Internet Movie Firearms Database - Guns in Movies, TV and Video Games - User contributions [en]

Talk:Forty-Four Mutineers

2012-05-24T02:14:11Z

Spades of Columbia: /* weird poster */

==weird poster==
Wouldn't "Čtyřicet čtyři" be more correct? [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 20:24, 23 May 2012 (CDT)

If we were simply translating a number yes it would be more correct...but since this is a movie page we should have it as IMDB recognizes it to be...or we could call it "Aufstand wider den Tod" and be more correct then your original correct :)--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 21:14, 23 May 2012 (CDT)

Talk:Live Free or Die Hard

2012-05-23T22:32:25Z

Spades of Columbia: /* odd choice */

==Goofs?==

Anyone else notice that he fired off, what, how many magazines in Farrells house before running out of ammo, like ten, or what?
:I believe it was four mags, instead of 3 since he would have two in the pouch and one in the gun, so that was a mistake. What is more notable is how he fires close to 20 shots from each mag despite them only holding 7 shots each. Anyone notice how in the first film he managed to keep his Beretta loaded all the way to the end and here he wastes all his ammo in one firefight? If he had carried a "friend in need", a backup gun, he likely wouldn't have been left defenseless in the apartment once his SIG ran dry. Last thing, in the theatrical edition he tells Farrell he destroyed the helicopter with the car because he was out of bullets but he tells Matt he has mags in the glove compartment when they leave his apartment. In the unrated version, they changed what he said and this error went away.
9hi , one thing , the car that he uses isnt his , he gets hit by the garbage truck , then gets picked up by agent johnson. simmons 8492)
*** It could of been the 9mm p226 which holds 20 rounds per magazine.***
:A P226 holds 15 shots, not 20. And it has been confirmed as a P220 by the armorer of the film.

Can't a person get a 20 round mag for a 226? Also, wouldn't a 220 have to be his off duty weapon? The NYPD only allows 9mm and 38's.

:''I'd imagine they could, if one made such a magazine for that gun. And as for what the NYPD allows, real life =/= this movie. The gun's been long confirmed to be a P220R. So, in the Die Hard universe, that's what he was issued or allowed to carry.'' --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 20:19, 24 March 2009 (UTC)
::Also, in regards to what is permitted by NYPD, McClane as a senior detective (he has been on the force for decades) probably has more freedome in what he can carry than an average patrol officer.
:::Mauser currently made a 20 round magazine for the SIG P226 using super-new spring technology, but that's in 9mm. You can't fit 20 rounds of .45 ACP into a standard magazine and not have it extend way past the grip. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]

::Regarding the "I was out of bullets" remark, I'm guessing that probably had nothing to do with how much ammo he fired. That was probably just for humor. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 23:24, 8 October 2009 (UTC)

==Who did it first - ''Die Hard'' or ''Lethal Weapon''?==

Not to say that you're wrong, but wouldn't the ''Lethal Weapon'' movies be just as much of an influence on the guns popularity in the US? I mean, ''Lethal Weapon'' came out a year before ''Die Hard'' and Mel Gibson and Danny Glover talk specifically about the the Beretta in the beginning. "9mm Beretta, 16 in the mag, one in the pipe,..."Danny Glover.

Not that it really matters, but Glover said 15, not sixteen. It would be 16 total bullets, but only 15 in the mag. This would also be true in real life, as all 92 mags only hold 10, 15, 17, 18, or 20 rounds. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 10:22, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

I think both movies were equally influential in increasing the popularity of the 92FS. But, from my experience at least, Die Hard was the movie that made me want a 92FS from the age of 8 until I got one at 26.
::Hmmmmm. I already had several 92F pistols when I saw Die Hard in the theaters....[[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 09:54, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

''OK, have at it.'' --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 05:25, 17 March 2009 (UTC)

:::Then there's the fact that by the time ''[[Lethal Weapon]]'' came out, two ''[[A Better Tomorrow]]'' movies had already been released, both featuring the Beretta 92F prominently. BTW, interesting story I heard...has anyone ever noticed that there aren't too many Berettas in movies made in the U.K. during the 1980s (such as the James Bond movies of the time)? Apparently, this is because Bapty & Co.'s Beretta 92Fs and Taurus PT92s were rented out to so many Hong Kong productions in the '80s that they were never in inventory for use by domestic productions. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:42, 24 October 2009 (UTC)

== F-35 ==

The STOVL version actually ''doesn't'' have an internal gun, it mounts it in a ventral pod like the Harrier. I still don't think it has two like the Harrier does, so the page is right about it being inaccurate on that front. [[User:Dongs|Dongs]] 19:44, 20 June 2009 (UTC)
::I actually know nothing about jets so I used all the information I could find on Wikipedia and IMDB. Hopefully I did a good job. :) - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
:::You did pretty good. Got some things wrong though but who i am to judge? I don't know nothing about jets either. I'm more of a Army and Marines guy.-[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 20:16, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

well on like both of you i am a preaty big plane experet and some countries ( Canada norway and turky) but not USA are planeing to put two internal guns for a ground attack variant. --[[User:Armyguy277|Armyguy277]] 13:10, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

I've added corrected info about the gun pod and it's location. --[[User:Sidewinder Forge|Sidewinder Forge]] 05:23, 18 December 2011 (CST)

:Corrected you slightly. I don't believe there was any clear information on where it was going to be mounted back in 2007, since I couldn't find any back when I was searching in 2009. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 05:36, 18 December 2011 (CST)

==Sad to see it Go==
Anyone else saddened by the loss of Mclanes old Beretta for this new film? I'm not knocking the SIG P226, but the Beretta is Mclanes iconic pistol, and it deserved more then just a we cameo. [[User:M14fanboy|M14fanboy]]
:He actually uses a SIG P220, not a P226. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 01:01, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
:I would much rather see him use a P220 than his old, rattletrap Beretta-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 01:24, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
::I think everyone knows you hate Beretta's, S&Wshooter. No need to keep going on and on about it. McClane started with a Beretta 92 he should have finished the series with one. It's basically like Dirty Harry not using a S&W Model 29. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 02:17, 25 November 2009 (UTC)
: I think it would have been cool to see Mclane use a Beretta Px4 Storm-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 02:30, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

::Um..................he does. Have you seen the page??? -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 02:39, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

:''I think it would have been cool to see Mclane use a Beretta Px4 Storm''

:Is that a joke?

:[[Image:LFDH-BerettaPx4-3.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

:Also, your profile says you hate SIGs, too. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:59, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

:Oh I totally forgot about that part. I don't hate SIGs as a whole, just how all the weight is at the top of the slide and that they are really fucking expensive (I'm '''BROKE''' and if I spend the amount that a SIG goes for, it'll be for a nice Smith and Wesson revolver-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 04:01, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

::"Part"? He uses the PX4 Storm for half the damn movie! How can you be an IMFDB member if you don't read the page? Ugh...

::Anyway, as for SIGs, the weight on the slide is a consequence of SIG stupidly switching to those cheaply and crudely CNC-milled slides on all their guns since 1996. Earlier SIGs, like my West German stamped-slide P226, are much less top-heavy. So, stick with the P228s and the older-model P220s and P226s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 04:28, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

:For whoever is pissed about me forgetting a part of a movie that I only saw once, shut up. As for the SIG discussion, I find that the P239 is a pretty nice gun, even though I haven't fired it, and their Hammerli pistol is an excellent target pistol-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 04:38, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

9x19mms and .38s are cute and all, but i prefer .45, particularily the MK23 [[SargeOverkill]]

::OMG, so you only saw the movie once; haven't you looked at this page? We've got 7 pics of the Beretta!! BTW, thanks for the info on the SIGs, MT2008. :) -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 00:14, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

:::I'm not "pissed", sorry if I came across that way. But I just think it's hilarious that you're on a site which identifies guns in movies, and you constantly complain about guns you hate on this site, and yet you take NO time to actually read the site that you post on. You gotta admit it's hilarious. But whatever. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:14, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

:It's not that I didn't read the article, it's that I haven't read it in a month or so. I read every article that I see, so you are wrong- I do read the site I post on. I'm not going to hold your assumption against you, however, because you had no way of knowing that this is the third site I check whenever I go online-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 02:27, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

While I'm sad to see the Beretta go, since it's my favorite series of handguns (and I'm not particularly interested in getting into an argument over it), I do have to say that it was kinda cool that they had McClain acquire one of Beretta's latest pistols, as sort of a throwback to his original. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 10:28, 12 February 2010 (UTC)
I think the P220 could be the one choosen because Live free or Die is New hampshire's state motto and SIG pistols are made here.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:41, 3 March 2010 (UTC)

I was mad too, because I've always identified the 92F/FS with [[Die Hard]]. I was pretty much just mad because of the P220. I think of the .45 Automactic COLT Pistol cartrige as American. I'm just like that... the only .45 ACP I like is the [[M1911 pistol series]]. Let's not get into a big fight over it though. 9mm all the way for me.--[[User:Yo dawg 111|Yo dawg 111]] 09:28, 2 January 2012 (CST)

==Watch used==

I was looking at another site and discovered the brand of the watch, worn by Emerson. It is handmade in Switzerland and sells from $15,000.00 to $70,000.00, depending on options. That is quite a watch for a thug to have.

[[Image:LFDH-MP7A1-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Emerson points his Heckler & Koch MP7A1 at McClane.]]

Well, quiet honestly, the watch is probably owned by the actor, and was just included in the movie because the actor was wearing it while they were shooting. I don't think they expected moviegoers to look up the kind of watch he was using.[[User:Acora|Acora]] 10:26, 12 February 2010 (UTC)

::Not for a major motion picture. The Props and Wardrobe department usually have everything for the actors, including their watches, ready so that an actor doesn't surprise everyone by showing up with a duct taped "hello kitty" watch. ;) Everything, down to the socks (but NOT the underwear) are usually provided by wardrobe (in BIG movies) because any delay caused by something weird that the actor wore from home, costs time and money. Sure, an actor can request to have his own personal watch in a scene, but personal property is many times, not protected from loss by the production insurance if a prop watch is provided and rejected. It can be either way, but usually major motion pictures provide everything so that if there is loss or damage, they have a BOX full of backup watches to slap on the actor for the sake of continuity. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 22:38, 26 February 2010 (UTC)
::PS, as for the watch costing tons of $$, either they have a deal with the manufacturer to provide watches (like they do for James Bond Movies, tons of product placement on those films), or they use the tons of counterfeit or nonfunctioning watches available from prop houses. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 22:39, 26 February 2010 (UTC)

Okay, I think I understand. Thanks for clearing that up. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 19:26, 27 February 2010 (UTC)

That is a Patek Phillipe watch. Expencive? You betcha!!

==Holster==

Any Chance at someone identifing what Brand/type of Shoulder Holster John uses? [[Spades of Columbia]]

If I were to guess it looks like a Galco shoulder rig of some kind, possibly a Galco Jackass. Very very comfy rig, I have one for a P226. If they are fit correctly they are incredibly comfortable to wear. --[[User:Cool-breeze|Cool-breeze]] 18:42, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

==PX4==
How do we know it was a 45? [[24guns]]

I was thinking the same. I was looking at the screenshots and the bore size doesn't look big enough to be a .45 to me. But there aren't a lot of hugely clear shots of the bore to make a positive identification. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 15:01, 17 September 2011 (CDT)

Nobody said it was or wasn't a .45 in the first place anyway.[[User:Kornflakes89|Kornflakes89]] 02:14, 18 September 2011 (CDT)

It's been changed now but when I looked yesterday it did actually say in the Px4 section that it was a .45 ACP version in the film. But like I said today it's been changed to 9mm. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 05:26, 18 September 2011 (CDT)

==Glockity Glock==
Were the full size Glocks used in this actually 22's? I mean we see lots of pages where people think that Glocks use by FBI in films are actually 22's. Lots of the time they are wrong. And on this page it said, I quote '''"They are noted as such by their muzzle diameters and by the fact the FBI actually carries Glock 22s in real life."''' Of course it's another thing if they have been verified as such by the film's armorer (who apparently has generously given info on some of the other weapons used in the film). So, have they been confirmed as 22's by the armorer? Just wanna know, this thing's been bugging me for a while :) --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 19:00, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

:I dunno, but yes, we shouldn't justify it by the fact that the FBI carries Glock 22s in real life. The bore size is a legit argument. But I'd have to ask Steve if they were G22s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:07, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

In the screenshots on here if you look really closely it looks like it says 17 on the slide, but it's hard to tell. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 18:33, 2 April 2011 (CDT)

== Sticking Mags ==
Has anyone ever had the problem of sticking mags as shown in the movie, not just in a P220R, but in any gun.--[[User:MarineCorps1|MarineCorps1]] 22:54, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

:Never seen it with SIGs or any metal framed pistol, but I've seen it happen with Glocks (especially older Glocks loaded with older, well-used mags). Sometimes, the heat from firing the weapon repeatedly can cause structural distortions to the mags after extended use that cause them to rub against the inside of the grip, so that they won't drop clear of the gun when released unless you shake the weapon. The problem can be compounded by excess powder getting blown back into the action. And remember that blank ammunition (as used in this and other movies) burns much, MUCH hotter than live rounds and also make the weapon's action much dirtier, so I'm guessing that means you're more likely to see movie blank-adapted pistols experiencing the problem of sticking mags than live ones. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:07, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

::One other thing I forgot to mention...the structural damage to the mags which cause them to "stick" can also come from them being dropped repeatedly. Sadly, guns and mags tend to experience FAR more abuse on movie sets than they would in real life. The movie armorers on here will tell you that actors will sometimes "improvise" and drop or throw down real guns (rather than the fake rubber "stunt guns" that are normally used for such purposes). It's possible that in the case of this movie, Bruce Willis kept ejecting his mags and letting them hit the floor rather than catch them, and over time, they got damaged and started "sticking" in the P220. And if his treatment of the MP5 in ''[[Die Hard 2]]'' is any indication, Bruce Willis treats weapons pretty roughly. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:13, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

:::How easy is it to switch the mag release on those SIGs? That also could have have been the problem. One thing I noticed on my P220 if the magazine hasn't been seated in all the way (it will look like it is, but is a little bit out) you'll have to pull it out by hand or probably shake it out. Another thing since they knew the mags were going to be dropped on the floor they probably used shit or damaged mags as Matt said. Did Bruce mistreat a real MP5 or was it a fake one? But I think the worst gun mistreatment goes to Stallone in Rambo 3 with the M60. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 20:27, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

::::I haven't tried to switch the mag release on my own SIG, but I'm pretty sure that's not the issue. Not to mention that I imagine they made sure the mag releases worked smoothly on all of the P220s (there was more than one used on-set) when they reversed them for Bruce Willis.

::::''Did Bruce mistreat a real MP5 or was it a fake one?''

::::I haven't been able to find out from any of the armorers on here, but I'm pretty sure it was a real MP5 that he threw down after he fired blanks at Dennis Franz. I say this because (1.) he ejects the magazine out of the weapon before he throws it down, all on-camera (rubber MP5s don't have magazines that you can remove), and (2.) most rubber MP5s have filled-in front sights due to the casting process, but the MP5 he throws down doesn't. So I think Bruce actually threw a real MP5 ''hard'' on the ground in that scene, and I'm guessing that this was an improvisation and also that Mike Papac must have been angry at him afterwards. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 22:02, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

The reason for the Magazines Sticking is a very simple one: When you eject a mag normally, it just drops to the floor straight down. In a stylish action movie, this looks boring. Having Bruce Willis dramatically flip or throw each mag out of the gun and send it spinning into the air is more exciting that just Push-button-clack-floor. As I always say, if it's worth doing, it's worth overdoing.-Cutter9792, 12/18/2011

Regarding the catching the mags or letting them drop, if I was fighting for my life, the magazine's condition is the least of my worries. Mags are replaceable, my life isn't.--[[User:Yo dawg 111|Yo dawg 111]] 09:32, 2 January 2012 (CST)

I think McClane was just stressed at the opening shootout and therefor shakes the magazine out in order to make it drop faster. When Mai later disarms him, she pops out the magazine with no trouble at all...

== Missing Gun ==

When McClane chases the Terrorists to the Warehouse at the end, he shoots one of the Hackers. Even though he was just a Hacker, the camera points down to the Gun he's holding to show why McClane shoots him. It looked like a Beretta 92F, purhaps the same Gun from the previous films.

That was the Beretta 92G Elite 1A. Used by Trey([[Jonathan Sadowski]]).

