to be used in a PDW-type role, and its high effectiveness against armored enemies. As for the minigun, it's probably just as this page says- to justify a ridiculously low per-shot damage value. And yeah, that scaling is just someone not thinking things through clearly. Thoughts? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 20:49, 24 April 2017 (EDT)
:: I dunno, 5.7 and 4.6 are pistol sized cartridges, while 5mm is definitely at least the same length as 5.56, given the fact that the Assault Carbine and the Service Rifle use the exact same magazine model, and I always figured that the low damage was because it was punching straight through and leaving a pretty small wound channel. Also, the AC loads 4 more rounds that the SR, so it's probably thinner as well, my best guess is that it's like the XM645, but shorter. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 04:20, 26 April 2017 (EDT)

Talk:Fallout 4

2017-04-26T08:20:46Z

Yocapo32: /* 5mm */

__TOC__ 

=Discussion=
Once you upgrade the Combat Rifle with long barrel, .308 receiver, and full stock, it's pretty much a BAR. And the Hunting Rifle is probably based on a real rifle. as well. The Assault Rifle looks a bit like the Lewsi Gun, but I haven't got one yet.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 10:05, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:Oh, yeah, there's a .44 revolver as well.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 10:08, 13 November 2015 (EST)
::The revolver is similar to the S&W M29, which would make sense since they used that model in the previous games. The character in first person is always shown cooking the hammer between shots, but that isn't actually animated in third person.
::There's something i wonder btw, in the live action intro (which doesn't have Ron Pearlman narrating for some reason :() you can see a chinese soldier holding a rifle that kinda looks like a Galil, is that the case?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:10, 13 November 2015 (EST)

::Haven't gotten that far in the game myself, but yeah, the Galil looks like it has the folding bipod equipped (seen below), making it the Galil ARM. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 12:58, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:::Have the chinese ever used Galil's or is that a stand in for whatever weapon they were using in the 50's?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:25, 13 November 2015 (EST)
[[Image:Fallout4Galil.jpg|thumb|none|500px|A Chinese soldier holds a Galil ARM in the live-action intro.]]
:No the Chinese never used Galils, the Galil went into service with the Israelis in 1972, and the Chinese used Type 56 Carbines aka the Chinese SKS and the Type 56 Chinese AKs in the 50's. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 14:57, 13 November 2015 (EST)
::Struck me as a bit odd for them to use that weapon in that intro. Then again, this is a game where you can have laser pistols so i guess i can gloss over it.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:07, 13 November 2015 (EST)
Maybe as a stand-in for the Type 81? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 15:20, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:Type 81's came out in the 1980's. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:25, 13 November 2015 (EST)
You can't put real timeline on a Fallout game, they have a parallel history, where a lot of technology came early, and some of it more advanced than ours right now. Realistically the rifle is probably not meant to be a galil but just a generic rifle that in that universe is used by them, they just chose the Galil because it would be relatively unknown to gamers and it looks like a bad guy gun. AK on the other hand would be known by most --[[User:Iceman|Iceman]] ([[User talk:Iceman|talk]]) 09:04, 17 November 2015 (EST)

::Oh, and I just saw a Walther PPK (or a PPK/S) on a loading screen today. Haven't seen one in the game yet, though. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 15:33, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:::It would('ve) be nice to have one of those in the game. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:41, 13 November 2015 (EST)
The Combat Rifle looks like a PPSh-41 but with a small mag and apparently chambered in. 45 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 22:36, 15 November 2015 (EST)
: Looks a bit like the BAR with the long barrel, full stock, and .308 receiver--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 06:22, 16 November 2015 (EST).

What do you say about these guns?

Combat rifle: [http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/6/67/Fallout4_Combat_rifle.png/revision/latest?cb=20151111133727]

Flare pistol: [http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/c/c1/Fallout4_Flare_gun.png/revision/latest?cb=20151122152815]
--[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 14:38, 28 November 2015 (EST)
:The combat rifle kinda looks like a BAR (and is also really similar to the combat shotgun) I also recognize that Flare Pistol design but i can't remember the name for it. If you have good screenshots of em, ad them.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:44, 28 November 2015 (EST)
::[http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/Kampfpistole The Flare gun is this thing]--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:22, 28 November 2015 (EST)
== Pipe weapons: Total fiction? ==

Anyone who has played this game has probably come across one of the many pipe weapons in game, weapons that have been crudely built from (as you might have guessed) pipes, sticks and other junk. What i wonder is if these types of weapons even would work in real-life.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:30, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:I know you can build a zip gun using pipes. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 16:43, 13 November 2015 (EST)
::To some extent, yes, it is entirely possible to make working firearms out of scrap materials but of course they always have inherent flaws. I doubt you'd be able to make 'em like anything in Fallout 4 but I know that many third world militia's and criminal elements in the world sometime make use of home-made firearms ranging from revolvers and pistols to sub-machine guns and rifles all made out of pipes and scrap metal. While I wouldn't believe that the design of the Pipe Pistol (and its upgrades from pistol to rifle) could work, the most realistic "home-made" weapon I've found thus far appears to be the Pipe Revolver. It's chambered in .45 caliber and is single action only. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] ([[User talk:Draco122|talk]]) 17:21, 13 November 2015 (EST)
:::Well, there are some guns like the Sten that are specifically designed to be made with as little specialised tooling as possible, too. Though I do like the pipe-FG42 you can build, that's suitably silly. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:35, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::::Building a pipe-weapon is possible, but AFAIK it would only be good for like one or two shots. A fully-automatic pipe weapon, especially the ones in game that are built out of a wood block, springs, screws and piping wouldn't be good for more than a few shots before they either caught fire, jammed, exploded or broke. Making a weapon out of that stuff that can feed, extract and fire .38s and .45s with no problems constantly (and do it fully automatic) is in the realm of fantasy. Its a nice touch though, really fits into the universe and gives it a very "Metro 2033" vibe. [[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 01:04, 18 November 2015 (EST)
:::: not quite total fiction. You really should check out some of the weapons that have turned up on Improguns. Some of the stuff rivals factory quality while other stuff I'm surprised it didn't explode. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] ([[User talk:Rockwolf66|talk]])
:::::With modern machining and resources, I have no doubt its possible to make functioning firearms like zip guns or makeshift shotguns. But if the weapon is literally a block of wood tied to a piece of metal with zip ties, with a pipe for a barrel and chamber, a screw for the firing pin assembly, another screw and spring that functions as a charging handle and two more circular pipes for the grip and stock and said weapon is capable of chambering .38 Special or .45 ACP, feed them flawlessly without a jam or extractor failure and fire them in fully automatic without the wooden block catching on fire or the weapon catastrophically failing, I have to say that's incredibly impressive. Doubly so because this is 210 years after a nuclear apocalypse. [[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]])

== Weapons thus far ==

So my journey's into Fallout 4 and the vast number of weapons have made me try and find the most realistic looking ones so far the ones I have found are:
* .44 Revolver - Like someone above has said it resembles the S&W Model 29, however certain mods and even a unique version make it look very similar to some Dan Wesson PPC Revolvers.
* Walther PPK - Is a unique 10mm Pistol called the "Deliever", it has a permanatly affixed suppressor and uses 10mm
* Flare Gun - Appears to be based off the german Kampfpistole Z, works similar to the Radio in FNV, fire it in the air and it will summon allies to your position if they are nearby.
* Hunting Rifle - Appears to be based off the early Remington 700, a unique version called Reba II uses .50 caliber and a synthetic polymer stock and can also be modified into a pistol form
* Combat Rifle/Combat Shotgun - Both seem to use the same model, except the Combat Shotgun uses a different magazine. Initially it chambers the .45 Round, which made me think it was like supped up Reising SMG but can later be converted to .308 and function similar to a BAR.
* Double Barrel Shotgun - Mods really change this weapon, initially it appears as a short barrelled shotgun with a pistol grip but can feature sawn off barrels for increase spread (and better critical damage) or a full wooden stock and a long barrel for more concerntrated fire.
* Sniper Rifle - Haven't found one yet but it appears to be based on a Semi-Auto sniper platform.
[[User:Draco122|Draco122]] ([[User talk:Draco122|talk]]) 17:47, 13 November 2015 (EST)
::So far, the weapons that i've come across that's called sniper rifle was just the hunting rifle with a scope. The names of the weapons change depending on what mods they have.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 07:32, 14 November 2015 (EST)
:::You can also get it to call your weapon a sniper rifle if you give a "pipe" weapon some combination of long barrel / marksman stock / scope. It seems to work out the name of the weapon a bit like Borderlands does, only it doesn't only give the weapon the highest-order prefix. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:38, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:::Also having seen the model for the .44 revolver, the huge beefy barrel isn't really Dan Wesson, it's just a really weirdly re-proportioned vented rib barrel turned upside-down. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 10:48, 15 November 2015 (EST)

== Remington VTR ==
If you upgrade the hunting rifle with the final stock and a certain barrel which makes the barrel into a triangular shape, it strongly resembles a VTR. Worth mentioning? [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 09:40, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:Got a screenshot? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:41, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:: I can get one uploaded once I'm off work, I can also do some 1st person ones of the others as well. Also, could someone move the mural guns to a non-usable section? [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 09:46, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:::We don't normally do that, weapons are usually documented by type rather than if you can use them or not. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:51, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::: Alright, one last thing, the Assault Rifle in-game instantly reminded me of an MG-08 or something along those lines, even more so since it can take a drum mag. It also has a unique compensator that someone might be able to narrow it down. [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 10:02, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::::Haven't seen it yet, been too busy pratting around turning my pipegun into an FG42-thing :) [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 10:06, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:::::Also, I think I have now seen that barrel you're talking about for the hunting rifle, it looks more like it's a squashed FAL handguard. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 10:52, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::::::I checked it, it is a VTR based stock and triangular barrel. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 15:24, 15 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::For Tim. http://i.imgur.com/ghSou9r.jpg [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 20:19, 15 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::Huh, ok. Didn't look like it did that from the side. Guess I was figuring that from their propensity to make custom parts by randomly stretching and squashing things, like the MP7 bits on the rocket launcher. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:41, 15 November 2015 (EST)

== Minor Edit ==
Just a quick edit to the page, but you can remove the Walther PPK aka The Deliverer' surpressor by going to the Weapons Workbench in-game. --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 23:06, 16 November 2015 (EST)
:Didn't know that--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 06:49, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::I only just found out last night you can do that (Though, am I the only one hearing the silencer sound-effect from the N64 Goldeneye 007 when firing that gun while it's surpressed?). --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 12:43, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::Actually just got it, can't say it sounds like that though--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:06, 17 November 2015 (EST)

== Acronym for player character. ==

So i was just wondering if we should use an acronym for the player character, like PC, Since the PC doesn't have any catchy name like "The lone wanderer" or "The courier" this time around.
Not a huge deal really but constantly writing player character just seems a bit dull.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:13, 17 November 2015 (EST)
: Your character is the Sole Survivor.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 14:25, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::In that case.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:00, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::Which is a bit of an odd name for them since the whole point of their quest is that they're looking for a second survivor. As long as you don't call them "the player" since the person in the game isn't the player: you end up with extremely silly sentences like "this weapon can easily kill the player" if you do that which make it sound like the game has a high chance of leaving you lying dead on the sofa. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 15:12, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::(un)Funny thing is that i just did that. Call the "Sole Survivor" the player. Oh well, such is the life of the mac--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:27, 17 November 2015 (EST)

== Name of rifle ==

The generic name for the Remington appears to be "rifle:" "hunting" is the prefix for short versions and "sniper" the prefix for long ones. "Sniper" might also require a scope to be fitted, but I know it does require a long barrel:

[[Image:Fallout4-10mm-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|"Scoped Powerful Hunting Rifle" can be seen in the list (I didn't highlight it because I already had a shot of the Obrez version and didn't think I needed another).]]
[[Image:Fallout4-Remington-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Since I didn't have enough screws or duct tape to make a long barrel (um...) I didn't have one at that point, but the title changes when it's selected. Since it doesn't say "scoped," "sniper rifle" probably requires rifle + scope + long barrel, but I haven't checked what it's called if you deselect the scope yet.]]
:Interesting hunting rifle on the first pic there. Is it a unique weapon?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:50, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::Naw, it's just the name there because I didn't have it highlighted. Look two up from the cursor. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 15:52, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::Crazy--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:08, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::Also, now that i think about it, should the 10mm pistol even be on this page? Considering it doesn't really look like any actual gun (atleast not any gun that i can think of)
::::It doesn't really have any resemblance to the Desert Eagle anymore.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:18, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::::It's worth pointing out that it's changed from being loosely based on a real gun to just being based on the previous version of itself; we covered that version, so we should probably include it here too. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 17:21, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::::Is it just me or does it looks as a mutated [[Colt M1911]]? --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 00:53, 18 November 2015 (UTC+2)
:::::::I guess i can see some resemblance to the 1911, some.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:50, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::It reminds me of that prototype stamped steel 1911.http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2013/01/02/the-mystery-of-the-stamped-steel-1911/ --[[User:Aidoru|Aidoru]] ([[User talk:Aidoru|talk]]) 19:27, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::Yeah, but that's largely a coincidence, it's a deagle slide with the safety removed because we have the past games to refer to. Given how obscure that pistol is, I doubt the devs knew about it. Also check out the Liberator on that page, someone plated one of those silly contraptions? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 19:34, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::::::::I know some people are weird about it, but we include completely fictional guns (as long as that's not all the game has) to inform people that look up the game or the weapons what they are and are not. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 20:44, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::::::::::Yeah, as long as it's not something nobody would think was real in the first place like the laser muskets, it's ok. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:46, 17 November 2015 (EST)

== About screenshots ==

If you're playing the PC version of the game and want to take some fancy screenshots for the site (or just in general) You can use the console and type in tfc, this will allow you to move around the camera freely, type tfc 1 and it will also pause time. Then you can just hide the HUD by writing in tm and/or change the FOV via typing in fov 90 for example (the default FOV is 70)--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:53, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:I prefer in-game shots where possible, and you can usually get some nice views in VATS so that isn't really all that necessary. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 19:38, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::They are still in-game, VATS have HUD all over the place and the camera angles are random.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 19:53, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::Well, the HUD is kind of supposed to be there, you know, that's what the game looks like. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:08, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::It doesn't look very good in a screenshot, something that's supposed to show the gun, not the HUD, less clutter is preferable.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 20:09, 17 November 2015 (EST)
:::::Eh, my feeling on it is that it should look as normal as possible (subject to some sacrifices like turning off motion blur to make things clearer) to show what the weapon looks like while you're playing the game. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 20:45, 17 November 2015 (EST)
::::::I guess i have a flare for the dramatic then.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 21:10, 17 November 2015 (EST)

If the HUD seriously obscures the image to the point of making a positive ID difficult or something, that'd be one thing, otherwise I'm with Tim - In-game shots should remain in as normal/default a state as possible. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] ([[User talk:StanTheMan|talk]]) 01:24, 18 November 2015 (EST)

== Fallout 4 Assault Rifle=Not an assault rifle, but a machine gun? ==

The more I stare at Fallout 4's Assault Rifle (which IMHO looks weird and terrible, what happened to Fallout 3's amazing design?), the more its design and designation as an "assault rifle" bothers me. What exactly was Bethesda thinking when designing it?

*It has a liquid cooling jacket wrapped around the barrel, like an early Maxim gun or Lewis gun. In fact its barrel reminds me of an M1917 Browning.
*It has a machine gun style carrying handle to the right of the receiver.
*It feeds from the side, like an FG42.
*Its grip is directly taken from an MG42.
*The overall bulky shape and profile seems to suggest "machine gun" more than "assault rifle"

Its basically a mishmash of various machine guns, with the "assault rifle" tacked on. Fallout 3 had its G3 based assault rifle, so this feels like a step back.[[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 01:18, 18 November 2015 (EST)
:I wouldn't say the gun design in Fallout 3 (or New Vegas for that matter) was "amazing" some guns were alright but for the most part they looked like crap and the animations were awful. Thank god for modders. But anyhow,one thing i've noticed to is that, when firing the AR, while the weapon has its ejection port on the right, the brass actually goes through the gun and ejects to the left. Also, when reloading, you simply remove and insert another magazine.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 05:22, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::Fair point, Fallout 3's designs weren't stellar, but they sort of fit in the universe and made sense, the animations were awful though. [[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 16:41, 18 November 2015 (EST)
Can I see some screenshots? [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 13:12, 18 November 2015 (EST)
:I think the 'Assault Rifle' is designed to be held by someone in power armor, hence the bulky design, although I agree it seems more like a Machine Gun. --[[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 18:36, 18 November 2015 (GMT)
::I can get some pic.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:56, 18 November 2015 (EST)

Here you go, Mr. Wolf. Have never posted a picture here before, so I may have formatted it wrong. Direct from the Fallout 4 page here on IMFDB.[[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 16:50, 18 November 2015 (EST)
[[File:F4 AR left.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

:::Remember to sign your post buddy. Anyhow, pics are up on the page, take a look.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:42, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::::My bad, forgot. I'll make the necessary edits.[[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]]) 16:50, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::You live you learn.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:54, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::It's highly like [[Lewis gun]]. Must be an upgraded version similar even more? --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 16:59, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::Funny that you mention that because there is! You can put a long barrel on it which makes it look very similar to a Lewis gun.
::Seriously though, what kind of gun is this to include in the game anyway? It looks dumb--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:30, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::See what I mean? It just looks weird and off, and looks like something from an alternate WW2. [[User:Antediluvial|Antediluvial]] ([[User talk:Antediluvial|talk]])
:::An M16/CAR-15 like in NV or a M14 would of been better... [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 20:45, 18 November 2015 (EST)
::::There was an M14 in the live action Wanderer trailer. It got my hopes up for a little bit. The closest thing we have to a practical assault rifle is the Combat Rifle, which reminds me of a BAR somewhat. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 17:32, 19 November 2015 (EST)
I just want to remind everyone that the cover on the Lewis gun is not a water jacket, the Lewis is air-cooled. The description on the page right now seems to suggest that the Lewis is also water cooled. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 22:27, 18 November 2015 (EST)
:Yeah, it's got the fin array from the Lewis barrel jacket at the base and ''also'' has a coolant line going in like a Maxim. Just a note, with a water jacket this would never be a GPMG, it'd be too heavy to use in the light role. It's a medium machine gun. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 00:38, 19 November 2015 (EST)
::Then again, it's fed by a box magazine rather than a belt and is missing a bipod. What a train wreck. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 07:39, 19 November 2015 (EST)
:::It's really either a heavy light machine gun or no-purpose machine gun :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:39, 19 November 2015 (EST)
::Sorry. :V [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 01:22, 19 November 2015 (EST)

Here is another pic: [http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/fallout/images/1/17/Fo4_assault_rifle.png/revision/latest?cb=20150616142923]. Here, similar to the Lewis gun even more. --[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 08:57, 19 November 2015 (EST)
:Is that a drum mag? At least that would make more sense. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] ([[User talk:Funkychinaman|talk]]) 09:02, 19 November 2015 (EST)
::It's a drum mag. Also, could i ask why your pictures are so small? What are you playing the game on? A phone?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:35, 19 November 2015 (EST)
:::Different guy, it's wikia doing that this time, they only display a thumbnail if you direct-link to an image on their servers. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 09:38, 19 November 2015 (EST)

Anyone think that the Assault Rifle looks like a MAS AA-52 with a Lewis Gun Barrel Jacket on it?--[[User:Insertjjs|Insertjjs]] ([[User talk:Insertjjs|talk]]) 13:16, 24 November 2015 (EST)
[[File:AA52.jpg]]

Kinda--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:32, 24 November 2015 (EST)
:Looks more like a [[Maxim MG08/15]] than anything else to me. --[[User:RedRobinAlpha|RedRobinAlpha]] ([[User talk:RedRobinAlpha|talk]]) 16:09, 01 December 2015 (GMT)
::That's even more clunky than the gun in the game. :P [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 18:37, 1 December 2015 (EST)

What about this gun? Does anyone see any similarities with the Fallout 4 Assault Rifle? I know this might not have the other features that were taken from the aforementioned guns, but it seems to be more closely representing this particular oddboy than anything else. [[User:50AEDeagle|50AEDeagle]] ([[User talk:50AEDeagle|talk]]) 8:30, 23 March 2017 (EST)
[[File:MClean machine gun.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Mclean Automatic Musket. This odd-looking machine gun was the "baby step" in the development of the Lewis gun. (File from [https://www.slideshare.net/tcattermole/lewis-machine-gun-a-game-changer here])]]

== Section for the Discussion of Old/Beta weapons ==

I added into the Galil ARM section about how a Galil ARM-Look alike with a different barrel(?) can be seen in the Teaser Trailer wielded by one of the Diamond City Guards.

Hopefully there are files left for it in the game, would be nice IMO to have a PROPER ASSAULT RIFLE instead of that wannabe MG-08 Assault Rifle/Lewis Gun/M249 SAW mutant.

[[Image:Beta_Fo4_Galil.jpg]]

--[[User:Morayus1|Morayus1]] ([[User talk:Morayus1|talk]]) 03:43, 19 November 2015 (EST)

:Um...Is the reader supposed to determine this with a microscope? 89 pixel thumbnails aren't really good enough to make an ID from. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 04:20, 19 November 2015 (EST)
::What is this? A picture for ants? Really though, the gun on that tiny pic kinda looks like the Battle Rifle BAR thing with a curved mag, i don't think it's some weapon that never ended up in the game.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 08:12, 19 November 2015 (EST)
:::It's probably just the Chinese Assault Rifle used as a placeholder. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 13:29, 23 November 2015 (EST)
::::Actually, i just found [http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/2455/?tab=1&navtag=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nexusmods.com%2Ffallout4%2Fajax%2Fmoddescription%2F%3Fid%3D2455%26preview%3D&pUp=1 this] on the Fallout 4 nexus. Apparently there was going to be a Chinese Assault Rifle in the game but they cut it. Kinda like that Harpoon gun. Too bad, since it looks much better than the "assault rifle" that we got. Maybe we'll see it return in some future DLC--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:12, 24 November 2015 (EST)

== .44 Pistol Third Person Cocking ==
"The player character will always cock the hammer after each shot, this animation is however only present in first-person." You sure? Cause I fired this gun in-game in third person and it does look like he cocks the hammer. --[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 12:48, 22 November 2015 (EST)
::I'm fairly sure.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:29, 22 November 2015 (EST)
:::I just checked again and he does cock the hammer when in third person.--[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 00:27, 23 November 2015 (EST)
::::Change it then--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 04:43, 23 November 2015 (EST)
I've changed it now. The player character does fire it in single action in third person too. It's more visible if you use VATS and power armor, but it does happen. Also, the minigun seems to spin clockwise in 1st person but counter-clockwise in 3rd person for some reason, so I added that too.--[[User:Xarex|Xarex]] ([[User talk:Xarex|talk]]) 05:25, 31 January 2016 (EST)

== G3 ==

I dont know if those count but there are two G3's on a weapon shop sign in Diamond city. - [[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] ([[User talk:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|talk]]) 14:29, 24 November 2015 (EST)
:Might as well ad them since someone added the weapons seen on that wall in that museum. Very specific i know.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 16:33, 24 November 2015 (EST)
::If they're there and we know what they are, we should identify them. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 17:57, 24 November 2015 (EST)

== New Firearms Seen in Far Harbor DLC Trailer ==

[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B0wSCFBJcSs A New trailer has been released for the next DLC for the game, titled "Far Harbor"], and two new conventional firearms can be seen in the trailer, a lever-action rifle, and a new assault rifle that appears to resemble the Volkssturmgewehr from the end of World War 2.

[[Image:Fallout4LeverActionRifle.jpeg|thumb|none|500px|The Lever-Action rifle held by the old man.]]
[[Image:Fallout4NewRifle.jpeg|thumb|none|500px|The Rifle resembling the Volkssturmgewehr.]]

--[[User:QueenSasha24|QueenSasha24]] ([[User talk:QueenSasha24|talk]]) 18:10, 4 May 2016 (EDT)
:Like the look of that levergun, but as a guy i know said; "Fallout 4 is worse than blighttown"--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 22:42, 4 May 2016 (EDT)

So here's some pics of the "Lever Action Rifle" if anyone wants to use them for the page or identifying. It fires 45-70 (not that Fallout 4 cartridges are ever accurate), and has a five round magazine. I know next to nothing about lever actions rifles, but it seems to be most similar to a Marlin 336. I'd rather not make the entry until I can get some more informed opinions, though.

[[Image:Fallout4_Lever_Action_Rifle.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The base rifle.]]
[[Image:Fallout4_Lever_Action_Rifle_with_ mods.jpg|thumb|none|500px|With stock and scope.]]
[[Image:Fallout4 Lever Action Rifle first person.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The player prepares to save Open Mic Night from McCready's awful jokes.]]
[[Image:F4_Lever_Action_Rifle_3rdPerson.jpg|thumb|none|500px|I miss New Vegas.]]
[[Image:F4_Lever_Action_Rifle_3rdpersonEx.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Much to the Brotherhood of Steel's chagrin, the player re-enacts a scene from Cowboys vs Aliens.]]

Had to use my phone for these pics, so I apologize if they're lower quality or something.
--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 03:13, 21 May 2016 (EDT)

Looks like Sasha was right about the Volkssturmgewehr; it appears in game as the "Radium Rifle".