== Left Hand Shooters ==

I couldn't tell, but it looked like the slide lock was ambi on Mclane's P220. I know that this isn't factory availible. The grip would have been screwed up because the grip is fat where the slide lock is on a normal SIG. Can anyone confirm this, or did I screw this up.--[[User:Yo dawg 111|Yo dawg 111]] 09:37, 2 January 2012 (CST)

== odd choice ==

I got the opportunity to see an old friend and we watched all 4 [[Die Hard]] movies in a row. He then said we should shoot his [[Beretta 92FS]] and [[SIG-Sauer P220]]. I shot the 220 left handed like [[Bruce Willis]] and had SERIOUS difficulty releaseing the slide left handed. maybe I'm just bad off-hand or it seems like a poor choice for a lefty. Before on this page I said maybe the 220 had ambi slide controls but after looking into this I couldn't find anything that said it was possible. Do any lefty shooters have issues with reloading SIG P220 and other weapons from that series?--[[User:Yo dawg 111|Yo dawg 111]] 17:24, 6 April 2012 (CDT)

you also have to remember that it is designed as a slide lock back not a slide release...most hardcore training still teach you to release the slide by reaching over and pulling back on the slide with a loaded magazine in it.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 17:32, 23 May 2012 (CDT)

Talk:Anne Parillaud

2012-05-18T02:46:38Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Photo */

Talk:Justified - Season 1

2012-05-17T21:01:14Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Please help ID this rifle */

An interesting note is that in te episode bulletville after killing the two
Men sent to kill him Raylan can be seen putting what appears to be a sig ( you can see the hammer) into his holster but is never seem again after words

== Please help ID this rifle ==

I'm not sure about this rifle. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 22:49, 16 May 2012 (CDT)

[[File:JustS1E13 12.jpg|thumb|none|800px|]]
[[File:JustS1E13 11.jpg|thumb|none|800px|]]

Looks to be a Ruger M77 MKII. --[[User:Lynx|Lynx]] 00:05, 17 May 2012 (CDT)

it is for sure the Ruger M77 MKII SS Skeleton Stock.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 16:01, 17 May 2012 (CDT)

Talk:Smith & Wesson

2012-04-27T02:28:54Z

Spades of Columbia:

I'm going to be traveling for the next few days so I may not get much work done on this page until next week. --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 23:12, 4 January 2012 (CST)

I find it odd that the Model 41 has not made a movie or tv appearance.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 21:23, 26 April 2012 (CDT)
Nevermind...now i fell like a idiot...Léon (The Professional)--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 21:28, 26 April 2012 (CDT)

Talk:Smith & Wesson

2012-04-27T02:23:57Z

Spades of Columbia:

Talk:The Walking Dead (TV Series)

2012-03-23T19:44:02Z

Spades of Columbia: /* The guns of the survivors */

==OTHER==
That's Norman Reedus with the crossbow. He plays Daryl Dixon, who was not in the actual comic that I can recall. I like that though, he's a cool actor. I'm also a little bummed that they didn't use the guns drawn in the comics. Rick uses a HK mk.23. For those of you who might think that it's impossible to tell that from the comic the artist wrote HK MK.23 on the barrel. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

:I read some where that the Walker are attracted to loud noises. that might be why he is carrying a crossbow

It is smart to use a crossbow; because it saves on bullets and in most all undead literature and movies the undead always react and swarm when they hear a gunshot. Very good show, have never read the comic but look forward to.-GoshMr.Peabody

It's pretty amazing. I recommend buying the trade paperbacks. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

Not only does a crossbow save on ammo and is silent, crossbow bolts can be retrieved and reused repeatedly before they bend, dull, break, or otherwise can't be used any longer. In effect, Daryl has essentially a near-infinite source of ammunition. As for Rick, I think the Python suits him better. It has personality, the Mark 23... not so much. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:43, 27 February 2012 (CST)

==Whoa==
I loved the comic, when the hell did it get a tv show?

The idea was revealed a while ago. It comes out on Halloween. -SasquatchJim

honestly , its like two hours till the show ,i cant wait. simmons 8492

Well it kept my interest. I'll watch it again next week to see if it can maintain the momentum.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 18:30, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

honestly it took some time to realy get things going , but now hes in a populated zone with other survivers . and if i was him id start that tank up! simmons 8492

I coulda sworn the 50 on that tank was still loaded with ammo and in the next scene, it had no ammo [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 01:30, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

Just watched it again. The .50 on the tank doesn't appear to be loaded, but there's another one in a sandbag fort that is, in the foreground as he goes by. -IGemini 04:15, 4 November 2010 (UTC)

iv watched it from the start and i have to say its great simmons 8492

== Crappy dialogue ==

In the trailer, one of the cops told the other to make sure he had a round in the chamber and that his safety is off. First off, the man he was talking to, had a Glock, so no safety. And since he's a trained cop, ready to open fire on a suspect that's hostile, why wouldn't he have a round in the chamber and his gun ready to go? That line just threw me off [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 22:58, 3 September 2010 (UTC)

Hey guys, just watched it. Its brilliant, easily as good as the comic. The 'crappy dialogue above does jar a little tho. Hes telling him to make sure he had a round in the chamber and that his safety is off as it is implied the officer in question is a bit useless, however after doing a brass check the officer in question then presses down on the slide release (even tho the slide is forward) as if to pretend it is the saftey catch. Morgan has a 5 shot snub revolver (which someone else will have to identify as im not too good with em). Rick pull a 92fs (standing in for an m9) from a dead soldiers shoulder holster at the end of the episode, and i'm fairly sure the SIG is a tutone P228 or 229 not a P239 --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 00:21, 22 October 2010 (UTC)

:Maybe Basset is so damn useless that he hasn't even figured out that Glocks don't come with manual safeties... --[[User:Euromutt|Euromutt]] 07:28, 25 June 2011 (CDT)

The funny thing about the thing with the safety is that you can hear the sound of a safety being click off.--[[User:Mattattack07|Mattattack07]] 04:03, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Remember that the dialogue was written long before it was decided the cop would be holding a Glock(unless the writer is Michael Mann). So maybe the round in the chamber thing may have been unwarranted, but maybe he was a rookie, he did seem sort of skittish. Regardless, it's unfair to call ''that'' crappy dialogue. I think you're letting your knowledge of guns get in the way of enjoying good stories.--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 04:32, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Dont know if its worth noting, but the cop he tells that too, is actually, the first zombie he ends up shooting, after leaving the police station. Rick commented he was careless and dumb, so reminding him, makes sense.

And, of course, Rick committed a cardinal sin; he referred to a magazine as a clip :P -SasquatchJim

I'm not surprised, Sasqatch. The cop I talked to called his Glock 17 a "Glock 9". I'm sure he would have said clip to. Not all cops are into guns. Haha

:He also could have meant "Glock 9mm", you know, since "9" is common shorthand for 9mm. When has anyone referred to .45 ACP as "11.43mm"? Hell, I once had a conversation with a Korean War vet about 1911s and when I referred to the cartridge by its dimensions, he had a dumbfounded look on his face and "corrected" me, telling me that the 1911A1 was "a 45, not no 11-something". [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:51, 27 February 2012 (CST)

==SIG P239==

[[Image:WalkingDead-SIGP239.jpg‎|thumb|none|500px|A chase suspect emerges from the wrecked car firing a two-tone SIG P239 at police.]]

This doesn't look like a P239 to me; more like a P226 or P228. It's too big, and it has nickel controls (which the two-tone P239s don't have). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 01:45, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
:P228 because of the slide length. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 01:49, 1 November 2010 (UTC)
::Remember, on low resolution screencaps like the ones I had to use, feel free to correct the Gun IDs. :) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]]
::: Watching the scene I agree that it is somewhat larger. Sounds fine to me - I'll change it. The first episode was pretty good. I'm adding a Beretta 92FS (M9) entry - Grimes indeed takes one off a 'dead' soldier inside the Abrams tank he gets into, as noted by the above section. Also, I never did get a good glance at the snub revolver, though I'm fairly certain it's a S&W. They're replaying the show so I'll keep an eye for it, and some of the other guns. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 02:21, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

==Spoiler Comment and Morgan's Revolver==
Its nice to see the page updated but arn't some of the descriptions (mainly the colt python) a bit spoilerific for anyone who hasn't watched it yet? --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 04:07, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

:: Whoa, yes they are, I sure as hell didn't add those. :b I'll reword them somewhat. Also! The revolver Morgan uses is a Snub S&W Model 66, I can almost guarantee it. Bah, wish I could get screencaps. Still, I'll add that as well. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 04:34, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Are you sure its a 66? I remember it having a 5 round cylinder --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 04:52, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

I grabbed this off my skyplus box so sorry bout the quality [IMG]http://i53.tinypic.com/2i700fm.jpg[/IMG] Any use, its definatly a 5 shot--[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 04:58, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

: I could have ''sworn'' it was a S&W. But it's definitely not a Model 66, since there's no rear adj. sights, nor of course a 6-shot cylinder. But Smith snubbie J-frames (5-shot) all have flat 'bull-nose' ejector rod shrouds, not curved. Bah, now I'm kinda stumped. My best guess at this point would probably be a [[Ruger SP101]]. Convert that image there to JPG and upload it on the site. It's not great, but it's better than nothing. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 05:05, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

::Looks like it could also be either the [[Taurus Model 617]] or possibly a stainless steel [[Taurus Model 85]]. Biu it is difficult.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 12:45, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

From the barrel it looks like an early Taurus Model 85 in stainless or nickel plated. It was a five shot cylinder definitely.[[User:GaBoy45|GaBoy45]] 17:11, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

: After posting I did consider it being a Taurus, many of them are awfully S&W looking to begin with. I doubt it's a 617 but it easily could be an 85. Hell, could be anything for all I know at this point. I guess it'll just be another 'unidentified' until we get more/better screencaps. I'll modify the S&W 66 entry I posted and just call it un-ID'd snub revolver, noting the 5-shot capacity and stating the possible choices. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 17:34, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

I am almost certain it is actually a Ruger SP101, two inch model. No other snubbie, as far as I know, has the upper rear of the frame shaped into a rear sight notch like the SP101, as both of those Taurus models just lack rear sights - you can check the Taurus website as both models lack a "rear sight" category under specifications. Also, if you check out the behind the scenes vid [http://www.amctv.com/originals/The-Walking-Dead/?bclid=625294007001&bcpid=111717822001&bctid=628200502001 here], there is a pretty decent side shot of the revolver. The general shape is very close to a SP101, and even from the front, the lines on Morgan's triggerguard and barrel are cut much closer semi-melted look on the SP than the very sharp ones on a Taurus oR S&W.

All said, the easiest way to tell would be if they showed the damned cylinder release at some point. --[[User:John 234|John 234]] 07:41, 8 November 2010 (UTC) (Corrected typo --[[User:John 234|John 234]] 02:35, 9 November 2010 (UTC))

: It's not an SP101. The recoil shield shown is a simple traditional shape, not the bulkier contours Rugers have in that part of the frame. Also, the ejector rod shroud is cut back more sharply from the muzzle, and the revolver in the show seems to lack the small hole on the front of the frame for the front crane lock. [[User:Rule .303|Rule .303]] 14:56, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Judging by the screens uploaded I'd say definately not a 617, 617 is a 7-shot, also can't see a ported barrel. Still think it's a Taurus though. [[User:ZombieKiller|ZombieKiller]] 09:22, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

If you watch the Making of the Walking dead Season 1 it shows the side of the revolver.. Looks exactly like the Ruger SP101 from Breaking Bad. I'm guessing its the same prop. (Just like I think the RV is. )

: It's definately not a Ruger SP101. As to the comment of the SP101 being unique with regards to the rear notch site. Nope. All snubbies have that. I have both the Taurus 85 (old shape) and the Taurus 85 Stainless. Looks much more like that due to the unique underlug on the revolver. Also look at the SP101's front. http://www.dayattherange.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/sp101target8.jpg Definately not what we are seeing in these screen captures. [[User:Potentpoefie|Potentpoefie]] 07:25, 19 November 2011 (UTC)

It appears to be a Taurus 405 to me. Looks large-bored, probably .40S&W so that would match the 405. The front sight is tiny from that back angle which also matches the 405, the cylinder backing plate is the same etc. krispic 21:36 Feb 22 2012

== What kind of tank was that? ==

Its oviously a stand-in for an M-1 but I'm not sure what it is. I'm thinking possibly a Chieftain, but I'm not sure. Also, note that a real M-1 woulnd't have worked for the scene since it lacks the floor escape hatch.

-AC.

:I'm also reasonably certain the 82nd Airborne Division doesn't have tanks in their TO&E, yet the (un)dead soldier in the tank had an 82nd patch on his left shoulder. --[[User:Euromutt|Euromutt]] 07:32, 25 June 2011 (CDT)

Well i would imagine that in the chaos of the zombie apocalypse lots of soldiers ended up with other units doin jobs they aren't really trained for.

Actually smaller units are frequently attached (I believe the Brits call it seconded) to other units for mission purposes. Some armor battalions spent the whole campaign in France (WW II, 1944-1945) being attached to various infantry units - to include the airborne. After all the elements of the 9th and 10th armor divisions that were in Bastogne during the siege fell under the 101st Airborne for the duration of that battle. Funny how the airborne mafia always seems to forget about all the ''other'' troops that fought in that battle. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 13:17, 23 August 2011 (CDT)

At this point I'm not sure, but I do suspect it's the same tank that shows up in ''[[Zombieland]]''. Both shows are filmed in Georgia and the voice-over commentary on ''Zombieland'' states that the tank is owned by a private collector.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 16:34, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

Definately a Chieftain.

: I concur, Chieftains are often used (mocked-up) as stand-ins for Abrams tanks. I also noticed the bottom escape hatch, which as far as I can recall, indeed isn't on an actual Abrams. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 23:49, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

''Other comments posted on main page-''

(Perhaps it is just me, but the Abrams featured in this appears to be a mocked up British Chieftain Tank, I didn't get a good look at the tank but it didn't seem to be a genuine Abrams, although it could simply be an older pattern M1 without the TUSK upgrade, reactive armor and the more apparent loaders hatch. Yet that would not explain the escape hatch.- Doc345)

Older M1s didn't look that diffrent, from the later ones, aside from the most recent upgardes.

Also, the angle of the frontal turret armor is wrong to be an M1.

I think this may be the same tank which appeared in, among other series, Jericho. The vehicle, if I remember correctly, is built on an old Centurion chasis to resemble an Abrams with some obvious differences. --[[User:Charon68|Charon68]] 00:06, 9 November 2010 (UTC)

On a random note, where was a Striker seen in the episode? It says on the page that there was one with a fifty cal on it, but aside from the tank, the only other military vehicles I saw where some HMMWVs, what looked like a deuce, and a half, and some abandone Hueys.

Intrestingly, in the trailor, the one Rick first sees after leaving the hospital lacked a rotor blade making me think it was edited in post-production. Also, the one off to Ricks left appears to still be lacking one.

-AC

at the begging seen when the main cerictor walkes out of the hospital he sees a ebandoned military equpent you can see a Stryker IFV --[[User:Armyguy277|Armyguy277]] 21:33, 9 November 2010 (UTC)
heres a picture
[[Image:The walking dead.png]]

I can say without a doubt that the 'M1' ''is'' a Chieftain, not a Centurion. The long sloping frontal 'nose' armour, the front idler wheel and the lockers/storage bins are features of the Chieftain, not the Centurion. Not too sure about the 'escape hatch' though. I wonder if this is the same 'M1' that appears in the 2010 remake of Red Dawn? It looks the same to me. [[User:Spanner|Spanner]]

*Naw, that one they've actually made some modifications to like building up the hull and turret to be more Abrams-like and putting an M1-style bulge over the cylindrical fume extractor. This is just a Chieftain with a fake M2 awkwardly perched on top of the hatch weapon mounting. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 09:07, 25 June 2011 (CDT)

== Things I noticed ==

Did anybody else notice that when Morgan cocked the hammer back on his gun and threatened to shoot Grimes if he didn't talk, the cylinder didn't advance to the next chamber like it should?

And what about Grimes' personal arsenal in his backpack? Is it safe to assume that rubber/resin mockups? He was getting bounced pretty hard by that horse and the guns kept bumping him in the back. That's at least 40 pounds of gear to be carrying around.

More than safe to assume that. Most of them even appeared to have solid barrels. Probably rubber.--[[Special:Contributions/99.48.50.70|99.48.50.70]] 04:04, 24 November 2010 (UTC)

The cylinder did rotate, I remembered that happening when I watched the scene. As far as the bag -o- guns, I have no idea. If they were all rubber, they were modeled after some hard to find shotgun configurations and looked very real. --[[User:Yournamehere|Yournamehere]] 20:59, 2 November 2010 (UTC)

According to Grimes in episode 3 his duffle bag was holding six shotguns, two "high powered" rifles, a dozen handguns, and 700 rounds of assorted ammo. That's easily 80-90 pounds of gear. There's no way Grimes could be carrying that around in one hand with a gas can in the other. Or getting bucked and having the bag sag to the side and the stuff not come falling out.

Did anybody else notice that Dale seemed to switch between carrying a rifle with a sling, to carrying one without a sling between scenes?

== I rewatched the first episode. ==

Two of the Sheriffs deputys from the neighboring county had shotguns. One looked like and 870 Remington. The other looked like a Mossberg.

The gun used to shoot Rick, I'm pretty sure was either 1911, or a Glock. It seemed to have an extended slide.

-AC

:: I noticed the shotguns too but it was hard to get a decent look at them, mainly the second one (Mossberg I guess). I will concur at least one of the other shotguns was indeed a standard 870. No idea what the pistol is/was. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 16:19, 3 November 2010 (UTC)

Almost positive the other two deputys, from the neighboring county had Glocks, like the other deputys from Ricks department.

You can see one of the shotguns fairly well, after Rick gots shot, one of the two deputys joins Shane in trying to help Rick. Like Shane, he drops his gun, and it can be seen fairly well.

Looking at the pick on here, I'm more positive than ever that the last gunmans weapon was a 1911.
Good eye on my part, since it was litreally visible for like less than a second.-AC.

==Andrea's gun==
I believe Andrea is packing a Smith and Wesson 3913 Ladysmith [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

:I concur. -[[User:The_Winchester|Winn]]

Here's a good picture. http://blogs.amctv.com/photo-galleries/the-walking-dead-season-1-episode-photos/episode-2-rick-andrea.php
[[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

:: I also agree about it being a 3913 Ladysmith. We also saw a M67 'baseball' grenade in this latest episode (actually the training version, you could still spot some blue paint on it). [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 05:21, 8 November 2010 (UTC)

== What kind of rifle did Meryl have? ==

Looked like possibly a Model 70, but I'm bad at identifing bolt actions.
-AC

Seriously, does anyone know what kind of rifle he had?-AC

Compare the bolt heads (or whatever the end of the bolt closest to the butt is called); the Remington 700 seems to have more of a protruding portion, while the Mod. 70 is tucked in and more square-like.

At least, that's what it seems like. There used to be a generic page for comparing Bolt-Action Rifles, like the shotguns have now. Where did that page go?

Here it is.

[[Bolt Action Rifles - Most common Sporting Models|Scoped Bolt Action Hunting Rifles]]. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 01:52, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

==Shane's Pistol==
Can anyone identify the pistol Shane is carrying? It looks like either a Glock or possibly a Sig Pro. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

Probally a Gock. There very common cop guns, in both hollywood, and real life. Also, severael of the cops, at opening shootout had them, so evedently the prophouse they went to had some.
-AC

Definitely a Glock. Although it's only shown briefly, it looks like a 17. He carries it in a thumb break holster. [[User:Mmarlon brando|Mmarlon brando]]

Picture of him holding it: http://blogs.amctv.com/photo-galleries/the-walking-dead-season-1-episode-photos/episode-4-carl-lori-shane-morales.php

After looking at the screenshot on the main page, can anyone identify the holster?

In the finale you can see its a Glock 19. Not 17. (Also the firing M4s looked like they had blank firing adapters as flashiders)

Definitely a 17 in the last episode when shane opens the barn doors and shhots all the walkers he fires too many rounds for it to be a 19

This is getting tiresome now, stop identifying guns based on the amount of rounds that they fire! It's a TV series where in editing they can easily make a 15 round magazine last for 80 rounds (see John Woo films) --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 05:27, 2 January 2012 (CST)

==Merle==

It's Merle not Maryl or Marle

==Guts==
I really like how Rick actually checks the dead soldier's vest for more ammo instead of just taking the weapon like every other film. I also like how when his Beretta runs dry he doesn't toss it away like some generic action hero but he keeps it and stows it in Glenn's backpack. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 02:03, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Oh yeah, that was good stuff. Have yet to see the Beretta again though. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

:Did you also notice that his [[Colt Python]] is still in his hoslter even though he ran out of ammo for it? I liked that touch as well. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 14:29, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

You never know what you might find ammo for at a latter date.-AC
::Which he does in the third episode. Anyway Python's are too expensive to be tossing away on a whim. Even after the Zombie Apocalypse has happened. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 17:32, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

If I recall right they've been outta production since the late 90s.

::The last Python was manufactured approximately six years ago. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 18:30, 16 November 2010 (UTC)

Still outta production than. If I recall right, for a while it was outta generael production, but could be special ordered.

Yes the last five or six years it had to be ordered through the custom shop.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 01:54, 18 November 2010 (UTC)

The Python, and The Anaconda, where the best revolvers Colt made since the SAA imho-AC

IMO, the Official Police and Detective Special should be included as well. -SasquatchJim

Too bad that still fully loaded .50 next to the tank is too heavy to take back [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:16, 22 November 2010 (UTC)

If he can walk and ride a horse with a 90lb bag on his back like its nothing, he could carry a M2.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 01:44, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

And he brought buddies with him to GET that bag he left behind. They can lug around an M2 with ammo. Sure it doesn't look like there's any extra, but it's an M2 with AMMO! [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 03:11, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

But honestly, what would be the purpose, in this story? I mean, they're already getting guns and ammo, and it's not like you need a lot of penetration to kill a zombie, so they don't really need a .50 caliber machinegun. All it would really do was kill a couple of zombies while making a shitload of noise, attracting every zombie in a mile radius. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 05:04, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

: I bet one would've come in handy on top of the camper during the attack on the camp. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 04:07, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
::Possibly (I posted that before I saw that episode, sorry.), though I doubt any of them have any training or even any practice with military grade machine guns, and so I'm betting that during the chaos of the attack, they would have killed more of their own people. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 02:43, 1 December 2010 (UTC)
::: Woulda been kinda hard to use that thing in the dark, too, since the only source of light is that campfire. Scoring headshots on zombies without friendly fire in a situation like that? No way even TV-land can pull THAT one off.

Talking about scavenging guns, even when they were rushing back to the vehicles in front of the CDC wouldn't it have been a good idea to at least grab a couple of the discarded weapons lying around out front?

==Vatos==
Ok, tonight I think I've seen a S&W model 10, a Colt Detective Special, and possibly a S&W mosel 28 in the hands of the mexican gangsters and it looks like T-Dog was using a BAR. The bag had some Sigs and Glocks and Daryl had a Remington 870 and I think that Rick is using a Mossberg 590 not a 500. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

Just so everyone knows, I didn't edit the page tonight, I just wrote on here. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

Daryl took at least one Sig from the bag. T-Dog used a Mossberg later, but I think his scoped rifle was a BAR. The shotty Glenn ended up with, looked the same as Daryl's. Also, Shane drew his pistol at one point, but it was hard to see.-AC
==Daryl's Crossbow==
Daryl Dixon's crossbow is a Horton Scout HD 125: http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2817217&cid=CSE:GoogleProductSearch. In the fourth episode "Vatos", when Daryl points it a T-dog on the roof you can see the faded Horton logo on the front. Scout 125 can be seen above the trigger after the camera angle changes. [[User:Mmarlon brando|Mmarlon brando]]

::Picture added and changes made. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 19:20, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

== Was that an XD? ==

The handgun, that Daryl takes from the bag of guns. At first I thought it was a SIG, but after rewatching it, I think it may have been a Springfield Army XD.
-AC

Nope, definitely a bi-tone Sig of some kind.

Yeah, the XDs don't have all that stuff on the side of the gun and the slide is actually more Glock like than the more rounder Sig slides [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 17:36, 28 November 2010 (UTC)
[[Image:Walkingdeadsig.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Rick Grimes ([[Andrew Lincoln]]) inspects a bi-tone Sig Sauer handgun from his bag of guns.]]

- ZeoRanger5 17:20, 27 November 2010 (UTC)

that looks like a SIG-sauer P226 or P228. simmons 8492

I agree with simmons 8492, i'd say p228 myself.

How did you think that was an XD?--[[User:Jackie.45Cal|Jackie.45Cal]] 14:48, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

Not sure. When I stuck it in his waistband, it looked like a combination between a Sig, and a Glock. As far as handguns go, I'd say the XD is closest to that description. Course I was rather sleep deprived at the time.-AC

i also think that in episode 5 shane pulls what looks to be a sig when the sister is coming back to life . im not sure because i know shane has a glock but this isnt in the holster , its carried mexican style and is only seen for seconds. can some one verify ?[[User:simmons 8492|simmons 8492]]

Rick also pulls a gun carried similarily in that scene. Ricks looked like a Glock.

but shanes looks more like a sig or something .[[User:simmons 8492|simmons 8492]]

Some ones gotta move that pic into the 228 spot.[[User:simmons 8492|simmons 8492]]

:It's not a P228. The screencap doesn't show it well, but I checked the episode again, and it's possible to see that it has the squared trigger guard of the P226, rather than rounded, as on a P228. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 23:16, 28 January 2011 (UTC)

==Faking recoil==

Its a littlle overdone but nice to see it (a HP in 9mm doesnt kick as much as shown, but its better than most shows, and handling is pretty good or tv.

may be because he hasent realy fired a 9mm in a while he wasnt use to it or because hes used to the revovler

That makes no sense, .357 Magnum (I'm guessing thats what is loaded) has alot more kick, if he can handle a .357 than he could easily handle a 9mm.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 23:02, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

and im sure that a python has more kick than that highpower . and being that he killed a hand full of zombies with that in the first episode it wont matter .-[[User:simmons 8492|simmons 8492]]

:Just a FYI, its Hi Power, not High Power.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:07, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

/AUA

Since most people don't know the distinction between a Hi-Power and a Colt M1911, and the show is known to have certain..flaws when it comes to reality, they could have just been assuming that it was a .45, and Hollywood logic states that if it's larger than 9mm, it makes your wrist fly up and sends bad guys flying.

Or it was just because they wanted Rick to seem cool with a stainless steel firearm (like his Colt Python, which he points at other survivors so often, it could be a drinking game).

But being seriously, this is the same show where Glocks have external, slide-mounted safeties in the US and headshots can be made off-hand with a sidearm at 50 meters while running.

AUA/

:I haven't been able to watch the series only the first episode (no cable) but... The Python is a heavy revolver and could be loaded with .38 Specials. Also with the Hi-Power being a semi-auto and able to shoot more rapidly. Would have more perceived recoil. Seeing guys on YouTube handle .45s with very little recoil, it's shotguns and full auto rifles where movies get recoil wrong. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 02:34, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

==DShK heavy machine gun?==

I believe there was an abandoned DShK heavy machine gun flanked by sandbags when they headed towards the CDC building by the looks of the muzzle. (This was the best episode so far, I think.) - Angel_956

Most likely a mocked up M2 but I definatly saw that distinct muzzle brake.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:20, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

I added a cap but you cannot really tell one way or another if it is a mock up or not. Either way...it makes no sense for it to be there in the first place!!! --[[User:Charon68|Charon68]] 23:46, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

That's exactly what I was thinking. Why would an outdated Soviet Union machine gun even be in the show, but it might be cleared up in the next episode. I clearly remember the guy in the CDC building saying something about some French soilders, I think. If so it might of meant that there was an international response to the zombie outbreak, trying to control it, explaining the DShK. [[User:Angel_956|Angel_956]]

:Now your just over-analyzing, it's in all likeliness what they used because it's what was available to use when they were shooting the scene. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 05:46, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

:Maybe somebody "requisitioned" (read: looted) it from the National Infantry Museum or Fort Benning; both are in or around Columbus, GA, which isn't exactly close to Atlanta, but it's the closest place I can think of where you might plausibly find a DShK. When you need more HMGs, you grab what's available. --[[User:Euromutt|Euromutt]] 20:18, 24 June 2011 (CDT)

Weird though, since they obviously had M2s available for filming.-AC

:Not necessarily. Armorers can change during filming and weapons may not be available even though they were previously. Also remember that only the first episode had the M2 so the armorer could have changed since then. --[[User:AdAstra2009|AdAstra2009]] 22:43, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

::Actually, those M2HBs are still there in episodes 2 ("Guts," when Grimes escapes from the tank) and 4 ("Vatos," when Glenn goes to retrieve the Bag O' Guns) and they pass at least two M2HBs on the way to the CDC's front door after they pass the DShK. They weren't just there for the pilot. --[[User:Euromutt|Euromutt]] 09:18, 25 June 2011 (CDT)

My thought was militia that made a last stand with the army to protect the people gathering at the CDC (notice the weapon is surrounded by bodies in civilian clothes), the DShK having been purchased by one of the members (legitimately or otherwise) and subsequently put to use following the outbreak. - Wolfblade670

Maybe the Russians dropped in tom VDV to help protect the CDC. -Jakezergling

:I, umm, highly doubt that... - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 03:30, 7 September 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, Russia would have enough trouble fighting the Walkers on their own turf, considering that Russia is easily 2 times the size of continental United States. Besides that, do the Russians even use the DshK anymore? I do believe it's been phased out by the Kord since the late 90s/early 2000s. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 18:18, 27 February 2012 (CST)

== Daryl's knife ==

In the third episode, when Daryl is told about his brother, he attacks Rick with some sort of hunting or combat knife. He's later seen with it in a sheath on his left thigh, and you get a fairly close (But very brief) look at it when they're walking through the building at the beginning of the forth episode. Anyone have any clue what it is? I mean, from the brief glimpse I got of it in the forth episode, it looked like it was possibly a TOPS Steel Eagle 107C, the same kind of knife that the character Royce had sheathed in Predators, but I'm not sure. Can anyone confirm, or give an alternative? [[User:Acora|Acora]] 07:42, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

It's actually a Busse Combat Team Gemini with a bead blasted finish and black and tan layered g10. Gerber is now supplying knives to the show as well, as seen in the season 2 premiere when Carl finds a full roll in and abandon vehicle. The list of models is on their FB page. [[User:Mmarlon brando|Mmarlon brando]]

: I would agree that Daryl does have a Busse Combat Team Gemini. A clear profile-type photo of Daryl's knife was featured in the "story sync" for the eighth episode of the second season on the AMC website. Here's a link to that image: http://www.amctv.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/208-17.jpg --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 12:24, 23 February 2012 (CST)

== What kind of gun did he give Morales? ==

He said it was a .357, but I have no idea what it was.-AC

/AUA

He held it in his hand for a profile shot; maybe you should try screencapping it at that point and going from there. There should be an ID for it though, unlike Morgan's snubnose.

AUA/

I lack the equipment needed to screencap.-AC

/AUA

Use IrfanView (freeware) or the PrtScn button on your computer (press it on the frame you want to capture, and then paste it into Paint to crop it).

AUA/

I think it's a Smith and Wesson 586 [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

== Rick's second shotgun.==

After Rick gives the 590 (it wasn't a 500, someone should change that) to Guillermo, he uses one with an 18 inch barrel, a blued type finish and wood furniture. I think some people commented on it being a Mossberg, but it has a rounded bolt like a Remington 870. However, it's not an 870 since the trigger guard isn't round enough, the magazine tube is longer than the standard 4 shot tube, and it doesn't have an extension attached, and the wood furniture has a single rib on the side for gripping. After doing some research, my best guess is that it's an earlier H&R Pardner Pump, possibly in some sort of police configuration. I know it's neither a Mossberg or a Remington, though.

It's indeed an H&R Pardner Pump. The humpback receiver is unmistakable. [Ballistics_Expert2]

/AUA

I'd PrtScn/screencap the shotgun in question before making any comparisons. We still haven't definitively IDed Dale's bolt-action, so maybe you should get one of that as well.

AUA/

We still have Merles bolt-action as well.
-AC

This cap from the page will suffice:

[[Image:WD870ep05.jpg‎|thumb|none|500px|Rick with his Remigton, when he and Shane patrol the woods (Episode 5).]]

And a link to a Pardner Pump configured similarly:
http://i271.photobucket.com/albums/jj131/TRguy/Guns/NEFPardnerPumpYouth8-12-10.jpg

A few things distinguishing the shotgun in the picture as a Pardner Pump as opposed to an 870, 500 series, or whatever:

-Some type of thin rib on the top of the barrel.
-The foregrip has the distinctive groove in it as seen on the Pardner Pump.
-The agnle that the receiver curves at the butt end is a sharper angle rather than a bend type (you can tell by the shadow).
-The magazine tube is longer than a 4 shot, but it's not screwed on like other models, nor does the endcap and barrel link resemble that of other models.

Some other things that you can't notice in the picture, like the flatter trigger guard or a good shot of the angled receiver, are seen in the series very easily, namely in Episode 5 during Rick and Shane's patrol, when this cap takes place, and one instance in Episode 6 where the doctor is drawing blood and the gun is sitting behind Rick as he waits. This good enough? --[[User:Yournamehere|Yournamehere]] 10:08, 6 December 2010 (UTC)

::I think you're right, it's not a Remington, Mossberg, or a Winchester. It looks like a Pardner, more like the Pardner pump compact, due to the shorter barrell. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 23:43, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

-Rick's first shotgun was a 500 with the extended tube. It didn't have the bayonet lug, just check some of the promo pics on imbd.com - [[User:MarkXIX|MarkXIX]]

Ah, so it is, I could have sworn I saw the 590s tube cap on it. I can notice a buncha stuff on an H&R, but I get that wrong, lol. --[[User:Yournamehere|Yournamehere]] 17:47, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

Rick's shotgun, from the end of Vatos and on, was a Pardner Pump, but I don't think it was a 20 gauge. Sometimes, hunting model guns can have the vent-rib barrel cut down, to where it is a riot shotgun. I see that as being more plausible. --[[User:1897Reloaded|1897Reloaded]] 11:46, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

==Think its funny==

Rick misses several close range shots (so do long gun toting officers) in the beginning against chase suspects, then later in series hes nailing headshots left and right....

Noticed that too, although zombies don't shoot back. They just charge straight ahead.

/AUA

It's a screenplay-direction thing. The show is already a bit overdramatized in general, so little things like the 'clip' and 'safety' dialogue or the headshot ratio aren't really all that important to the screenwriters, at least not compared with inserting dramatic bits into it.

AUA/

When the police were shooting the chase suspects, their targets were live people. An accurate marksman or not, if you're not used to firing live rounds at live humans your subconscious may not want you to hit that kill shot. Zombies are different.

also he has had weeks of shooting live targets ie the zombies so he as probaly leared to shot them really well --[[User:Armyguy277|Armyguy277]] 20:21, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

/AUA

Unless you're superhuman, you can't learn how to make a shot that is off-hand, behind you, at a 1.5 x 1 ft target at 50 meters, while RUNNING, in a few weeks. Few people would be able to make that shot, period. The gate-zombie shots were just...unfeasible.

AUA/

*Well it is a show about the dead walking around and eating the flesh of the living. I'm willing to overlook the amazing skill that Rick displays with headshots.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 17:28, 20 June 2011 (CDT)

==Question about Shane's shotgun technique==
Just a question for those who may know, is it considered proper technique to hold the gun that high on the shoulder, with his cheek resting on the receiver? I figuered it was an adjustmant made due to the M4-style stock, as Rick and other survivors wielding unmodified weapons don't do this.

: I noticed that too, I figured it was just the actor's preference (possibly due to inexperience) but I guess it could be because of the M4 stock. I dunno. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 01:39, 1 December 2010 (UTC)

:It's standard practice in the US military. They teach you to ride the stock high so that your sights are level with your eyes. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 13:56, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Thats with the M16/M4, not a shotgun.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:58, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

:the stock on the shotgun is a Knoxx Industries SpecOps NRS Shotgun Stock

::My dad has one on his 870.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:59, 5 December 2010 (UTC)

-i noticed that . i dont think that stock has a single thing to do with it . it probably prefrances [[user:simmons 8492|simmons 8492]]

Considering the US military teaches you do to that with a M4, the stock is pretty much the same as the M4 so I could see why he's doing it. Also I don't get the feeling that any of the actors are really inexperienced, they all seem to be trained well in regards to weapons. Least Rick and Shane do.[[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] 22:18, 8 March 2012 (CST)

==Series Finale==

I noticed a nickel finished pistol tucked into Daryl's waistband mexican style early on in the episode, looked like a SIG.
I'm thinking that Daryl's pistol was probably the same Hi-Power Rick took off merle in episode 2.