[[Image:F4Volkssturmgewehr.jpg|thumb|none|500px|With the extended mag and full stock mods.]]
[[Image:F4Volkssturmgewehr1stperson.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The Volkssturmgewehr user takes aim at his least favorite painting.]]
[[Image:F4VolkssturmgewehrADS.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Aiming down the sights.]]
[[Image:F4Volkssturmgewehr3rdperson.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Gute Nacht.]]
--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 03:44, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:Seriously, Bethesda's weapon design in horrible! Hate the weapons in this game. I really hope Obsidian makes the next Fallout (heard some rumors about that) since they seem to have slightly more knowledge about guns. Slightly.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:01, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::These weapons seem a lot better than the ones in the base game; have to give them kudos on actually knowing about the VG.51. Perhaps people are really paying attention to Forgotten Weapons.--[[User:AgentGumby|AgentGumby]] ([[User talk:AgentGumby|talk]]) 10:27, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:::They are still committing the mortal sin of mirroring the weapon models.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:37, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::::Yeah, I forgave them the first time, but they really need to knock that off. Still, it's a fun gun. Anyway, should I create a gun page for the Volkssturmgewehr when I make the entry for the "Radium Rifle"? There doesn't seem to be one existing. --[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 13:31, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:: I have to agree with that statement. Going from AKs and G3's (Fallout 3) to M16s, M4s, and RO933s (Vegas) to these is pretty disappointing. [[User:Majorcamo|Majorcamo]] ([[User talk:Majorcamo|talk]]) 13:39, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::: I agree- Fallout is better with more real world weapons. It feels more believable and immersive. I just really can't get behind the weird guns in this game. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 14:48, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::::I'm with ya'. It doesn't help that the first person animations suck too.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:00, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
I very much agree that the animations just suck. The levergun, for example, has only ONE reload animation: insert five rounds into the tube regardless of current ammo state. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] ([[User talk:HashiriyaR32|talk]]) 20:19, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:::::I'm kinda hoping that they will add a pump action shotgun. Something with a magazine tube and not some weird box mag.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 21:36, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
Also, there's a Harpoon Gun, but I have no idea if it's based off of any real weapon. If it is, I'm guessing it's late 19th century.
[[Image:F4Harpoongun.jpg|thumb|none|500px|."Got a whale of a tale to tell ya, lads, a whale of a tale or two!"]]
--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 21:06, 21 May 2016 (EDT)

Well, I added the VG 1-5. Let me know if I need to change anything (or just make the changes you see fit). P.S., after some quick Google searching, I think the Harpoon Gun is an original design loosely inspired by a handful of early harpoon guns (found a few pictures and drawings). Should we bother including it?--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 02:05, 22 May 2016 (EDT)
:Is Far Harbor similar to Point Lookout from Fallout 3? Cuz i loved Point Lookout.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 13:25, 22 May 2016 (EDT)
::I have to admit, I never played that DLC. But Far Harbor is better than I expected (not saying much) so far. I'm still pretty early into it, but what I like most is the environment. It's a little bit swampy in places, it's foggy, it got a forest that looks great, and the sounds are the best part. Real insect and frog sounds that are probably supposed to be creepy, but felt kind of serene to me. This DLC has made me miss camping. Anyway, there's really no new features so far, but the theme is alright, the environment is good, and there's some cool new enemies like the giant hermet crabs. I haven't played enough of it to know if I should recommend it, though.--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 06:59, 23 May 2016 (EDT)
:::I'll probably buy it just for that lever-action rifle, love those.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 17:55, 23 May 2016 (EDT)

== Not an M1911 ==
I noticed that the gun on the poster didn't look right for a 1911, then I noticed that it seemed a bit weird for a WW2 soldier to be using such a grip. It was at that point I remembered [[http://www.wearethemighty.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/03/Browning-HP-British-soldier-e1459175767900.jpg This image]] that I'd seen awhile ago of a British soldier with a Hi-power in Basra. Perfect match.--[[User:BlackHawk510|BlackHawk510]] ([[User talk:BlackHawk510|talk]]) 23:00, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:How about that!--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 23:05, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
::Damn- good catch! It's funny, I remember thinking when I picked up that magazine "huh, that grip seems surprisingly...modern". But I didn't even think to check the gun. It's always cool when you find the exact picture that video game artists used. It is a shame there seems to be almost no artists that know much about guns, though. Will you be changing the entry, or should one of us?--[[User:Fidget|Fidget]] ([[User talk:Fidget|talk]]) 23:44, 21 May 2016 (EDT)
:::Eh, I'll do it.--[[User:BlackHawk510|BlackHawk510]] ([[User talk:BlackHawk510|talk]]) 00:14, 22 May 2016 (EDT)
::::It's a real shame that gun and caliber aren't present in this game; I love the fact ''New Vegas'' has more handguns than there are guns in this game. --[[User:Godzillafan93|That's the Way It's Done]] ([[User talk:Godzillafan93|talk]]) 22:02, 27 May 2016 (EDT)

== Art of Fallout 4 and Assault Rifle ==

The official Fallout 4 artbook states that the "assault rifle" was intended to be a machine gun that would look large in the oversized hands of power armor. During development, it eventually morphed into the assault rifle we see now. It was also one of the first weapons created for the game, as well as being a way to test the modular weapon customization. So that kind of confirms our theories on why that thing is called an "assault rifle." --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 00:46, 27 May 2016 (EDT)
:What's interesting is that someone found an unfinished model for the Chinese AR in the game's files and uploaded it to the Fallout 4 [http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/2455/? Nexus]. Too bad Bethesda never added it to the game.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 08:45, 27 May 2016 (EDT)
::Yeah, it is a shame. I would've really appreciated a true AR in this game. The combat rifle is a good gun, but aesthetically I don't really like it. An I'm pretty sure the Assault Rifle is the only 5.56 gun in the game. Seems like a waste. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 22:19, 28 May 2016 (EDT)
:::A G3 would be nice--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 09:21, 29 May 2016 (EDT)
::::Or a M16 and a CAR-15 like in New Vegas since this is still in the US. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 12:28, 29 May 2016 (EDT)
:::I can't stand how the Assault Rifle looks. To the point I modded in the rifles from the previous games--[[User:Zombiedrd|Zombiedrd]] ([[User talk:Zombiedrd|talk]]) 12:42, 29 May 2016 (EDT)
::Now AK series appear in the new trailer for Fallout 4. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DIneiOpuS2M Youtube]--[[User:PaulD21x|PaulD21x]] ([[User talk:PaulD21x|talk]]) 00:41, 16 August 2016 (EDT)
:::Interesting, the AK doesn't have the top cover on. Maybe i should buy this despite the fact that it looks stupid as shit. Atleast we got Far Harbor before this.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 06:50, 16 August 2016 (EDT)
:::I'm currently playing through the DLC and you can mod the rifle to have the top cover, along with making it look like other AK varietals (And one that makes it look like something Hello Kitty would shoot).--[[User:SeanWolf|SeanWolf]] ([[User talk:SeanWolf|talk]]) 00:41, 30 August 2016 (EDT)

==Nuka World on PC is a bitch==

If my game doesn't keep on crashing every 10 minutes, I'd be able to enjoy it. All I know is that they based the new gun design off of that famous photo of an AK built with a shovel as the stock. Which is pretty funny [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 14:55, 2 September 2016 (EDT)

Looks more like a [[Galil AR]] stock to me. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 15:25, 2 September 2016 (EDT)
:One variant has the shovel stock. The "Best stock" is the folding Galil looking stock. There's also an SVD type stock as well [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]])

:That's Bethesda's handiwork for you, making the modders fix everything.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 15:41, 2 September 2016 (EDT)

Shovel Stock OP https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/215491751459291137/219975615984566282/unknown.png --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] ([[User talk:HashiriyaR32|talk]]) 23:21, 2 September 2016 (EDT)
:Rifle is fine.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 23:41, 2 September 2016 (EDT)
Fire selector on the wrong side (as always). And it seems to be based on the early "Type I" AK-47. -[[User:Slon95|Slon95]] ([[User talk:Slon95|talk]]) 08:39, 4 September 2016 (EDT)
:Is the ejection port on the wrong side as well?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:40, 4 September 2016 (EDT)
::Yep. I'm pretty sure every gun in FO4 has the controls and whatnot on the wrong side. There's also a modification for the AK that removes the receiver cover. Can't imagine that's very good for the gun. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 21:32, 5 September 2016 (EDT)

I think the charging handle on the wrong side is so they can be lazy with animation and recycle the animation from another gun like the Combat Rifle. Why they couldn't animate the brass still going the other way is beyond me. The Combat Rifle is left side charging handle but brass ejects to the right. The base gun doesn't start out with a top cover on it but later on, you can add one as you upgrade it. Even though I couldn't play the DLC, I was able to get the ID code for the gun itself and mess around with it. Awesome gun, more powerful than the "Assault Rifle" and takes up less room on the screen. Funny thing, when mounting the red dot, it has a side mount similar to the real AK but on the other side to accommodate the left side ejection. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]])

Also despite this being an AK...they didn't want to call it an AK or even the Chinese Assault Rifle like in Fallout 3. I keep wondering is the reason why no real world guns is because of some weird legal copyright issue or are they so incompetent that they can't imagine good mods for real guns? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 09:54, 6 September 2016 (EDT)
:I assume that the lack of any real guns is a stylistic choice or something along those lines. Which is lame (if that's the case) as previous Fallout games contained a nice combo of made-up guns along with real ones, didn't Fallout 2 have P90s and those SA80 prototypes?--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 12:54, 6 September 2016 (EDT)

A lot of guns in Fallout 3, which was also a Bethestha game had mostly real guns. Even the 10mm handgun is partly based off a Desert Eagle. There's the G3 type, the AK type. In Vegas, Obsidian took it a step further with AR type rifles, a Browning HP and 1911s in the DLC with direct ties to John Browning with the guy claiming an ancestor of his designed them and tommy guns. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 14:22, 6 September 2016 (EDT)
:Well, yeah, but why did they decided to stop doing that and make a whole lot of disgusting abominations as in this game? --[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 18:25, 6 September 2016 (EDT)
::Maybe they are fueled by the "cool kids" that don't like any actual real world guns and wanted to design some fakey guns of the faux future...despite that the sniper rifle is still pretty much a Remington 700 and there is a Tommy Gun. And now they added an AK most likely because of modders making actual real guns in the game. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 13:40, 7 September 2016 (EDT)
Maybe they think it's tasteless or something to feature real guns in their ultra-violent game. Whatever the reason is, it's lame.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:04, 7 September 2016 (EDT)
:Yeah, I call BS on that logic. I think it was either a matter of copyright issue for using real world gun images like this or because the lack of imagination on modding real world guns. I seriously think the AK in Nuka World was placed here in response to the tons of mods of real world guns being used and it isn't even correctly placed in here. Left side charging handle with rounds ejecting the wrong way is so early 2000s FPS. It used be the rage with games to mirror guns and have the brass all over your face when you shoot. To me, it just bothers me. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 17:56, 7 September 2016 (EDT)
::I'm with ya'. I can't stand mirrored models like that either. Even when the weapons are fictional it makes zero sense.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 04:03, 8 September 2016 (EDT)
::Goes to show these guys just don't understand how guns work. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 10:06, 8 September 2016 (EDT)

== So, I was browsing Forgotten Weapons... ==

And I came across the [http://www.forgottenweapons.com/other-handguns/volkspistole-walther/ Volkspistole], a German made pistol that was designed to be a cheap "last ditch" weapon during the last days of the Second World War.

Now, maybe I'm crazy but I can really see the Fallout 4 10mm Pistol in this gun. The last image on the page is what really made me see the resemblance.

Am I the only one? I can kinda see it in the general shape of the slide, mostly. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 14:48, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
:I can sorta see what you're going for, question is if they actually based it of this gun or it's just mere coincidence....--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 14:59, 12 September 2016 (EDT)
::I'm leaning more towards coincidence. It just really reminded me of the 10mm for some reason. --[[User:PyramidHead|PyramidHead]] ([[User talk:PyramidHead|talk]]) 16:22, 12 September 2016 (EDT)

Nope. the grip angle is wrong and the slide really isn't anywhere close [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 15:01, 12 September 2016 (EDT)

: Yeah, doesn´t look at all like the 10mm from the game. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] ([[User talk:Warejaws|talk]]) 01:51, 13 September 2016 (EDT)

== 5mm ==

What is the 5mm round actually modeled after? I've never heard of any 5mm in real life.

Here's a [https://imgur.com/46kzrzU? comparison]between some other calibers in-game (not my pic).

I wondering about this cuz there's a [http://www.nexusmods.com/fallout4/mods/18047/? mod] trying to change the names for the various rounds in the game.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 10:19, 16 October 2016 (EDT)

:That is defiantly not a "5mm round", it looks closest to .460 Steyr http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-6IvtI00pxmg/Vmjm4w4fv5I/AAAAAAAAOzQ/ErQO9GO6R6o/s1600/Standard-Obsolete-Big-Bore-bp.jpg. Also all the bullets look to be the same bullet at different scales, Oh Bethesda... What gun is it for anyway? [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 12:05, 16 October 2016 (EDT)

The 5mm is chambered (exclusively, if I'm not mistaken) for the minigun.--[[User:H3nry8adger1982|H3nry8adger1982]] ([[User talk:H3nry8adger1982|talk]]) 10:56, 24 March 2017 (EDT)H3nry8adger1982
:I think the question was about what it's modeled after and not which weapon used it.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 11:03, 24 March 2017 (EDT)

Yes, but he asked, 'What gun is it used for anyway?' That's what I answered.--[[User:H3nry8adger1982|H3nry8adger1982]] ([[User talk:H3nry8adger1982|talk]]) 13:31, 24 March 2017 (EDT)H3nry8adger1982
::No, he literally asked "What is the 5mm round actually modeled after?" In any case, I'd say it's somewhat analogous to either 5.7x28mm FN (which if I recall the "More Calibers" mod changes it to) and the 5.45mm round the Russians use. New Vegas gave us the Assault Carbine to fire it as well (naturally Bethesda then removed it from this game because we can't have nice things) which further solidifies my belief it's supposed to be an intermediate PDW round (though why something like that would exist when there's already 5.56mm in the game and further why on earth you'd chamber a minigun in it is beyond me). If I recall, one of the AK variants in one of the pre-Bethesda games also uses this round, so it may be a holdover from then, although the rifle it was for has not shown up since, to my knowledge. --[[User:Godzillafan93|That's the Way It's Done]] ([[User talk:Godzillafan93|talk]]) 00:07, 24 April 2017 (EDT)
:::I didn't look at that picture before I commented above; I don't think Bethesda's scaling on this is correct, but that's really absurd for the 5mm round to be so big. I remember in ''New Vegas'' shot for shot it was in the high ROF, low DPS weapons like the Assault Carbine (which was the traditional FPS assault rifle) and the minigun, so it logically should be smaller. Also if I recall the Assault Carbine used regular 20-round STANAG magazines, which makes this even more bizarre. --[[User:Godzillafan93|That's the Way It's Done]] ([[User talk:Godzillafan93|talk]]) 00:10, 24 April 2017 (EDT)
If I remember my lore correctly, the 5mm is the Fallout equivalent of Project SALVO's 5.6mm, but with a spitzer bullet with a steel core instead of a flechette. The massive size difference in comparison to previous titles is, once again, Bethesda not giving half a petrified turd about lore and just making it up as they go along. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 20:22, 24 April 2017 (EDT)
:If you ask me, it just seems to be an analogue for things like 5.7x28mm or 4.6x30mm- a small-diameter, extremely high-velocity round meant for dealing with armor. Now, I'm going mostly by FA:NV here, but this is further supported by its use in small, compact carbines, presumably intended to be used in a PDW-type role, and its high effectiveness against armored enemies. As for the minigun, it's probably just as this page says- to justify a ridiculously low per-shot damage value. And yeah, that scaling is just someone not thinking things through clearly. Thoughts? [[User:Pyr0m4n14c|Pyr0m4n14c]] ([[User talk:Pyr0m4n14c|talk]]) 20:49, 24 April 2017 (EDT)
:: I dunno, 5.7 and 4.6 are pistol sized cartridges, while 5mm is definitely at least the same length as 5.56, given the size of the Minigun and the fact that the Assault Carbine and the Service Rifle use the exact same magazines, and I always figured that the low damage was because it was punching straight through and leaving a pretty small wound channel. Also, the AC loads 4 more rounds that the SR, so it's probably thinner as well, my best guess is that it's like the XM645, but shorter. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 04:20, 26 April 2017 (EDT)

Talk:Fallout 4

2017-04-25T00:22:19Z

Yocapo32: /* 5mm */

Talk:Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots

2017-01-22T17:54:30Z

Yocapo32: /* Operator or TRP Operator? */

== Replacing the infobox image ==

[[File:MGS4poster.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Infobox image as of now]]

I really don't consider this pic... well... "identifiable MGS4 imagery." Like Jesus, I think that's the beta character model of in-game Snake shown in early trailers, right!? Like take a quick peek at the images in [http://thesnakesoup.org/editorial-articles/tokyo-game-show-2005-get-the-fuck-over-it/ this awesome yet dated article] for comparisons.

Anyway, ''I'm in favor of installing pic below instead.'' The above image seems to be the prototype of the final North American cover (as shown below) and atleast the people are way more familiar with this than... Whatever the thing above is ripped from. (''Where'' *is* it from?)

[[File:MGS4_North_American_Cover.jpg|thumb|none|300px|MGS4 North American cover]]

Or alternatively
* [http://img2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080511045406/metalgear/images/c/c5/LE.jpg North American Special Edition Cover]
* [http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20080407204745/metalgear/images/e/e7/MGS4_European_Cover.jpg European Cover]
* [http://img3.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20121107145935/metalgear/images/d/d6/10650061-1352291151-833499.jpg European "MGS 25th Anniversary" reprint edition cover]

Open for opinions. [[User:TrickShotFinn|TrickShotFinn]] ([[User talk:TrickShotFinn|talk]]) 14:35, 28 February 2015 (EST)

:I would like to see the MGS4 NA cover become the new infobox picture; it's probably the best-known cover for this game. Besides, it also showcases how Old Snake was deliberately modelled to resemble [[Lee Van Cleef]] in his later years.--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 19:30, 28 February 2015 (EST)

'''''And it is done.''''' And now the whole article looks so much better! [[User:TrickShotFinn|TrickShotFinn]] ([[User talk:TrickShotFinn|talk]]) 03:54, 9 July 2015 (EDT)

== Airsoft 1911 ==
Are you absolutely sure the airsoft gun wasn't based on the gun in the game?-protoAuthor
:What are you talking about? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 04:10, 6 September 2009 (UTC)
::You say the custom 1911 was based on an airsoft gun. Are you sure it wasn't the other way around?-protoAuthor
::I also agree that the gun isn't based off the one in the pic for that weapon. Aside from it being an airsoft gun, it is a compact version of a 1911 when Big Boss's 1911 was a fullsize. Also, the slide serrations are slanted wheras the ones on big boss's weapon were vertical like those on the original 1911. Neither one has anything to do with the other, I think the image should be removed.

the 'source' for the statement 'Big Boss's gun is based off a custom airsoft' is http://crimsonsguns.tripod.com/gameguns.html

However, I view this with a huge degree of skepticism. For starters, as mentioned, the barrel/slide seems to be longer on Big Boss's gun. But even if it is based on an airsoft gun, the airsoft gun itself is based on a standard real-world 1911 with real world features. So it's just one step removed from raw, hands on research. But then again, I don't think most game companies actually buy real versions of the guns they are modeling, they just look around for photos of them. It's like saying 'the model for the gun in this game isn't based on a REAL M-16, it's based on pictures of an M-16'

That 'source' mentions that the gun was produced by Sheriff Co. Given that Sheriff is mentioned in the MGS3 credits it's actually quite likely that it was in fact modeled off an airsoft gun. However, the one in the picture is obviously not the one in the game.--[[User:Lynx|Lynx]] 19:44, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

I know that Western Arms did an airsoft version of the MGS3 custom 1911 after the game was released. I wasn't aware of an airsoft gun like that existing before MGS3 was released. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 07:30, 2 July 2011 (CDT)

== DSR-1 ==

It can also be found in South America when following Naomi's trail, just follow the wrong footsteps from the point where you can also find hand trails. You will hear Naomi crying for help (from a radio) and a sniper will wait for you to come. She has the DSR-1 with her.

== In game pistures ==

Someone needs to post ingame pictures of the guns.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:22, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

this shot gun (http://www.gunsamerica.com/926290644/Guns/Shotguns/Ithaca-Shotguns/SxS/Ithaca_NID_New_Ithaca_Field_Grade.htm) looks alot like the "twin barrel" in the game.--[[Special:Contributions/184.35.22.22|184.35.22.22]] 22:34, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

== Mark 23 Mod 1? ==
''According to the Metal Gear Wiki, the gun they used as a reference in MGS4 is actually an experimental "Phase 2" model that is currently undergoing testing by the US Navy.''

No, actually it says that ''the SOCOM presented in MGS1, MGS2 and MGS4 is in fact the Phase II model handgun submitted for trials in the USSOCOM Offensive Handgun Weapon System (OHWS) competition around the later part of 1991, and not the actual production model of the Mk.23 Mod 0''. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 23:37, 5 May 2010 (UTC)

::I wrote that -- the differences were the LAM, front serrations on the slide, markings, and the hammer looked different too. By the time the Mk23 was received in May '96, these details bad been changed; both for the military and civilian versions of the pistol. Overall, they're mostly aesthetic changes. -- Orca*

==Screenshots needed==

This page needs someone with enough effort to add pictures for all of these guns. -GM

:I can't do screencaps, but I did add some details about some of the weapons such as where they can be found and such. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 12:06, 26 May 2009 (UTC) Spartan198

:I would agree that a game with this many weapons would be much better with more relevant screencaps, especially ones without watermarks. More relevant information about the guns themselves would also be welcome.

==Why the strange biases towards certain weapons and calibers in this game?==

It seems odd to me why the weapon/caliber selection is so odd in this game. Metal Gear Solid has been one of the best game series to prominently display the real names of every gun in the game, but I have to wonder if some of those companies Kojima got permission from paid him to underplay the abilities of other guns in this game.

For the calibers, it seems mighty odd that the Glock 18c is the only 9x19mm pistol in the entire game. Not even the rebels or militia use older 9x19mm pistols, which is very odd because you'd think that of the vast majority of older pistols that escaped the worldwide mandatory ID lock systems that is mentioned in the game's backstory would be 9x19mm pistols. Not even something like a Beretta M9 is used by the PMC troopers, even though it would be a nice free choice to have in Metal Gear Online.

The game also strangely features 7.62x51mm Battle Rifles where they aren't the most appropriate, such as how the PMCs use the FN SCAR-H even in the confines of urban ruins (as in Act 1) or an intact city (as in Act 3). Only the South American countryside in Act 2 would be an appropriate location for those Battle Rifles in the hands of general troopers. You'd think that Kojima with his weaponry knowledge would give them assault rifles/PDWs/shotguns instead while in urban operations, but that's somehow not the case.

Did H&K and FN pay Kojima to include (and in turn, advertise) their products a great deal in this highly-anticipated and wildly popular game? FN has the Five-SeveN, the P90, the SCAR-H, and the FAL all in the game, while H&K has the SOCOM pistol, the MP5SD2, the XM8, the G3A3, and the HK21E. Colt products and their users by contrast don't get that kind of exposure--Colt M4s are rare, and Colt M16s are completely non-existent in this game. I also think it's telling that the FN P90 has its 50 round magazine, a combat sight, a flashlight and a suppressor, but its competitor, the H&K MP7 has only a red dot sight and is stuck with its 20 round magazine (not its upgraded 40 round magazine) according to this game just can't compete.

Contrary to what some posters on this wiki have said elsewhere, I don't believe this game is biased towards the latest and greatest weapons in general, as several weapons here such as the Vz. 83, the FN FAL carbine, the G3A3, the MAC-10, the Mosin Nagant, the PKM, the RPG-7 and the SVD Dragonuv are quite old.

Kojima definitely spent some time doing weapons research for this game, but did he ever come out with a reason as to why the game chose such odd additions to its arsenal? His personal favourite gun is the Barret M82, something not suited for general combat, so maybe he himself doesn't know as much as the ingame info might imply. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 00:50, 13 May 2010 (UTC)

I think the same arguments could be said about any of the Tom Clancy games like Rainbow Six Vegas and it's whoring worth of H&K weaponry [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

It would seem to me that if HK and FN paid Kojima off to showcase (or "whore out", whichever you reading this prefers) their tech, weapons like the XM8 and SCAR-H wouldn't be seemingly outclassed by the M4. You can kit the M4 out with anything and everything, while the SCAR-H lacks a suppressor and grenade launcher (severely hindering its flexibility) and the only thing the XM8 gets is the grenade launcher. Heck, the M4 is pretty much a CQB, grenadier, and designated marksman carbine all in one package (and I typically use it as such, often foregoing the actual ''sniper rifles'' in the game in long range combat for the M4 equipped with an ACOG). If HK or FN had paid him off, it would seem logical for the M4 to be totally outclassed in-game by both the XM8 and SCAR-H. Not only those points, but the M4 and the 1911s (I say 1911s collectively because cutscenes seem to automatically replace every non-1911 pistol in your inventory with the Operator) are implied to be Snake's signature weapons this time around. If he were paid off, why aren't the Mark 23 and XM8 or Five-Seven and SCAR-H his signature weapons? Also where's the PSG1, the so-called "greatest sniper rifle in the world" (or so HK says)? And I also feel the urge to point out that the HK21E has '''0''' modifications for it as well as a ridiculously slow ROF, which makes the M60E4 ''clearly'' superior to it. Now, I'm not exactly ''defending'' either company here, but it just seems to me that if they had paid Kojima off, the biases pointed out here would be far more extreme. As it stands, I just think Kojima wanted the weapons he likes the most to be the ones players used the most. Regarding the "old" weapons in the game, they may have seen a few years, yes, but FALs, G3s, Dragunovs, PKs, and above all the RPG-7 are so ubiquitous today that we'll be seeing them on modern battlefields, ''especially'' ones in the Middle East, for decades to come. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:11, 13 May 2010 (UTC)

:Actually, now that I've spent some time thinking about it, the M4 and M1911 in MGS4 may not actually be Colt products at all. After all, didn't a court decision in real life rule that an M4 is a type of firearm and not a Colt trademark at all? It's kind of like how an "M1911-style pistol" is also a type of pistol, not a Colt trademark which is why there are dozens if not hundreds of kinds of "M1911-style pistols" for sale on the general market today. I wonder if Kojima asked Colt to use their trademarks and got rebuffed for whatever reason, which might have caused him to withdraw the M4s from the PMCs and substitute FN SCAR-Hs until someone told him he could just call it an M4 (though not a Colt M4) and avoid copyright infringement.

:On the issue of customizability, I think the M4's customizability compared to, for instance, the XM8 and FN SCAR-H is a bit of laziness on the part of Kojima. I don't think there's any reason why they couldn't just stick the M14 EBR's suppressor model on the end of the FN SCAR-H or G3A3 and turn those two into suppressed firearms, for instance. They could have also stuck the M4's suppressor model onto the AK-101 or XM8 as well (in my opinion the XM8's integral red dot sight in MGS4 is easier to use than the M4's, being a great deal less claustrophobic than the M4's version). Something like the FN EGLM would have been nice on the SCAR-H (or the SCAR-L had they bothered to give the PMCs assault rifles in urban areas) but unlike the M320 or GP-30, would only have gone on one weapon (unless the SCAR-L was included) and possibly not have been good on the cost-benefit analysis. But my point, that the customizability of many of the weapon systems (where are the PSO-1 scopes for the AN-94 and AK-102, for instance?) is more an artifact of the design decision than the reality of the weapons in question. Of course, even with the full "real-life" customizability, the M4 would still be the only one capable of carrying an underslung shotgun, which I think is unique enough (though I bet the XM8 could have gotten one had it been adopted, and I'm sure one will be designed for the FN SCAR models if it proves itself in the field enough).

:Oh, and one of the reasons why you can snipe with the M4 is because the game over-emphasizes headshots and doesn't implement ballistic physics for bullets. If it did, bullet drop would come into play (especially since the M4's short barrel means that less velocity and energy is imparted to the bullet, resulting in less effective range), moreso with the M4 than the FN SCAR-H or M14 EBR for instance. I think the game would have been more fun if helmets were stronger (for instance, 5 helmet hits from most pistol weapons to kill, 3 helmet hits from 5.56mm weapons to kill someone, or 2 7.62x51mm/PDW ammunition hits, or 1 9x39mm/shotgun slug hit), forcing the player to aim for the exposed face or neck to guarantee a one-hit headshot kill).

:I only mentioned those weapons as "old" so as to defuse claims that Kojima was only focussed on the "latest and greatest."

:It would have been nice if a PSG-1 and FAMAS (both weapons used in MGS1) showed up in the game for old time's sake, but that was not to be. Still, that doesn't resolve the question of why HK's PDW (the MP7A1) is so inferior to FN's PDW (the P90) in this game. Even the wikipedia image of the MP7A1 shows it with a suppressor and 40 round magazine, along with custom optics. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 18:25, 17 May 2010 (UTC)

::Play on a higher difficulty level. The strength of the PMC's helmets varies. On the easiest level, a single 9mm round will punch through. On the highest level, it takes a couple of rounds of 7.62 NATO to punch through. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:50, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

One imagines a general switch from assault rifles back to battle rifles would occur in a world where you might reasonably expect to encounter extremely tough infantry armour or power suits; given the nature of the PMCs as private entities, being "equipped for anything" is probably a selling point. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 04:23, 29 May 2011 (CDT)

:Sure, but if you're really "equipped for anything" you'd issue what's needed for the environment. And the PMCs in Act 2 (South America) still use the SCAR-H CQC even though in open countryside that barrel length is more of a liability than anything else. Even the Leftist insurgents are using full-size G3A3s in that stage. In a battle rifle, the shorter the barrel, the more of the cartridge's energy goes to waste as useless muzzle flash and sound. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 00:09, 30 May 2011 (CDT)

::To be fair, Pieuvre Armement also have more support weapons than any of the other PMCs (snipers, HMGs, grenade launchers, and a lot of mounted guns) and it looks like they were primarily hired to defend key government structures rather than fight it out in the open. Perhaps with the SCARs they just got a bulk discount, or given it's a private entity it could just be one of the directors like the look of the weapon / someone was impressed by the salesman's spiel / someone was sleeping with someone else / whatever. Out of game, it makes some sense; it means you only need one set of gestures coded for NPC / rifle no matter what level they're in. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:19, 30 May 2011 (CDT)

:If Kojima's aim was to make the FN SCAR-H a "this is one of the signature enemy NPC guns" type of thing, then that does make some sense, but that doesn't even cover how many Pieuvre Armement troopers can be found patrolling in the open, sometimes ambushed by Leftist insurgents, or the lack of customizability options for the FN SCAR-H.

:Furthermore, if Kojima and his team could afford the time and money to put the KAC Masterkey on the M4A1 Carbine (an accessory that can be mounted on no other weapon in this game) you could just as easily do the same kind of work and stick an FN EGLM grenade launcher to the SCAR-H (it uses the same swing-out cylinder as does the M320 grenade launcher, so the animations would be largely the same), to say nothing of a suppressor or the LSS underslung shotgun for the XM8. And why not rip off the Mk. 14 Mod 0's suppressor to use on the SCAR-H, G3A3 or the FAL carbine? Before you tell me "they don't have barrel threading," neither does Snake's Operator pistol, his very first suppressed lethal weapon. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 15:31, 30 May 2011 (CDT)
::Uh dude, Snake's Operator does have a threaded barrel, did you even look at the pics... - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 15:41, 30 May 2011 (CDT)

:I stand corrected, the thumbnail made the threading blend together into a featureless grey. Regardless, my other points stand. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 15:55, 30 May 2011 (CDT)

I think the idea was to make players want to use the M4 over other weapons (I guess to emphasise it), so the SCAR couldn't be as good as it. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:07, 31 May 2011 (CDT)

Noteworthy is the fact that the Masterkey in reality doesn't come in a rail-mounted version like is shown in-game. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:44, 27 June 2011 (CDT)

== Mk. 23 Mod 0 ==
I just have to ask this; why does Snake like using the H&K Mk. 23? I mean, from everything I've heard/read about them, the USP compact tactical variant is much better, so why doesn't Snake use that?--[[User:Zblayde|Zblayde]] 16:00, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

He uses it because the designers wanted him to use it. And if you've ever shot a Mk23 you'd know that it is vastly superior to the entire USP series in every possible way other than weight and weight shouldnt be an issue you're looking for a combat handgun.
-Double Agent M

:Um, yes, weight ''is'' an issue in a combat handgun. Weight is ''always'' an issue when it comes to the weapons and gear used by soldiers. That's why the Mark 23 ''failed'' as a combat handgun and lavished on supply shelves instead of inside holsters like the various 1911 makes and even the entire USP series. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 08:55, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

I've been meaning to ask this for a while now on the HK Mk. 23's page, but since this was brought up, I might as well ask it here: why ''was'' the Mk. 23 made so big and bulky in the first place, if its performance could have been replicated in the smaller USP series? It's close in size to the Desert Eagle despite firing a smaller (and more combat-practical) cartridge. Was it to ensure ruggedness, resistance to salt water damage, and reliability? Or something else? It's always puzzled me about this pistol that is one of the signature weapons of the Metal Gear Solid series (making appearances in 1, 2, and 4). Of course, it could be that Kojima just thinks it's a "cool gun" . . . --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 20:59, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

Its weight helps counteract recoil, the elongated barrel improves accuracy, and right out of the box it can be fitted with a suppressor and a LEM. It's bulky enough so that if you need to you can beat a man to death with it. It's a fantastic combat handgun but where it loses out to Berettas and Colts is in complexity. Because of it's raw size you cant just whip it around and the controls can take some getting used to. It's not intended to be a back-up weapon, it's designed to supplement and compliment a shooter's primary firearm.
-Double Agent M

:Supposedly the USP Compact Tactical can mount a suppressor and Laser Aiming Module, but only has 8 rounds in .45 ACP. Also, as a "Offensive Handgun Weapons System," the SOCOM pistol supposed to be usable as a primary weapon when killing is supposed to be done discreetly, such as many situations in the Metal Gear Solid series. On paper I can see why it's better, but if the hands-on experience of operators deems it as "uncomfortable to carry and use," then their complaints trump the on-paper benefits.