Does any one else think the grenade description is a bit of a spoiler as it is a deus ex machina. I suggest only saying it is used in episode 6 and not how. I know this has absoloutely nothing to do with firearms but i loved the ax decapitation amidst the headshots at the end --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 02:39, 7 December 2010 (UTC)

:The grenade wasn't a deus ex machina, but a textbook example of Chekhov's gun. He found it in the first episode even. It would have been a deus ex machina if they found it there.(I expected him to actually bring it out against the guys in the city in episode 3, myself)--[[User:Mr-Jigsaw|Mr-Jigsaw]] 08:28, 8 December 2010 (UTC)

Hi, New guy here. When Jenner allows the the others to enter the facility at the start of the episode, he's seen holding an M4, and he mentions that "There're a lot of these lying around. I familiarized myself." And yet, none of the others ever even think of finding a couple of the guns for themselves. Shame, considering a couple of those and a few mags would've come in pretty handy outside (especially if there was a suppressor to be found) Anyone else bugged by this?

They've been sitting outside for like a month. The M4 is a fine, gun, but you need to clean it regularly.-AC

:Only if your in the desert sand, sitting around like that outside would be fine but not how I would store my guns.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:32, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

I was definitely bugged by this fact. Supposedly a lot of M4s and 30 round magazines lying around, and Jenner's the only guy who has one. But then again the supply of ammo might've been low, considering everything that'd happened. [[Ballistics_Expert2]]

first off all there are no M4A1`s seen inside all out side wicth iswere he probily got it second they were only out side for a few momints ehter runing away from the bulding or trying to get in before they are over welbed with zombies tird as he said ammo is preety rare as you can see when they are out side there are hunderdes of dead zombies witch had to be killed by something --[[User:Armyguy277|Armyguy277]] 19:51, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

== To Do List. ==

1. Shotguns used by deputies in opening shootout.
2. Morgans revolver.
3. Merles rifle.
4. The guns, Rick, and Shane pull after Amy turns.
5. The gun given to Morales.
6. Daryls handgun.
7. Whether Shanes Glock is a 17 or 19.
8. Whether Ricks first shotty was a 500 or a 590.
9. Ricks second shotty.

I miss anything?-AC

==Short Season Huh?==

At least season 2 will be twice as long, whenever they get around to making it.....

At least there will be a seaon two, I thought this was a miniseries at first and was very dissapointed that it was over so soon. [[Special:Contributions/67.187.27.89|67.187.27.89]] 01:45, 10 December 2010 (UTC)

It's definately already in production. Normally when a series gets picked up production on the second season gets rolling ASAP. This became a pretty popular show, show I'm guessing AMC got the ball rolling right away when they realized they had demand for the show. Anyone here read the graphic novel series? I want to try and get into it but want to know if it's worth the time and money--[[User:Burgershot621|Burgershot621]] 05:09, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

They really are worth it. I buy the trade paperbacks, they are like $12.00 a book. There are 13 of them up to now. [[User:humanzie3|humanzie3]]

Personaaly i prefer the graphic novels. Dont get me wrong i love the series, but the comics are much more grim and dark, in the series everyone seems to be more willing to get along and its more zombie orientated, the comics are much more grim, its about the characters and in the comic no characters are safe, even mainstay ones. The tv series feels slightly more commercialised and main characters have outlived their comic book life already. I do love the tv version, and darly dixion is the best non comic character creation to be added to the series, I just hope Carl gets a gun next series, that said and cant belive i have to wait till october to see series 2.- Captain Snikt [[Special:Contributions/109.157.4.163|109.157.4.163]] 23:58, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

== Popular Cop Guns ==
An answer above said that the Glock was "a very common cop gun, in both hollywood, and real life." This is true, but I was wondering if their were any other cop guns in hollywood and in real life that are as popular as the Glock.--[[User:MarineCorps1|MarineCorps1]] 21:49, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

The Beretta 92 is the only one that comes to mind for me. -SasquatchJim.

:There aren't too many police depts issuing the Beretta 92F anymore, even though Hollywood still shows them being carried by cops. Anyway, Glock holds just under 2/3rds of the U.S. law enforcement market, SIG-Sauer holds about 1/3rd, and a number of other makes (S&W, H&K, Beretta, etc.) are constantly fighting each other for what's left. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 16:00, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

SIG-Sauer P226, S&W M19/66, AR-15, and many more... --[[User:nkingman|nkingman]]

Ah, that's right.
Some older ones include the S&W Model 10, S&W Model 28, Colt Trooper, and a 12 gauge pump shotgun (namely a Remington 870.)
Another new one is the S&W M&P -SasquatchJim

There was once a time when the S&W Model 15/67, the S&W Model 13/65. Colt Official Police, Ruger Six Series revolvers, the S&W Model 19/66 and the Colt Lawman/Trooper Mk III were also very popular Cop revolvers.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 14:40, 28 March 2011 (CDT)

== Flash suppressor on M4A1 ==

Did anyone else notice the flash suppressor on the M4A1 held by the soldier that gets grabbed is different than normal?
:I thought it was a nongun.--[[Special:Contributions/129.89.179.105|129.89.179.105]] 01:22, 19 December 2010 (UTC)(thePotShot)
::Just for reference,
::[[Image:M4A1nongun.jpg|thumb|500px|none|M4A1 Non Gun]]--[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 11:58, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

:::Yeah, it's a Non Gun M4. Look at the range at which he's shooting at his comrades. Blanks are dangerous if an actor is shooting at other actors who are that close, so they probably had to use the Non Gun instead. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:57, 22 January 2011 (UTC)

:Actually, the Aimpoint M68 CCO (in this case I believe it is a Comp M2 or ML2) can be used with the foreward lens cover closed. Used in this method, it forms an occuladed eye-sight, which were one of the first types of weapons optics employed. Using an occuladed eye-sight is very similar in principle to the BAC method employed in some Trijicon ACOGs, both eyes are left open and due to the way the brain processes images from the eye, what the left (or right eye sees) downrange has the red dot from the other eye (which is looking down the sight) superimposed on it. This is useful as there are rumors that the red dot (particularly in the Aimpoint family) can in fact be detected from in front of the weapon due to the intensity of the light, espiecially in night battle conditions. So the sceintist might really know what he is doing, but it is just as likely it was a mistake by the prop department.[[User:SAWGunner89|SAWGunner89]] 22:17, 1 March 2011 (UTC)

== I liked Rick's reaction when he pulled the pin on the grenade in the last episode ==

He was thinkin "ohshitohshitohshitohshit" and then hauled ass outta there haha. I liked that little detail, along with him getting knocked off his feet as he tried to get as far away from it as possible, instead of the clichè "walk slowly towards the camera as a bomb goes off behind you with a bad-ass grimace on your face". This show had a lot of nice little details like that. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 03:46, 28 January 2011 (UTC)- Yeah but its a grenade bro, you have like what 7 seconds so you can't walk away slowly from it..and also the building was about to total..-jake

Yeah, I liked that too. i hate when like the everyday joe can slowly walk away from a huge explosion,[[User:Simmons 8492|Simmons 8492]]

I like the way that he pulled the pin and had the "Oh my GOD!" moment when he suddenly realised that he needed to run fast. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 07:49, 2 July 2011 (CDT)

== Season 2 ==

Anyone seen the trailer yet for the second seaons? It's been out for a few weeks now. I jus--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 19:57, 11 August 2011 (CDT)t thought it was interesting that it hasn't been mentioned here.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 19:57, 11 August 2011 (CDT)

I don't have the equipment for getting screencaps from TV, but the revolver Daryl took from the camper who committed suicide looks like either a Colt Cobra or Detective Special. The structure doesn't look right for being a S&W Model 10 or Model 36/37. And the slender grip profile and lack of an ejector rod housing eliminates the possibility of it being a Taurus.
--[[User:Ballistics_Expert2|Ballistics_Expert2]]

I was rewatching the season 2 premier episode and I noticed something that irked me a bit concerning the scene at the tent where Daryl found the Colt revolver. This is a series known for a great deal of firearms safety and consideration. But here we have an example of typical Hollywood gun handling. Nobody checked to see how many live rounds were in it, they just assumed it was still loaded and ready to be used. For all we know Daryl handed Laurie an empty weapon for taking on the trail back to the RV.
--[[User:Ballistics_Expert2|Ballistics_Expert2]]

==Gerber Bag of Knives==

Carl ([[Chandler Riggs]]) found this bag in the first episode of the second season which contained six different gerber tool knives and machetes.

[[Image:Gerber-Zombie-Apocolypse-Knives.jpg|thumb|none|500px| So long as you use a knife, there's still a little love left.]]

In the Season 2 props video on the AMC website, they explain the endorsement and show some of the gear. The prop master also gives a look at Rick's character specific items, which includes a [http://www.amazon.com/Gerber-31-000582-Modified-Partially-Serrated/dp/B004DT26ME/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1319921541&sr=8-2 DMF Folder]. --[[User:Mmarlon brando|Mmarlon brando]] 15:58, 29 October 2011 (CDT)

Some of this bag is anachronistic though, as the knives were not invented until after the zombie apocalypse destroyed humanity, and presumably the Gerber factory. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 19:21, 29 October 2011 (CDT)

How do you know that though? As far as I can remember there hasn't been a date mentioned for when the zombie apocalypse happened, it could be set in the very near future. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 01:30, 30 October 2011 (CDT)
:What I meant is that some of the knives have been released since the series started airing, and I'm assuming that the first episode wasn't set in the future. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 04:41, 30 October 2011 (CDT)
::Fair enough. I do think of it like well they haven't really set an actual date on when it occurs so anything "new" that shows up in the show is either there to look cool or it's there for some sort of product placement. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 12:33, 30 October 2011 (CDT)
:::Or both. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 12:35, 30 October 2011 (CDT)
:::: Touche --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 18:08, 30 October 2011 (CDT)

== Morgan's Revolver ==

The revolver that Morgan uses is a S&W model 60

:It can't be the Model 60 because of the curved ejector shroud. [[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]] 13:38, 21 November 2011 (CST)

== Season 2 spoiler-ish descriptions ==

I feel like a lot of the description "updates" on the guns used (or re-used, as applicable) in Season 2 are giving too much info away. Definitely enough to qualify as spoilers to some people (like me). One shouldn't need to narrate the scene and context in which the gun appears, at least not to the extent some of the descriptions are- especially if it's giving away future happenings.

== M4 ==

I think the caption about the doctor not noticing the covers for the M68 is a little of a moot point. The doctor stated he wasnt familiar with the weapon, and simply picked it up when soldiers started dying or running away. -MissySummers-

== Dave and Tony's guns ==

In the eighth episode of the second season - "Nebraska" - two newcomers walk into the bar where Rick and Glenn found Hershel drinking alone. The strangers introduce themselves to Rick, Glenn, and Hershel as Dave and Tony. I had a difficult time identifying these two guns that Dave and Tony had. Dave's gun looked to me like it might be a SIG-Sauer P226. Tony's gun looked to me like it was some sort of sawn-off double-barrel shotgun - maybe an over/under style double barrel shotgun too. Did anybody get a good look at either one of these guns? [[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 12:52, 21 February 2012 (CST)

After watching the episode "Triggerfinger" it looks like hershel picked up Dave's pistol which looked to me like a SIG-SAUER P228 to me. And the big guy had a cutdown pump shotgun that I think was a Remington 870 and Rick was duel weilding it with his Python when they left the bar. The kid on the roof appeared to a have a bolt action rifle but it never showed a clear pic.

: I just watched the "Nebraska" and "Triggerfinger" episodes again back to back. I would have to agree with you now on Dave's gun. It appears that Dave actually did bring a SIG-Sauer P228 into the bar in the "Nebraska" episode. I got a better look at this gun in the "Triggerfinger" episode when Hershel was armed with it. I could tell this gun was a P228 because the trigger guard was curved instead of hooked like the P226 has, plus the barrel and slide on this gun were shorter than what the P226 has. I looked very closely at Tony's shotgun too, but I don't agree with you on this one. There's no way it could have been a Remington 870. I would still say that it is a sawn-off, over/under, double barrel shotgun. (Just my opinion here, but a sawn-off shotgun would be a piss-poor gun for defending yourself against a zombie horde that is coming at you. The shot spread pattern on a sawn-off shotgun would be way too wide to be effective on any zombie's head beyond short range, and it's better to kill multiple zombies from a distance than at point blank range, right?) I also noticed that Glenn had Tony's shotgun later on in the "Triggerfinger" episode. I agree with you about that the kid on the roof though - he sure seemed to have a bolt action rifle with a scope mounted on it. What happened to it is the question now. [[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 15:59, 22 February 2012 (CST)
I just watched it again and I swore I heard a cocking sound so that could make it a pump action shotgun. You were right its not a pump action i believe its a over/under gun. [[User:Balin21|Balin21]]

: TV shows and movies usually have the cocking sound effects for guns added in for dramatic purposes. (For example, it seems that we often hear the cocking sound effect every time the script calls for one character to point a gun at somebody or something. In real life, guns are normally silent when this happens.) The Walking Dead seems to be just such a TV show. I don't know how to screen capture this yet, but I paused episode 208 at the 43:15 mark. I could clearly see the underside of Tony's gun there, and I did not see things on this gun such as a loading port, or a slide piece, both of which would be consistent with a pump action shotgun. It was all dark on that part of the shotgun instead, which to me seems more consistent with a double barrel, over/under, break action shotgun than with a pump action shotgun. --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 12:55, 23 February 2012 (CST)

: I couldn't get a good look at Tony's shotgun in either "Nebraska" or "Triggerfinger". At first glance it looked like a cut down Winchester 1887 (like in T-2). I was wondering if anyone else happened to think that too? Also it almost looked like it had a synthetic stock on it which made me think it could have been the Chiappa T-Series 1887, but I don't know if those are availible yet, but again I didn't get a good enough look at it.--[[User:Fenderfiver03|Fenderfiver03]] 20:10, 23 February 2012 (CST)
::It is a sawn off over and under (although it may be purpose made as it appeared to have a front sight present). You get a look at the gun when the guy gets up to piss, and after he is shot you see a front view of the gun showing that it is two open barrels rather than a barrel with a magazine tube underneath. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 20:37, 23 February 2012 (CST)
::: You're right. After rewatching the episode online and pausing just after he gets shot I could see the two barrels and also could see there is no lever either.--[[User:Fenderfiver03|Fenderfiver03]] 22:57, 23 February 2012 (CST)

Tony's shotgun looks VERY much like the MOSSBERG HS12 after another look at episode 9. When Rick searches Tony's pocket and picks up two (probably 12-ga) shotgun rounds, you can clearly see the Top/Locking Lever for opening/locking the breech contrasted against the background. In the shot just before that you can see a Picatinny or Weaver rail on top of the receiver. This clearly says "HS12" to me...and though it pretty clearly does not have a rail on the bottom of the under barrel, not all HS12s have the under-barrel rail, I think. --[[User:dryfireandy|dryfireandy]] 27 Feb 2012
:Had to Google Mossberg HS12, and I must admit I giggled a little bit at the concept of a "tactical" over/under. I watched the episodes in question the other day, and from memory at least I'd have to agree with you. It'd be nice if someone could post a picture, though.... [[User:Krakydak|Krakydak]] 18:05, 27 February 2012 (CST)
::I will try to get an appropriate screencap uploaded; ditto for the Sig P228/229 to help resolve that one. PS "tactical" double-barrels have made ground in the last couple years or so- check out Stoeger's "tactical" SxS...just remember to bring your barf bag- they're charging the same prices for one as you'd see for a good 870 or Mossy pump. Outrageous! In any case, stupid people waste their money on them- but I digress. Tony's apparent choice of shotgun bespeaks his desperation and/or seriously limited tactical reasoning ability- which I guess we already could've figured out around the time his body hit the floor. =P --[[User:dryfireandy|dryfireandy]]

: Does the Mossberg HS12 come with sling swivel studs? I noticed that Tony was carrying his shotgun by a sling that was looped over his shoulder. Since the buttstock of this shotgun had been sawn off, there was no way to just let it hang there - he had to keep holding onto the sling with his hand instead. --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 09:00, 29 February 2012 (CST)

== What caused it? ==
Does the comic ever reveal what the cause of the outbreak was? I'm not asking for spoilers as to what the cause ''was'', I'm just asking if it's ever revealed, like a "yeah, they find out what it was" or "no, they build a rocket ship and fly to Mars to restart human civilization", or something like that. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 16:59, 27 February 2012 (CST)
:I don't think any reason has actually been given, and Robert Kirkman (writer of the comic) has stated that he doesn't plan to ever give a definitive cause. In the comic characters have speculated that it is caused by a virus that everyone in the world is infected with that causes them to reanimate after death. Because I've read the comic I already knew this so can't remember if it is made clear in the series, but it is the kind of zombie apocalypse where everyone who dies turns into a zombie, even if they die from non zombie causes (zombie bites cause infections that are 100% lethal). --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 17:10, 27 February 2012 (CST)

For Example a certain Main Character is shot dead at the end of the first book (in the comic they never went to the CDC, instead they just got the guns and left, but before they left the character is killed) and later in the series (maybe a book or two later, Rick returns to the place where they buried said person, and he was a zombie even though he had died by a bullet and not bite/scratch --[[User:Smish34|Smish34]] 09:34, 29 February 2012 (CST)

== Unidentified pistol ==

In the most recent episode, S02E11, Carl takes a pistol out of Daryl's bike. Presumably it is the same pistol Daryl used in episode S01E4. There were some pretty clear shots of the pistol when Carl is holding it, looked like a Browning, but I could be completely wrong. --[[User:Animalmenace|Animalmenace]] 23:51, 5 March 2012 (CST)
:It was a [[Browning BDA]], not sure if this is the same gun as in S01E04 as it looks like that has a larger beavertail on the back of the grip, but is hard to tell from the shots available. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 06:56, 6 March 2012 (CST)

== Shotgun stock? ==
What type of stock is on Shane's shotgun?
--[[User:Zombie Killer 1995|Zombie Killer 1995]] 09:24, 6 March 2012 (CST)
:It says on the main article, a KNOXX SpecOps NRS stock. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 11:40, 6 March 2012 (CST)

== Daryl's pistol ==

I think Daryl's unidentified pistol might be a CZ-75 series, the frame/grips seem to match it as does the general size.
:Looked more like a Browning Hi-Power to me. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 13:18, 6 March 2012 (CST)
:Yeah, I concur with Cool-breeze. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:41, 7 March 2012 (CST)

::Looked more like a Browning BDM to me.

Hey, it does not really matter at this point as the stupid kid loses in the leafs and then books it..
::He ''didn't'' lose it in the bushes. But even if he had, it still matters what it is, considering the purpose of this website. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 15:22, 12 March 2012 (CDT)

That actually seemed to best the best look at the handgun we see and it appeared to be a Browning Hi-Power to me as well.[[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] 22:15, 8 March 2012 (CST)

:People are talking about two different guns here. The easily identifiable one is the one that Carl takes out of Daryl's saddle bag in the most recent episode, which is definitely a [[Browning BDA]]. There is also the pistol that only the grip is seen sticking out of his waist band in S01E04, which I think is a different pistol. One of the only features that you can make out on this pistol is that fact that it has a prominent beavertail/grip spur at the back which is does not match the BDA or BDM. Hammer is wrong for the Hi-Power, my best guess would be a CZ-75 from the relationship between the hammer and the grip spur but it is not possible to tell from this pic. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 04:57, 9 March 2012 (CST)

== GUN SENSE ==

Their for sure would tons of M4'S and possibly m16a4's lying around in the streets of Atlanta with moer Berettas. Why does no one go for one and why do they not ask jenner for some. Would an assault rifle not be good to kill hordes of undead? Also why did rick not get on the .50 on the tank and take out some before. Even when I see police cars don't they raid them. The only time I have seen anyone do that is when Shane and Otis use the flares from the cruiser to distract the walkers..And yes I know it is a scripted show.
------
Don't forget that the show starts a while after the zombies take over so any M4s,M16s, etc would have already been scooped up from the Atlanta streets, at least the ones people could get before the city was overrun. And they didn't ask Jenner for any because an assault rifle is actually quite cumbersome and the ammo could weigh them down even more then they already are. Also it would be pretty hard to find any ammunition for M4s/M16s as that doesn't seem to be a commonly used weapon in this show beyond the military. They don't search cop cars because as I stated, the show starts a while after the initial overrunning of cities so if people had any brains, they would have raided cop cars a long time ago. As for the Beretta statement, it seems like that is more of a military firearm as well and not a police weapon, plus they can't search every single corpse they find in the city. As to the .50 cal on the tank, notice how fast the zombies crawled on top of the tank? Rick would never have lasted, plus I don't believe there was any .50 ammo in the tank, nor in the gun. [[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] 22:14, 8 March 2012 (CST)

- -

Sorry I'm new at posting on here. Good point I forgot it starts 2 week after the outbreak. But I was thinking if Otis and Shane both had automatics it may have ended differently. Also we do Rick's beretta again with Shane and Andrea in the housing developments she has it no and perfers it to her ladysmith. And as to the .50cal their was one zombie when he came out to escape he shoveled it in the face. The .50 just is a bad idea in my opinion caue its one loud mother. Also I don't understand why people carry bolt actions around, look what happend to Dale. Imagine how smooth the show would run if everyone had silenced weapons. One more thing, is anyone else hoping for the variety of guns to switch up? We know that the kid's camp has 30 men+(jude,jury,executioner)so assuming Rick's group comes up on top cause the shows been renewed for season 3. Will they get some real artiliery? (User:n Gunfan1996)

:If I remember in the first episode, Rick did bump into a tank and I coulda sworn I saw ammo in that 50 cal, but it is a bit heavy for one to carry. An Assault Rifle plus ammo is not heavy at all. A shotgun with ammo is actually more heavy and cumbersome to carry and limited range 12:46, 9 March 2012 (CST)

:There was no ammo in the tank gun.

[[Image:WalkingDead-BrowningM2HB 02.jpg|thumb|none|500px|A closeup of the mounting; note that the mounting is designed for the L7 GPMG, an FN MAG derivative, and the fake M2 simply sits on top of it. Compare to the real M2 in the foreground of the shot above.]]

:Besides, Rick was on horseback. What's he going to do, mount the .50 on the head of his horse? And it's also worth noting that he didn't have any weapons that used that ammo. A belt of .50 would be dead weight (no pun intended). [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 15:37, 12 March 2012 (CDT)

== WOW!!!!!!! AWESOME ENDING (SPOILERS! SPOILERS! SPOILERS!) ==

I couln' resist saying how awesome i thought S02: E12 was. That was the way to kill off Shane. Plus with the cool remix of the theme song playing as you see an army of walkers walk out onto the field. Just saying, I think Hershel or Maggie will die in the season finale. For those who missed it, here's a link: http://www.amctv.com/the-walking-dead/videos/talked-about-scene-episode-212-the-walking-dead-shanes-last-stand --[[User:Yo dawg 111|Yo dawg 111]] 14:51, 12 March 2012 (CDT)

Yep pretty good. I knew that eventually Shane was going. If I remember the comic book correctly it was Carl who killed Shane when he was going to kill rick and then Rick finished him off when he came back as a walker. So in the television show they reversed that. Liked the ending. I wonder if next season they will deal with the Governor and the Prison? --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 15:30, 12 March 2012 (CDT)

:If you search for news of the show, te actor has already been cast, looking forward to the next season.--[[User:Dillinger|Dillinger]] 17:14, 12 March 2012 (CDT)

:The Governor has indeed been cast and no it is not Merle. [[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] 17:55, 12 March 2012 (CDT) [[http://screenrant.com/david-morrissey-governor-the-walking-dead-yman-156371/]]

Nothing you guys said makes any sense because i don't read comics. Don't tell me though. I'm going to read the comics after the series finally ends. I know a friend with the complete collection who sai he is going to sell it along with DVD copies when they all come out. I WANT THAT!!!!! Check on ebay after the series comes to an end.--[[User:Yo dawg 111|Yo dawg 111]] 18:56, 12 March 2012 (CDT)

All I'm wondering is why did they make it so all you have to do is die to become a zombie instead of being bitten/scratched? Do they explain this as well? [[User:ZombieKiller|ZombieKiller]] 10:00, 13 March 2012

:Almost every zombie story I've ever read, movie I've ever seen, or game I've ever played has it the same way as The Walking Dead TV series and comic book has had it - When a person dies for any reason, that same person later becomes a zombie, unless their brain has been damaged or destroyed first. So far, no explanation has been given as to exactly how this happens. My guess would be that it's all due to an airborne virus. --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 10:56, 13 March 2012 (CDT)

Can anyone identify the knife Rick used to finally put Shane down? Was it one of the Gerbers seen frequently throughout this season, or something else? I couldn't get a close enough look.--[[User:Mmarlon brando|Mmarlon brando]] 15:35, 13 March 2012 (CDT)

:I paused S02/Ep12 at the 39:09 mark. That was where I could get the best look at this knife. As best I can tell, Rick used a Gerber DMF folder on Shane. I think Rick has had that same knife all throughout Season 2. --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 13:19, 14 March 2012 (CDT)

I also wanted to know about a knife from episode 10 of season 2 (18 Miles Out). The knife in question is the one that Rick leaves for Randall to use. I don't know if it can be seen any better in any other episode but I know that Randall does eventually use it and I think I remember a few semi-close up shots of it.

:Yes, there are a few close-up shots of the knife Randall uses in Episode 10 of Season 2. It appears to be a sheath knife without any serrations on the blade, finger grooves on the grip, and a clip point. I checked the official Gerber website, but I was unable to see any knife pictured there which resembled this one. --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 19:20, 18 March 2012 (CDT)

On the actual subject of the firearms used in the finale, I think Lori uses the Charter Arms Pug that Carl had earlier in the season. Daryl used a revolver I couldn't ID.... Looked like a .38 of some kind with a 4 or 5 inch barrel, but I'm not sure. [[User:Krakydak|Krakydak]] 22:02, 18 March 2012 (CDT)

To add to that, Glenn was seen using Shane's Mossberg with the M4-style stock in the finale. (Shane no longer needed it.)
Hershel was also seen using, what I believe is the Remington 870 Wingmaster used by Dayrl in "Vatos"

== Logo on Carl's shirt ==
This is way off topic for IMFDB, but the logo on Carl's shirt in the episode "Better Angels", a black bear paw in front of a red atom, I know I've seen it elsewhere but I can't place it. At first I thought it was the old Blackwater logo, but the BW logo is a black bear paw in a red scope crosshair. Does anyone recognize it? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 19:13, 18 March 2012 (CDT)

:The logo on Carl's shirt is for "Science Dog" - another comic book by the creator of TWD, Robert Kirkman. The comic book version of Carl has this same exact logo on his shirt too. Adding this level of detail to Carl's wardrobe in the TV series was a nice touch, I would say. --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 07:01, 19 March 2012 (CDT)

== The guns of the survivors ==
Way back in episode one of the series we see Rick load up all of the available weapons from the precinct's armory for his journey to Atlanta. And while we've had about 18 episodes to ask the question we really haven't yet. If they weapons came from the police armory why do a good portion of the long guns appear to be hunting firearms? The Browning BAR, the Remington 700, the Remington 870 and such look out of place in the right context.

- Well, I think that the older wooden-furniture Remington 870 and the Remington 700 can be explained, as it is a small, rural County Sheriff's Office in Georgia. Before the widespread distribution of tactical sniper rifles, M16's and M4's across America's police departments, police were using other weapons, such as the Remington 700 and the Winchester Model 70 for that purpose. Also, we see Rick gathering up the weapons AFTER the outbreak. The Sheriff's officers could have grabbed the new firearms and left the older ones, which would still be in the armory for storage and reserve purposes. If the story was broadened, it would probably show the other Sheriff's deputy's taking tactical rifles and carbines to employ them in the field. [[User:Scattergun|Scattergun]]

:One thing that always struck me as "unrealistic" about TWD has been the types and and amounts of guns depicted in seasons 1 and 2, along with the feelings of some of the characters toward guns. The setting for this show all along has been in Georgia, which in real life is a "red" pro-gun southern state with a longtime history of private gun ownership among a large percentage of the population. So far on TWD however, the way in which guns have been depicted seems somewhat more as if the show's setting has been in a "blue" anti-gun northeastern state like New Jersey!

:In real-life Georgia, I have no doubt that there are many civilians who own at least one semi-automatic rifle chambered for a military cartridge and a few high-capacity magazines for it, and that number probably increased by even more after Obama got elected in 2008. Bearing this in mind, I can't see why there would not have been at least a few people in that survivor's camp outside Atlanta during season 1 armed with something more than just hunting firearms and handguns. The two "redneck" characters in season 1 - Merle and Daryl - they would have both had tactical-type rifles and hidden caches of ammunition for them if it had been up to me. Rednecks in real life have been stockpiling ammunition ever since Obama got elected. Plus, seasons 1 and 2 have had two former cops in the group - Rick and Shane - but neither one of them have ever seen the need to acquire better firepower. There were M4's and other weapons scattered all around the outside of the CDC in season 1, but nobody thought to pick any of them up. If I had been Rick, I would have been constantly telling everybody else in the group all throughout seasons 1 and 2 to keep gathering up guns and ammunition whenever possible. That one black bag Rick loaded up at the police station's armory in the first episode of season 1 could not possibly have held enough ammunition to last all the way to the end of season 2.

:Then there were the anti-gun sentiments among some members in the group - Lori in season 1 and 2, and Hershel in season 2. Lori's objections to her son Carl learning how to shoot struck me as being a bit odd. Lori is supposed to be a housewife from a small town in the South who is married to a cop, not a soccer mom with a career from a liberal anti-gun upbringing. Being that Carl is the son of a southern small town cop, I think it would have been more realistic if he had already learned a few things about shooting from his dad Rick long before the outbreak. Hershel's attitude towards guns struck me as being most odd. Hershel is supposed to be a cattle rancher from rural Georgia, so when he said that he did want his property to become an "armed camp" from the group carrying guns around, I was shaking my head by then. Cattle ranchers in real life often have to keep a gun handy to kill coyotes and other pests. I doubt that coyotes would stay away from a farm or ranch with livestock on it after a zombie apocalypse starts. I would have to say that Hershel seemed to redeem himself later in season 2 when he said that he knew how to shoot, although he did not like to. In the season 2 finale however, Hershel seemed to be very much into showing off his shooting skills. --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 10:43, 21 March 2012 (CDT)

::I just want to say a couple of things about this rant. First, you are being very stereotypical about the South, thinking that everyone is a gun-toting redneck. I can speak from experience because I am from the most anti-gun state in the country, Massachusetts, I think I can guarantee that there are at least a few people living in the South who don't like firearms. Like I said, I am from Massachusetts, but I like guns, unlike most of the state and most of the Northeast for that matter, except New Hampshire of course. Also, the show takes place a few weeks after the zombie outbreak, most of the people with the military caliber firearms have probably long since left and moved to places they would think was safer. About Rick teaching Carl to shoot guns, he is a cop, so maybe he has seen people get badly hurt by guns, so he didn't want anything to happen to Carl. Hershel knows how to shoot pretty well. I am guessing by his hate for guns, he probably faced some kind of horrible incident in the past that resulted from him using a gun. Again, this is just speculation. In the season 2 finale, Hershel showed his shooting skills because by this time, his outlook on the undead had completely changed. --[[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]] 18:01, 21 March 2012 (CDT)

:::We love our guns up here in New Hampshire! Rick teaching Carl about guns is a good thing and something that is needed. He'll be needing to use that gun more considering how the world has become with the Zombies. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:57, 21 March 2012 (CDT)

::::Oh no, I completely agree with teaching Carl to use guns after the zombie outbreak, but I mean before the outbreak maybe Rick didn't have any motivation to teach his son to use guns, that's all. --[[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]] 19:36, 21 March 2012 (CDT)

:::::SmithandWesson36, have you been to the South much? I have. I have been to most of the southern states myself, and not just to the large cities and tourist spots, either. I also live in a somewhat rural part of Pennsylvania - it's had some population growth over the last 15 years. Anyway, the point I was trying to make above is that these days, in the "red states" of the South and other rural areas, there are more tactical type rifles in the hands of "plain folks" civilians than ever before. It's more than some people may even realize or want to admit, and the buyers are not necessarily ones who fit the "redneck" mold. Case in point: Not long after Obama was elected in 2008, the biggest gun shop in my area was packed every time I went in to browse. The gun shop's employees were often telling me back then that they could not keep up with the demand for semi-auto rifles chambered in .223 Remington. I made some small talk there once with a single mom, who seemed articulate enough, not a redneck type, etc. She was with her teenage son - they were there to buy her first gun. She bought a Yugo SKS rifle. (I think she wanted to buy an AR type rifle at first, but the SKS was much cheaper.) Also in 2008, I went to several parts of North Carolina at different times that year. I noticed that even the small pawn shops in the suburban "Research Triangle" area of NC had at least one or two AK type rifles. Plus, every time I have been to either of the two shooting ranges that I regularly go to, there has always been at least one person there shooting his or her own AR type rifle. Based upon my own personal experiences such as these, this is part of the reason why wrote what I did above. --[[User:Kepiblanc|Kepiblanc]] 01:11, 23 March 2012 (CDT)

Originally this started out as a discussion about why a police precinct would have hunting firearms in the armory. I don't really know how we got into the portrayal of red state/blue state issues in the show and about who personally owns what and why as opposed to something else.

As to the anti-gun bias on the show, I believe that it's to some degree understandable when considering everything. Rick and Shane are police officers, their training dictates that firearms not in the hands of fellow officers are a threat to their safety. Even if the dead have started walking that training is still with them and they're going to be relying on what they know. Hershel's stance is understandable because he sees the Walkers as sick people in need of help, not open slaughter like what was possibly being shown on the news reports. He understands that the survivors don't see things his way and would rather shoot a Walker rather than help it and he wants to prevent that...at least until after Shane opens his eyes to the truth. Lori is a mother and worries about the safety of her son, possibly because so many kids get shot and killed each year and was afraid of contributing to that. It's also possible she's opposed to the idea of Carl learning to shoot because it doesn't jive with her hopes of the world returning to what is used to be when there was order and safety. It's possible she views the idea of her child growing up cold and hard is just another nail in the coffin of the world having any sort of order to it again and she doesn't want to be swinging that hammer. --[[User:Ballistics_Expert2|Ballistics_Expert2]]

:Thank you, Ballistics_Expert, that's exactly what I was trying to say. I wasn't arguing anything about red state/blue state, I'm simply stating that not everyone single person in the South loves guns and some are opposed to them. I didn't mean anything political by that, I just meant that anywhere you go, there will be people who disagree with the common concensus of the area. --[[User:SmithandWesson36|SmithandWesson36]] 13:37, 23 March 2012 (CDT)

...and back to the subject...reason would lead one to believe the other cops already took the duty guns at the begining and all that was left was confiscated guns left in the evidence locker or something.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 14:44, 23 March 2012 (CDT)

Talk:Baccano!