:Of course, "uncomfortable" and "hard to use" is a bit of a relative term, since training and practice can certainly acclimatise someone to almost any well-designed weapons system, but that takes time, money, and perseverance. Given that handguns are hardly a primary weapon system anymore, and the majority those who do professionally use them as such (such as average beat cops) don't train with them to be expert shooters most of the time, I suppose ease of use is a major factor because it's the easier way out instead of spending time to get used to a better-on-paper but less-user-friendly weapon. If "better-on-paper" mattered more, wouldn't the FBI be using Glock 20 pistols instead of Glock 22 pistols? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 16:48, 11 July 2010 (UTC)
:::I agree with you. :) But I'd still love to get a hold of one and try it for myself. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 13:23, 16 April 2011 (CDT)

:: "It's not intended to be a back-up weapon, it's designed to supplement and compliment a shooter's primary firearm." <-I love this kind of thing. Sure, a pistol that's a foot and an half long with a suppressor and weighs as much as an empty MP5 is a much better compliment to your primary weapon than it's weight in extra magazines ''for'' that primary weapon. Think you needed to lay off the HK propaganda there, "Agent M." To actually answer the question, they used the Mk23 because it's huge and blocky (same reason Meryl got that 50 AE Deagle), so it's easy for the player to see it in Snake's hands and for the PS1 to render it. Simple as that. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 06:42, 16 April 2011 (CDT)

:::I've heard from a lot people who actually own MK 23s and they say that their excellent weapons (and no, it was not "HK propaganda"). - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 13:23, 16 April 2011 (CDT)

::::From what I've heard, they're excellent weapons in terms of accuracy (which comes from being gigantic and heavy) but not something you'd want to take into combat; they're too big for a backup weapon and not capable enough as a primary weapon. Also, anyone who drops the cost of a Mk23 on a pistol is going to have thought it was an excellent weapon ''before'' they bought it, otherwise they never would have done so in the first place. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 14:56, 24 May 2011 (CDT)
:::::I would buy one, but hey, a four pound .44 Magnum revolver feels like nothing in my hands, and I'm only a medium-sized guy with not much of a build. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:43, 24 May 2011 (CDT)

:::::Not sure if anyone has noticed this, but is it me, or the MK 23 is listed in the menu as actually much lighter than it is IRL? Maybe that's why it is so popular in the MG universe... --[[User:Researcher|Researcher]] 20:18, 12 March 2012 (CDT)

::::::I always thought the reasoning behind the design and adoption of the Mark 23 initially, was because the weapon could handle ridiculously hot ammunition loads without exploding, something special forces occasionally use, which would normally destroy any "lighter" handgun. Out of the box, the Mk23 alongside the USP line, was one of the few handguns capable of firing .45 Super (not 100% on this) and the reliability of the weapon was insane for the time of its introduction as it could and still can take immense abuse. [[User:Draco122|Draco122]] ([[User talk:Draco122|talk]]) 06:41, 16 March 2013 (EDT)

The MK23 is too heavy to be considered a practical firearm, too big to be quickly drawn from the holster if needed, sure the added weight can help reduce recoil, and the good magazine capacity is a plus, but that's really all that it has going for it, it was developed for the Navy SEALS SOCOM unit, and they don't even like it, preferring the smaller and more user friendly SIG SAUER P226, so if an actual military unit thinks the pistol is crap, then quite honestly, it's crap.[[User:Kornflakes89|Kornflakes89]] 19:10, 9 May 2012 (CDT)
:It's not that much heavier than a 1911. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 11:48, 16 March 2013 (EDT)
::Yeah, but it's supposed to be issued as a "system" with the suppressor and LAM. With those it's over a foot long and weighs as much as two and a half loaded Glocks (or almost as much as an empty AS Val). [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 08:01, 17 March 2013 (EDT)

== Meryl's Desert Eagle ==

Just how "combat-effective" would the ballistics of Meryl's long-barrelled Desert Eagle be? What might the effective range be, and would it regularly penetrate the body armour of the FROG troopers she faces? Or would she be better off with an 40-round MP7A1 (to go with the theme of "biggest to smallest" weapons of the Rat Patrol) when fighting the FROG troopers in Advent Palace and Outer Haven? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 15:51, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

*I've got an Airsoft Desert Eagle (bought many years ago, mind) that came with both barrels, and it's weighted to the point you can see what a bad idea it is: it's ridiculously front-heavy with that barrel extension, and I imagine with a scope as well it'd probably weigh as much as the MP7 anyway. So maybe it could penetrate body armour and maybe it couldn't, but you'd still have better ergo from using a 1911 duct-taped to the head of a banjo. [[User:Vangelis|Vangelis]] 09:21, 6 March 2011 (MSK)

:Okay, so that Airsoft model exactly duplicates the loaded weight of Meryl's long-barrelled Desert Eagle? That's rather interesting. Even if it couldn't penetrate the body armour the FROGs seem to be wearing, would the impact force be enough to inflict blunt trauma on the FROGs, such as broken ribs, concussions, or the like? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:15, 6 March 2011 (MSK)

Well back when I did Airsoft, I played for functionality and being simple. Sure my team and I decked out our guns, but nothing more than red dot sights, and vertical grips. Because it isn't real firearms, we tried to not equip like we would a real weapon because it's not the same thing. Lighter is always better. The less we have to carry, the better. That being said, I would never get an Airsoft Desert Eagle to shoot in games. For fun, yeah. It'll be cool to run around the woods with the 10in barrel and a scope mounted on it, but you wouldn't get any good range with an airsoft pistol anyway, even if it is gas powered. Now a REAL Desert Eagle, I'd get for fun, but that's only after I get my more practical guns first.

Anyway, I think from a character standpoint, Meryl's character is supposed to be a "tough chick" so what's the iconic tough guy gun? A Desert Eagle from the action movies. I don't know if the .50 AE could go through body armor [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 10:42, 6 March 2011 (MSK)

:Yeah, I just use it for plinking spiders because I have a high ceiling. Bought it because I was a teenager and it was a Desert Eagle, I will make no excuses on that front. [[User:Vangelis|Vangelis]] 10:48, 6 March 2011 (MSK)

::lol, I also bought a Airsoft Desert Eagle when I was a teenager and I still have it. :D - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:50, 24 May 2011 (CDT)

:::Well, living here in Comrade Elizabeth's Glorious People's Republic of Englandstan makes it easy to hang on to it since if I'm reading this correctly I couldn't legally sell it anyway. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 07:13, 25 May 2011 (CDT)

::::lol. :) - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 07:49, 25 May 2011 (CDT)

:Well I admit before I knew anything about the M16, I was very anti-gun kid in early high school. Then when I got to know guns, I thought the M16 is this Vietnam piece of crap that jams all the time and the AK is the ultimate assault rifle until I grew up and got a more objective view of guns. When buying my first Airsoft, I bought a P90 cause I was a fan of Stargate...then I discovered a P90 Airsoft is useless, inaccurate and has terrible range. So I went and bought an M733, and then realize that you need a longer barrel for range and accuracy and that evolved to my M4 type rifle. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 10:59, 6 March 2011 (MSK)

One more thing; does the reloading style Meryl uses in the fight inside Outer Haven's computer room have a name (where she jams one of her magazines into the crook of her knee while firing with her other hand, before reloading an empty Desert Eagle with the magazine held in her knee)? I see so many adds for shooting schools with patented styles around I have to wonder if this comes from one of them. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:11, 21 June 2011 (CDT)

== Tanegashima rifle ==

Why isn't it on the page?

:Thanks to Evil Tim's hard work, it is now on the page. However, there's something that remains to be investigated; I've heard conflicting reports about whether or not the Tanegashima arquebus will always fire its "divine wind" (translated version of the Japanese word "Kamikaze") tornado if you fire it in the opposite direction of the wind in a singleplayer level. That could be something worth looking into. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 07:15, 2 June 2011 (CDT)
::I'll check up on that; I'd just heard it was a one-third chance per shot. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 07:51, 2 June 2011 (CDT)
::Nope, nothing to do with the wind direction, I tried with and against the wind, and in the end it just went off at random like usual. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 06:17, 3 June 2011 (CDT)
:I see it was just a rumour then. Still, I'm puzzled as to why you didn't take a screenshot highlighting the extreme silliness of the weapon; it would have been worth a chuckle to see a screenshot of PMCs caught in the tornado flying in a spiral while dropping far more items than they could ever carry in real life while collecting their "frequent flier miles."--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 12:57, 4 June 2011 (CDT)
::Well, I accidentally selected Solid Normal rather than Big Wuss Easy, and it's hard enough getting the Tanegashima to do its thing normally, nevermind trying to check how it's affected by the direction of the wind while being shot at. I'm doing enough stupid things to burn through rations as it is :D [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:58, 6 June 2011 (CDT)
:I see; I guess not all of us have the time to learn how not to get shot up less in this game (here's a tip; going prone or crawling is the best way to use your Octocamo). Would have been nice to see PMCs flying in a big spiral anyhow on this wiki. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:43, 6 June 2011 (CDT)
::Well sure, I can be pretty sneaky when I'm not doing stupid things like seeing if I can get a Gekko to throw a grenade at me. Same as I'm trying to avoid wearing the Octocamo hood even though it's good for your camo index, because it also makes Snake look really stoopid. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 00:42, 28 June 2011 (CDT)

== Someone needs to finish this page ==

This page is how old and no one has finished it? Someone needs to start doing it.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:17, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

Well I don't have this game and it's a chore to get all the screenshots second hand [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 02:54, 26 January 2011 (UTC)

I've got a much better capture device than I used to, so I could probably do this at some stage; the main problem is I'd have to record it first (since the software with the Dazzle crashes every time I take a screenshot and BSODs the entire computer if I try to take more than one); I'll have a crack at it next time I'm off work. Don't want to just stand in a corner looking at the same thing for every gun, that makes for dull page. [[User:Vangelis|Vangelis]] 09:34, 2 March 2011 (UTC)

:Please do. Stealth camo would be useful to take screenshots of weapons in the hands of NPCs (such as the MP7 or the like). --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 00:48, 3 March 2011 (UTC)

::Still on this. It's going to take a while before I have time (especially since I'll need to record some of those billion hours of cutscenes), but I haven't forgotten. I'll probably get Twin Snakes and cap the whole series, since doing PS1 MGS1 without first-person aim mode for caps would be a bit pointless. "Look, Snake has a FAMAS! Down there in his hands...oh just click on the damn image and press your nose right up to the screen." Only thing I really need from that is a comparison shot of the Abrams, since the original game's one had two M2 Brownings instead of one. Also I've got an MGS2 trailer somewhere showing Snake with a FAMAS, so I'll have to add that to the 2 page. I'm hoping I can find a picture of the wooden prop version of Fortune's railgun that they built for motion capture. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 04:31, 16 April 2011 (CDT)

:Good to know. I'm looking forward to a full version of this page. I would have finished the MGS2 page myself, except that the PC version I have (the official KONAMI port) is somewhat poorly optimized, with some textures missing or improperly rendered (and what do you mean, KONAMI, that we can't use the mouse to aim in FPV or duplicate the pressure sensitive button functions from a PS2 controller with a keyboard?!). Also, the FAMAS in MGS2 is only usable on the demo version of MGS2 (though it does show up in some cutscenes in the Plant chapter for some strange reason). Did they reuse the MGS2 Demo FAMAS for the Twin Snakes? Perhaps you can find out. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 04:54, 16 April 2011 (CDT)

::Yeah, that'd be worth checking. I heard GIAT (it was still GIAT back then) got very precious about their intellectual property after they realised people wanted to put the FAMAS in games (they're the same about model companies and the LeClerc, Tamiya had to stick their logo and "officially endorsed" on the box of their LeClerc kit) and I think that's why Konami pulled the FAMAS from 2 and never had it turn up again even in 4. Probably they couldn't say no to using it in a remake since they'd already said yes the first time. I've still got the demo of 2 (only reason anyone bought ''Zone of the Enders'', after all) and the FAMAS isn't in that either; it goes from the start of Tanker to the end of the boss fight with Olga, and only gives you the M9 and USP. It was only ever in the early trailers showing Snake on the Tanker. I heard there's some other changes like the guys in the Warhead Storage room using ring airfoil rounds rather than just instakilling you with a radiation leak if you were spotted. Also, you didn't miss anything with the pressure sensitive buttons, trying to half-hold the fire button to aim a rifle in first person was terrible. Apparently the "Tanegashima" is a Japanese copy of a Portugese arquebus design (sayeth Wikipedia, anyway), so I'll have to add that to the page too. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 05:19, 16 April 2011 (CDT)

:Well, copyright is a sticky situation (go look at one of my earlier comments here and notice how there are no Colt products in this game, despite the presence of an M4A1 Carbine and an M1911). Ubisoft got around it because the FAMAS appears in Rainbow Six Vegas 2 by its real name, so why not MGS4? And I was wrong; the FAMAS is coded within the MGS2 demo, but it is only accessible [http://youtu.be/MxfMCXcpGx8 via a code]. And actually there are a few uses for the pressure-sensitive buttons in MGS2--without them you bang your head against a locker ventilation grille when trying to look out, alerting any nearby enemies. You also can't aim an assault rifle without the pressure-sensitive controls, which made controlling them on the PC next to impossible. Another problem is you can't lower a pistol without firing it if you don't let go of the aiming button gently (I got around this on the PC version by unequipping my weapon). Finally, the distance you throw grenades is determined by how hard you press the pressure-sensitive button (but they were almost useless anyway since throwing a frag or flashbang grenade automatically causes an alert upon detonation and frags have a small damage radius). All this made for a frustratingly bad PC port, which is why I caved in and got the PS2 version afterwards. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 15:20, 16 April 2011 (CDT)

Well, made a start before realising I'm going to have to crop the borders off every image by hand. :( Ah well, they're just placeholders anyway just so we can get rid of the IGN watermarks and have actual game images. For now they can keep the borders and I'll replace them all when I do this page properly. I hope you appreciate my sacrifice, I had to uninstall Vanquish to get these. Stupid 40 gig PS3. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 12:35, 24 May 2011 (CDT)

Good work so far Tim. :) - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 16:40, 24 May 2011 (CDT)

*Ok, I'll put up the explosives later today (since we don't have them at all). I'm fairly sure the railgun qualifies as reasonably believable; it was actually built as a physical object (a wooden MoCap prop) and looks like an XM25 that's eaten its Wheaties. And then everyone else's Wheaties. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 23:29, 24 May 2011 (CDT)

Anyone remember where the PMCs with standalone Masterkeys show up? I think it's somewhere in Act 2, but I can't remember if you have to cause an alert or if they're just ahead of where I stopped recording (partway through Confinement Facility). Also, don't worry, the shots aren't all going to be from Act 2. Also added a spoiler warning since, well, I can hardly ''not'' have a shot of A Certain Person holding the Patriot, and the fourth Act being on Shadow Moses is kind of a spoiler too. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 04:07, 29 May 2011 (CDT)

:There's definitely at least one in the Confinement Facility, check out about 10:50 of this video [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mg87rbI3CXU#t=10m50s], there's a guard with one who shows up with one at the right edge of the screen (pretty sure he always respawns there with a Masterkey). --[[User:Lynx|Lynx]] 15:27, 29 May 2011 (CDT)

::Naw, that's an XM320, he's one of the pair I've got a shot of in that section. You can hear a "phut" rather than a shotgun blast when he fires. But I know there's people with standalone Masterkeys somewhere, because I remember being puzzled at why on earth you would create such a thing. (edit) Ah, MG Wiki says there's one at the gate of Vista Mansion. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:05, 30 May 2011 (CDT)

:Also, considering all the shit that fits inside Metal Gear Mk. 2 (50 Stingers, 50 Javelins, 50 LAWs, a Barrett, a railgun the size of a pony, etc) why does it never occur to Snake to hide inside it himself? I know they kind of joked about it with Snake being able to pocket a drum can that's bigger than he is, but still. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 10:36, 29 May 2011 (CDT)

It's called a "Hyperspace Arsenal." I would be all for a realistic mode that forced you to carry guns that are too big right from the beginning of a mission rather than have them delivered by the mini-Metal Gear, or have you collect them after a period of time after "requesting" them at a cache location dropped off by Drebin, or else only be able to transfer/launder/buy ammo just after meeting Drebin in cutscenes. Still, that wouldn't address the other realism issues this game has, such as how the NPCs are indestructible--shouldn't shooting them with .50 BMG weapons or high explosives blow off limbs or reduce them to ludicrous gibs? And what about the octocamo system; wouldn't the human eye only be realistically fooled if Snake was hiding in foliage or else, quite some distance away, lest the enemies spot his outline and start shooting at Snake?

In any case, do you think you could also include tidbits on which guns need to be laundered and which don't need to be? It'd be a nice tidbit, since the entry already includes which guns are available in multiplayer and which aren't. I'm very much looking forward to seeing more great screenshots of this game's guns--do you think it'd be possible for you to equip stealth camo and enter First Person view so we can see NPCs with holding their guns up close?--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 14:06, 29 May 2011 (CDT)

:I'm afraid I don't have stealth camo (I can never resist firing LAWs at Strykers :() but I tend to prefer wider shots with things actually going on in them; just focusing right in on the gun makes the page rather dull to look through, IMO (I ''hate'' those CoD page images with everything cropped out but one corner of the screen; just imagine if you took the shot of Dirty Harry holding his revolver in the "do you feel lucky?" scene and cut out everything but the revolver). Also, I'm fairly sure the player and world models for weapons are exactly the same in this game. Still, it's not that hard to get close when you're recording video rather than taking individual screenshots, and it's even easier to get close to the totally broken Raven Sword AI in Act 3. Plus you can get great views of almost all the PMC weapons in cutscenes anyway. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 01:53, 30 May 2011 (CDT)

I didn't mean cropping the images so that only the guns are visible; I was just saying that with Stealth camo you could get within punching (or kissing) distance of the various NPCs in the game so you could get good pics of them holding their weapons without the annoying black-screen parts from scopes or the HUD marks in the centre of the screen if you use Snake's binocular's or the mini-Metal Gear's camera view. Also, could you please please please make a screenshot of the FROG firing her DSR-1 at Big Mama followed by the latter's "I'm fine" despite not wearing any body armour? I find it one of the more unintentionally hilarious parts of the game. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 16:15, 30 May 2011 (CDT)

:I'll be sure to get that, yes. Though for me the funniest sequence was the part before the "guns of the Patriots" part, where the US Army were pointing guns at Liquid Ocelot's boat and making clicking noises for so long it became ridiculous. Of course the Foxdie scene was funnier, but probably intentional (Snake and Liquid do the "Fox..." "...Die" bit, Liquid Ocelot jumps up and runs away cackling ridiculously and Snake responds by falling over). [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:05, 31 May 2011 (CDT)

Heh heh, it's funny how after the "Guns of the Patriots" scene, Drebin's prices fall flat on their faces with a permanent 50% discount until the end of the game. Of course, that raises the question about why Drebin's prices never go up; wouldn't the complete lock-out of ID-locked firearms mean that the services of gun launderers like Drebin would be more in demand than ever (resulting in a huge price increase), even if just to keep the Rebels who use naked guns from killing all the ID-locked gun users? It's just another entry in the long list of this game's realism problems. And of course, the first FOXDIE scene is another manifestation of how wrong it was to let Kojima direct the game, since he's so firmly stuck in MGS1's shadow the plot of MGS4 is so firmly stuck in the first game's mold. Of course, that's got nothing to do with the weaponry in the game, but I'm still looking forward to this page's completion nonetheless. By the way, have you seen Ocelot's "THINK AGAIN!" ability in Metal Gear Online yet?--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 21:47, 31 May 2011 (CDT)

:I must admit I've never played MGO. As for Kojima, I think he was at his best in MGS3 when he was making a tribute to something he loved (the old spy movies that had inspired the series in the first place, with their cool gadgets and ridiculous villians) and he's at his worst when he's trying to force out a game he seems to have regarded as his obligation; I remember that he didn't really want to be involved in 4 and only came back on board after the fans raised a stink about his being absent. He strikes me as a lot like Lucas, who was great when he was making a tribute to the old-fashioned sci-fi he grew up with and hideous when he was left making something he didn't really care for except as a way to make money. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 01:57, 1 June 2011 (CDT)

Funny that you mentioned George Lucas. I have to wonder whether or not Kojima took some inspiration from Lucas when he decided to make his newest, completely over-referenced MacGuffin: nanomachines that do almost everything, from track biological functions to serve as ID keys, even form the basis for mind control or emotional manipulation. Kind of reminded me of Lucas' "midi-chlorians," since the two of them are both blood-borne squiggly things. Oh well, the fans, like everyone else, don't always know how what they want isn't necessarily what they need. And even the greatest of us can succumb to "Creator's Conceit," whereupon one starts believing in the delusion that "because I made this best-selling piece of media, I can change it however I want, heedless of the needs of believability, plausibility, realism or even my own previous work." Ocelot's "THINK AGAIN" ability in Metal Gear Online can be seen in full force [http://youtu.be/XM7yc5Gf_OU here]. You should give Metal Gear Online a try if you have the money; its training mode is great for taking pictures of the unique characters and their weapons, and it is the only mode where you can use the ballistic shield, or hear the various multiplayer characters do their Rambo impressions while firing an M60E4. Once again, a hearty thank you for your hard work. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 07:26, 2 June 2011 (CDT)

:I think I'm immune to stupid depictions of nanomachines after playing the two ''Deus Ex'' games, expecially the second one where you apparently have a nanoforge in every weapon that makes the relevant ammo type out of a universal base material ''as you fire''. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 07:53, 2 June 2011 (CDT)

:Also, I'm trying to remember: I know there's no flashback of Vulcan Raven, but wasn't there one of Sniper Wolf that showed her PSG-1 at one point? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 08:59, 2 June 2011 (CDT)

::The various flashbacks in Act 4 can be found [http://youtu.be/81A3yb_FATg here] and [http://youtu.be/aznWCpBYkKQ here]. You can check those out at your leisure. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 12:50, 4 June 2011 (CDT)

:::The links you're posting don't work [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:59, 6 June 2011 (CDT)

::Pardon me, they're fixed now. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 21:13, 6 June 2011 (CDT)

Right, that's me out for today, getting sleepy. Got a lot more caps to get off this Act 1 video, though. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:13, 3 June 2011 (CDT)

:I think if you see Sniper Wolf's PSG-1 it's part of Crying Wolf's death scene or Naomi's (I seem to recall there's an X button prompt when Otacon is getting upset about that whole thing where everyone he displays the slightest affection for dies instantly), which that doesn't have. Regardless, been a little busy, but should have some new caps up soon. I'm trying to get everything with a Browning M2, so IIRC I still need the Stryker MGS from Act 2, the Humvee in Act 3 and the derelict M1 tank in the hanger in Act 4. I'll finally be able to take that "Incomplete" down once I get a shot of Rex, Ray or one of ''Missouri's'' Phalanxes. Also might see if I can ID those two giant cannons on Liquid's boat, at least in a caption. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:10, 7 June 2011 (CDT)

::I was right, you ''do'' have an X button flashback there. There's also a painting of Big Boss holding his old Mark 22 in Big Mama's church, because it makes sense for one of those to be there. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 21:12, 17 June 2011 (CDT)

Having never had a chance to really pay attention to the Vamp / Raiden fight until now, I must admit I laughed my ass off at the part where Raiden has both arms pinned to his back and so blocks Vamp's arm and then throws him using only his teeth. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 20:36, 27 June 2011 (CDT)

Ok, going to be redoing all these caps soon (seen [[Dark Sector]] for why, comparing the new shots with the ones of the Spectre and G36; I've now got an official Sony component cable, so the red after-image from my third-party cable on the [[Bodycount]] page is gone). Going to be kind of "fun" trying to get the same shots all over again, I'll probably be updating all the basic weapon images tomorrow or so and then starting on recording the levels. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 04:53, 24 September 2011 (CDT)

:The things we do for this wiki . . . well, I'm glad you're willing to get more screenshots over something that isn't very visible on the thumbnails. Are you talking about the red-tinged edges that can be seen on some of your screenshots on the Bodycount page? That's known as chromatic abberration, but I can't see much of it on the MGS4 screenshots myself. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 01:01, 25 September 2011 (CDT)

::Naw, the red was just why I was holding out for the Sony cable, that's why it isn't on the Dark Sector images (I now have it). The reason I'm going to replace these images is they're taken using a much lower-resolution capture device than the one I now have (a Pinnacle Dazzle rather than a Hauppage HD-PVR). You'll see the difference. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 01:45, 25 September 2011 (CDT)

OK, here's the difference:

[[Image:MGS4-1911Cus.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
[[Image:MGS4-M1911Cus-HQ.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
I'll resize the rest to 1280x720 or so rather than all of them being as big as that one, it's kinda unnecessary when they're only shown on the page at 600px anyway. The weird effect at full resolution is how the pause menu is actually supposed to look, to those not familiar with MGS4. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 05:50, 25 September 2011 (CDT)

:YES. Better resolution is ALWAYS welcome. Looking forward to seeing more MGS "gun porn" in HD, as well as seeing some other issues resolved (such as whether the M10 and M60E4 are closed-bolt firearms in this game or their original open-bolt versions, just how Old Snake holds the M10 in a two-handed fashion with no foregrip, suppressor, or strap to put his offhand on, etc.). --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 07:01, 25 September 2011 (CDT)

::If Snake is holding the MAC-10 in a two-handed grip without the aid of an foregrip, suppressor, or strap, he would hold it in a Weaver-stance or a CAR-stance. I saw a screen shot of him using the MAC-10 and he held it in a Weaver-stance like a handgun while utilizing the stock, which makes good practical sense. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 18:28, 25 September 2011 (CDT)

:I see. Regardless, I'm surprised that Kojima didn't slap on a "modernizing conversion" for the MAC-10 in this game, such as made available by [http://www.max-11.com/ Lage Mfg], which in short makes the gun much easier to handle by increasing the length of the barrel and handguard to add space for rails (and their accessories), a foregrip and folding buttstock, along with a mechanism that reduces the rate of fire to 600 RPM from 1100 RPM. This sort of conversion kit would essentially turn the MAC-10 into a close competitor for the HK UMP, except that this "MAX-10" version would be easier to instinctively reload since the magazine goes in the pistol grip. Too bad that the only .45 SMG in this game just isn't that good; whatever else can be said about the MAC-10, ergonomics were clearly not emphasized in its original design. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 10:45, 2 October 2011 (CDT)

::From what I know, the MAC-10 has inferior reliability compared to the UZI and pretty much any other SMG design. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 15:07, 2 October 2011 (CDT)

Just a couple of new images tonight, going to do the rest of this video tomorrow. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 14:44, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

Oh, and here's Otacon explaining why the AK jammed:

[[Image:MGS4-Otaconsez.jpg|thumb|none|600px|"Also, there was apparently more than one cartridge in the chamber. That might have been a problem too."]]

[[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 14:48, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

:I think that's pretty cool he explains what possibly happened to the weapon, you don't get that in very many games. But it still doesn't explains ''how'' this happened to an AK, I could expect that from an AR, but an AK? Like I said on the page, Snake must have REALLY bad luck. :) - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 15:25, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

::Well, he's not the only one, I noticed at least one of the rebels struggling with the charging handle of his AK during the same sequence. It must just be ''really'' bad ammo. Maybe it's special ''Far Cry 2'' ammo made from blasting caps and dynamite. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 15:36, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

:::I think you just solved it mate. ;) - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 16:20, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

Had a few problems with my footage being blurry (not in the shots I actually uploaded, mind) which I think is my old PC. A suitably beefy PC should be winging it's way to me in the next couple of weeks. :D [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 10:45, 4 October 2011 (CDT)

:I've already had my new beefed-up PC a couple of weeks. :D Now I'm counting down the days for BF3. >:B - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 18:09, 4 October 2011 (CDT)

::Then let us do as men have done for centuries and compare the lengths of our, um, computers. Mine's going to be an i7 2600K overclocked to 4.6 GHz, SLI 2 x 1,536 meg GeForce cards, 16 gigs RAM, 120 gig SSD + 3 terabyte data drive. I imagine it'll just be able to scare Crysis into running. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 23:05, 4 October 2011 (CDT)

== Screenshot requests ==

I know Evil Tim's busy, but this might be a good opportunity to let him know what screenshots might be appropriate to showcase each weapon.
*Five-seveN pistol: Old Snake commits "sexual assault" at gunpoint by holding up a FROG trooper with her own pistol while patting her down for items, along with the "crotch grab" move.
*MAC-10/G18C: Old Snake tries out for a movie of "Bonnie and Clyde" while performing a drive-by shooting from Big Mama's motorcycle.
*M4 Custom: For some reason, Old Snake has taken up the habit of shooting this carbine while holding it sideways.
*Shansi Type 17: Big Mama gets her awesome on by shooting up some Dwarf Gekko drones with her Type 17 pistol.
*MP7A1: Isn't there a PMC in Act 2 carrying this weapon who is distracted by a Playboy Magazine?
Sometimes funny screenshots make entries on this wiki all the more entertaining to read. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 13:09, 4 June 2011 (CDT)

*Might try that
*Almost certainly going to do something like that
*When does he hold it sideways, again?
*Yes
*Yes

Also, totally going to show how you can kill a Gekko with the SVD. Just a note: you don't have to call him Old Snake in every caption. The game only calls him that occasionally and he's "Snake" the rest of the time, and it's not like this is MGS1 and there's two people potentially called "Snake" (even in that case, they always call him Snake and his brother Liquid, so there's only minimal potential for confusion). I could see there being some issues with what to call Big Boss in 3, but this guy is still Snake. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 04:06, 6 June 2011 (CDT)

:I call him "Old Snake" because that's the name above his lifebar, and because that name clearly refers to him in the MGS4 time period. Of course, if you really want to be pedantic, it could be argued that Liquid Snake and Solid Snake should have called each other Liquid and Solid instead of Liquid and Snake (I think the latter combination was chosen because it sounds less silly). If you prefer to just call him Snake in the article, feel free to change that part pack. And Old Snake holds his M4A1 carbine sideways once when engaging the Pieuvre Armement PMCs who are taking Naomi away after headshotting Vamp. Another US Marine aboard the Missouri holds his M4A1 Carbine while trembling with fear as the Dwarf Gekkos execute a boarding action right outside the Missouri's bridge. That's all I can remember right now. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:37, 6 June 2011 (CDT)

Oh, and if you want to show the Vulcan Cannons on the Missouri battleship, shouldn't you include the dramatic close-up shot of its CIWS cannons firing like hell trying to intercept the swarm of anti-ship missiles launched from Outer Haven? The one available now only shows the CIWS cannons in a distant shot. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 21:58, 27 June 2011 (CDT)

:The one you're thinking of is a rather dull closeup of the installation from the ''rear'', I wanted this one because it shows the main guns and looks awesome. The Phalanx shots are exclusively taken to show off ''Missouri'', the installations can piss off. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 22:15, 27 June 2011 (CDT)

Incidentally

[[Image:MGS4-M61-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

Ray should not have been allowed to use the hydrocutter as it's opening attack. >:( Also, just noticed that half the "Street Fighter" attacks use the beak to grab Ray, even though it's where Snake is sitting and at least two of them would clearly kill him. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 04:08, 28 June 2011 (CDT)

== Question ==

Do real suppressors degrade like in MGS3 and MGS4? I think not, or at least it's ''very'' exaggerated in these game. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 11:50, 6 June 2011 (CDT)
:old style wipe suppressors do degrade over time. Maxim type supressors and supressors designed after the 1960s don't degrade. You will have to clean them out after combat load but with the lenght of most computer games it should not be an issue as there isn't the time for junk to build up to the point where the supressor will fail. Basically if you take the time to clean you equipment every so often things should't go bad. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 21:32, 6 June 2011 (CDT)
::Thank you. :) - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:45, 6 June 2011 (CDT)
:Yep, suppressors in this game are another problem with its realism. The wipe-style suppressors in MGS3 would indeed degrade, sometimes after as low as 5 to 10 shots. Modern suppressors can last for thousands of rounds of semiautomatic fire, but less if fully-automatic fire is used.
:In reality, detachable suppressors fitted to weapons with supersonic ammunition (Drebin doesn't sell subsonic versions of normally supersonic ammunition, such as 5.56mm NATO, 7.62mm NATO, etc.) would not be as stealthy as depicted, especially at the ranges you fight at in this game. Try dropping a phone book from a height of 5 feet (or 150 cm in metric) onto a hard floor that is not covered by a rug or carpet--that's close to what even the best suppressors can do. At most of the ranges you shoot at in this game, real people would definitely notice (if not necessarily know where you are) and would immediately trigger a caution phase unless your first shot killed someone who was all by his lonesome. Suppressors can't deal with the sonic boom caused by supersonic ammunition, either, which can alert people. This is why the quietest suppressed weapons use subsonic ammunition (such as .45 ACP, or Russian 9x39mm ammo, etc.), or a special integral suppressor (like that on the MP5SD2) that slows supersonic ammunition down to subsonic speeds. Even that doesn't do anything for the clacking noises caused by the cycling of a (semi)automatic weapon's action, which is why the tranquilizer pistols in MGS2, 3, and 4 all use slide locks to eliminate that.
:Another problem is that suppressors, by slowing down the hot gas from fired rounds, cause a gun to overheat faster (because the slowed gas has more time to impart its heat to the weapon). Again, this is generally not a problem unless you forgo all fire discipline and keep firing in full auto; then you might have reason to detach an overheated suppressor and put a new one in place. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:08, 6 June 2011 (CDT)
Last time I helped put rounds through a MP5 with a detachable suppressor it took a bit for the suppressor to cool enough that it could be removed from the barrel. Of course we put 120 rounds through it with mostly magazine dumps as we were just testing the guns function.[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 22:36, 6 June 2011 (CDT)

Thanks guys. Well a suppressor is not meant to suppress gun fire so people in the same room can't hear it, it's meant so people in the whole building and in the city outside the building can't hear it. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 12:46, 7 June 2011 (CDT)

:Oops, forgot to mention that another way to remove the "clack-clack" sounds of a firearm's action (which can be louder than a suppressed gun's muzzle blast if the suppressor is good enough), aside from slide locks. Any type of round cycling that needs to be manually operated (such as bolt action, pump-action, etc.) will eliminate that sound. Too bad the DSR-1 couldn't be suppressed in this game; combined with its bolt action you'd get a very powerful, quiet, and lethal counterpart to the Mosin Nagant tranq rifle. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 00:45, 10 June 2011 (CDT)

Is possible to silence revolver then? Like in BO2?

== Just checking something ==

Of the M4, Drebin says "The barrel's free floating, of course." Now, you can see from the shot of Snake firing that even the ''handguard'' isn't free-floating, but isn't it a contradiction in terms for a direct impingement rifle to have a free-floating barrel since the barrel ''has'' to be touching something other than the receiver, namely the gas tube? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:08, 12 June 2011 (CDT)
:I hear of free-floating barrels on AR-15s all the time, I think "free-floating" means nothing but the receiver (and the gas tube) is holding the barrel in place. At least, that's what I know. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 13:36, 12 June 2011 (CDT)
It could be a bit of "Kojima nonsense" that snuck its way into the script (kind of like how Drebin claims the PMCs love to use the M4A1 Carbine, when in fact none of them do, and the game gives you the impression that Drebin is just foisting off old, obsolete stock onto Old Snake). After all, are we really supposed to believe that Fatman from Metal Gear Solid 2 built his first atomic bomb(!) at age 10? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 13:56, 12 June 2011 (CDT)
::I guess it could also be a translation error of some kind, since there's a few of those knocking around; I've just got to the first case of them mangling a symmetrical sentence by having Naomi alternate "fate" and "destiny" rather than just saying "it" the second time. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 06:41, 14 June 2011 (CDT)
:Or it could be Kojima's notoriously inconsistent stance on the realism/unrealism scale, especially when it comes to weaponry. First in MGS2 they let us render any enemy limb useless in a single lethal weapon hit (a feature that never returned), but in that same game they let us use the Stinger Missile Launcher indoors (even though that kind of weapon would cause a cave-in or flooding in the Plant chapter). And now they ask us to believe that in some scenes, professional PMC operators can't hit Snake when he's in spitting distance (such as after he shoot Vamp in the head in South America). That scene might have worked if he was hiding some distance away using Octocamo, though. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 21:07, 14 June 2011 (CDT)

Oh, and one more thing about the M4A1 in this game; why would you need to have a free-floating barrel on an automatic carbine? Wouldn't it just be simpler to insert a longer barrel, which would increase both accuracy and the bullet's effective range? Or, if you have the resources, you could always use better rounds (like the real life Mk 262) which have both longer effective range and accuracy than the standard 5.56mm NATO rounds in service now. That speech of Drebin's just makes him look like a "used car salesman"--it reeks of hucksterism. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 10:04, 21 June 2011 (CDT)

== Unknown pistol ==

Any idea what this is in Johnny Sasaki's leg holster? USP, maybe?

[[Image:MGS4-UnknownPistol.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Unknown]]

[[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 06:26, 14 June 2011 (CDT)

:Wow, even I'm a bit stumped, it's almost featureless. o_0 - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 16:12, 14 June 2011 (CDT)

::I was going by the features it doesn't have, more. It's got a horizontal base to the grip while holstered, which rules out any 1911-based pistol, but it doesn't have a beavertail bigger than the one on an actual beaver, so it can't be a Desert Eagle. It's obviously not any pistol that's available in the game unless it's a very small Mark 23, and a very small Mark 23 is called a USP. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:25, 15 June 2011 (CDT)

Also, am I hideously mistaken or is the Mk. 46 Mod 1 actually a Mod 0? The handguard doesn't look right for a Mod 1. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 14:01, 15 June 2011 (CDT)

:Based on what the model looks like it could be a featureless USP or P226 (it's too small for a Mark 23), but without the said "features" it's almost impossible tell what it is. It could also be just a generic "holster stuffer". :P (P.S. what's the deference between the Mk. 46 Mod 1 and the Mod 0, I've only seen the Mod 0?) - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 16:59, 15 June 2011 (CDT)

::The forearm of the Mod 1 lacks the rail at the 12 o'clock position (FN Herestal has pictures of the Mod 1 on their website [http://www.fnhusa.com/le/products/firearms/family.asp?fid=FNF055&gid=FNG008]). There's probably other differences, but either Google is failing me, or there's no info about on the Mod 1 upgrades on the entire internet. --[[User:Lynx|Lynx]] 18:48, 15 June 2011 (CDT)

:::[http://www.fnhusa.com/mil/products/firearms/model.asp?fid=FNF059&gid=FNG008&mid=FNM0039 FN USA] says "improved receiver pins, a feed tray with retention pawls and a vented handguard with improved heat shield and three MIL-STD 1913 rails." Now, I've checked the reload animation and you can see it's got a 12-o-clock rail on the handguard, so it's a Mod 0. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:05, 16 June 2011 (CDT)

::Also, of those two it'd have to be the USP, the SIG would have two screws visible holding the grips on. What I can tell you is the shape is intentional; it's ''not'' the same model used in PMC holsters; the ones I checked have a diagonal base to the grip and therefore are obviously supposed to be a GSR. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 04:34, 16 June 2011 (CDT)

Just to add these:

[[Image:MGS4-FROG-Holster.jpg|thumb|none|600px|FROG holster weapon, probably Five-seveN]]
[[Image:MGS4-GSR-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|PMC Holster weapon, clearly GSR.]]
[[Image:MGS4-UnknownPistol-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Another angle on Johnny's weapon, and one where they seem to have forgotten to add that delightful skidmark to his trousers, too.]]

Incidentally, ID'ing this one will take us up to 76 weapons with only one not ID'd (the land mine). [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 08:25, 16 June 2011 (CDT)

But it doesn't have the finger tip-shaped slots at the mag well to be a USP ether... In the last pic of Johnny the pistol now looks like a stubby Desert Eagle because of the way the grip looks. :/ - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 15:53, 16 June 2011 (CDT)

:Well, there should be some closer shots of it when I finally get off my ass and get around to recording and capping stage 3, there's a lot of closeups of the Rat Patrol members at the end of that one that should settle it if it actually is something. Interestingly, Meryl also has that holster as part of her uniform, but hers is empty (Deagle the first has a horizontal chest holster). [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 16:24, 16 June 2011 (CDT)

[[Image:MGS4-UnknownPistol-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

Think this is the best shot you're likely to get. Now, I'm going to bed, I just spent hours recording the entire third Act and at least half of the fourth and it's 3am. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 20:57, 17 June 2011 (CDT)
::In more ways than one. :P [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 18:33, 24 March 2012 (CDT)

:Looks kinda like a Desert Eagle with the beavertail milled down, wow this is hard. :/ - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 23:27, 17 June 2011 (CDT)

::Seems it's actually a Mark 23, since Raiden's character weapon (aside from a heap of pointy things) is a Mark 23, and he has the same holster. Holster looks to be very similar to [http://airsoftbb4u.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=402 one of these]. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 19:10, 27 June 2011 (CDT)

:::You could be right, but still looks off from a Mark 23, I see a metal tang on the grip like the Desert Eagle. Err. -_- [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:04, 27 June 2011 (CDT)

::::Might just be a mistake in the model. It's certainly supposed to be a Mark 23 (it's Raiden's only gun in multi), but since they never draw them (unlike FROGs and PMCs, who do draw their sidearms if they're disarmed), there was probably no obligation to actually put a drawable gun in there. I can't remember if Johnny pulls out his sidearm when they're defending the door or not, I'll have to see if they'll actually settle it for us or not. Otherwise we'll just have to say it's an inaccurate Mark 23. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 22:09, 27 June 2011 (CDT)

:::::Johnny does use his sidearm there. He uses a GSR. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:11, 29 June 2011 (CDT)

== Note about the M4 and the "big PMCs" ==
They ''did'' use the M4 in early builds of the game [http://ranger.gamebanana.com/img/ss/srends/thm__2863-.jpg] [http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o58/God-of-Reapers/metal-gear-solid-4-guns-of-the-p-1.jpg], but it was changed to the Mark 17 at some point for some unknown reason. Snake even got ''his'' M4 by taking it from a PMC in an early trailer. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:11, 29 June 2011 (CDT)
:Regarding the Patriot, wouldn't it fall under the same hideously ill-defined "PDW" label as the XM8 Compact? It does rather seem that PDW just stands for whatever your marketing department wants it to: HK definately called the XM8 compact a PDW in sales fluff, and invented the term because they didn't want to call their compact MP5K the MP5 Kurz Kurz as far as I can tell. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:14, 30 June 2011 (CDT)

:On the subject of the M4: the article mentions that the handguard isn't free floating like Drebin says. However, I'm pretty sure the rail is carbine length KAC URX which is free floating. Also, the MP5K-PDW isn't a compact MP5K; it's an MP5K with a stock added. --[[User:Lynx|Lynx]] 09:01, 30 June 2011 (CDT)

::Look at the shot of Snake firing the M4 into the camera and you can see there's a circular cap on the front of the rail handguard which contacts the barrel: a KAC URX doesn't have such a cap, which is why it's free-floating while this one isn't. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 15:42, 30 June 2011 (CDT)

::Also the delta ring between the rail system and the receiver. URX mates with the receiver to form an uninterrupted top rail for optics. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 22:56, 24 November 2011 (CST)

PDW is indeed something of a term that is a bit too nebulous. I've even heard the term applied to the select-fire variant of the Mauser C96 being described as a PDW since it could mount a shoulder stock and used ammo that was "armour piercing." Still, the question I raised earlier on this page as to the point of mounting a free-floating handguard onto an M4A1 carbine remains--isn't a free-floating barrel mainly for sniper or designated marksmen weapons, not for CQB full-auto weapons? And wouldn't greater long-distance accuracy be achieved more simply by using a longer barrel or enhanced ammunition? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 13:09, 30 June 2011 (CDT)

:With regard to free-float rails: there's more to it than just accuracy. Keeping the rails from contacting the barrel means that any accessories mounted on the weapon will be affected less by the vibrations that occur during firing. This helps keep vertical grips and the like from coming loose, and any optics/lasers/IR designators mounted on the forearm will have an easier time retaining their zero. --[[User:Lynx|Lynx]] 15:12, 30 June 2011 (CDT)

Well, that does make a bit more sense, but it still sounds like the sort of thing a National Army wouldn't issue--though it wouldn't be out of place among civilians or Private Military Contractors. Don't National Armies train for accurate semiautomatic fire whenever possible from anything that isn't an LMG, and if you fire enough fully-automatic rounds to affect the zero of accessories mounted on the handguard, doesn't that mean you're doing something wrong? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 01:07, 8 July 2011 (CDT)

== XM8 Compact ==

Why is the XM8 Compact under the SMG/PDW section? PDW or not, 5.56x45mm should go to the Assault rifles. - [[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] 07:37, 1 July 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, I was considering moving it to go with the Patriot. I'll do that tomorrow assuming someone doesn't beat me to it, and I'll remove "PDW" from the other heading since it's such a vague, useless class of weapons that seems to include everything gun company marketing departments feel like including from SMGs firing pistol rounds to compact assault rifles. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 08:37, 1 July 2011 (CDT)

I'm not sure about that; I think PDW is still useful to describe select-fire SCHV (small caliber, high velocity) two-handed firearms using proprietary rounds purpose-built for armour-piercing properties, like the 5.7x28mm, the 4.6x30mm, the 6.5x25mm, etc. that aren't (machine) pistols. Having said that, I would agree about how the label can be abused (the MP5K-PDW should have just received an "A" designation such as the MP5KA6 or the like). Still, I have to wonder if Akiba was given the XM8 Compact to show that Meryl "wears the pants" in their relationship--at a 9-inch barrel length, the XM8 (ultra)compact carbine is shorter than Meryl's long-barrelled Desert Eagle, which is 10 inches long.--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 10:08, 1 July 2011 (CDT)

:The trouble I have with the PDW label is either (a) it just means SMG so there's no point including it or (b) it includes all the stupid things that are called PDWs but aren't SMGs. Sure, the SCHV rounds aren't all used by pistols so not all PDWs are ''technically'' SMGs, but all PDW rounds are dimensioned like pistol cartridges and most have pistols designed and / or manufactured to shoot them anyway. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 04:42, 3 July 2011 (CDT)

The funny thing is, if you really want to be pedantic, an SMG is really just a select-fire pistol-caliber carbine. In my view the PDW label is still useful for a narrower class of weapons than most users of the label think, and should only be used if the weapon meets all of the following characteristics.

*Proprietary PDW rounds are designed from the ground up as armour-piercing rounds (piercing Level IIIA ballistic armour or lower), and resemble miniaturized assault rifle ammunition (by virtue of its dimensions and spitzer shape) rather than traditional pistol ammunition. So by this definition the PP-2000 would not be a PDW since it's still using 9x19mm rounds, just in an armour-piercing configuration.
*A stock and foregrip must be present on the weapon for it to be considered a PDW, since both simplify aiming (which is very important in a CQB situation). So a select-fire Five-seveN or C96 are still not PDWs (instead, they are just armour-piercing machine pistols) since it lacks the ability to have both of those features. An MP5K PDW has both a stock and foregrip but doesn't meet the first requirement, and is therefore just a compact SMG with a folding stock and small foregrip.
*A true PDW must have select-fire or fully-automatic fire capability, otherwise it just becomes a fancy carbine like the PS90.

You have to admit that PDW is a more convenient acronym than something like SCHV SMG or the like. We could just go with something like "AP (armour-piercing) SMG" but that would bring stuff like the PP-2000 back into the mix. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 21:27, 3 July 2011 (CDT)

::Actually, an SMG is a super-light machine gun firing a pistol round: remember the category comes from the first world war before the concept of an intermediate round even existed. And the problem is most users of the label include most companies that say their weapons are PDWs; there's such a huge number of bad examples and so few good ones that it isn't really worth using it, IMO. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 21:42, 3 July 2011 (CDT)

:My google-fu's rather weak right now, but aside from H&K marketing derivatives of the MP5 and XM8 as PDWs I don't know of companies that are marketing SMGs or compact assault rifles with the PDW label, when in fact they don't meet the requirements I outlined earlier. Maybe you could point me in the right direction? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 23:32, 6 July 2011 (CDT)

::Wikipedia says the Jatimatic was marketed as a PDW back when HK invented the term, and since the 5.7mm has realised its friends would still like it if it came out as a pistol round anything that fires that is basically a subgun in the normal sense of the term. Magpul's PDR Shirow-gun fires a full-sized 5.56mm, the Chinese QCW-05 fires the 5.8x21mm pistol round, the VBR-Belgium PDW fires the 7.92x24mm pistol round...It's fair to say most things called PDWs don't qualify in the strictest sense. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:00, 7 July 2011 (CDT)

:The "Shirow-gun"? And here I was thinking firearms designed for Ghost in the Shell at least made some sense, even if their service pistol caliber choice was a little iffy on the stopping power side (BTW, the Seburo Firearms page should not have been removed from this wiki). PDW rounds fired out of pistols seem a little iffy to me as well; if HK had to cancel its UCP for "inadequate ballistics in a pistol platform," what makes the Five-seveN/QSZ-92/VBR 7.92 Glock that much better? In any case, the Magpul PDR is just a compact bullpup carbine in 5.56mm NATO, and the 5.8x21mm round (how is this better than the 5.7x28mm round again?) is a miniaturized version of the Chinese 5.8x42mm assault rifle round, which makes it a PDW round. Maybe we could compromise and call them "CQDWs" for "Close Quarters Defensive Weapons" to show how they are meant to be stowed in "Close Quarters" and are most effective in CQB range as well, given their shorter cases compared to full-size assault rifle rounds? Making a poll on the forum asking whether or not the PDW label should be expunged from the site might be useful as well. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 01:23, 8 July 2011 (CDT)

::Again, though, I don't really see the point of using a label that's just going to cause a lot of confusion with not-examples and pseudo-examples. Anything that is categorised as a PDW in the strictest sense is basically an SMG firing AP ammunition. Not using the term rules out all the various pistols and assault rifles that would otherwise sneak into the SMG heading through the vague backdoor marked "PDW." It's sorta like having a category called "Dogs / mammals" next to one saying "cats" and expecting cats to not end up in the dog category. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:05, 8 July 2011 (CDT)

:I lol'ed at what you said about Akiba and Meryl. :D - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 16:15, 1 July 2011 (CDT)

Yep, then Akiba tries to "man up" by getting the Barrett M82A2, but then finds he can't "last long." He definitely would have lasted longer if he had gotten something capable of "sustained fire" instead, like the Mk. 46 Mod. 0 coupled with an FN P90 of his own, so either he or Meryl could use the LMG for covering fire while the other goes out to loot P90 magazines from dead FROG troopers and keep wreaking merry hell as long as possible. But no, Kojima had to saddle Akiba with an incredibly impractical Barrett M82A2 (only really useful for killing larger Gekko drones and annoying unmanned Metal Gear RAYs), his old XM8 Compact and a GSR. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 17:23, 1 July 2011 (CDT)

== The MAC-10 in this game ==

Is it an open bolt (the original version) or a closed bolt version? An open bolt version wouldn't need charging after reloading, and wouldn't need to be racked unless the trigger was held down after the last round fired (after which you'd just pull it back to ready the weapon). If the MAC-10 in this game were a closed bolt version, then you would need rack the bolt if you were loading from empty and would indeed eject a round if one were still in the chamber if you racked the bolt. If Old Snake is ejecting a round from the MAC-10 after a mid-magazine reload, then wouldn't it be a closed version? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:27, 6 July 2011 (CDT)

:I'd have to check. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:09, 7 July 2011 (CDT)

Another thing you might want to examine is the M60E4; it's still an open bolt weapon last I checked (partly because open bolt weapons run cooler than closed bolt ones, an advantage on an LMG since it means you don't have to change barrels as often). Also, is the M60E4 supposed to be the "very latest model" that the rebel in the Middle Eastern Militia Safe House was boasting about? It would make more sense than an HK21E, since some PMC machine gunners use the M60E4 and it is "the very latest model" of its kind. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 04:45, 7 July 2011 (CDT)

:Again, I'll check. In the latter case, I imagine the "very latest model" was probably supposed to be the XM8 LMG: it's the only version missing from the final game. Perhaps they gave the guy the HK21 instead because their playtesters would always kill him to get themselves a free 5.56mm machine gun with a built-in optic. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 22:30, 7 July 2011 (CDT)

Please do. Your considerable efforts on this page are much appreciated. But it wouldn't be the first time a game has used closed bolt versions of weapons that were originally open bolt; Rainbow Six Vegas 2 uses a closed bolt version of the MAC-11 machine pistol, for instance. And the XM8 LMG was always a strange one to me; while the other variants had good advantages for reliability and ease of use for their roles (since their sights didn't need zeroing, had more durable/reliable parts, along with infrared laser pointer/illuminators built into the sight), the XM8 LMG does not have a quick-swap barrel (unlike the M249, for instance) and is a closed bolt weapon which would make its heat buildup more problematic, despite the tougher barrel. In any case, all the game devs had to do to make the XM8 LMG would be to stick a Beta C-mag on the Marksman version of the XM8, since you can't use bipods in this game. The XM8 LMG would have been great in Johnathan's hands, and the standard carbine would then be given to Akiba. Even so, giving that boastful rebel an M60E4 would still require that you spend the money for accessories on a new game, so it wouldn't be as imbalanced as an XM8 LMG.--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 01:34, 8 July 2011 (CDT)

== The "PMCs love the (M4)" line ==

In my edit I did NOT specify which voice track language I was referring to (for all I know, that line could also have been in the original JP version). What I was commenting on was how the recording for that scene was probably done before the decision was made to have the PMC guys use the SCAR-H rather than have them actually use the M4-type carbines (as seen in the preview images someone posted earlier). While not wrong to begin with, the fact that they didn't go back to re-do that scene based on the new weapon assignment leave me scratching my head. --[[User:HashiriyaR32|HashiriyaR32]] 01:26, 7 July 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, but it's hardly the only strange mistake made in that scene; Drebin also says it has a free-floating barrel even though there's clearly a circular end cap connecting the rail handguard to the barrel, and also that the US Army uses it even though in-game they don't. It's hard to say if it's something that used to be true, a mistake, or just Drebin playing salesman and hoping Snake doesn't notice the more obvious BS in his pitch. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 01:43, 7 July 2011 (CDT)

:Just my personal observation, but I don't think Drebin's 'pretty popular with the big PMCs' line must necessarily mean that the M4 Custom is their standard-issue weapon. Maybe, in-universe, this version of the M4 is perhaps more like a weapon custom-made by the Drebins, and naturally sold exclusively by them. Perhaps he refers to veteran members of the PMCs buying them with their own fundings? Just my theory here, maybe I'm looking too much into it. --[[User:Researcher|Researcher]] 21:01, 12 March 2012 (CDT)

:It's also a possibility that ''everyone'' used the M4 Custom in a previous build of the game and the changes were made after the voice overs were recorded. There's really nothing in the game to prove the M4 isn't still the US Army's standard combat weapon. Meryl's "Army/Marines" team is a very, very, very small fraction of the entire US military and them using XM8s means nothing, otherwise HK416 use by Delta Force is proof that that weapon is used by the whole US Army, which we all know isn't true. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 15:39, 13 March 2012 (CDT)

::The problem is we have no evidence at all of that being the case; the only standard rifle we see any US soldier using during the duration of the game is the XM8, and the only one the PMCs use is the SCAR. Made-up reasoning to fill over a hole in the game world's logic is referred to in some circles as "plot spackle." To go with your example, if the US Army were fictional and we had only ever seen soldiers with HK416s, it would be correct to say we have no evidence the US Army uses anything but the HK416, and if someone said they used the M4, we would point out we've never actually seen them do so and the HK416 appears to be their standard weapon. When interpreting fiction, seeing is believing; characters can lie, exaggerate and be wrong, but a bunch of guys carrying one gun and not the other is a pretty airtight argument as ti which weapon they use. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 21:39, 21 March 2012 (CDT)

== Just found out something interesting... ==

HD remakes of all the previous games are apparently being released on PSN and possibly Live in November, so I'll hold out for them before screencapping those pages. Apparently they're going to sling in ''Peace Walker'' for PS3, too. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 06:15, 9 July 2011 (CDT

:Are they going to retexture MGS2 and MGS3 for this collection? I hope so, because MGS2 is horribly bland with its textures, far more than MGS3 was. I'd do MGS2 myself, I don't have a capture card and the PC version I have is not well programmed for PC graphics cards, so you often end up with a lot of graphical errors. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 11:48, 9 July 2011 (CDT)

::From the sounds of things it's going to be retextured MGS2, retextured MGS3 and probably retextured Twin Snakes running in the MGS4 engine. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 12:02, 9 July 2011 (CDT)

:::That sounds cool. :) - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 13:53, 9 July 2011 (CDT)

Last I heard it was only for the X Box 360. Good news that it's being released on the PS3 as well. Might mean that we're going to see it on the PC (fingers crossed). --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 15:10, 9 July 2011 (CDT)

== Drebins Camo Trousers ==
hi guys, wondering if anyone can tell me that make/pattern drebins trousers are, i mean obviously they are desert but im not sure what brand.