2012-02-08T01:49:53Z

Spades of Columbia:

Can anyone ID the rifle and/or the flamethrower?--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 03:39, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Too bad the title isn't Baka No "My idiot" HAHAHAHAHAHAHA. ;) mpm

:It took me about five minutes to get that. I need more caffeine.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 04:51, 21 October 2010 (UTC)

Could the unidentified rifle be a custom Winchester Model 1890? Some modern owners of it claim to have such with hexagonal barrels, the third generation had straight stocks, the lack of an ejection port on the side is justified by it ejecting from the top, and sawing off the barrel to match the magazine resembles the rifle. With a custom pump-stock, is it a possible idea? Quite a lot fits after all, in the mechanics and build atleast.--[[User:Z008MJ|Z008MJ]] 18:43, 7 February 2012 (CST)

: I doubt it. It's too big and the receiver is too long for an 1890.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 19:02, 7 February 2012 (CST)

I think that pump rifle is the Browning BPR.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:49, 7 February 2012 (CST)

Talk:Typhoon

2012-02-03T18:22:14Z

Spades of Columbia: /* M1911A1? */

==M1911A1?==
There's some sort of switch on the slide of the "M1911A1". Any ideas? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 10:30, 3 February 2012 (CST)
[[File:Typhoon-M1911--2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|You can see it clearly on the slide here.]]
[[File:Typhoon-M1911-4.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Here as well.]]

are we sure it is for sure a 1911...it kinda looks similar to a type 54 pistol...and its sight's are very Tokarev like.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 12:22, 3 February 2012 (CST)

User talk:Funkychinaman

2012-02-02T22:34:47Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Thanks */

== Black Dynamite ==
If you have caps, go for it, man! I don't have the DVD anymore, as I was borrowing it from a friend.-protoAuthor 16:50, 26 June 2010 (UTC)

== Amen brother ==
I read your preference for SA/DA pistols over striker fired and DAO guns. I myself firmly hold this belief and strongly dislike the way most new guns are adopting the striker system, especially in the law enforcement market. Though I have to say I have a far stronger dislike for hammerless revolvers regardless of their superior snag resistance. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

==Reply==
Thanks for responding to my post. With regards to law enforcement sidearms I think agree that liability probably plays a major role in their weapon selection but personally I still don't think that explains their choices. A Glock or similar pistol with a light trigger pull and no manual safety is a Plaxico Burress situation waiting to happen. The New York City Police solution, modifying DAO weapons to have 12 lbs triggers, seems like a real dumb idea as that can't be good for accuracy, something I would like to think police have mastered. The only reason I can think of why Striker guns are good from a liability standpoint is drop safety, but modern hammer guns are just as safe in most real world senerios so I still don't understand the striker craze.

Also, I did screen cap alot of Archer episodes that featured realistic weapons right before I found out that the article already existed and had been deleted. If you wanted to see how good their quality was so as to make a case for an Archer article being allowed I would be happy to post some of my screencaps.

P.S. The Bersa Thunder 380 is an amazing little gun, though you are right .380 ACP is almost impossible to come by recently. Most stores in my area get 2 or 3 boxes a month which quickly get sold for close to double what they used to cost. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

==Chekhov's Gun==
I noticed you're comment about the .25 Chekhov mentioned in Archer. This is a somewhat esoteric joke about a literary technique known as the Chekhov's Gun, which refers to a seemingly minor object mentioned early in a story turning out to have a major impact on the plot later on. Here's a link that explains more about it. [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Ptitlexn9xzsjd5fif?from=Main.ChekhovsGun] Toward the bottom of the page it even specifically mentions the example from Archer. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

==History==
Of the reality shows, things like ''Pawn Stars'' and ''American Pickers'' make sense as they involve historical artifacts, however, Ax Men, truckers, and that new swamp show don't belong at all. As for Arms and Armor, I've never even heard of that show (probably before my time). What I miss is ''Conquest'', there used to be reruns on History International but they've stopped. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

I've never heard of that show either. I think 30 min was too short for Conquest as well. More running time would have made the show alot better. Other improvements would have been to use different people each episode (like Fear Factor or Dog Eat Dog) and change some of the final challenges like those in the Pirate and Ninja episodes which were clearly staged and fairly corny. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

The feeling that History has completely abandoned its initial mission statement is very pervasive. TVTropes.com also has several articles that mock the History Channel, though admittedly not in flowchart form. I've always loved Cracked.com, very insightful information presented in their endearing snarky, jackass tone. The worst show imaginable on that list is ''Ancient Aliens'' where people who seriously must functionally retarded try to rewrite history in the most asinine way possible (Noah's ark was a DNA Bank, Gold eating aliens founded Babylon, the moon is a hollow space station monitoring earth, and ancient aliens in bronze age India fought wars with atomic bombs). THIS IS NOT HISTORY. Technically neither is ''[[Top Shot]]'' but as a gun enthusiast I'm willing to look the other way ;). -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

What I found more interesting than the HD WWII documentaries was a mini-series they did several years ago called WWI in color. It was an actual documentary series with each episode exploring a different topic (trench warfare, the birth of Aerial combat, the eastern front, the war at sea) but augmented the historian and veteran (they actually found a dozen WWI vets) interviews with colorized footage from the front lines. Color footage of WWII may be rare but it's unheard of for WWI. Also, the show didn't entirely rest on the color footage but simply used it to supplement a good documentary. As for a show about horsemanship, it sounds interesting if they could encompass things from the entire history of mounted warfare. Have the contestants use javelins, lances, bows, swords, and guns, from horseback, chariot, camel, possibly even elephant. Unfortunately with the way the history channel has been headed it would probably end up less like ''Conquest'' and more like ''[[Deadliest Warrior]]''. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

I think asking people trained in modern riding styles to ride without stirrups may be asking too much. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

==Cracked Article==
A little while ago you sent me a link to a cracked.com article about the history channel. I just found another article on Cracked I believe is written by Gunmaster45. I found it very amusing and thought you might enjoy it [http://www.cracked.com/funny-2939-top-10-mall-ninja-guns/]. It lists 10 overrated, impractical guns including a tactical double barrel shotgun. Let me know what you think. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

== BSG Apollo ==

Jamie Bamber did use the Colonial pistol. Take a look at the 2nd screenshot under the Colonial handgun entry. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 04:47, 11 June 2011 (CDT)

== Thing is... ==

...We're not compiling an official Navy listing here, we're just using Lt. as a shorthand for "Lieutenant" in the same way "Mr." is a shorthand for "Mister." It doesn't really matter what service the pretend people are part of, and Jessica Biel and Josh Lucas aren't Lieutenants. I might agree if we were talking about ''real'' pilots here, but we're not. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 14:38, 8 July 2011 (CDT)

:Either is correct, but Lt. is better for readability. "Lt." is always short for lieutenant regardless of what else might be; US Navy lieutenants are ''officially listed'' as "LT," but that's just an administrative choice, it doesn't change the entire rest of the English language (any more than Capt. stops being short for "Captain" if you happen to have joined the Army). It's about people understanding what you're using it as a shorthand ''for'', not about using a term that will have the uninitiated wondering what "LT" is an acronym for because there's no full stop after it to say it's an abbreviation. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 14:54, 8 July 2011 (CDT)

::I don't know, if you're trying to educate people there's no point being correct if nobody understands you're correct; the first time I saw someone allcaps'ing rank names I just thought he was being a moron (in my defence, he was a moron in a multitude of other ways). The proper abbreviation only helps in differentiating ranks if you already know that's what it is; it's a little like "Hg" is only a useful shorthand for "Mercury" if you already know the periodic table well. It's much easier to tell they're Navy airmen by the fact that there's an aircraft carrier in the movie. Anyway, I'm just going to change it to the full word. To show there's no hard feelings, [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMWr3OY0xEM&feature=related skip to 1:30 to see what it looks like when an M167 VADS is actually firing]. I laughed. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 00:09, 9 July 2011 (CDT)

:::Well yeah, but we explain which variant is which. What I mean is that it's useless using a ''shorthand'' if it won't help people get it, since the purpose of a shorthand is to say something quickly in a way people can still easily understand. As for a videogame, it's called Ace Combat :D [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 01:11, 9 July 2011 (CDT)

::::I dunno, I guess it just bugs me because it doesn't look right. And yeah, I'm annoyed at the wait too, much as I was annoyed that AC6 was 360-only. Still, I've got the three PS2 games lurking around while I wait for a next-gen one I can actually play or a HAWX that doesn't suck. What were they ''thinking'' with those point-and-click UAV missions in HAWX 2? [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 02:02, 9 July 2011 (CDT)

==Ranks==
Hey, wow, chill man. I only changed them because (a) the Navy ranks looks stupid on the page (no offense) (b) they are harder to read (c) the Average Joe won't propably understand the rank, and is most propably unwilling to spend 5 seconds on Google to find out about them, and (d) there's no rule or regulation the ranks should be presented in their absolute correct from, since we see the other ones more frequently.... --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 20:24, 12 July 2011 (CDT)
::Well, I guess there's no harm in having the "correct" abreviatons. Heck, maybe I'll even learn them someday. Altough, I'm still a bit torn on this but we might as well go with your way. Sorry if I offended you btw, I've always been pretty straight-forward... --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 05:55, 13 July 2011 (CDT)

== Austeryr F88T ==

Yeah, don't mind that, I only uploaded it when it looked like I wouldn't be able to find an F88S and would need to use the .22 version as a reference image. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:37, 13 July 2011 (CDT)

== Army of Two ==
Thanks for screencapping Army of Two the 40th day. I just got the game and hadn't gotten a chance to aquire everything in the game to screencap it. I can now cross another page of my to be done list. [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 13:23, 15 August 2011 (CDT)
:If you are going to get a picture of the 870 MPS in Masterkey configuration do you think you can get the image of it mounted on the M32? [[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 21:47, 15 August 2011 (CDT)

== Reply to: H:LotS ==

You're welcome. I've been watching the show from the start, and I could make out a lot of guns on the show. Though I'm still trying to ID the revolver that Det. Bolander ([[Ned Beatty]]) carries. - [[User:500Magnum|500Magnum]]
:You only see Bolander's gun a few times, but I remember him pulling it out and holding it behind his back, though it's hard to make out due to the angle. And there are moments where you get a look at Howard's Colt DS, and it didn't look like a 1st Generation Colt, the grips and the barrel looked more 3rd Generation. I also noticed in the first season that Bayliss had a Beretta (IDed from the grips) and not a Glock at first. - [[User:500Magnum|500Magnum]]

==re:==
Yes thank you for that. I leave for 5 minutes and look what happens. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 21:44, 2 September 2011 (CDT)

== Umm... ==

Hey, it's Jazz. What happened with my page? I saw that you undid someone else's change to my page, and I was just curious what happened.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 21:54, 2 September 2011 (CDT)
:Alright, I was just wondering. Thanks for deleting that.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 23:25, 2 September 2011 (CDT)

== Something to say ==

If you have something to say please say it to me instead of going to the blogs.--[[User:JD0556|JD0556]] 21:25, 8 September 2011 (CDT)

Yeah thats what I thought now go run and hide in the blogs because you know that I can't say anything there.--[[User:JD0556|JD0556]] 21:36, 8 September 2011 (CDT)

== RE: AIM photo ==

yeah, but I didn't touch the aspect ratio, I just removed the g'damned excess white... check the [[AK-47]] page how it looks when the image itself has updated... --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 18:33, 14 September 2011 (CDT)

== Thanks ==

How do take/upload screenshots?

Ok thanks.--[[User:Yo dawg 111|Yo dawg 111]] 18:02, 29 September 2011 (CDT)

Thank you sooomuch for doing the alien girl...not to mention in such a timely fashion, looks great.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 16:34, 2 February 2012 (CST)

== I figured that out in the end ==

See, it's not so much writing it down as just having a list of passwords scattered over a dozen sheets of paper, very few saying what they're for. It turns out I ''was'' using the right one, but when you enter a password for a new account it's logged all in lowercase, even though the enter password screen is case-sensitive. So, you're fumbling around trying to remember where the shift characters were when they're all gone from the actual password. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 18:30, 18 October 2011 (CDT)

== No Problem ==

You are welcome. You helped me with some stupid vehicles in Ghost Recon so now we are even :) - [[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] 10:57, 27 October 2011 (CDT)

== Chuck ==

I wouldn't know, I don't have a TV license. I figure that I can just rent or buy £140 worth of DVDs in a year and watch more things I want without paying the BBC to employ Jonathan Ross. [[User:Evilim|Evil Tim]] 08:53, 1 November 2011 (CDT)

== Netherlands ==
I suppose because British and French is a general term the Netherlands. But we don't call the British movies English. I know that Holland is one of the provinces in The Netherlands and Dutch is the language, but for reasons that i can't really explain i preferred to use the name of their country. Even though dutch would work. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 19:11, 16 November 2011 (CST)

== Re: Approval of a new page. ==

Hi Funkychinaman,
I am also a Taiwanese, currently studying in Singapore. There is a Taiwanese drama, TV series, called Rookies Diary 新兵日記. I am not sure if you know about it but it is filmed by Formosa TV, on aired from 2010 July 2nd to 2010 September 16. There are two seasons in this series. First part is about teenage boys serving their national services and underwent military training and second part is about joining the Special Forces. called 新兵日記之特戰英雄. I am not sure if I am able to publish it since it did not fulfill the imfdb Rules as it is not recorded in IMDB. Please help me have a better check. Thanks :). -[[S9771773G]]
:: So you mean I construct the page first, or go consult someone else? Like [[User: Evil Tim]], [[User: commando552]], [[User: Spartan198]], or [[User: MoviePropMaster2008]]. They are all experts on this. Your call?
Oh okay. You are quite right actually, maybe I should start on something easier first. Thanks very much. I would inform the admins about this issue. By the way, I owe you one. --[[User:S9771773G|S9771773G]] 00:06, 24 November 2011 (CST)
:: I have registered it, but may I know how it worked and how can I put that up? --[[User:S9771773G|S9771773G]] 10:09, 26 November 2011 (CST)

== Forum help. ==

Hi Funkychinaman It shows these below when I want to post new threads. Can you help?

1. Your user account may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system?

2.If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation.

--[[User:S9771773G|S9771773G]] 11:00, 28 November 2011 (CST)

== Aspect Ratios ==

The general rule for aspect ratios:

500px - Films or TV shows that are presented in the square 4:3 format, the 1:85 to 1 format (older films like [[Predator 2]] were shot this way) or the 16:9 widescreen format (for newer shows like [[Chuck]]). Sometimes, picture quality of the media featured would suggest either lowering it to "400px" or raising it to "600px".

600px - Films and media that are presented in the super widescreen format of 2:35 to 1 (most feature films today like ''[[Captain America: The First Avenger]]'' or ''[[Inception]]'' are released this way). Sometimes, if television screencaps are in HD, they can be bumped up to 600px because of the greater detail.

--[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 18:44, 2 December 2011 (CST)

== You're killing my actors! ==

Hi, it's funny how we are cooperating. I am creating actor pages for The Dukes of Hazzard (Best series ever!) and here I am getting all these messages from you saying that the actors have all died. Hahaha! I will check IMDB for further new actor pages, don't worry, --[[User:PeeWee055|PeeWee055]] 16:05, 22 December 2011 (CST)

:I know what you mean about the cars, I used to think that it was cool to see cars being wrecked, but now that I have a car of myself I freak out when I see pigeon poop on the hood hahaha But don't you just love the show for the 80's timewarp, the stupid haircuts and did I mention Daisy Duke? Take care, --[[User:PeeWee055|PeeWee055]] 16:35, 22 December 2011 (CST)

== Bill Macy ==
Okay that's fine. I was going off the movie credits.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 17:40, 22 December 2011 (CST)

== Just want to say ==

You do good work with these spammers. Thank you. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 00:59, 23 December 2011 (CST)

:By the way, I found something interesting while trawling through old revisions of FN Herstal's website on Archive.org: [http://web.archive.org/web/20060720080344/http://www.fnherstal.com/html/Index.htm]. This is from 2007. Click "Unique Opportunity to See FN HERSTAL's Products in Latin America" and then follow the link to the F2000. From the wording there it seems the FN EGLM / GL-1 didn't actually ''have'' an official name in 2007 and was considered part of an "integrated weapon system;" the name "FN40GL" only starts turning up on their site after a redesign in July 2008. I'm not really sure which name came first, but since the Mk 13 was entered for the EGLM requirement and had no official name, I guess that's how we ended up with FN ELGM. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 01:33, 23 December 2011 (CST)

== FN Herstal ==

Thanks for correcting my error with the FN Herstal page. That was definitely a mistake on my part. Thanks! --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 18:11, 23 December 2011 (CST)

== Grenade Launchers ==

I hadn't tried that. Thanks for the tip! --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 11:41, 26 December 2011 (CST)

== Ruger Updates ==

Hey man, I noticed that you were updating some of the Ruger guns. Thanks! Out of curiosity, have you looked at the new [[Ruger]] page? --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 16:18, 28 December 2011 (CST)

:Just out of curiosity, how certain are you about the Luger not being the basis for the Ruger Standard? Ive read that "Ruger decided to incorporate the looks of the German 9mm Luger and the American Colt Woodsman". Then again, my source is Wikipedia, so you cannot possibly dispute me... (sarcasm...). I'm just curious what you've read that I missed. Thanx! --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 00:18, 29 December 2011 (CST)

::Oh yea?! WELL.... yea i got nothing... lol. I bow to your superior knowledge. thanx for the info! --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 00:35, 29 December 2011 (CST)

== Converting tables ==

Thanks for all your help in converting the pages to the table format, as they look much better now.