[http://images.wikia.com/metalgear/images/c/ca/DrebinMGS4.jpg] --[[User:Sike|Sike]] 10:48, 14 July 2011 (CDT)

Pattern would be something like "desert tiger stripe" and there's a similar-looking set of trousers [http://www.tigerstripeproducts.com/original_desert_tiger_stripe.htm here]. His look to be bleached a bit lighter or something, but it's the same basic pattern. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:04, 14 July 2011 (CDT)

== A minor controversy over the Operator suicide scene ==

The English voice actor of Old Snake, David Hayter, caused a minor controversy among gaming journalists and the MGS fandom when he said he [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rH-cYUiogI didn't find Old Snake's reluctance to commit suicide to be believable]. Now that the relevant screenshot is in this wiki entry, I thought it deserved some explanation. In David Hayter's words, he says ''". . . Snake would put a bullet in, and put [the gun] in his mouth and just pop himself, like he's killed--he's killed how many countless thousands of people, and he's going to shake because he's going to kill himself? I didn't agree with that at all and begged them to change it . . . ."'' --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:05, 29 July 2011 (CDT)

:Hm, I don't really buy that. He's killed ''other'' people, sure, but confronting the end of your own existence and what might come next isn't going to be easy unless you're incredibly secure in your convictions as to what will happen (and Snake hardly strikes me as devoutly religious) or too stupid to comprehend that's what you're doing. It's not like it's a spur of the moment "I have to do this" thing, after all. Mind you, I really don't think we needed to see him going down on the Operator for quite as long as he did. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:45, 30 July 2011 (CDT)

Even so, I think he's used to fearlessly facing death, even if it's virtually certain (such as when he faced Metal Gear REX before Grey Fox intervened in MGS1, or during his hopeless duel with Fortune in MGS2). And "going down on the Operator"--that's a nice wordplay. Still, I think it's a little disappointing how what comes next is available at any difficulty--it would be more of an incentive to play on harder difficulties if you only got the complete scene after doing something such as completing the Boss Extreme difficulty or getting a Big Boss emblem. Otherwise, you'd only see:

*Old Snake smoking a last cig before fading to black and the last gunshot after finishing Liquid Easy.
*The scene where he sucks his gun off (again fading to black with the last gunshot) after finishing Solid Normal.
*A short cut after the final gunshot showing the gun and its smoking barrel in Old Snake's gnarled hand, fading to black after finishing Big Boss Hard.
*And the complete ending scene after finishing The Boss Extreme.

It would also have been a nice touch if you got to see the ghostly forms of all the people you killed throughout the game or the people Old Snake couldn't save (which means, at a minimum, Liquid Ocelot, Naomi and Big Mama) surrounding Old Snake in the cemetery as he puts the gun in his mouth, as he will join them in death very soon. Such a scene would be a nice reference to the Sorrow's River in MGS3. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 13:42, 30 July 2011 (CDT)

*I don't know, facing almost certain death is different to facing ''actual'' certain death, especially when it's for something as abstract as the human race rather than something as concrete as someone right in front of you. Also, in both those cases his other option was being killed by the thing he was facing, so he ''didn't'' pick the "certain death" option. Also, given Naomi's record for telling the truth, he's probably worried that shooting himself would just make the bullet ricochet off his superior genes, kill the person who was ''actually'' going to cure the disease and overpenetrate to also kill the world's most adorable kitten which was behind that guy. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:18, 31 July 2011 (CDT)

I think the best real world explanation on why Snake's Operator locked back when he had no mag was that he could have possibly pressed the slide release up and hence locking it back by accident. I've seen people accidentally lock the slide back when they accidentally push the slide release up with a loaded mag in. It could have just been the mistake of the animator that they drew a mag follower when there shouldn't have been a mag inside the gun [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:56, 25 September 2011 (CDT)

A buddy of mine told me that dropping a round into the chamber like what Snake did would really risk accidentally setting the gun off and he seriously tells me to never do that in real life for any gun [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:26, 24 November 2011 (CST)

::Hideo Kojima thinks so as well. He was forced to add that scene after the credits, I hear. In his mind, Snake did kill himself-protoAuthor 17:31, 24 November 2011 (CST)

:::Actually the original ending would have been Snake and Otacon being hanged for treason (it's not clear who by). Hence "Here's to you" over the credits, which is about [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sacco_and_Vanzetti these two]. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:57, 25 August 2012 (CDT)

"Also, given Naomi's record for telling the truth..." ...makes me facepalm at how proponents of the suicide ending stick to her claims of Snake becoming a biological weapon as if they're the words of Jesus himself. Seriously, if someone attempted to assassinate ''you'' with a biological weapon and that person later told you that you were in danger of ''becoming'' a biological weapon, would you really actually believe that person? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 23:14, 24 November 2011 (CST)

== Operator ==

I think Snake's main 1911 is closer to a TRP Operator than a standard MC Operator. It has a Target cut rear sight, full length guide rod, extended magazine well and front strap checkering. Standard MEUSOC 1911s like the MC Operator and the Kimber Warrior don't have these features. I know it's not a huge difference but I think it may be worth mentioning.
:I just realized that TRPs are usually bushingless. I think it's more of a frankengun with features from both but I still think it's closer to the TRP so I changed the picture. Hope no one minds.
::I think we'll stick with the MC, it's heavily modified from either regardless of what it originally might have been. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 12:57, 31 August 2011 (CDT)

== screenshots ==

I've taken some screen shots from MGS4 of most of the guns from a side on view I've uploaded a few as an example. The first is snake loading a cartridge into the breech of the thor, the second you can see the compensator working on the G18C, the third is snake screaming Rambo style. [[http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:THOR_breech_load.jpg]] [[http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:G18C_working_compensator.jpg]] [[http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:Rambo_Scream.jpg]]
I've got more like them if anyone wants me to upload them just want to see what you think. [[User:Whatmename|Whatmename]]

You couldn't have taken bigger screen shots? [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:31, 2 October 2011 (CDT)

:<s>Certainly doable, yes. I'm going to be re-doing all the other shots when I have some time off work next month, I'll pick those up at the same time.</s> Edit: oh, wait, that wasn't Excalibur asking me to take bigger ones. Nevermind, I'll take bigger ones of those things, Whatmename, don't worry about uploading yours. Best that every shot comes from the same capture device and method, it makes the page look tidier. Besides, we don't really need side-on shots of most of the weapons since we've already got the inventory images for that. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 05:09, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

I think that screenshot from the G18C shows that the muzzle flash doesn't quite fit where the compensator port is supposed to be. I think the only video games I've seen that correctly emulate the compensated muzzle flash are Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter 1 and 2. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:21, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

== M4 Custom RAS ==

Regarding the confusion regarding the RAS on the M4 custom.

The in game RAS resembles two offerings from KAC, the Carbine RAS and the free floating RAS.
[http://www.knightarmco.com/mod_weapons_1.htm Knights ArmCo RAS]

The carbine RAS replaces the standard handguards and is secured with the default delta ring and end-cap.
The free floating RAS replaces the entire handguard, including the delta ring; replacing it with a visually distinctive locking ring. The end-cap in not employed.

The in-game model has the locking ring from the free-floating RAS but the end-cap from the carbine RAS.

IMHO this was done so that the game engine wouldn't have to render the interior surfaces for the RAS and barrel.

:Given we have other errors due to using airsoft guns as models, I think it's more likely that they used an airsoft replica. A cheaply made plastic RAS might have issues with snapping off if it wasn't secured at both ends. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 18:47, 25 October 2011 (CDT)

:Also, I'm going to be replacing almost every picture on this page with HD versions soon, so don't worry too much about new ones, it just gives me more work. Put any suggestions here or on my talk page. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 19:02, 25 October 2011 (CDT)

== Playing this again and disappointed in weapons ==

Decided to pop this back in and am a bit disappointed on how limited the guns are. The M4 is really the only gun you can fully accessorize and even then it was limited to what was available at the time of development. I didn't like the old style Aimpoint sight, no EOtech sight and I couldn't customized other guns like putting a red dot on the MP5. or the FAL. Since I've first played this game, I've learned how to shoot guns and I am a bit put off on how Snake not using the mag release button on rifles and ejecting a live round for only rifles and for some reason, not the handguns. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:05, 11 May 2012 (CDT)

:Yeah, I'm playing through this one again, too. I think that the gun ''selection'' is good, but I'm with you on the customization. They really could have explored more options as far as accessories go. As for him not using the bolt catch and ejecting live rounds...well, Snake is a professional, and I guess he has his own way of doing things. There's not really anything wrong with either of those (well, ejecting chambered rounds is pretty weird). It's like how some people drop the slide on a pistol with the slide lock, while some rack and release the slide. --[[User:ColonelTomb|ColonelTomb]] 22:43, 11 May 2012 (CDT)

Selection-wise there are a lot of odd guns in my opinion. There's no reason why the Middle Eastern Rebels couldn't have been using AKMs or AK-74s, and Big Mama's resistance members could also be using them as well. The HK21E has absolutely ZERO reason to be in the game (you could have just replaced the Rebel's HK21E with an M60E4 and everything would be hunky-dory rather than with the nonsensical dialogue the Rebel spouts about the HK21E being "the very latest model"). The XM8 should have been the full-length model to give better damage retention at range than the M4A1 (and should have been given a suppressor as well). And no revolvers, despite Ocelot being in the game? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 20:50, 24 August 2012 (CDT)

Despite how overrated and in many games now, the ACR should be in this game. Because this game takes place in the future, a LOT more new guns have been out since then. The standard XM8 is a carbine. The "full length model" as you call it is just the DMR variant. The XM8 was originally intended to be a replacement carbine for the M4. Technically those aren't "middle eastern rebels" but mercenaries hired, so their gun choices are whatever they want. I wish the SCAR-L was in the game alongside the SCAR-H and I wish they modeled different barrel length instead of just the CQC variant. It's kinda odd none of the more "professional" PMC soldiers had any optics on their guns and shooting their SCARs in full auto. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 20:59, 24 August 2012 (CDT)
:Those ''were'' Middle Eastern rebels, the only PMCs there were the advisers, the guys who didn't wear anything covering their faces. This is stated so during Codec conversations with Otacon. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:47, 1 September 2012 (CDT)

The game is also missing out on using more widely know handguns like SIGs and Glocks. The Glock 18 is just something overused in the media, so it doesn't count. I kinda wish you can "equip" a gun in the game so that in cut scenes, Snake is holding the gun you were holding the moment before the cut scene was triggered or when you walk around, the handgun holster is not automatically the 1911. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:10, 24 August 2012 (CDT)

:I think the main problem I always had with this is there's so many guns you never have any good reason to actually use for anything. The P90 is just plain ''better'' than all the other subguns, most of the vanilla pistols are useless, and so on. It's like they just threw darts at an airsoft catalog, and it results in some pretty dull bosses since none of them are designed with any particular weapon in mind. Plus the mount system doesn't have enough options; it's no good having mount something / mount nothing attachment points, there should be several accessories per location. Even if it's slightly farfetched things like sensor mountings on the side rails, it's better than nothing. Too many weapons with no accessories, too; I'd rather have fewer guns and more stuff to do with them, maybe have a SUIT scope for the FAL and some bracket accessories for the AK like a Kobra sight and so on. Also Snake maintaining light discipline in fully lit rooms is ridiculous.

:In general the design doesn't really work; dividing a warzone into arbitrary rooms shouldn't be necessary, and since they use the same alert system as always you get the weird scene of soldiers being attacked by a BMP-3 going to alert because AN OLD MAN WITH A BAD BACK IS HIDING IN THAT ALLEY. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:31, 25 August 2012 (CDT)

:I think the reason why 9mm semiautomatic pistols were not included lies in the damage variables used in the game's engine. If you ever played Metal Gear Online 2, you might have noticed that it took 8 auto-aimed hits from the GSR to down an enemy player at full health. Using auto-aim with a full-auto Glock 18 took around 20 bullets to down someone as well. Imagine taking a Beretta M9 into that mode and consistently finding yourself 5 bullets short if you tried to use your handgun and auto-aim a lot. And yes, the alert system is lifted straight from the earlier games, so the PMCs' highest threat priority is Old Snake at all times. More accessories for more of the ingame-weapons would have been nice, but what do you mean by "sensor mountings"? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 02:05, 7 September 2012 (EDT)

I kinda wish they brought back some weapons from the previous games like the FAMAS, or the PSG-1. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:02, 1 September 2012 (CDT)

:An AKS-74U with Kobra RDS and PBS-1 suppressor options would have been nice, too. I also would have preferred the XM8 be the RIS-equipped Malaysian variant (if not replaced altogether by something more relevant and modern like the ACR), the AK-102 have its tri-rail handguard, optic choices (EOTech!!!!!) and mounts for more guns, an M203 for the M4 (the HK launcher just looked too damn bulky on it) and suppressor options for ''most'' conventional weapons. I was just using the Dragunov last night during Act 2 and wished to high heaven I'd had a suppressor for it. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 20:07, 1 September 2012 (CDT)

I understand why the M203 was not in the game. If you think about it, it's a weapon that's getting old and this game takes place in the future. So a more future Grenade launcher would be better...that said, I wish the SCAR-H in the game was given a EGLM. Seriously, we needed more optics than the Aimpoint and ACOG. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:11, 1 September 2012 (CDT)
:This game is chock full of vintage weapons, including the Makarov, 1911, Mosin-Nagant, G3, Dragunov, MAC-10, Type 17, FAL, and even a freaking muzzleloading matchlock rifle, all ''older'' than the M203. Same could be said in a round-about way about the Mark 14 (M14), M4 (M16 platform), AK-102 (just an updated AK), and the Remington 870. I don't see how giving the M4 a variation of an accessory it's ''famed'' for would be out of place. It all goes back to us wanting more variety in weapon mods. Besides, there's nothing functionally wrong with the M203 and all the ammo available for the XM320 and MGL were standard 40x46mm that would have worked fine in it. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:39, 2 September 2012 (CDT)

When Snake held his M4 tilted, it doesn't make sense in the context of the scene, but if the game was made today, I'd bet you Kojima saw the future when we have recently added red dot attachments at a tilted angle for ARs. I wanted a regular M82A1, not the bullpup variant that no one ever sees anywhere. I really wished Merle didn't have double Desert Eagles. One as a sidearm, sure as a homage because it was her gun in MGS1 but 2? The G36 series of guns would have been nice. I wish the SCAR-Ls were in the hands of the mercs along side the SCAR-H because it's kinda weird that they ALL have SCAR-Hs but weirder is that none of them have optics or other attachments. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:11, 1 September 2012 (CDT)

:Out of all the Barrett rifles, the M82A2 actually makes the most sense for how it's used in-game, The M82A2 was designed to immensely increase the ease of use when standing or crouching compared to the conventionally lain-out M82A1, mainly for shooting at helicopters. Which works in the game since you mainly shoot the M82A2 standing or crouched against fast moving robots. [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] ([[User talk:Mr. Wolf|talk]]) 21:57, 12 August 2016 (EDT)

== Name of the equipment that allows Old Snake to reload one-handed? ==

If you choose to make Old Snake commit a war crime by taking an NPC as a human shield while wielding a handgun, you'll notice that unlike the previous game, Old Snake will actually reload his handgun when you press the reload button, rather than just stand around like an idiot when his gun runs empty (as was the case in MGS3) while holding a human shield. Is there a name for the holster setup he uses ingame that lets him reload one-handed? Would it be possible to get something similar that would allow you to reload a handgun that doesn't use detachable box magazines, like the Thor .45-70 in this game or a revolver? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 20:19, 24 August 2012 (CDT)

: I don't think he has any special equipment to reload with a human shield. I think he just smacks the gun around on his leg to make it look like he is actually doing something, but his gun is just reloaded by the magic elves in shooters, that also pick up spent shell casings and discarded mags as well as re-plaster walls that were damaged by bullet holes. --[[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]] 21:31, 24 August 2012 (CDT)

: Also, it's not a war crime; the fourth Geneva convention only says you can't take civilians or soldiers who are taking no active part in the conflict as hostages. I don't think it applies to threatening one soldier to make others back off. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 03:19, 25 August 2012 (CDT)

It would be cool to see them do some animation where we see Snake doing one handed reloads while holding a hostage. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:22, 24 August 2012 (CDT)

I would think that directly using one as a human shield would be frowned on by those at the Hague, however. But that's not the worst of it in this game. For one, you can make Old Snake execute soldiers you've made to surrender (i.e., you hold them up, then throw them to the ground and hold them up again to make them put their hands behind their heads). You can also commit sexual assault at gunpoint by holding up a FROG trooper and patting her down, along with the crotch-grab move. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 02:14, 7 September 2012 (EDT)

:You can think that if you want, but it doesn't make it so. Police pat female suspects down just like they do males. It's not sexual assault. You have a beef against Solid Snake or something? First you try to make him out as a war criminal, next a rapist. Are you going to imply he beats Sunny next? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 12:52, 11 September 2012 (EDT)

Mazryonh, you're thinking with a civilian mindset. Depending on situation, military around the world do train their people how to effectively hold someone, either as a "hostage", to suppress nonlethal or to kill silently. It's part of military doctrine. The whole patting down is also part of procedure. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 13:24, 11 September 2012 (EDT)

:Oh well, police officers at least have a legal right to pat people down, and at a police station a female detainee can usually ask to be patted down by a female officer. I very much doubt that the crotch squeeze (which is intentional genital contact) counts as "standard procedure" either. It was a joke in MGS2 and MGS3; here it's something Old Snake (who to everyone but a few people in MGS' world is an "illegal combatant") intentionally does to incapacitate the enemy or "cop a feel" at gunpoint (the FROG troopers even sometimes quip that "You know what I like!" if you do it to them sometimes, shortly before they try to kick you down). --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 01:29, 14 January 2013 (EST)

Personally I don't see the point of asking to be pat down by a female officer, you're going to be patted down the same way by either gender so it doesn't make much of a difference, if they think you're hiding something up "there" they're still going to pat down that area. And the reason for the crotch squeeze is to 1) Knock the male PMC's out and 2) Make the FROG soldiers kick Snake in the face. [[User:Kornflakes89|Kornflakes89]] ([[User talk:Kornflakes89|talk]]) 23:08, 11 March 2013 (EDT)

== Most Detailed Weapons in Gaming History? ==

Now I know MGS isn't perfect as far as weapons go (wonky weapon choice, needless cocking), but doesn't it have the most detailed models? I've personally never played a game where so many weapons were portrayed so realistically (visually at least). All guns cycle and eject spent casings. Bolts lock back when they're supposed to (M4 Custom, MK 17 bolt lock's back along with charging handle). And even when snake reloads early (he needlessly cocks the weapon) the weapon does eject the appropriate cartridge, which means they actually modeled a spent casing along with a cartridge. Maybe i'm the only one constantly in awe of this games weapons, but maybe not. Who else agrees. - cheech98

:The devs definitely went (almost) all out. But then again, that's what I'd expect from an MGS game. The only thing that kinda spoils it is the fact that fresh mags aren't modeled with any cartridges in them. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 11:27, 25 August 2012 (CDT)

It's also the first game that I've ever seen where people use a large amount of trigger discipline, some games are starting to implement it but I have never seen it as much as in this [[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] 20:37, 25 August 2012 (CDT)

:It's probably the first ''console'' game to model firearms with this level of detail. But ''PC'' games did this earlier. Just go look at the level of detail present in the PC versions of [[Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter]] and [[Ghost Recon Advanced Warfighter 2|its sequel.]] Both of them have the +1 round in the chamber from a tactical reload, there are two reload animations for virtually every firearm, and weapons can be extensively customized (except for the lack of an underslung shotgun). About the only real complaints I have about the guns in those games are an unrealistic damage system and the fact that selector switches don't actually move when you change your firing mode. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 02:50, 7 September 2012 (EDT)

== Weapons in stock photos used in cutscenes ==
Mostly M16A2s, an M16A2 with an M203, and an M249E1 from the first Gulf War (from the looks of their 90s-vintage gear), and M4s and a not-clearly-shown M240 variant used by troops in Iraq. Should these be included? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:15, 1 September 2012 (CDT)
:Yeah, stock footage is still in the game, after all. I'll have to get those when I get around to re-recording all this in HD. Kinda tricky because I'm going to need to make myself a plan of exactly what to do to get the same shots again in gameplay. Be interesting to see what the rumoured upcoming patch is going to do and if it changes anything (it's going to add trophy support, we know that part). [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 01:48, 1 September 2012 (CDT)
::That patch is actually already out, released two or three days ago. Didn't change anything aside from adding trophy support, from what I can see (and I just finished a playthrough about half an hour to an hour ago). All of the above weapons appeared in you-know-who's monologue at the end of the game. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:50, 1 September 2012 (CDT)
:::I assume they haven't put the MGO servers back up? They were turned off earlier this year IIRC. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 05:43, 2 September 2012 (CDT)
::::No. The MGO option in MGS4's main menu has been replaced with an option to install all five acts of the game to the HDD at the same time. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:28, 2 September 2012 (CDT)

== Hey... ==

If Johnny doesn't have nanomachines, wouldn't that mean he didn't have a system ID, meaning he'd have never been able to fire his issue weapon? Wouldn't someone have, you know, ''noticed'' that? For that matter, how come Snake thought threatening him with his issue weapon was a good idea when as far as he knew he'd never have been able to fire it without taking it to Drebin? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 00:06, 14 January 2013 (EST)

:I talked about this in an earlier revision of the XM8 section of this entry. But apparently I was wrong, and that was before I got the game for myself anyway. In any case, it's not too far of a stretch to posit that he's been paying Drebin some visits. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 01:22, 14 January 2013 (EST)

::Well yeah, but it's his issue weapon. Wouldn't the instructors have noticed he was the only one on the firing range physically incapable of firing his weapon at a target and, you know, done something about it? And you get in trouble if he has a non-ID weapon too since he should have used it at the end of Act 3. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 04:17, 14 January 2013 (EST)

:::He couldn't have used it if he wanted to in Act 3 cause he was puking his guts out on that boat. Of course now that you mention it, I do wonder how neither Merle or anyone on her team notices how they cannot link with Johnny at all [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 08:25, 14 January 2013 (EST)

::::Meryl oft mentions how johnny can be so out of synch with the rest of the team, most notably in the first few scenes where they are introduced IIRC. Also, from what I recall from the MGS database, all his gear is customized with tech from Japan to bypass the ID coding, minus the stuff from Drebin. [[User:The Kaptain|The Kaptain]] ([[User talk:The Kaptain|talk]]) 15:06, 14 January 2013 (EST)

::::But there was no way Snake could have known Johnny's XM8 is potentially an Non ID gun because his lack of nanomachines, yet he disarmed him and was ready to use it despite being informed previous that all guns are ID locked and he can't possibly used them without Drebin unlocking them for him to use. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 00:42, 12 March 2013 (EDT)

This game, while moderately fun (MGS3 is easily 10X more fun than MGS4 is, but that's just my personal opinion), has so many glaring issues that I'm so tempted to say, "Just throw it into the big bag labeled 'Plot Holes' and move on." LOL. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 05:32, 12 March 2013 (EDT)

:MGS3 was a game based around its gimmicks in my experiences--the guards are much easier to fool than in MGS4 and you have Naked Snake's omnipresent hunger to deal with (but we should save this for the actual MGS3 page). Still, Kojima could have prevented this problem if Old Snake, after slamming Johnny with CQC, unloaded his weapon, pocketed the magazine, threw it away (since I doubt Old Snake knew how to field strip, Boss-style, an unfamiliar weapon like the XM8 on very short notice), then drew his own looted AK-102 (which you MUST take) to point at the Rat Patrol. As for Johnny's part, he could just have visited a gun launderer early on in his training (though it still doesn't take care of the question of why Old Snake commandeered his XM8 since for all Old Snake knew the ID lock would have rendered it nonfunctional).--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 01:49, 15 March 2013 (EDT)

:::The soldiers in MGS3 are easier to handle because they aren't interconnected to each other via SOP like the mercs in MGS4 are and, barring the Ocelot unit and other Spetsnaz, were likely far less extensively trained since the Soviet war machine of the time was based primarily on overwhelming an enemy with sheer numbers. Even then, Big Boss is (at least from my POV) shown to be the obviously better soldier when compared to Snake. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 04:53, 16 March 2013 (EDT)

::How could he visit a gun launderer before taking his issue weapon out on a firing range, though? They don't tend to let you take your rifle home and screw around with it in the military, last I checked. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 04:48, 15 March 2013 (EDT)

:Easy, he could have noticed that "Oh, crap, I'll be using an XM8 as part of the Rat Patrol and don't have any nanos; I need to get a counterfeit chip/firing mechanism blocker/whatever ASAP" and then visited a gun launderer to ask for that specific component ("Sure, you can have one for an XM8, so as long as you bring me the original by tomorrow" or the like). All Johnny has to do then is to substitute the counterfeit component (most plausibly something that locks the safety switch in its "on" position without the appropriate radio signal from a user's nanomachines, and has its own microchip component that can receive an overriding signal from the Patriots) for the original via field-stripping his weapon before his first firing trip range--they have field stripping practice sessions in the military, don't they?--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 20:35, 15 March 2013 (EDT)

::If it were that easy, I doubt the Drebins would have made a business out of it. Every soldier in the field and mom & pop gun shop would be able to easily circumvent SOP, thereby making the whole thing--and the entire premise of the game--a proverbial fifth wheel. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 04:53, 16 March 2013 (EDT)

:No, according to Drebin 893's explanation at the end of the game, the gun launderers are '''(SPOILERS)''' Patriot-sponsored workarounds to the system, so it's most likely that only they can create chips (or whatever the component is actually called) that countermand/counterfeit the Patriot's System ID locks. Besides, the Rat Patrol's true purpose is in fact supporting Patriot operations, so I'm sure they would have given Johnny what he needed when he was assigned to the team, one way or another.'''(END SPOILERS)'''--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 00:53, 17 March 2013 (EDT)

::Yeah, but like I noted on the page, all of these weapons are designed to work without the System, so the worst you'd have to do is replace a component and maybe mill some metal out of the receiver so it fits. A lockout might work with something like the Javelin if the software is cloud-based and the missile programmed by the System since you'd have to write new software from scratch to use it, but a lockout on a gun is like a safe. It's there to stop you immediately accessing the contents, but if you can take it away and do whatever you like to it, it's not going to last for very long. So the Drebins would have been undercut by black-market gunsmiths who were just removing the ID locks or manufacturing weapons that never had them installed in the first place.

::That's not even getting into how daft it is having an army that requires the equivalent of an always-on internet connection to stop their soldiers turning into gibbering wrecks, their guns locking up and all their vehicles shutting down (helicopters doing so in mid-air, even). What do you do in an area with bad communications or jamming? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 07:45, 17 March 2013 (EDT)

:I was just arguing within the constraints of the story; if Kojima had thought things over he might have chosen other methods (such as surgical implants) to better control and monitor soldiers. And it doesn't have to be an "always-on connection"--perhaps the overriding orders only need to be issued once via a frequency no one else is allowed to transmit on.--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 16:34, 17 March 2013 (EDT)

::Naw, it's very much implied that a local shutdown of the system immediately disables all devices linked to it, there isn't even a crash mode so that you can, say, land a helicopter. That really long description of the System that Drebin gives also shows it's an active monitoring system, hence it doing things like regulating emotions and linking squadmates together; it's all centralised with the Patriot AIs acting as the hub. SOP is the networked battlefield taken to a more or less impossible extreme. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 16:44, 17 March 2013 (EDT)

== Random question regarding the SCAR-H description ==
Why are the XM320 and Masterkey referred to as "NATO underbarrel accessory weapons"? Neither weapon adheres to any NATO standard AFAIK, but the wording makes it sound as if both are some kind of standardized weapon systems used by all member states when no such standardization has ever existed. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 05:26, 12 March 2013 (EDT)

:My take is that they were designed for use by NATO-standard nations, just like the GP-25 is a Warsaw pact underbarrel weapon.--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 01:51, 15 March 2013 (EDT)

::Are there even any NATO standards for shotgun and low-velocity grenade munitions? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 04:55, 16 March 2013 (EDT)

:::Standard-measurement (2 3/4 in, 3 in, etc.) 12 Gauge shells for shotguns (I know, it seems obvious, but that's what it is) and 40x46mm for grenade launchers. [[User:Jeddostotle7|Jeddostotle7]] ([[User talk:Jeddostotle7|talk]]) 12:06, 17 March 2013 (EDT)

:::What I mean is they go on NATO-ammunition-using weapons. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 07:39, 17 March 2013 (EDT)

:NATO most definitely doesn't use the VOG-25 caseless grenades fired by the GP series grenade launchers (and they were purposely designed to be non-interchangeable with NATO weaponry, like the 9x18mm Makarov round). 12-gauge shotgun rounds have been around for so long they're used on both sides of the old Cold War factions (look at the Saiga-12 and the Benelli M4, for instance). The Russians currently still haven't designed and deployed an underslung shotgun for their assault rifles, but that's clearly not due to technological constraints.--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 16:38, 17 March 2013 (EDT)
::The question is why would you need an underslung shotgun for an assault rifle. Those things were never standard equipment for even the US army let alone any army. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 16:30, 12 June 2013 (EDT)
:::Yeah, but the point is they're the accessories that go on rifles that use NATO rounds, rather than on the Soviet rifles which get the GP25. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 02:11, 13 June 2013 (EDT)
::The [[M26 Modular Accessory Shotgun System]] has had success in the field because:
:::'''1)''' It allows M4 Carbine users to have a door-breaching method without carrying a separate weapon (the MASS was designed to have its muzzle be at the same position as an M4 Carbine's when mounted to one--the MASS could conceivably be mounted on full-size M16s, but with the main weapon's barrel protruding past the MASS', it would be rather awkward to get the unmodified MASS' barrel into the right position for door breaching, and shorter-barrelled military AR-15 variants might not have the barrel length to safely mount the MASS).
:::'''2)''' It allows users another close-range weapon to use if they are attacked when they are out of ammo for the primary weapon, assuming the MASS isn't also empty.
:::'''3)''' Due to the various alternative 12-Gauge shotgun loads, it allows the user more versatility without carrying another separate weapon system (such as buckshot for room-clearing, flare/smoke rounds for signalling, beanbag/stinger round for less-lethal takedowns, etc.). As FRAG-12 shotgun rounds proliferate, I would imagine that the M26 MASS may replace underslung 40mm grenade launchers for short-range work, as having a 3-5 shot grenade launcher right on your weapon would be a positive asset so as long as you can handle the extra weight. Alternative 40mm rounds such as less-lethal or buckshot-carrying versions exist, but so far the vast majority of underslung grenade launchers remain single shot, unlike the MASS. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] ([[User talk:Mazryonh|talk]]) 23:33, 13 June 2013 (EDT)
:The only downside to the MASS is its bulky size, IMO. I'd personally pick a Masterkey over it in the same way I prefer the M203 for its compactness over the bulky M320. At any rate, though, I just think referring to the XM320 and Masterkey as "NATO underbarrel accessory weapons" implies the weapons themselves are standardized by NATO and used by the militaries of all the organization's member states when they aren't. Many armies use AG36-based grenade launchers, yes, but not all these launchers are the necessarily the XM320/M320 variant in particular, and I don't think the Masterkey was ever widely used by ''anyone'' other than Delta. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 05:22, 8 December 2014 (EST)

== Uzi ==

Sat around at the menu to watch Snake's antics from the different angle than in the ending, and then it ended up playing one of the commercials for the PMCs from the start that I never saw before. Apparently nobody else around here did, either, because it turns out there's a gun present in the commercial for Praying Mantis that isn't mentioned on our page for the game. Alas, I've currently got no way to get direct screencaps of the game - the best I can do is screenshots of a video of the game, so I wanted to point it out here before I did anything to the regular page.

[[Image:MGS4-Uzi1.jpg|400px|thumb|none|IMI Uzi in the Praying Mantis commercial.]]
[[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 02:04, 4 July 2016 (EDT)
:There's also the stock footage weapons--[[User:Death Shadow20|Death Shadow20]] ([[User talk:Death Shadow20|talk]]) 06:19, 4 July 2016 (EDT)

:Actually I think that's a [[Minebea M-9]] of some kind, you see later it has a foregrip.
:[[File:Minebea M-9 submachine gun (New).jpg|thumb|400px|none|Minebea M-9 (Current Model) - 9x19mm]]
:[[Image:MGS4-M9-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
:[[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] ([[User talk:Evil Tim|talk]]) 16:46, 4 July 2016 (EDT)
::I'm not sure it's an M-9 there (the shape of the sight wings and the charging handle are pretty indicative of an Uzi), but it does do some shape-changing between shots. That one in particular, it seems to have grown a vertical foregrip, and had the Uzi's folding stock give way for one from a Mini-Uzi. The last shot it shows up in it's certainly a regular Uzi again, but it's still missing the stock for some reason. [[User:Kadorhal|Kadorhal]] ([[User talk:Kadorhal|talk]]) 19:39, 4 July 2016 (EDT)

== Operator or TRP Operator? ==

Just looking at the image from the game, I notice the sights and the magwell, and looking at photos of the TRP Operator it has the same sights and magwell. Could it just be chalked up to modifications made before Snake got it, or is it actually the TRP Operator? [[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] ([[User talk:Bristow8411|talk]]) 23:49, 14 August 2016 (EDT)
:I checked and the in-game gun sure is very similar to the TRP. Only difference being the threaded barrel, different grips and the slide release.--[[User:AnActualAK47|AnActualAK47]] ([[User talk:AnActualAK47|talk]]) 07:23, 15 August 2016 (EDT)
::Since it bares more of a resemblance to the TRP Operator, I'll change it to such. [[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] ([[User talk:Bristow8411|talk]]) 21:25, 25 August 2016 (EDT)
:Honestly, considering the live drab slide and wood grips, I'd say it's more likely it's a regular Operator with target sights and a magwell, it's not like it's something that is that hard to customize. Also, I'm pretty surethe TRP Operator has a bull barrel, which the in-game weapon doest have. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 12:54, 22 January 2017 (EST)

Talk:M18 smoke grenade

2016-10-28T07:38:07Z

Yocapo32:

Was just wondering when this was adopted? Google didn't turn up a year, and I notice that it was in Band of Brothers. Was it standing in for another grenade, or has it really been around that long? [[User:Jimmoy|Jimmoy]] 15:55, 24 May 2011 (CDT)
* The M18 replaced the Willie Pete during WWII, if I remember correctly. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 03:38, 28 October 2016 (EDT)

Talk:Stella Women's Academy, High School Division Class C3

2016-10-27T04:37:22Z

Yocapo32: /* Second Unknown Pistol */ new section

== TM ==

A lot of their weapon choices are ones that are high-profile in Tokyo Marui's line-up. Guess they're going to fly the flag for domestic airsoft.[[User:Temp89|Temp89]] ([[User talk:Temp89|talk]]) 06:17, 15 July 2013 (EDT)
:Well, Tokyo Marui is listed in the credit as the military adviser for the series, so it's probably safe to assume that all the weapons are modeled after TM products.--[[User:Wildcards|Wildcards]] ([[User talk:Wildcards|talk]]) 18:08, 16 July 2013 (EDT)
::Here's [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/event/stella/ Tokyo Marui's Page] advertising the anime and their product.--[[User:Wildcards|Wildcards]] ([[User talk:Wildcards|talk]]) 14:14, 22 July 2013 (EDT)
:::Damn, TM just did most of our job for us. I think if a gun in the show isn't particularly detailed and/or is causing confusion as to exactly which variant it is, we should go by the replica it's based on. The pictures there aren't necessarily the variants used in the show, they show the black P228, but Yachiyo uses the stainless version. Note that beside the P228 it lists two variants with the blue "Air" bubble, which means both are spring powered. The Skorpion, M4A1, 92FS, G17 and Desert Eagle, all have mulitple replicas too. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 17:02, 22 July 2013 (EDT)
::: I noticed they showed the AUG in the ad for the show, but the only appearance I see it in is in Sonora's Closet. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 20:48, 22 July 2013 (EDT)
::::I noticed that too. I bet she'll be using it as her primary, and this picture is basically a spoiler of that. I wonder what she'll have for optics on it. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 22:42, 22 July 2013 (EDT)

Just found [http://www.hyperdouraku.com/airgun/gindan/index.html this page] on another forum describing the Tokyo Marui New Gindan series. Could the pink pistol actually be Glock 26? --[[User:Wildcards|Wildcards]] ([[User talk:Wildcards|talk]]) 13:33, 2 August 2013 (EDT)
:Yeah, Looked at the design again in the anime, Akane used the red Glock, not the PPK. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 18:00, 2 August 2013 (EDT)

Here are all the main airsoft guns used in the show, we can use these as reference in case detail isn't clear on something. A few noteworthy things: The TM AUG A1 is discontinued. TM's electric Skorpion has a black grip; only the spring-powered version has a brown grip. TM only makes a spring-powered P228, even though Yachiyo's seems to be gas-powered in the show, and while the SIG looks stainless in that one picture we have, I'm pretty sure that was the lighting, as it looked black to me at every other point in the show, like [http://avvesione.files.wordpress.com/2013/07/stella_jogakuin_koutouka_c3_bu-01-karila-honoka-yachiyo-rento-survival_games-airsoft_guns-protective_eyewear-pose.jpg here]. Links incoming: [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/electric/compact/196 Vz. 61 Škorpion], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/gas/blowback/60 G17], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/gas/blowback/53 Desert Eagle Mark XIX], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/electric/standard/16 P90], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/gas/blowback/259 "Strike Warrior"], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/electric/nextgeneration/231 G36KV], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/gas/blowback/272 Mk IV Series '70], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/electric/standard/28 AK-47], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/gas/blowback/50 G26 "Advance"], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/aircocking/boltaction/215 AWM], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/electric/standard/42 Type 89-F], [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/aircocking/handgun18/136 P228]. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 10:06, 7 August 2013 (EDT)

==Help identifying guns==
[[File:C3 (22).jpg|400px|thumb|none|(Ep.1)]]
[[File:C3 (92).jpg|400px|thumb|none|(Ep.1)]]
[[File:C3 Glock (5).jpg|400px|thumb|none|(Ep.1)]]
Can someone help identifying these guns? [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 08:22, 16 July 2013 (EDT)
:First AEG rifle is [[Howa Type 89]]-F Airsoft.
:[[Image:HowaType89Para.jpg|400px|thumb|none|Howa Type 89 F Assault Rifle]]
:The second image is a parody scene of "[[First Blood]]". But this revolver was used not Sheriff Will Teasle. He used [[Smith & Wesson Model 66]]. - [[User:KINKI'boy|KINKI'boy]] ([[User talk:KINKI'boy|talk]]) 21:58, 16 July 2013 (JST)
::Thanks, i added one more image, do you know what kind of revolver is portrayed in the parody scene?[[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 09:02, 16 July 2013 (EDT)
:::I think that is similar to the scene that attacked the sheriff in ''[[First Blood]]''. However, it has not been reproduced less. - [[User:KINKI'boy|KINKI'boy]] ([[User talk:KINKI'boy|talk]]) 22:17, 16 July 2013 (JST)
::::The revolver? The last i recalled, the sheriffs were armed with rifles when hunting Rambo in "[[First Blood]]". So do you not know what kind of revolver the sheriff in this animated parody scene is using? Also what is the gun in the drawer? Looks like a SIG to me, is it? [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 11:04, 16 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::I can't place the pistol in the drawer, though it looks familiar, but those magazines to the right of it are definitely M1911 mags (I have a TM M1911 mag identical to those). Also, that rifle on the right side in the closet looks like a G3 (likely the SG/1, TM's standard G3 replica) to me, not an AR-18. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 19:12, 18 July 2013 (EDT)
::::::Yeah, I looked at it again, its likely a G3, but not the SG1 with bipod. ( unless it was removed) [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 20:28, 19 July 2013 (EDT)
:::::::If you look really closely, it appears to have the grooves in the handguard for the bipod, it just has the bipod removed. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 22:17, 19 July 2013 (EDT)
::::::::Looking through ''all'' the pistols TM makes, I think the one in the drawer is supposed to the the [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/aircocking/handgun18/99 spring-powered USP40]. First, the angle of both images is the same, the muzzle looks almost identical, the square bump under the rail in the drawer pistol has the same dimensions as the serial number plate on the USP, the vertical ridges that stick out a bit further back match with those at the back of the rail on the USP, and the rectangular bit behind that looks like it's supposed to be the slide lock. The forward cocking serrations (that are in the same place as the trademarks) look to be an error, and that's what was screwing with me. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 22:37, 2 September 2013 (EDT)

==Real Desert Eagle==
I am really suspending a lot of disbelief that a high school girl of that size can handle a Desert Eagle in 50 without any problems. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 16:39, 18 July 2013 (EDT)

==Yachiyo's SIG ==
[[File:C3 Sig (7).jpg|600px|thumb|none|That's a Glock 17, and looks to be a continuity error here. There are no airsoft P228Rs anyway.]] [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 15:24, 12 August 2013 (EDT)
:How experienced are you with airsoft? Just curious. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 23:53, 13 August 2013 (EDT)
::I got my first gun, a TM Glock 26 like Rento's, but normal, five or six years ago, but I only got a rifle and started actually going to games in the last two years or so. I've disassembled both my M4 and M1911 down to every last part and reassembled them (for good reason, mind you), so I know my way around them pretty well. I'm not sure how experienced everyone else here is with airsoft, but if someone's confused about something or other, I can probably help :) Facts of the day: For those who don't know how they work, electric airsoft guns are neither open nor closed bolt, they're a kind of weird mix of the two. There's never a round in the chamber, and when you pull the trigger the piston cycles back, then forward, chambering a round and also firing it, then the piston stays there. Basically, instead of cycling after firing, they cycle before. Gas guns, however, function exactly the same as real ones (minus shells), with the key difference being that the propellant is stored in the magazine instead of within each round, thus they can't fire without a mag in the gun. The slides and hammers don't just move for show, they're completely functional. Wow, that was way more of a wall of text than I intended :/ [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 00:39, 14 August 2013 (EDT)
:::That's cool, I got a TM Hi-capa 4.3 as a first gun. It's amazing how airsoft technology has advanced in these past decades, ain't it?
I played Airsoft when I was in college. My team was lead by a guy who served in the British paratrooper, so he taught us the basics on how to be a soldier and even got us all to dress up in British DPM. So before I had even handled my first real gun, I knew the firearms safety rules, the fundamentals, team work, and some basic infantry tactics. I had a lot of fun running around the woods, going through rivers and swamps and clearing buildings. At the time, we all used rifles that were battery power, but by the time I graduated college, some of us had switched to gas powered rifles like our sidearms. I loved using the gas powered rifles because they felt even more like real weapons and bolts lock back when empty as well as more simulated recoil. I had sold most of my gear to the freshmen that came after me. My rifle was a WE M4, commando variant I think with a rail similar to the ARMS because I had some work done to it and took parts of a Tokyo Marui M4 S-System onto it, vertical foregrip/light combo, an actual Magpul CTR stock and an airsoft EOtech. I kept the stock because I wanted it on my real AR one day. My sidearm was a Glock 17, which I also sold. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] ([[User talk:Excalibur01|talk]]) 23:04, 14 August 2013 (EDT)
:Related to both Yachiyo and our own airsoft: The Tokyo Marui AWS I ordered just showed up today, I'm ''very'' impressed with it, in terms of aesthetics as well as performance! Once the TM bipod, rail riser, scope rings, and scope get here I'll post a picture of it :D Now I just need a Type 89-F to complete the set. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 23:29, 6 September 2013 (EDT)
How are you certain that the SIG pistol is made by WE? I know TM doesn't make GBB SIG, but why WE in particular? Or are you just using that company as an example as there could be many more companies that makes the SIG airsoft.[[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 02:47, 20 September 2013 (EDT)
:I posted it as my edit reason, but adding to the talk page would've been better in hindsight. There are three companies that make P228s: TM, Tanaka, and WE. TM's is out for two reasons, both because it's not a GBB, but also because its guide rod is solid at the front, whereas both the Tanaka and WE (both GBBs) have a hole in the guide rod. [http://i.imgur.com/l0Df4Hk.jpg Yachiyo's has the hole.] This proves that it's not based on the TM version, as it was otherwise possible they just took the liberty of making it a GBB. The differences between the [http://www.wgcshop.com/WGC_Shop/images/tw_ps_p228bhw_l.jpg Tanaka] and the [http://www.wgcshop.com/WGC_Shop/images/we_ps_f228_bk_l.jpg WE] are that the Tanaka has the older takedown lever and a serrated mag release, while the WE has the newer takedown lever and checkered mag release. Unfortunately, neither of those are ever seen with enough detail for that to matter. The only other visual difference is that the WE has a very, very grey finish of the slide, whereas the Tanaka is all the same shade of black. It's visible in those pictures, but do a picture or video search for the WE and you'll see it's not just a lighting issue. The best quality shot of the P228 is [http://www.imfdb.org/images/1/14/C3_9_%281%29.jpg this one], where it clearly has the WE's finish, and it's even visible in [http://www.imfdb.org/images/8/84/C3_%2844%29.jpg this shot] too, despite the odd shininess. Lastly, Tanaka's P228 is a very old model, and has been discontinued for quite a while, while WE's is a year or less old, it's brand new. I also got [http://i.imgur.com/HE1t7Ot.jpg this screenshot] while looking closely at this scene, the P228 is super crazy high res when she pulls it out here, even though I had to frame-by-frame to notice any detail at all. Right before that there's one of the top of the slide and rear sight, and after it you can see the base of the magazine with the gas fill hole in it. Nothing really important about that last one, I just found it amusing. :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 17:34, 20 September 2013 (EDT)

==Pictures==
I have the episodes downloaded in 1080p; is it okay if, along with adding pictures, I replace the ones we have now? [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 22:29, 13 August 2013 (EDT)

: I think most of the current pictures are all fine as they visually portray the weapon just fine in the format, but 1080p pictres of some firearm like the M9 [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:C3_M9_(3).jpg], MAC-10 [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:C3-3_Mac10.jpg], the glock and Type 89 continuity error with Yachiyo [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:C3_Sig_(7).jpg][http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:C3-bu_Type89.jpg], the Gindan series, M3A1 [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:C3-3_M3_(2).jpg|M3A1], the unknown sheriff's revolver [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:C3_(92).jpg], Sonora's closet [http://www.imfdb.org/wiki/File:C3_(31).jpg], vague pictures, etc. will help with identification. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 23:53, 13 August 2013 (EDT)

::I'll just upload them somewhere else for now, and link them to the talk page as needed. I just noticed there's a box for a "Colt 38" in the closet, up top. Here are a few we missed and some I think we could add: [http://i.imgur.com/gSnTuhg.jpg Deagle in intro], [http://i.imgur.com/2s1iTBj.jpg G36 in intro], [http://i.imgur.com/uB8F4Gq.png AWM in intro], [http://i.imgur.com/BofWKUq.jpg AK in intro], [http://i.imgur.com/HEMEgpY.jpg Honoka with dual MkIVs in her imagination], [http://i.imgur.com/2FS2lgN.jpg a fairly generic sniper rifle], [http://i.imgur.com/EVTFhmy.jpg and again], [http://i.imgur.com/sVYddLI.jpg a nice shot of Yachiyo's SIG], [http://i.imgur.com/GvoIsbr.jpg a Glock 26 Advance firing live ammo!], [http://i.imgur.com/Glck4vs.jpg the G36's scope], [http://i.imgur.com/vrCWBwH.jpg a different pink M4 with rails and an ACOG], [http://i.imgur.com/XHVkAZg.jpg super closeup of Sonora's Deagle], [http://i.imgur.com/XOOcv5Z.jpg maybe a 74u?], [http://i.imgur.com/WAVU8KQ.jpg and again], [http://i.imgur.com/7iUAKRF.jpg a couple pistols], [http://i.imgur.com/uKpcRLa.jpg the Deagle water gun], [http://i.imgur.com/0FVhAIj.jpg and the Glock water gun]. Also, I fixed it on the page already, but Yachiyo's 89 is always an F, they just coloured the whole stock black instead of parts transparent in that one shot. You can see the notch on the bottom and the bar at the top-back. I'll get some more pictures tomorrow, including the ones you linked. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 00:39, 14 August 2013 (EDT)

:::Those are good selections, I forgot about the sniper rifle Yura had. The pictures:
:::* Pictures in the intro
:::* Yura's sniper rifle (M24 right?)
:::* Yachiyo's sig
:::* G36 scope
:::* pink M4
:::* close-up of Deagle
:::* the 74u and Deagle FPS view
:::* Competitor's pistol
:::would be a great addition and improvement to the page. I would exclude Honoka akimbo because it isn't detailed enough (I would say the same for 74u, but it's distinguishable) and the waterguns (felt that they didn't look "real" enough since we already have pictures of the black versions). Also I'm aware of the fix for the Type 89, but I suggest a HD picture of the picture in question so we could see the error in it more clearly since it took me a while to notice why they were different from the picture. I'll go ahead and use some of the pictures you linked. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 01:03, 14 August 2013 (EDT)

:Some things that were missed. [http://www.imfdb.org/images/8/8d/C3-8.jpg This picture], the sniper rifle appears to be an M40, based on the colour and the square-looking front end, and the rifle on the right is an HK416. KGB's Hibiki Tsubaki's [http://i.imgur.com/fHgSCYj.jpg sniper rifle], maybe another M40? The RDSs on Meisei's MP5Ks have [http://i.imgur.com/U7zWLAn.png night vision], as well as [http://i.imgur.com/ohEkkid.png zoom]. And a nice shot of the P90, G36K, and Skorpion [http://i.imgur.com/FINrKLf.jpg on a table]. You guys sure you don't want me to replace the screencaps we have? The higher resolution may not matter on the page, but mine don't have the TBS watermark. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 21:34, 29 August 2013 (EDT)
::[http://www.imfdb.org/images/8/8d/C3-8.jpg This picture] Its hard to tell what that guy's sniper rifle is, is the handguard the only evidence or does the color give it away more than I thought? What source is your anime files? Is it HorribleSubs? Their the only ones I can find with 1080p of the show.[[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 09:57, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
:::HorribleSubs, yes. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 08:07, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
::::Go ahead and replace the screencaps then.[[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 09:57, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
:::::Yay, a project! [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 17:39, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
::::::Also I already did Episode 8 with HorribleSubs to see how it would look like so you can ignore that episode. There is this one picture from Episode 8 that makes it look like HorribleSubs 1080 has worse quality than the 720. I think its just my computer but if you want to compare: [http://www.imfdb.org/images/archive/2/2d/20130830061835%21C3-8_MP5K.jpg 720p] and [http://www.imfdb.org/images/2/2d/C3-8_MP5K.jpg 1080p] , you'll notice by the background, maybe you can retake that and see if it looks any better on your side. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 20:44, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
:::::::Woah, you're right, it's the same for me. Also, both of the pictures you linked are 1080p; what's the source for the not-actually-720p one? Also, on second thought, those two sniper rifles are likely just TM VSR-10s, which I believe are M700-based. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 21:27, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
::::::::oh, the 720 one is from Commie's 720p video file, I took it on my moniter so thats why its in 1080p, but the actual file is just 720p. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 21:57, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
:::::::::Since I'm going to go with one of the other three fansubs due to the 1080p actually not being great, I looked up reviews of Vivid, Anime-Koi, and Commie, and Commie is ''by far'' the least liked sub, just a heads up. The other two are reasonably close, but Vivid is generally agreed on as the best. No screencapping for me :( Here's [http://notredrevie.ws/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/Vivid-Stella-Jogakuin-Koutouka-C3-bu-04-CCDB2636.mkv_snapshot_04.36_2013.07.29_16.00.57.png an example] of Vivid's subs :D [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 22:30, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
::::::::::Maybe cuz Commies the worst 'cause they are one of the fastest to upload their files? They seem to upload the same day the episode is aired, and they have if not great, decent video quality. Rushed service I guess. I'll check out Vivid out for personal comparison when I get the time. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 01:32, 31 August 2013 (EDT)
:::::::::::The video quality is likely identical for all three 720p subs. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 01:35, 31 August 2013 (EDT)

==MP5K RDS==
I've figured out the suppressors are replica [http://www.wgcshop.com/wgc2008/main/product_detail1.php?item=MB-SL-GRMPS Gemtech Raptor-IIs], they mount to the 3-lug muzzle, but I don't know what the real name of the [http://www.wgcshop.com/wgc2008/main/product_detail1.php?item=GP-RD-SC24 red dot scope] is, it has a built-in claw mount. Is it H&K-made? And since this is also Meisei related, I think their team's pistol is an [http://www.wgcshop.com/wgc2008/main/product_detail1.php?item=TM-PS-XDM40 XDM-40], given the cocking serrations and how the front looks like a compensator (how it was drawn). [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 22:23, 29 August 2013 (EDT)
:I think it was originally made by Walther, but not sure as you can get it without about 10 different names printed on the side like NcSTAR, Vector Optics, Matrix Tactical Systems, all sorts. A lot of people call it a "1x20mm Razor Compact Claw Mount Red Dot" or something along those lines, but don't know if this is an original name or just something that has been attaches to it for some reason. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 12:02, 30 August 2013 (EDT)
::But it is a real steel scope, the original Walther one? Or is it an airsoft-only RDS? My money's on theirs being the G&P one that I linked, it's the highest quality manufacturer and version made, and it has the orange-tinted lens while some other replicas lack that, and also no trademarks. It's pretty cool that both of the MP5K's attachments are MP5-specific. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 16:51, 30 August 2013 (EDT)

==Miyagi's Desert Eagle==
TM never made a chrome version of the standard Desert Eagle with a 10-inch barrel, thus this is [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/bio/history/07/ Resident Evil version]. Hibiki's sniper rifle is [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/aircocking/boltaction/206 this one], given the colour and far-forward magazine (though extended magazines for VSR-10s don't really exist). Is the VSR-10 an M700 replica? [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 19:53, 31 August 2013 (EDT)

:I think it is a M700 derivative, I thought it more as a M40 at first (which itself is a M40 derivative). It's possible that the weapon could have a customized extended magazine, animator depth and drawing is done wrong, or we misidentified the weapon, I just think there isn't enough detail in the gun.. Also is it the same for that other sniper rifle with the competitor in a group of 4? The picture with mp7, hk416, and scar.[[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 23:45, 31 August 2013 (EDT)

::The thing that sold it for me is that if you look closely at the bottom of the magazine, you can see the little dimple groove things on each side that let your fingers pull the mag out. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 00:24, 1 September 2013 (EDT)
:::Oh ho, I see it, yep. That's should be a VSR-10. Still can't confirm on the other sniper rifle? [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 06:18, 1 September 2013 (EDT)

VSR-10 is about as generic as you can get, putting it as that was a good idea. Okay, this is the last thing I'm unsure of: [http://www.imfdb.org/images/7/7c/C3-7_%2814%29.jpg The pistol on the back of the magazine.] I think it's [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/gas/slide/68 this one] because of the slide, but it looks to have the magazine from [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/aircocking/handgun18/107 this one], and the slide is long enough on that one too. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 00:12, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:I'd go with the HardBaller, comparing the two the Hardballer slide looks just about right for the image. The Centimeter Master has a second serrated area on the slide, but the Hardballer and the image doesn't, but this could be due to lack of details. It's really crude to be sure just like that, but I'd go for the Hardballer for those reasons. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 01:09, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::That's what I was leaning towards as well, I just noticed the magazine even says "Long Model". You should add it to the page, I don't know how you want it organized. I believe we have every gun seen so far up on the page now, and the only thing I'm not confident about is that "Colt 38" box. While similar, the silhouette isn't right for an M1908, for example the M1908's furthest back point is the slide, while the gun on the box looks like it's the frame, like a beavertail type rear end. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 02:03, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::Well the Colt box isn't exactly the most detailed picture in the series. It looks similar, but total confirmation can be nigh impossible from the angle we're given. Added the Hardballer [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 02:25, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::Oh wait, I totally forgot the S&W M36 in Episode 5's epilogue! And [http://i.imgur.com/7iUAKRF.jpg this pistol], only the close one looks identifiable, and I think it's a [http://www.tokyo-marui.co.jp/products/gas/slide/71 Steyr GB]. Actually, does the back one have the barrel cut out of an M9, or am I just going crazy? [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 18:57, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::::Your crazy, I can only see a generic pistol shape on the back competitor. Also that might not be a Steyr, if you look at the hand, you can see some sort of grip spur coming out of it, which the Steyr GB doesn't have, thats the only thing I see wrong. And the S&W M36? Should we add that? I mean...It's a sand drawing... [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 19:39, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
::::::Zoom in reeeeally close on the "M9". I noticed that bit too, the only other thing I was thinking of was a CZ 75. I know we don't add the other random drawings, for good reason, but it ''was'' mentioned by name. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 20:33, 3 September 2013 (EDT)
:::::::I don't really see any Steyr GB in there at all. The slide serrations are vertical rather than slanted, the rear sight is too big, the slide safety (if it is there at all) is way too small, it lacks the large barrel bushing at the front of the slide, the grip plates aren't high enough, it looks like there may be a frame safety of something on the right side of the frame, and the general profiling of the slide is totally wrong (the GB has very distinctive profiling at the front of the slide where it narrows to the bushing and at rear of the slide where it sweeps upwards to the rear sight). My guess is that it is just a particularly off model Glock or otherwise just a generic pistol. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] ([[User talk:Commando552|talk]]) 20:43, 3 September 2013 (EDT)

== Episode 12 ==
Standard issue are Five-seveNs, a few standard wood M14s in a locker as well, along with an original M16 (but with a birdcage flash hider), an M82A3 (even though the only airsoft M82-series replicas are M107s), a couple RPG-7s, and a couple other guns that may or may not be IDable in the windows. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 22:11, 19 September 2013 (EDT)
:Haven't watched it yet, but I'll look out for them when I do. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 02:46, 20 September 2013 (EDT)
::That's why I didn't post any spoilers :) [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 17:34, 20 September 2013 (EDT)