For gun pages, if you click the picture of a gun, you can see what pages they were used in and this would be helpful in determining what media they were used in. If you're considering cleaning up the [[Remington 870]] page, I would recommend creating tables for each different model as it would very labor intensive to list it in the "Notes" column for each variant. It probably should resemble the [[Glock]] or the [[M1911]] page. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 17:51, 28 December 2011 (CST)

:Thanks on updating the actors with the new table format it looks much cleaner now. I will try to update more of the show I posted to this format. --[[User:Phoenixent|phoenixent]] 11:55, 29 December 2011 (CST)

== Sergei Garmash ==
Sorry, IMDb is wrong naming him as "Sergey". Wikipedia is more correct: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergei_Garmash. It can be seen that all Russian persons with this name are "Sergei", not "Sergey": composer Sergei Prokofiev, poet Sergei Yesenin and many others. [[User:Greg-Z|Greg-Z]] 13:44, 29 December 2011 (CST)
: As for myself, I count Wikipedia a more reliable source then IMDb. But I'll follow the rules and laws... so let it be. [[User:Greg-Z|Greg-Z]] 14:05, 29 December 2011 (CST)
:: >In Russian, are all Sergei/Sergey's supposed to just be "Sergei?"
:: Yes, it is so, there is only one form of this name in Russian. Its final letter is always "short i". The same is with other similar names. [[User:Greg-Z|Greg-Z]] 00:55, 30 December 2011 (CST)

== Tables ==

Yes, please put the earliest titles first. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 02:02, 2 January 2012 (CST)

:Ah crap... really?! I've done like 100 of these in the last few days all in descending order... I just assumed since that's how IMDB does it... o well. Sorry! thanks for the heads up. --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 17:45, 3 January 2012 (CST)

::Yea. Good point. I really don't feel like going back and reversing the order... --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 19:09, 3 January 2012 (CST)

== Kampfpistole ==

Hi, me again. Thanks for the revision of the '''Kampfpistole''' section, it looks all complete now; good work! Allow me to check with you for two small remarks.

(1) Could you please revise the pagename from '''Kampfpistole Z''' to '''Kampfpistole''' (without 'Z'). See below for the logic. I don't know how to do that...

(2) While you're at it, could you add a few lines to your original text on the page to reflect my above explanation. Please see below suggestion. I can also do that if you want.

The Kampfpistole (“battle pistol”) was an adapted flare pistol used by the Germans in WWII that could also be used to fire explosive charges at lightly armored targets. The adaptation stemmed from a desire to have a more accurate delivery of explosive rounds than from a regular flare pistol. For this reason, a flare pistol (the ‘Leuchtpistole Modell 1934’) was equipped with a grooved barrel (grooves = ‘Züge’ in German) and the naming was changed to Kampfpistole ('battle pistol'). This model has the alternative name ‘Leuchtpistole Z’ and it has a ‘Z’ painted on the left side of the chamber.

Sorry to bother you but I hope that all will be clear now. Yes, us Europeans like to keep matters complicated :-), --[[User:PeeWee055|PeeWee055]] 16:36, 3 January 2012 (CST)

==re:thanks==
Hey no problem, it's nice when they give good close ups. The other one is likely a Series 70, judging by the grips. But they can easily be swapped though. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 22:53, 9 January 2012 (CST)

== Walther P99 ==

Dude. Take a breath. I'm working on the page right now sorting stuff. I'm doing it a step at a time. --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 16:26, 13 January 2012 (CST)

:No worries. Sorry to jump down your throat I was literally working on it when the message showed up so... yea. Any way, I'm just about done and would love a second pair of eyes to look it over and catch any typos I inevitably made if you are interested. :-) --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 16:46, 13 January 2012 (CST)

==Downfall Russian?==
You put that Downfall was a Russian co production. There seems to be no evidence of that at all. NONE of the production companies associated with it were Russian. All of them were German according to online info. Just filming in Russia doesn't make it a Russian co production. But if you have other info to the contrary, let me know :) Thanks. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 12:17, 15 January 2012 (CST)

==Filmed==
Sorry but Merely filming in a place doesn't make it a co-production. That interpretation is new. The intent of that category was to recognize the actual ''film industry'' in different countries. Just going there to film something doesn't make it partially theirs. If we listed EVERY country that a movie was filmed in, that would make every multi-country movie a co production of that country. Which is NOT TRUE. Look at the 007 Movies. Those movies are filmed all over the place. We don't list every country as a co producer of every movie. The category is meant to read Produced & Filmed by ..... [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 03:45, 16 January 2012 (CST)
::We need to clarify the category since this type of confusion can occur. But the rule is: The movie MUST be done or partnered in a major way with an ACTUAL production company from that country. I can film scenes of my movie in Sri Lanka. Doesn't make it an example of Sri Lankan cinema. Per your logic, all of the James Bond movies would have to list ALL of the countries they filmed is a being CO-Producers of the movie. Thanks for your understanding. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 15:01, 18 January 2012 (CST)

== Copyrights ==

The first time I saw the page on our copyright policy was blank I was actually going to redirect it [http://www.imfdb.org/w/images/5/52/DH1S%26W25-3.jpg here] :D [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 10:47, 16 January 2012 (CST)

== Re: P220 links ==

I verified the link worked when I corrected the edit. Now please quit acting like a kid picking at a scab and leave it alone. I am not in a good mood and do not need someone bitching at me about inane nonsense like this. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 03:33, 18 January 2012 (CST)

==hold off==
until a more refined definition can be made for the category. I SAID before, that the category should be redefined more formally. STOP pushing the issue. If you took the time to check you'd see why DOWNFALL fell out of the category you listed. QUIT trying to turn this into a debating match. I (and many of the other mods) don't have the time to endless debate a topic. I never expected someone to make it an issue, but it has. the James Bond example should have put an end to this discussion. Obviously it has not. You completely ignored it and the reasoning behind it. I'm not going to go into an endless debate with you on this. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 00:24, 19 January 2012 (CST)

== Thanks for the help ==

Just out of desperation, how do I upload the images to my talk page? Thanks once again. --[[User:Taurus96|Taurus96]] 13:21, 23 January 2012 (CST)

Talk:The Dark Knight Rises

2012-02-02T17:18:14Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Images from the film's prologue... */

==Unknowns==

[[File:DKR-Weapon-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Batman wields some sort of weapon or gadget.]]

== Images from the film's prologue... ==

Are they legal or from an officially released source relating to the movie or to the studios? Cause if they aren't (they look like they were captured from a camera inside a movie theater), then they should be taken down right away. The last thing we need is the studio lawyers coming after us for illegal, bootlegged images from an unreleased movie. --[[User:ThatoneguyJosh|ThatoneguyJosh]] 20:41, 31 January 2012 (CST)

How is it that this page may have Potential Spoilers? Has any real info even been released on the script?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:18, 2 February 2012 (CST)

Talk:Tom Hardy

2012-01-31T17:43:47Z

Spades of Columbia: /* not done yet */

== not done yet ==

Someone should do the mini series "The Take"...Tom Hardy is at his darkest most brutal character to date and its wonderful!...he is a damn animal and is become one of my favorites. I truely recommend "The Take" with its gritty and dark feel.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 17:51, 28 January 2012 (CST)
:Netflix has it on Instant View. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 17:56, 28 January 2012 (CST)

Yeah thats where i watched it...but im a idiot child when it comes to computer code. Love the series and would like to see more of Tom like his character.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 18:03, 28 January 2012 (CST)
:Hmm, four episodes. That's doable. Maybe after I finish a few things. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 18:08, 28 January 2012 (CST)

I dunno, man. Bronson was a pretty brutal character to play. I'll check out that series, though. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 20:53, 28 January 2012 (CST)
:after you watch it you have to tell me what character you think is more brutal...At this point i think Freddie could take Bane on as most dark and gritty.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:43, 31 January 2012 (CST)

Talk:Tom Hardy

2012-01-29T00:03:57Z

Spades of Columbia: /* not done yet */

Talk:Tom Hardy

2012-01-28T23:51:20Z

Spades of Columbia: not done yet

Talk:Red State

2012-01-26T01:56:01Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Well... */

== Well... ==
On addition to being one of the few Kevin Smith movies I really dislike you could tell a lot of the muzzle flashes were CGI especially some where the shots were done at extreme close range. --[[User:Charon68|Charon68]] 17:44, 25 January 2012 (CST)

:I refused to watch this. No counting the BAD PUN on anyone who is not a blue state liberal, it paints people to the right of center as some religious gun toting nuts. NOT the kind of stereotype we want of any gun owners. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 19:36, 25 January 2012 (CST)

I guess you should see it if thats what you think this movie is about...this is the most original movie Smith has ever made and he does a awesome job at making everyone look bad. It really has nothing to do with a stereotyping of gun owners or religous fanatics...it makes the government and law enforcement look more like morons then anything. And hey atleast its not Vulgar which is the worst movie that Smith has anything to do with.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:56, 25 January 2012 (CST)

Talk:Glock pistol series

2012-01-22T01:44:18Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Full Auto? */

2 Glocks (.45?) play prominet roles in the movie "Fracture" starring Anthony Hopkins. Don't know the model so I didn't edit the main page ([[Special:Contributions/80.121.38.199|80.121.38.199]] 18:10, 20 March 2008 (UTC))

__TOC__ 

==Other Glock Variations==
===Screen-Used===
[[Image:IMFDB P00261 Sopranos Tony Soprano Glock 19.jpg|thumb|none|350px|'''World IMFDB Exclusive:''' Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This blank firing weapon is verified as screen used by actor [[James Gandolfini]] in '''[[The Sopranos]]'''. More detailed images and purchasing information on this item can be found at [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/ The Golden Closet]; see [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/merchant/merchant.mvc?Session_ID=6ef04a13fbe759cbdcbdc6bc4c4b809f&Screen=PROD&Product_Code=P00261&Store_Code=TGC&search=Sopranos+Glock&offset=0&filter_cat=&PowerSearch_Begin_Only=&sort=&range_low=&range_high= here].]]
[[Image:P00650 Glock Full Left.jpg|thumb|350px|none|'''World IMFDB Exclusive:''' Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This non-firing prop weapon is verified as screen used from the film '''[[The Other Guys]]''', and was carried by [[Will Ferrell]] in the film. The gun is accompanied by the Galco belt holster also used in numerous scenes throughout the film.]]
[[Image:P00613.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This blank firing weapon is verified as screen used from the film ''[[Salt]]''. The gun has been modified to fire blank rounds only. This item is currently being sold by [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/ The Golden Closet]; see [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/merchant/merchant.mvc?Session_ID=6ef04a13fbe759cbdcbdc6bc4c4b809f&Screen=PROD&Product_Code=P00613&Store_Code=TGC&search=Salt&offset=0&filter_cat=&PowerSearch_Begin_Only=&sort=&range_low=&range_high= this link].]]
[[Image:MattDUlt.jpg|thumb|350px|none|The actual screen-used 3rd generation Glock 17 - 9mm from ''[[The Bourne Ultimatum]]''. This weapon was actually handled and fired by [[Matt Damon]]. Note the damage on the rail.]]

===Other Images===
[[File:Glock17ext.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 17 with 33 round magazine.]]
[[File:Glock17stainless ext.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 17 fitted with stainless slide and 33 round magazine.]]
[[Image:Glock_12892-1-.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 OD Green - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:Evolution.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Suppressed Glock 17 - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:BruniGAP-178mm.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Bruni GAP Glock 17 blank firing stage prop - 8mm blank]]
[[Image:Glock17RAM4.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 RAM - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:CAA.Tactical-RONI-G1.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 - 9x19mm mounted in a CAA Tactical RONI-G1.]]
[[Image:Pistol Austrian Glock 18 with 31 round magazine.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 18C with a 19 and 31 round magazine - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:Glock22left.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Glock 22 (2nd Generation) left side - .40 S&W.]]
[[Image:G17-1x400.JPG|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 3rd Generation with SureFire x400 attachment and extended 19-round magazine - 9x19mm. Similar to the gun used by [[Shemar Moore]] in ''[[Criminal Minds]]'']]
[[File:Saliant Arms glock 34.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Salient Arms International Glock 34 - 9x19mm]]

== Longslide versions get their own Glock Model Numbers? ==

It seems kind of odd to me as to why variations of Glock pistols available with longer barrels have their own unique model numbers. Many gun websites I've been to don't seem to list such customizations with their own unique model numbers (except maybe in inventory listings or the like), but rather just mention that a particular model of pistol has a longer barrel version available. Is such a practice just for convenient reference? To satisfy customer preferences? Or for some other reason?

By the way, I appreciate all the hard work the people here have done in identifying the various Glock pistols used in the media on this site. I'd find it pretty hard myself, since barring obvious visual differences like how to tell a full-size Glock from a subcompact one apart, I wouldn't be able to tell a G17 from a G22 without seeing the number on the slide in a movie, for instance, since they look substantially the same. Something like trying to tell a G22 from a G20 would also be quite difficult without hearing a character in a movie say its caliber out aloud or seeing the number on the slide, since they are chambered for similarly-sized cartridges. I don't think its entry on the date of this comment is correct--the real-life US Marshals use Glocks chambered for .40 S&W, not 10mm Auto.

About the only exception to the aforementioned practice on Glock's end is the Glock 20, which apparently now has a factory-made longslide version (not the aftermarket ones), but to my knowledge does not have a unique Glock model number. Can someone fill me in on this? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 06:15, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

== The "Glock invisible"-nonsense ==

Here's what [[Hugh Laurie]] (yes, the "House M. D."-guy) had to say about that in his novel "The gun seller":
"You may have read, at one time or another, some of the nonsense that’s been written about the Glock. The fact that its body is made from a fancy polymer material got one or two journalists very excited a while back about the possibility that the gun might not register on airport X-ray machines - which happens to be so much hooey. The slide, barrel, and a fair portion of its innards are metal, and if that weren’t enough, seventeen rounds of Parabellum ammunition are pretty hard to pass off as lipstick refills. What it does have is a high magazine capacity for a low weight, great accuracy, and virtually unequalled reliability. All of which have made the Glock 17 the choice of housewives everywhere."
Dr. House, I couldn't agree more.
--[[User:Lastgunslinger|Lastgunslinger]] 22:39, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

I have to admit that my whole perspective of Glock changed when they sued Smith & Wesson over the Sigma. I mean, they make more money from their handguns than any other company in the world and then they go and sue someone. The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all. I see the similarities but they are easily telled apart. Not a cool thing to do Glock, I wish you hadn't stooped down like that.

== 'Resembles Every Handgun' ==

"The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all."

It only resembles every handgun, because almost every brand has a Glock copy now. There wasn't anything like it back in 1982 when it was released. Back then its main competitors were the 1911, S&W 39, Berreta 92 and various wheel guns. Gunner313
Not to mention that S&W didn't just copy the Glock design they cloned it with parts that would fit into a Glock body, with potentially disastrous consequences.

A copy is a near exact of something. The S&W Sigma is the only Glock copy. The rest are just polymer pistols.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:29, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

I think he mans that is so genaric and non-descript in apperance that it has gained the status of being the genaric
icon for "pistol" among the populous, especially laymans.
An example being that I asked my parents (who know nothing of guns) to draw their interpretation of a pistol, what they drew was inescapeably a glock-like design.
I think this is because its basically just a rectangular prism with a very simple handguard on it, also its common use by police give it a good possition in the public eye even for those who avoid movies and other media for whatever reason.
Compaired to other self loading pistols the only competition I can see it having is the Beretta 92 serise of guns, also yes I think your point is very valad - other companies making sudo-glocks means that their image is even more common and that the layman will associate the image of a glock less with glocks and more with the term "pistol".
- annon

==Durability==
:Does anyone else find it ironic that Glock's are nigh indestructible but feel really fragile?-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 23:05, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
The Glocks I've fired, for the most part, don't feel extremely fragile. Sure, they don't have that 'all metal heft' that some other handguns have, which makes them lighter, and conceivably more fragile feeling, but none of mine have never felt like they would shatter if I dropped them. I might be misunderstanding what you mean, though. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 21:39, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
:It just about takes a nuclear blast to destroy one, but at the same time it feels like I could cruch it with my bare hands-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 20:45, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

I've never noticed them feeling fragille, but that could be because I can't get over how friggin' UNCOMFORTABLE they are to hold. I'm not trying bash glocks here, they just don't fit my hand. At all.--[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 00:48, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

==Catastrophic Failure ==
The Portland, Oregon police department stopped offering the .45 Glock 21 as an option for Officers to carry on duty after two incidents in which the weapons exploded in the hands of the range master during testing. Afterwards reports came in from across the country of similar incidents with the Glock 21. Do all Glocks chambered for powerful cartridges (.45, 10mm) have this problem or is it just the Glock 21? Furthermore do all Glock 21s have this issue or were these just a few rare accidents? I don't particularly like Glock pistols but never considered them dangerous (at least to the user) before hearing about these incidents.
-[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

Hmm. Given the problems that PPB has given Glock in the past (back in the early nineties they commented that "PBB is one of those customers we can't seem to ever make happy") I'm not surprised they blame the company rather than themselves. They also refused to fly to Smyrna to allow Glock to examine one of the pistols; they also refused to allow Glock to remove even one of the allegedly defective pistols for lab tests. The PPB also failed to submit either of the pistols for independent testing, despite stating that it would.

If there was a design flaw it would have shown up '''long''' before now. Glock has ~65% of the US LEA market, mostly in .40 and while the "Short and Weak" isn't nearly as powerful as 10mm Auto, it's generally loaded to higher pressures than .45 ACP

I've used the G20 and G29 (both chambered for the far more powerful 10mm Auto round) for years and haven't had a gun explode or do anything worse that FTE when used with poor ammunition. A few years back we torture tested one with 15,000rds in a single day, it didn't explode.

It's not just .45 and 10mm. I've personally seen a glock 17 explode with factory ammo. Not a pretty sight. --[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 00:55, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

== Portland Police and its standards ==

The Portland Police Bureau is a strange department. I've known experienced officers who have tried to get on with the PPB only to be told that they didn't meet Portland's criteria. In a couple cases they were experienced Oregon certified officers from neighboring cities. One of them spent a year in Kosovo with the U.N. civil police training task force. It's a strange city with an odd police administration. I've known a few good cops who work for Portland, but overall I'm glad that I never applied with the PPB.Ultimately I believe the politics of that part of Oregon would have driven me crazy.Very very LEFT WING. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 15:40, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

-----------------------------------------------------------------

It's only certain Glock models that do it. I've noticed it a lot on the .40 S&W models such as the 22 or 23. The problem is that in order to increase more reliable feeding as well as to make the gun cycle more reliably, Glocks have more of their chambers cut away, which leaves parts of the case unsupported. They count on the casing to hold in the powder load. I think it happens mostly on the larger cartridges such as 10mm Auto, .40 S&W or .45ACP. Haven't heard of it happening on any of the .45GAP models though. I'm personally not a big fan of Glock pistols. I don't find them very visually appealing and I hate the lack of a manual safety. And I really, really dislike the trigger they make on it. They need to take off the little lever in the trigger, and just go to a solid double action trigger and put a manual safety on it. I'm a 1911 man, but I think there are many other designs that are better than Glock's. For example, Sig Sauer or H&K. Or Springfield's XD series. S&W Sigma. I mean the list goes on and on. I won't buy a Glock for the reasons I mentioned above. Right now, all I own are 1911s and one H&K USP .45.