For episode 13 I see an [http://i.imgur.com/7hY7sH7.png AUG High Cycle (AUGA3-based) and two Px4s], along with a PSG-1, HK416, and PPK/S, the last three we've seen before. In the competition, Seira Yaguchi uses an [http://i.imgur.com/K6oxh7A.png AK Beta-Spetsnaz without a stock], Tae Aizu uses [http://i.imgur.com/bdF7OPE.png some rifle or shotgun], Kiku Nagato uses a [http://i.imgur.com/O0Z05qo.png fairly generic pistol], Bonny Anne uses a [http://i.imgur.com/XbhVX3k.png flintlock pistol] (yes, there is an airsoft replica of one), and Maiotome Ise uses a [http://i.imgur.com/hRUmTQ4.png C96]. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 17:01, 28 September 2013 (EDT)

:Got it, thanks. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 21:16, 28 September 2013 (EDT)
:Well, the series is now officially over for me, man that was a lot of guns in one anime series. I hope there is another anime like this (as in gun-heavy) in the future. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 03:46, 29 September 2013 (EDT)
::A season 2 would be pretty awesome :D [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 13:19, 29 September 2013 (EDT)
::: Was actually disappointed with the last episode, Ep.12 had a better ending. And *spoiler alert* why was sonora back in ep.13? Didn't she head to America by ep 12?
:::Honestly an OVA will be pretty satisfying for now. Hope for a season 2 as well. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 18:34, 29 September 2013 (EDT)
::::Ep12 was the proper finale, 13 was like a bonus episode, like an OVA that aired on TV. That doesn't mean we won't get an OVA though, ''K-On!'' followed the same pattern in its first season: 12 Finale, 13 Bonus, 14 OVA. Sonora just hadn't left yet I suppose, it didn't seem like she was leaving that day, just pretty soon. Either that or this is set months later near the end of the school year and she's back visiting, which is quite possible given their reaction when she walked in. Either way the episode showed her reduced role in the club, with Honoka obviously taking over as leader. If there is a second season I bet the new member is going to be using that AUG HC they just won. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 18:25, 30 September 2013 (EDT)

==Episode 4 WWII Rifle==
So I just learned that the tank that drives over Yura is a Matilda II, thus the soldiers running with it are British. That makes the bayonet-fitted bolt action rifles they're carrying SMLEs, right? [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 17:54, 6 December 2013 (EST)
:Could be, but there isn't any real good visual in that scene if it is that rifle. [[User:Inceptor57|Inceptor57]] ([[User talk:Inceptor57|talk]]) 11:17, 29 December 2013 (EST)

==Dafuq?==
[[File:C3-2 M4 (1).jpg|600px|thumb|none]]
Anyone else notice how horribly this "M4" is drawn? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] ([[User talk:Spartan198|talk]]) 22:16, 29 July 2014 (EDT)

:Yeah, it's like that to varying degrees of terribleness for the whole second episode, but in the third episode, where Yura uses it as her primary at the tournament, it looks great. I'm assuming they didn't have proper reference material until after episode 2. Thankfully it's some of the only bad gun artwork in the show. [[User:Alex T Snow|Alex T Snow]] ([[User talk:Alex T Snow|talk]]) 13:51, 30 July 2014 (EDT)

== Second Unknown Pistol ==

I think it may a CZ-75, considering the overall shape and tiny slide. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 00:37, 27 October 2016 (EDT)

Talk:Rise of the Tomb Raider

2016-10-23T08:06:08Z

Yocapo32: /* "Unknown Machine Gun" */ new section

Couple things
:First of all, the site won't let me upload some pics because: "Could not create directory "mwstore://local-backend/local-public/0/00".
:Second, there's some weapons I can't identify but the site won't let me upload pics off. Will post them later.
:Third, I still need to do a third run through the game, I'm missing some guns and want more/better pics of some others

I'll come back and double-check spelling and grammar when I haven't been starring at this for three hours.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] ([[User talk:Mandolin|talk]]) 15:20, 14 March 2016 (EDT)

== "Unknown Machine Gun" ==

Considering the barrel, I'm pretty sure it's the handheld Type 1 from the previous game's multiplayer. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 04:06, 23 October 2016 (EDT)

Batman: Arkham Knight

2016-09-17T07:11:03Z

Yocapo32:

{{incomplete}}
[[File:BAKTitleTemp.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''Batman: Arkham Knight'' (2014)]]

{{Game Title}}

__TOC__ 

=Handguns=
==Glock 17==

The Arkham Knight carries a backup pistol seemingly based on the [[Glock 17]], though heavily stylized, presumably to fit with his futuristic soldier aesthetic. While they seem to be modified in the same way as his Desert Eagles below, and he does indeed carry a pair, further suggesting this, he only pulls them out one of a time, losing the first one when Batman disarms him prior to his boss fight, and then pulling another one at the end of said fight, when his Desert Eagles are knocked away form him. This second pistol is never used again in the game, leaving it's fate unknown.
Second Generation Glock 17s are used by GCPD officers in an attempt to defend themselves from the newly formed alliance between Gotham's mayor villains in the "Father to Son" trailer for the game.

[[Image:Glock17EarlyModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|2nd Generation Glock 17 - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BAKGlock17.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A GCPD officer fires his 2nd Generation Glock 17 into the onslaught of mooks.]]
[[File:ArK-Glock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight holds Batman at gunpoint, seemingly unhappy that he hasn't been able to figure out his secret identity yet.]]

==Desert Eagle==
The Arkham Knight carries a pair of extensively modified [[Desert Eagle|Desert Eagles]] of unknown model, one fitted with a retractable scope and laser sight, and the other with a folding stock, as his weapons of choice. During his boss fight, he somehow combines both of them, extending the scoped one's barrel to around fourteen inches, and turning them into a straight-pull bolt action rifle.
Jason Todd as the Red Hood carries similar weapons, but without the scope nor stock, apparently being straight out of factory weapons, marking the first time since the Joker's playable appearance in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]] that the player is allowed to freely use lethal force to deal with their opponents.

[[File:Desert-Eagle.jpeg|thumb|none|325px|IMI Desert Eagle Mark XIX - .50 AE]]
[[File:Desert_Eagle_Mk_I_14_inch_barrel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Desert Eagle Mark I with 14 inch barrel - .50 AE]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, with his face censored to avoid spoilers, whips around with his Desert Eagles at the ready.]]
[[File:ArK_desert_eagle-stock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After screaming at Batman how he's going to personally kill him for three quarters of the game, the Arkham Knight finally makes good on his threats, extending the stock on one of his Desert Eagles...]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-combined.jpg|thumb|none|600px|...Then extending the barrel on his other one, and locking them together.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-sniper_rifle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, now visorless thanks to Batman destroying it in an attempt to disarm him earlier, poses with his combined pistols before jumping away, beginning the boss fight.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-laser_sight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Apparently, the Arkham Knight was a big fan of Power Rangers S.P.D. when he was a kid.]]
[[File:RedHoodArkhamKnight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jason Todd with two Desert Eagles in a promotional poster.]]

==SIG-Sauer P220/P228R Hybrid==
A strange, almost bizarre amalgamation of several variants of the [[SIG-Sauer P220]], combining the full size and single stack mag of the P220, along with the almost full-length rail of the P228R, along with a slide mounted decocker/safety, appears as the game's most commonly used pistol, replacing the [[Sphinx 3000]] from the previous games. The weapon is proportioned in a extremely cartoonish matter, with grossly exaggerated features, including an extremely over-sized ejection port and a thin, almost comically small grip. Why this design was chosen, given the realistic style of the rest of the game, it's unknown.

[[File:SiGP220RNewModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P220R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:SIG-Sauer_P228R.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P228R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two Face hold the SIG hybrid in his character showcase, showing the massive ejection port and Picatinny rail extending past the front of the slide.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-safety.jpg|thumb|none|600px|An intruder at Wayne Industries, with his face and name censored to avoid spoilers from Arkham City, hold Lucius Fox hostage, showing off the slide-mounted decocker/safety. Also note the lack of a bulged grip, indicating the use of single-stack magazines.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-side.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Christina Bell, one of the people infected with Joker's blood mentioned in the previous game, uses her gun as a pointer while ordering Harley Quinn's mooks around. Rather unsurprisingly, she ends up shooting one of them by accident, as denoted by the subtitles.]]

==Colt Python==
An stainless 4-inch [[Colt Python]] with rubber grips is used by Commissioner James Gordon as his sidearm, replacing the nickle plated [[Desert Eagle]] he carried in the previous games. The revolver is, for some reason or another, not only modeled with a trigger guard relief, but also without a cylinder latch.
Two Face also owns, not surprisingly, a pair of these revolver, one with a stainless finish, and one a blued finish, similar to the ones the character carries in [[Batman Forever]]

[[File:ColtPythonSS.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Stainless Steel Colt Python with 4" Barrel and rubber combat grips - .357 Magnum]]
[[File:Colt-Python.jpg|thumb|none|325px|A blued Colt Python, similar to the one found on Two-Face's display, though lacking the rubber grips]]
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Commissioner holds his revolver in his character showcase, showing off the relieved trigger guard, along with the strangely modeled hammer.]]
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The other side, while out of focus, and further blurred with a simulated chromatic aberration effect, it's still shown clear enough to note that it doesn't have a cylinder latch, making one wonder how is the weapon supposed to be loaded.]]
[[File:ArK_MGL-140_Ugly_Revolver_Thing-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face's cache in the GCPD Evidence Room holds his two revolvers, along with his Milkor MGL from the Catwoman DLC from Arkham City. Strangely enough, he never uses any of these weapons in game, instead sticking with a sawn-off Mossberg 500 instead.]]

==Taurus Raging Bull==
Joker's stylized Raging Bull returns from his DLC in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]], held in a glass case in the GCPD Evidence Room, along with the rest of his gadgets from that particular game. Ironically enough, according to Aaron Cash, the revolver is loaded with five actual bullets, and a single "Bang!" flag, when in it's titular DLC it only had one bullet loaded. Although knowing The Joker, the flag is probably just as lethal as the rest of the ammo in the gun.

[[File:Taurus_Raging_Bull.JPG|thumb|none|325px|Taurus Raging Bull - .44 Magnum]]

[[File:ArK_Joker-Ragingbull_barrel_JPG.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A close-up of the barrel of Joker's Raging Bull, showing the "Bang!" flag hanging out of the barrel.]]

[[File:ArK_Joker-Ragingbull_closeup_JPG.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A more general view of the revolver, showing it still has the same cartoonish proportions from Arkham Asylum.]]

=="Bat Killer"==
Harley Quinn's comically oversized hand-howitzer returns from the "Harley's Revenge" DLC for [[Batman: Arkham City]], being found in the GCPD Evidence Room. The design seems to have changed following the events of the DLC, with a nickel finish, brighter wood grips, and the lack of the danger stripes on the backside of the weapon, whether this is artistic license or damage following the ending of Harley's Revenge is unknown.

[[File:ArK_Bat_Killer.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The "Bat Killer", collecting dust in a glass case.]]

=Submachine Guns=
==Auto Ordnance Thompson M1927==
A [[Thompson Submachine Gun#Auto Ordnance M1927 Thompson|M1927 Thompson]] previously belonging to Arnold Wesker, or more likely his "puppet" Scarface, can be seen in a display case at the GCPD Eveidence Room.
[[Image:M1927AutoOrd.jpg|thumb|none|500px|M1927 Thompson civilian semi-auto model with 50-round drum magazine - .45 ACP]]

[[Image:Arkham Knight TommyGun.jpg‎ |thumb|none|600px|Batman checks out the civilian M1927 Tommy Gun belonging to the Ventriloquist.]]

[[File:ArK_M1927_closeup_JPG.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A close-up of the M1927, showing the lack of a front sight and holes in the Cutts compensator.]]

=Rifles=
==Colt M4A1==

Multiple [[Colt M4A1]] rifles are used by Harley Quinn's men in the Announce Trailer, some with M203 launchers as well.

[[Image:ColtM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M4A1 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[File:BAKM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Harley Quinn's men fires his Colt M4A1 at a GCPD cruiser.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203(2).jpg|thumb|none|600px|Several goons with M203s attached to their M4s.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face brings his M203 to bear as he spot the Batmobile charging towards him.]]

=="Assault Rifle"==

The strange amalgamation of the [[Noveske N4 Diplomat]], along with the top rail of an [[Heckler & Koch SL8]] returns from [[Batman: Arkham City]], once again used by the GCPD, the Arkham Kinght's army, and every second armed thug from Crime Alley to Wayne Tower, this time with both the upper and lower receivers painted in coyote brown. Once again, they're incorrectly depicted as having two left sides, with the ejection port and forward assist nowhere to be found. Rather unsurprisingly, The Penguin still sells the rifle on the black market, his stock going unchanged between this game and the one before it.

[[File:NDiplomat.jpg|thumb|none|425px|Noveske Rifleworks Diplomat with M68 Aimpoint red dot scope and Surefire M900 weaponlight foregrip - 5.56x45mm]]

[[File:SL8-1_newModel.jpg|thumb|none|425px|Heckler & Koch SL8-6 Commercial rifle - 5.56x45mm]]

[[File:ArK_G36-AR47-hybrid_closeup_JPG.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A Noveckler DipSL8 sits on the GCPD Evidence Locker, a room separate from the archived evidence, which inventory changes as Batman defeats enemies with different firearms.]]

[[File:ArK_G36-AR47-hybryd_penguin_mooks.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Penguin's mooks holding the hybrid rifle on the Model Gallery, showing off the lack of ejection port, also note the lack of any kind of optical sight.]]

[[File:ArK_G36-AR47-table.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A loaded hybrid rifle left on a table next to high security holding cells, pointed at the hostages that can be rescued on different side missions.]]

=Launchers=
==M203==

Several [[M203]] launchers are seen attached to M4A1 rifles. Before he fired the grenade, the editing made it seemed like he pumps the M203 like a shotgun, despite seeing animation of the launcher opening and closing.

[[Image:M203.jpg|thumb|none|375px|M203 grenade launcher - 40x46mm.]]

[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face aims his M203.]]

{{Batman Series}}
[[Category:Video Game]]
[[Category:Third-Person Shooter]]
[[Category:Stealth]]
[[Category:Crime]]

File:ArK Joker-Ragingbull closeup JPG.jpg

2016-09-17T07:07:54Z

Yocapo32:

File:ArK Joker-Ragingbull barrel JPG.jpg

2016-09-17T07:07:53Z

Yocapo32:

File:ArK G36-AR47-hybrid closeup JPG.jpg

2016-09-17T06:44:51Z

Yocapo32:

File:ArK G36-AR47-table.jpg

2016-09-17T06:43:08Z

Yocapo32:

File:ArK G36-AR47-hybryd penguin mooks.jpg

2016-09-17T06:42:36Z

Yocapo32:

File:ArK M1927 closeup JPG.jpg

2016-09-17T06:38:40Z

Yocapo32:

File:ArK Bat Killer.jpg

2016-09-17T06:13:12Z

Yocapo32:

User talk:Yocapo32

2016-09-17T06:09:52Z

Yocapo32: /* Batman: Arkham Knight screenshots */

==Batman: Arkham Knight screenshots==
Your screenshots are great and I'm glad that you started posted them. I haven't been able to get Batman Arkham Knight due to the glitchy release I heard of (I think they patche'd it though, but not so sure). However, you don't need to censor other character's faces, especially if their mere appearance simply gives away spoilers. On Imfdb, you can just post a template at the top of the page that warns all viewers of potential spoilers on the page. You can read more about spoilers on the [[Rules, Standards, and Principles]] page. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] ([[User talk:Kenny99|talk]]) 03:52, 3 September 2016 (EDT)

Well, I don't have the game anymore, but if I ever manage to get some decent quality screencaps, I'll make sure to do that.
Also, yes, the game is extremely poorly optimized on PC, but subsequent patches managed to bring it more-or-less on par with the console versions. --[[User:Yocapo32|yocapo32]] ([[User talk:Yocapo32|talk]]) 02:09, 17 September 2016 (EDT)

Bioshock

2016-07-11T04:47:00Z

Yocapo32:

[[Image:Bioshock.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''Bioshock'' (2007)]]
'''Bioshock''' is the award-winning First-Person Shooter from 2007, created by Irrational Games. Set in 1960, player character "Jack" (who is never actually called that in-game) is stranded in the middle of the ocean after his place crash-lands. Seeking shelter in a lighthouse, he soon comes across the city of Rapture, an underwater Heaven-turned-Hell filled to burst with leaks, a powerful element called ADAM, power-giving Plasmids, violently ADAM-addicted "Splicers", little girls with giant diving-suited protectors, and a friendly Irish man called Atlas. Arming himself with these powerful Plasmids and various weapons, Jack ventures out into Rapture to defeat the tyrannical Andrew Ryan, the founder of Rapture, and find out that not all is what it seems.

'''These weapons were used in the video game ''BioShock'':'''
__TOC__ 

=Handguns=
== Webley Mk VI ==
The first firearm the player character finds is the "Pistol," based on the [[Webley Mk VI]] Revolver. This is also the weapon of choice for Leadhead Splicers for most the game. Its ammunition is very common until the Splicers begin to use other weapons. The pistol uses .38 caliber rounds and it can use rare armor-piercing rounds or rarer antipersonnel rounds. The pistol can be upgraded with a damage boost and a secondary wheel holding twenty-four rounds. The pistol model held by Splicers is smaller than the one held by the player.
Also, it should be noted that the hammer is always locked back, even though there is no animation for cocking it and the pistol operates in Double-Action. This is from an early build of the game, where the Webly was single-action. Another interesting thing is that Jack reloads the gun replacing the entire cylinder rather than using a speedloader (indeed, ammo packs for the pistol are of multiple cylinders, even when upgraded with the capacity increase).
[[Image:Webley.JPG|thumb|none|400px|Webley Mk. VI - .455 Webley]]
[[Image:BioshockPistol1.png|thumb|none|400px|"Pistol," chambered in .38 S&W. This is probably one of the best modeled weapons in the game, along with the Wrench.]]
[[Image:BioshockPistol2.png|thumb|none|500px|'''"Pistol"'''. '''From left''' : ''Regular'', ''extended cylinder magazine'', ''increased damage'' '''and''' ''fully-upgraded''.]]
[[Image:Bioshock pistol kill.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Player Character "Jack" fires his revolver at a Leadhead Splicer. Note that flames are somehow coming out from '''behind''' the cylinder.]]
[[Image:BS-R.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jack holds the revolver as he comes across a Vita-Chamber. When the player's health is completely gone, they automatically re-spawn at the closest Vita-Chamber rather than actually die in-game.]]
[[Image:BS-Rb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|When Jack reloads the revolver, the release latch somehow flips up automatically right before Jack proceeds to snap open the revolver.]]
[[Image:BS-Rc.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Even stranger, there is no separate animation model for a loaded cylinder as no rounds can be seen inside after the reloading process ends.]]
[[Image:BS-Rd.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Dr. Tenenbaum with her revolver when she encounters Jack for the first time.]]
[[Image:BS-Re.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Looking down the iron sights of the revolver.]]

== Single Action Army ==
The logo on the "El Ammo Bandito" vending machine features a pair of [[Single Action Army]] revolvers.
[[Image:ColtSingleActionArmy.jpg‎ |thumb|none|400px|Single Action Army - Colt Single Action Army w/ 5.5" barrel known as the "Artillery" model - .45 Long Colt]]
[[Image:BS-SAA.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A pair of Single Action Army revolvers can be seen on the logo of the "El Ammo Bandito" (Probably intentional badly translated Spanish for "The Ammo Bandit") machine.]]

==Colt Detective Special==
A [[Colt Detective Special]] can be seen as the logo for the Combat Tonics when viewing them via the Gene Bank.
[[Image:Colt Detective Special.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Colt Detective Special - .38 Special]]
[[Image:BS-CDS.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A cartoon Colt Detective Special is highlighted by the Gene Bank.]]

== Unknown revolver ==

A cartoon image of an unknown revolver  appears in the description of Combat Tonics.
[[File:Unkbisrev.JPG|none|thumb|600px|The Wrench Jockey combat tonic description features a cartoon rendition of a revolver.]]

=Submachine Guns=
== Thompson Submachine Gun ==
The "Machine Gun" is the third weapon in the game and is based on the [[Thompson Submachine Gun#M1921 Thompson|Thompson M1921]] with a charging handle on both sides of the weapon.
At the early stages of the game after it's found, ammo is very scarce. The weapon and its ammo become increasingly more common when Leadhead Splicers upgrade to this weapon from their revolvers towards the end of the game. The Splicer model is smaller and lacks the foregrip and stock. A modified version is the standard armament for security bots.
The weapon's casings eject to the left, as is common in video games. The weapon uses a forty-round drum (a real Tommy's drum would hold fifty rounds). The Thompson can fire standard ammo, rare antipersonnel rounds, and inventable armor-piercing rounds. It can be upgraded with a damage boost and a recoil reduction which resembles a suppressor. The ones used by Security Bots appear to be [[M1 Thompson]]s.
[[Image:M1921Thompson.jpg‎ |thumb|none|500px|M1921 Thompson - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:BIOSHOCKMACHINEGUN1.png|thumb|none|500px|Regular "Machine gun." Note the poorly-rendered Cutts compensator with the front sight at the wrong end. The stock and rear sight wings are a weird hybrid of M1921 and M1. Also note the hideous modeling on the weapon, with grips around twice the size they should be and the drum magazine smaller than it should be, which looks awkward in first person view.]]
[[Image:BIOSCHOCKMG3.PNG|thumb|none|500px|'''"Machine gun"'''. '''From left''' : ''Regular'', ''increased damage upgrade'', ''decreased kickback upgrade'' '''and''' ''fully-upgraded''.]]
[[Image:BS-SMG.jpg|thumb|none|600px|When Jack arrives at the Medical Pavilion entrance, he finds a Machine Gun lying against a control panel.]]
[[Image:BS-SMGb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jack fires the Machine Gun at a Splicer caught off-guard. Note that the spent casings are ejected from the left even though the real Thompson actually ejects casings from the right.]]
[[Image:BS-SMGc.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Jack reloads his Machine Gun while simultaneously contemplating the fate of a lone Little Sister.]]
[[Image:BS-SMGd.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Note that the left side of the Machine Gun is a mirror of its right side, technically giving the gun two bolt handles (although Jack only pulls back the right side bolt handle, which is correct for the Thompson). The bolt handle's always pulled regardless of whether or not Jack's reloading from empty.]]
[[Image:BS-Thompson.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Looking down the iron sights of the Machine Gun. Note the damage upgrade for the Thompson, which appears to add some sort of pump that heats up the rounds of the weapon.]]
[[Image:BS-Thompsonb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The fully upgraded gun seemed a bit like a Frankengun with the large improvised muzzle break, heat pump, and various random bits and pieces of machinery attached to it.]]
[[Image:BS-Thompsonc.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Note that this particular submachine gun used by a Leadhead Splicer against a Big Daddy lacks the wooden stock the player's weapon has, which would then be the standard submachine gun model in [[Bioshock 2]]. Also note how NPCs do not use the foregrip of the submachine gun compared to the player and instead hold it by the barrel, which could cause severe hand burns in reality as the barrel heats up when fired repeatedly.]]
[[Image:M1sb.jpg|thumb|none|400px|M1A1 Thompson with 30-round magazine - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Bioshock bot.jpg|thumb|none|601px|Security Bots carry their own machine guns. This version is belt-fed and the trigger and pistol grip have been replaced with parts integrated with the Bot's mechanism. Its damage and physics are identical to the model the player uses.]]

= Machine Guns =

== Browning M1919 ==
The [[Browning M1919]] is the weapon mounted on the automated gun turrets found throughout the game. It is not directly available to player character, who can hack the turrets to fight for him. Destroyed gun turrets sometimes drop .45 ammunition, implying that this gun somehow uses that instead of .30-06, which would mean technically it has been converted into an SMG.
[[Image:M1919A4Browning.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Browning M1919 - .30-06 on M2 tripod]]
[[Image:M1919-BS.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A lone and hacked automated turret fires on a couple of Splicers with its mounted Browning M1919.]]

=Shotguns=
==Spencer 1882 shotgun==
The "Shotgun" is the fourth firearm in Bioshock. It is based on a [[Spencer 1882]] with custom antique-style golden engravings on the receiver/main body of the gun, but loads from under the receiver instead of on top. Ammo for the shotgun is not common throughout the first half of the game, especially since enemies don't carry it, so it often has to be brought from vending machines. A mechanical auto-loader can be fitted to the weapon as part of the "Increased Rate-of-fire" upgrade. The weapon can fire 00 buckshot as well as electrified or explosive slugs.
[[Image:SpencerShotgun.jpg |thumb|none|500px|Spencer 1882 - 12 Gauge]]
[[Image:BIOSHOCKSHOTGUN.png|thumb|none|500px|Regular "Shotgun". Grip looks a bit iffy, but otherwise okay.]]
[[Image:BIOSCHOCKSHOTGUN2.PNG|thumb|none|500px|'''"Shotgun"'''. '''From left''' : ''Regular'', ''increased rate of fire upgrade'', ''increased power upgrade'' '''and''' ''fully-upgraded''.]]
[[Image:BS-Shotgun.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jack finds a shotgun on the ground next to a slain Splicer and a box of 12 Gauge slugs.]]
[[Image:BS-Shotgunb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jack frantically pumps his shotgun as he confronts the psychotic Dr. Steinman.]]
[[Image:BS-Shotgunc.jpg|thumb|none|600px|With very little time to reload his shotgun, Jack finds himself mired in an intense struggle with one of the Big Daddies - heavily armed guardians of the Little Sisters.]]
[[Image:BS-Shotgund.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After finding a bathysphere, Jack decides to reload his shotgun.]]

=Launchers=
==Home-made Grenade Launcher==
The "Grenade Launcher" is the fifth weapon in the game. It is a custom setup built from common household and industrial parts. The Grenade Launcher seems to be made from one of the many pipes available in Rapture, complete with their Art Deco patterns, a converted handle and trigger to fit that pipe, and various other parts - even including a box of "Home-Grown Asparagus" for the magazine/grenade box. Jack loads the next round by twisting the rear of the gun to the left, which exposes the breech and loads a new grenade from the box, and reloads by replacing the entire module behind the barrel. Ammo is somewhat rare until the final areas, where it suddenly becomes extremely abundant. Luckily, no enemies wield this weapon, though Rosie Big Daddies will often throw proximity mines when attacking, and RPG turrets fire RPGs (which may be heat-seeking like the ones you can get for the grenade launcher). The three ammo types for the Grenade Launcher are:

- Fragmentation Grenades; a very crude concoction of empty sardine cans filled with explosives. After shot from the grenade launcher, these will explode on impact with the nearest enemy or surface - but will often take some time before they explode, and will not explode after hitting the first surface due to their very primitive and simplistic design and manufacture. They are fired in a ballistic arc, so long-distance aiming might be more difficult. Fragmentation grenades are the standard ammo type and by far the most common.

- Proximity Mines; these are a significant technological step up from the regular grenades. These will only explode when an enemy/NPC (including friendly Big Daddies and Little Sisters) enters a certain radius around them - basically anyone except you. These are most effectively used as traps, to set up a defensive radius, or to inflict massive damage in a single attack to enemies who require it (the so-called "Big Daddy Buster"). These also fire in a ballistic arc but adhere to any surface, including walls and ceilings. Since they will also stay in place until detonated (even after transitioning to a different level), proximity mines are ideal for setting up on the known paths of Big Daddies so they take immediate damage and have to hunt you down. These are considerably rarer than the normal fragmentation grenades but also become more abundant towards the end of the game.

- Heat-Seeking RPG; the most advanced and rarest of the ammo types for the grenade launcher. As the name suggests, these projectiles are not only propelled by rockets - so don't follow a ballistic arc - they also actively seek the closest heat source. This is very useful if that closest source of heat are enemies, as you only need to aim in their general direction and the rocket will seek and destroy on its own. However, they will also aim towards fires and other hot masses if they are larger and/or hotter than your target. These are ideal in taking down Big Daddies as quickly as possible, as you don't need to precisely aim; just back away while facing their general direction while shooting RPG's at them from a very long distance. These are also ideal against targets who are not only very far off, but also semi-obstructed from direct line of sight, as well as groups of splicers due to its large radius of damage.
[[Image:Bioshock Grenade Launcher.jpg|thumb|none|500px|The grenade launcher.]]
[[Image:BS-GL.jpg|thumb|none|600px|When coming across the Fontaine Fisheries building, Jack receives a Grenade Launcher via conveyer belt.]]
[[Image:BS-GLb.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jack detaches the barrel from the rear module during the reloading animation.]]
[[Image:BS-GLc.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jack comes across a proximity mine ready for the taking. Armed proximity mines will have a red ring circling around it.]]
[[Image:BS-GLe.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Note that even before the grenade launcher actually fires, the grenade round, which appears to be made with a tin can, spawns, although to the left of the gun's breech.]]
[[Image:BS-GLd.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jack successfully proves to the imbecile of a Big Daddy that what he's shooting at him is no ordinary metal tin can, but an explosive one.]]
[[Image:BS_GLf.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After firing a grenade round, Jack twists the gun's rear to the left to chamber another round. This also happens when the gun is being reloaded or ammo is being switched out.]]
[[Image:BS_GLg.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jack finds a heat-seeking RPG round on the ground for the taking.]]

==Crossbow==
The crossbow is first given to Jack by Sander Cohen while heading to Andrew Ryan's office. It is a lever-action, six round self-loaded crossbow that can fire regular steel-tipped bolts, incendiary bolts, and trap bolts. The most unique of all ammo types, the trap bolt, deploys an electrically charged trip wire on impact and when used effectively, can instantly take out all kinds of Splicers and severely damage a Bid Daddy. When reloading the crossbow, Jack opens the release latch to eject the spent cartridge box holding the crossbow bolts and inserting a new one as he prepares to close the release latch.

=See Also=
*'''Bioshock'''
*[[Bioshock 2]]
*[[Bioshock Infinite]]

[[Category:Video Game]]
[[Category:Science-Fiction]]
[[Category:Mystery]]
[[Category:First-Person Shooter]]

Batman: Arkham Knight

2016-06-16T19:21:25Z

Yocapo32: /* Desert Eagle */

{{incomplete}}
[[File:BAKTitleTemp.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''Batman: Arkham Knight'' (2014)]]

{{Game Title}}

__TOC__ 

=Handguns=
==Glock 17==

The Arkham Knight carries a backup pistol seemingly based on the [[Glock 17]], though heavily stylized, presumably to fit with his futuristic soldier aesthetic. While they seem to be modified in the same way as his Desert Eagles below, and he does indeed carry a pair, further suggesting this, he only pulls them out one of a time, losing the first one when Batman disarms him prior to his boss fight, and then pulling another one at the end of said fight, when his Desert Eagles are knocked away form him. This second pistol is never used again in the game, leaving it's fate unknown.
Second Generation Glock 17s are used by GCPD officers in an attempt to defend themselves from the newly formed alliance between Gotham's mayor villains in the "Father to Son" trailer for the game.

[[Image:Glock17EarlyModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|2nd Generation Glock 17 - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BAKGlock17.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A GCPD officer fires his 2nd Generation Glock 17 into the onslaught of mooks.]]
[[File:ArK-Glock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight holds Batman at gunpoint, seemingly unhappy that he hasn't been able to figure out his secret identity yet.]]

==Desert Eagle==
The Arkham Knight carries a pair of extensively modified [[Desert Eagle|Desert Eagles]] of unknown model, one fitted with a retractable scope and laser sight, and the other with a folding stock, as his weapons of choice. During his boss fight, he somehow combines both of them, extending the scoped one's barrel to around fourteen inches, and turning them into a straight-pull bolt action rifle.
Jason Todd as the Red Hood carries similar weapons, but without the scope nor stock, apparently being straight out of factory weapons, marking the first time since the Joker's playable appearance in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]] that the player is allowed to freely use lethal force to deal with their opponents.

[[File:Desert-Eagle.jpeg|thumb|none|325px|IMI Desert Eagle Mark XIX - .50 AE]]
[[File:Desert_Eagle_Mk_I_14_inch_barrel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Desert Eagle Mark I with 14 inch barrel - .50 AE]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, with his face censored to avoid spoilers, whips around with his Desert Eagles at the ready.]]
[[File:ArK_desert_eagle-stock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After screaming at Batman how he's going to personally kill him for three quarters of the game, the Arkham Knight finally makes good on his threats, extending the stock on one of his Desert Eagles...]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-combined.jpg|thumb|none|600px|...Then extending the barrel on his other one, and locking them together.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-sniper_rifle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, now visorless thanks to Batman destroying it in an attempt to disarm him earlier, poses with his combined pistols before jumping away, beginning the boss fight.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-laser_sight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Apparently, the Arkham Knight was a big fan of Power Rangers S.P.D. when he was a kid.]]
[[File:RedHoodArkhamKnight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jason Todd with two Desert Eagles in a promotional poster.]]

==SIG-Sauer P220/P228R Hybrid==
A strange, almost bizarre amalgamation of several variants of the [[SIG-Sauer P220]], combining the full size and single stack mag of the P220, along with the almost full-length rail of the P228R, along with a slide mounted decocker/safety, appears as the game's most commonly used pistol, replacing the [[Sphinx 3000]] from the previous games. The weapon is proportioned in a extremely cartoonish matter, with grossly exaggerated features, including an extremely over-sized ejection port and a thin, almost comically small grip. Why this design was chosen, given the realistic style of the rest of the game, it's unknown.

[[File:SiGP220RNewModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P220R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:SIG-Sauer_P228R.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P228R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two Face hold the SIG hybrid in his character showcase, showing the massive ejection port and Picatinny rail extending past the front of the slide.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-safety.jpg|thumb|none|600px|An intruder at Wayne Industries, with his face and name censored to avoid spoilers from Arkham City, hold Lucius Fox hostage, showing off the slide-mounted decocker/safety. Also note the lack of a bulged grip, indicating the use of single-stack magazines.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-side.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Christina Bell, one of the people infected with Joker's blood mentioned in the previous game, uses her gun as a pointer while ordering Harley Quinn's mooks around. Rather unsurprisingly, she ends up shooting one of them by accident, as denoted by the subtitles.]]

==Colt Python==
An stainless 4-inch [[Colt Python]] with rubber grips is used by Commissioner James Gordon as his sidearm, replacing the nickle plated [[Desert Eagle]] he carried in the previous games. The revolver is, for some reason or another, not only modeled with a trigger guard relief, but also without a cylinder latch.
Two Face also owns, not surprisingly, a pair of these revolver, one with a stainless finish, and one a blued finish, similar to the ones the character carries in [[Batman Forever]]

[[File:ColtPythonSS.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Stainless Steel Colt Python with 4" Barrel and rubber combat grips - .357 Magnum]]
[[File:Colt-Python.jpg|thumb|none|325px|A blued Colt Python, similar to the one found on Two-Face's display, though lacking the rubber grips]]
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Commissioner holds his revolver in his character showcase, showing off the relieved trigger guard, along with the strangely modeled hammer.]]
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The other side, while out of focus, and further blurred with a simulated chromatic aberration effect, it's still shown clear enough to note that it doesn't have a cylinder latch, making one wonder how is the weapon supposed to be loaded.]]
[[File:ArK_MGL-140_Ugly_Revolver_Thing-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face's cache in the GCPD Evidence Room holds his two revolvers, along with his Milkor MGL from the Catwoman DLC from Arkham City. Strangely enough, he never uses any of these weapons in game, instead sticking with a sawn-off Mossberg 500 instead.]]

==Taurus Raging Bull==
Joker's stylized Raging Bull returns from his DLC in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]], held in a glass case in the GCPD Evidence Room, along with the rest of his gadgets from that particular game. Ironically enough, according to Aaron Cash, the revolver is loaded with five actual bullets, and a single "Bang!" flag, when in it's titular DLC it only had one bullet loaded. Although knowing The Joker, the flag is probably just as lethal as the rest of the ammo in the gun.

[[File:Taurus_Raging_Bull.JPG|thumb|none|325px|Taurus Raging Bull - .44 Magnum]]

=Rifles=
==Colt M4A1==

Multiple [[Colt M4A1]] rifles are used by Harley Quinn's men in the Announce Trailer, some with M203 launchers as well.

[[Image:ColtM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M4A1 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[File:BAKM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Harley Quinn's men fires his Colt M4A1 at a GCPD cruiser.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203(2).jpg|thumb|none|600px|Several goons with M203s attached to their M4s.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face brings his M203 to bear as he spot the Batmobile charging towards him.]]

=Launchers=
==M203==

Several [[M203]] launchers are seen attached to M4A1 rifles. Before he fired the grenade, the editing made it seemed like he pumps the M203 like a shotgun, despite seeing animation of the launcher opening and closing.

[[Image:M203.jpg|thumb|none|375px|M203 grenade launcher - 40x46mm.]]

[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face aims his M203.]]

{{Batman Series}}
[[Category:Video Game]]
[[Category:Third-Person Shooter]]
[[Category:Stealth]]
[[Category:Crime]]

Batman: Arkham Knight

2016-06-16T07:26:15Z

Yocapo32:

{{incomplete}}
[[File:BAKTitleTemp.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''Batman: Arkham Knight'' (2014)]]

{{Game Title}}

__TOC__ 

=Handguns=
==Glock 17==

The Arkham Knight carries a backup pistol seemingly based on the [[Glock 17]], though heavily stylized, presumably to fit with his futuristic soldier aesthetic. While they seem to be modified in the same way as his Desert Eagles below, and he does indeed carry a pair, further suggesting this, he only pulls them out one of a time, losing the first one when Batman disarms him prior to his boss fight, and then pulling another one at the end of said fight, when his Desert Eagles are knocked away form him. This second pistol is never used again in the game, leaving it's fate unknown.
Second Generation Glock 17s are used by GCPD officers in an attempt to defend themselves from the newly formed alliance between Gotham's mayor villains in the "Father to Son" trailer for the game.

[[Image:Glock17EarlyModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|2nd Generation Glock 17 - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BAKGlock17.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A GCPD officer fires his 2nd Generation Glock 17 into the onslaught of mooks.]]
[[File:ArK-Glock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight holds Batman at gunpoint, seemingly unhappy that he hasn't been able to figure out his secret identity yet.]]

==Desert Eagle==
The Arkham Knight carries a pair of extensively modified [[Desert Eagles]], one fitted with a retractable scope and laser sight, and the other with a folding stock, as his weapons of choice. During his boss fight, he somehow combines both of them, extending the scoped one's barrel to around fourteen inches, and turning them into a straight-pull bolt action rifle.
Jason Todd as the Red Hood carries similar weapons, but without the scope nor stock, apparently being straight out of factory weapons, marking the first time since the Joker's playable appearance in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]] that the player is allowed to freely use lethal force to deal with their opponents.

[[File:Desert-Eagle.jpeg|thumb|none|325px|IMI Desert Eagle Mark XIX - .50 AE]]
[[File:Desert_Eagle_Mk_I_14_inch_barrel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Desert Eagle Mark I with 14 inch barrel - .50 AE]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, with his face censored to avoid spoilers, whips around with his Desert Eagles at the ready.]]
[[File:ArK_desert_eagle-stock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After screaming at Batman how he's going to personally kill him for three quarters of the game, the Arkham Knight finally makes good on his threats, extending the stock on one of his Desert Eagles...]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-combined.jpg|thumb|none|600px|...Then extending the barrel on his other one, and locking them together.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-sniper_rifle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, now visorless thanks to Batman destroying it in an attempt to disarm him earlier, poses with his combined pistols before jumping away, beginning the boss fight.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-laser_sight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Apparently, the Arkham Knight was a big fan of Power Rangers S.P.D. when he was a kid.]]
[[File:RedHoodArkhamKnight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jason Todd with two Desert Eagles in a promotional poster.]]

==SIG-Sauer P220/P228R Hybrid==
A strange, almost bizarre amalgamation of several variants of the [[SIG-Sauer P220]], combining the full size and single stack mag of the P220, along with the almost full-length rail of the P228R, along with a slide mounted decocker/safety, appears as the game's most commonly used pistol, replacing the [[Sphinx 3000]] from the previous games. The weapon is proportioned in a extremely cartoonish matter, with grossly exaggerated features, including an extremely over-sized ejection port and a thin, almost comically small grip. Why this design was chosen, given the realistic style of the rest of the game, it's unknown.

[[File:SiGP220RNewModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P220R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:SIG-Sauer_P228R.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P228R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two Face hold the SIG hybrid in his character showcase, showing the massive ejection port and Picatinny rail extending past the front of the slide.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-safety.jpg|thumb|none|600px|An intruder at Wayne Industries, with his face and name censored to avoid spoilers from Arkham City, hold Lucius Fox hostage, showing off the slide-mounted decocker/safety. Also note the lack of a bulged grip, indicating the use of single-stack magazines.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-side.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Christina Bell, one of the people infected with Joker's blood mentioned in the previous game, uses her gun as a pointer while ordering Harley Quinn's mooks around. Rather unsurprisingly, she ends up shooting one of them by accident, as denoted by the subtitles.]]

==Colt Python==
An stainless 4-inch [[Colt Python]] with rubber grips is used by Commissioner James Gordon as his sidearm, replacing the nickle plated [[Desert Eagle]] he carried in the previous games. The revolver is, for some reason or another, not only modeled with a trigger guard relief, but also without a cylinder latch.
Two Face also owns, not surprisingly, a pair of these revolver, one with a stainless finish, and one a blued finish, similar to the ones the character carries in [[Batman Forever]]

[[File:ColtPythonSS.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Stainless Steel Colt Python with 4" Barrel and rubber combat grips - .357 Magnum]]
[[File:Colt-Python.jpg|thumb|none|325px|A blued Colt Python, similar to the one found on Two-Face's display, though lacking the rubber grips]]
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Commissioner holds his revolver in his character showcase, showing off the relieved trigger guard, along with the strangely modeled hammer.]]
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The other side, while out of focus, and further blurred with a simulated chromatic aberration effect, it's still shown clear enough to note that it doesn't have a cylinder latch, making one wonder how is the weapon supposed to be loaded.]]
[[File:ArK_MGL-140_Ugly_Revolver_Thing-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face's cache in the GCPD Evidence Room holds his two revolvers, along with his Milkor MGL from the Catwoman DLC from Arkham City. Strangely enough, he never uses any of these weapons in game, instead sticking with a sawn-off Mossberg 500 instead.]]

==Taurus Raging Bull==
Joker's stylized Raging Bull returns from his DLC in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]], held in a glass case in the GCPD Evidence Room, along with the rest of his gadgets from that particular game. Ironically enough, according to Aaron Cash, the revolver is loaded with five actual bullets, and a single "Bang!" flag, when in it's titular DLC it only had one bullet loaded. Although knowing The Joker, the flag is probably just as lethal as the rest of the ammo in the gun.

[[File:Taurus_Raging_Bull.JPG|thumb|none|325px|Taurus Raging Bull - .44 Magnum]]

=Rifles=
==Colt M4A1==

Multiple [[Colt M4A1]] rifles are used by Harley Quinn's men in the Announce Trailer, some with M203 launchers as well.

[[Image:ColtM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M4A1 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[File:BAKM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Harley Quinn's men fires his Colt M4A1 at a GCPD cruiser.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203(2).jpg|thumb|none|600px|Several goons with M203s attached to their M4s.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face brings his M203 to bear as he spot the Batmobile charging towards him.]]

=Launchers=
==M203==

Several [[M203]] launchers are seen attached to M4A1 rifles. Before he fired the grenade, the editing made it seemed like he pumps the M203 like a shotgun, despite seeing animation of the launcher opening and closing.

[[Image:M203.jpg|thumb|none|375px|M203 grenade launcher - 40x46mm.]]

[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face aims his M203.]]

{{Batman Series}}
[[Category:Video Game]]
[[Category:Third-Person Shooter]]
[[Category:Stealth]]
[[Category:Crime]]

Batman: Arkham Knight

2016-06-16T07:20:38Z

Yocapo32:

{{incomplete}}
[[File:BAKTitleTemp.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''Batman: Arkham Knight'' (2014)]]

{{Game Title}}

__TOC__ 

=Handguns=
==Glock 17==

The Arkham Knight carries a backup pistol seemingly based on the [[Glock 17]], though heavily stylized, presumably to fit with his futuristic soldier aesthetic. While they seem to be modified in the same way as his Desert Eagles below, and he does indeed carry a pair, further suggesting this, he only pulls them out one of a time, losing the first one when Batman disarms him prior to his boss fight, and then pulling another one at the end of said fight, when his Desert Eagles are knocked away form him. This second pistol is never used again in the game, leaving it's fate unknown.
Second Generation Glock 17s are used by GCPD officers in an attempt to defend themselves from the newly formed alliance between Gotham's mayor villains in the "Father to Son" trailer for the game.

[[Image:Glock17EarlyModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|2nd Generation Glock 17 - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BAKGlock17.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A GCPD officer fires his 2nd Generation Glock 17 into the onslaught of mooks.]]
[[File:ArK-Glock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight holds Batman at gunpoint, seemingly unhappy that he hasn't been able to figure out his secret identity yet.]]

==Desert Eagle==
The Arkham Knight carries a pair of extensively modified [[Desert Eagles]], one fitted with a retractable scope and laser sight, and the other with a folding stock, as his weapons of choice. During his boss fight, he somehow combines both of them, extending the scoped one's barrel to around fourteen inches, and turning them into a straight-pull bolt action rifle.
Jason Todd as the Red Hood carries similar weapons, but without the scope nor stock, apparently being straight out of factory weapons, marking the first time since the Joker's playable appearance in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]] that the player is allowed to freely use lethal force to deal with their opponents.

[[File:Desert-Eagle.jpeg|thumb|none|325px|IMI Desert Eagle Mark XIX - .50 AE]]
[[File:Desert_Eagle_Mk_I_14_inch_barrel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Desert Eagle Mark I with 14 inch barrel - .50 AE]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, with his face censored to avoid spoilers, whips around with his Desert Eagles at the ready.]]
[[File:ArK_desert_eagle-stock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After screaming at Batman how he's going to personally kill him for three quarters of the game, the Arkham Knight finally makes good on his threats, extending the stock on one of his Desert Eagles...]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-combined.jpg|thumb|none|600px|...Then extending the barrel on his other one, and locking them together.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-sniper_rifle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, now visorless thanks to Batman destroying it in an attempt to disarm him earlier, poses with his combined pistols before jumping away, beginning the boss fight.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-laser_sight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Apparently, the Arkham Knight was a big fan of Power Rangers S.P.D. when he was a kid.]]
[[File:RedHoodArkhamKnight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jason Todd with two Desert Eagles in a promotional poster.]]

==SIG-Sauer P220/P228R Hybrid==
A strange, almost bizarre amalgamation of several variants of the [[SIG-Sauer P220]], combining the full size and single stack mag of the P220, along with the almost full-length rail of the P228R, along with a slide mounted decocker/safety, appears as the game's most commonly used pistol, replacing the [[Sphinx 3000]] from the previous games. The weapon is proportioned in a extremely cartoonish matter, with grossly exaggerated features, including an extremely over-sized ejection port and a thin, almost comically small grip. Why this design was chosen, given the realistic style of the rest of the game, it's unknown.

[[File:SiGP220RNewModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P220R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:SIG-Sauer_P228R.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P228R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two Face hold the SIG hybrid in his character showcase, showing the massive ejection port and Picatinny rail extending past the front of the slide.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-safety.jpg|thumb|none|600px|An intruder at Wayne Industries, with his face and name censored to avoid spoilers from Arkham City, hold Lucius Fox hostage, showing off the slide-mounted decocker/safety. Also note the lack of a bulged grip, indicating the use of single-stack magazines.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-side.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Christina Bell, one of the people infected with Joker's blood mentioned in the previous game, uses her gun as a pointer while ordering Harley Quinn's mooks around. Rather unsurprisingly, she ends up shooting one of them by accident, as denoted by the subtitles.]]

==Colt Python==
An stainless 4-inch [[Colt Python]] with rubber grips is used by Commissioner James Gordon as his sidearm, replacing the nickle plated [[Desert Eagle]] he carried in the previous games. The revolver is, for some reason or another, not only modeled with a trigger guard relief, but also without a cylinder latch.
Two Face also owns, not surprisingly, a pair of these revolver, one with a stainless finish, and one a blued finish, similar to the ones the character carries in [[Batman Forever]]

[[File:ColtPythonSS.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Stainless Steel Colt Python with 4" Barrel and rubber combat grips - .357 Magnum]]
[[File:Colt-Python.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Similar to the one
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Commissioner holds his revolver in his character showcase, showing off the relieved trigger guard, along with the strangely modeled hammer.]]
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The other side, while out of focus, and further blurred with a simulated chromatic aberration effect, it's still shown clear enough to note that it doesn't have a cylinder latch, making one wonder how is the weapon supposed to be loaded.]]
[[File:ArK_MGL-140_Ugly_Revolver_Thing-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face's cache in the GCPD Evidence Room holds his two revolvers, along with his Milkor MGL from the Catwoman DLC from Arkham City. Strangely enough, he never uses any of these weapons in game, instead sticking with a sawn-off Mossberg 500 instead.]]

==Taurus Raging Bull==
Joker's stylized Raging Bull returns from his DLC in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]], held in a glass case in the GCPD Evidence Room, along with the rest of his gadgets from that particular game. Ironically enough, according to Aaron Cash, the revolver is loaded with five actual bullets, and a single "Bang!" flag, when in it's titular DLC it only had one bullet loaded. Although knowing The Joker, the flag is probably just as lethal as the rest of the ammo in the gun.

[[File:Taurus_Raging_Bull.JPG|thumb|none|325px|Taurus Raging Bull - .44 Magnum]]

=Rifles=
==Colt M4A1==

Multiple [[Colt M4A1]] rifles are used by Harley Quinn's men in the Announce Trailer, some with M203 launchers as well.

[[Image:ColtM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M4A1 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[File:BAKM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Harley Quinn's men fires his Colt M4A1 at a GCPD cruiser.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203(2).jpg|thumb|none|600px|Several goons with M203s attached to their M4s.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face brings his M203 to bear as he spot the Batmobile charging towards him.]]

=Launchers=
==M203==

Several [[M203]] launchers are seen attached to M4A1 rifles. Before he fired the grenade, the editing made it seemed like he pumps the M203 like a shotgun, despite seeing animation of the launcher opening and closing.

[[Image:M203.jpg|thumb|none|375px|M203 grenade launcher - 40x46mm.]]

[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face aims his M203.]]

{{Batman Series}}
[[Category:Video Game]]
[[Category:Third-Person Shooter]]
[[Category:Stealth]]
[[Category:Crime]]

Batman: Arkham Knight

2016-06-16T07:18:02Z

Yocapo32:

{{incomplete}}
[[File:BAKTitleTemp.jpg|thumb|right|300px|''Batman: Arkham Knight'' (2014)]]

{{Game Title}}

__TOC__ 

=Handguns=
==Glock 17==

The Arkham Knight carries a backup pistol seemingly based on the [[Glock 17]], though heavily stylized, presumably to fit with his futuristic soldier aesthetic. While they seem to be modified in the same way as his Desert Eagles below, and he does indeed carry a pair, further suggesting this, he only pulls them out one of a time, losing the first one when Batman disarms him prior to his boss fight, and then pulling another one at the end of said fight, when his Desert Eagles are knocked away form him. This second pistol is never used again in the game, leaving it's fate unknown.
Second Generation Glock 17s are used by GCPD officers in an attempt to defend themselves from the newly formed alliance between Gotham's mayor villains in the "Father to Son" trailer for the game.

[[Image:Glock17EarlyModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|2nd Generation Glock 17 - 9x19mm]]
[[File:BAKGlock17.jpg|thumb|none|600px|A GCPD officer fires his 2nd Generation Glock 17 into the onslaught of mooks.]]
[[File:ArK-Glock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight holds Batman at gunpoint, seemingly unhappy that he hasn't been able to figure out his secret identity yet.]]

==Desert Eagle==
The Arkham Knight carries a pair of extensively modified [[Desert Eagles]], one fitted with a retractable scope and laser sight, and the other with a folding stock, as his weapons of choice. During his boss fight, he somehow combines both of them, extending the scoped one's barrel to around fourteen inches, and turning them into a straight-pull bolt action rifle.
Jason Todd as the Red Hood carries similar weapons, but without the scope nor stock, apparently being straight out of factory weapons, marking the first time since the Joker's playable appearance in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]] that the player is allowed to freely use lethal force to deal with their opponents.

[[File:Desert-Eagle.jpeg|thumb|none|325px|IMI Desert Eagle Mark XIX - .50 AE]]
[[File:Desert_Eagle_Mk_I_14_inch_barrel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Desert Eagle Mark I with 14 inch barrel - .50 AE]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, with his face censored to avoid spoilers, whips around with his Desert Eagles at the ready.]]
[[File:ArK_desert_eagle-stock.jpg|thumb|none|600px|After screaming at Batman how he's going to personally kill him for three quarters of the game, the Arkham Knight finally makes good on his threats, extending the stock on one of his Desert Eagles...]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-combined.jpg|thumb|none|600px|...Then extending the barrel on his other one, and locking them together.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-sniper_rifle.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Arkham Knight, now visorless thanks to Batman destroying it in an attempt to disarm him earlier, poses with his combined pistols before jumping away, beginning the boss fight.]]
[[File:ArK_Desert_Eagle-laser_sight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Apparently, the Arkham Knight was a big fan of Power Rangers S.P.D. when he was a kid.]]
[[File:RedHoodArkhamKnight.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Jason Todd with two Desert Eagles in a promotional poster.]]

==SIG-Sauer P220/P228R Hybrid==
A strange, almost bizarre amalgamation of several variants of the [[SIG-Sauer P220]], combining the full size and single stack mag of the P220, along with the almost full-length rail of the P228R, along with a slide mounted decocker/safety, appears as the game's most commonly used pistol, replacing the [[Sphinx 2000]] from the previous games. The weapon is proportioned in a catoonish matter, which grossly exaggerated features, including an extremely over-sized ejection port and a thin, almost comically small grip. Why this design was chosen, given the realistic style of the rest of the game, it's unknown.

[[File:SiGP220RNewModel.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P220R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:SIG-Sauer_P228R.jpg|thumb|none|325px|SIG-Sauer P228R - 9x19 mm]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two Face hold the SIG hybrid in his character showcase, showing the massive ejection port and Picatinny rail extending past the front of the slide.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-safety.jpg|thumb|none|600px|An intruder at Wayne Industries, with his face and name censored to avoid spoilers from Arkham City, hold Lucius Fox hostage, showing off the slide-mounted decocker/safety. Also note the lack of a bulged grip, indicating the use of single-stack magazines.]]
[[File:ArK_SIG_Handcannon-side.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Christina Bell, one of the people infected with Joker's blood mentioned in the previous game, uses her gun as a pointer while ordering Harley Quinn's mooks around. Rather unsurprisingly, she ends up shooting one of them by accident, as denoted by the subtitles.]]

==Colt Python==
An stainless 4-inch [[Colt Python]] with rubber grips is used by Commissioner James Gordon as his sidearm, replacing the nickle plated [[Desert Eagle]] he carried in the previous games. The revolver is, for some reason or another, not only modeled with a trigger guard relief, but also without a cylinder latch.
Two Face also owns, not surprisingly, a pair of these revolver, one with a stainless finish, and one a blued finish, similar to the ones the character carries in [[Batman Forever]]

[[File:ColtPythonSS.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Stainless Steel Colt Python with 4" Barrel and rubber combat grips - .357 Magnum]]
[[File:Colt-Python.jpg|thumb|none|325px|Similar to the one
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The Commissioner holds his revolver in his character showcase, showing off the relieved trigger guard, along with the strangely modeled hammer.]]
[[File:ArK_Gordon-Ugly_Revolver_Thing-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|The other side, while out of focus, and further blurred with a simulated chromatic aberration effect, it's still shown clear enough to note that it doesn't have a cylinder latch, making one wonder how is the weapon supposed to be loaded.]]
[[File:ArK_MGL-140_Ugly_Revolver_Thing-Dent.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face's cache in the GCPD Evidence Room holds his two revolvers, along with his Milkor MGL from the Catwoman DLC from Arkham City. Strangely enough, he never uses any of these weapons in game, instead sticking with a sawn-off Mossberg 500 instead.]]

==Taurus Raging Bull==
Joker's stylized Raging Bull returns from his DLC in [[Batman: Arkham Asylum]], held in a glass case in the GCPD Evidence Room, along with the rest of his gadgets from that particular game. Ironically enough, according to Aaron Cash, the revolver is loaded with five actual bullets, and a single "Bang!" flag, when in it's titular DLC it only had one bullet loaded. Although knowing The Joker, the flag is probably just as lethal as the rest of the ammo in the gun.

[[File:Taurus_Raging_Bull.JPG|thumb|none|325px|Taurus Raging Bull - .44 Magnum]]

=Rifles=
==Colt M4A1==

Multiple [[Colt M4A1]] rifles are used by Harley Quinn's men in the Announce Trailer, some with M203 launchers as well.

[[Image:ColtM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M4A1 - 5.56x45mm]]
[[File:BAKM4A1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|One of Harley Quinn's men fires his Colt M4A1 at a GCPD cruiser.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203(2).jpg|thumb|none|600px|Several goons with M203s attached to their M4s.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face brings his M203 to bear as he spot the Batmobile charging towards him.]]

=Launchers=
==M203==

Several [[M203]] launchers are seen attached to M4A1 rifles. Before he fired the grenade, the editing made it seemed like he pumps the M203 like a shotgun, despite seeing animation of the launcher opening and closing.

[[Image:M203.jpg|thumb|none|375px|M203 grenade launcher - 40x46mm.]]

[[File:BAKM4A1M203.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face is handed an M4A1 with an M203 launcher.]]
[[File:BAKM4A1M203Aim.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Two-Face aims his M203.]]

{{Batman Series}}
[[Category:Video Game]]
[[Category:Third-Person Shooter]]
[[Category:Stealth]]
[[Category:Crime]]