:I'm a bit confused. You say that you do not like Glock pistols because you find them unattractive and you prefer a manual safety, both of which are valid reasons. But then you claim that designs from SIG Sauer, H&K USP, the Springfield XD, and the S&W Sigma -- all of which, save for a few specialty models, do not have a manual safety -- are superior to the Glock design. That just doesn't make sense. It's perfectly fine to dislike Glock pistols, but to claim that they are inferior to other designs for lacking a manual safety, when those very other designs also lack manual safeties, is rather odd. [[Special:Contributions/68.39.83.179|68.39.83.179]] 22:07, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

::I've only had hands-on experience with the Glock 21 myself. Me and my sister shot one on my birthday this year, and she had the Glock malfunction on her too, albeit not nearly as severely as the incidents mentioned above. She pulled the trigger and the weapon failed to discharge. When I cleared the chamber, I found that the pin had missed the primer and struck the back of the casing. After that though we didn't have any further problems with the weapon, that being the only round out of 50 we put through the Glock 21 that had a misfire. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 03:19, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

Not sure on the Sigma, but the XD has a grip safety, and most sigs have de-cockers. I don't know if those meets your definition of 'manual safety', but they're certainly more than glock has.--[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 15:40, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

==Glock 18==
what would a fully automatic pistol be used for? VIPs protection and CQC
There was a fad for such machine pistols (VP-70 and M-93R for other examples).

But the Personal defense weapon have taken this firearm nitch and more. Rex095

Sort of like lasers when they first came out.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:24, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

what do you mean? about the lasers

Lasers were thought to be the end-all substitute for irons yet now they are just seen as a gimmick.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:32, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

It's not really a gimmick today. People still use lasers to aim, distract someone by aiming at their eyes and for small frame guns where the iron sights are bad, like a pocket gun [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 14:57, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

== Generation 4 Glocks ==

I realized that the page is laking the Gen 4 Glock 17 and Gen 4 Glock 22 --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 17:34, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Added the Gen 4 model for Glock 22--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 17:49, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

:The picture you posted is not a 4th Generation Glock; it is an RTF (Rough Texture Frame) model, which is not the same thing. The main difference between the 4th Gen Glocks and older models is that they now have removable backstraps. And anyway, we don't need the picture until we know they've appeared in movies (and at the rate armorers buy new pistols, no time soon.) IMFDB's policy is that we don't need a picture of every variant of a gun that has ever existed (at least not on the gun's page), and ''especially'' if it hasn't appeared in anything yet. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:23, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Well that and the fact that the 4th Generation also has a captive recoil spring, but of course how in the hell do you show that? Shot a 4th Gen G17 today at the range. Very nice. Recovery is all that much faster. I was impressed. The company will be coming out with the 4th Gen G19 in a month or so. However the 4th Gen G21SF isn't due out until next year. Sorry 45 acp mafia. I was talking to one of the corporate guys so I feel confident that he knows what he's talking about. Anyway just some nice to know trivia.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 05:11, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

== Glock 34 ==

Just looking at the section for the [[Glock 34]], only [[End of Days]] and [[Man on Fire]]. In both movies, It's used by the Main Character to attempt suicide. That's gonna be a good ad campaign: "''When You Can't Go On Anymore, Reach For Your Glock 34''"

==1st Generation==
Did the first generation of Glock pistols feature anything other than the Glock 17? I've seen second and third generation versions of nearly every model, but the only first generation pistols I've ever seen are Glock 17s. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

A small number of first generation Glock 19's were made. - [[User:Right Wing Gun Nut|Right Wing Gun Nut]]

It should have only been in the glock 17...and you shouldn't see one easily because they didn't meet ATF regulation until the generation 2.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 22:25, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

What reg did they not meet?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:34, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

:1st Gen Glock 19s do exist, but they're very rare, because Glock went to the checkered front/backstraps on all of its pistols shortly after production began. Also, the Glock 17L and Glock 18 both exist in 1st generation incarnations (though they're also pretty rare). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:04, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

::So there were other 1st generation models than the 17, but were all 1st generation guns 9mms? -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

To meet American ATF regulations, a steel plate with a stamped serial number was embedded into the dust cover in front of the trigger guard for generation 2. I have seen no evidence of a first generation glock being in any other model than the 17. Even the people that claim they have a generation 1 glock 19 still only show pictures of a generation 2...so i would need to see proof on anything other model being in generation 1. but my knowledge is limited to what's available in the normal U.S.A. for some glock models are not legal to have in the states.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:55, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

:Gen 1 Glock 19s do exist. Check out [http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=887305 this topic] from GlockTalk. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:26, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

==Other models==
Why were the models that were removed before put back? I thought IMFDB didn't allow sections for variants of a gun that haven't appeared in any media. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::See Stan's post below, and also the Glock 20 that was deleted actually WAS in something. When we went to link it, surprise, it wasn't there because it had been removed. Not a good thing. Any SERIES of guns, do not remove the interim gun series entries ever. They are there for continuity in the SERIES of models. The only guns we remove are the weird single gun entries that some member jacked off of google and won't appear in a movie, etc. ever, and if they do, only then do we create the page. The only exception is guns that are in active armorer inventory NOW. That means that there is a much HIGHER chance of them being seen, and we need the gun pics to help members positively ID them. Hope this helps. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 18:51, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::When the Glock variants were initially deleted I mentioned that having gaps in the list of different models seemed odd, yet those who deleted them responded that any weapons or variants of weapons that have not appeared in media are subject to deletion. I like that the different variants have been restored to the list, I was just curious as to what the procedure was for guns that are variants of weapons that have appeared in films though that specific variant had not since I had heard conflicting information. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::::- Yeah, that was me. I found it irksome to have several models (mainly new ones), that weren't listed or even linked to anything, it was annoying to me. I still think that in regards to the newest 30 model guns, but that's just me. BUT, as MPM said, they are still standard guns of the same series, and many are in inventory, so they'll be used in something eventually (If indeed they haven't already and we just don't have pages, etc). I think the main problem was getting rid of older guns like the 20 that are ''definitely'' in stuff already and should be there accordingly. A couple of the other guns are also linked to pages but just don't have them listed - I'll go ahead and add the listing(s) myself if they're listed on complete pages and/or positively ID'd. Otherwise, you could just say they're being proactive. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:23, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

-Original Reply- 
I replaced the sections I previously deleted by request of MoviePropMaster2008. Essentially they are for reference right now. However, there are also a sort of placeholder as well - MPM has stated on other pages that such guns are in movie inventory, so eventually they'll get listings/entries - As such, the sections are to remain so that they don't have to be re-created later. A couple of the guns are already linked on pages I believe, but the pages may not be complete or they may not be listed for some other reason. I did remove them because at the time they weren't featured in anything, but it really wasn't my call to remove them in the first place. (EDIT - removed MPM's paraphrased personal message to me, as he posted himself). [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 05:36, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::I should point that I am highly skeptical of some of the Glocks IDs that are supposedly [[Glock 20]]s. The episode of ''[[Psych]]'' in which [[John Cena]] supposedly uses a Glock 20 is wrong; I've seen that episode, and he uses a Glock 17L. I'm equally doubtful that the Glock 20 appears in Season 4 of ''[[24]]''. Since we know that (as a rule) movie armorers rarely use any Glocks that aren't 9x19mm, I can't help but wonder if people are going to be tempted to mis-identify Glocks if they see these other variants on the page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 20:39, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Fair enough, and I'm not defending some of these questionable attributions, but I had to replace a pic for a VIDEO game where the gun was a specific variant of weapon (and was specifically NAMED in the game as an off caliber variant), so we still needed the section. Also foreign helmed films don't have the ammo biases that we in the States do ;) the sheer CHANCE that folks will mis-identify the gun is not reason enough to NOT have the section. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 20:44, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

:::- Well, in the case of those shows, I'll remove the TV subsection until they're confirmed. I will put in the VG entries, though, as they aren't questionable. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:50, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::::Whoa whoa whoa STOP!!!!! Don't remove ANYTHING!!! IMFDB users should look long and hard and try to correctly ID guns, but for now just creating a BLANK space is unacceptable. What is WITH this rush to delete everything all of a sudden? If you don't have correct info to replace it with, DON'T DELETE IT! YOu can put a disclaimer on the various discussion pages (that there may be a question as to whether or not the gun ID is correct), but I dont' want to start seeing blocks of empty space. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 21:47, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::- Uh, wait a minute, the only thing I removed was the TV section for the Glock 20, and that's it. Nothing else. Most of the gun sections I replaced from the other day were '''already blank''' - they didn't have anything before. Again, the TV listing subsection for the Glock 20 section was the '''only''' thing I've removed since I put all the other guns back, and I've since already restored it. Outside of that and adding some subsections to a couple of the guns, I haven't touched the rest of the page. Not trying to give ya a headache MPM, but I really haven't done that much this time, honest. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 23:45, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Sorry, I was just reeling from the previous Glock debacle where I spent an entire morning rephotographing a Glock variant, only to realize later that it had been previously there, but deleted. My brain is still traumatized ;) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 00:53, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
::- Yeah, I still feel real bad about that.. I'll probably never live that down. Bah. ;b [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 00:59, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

==First appearance==
I remember one of our movie pages pointing out that that film was the first appearance of a Glock Pistol in a movie. Does anyone know which movie that was because I can't remember.

: Don't know. The earliest-set movie page I can immediately spot a Glock (Glock 17) on is [[To Live and Die in L.A.]] (1985), but I'm not certain if that is it. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 04:41, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

That's not it. We have a page of a movie from the early 80s where the page explicitly states that this is the first appearance of a Glock in film.

:
::I'm pretty skeptical that ''[[To Live and Die in L.A.]]'' features a Glock, because they were not being imported to this country for the civilian market at the time the movie was filmed. Though I guess I'd have to see the movie to be sure. Season 3 of ''[[Miami Vice - Season 3|Miami Vice]]'' featured a Glock 17 in one episode (which was used by [[Don Johnson]]), and that's the earliest documented appearance of a Glock that we have on this site so far besides ''To Live and Die in L.A.''.

::''We have a page of a movie from the early 80s where the page explicitly states that this is the first appearance of a Glock in film.''

::Which page? I just checked all of the pages which feature our 1st gen Glock 17 picture, and didn't see any movies from the early-80s. Also, I'm skeptical because the first Glock 17s available to civilians didn't start coming into the U.S. until 1985, so it's pretty much impossible for any movie/TV show filmed before that to feature a Glock (unless it was filmed in Europe or some other country where Glocks were available sooner). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 13:15, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::- Not to increase the load, but it might be worth checking under the second gen picture also. After all, not pages pages use the accurate gun picture, whether because they didn't know about the specific differences/generation release dates when they made the page or because the Gen 1 picture wasn't actually around and no one updated the thumbnail. Just a thought. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 16:49, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::I have tried watching To Live and Die in L.A. and get a better cap, it just looks like a black gun to me. [[Johnny Handsome]] featured a Glock, it was released in '89. There's got to be a film before that. That Miami Vice episode aired Jan '87. Good idea about checking the 2nd gen pic. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 16:47, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

::::Point taken on the 2nd Gen G17 pic, I forgot about that. But I don't envy the person who has to sort through all the pages on which it appears (nearly 250 in total, last I looked). But I can still tell y'all that you're highly unlikely to see a Glock in any movie made before 1985, for the reason I mentioned earlier. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:10, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:: That's not even counting those that ''don't'' have a gun image, or.. well, you get the point. Bah. I'm afraid we may not find out what page it is, unless Anon's memory gets better. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 22:44, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::I just checked all of the page links for all three Glock 17 images. So far, I can't find any movies or TV shows other than the ones mentioned previously that have featured Glocks. Of course, there is still the possibility that somebody forgot to put ''any'' image for some movie that featured a Glock, but I imagine we'd have caught that by now.

:::So, I have reached the following conclusion:

:::*Season 3 of ''[[Miami Vice - Season 3|Miami Vice]]'' is the first media appearance of a Glock 17, movie or TV.
:::*''[[Johnny Handsome]]'' is the first known movie to feature a Glock 17.

:::Unless someone finds any earlier appearances (and has the screencaps to prove it), these are the first media appearances of Glocks. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

: Well, it's a page done by Pred, and the section says 'one of the earliest appearances of a Glock', so that's probably what Anonymous was talking about. If not, then we need to kill him for even bringing this up. :b [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 00:54, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
Yes, that is the page I was talking about, I just couldn't remember it. Please don't kill me. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::: Sure, but only because you said please. Mystery solved then? [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 15:29, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

::Wow look at that, I don't even like Glocks. I don't know if either of you two have seen Johnny Handsome. The gun dealer gave a little explanation about the gun, made in Austria, plastic etc. I just glad it beat Die Hard 2. When I wrote the comment I figured another film had to have featured it before JH that's why I said one of the earliest uses not the first. Unless another comes up with an appearance before JH, [[Mickey Rourke]] has both the first usage of the Desert Eagle and Glock in a film.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 01:06, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Alright I changed both the pages. If someone has better wording to use, go for it. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 01:20, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

== Removal of Variants that have not been seen in media ==

I was just re-reading the [[Rules, Standards and Principles]] page and was wondering if anyone has a problem removing the Glock models 24, 28, 29, and 37 - 39 as they have yet to appear in any movies/anime/games. It looks like alot of effort was put into this page so I just want check before making any changes.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 06:08, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
::'''Good thing you asked, since I would have been pretty pissed at you if you made such a major change without checking first.''' We've had this come up before. A previous member took it upon himself to remove a Glock variant which has not listed, and then, BEHOLD! it was obviously apparent in some movie or tv listing, so ANOTHER member, seeing that we didn't have the section (it had been deleted) copied a jacked GOOGLE image of the gun and re-created the section. I, seeing a CRAP google image thought "hmmm, I could have sworn I photographed that type of Glock for this page already", so I spent the entire morning rephotographing that model of Glock for the Glock page. When I tried to re-upload the photo, IMFDB warned me that this photo already existed. I was "WTF?" By tracking down the history of the page, I tracked down the member who DELETED the glock section and admonished them that it was just creating problems, since a few days AFTER he deleted it, the model appeared in something. So the rule is: DON'T REMOVE ANY VARIANTS on ANY PAGE, ESPECIALLY IF THEY ARE MPM MOVIE ARMORY PHOTOGRAPHS (which were done specifically FOR IMFDB). Thanks for your attention in this matter :) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 06:56, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
:I would leave it, Glocks are hard to tell apart sometimes. So it's good to have all the models on the page for reference. It's not like a user creating an entire new page for a gun that hasn't appeared.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 06:26, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

:::Damn propmaster no need to yell man. There's a reason I asked in here first. Maybe you should add the blurb about not removing variants pictured by armorers in the rules section. That's the only reason I brought up the question in the first place.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 06:29, 27 November 2010 (UTC)
::::It's not yelling, it's emphasizing. And sorry if it seemed that way. As for the emphasis, it was for all members. You at least asked, but I must emphasize again, if any member MUST do something, try adding to lame pages, resist the temptation to delete other people's work. Leave that to the mods, unless its something ridiculous. MPM

== Numbers ==
Anyone know how Glock comes up with the numbers for their handguns?--[[User:MarineCorps1|MarineCorps1]] 21:18, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

They are in the order that they were released...starting with the model 17 for it was the 17th patient to get it what it is today. But some people say that the original name came because it holds 17rds then in the order they were released--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 22:15, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

:Another theory is, if Wikipedia is to be believed, that the Austrian army set out a list of 17 requirements when they were looking for a new pistol to replace the Walther P38. In order for any pistol to be considered for the trials, it had to pass all 17 requirements. The Glock was called the 17 because it was designed specifically with thes standards in mind. Even if this isn't the source of the name, it's still an amusing coincidence. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

== Glock 30 & Glock 36 ==

Can someone explain the Difference between the Glock 30 and Glock 36. They both look like Sub-Compact Glocks in 45. ACP. [[Image:Glock30.jpg|thumb|200px|none|Glock 30 .45 ACP]][[Image:Glock36.jpg|thumb|200px|none|Glock 36 .45 ACP]]
:Glock 36 is a single stack, Glock 30 is a double stack. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 03:21, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
:Not to mention the Glock 36, while subcompact like the 30, also sports a slimline frame, just 1.13 inches wide and roughly six inches long.--[[User:LordOfTheLocusts|LordOfTheLocusts]] 13:50, 18 December 2011 (CST)

== 18 vs 18C? ==

Just wondering, is there any difference between the Glock 18 and Glock 18C? I think the proper name is 18C, but correct me if I'm wrong.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 13:26, 14 June 2011 (CDT)
:The C models include a built-in compensator, noted by a rectangular slot cut out in the top-front section of the slide and the compensator ports in the barrel. And yes, 18C is the correct name. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:18, 14 June 2011 (CDT)

== Full Auto? ==

Can other Glock pistols be converted to fire in full-auto, like the Glock 17-impersonating-Glock 18? Specifically, the 19 and 21 models? [[User:MrOshimida27|MrOshimida27]] 18:21, 16 August 2011 (CDT)

:Probably yes. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:46, 17 October 2011 (CDT)
::I've seen FA conversions of the Glock 19, 20, 22, and 26. Also shot a FA conversion 17. Fun weapons but not quite as reliable as a factory conversion IMO. Then again the 17 had been shot all day.[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 02:35, 18 October 2011 (CDT)

In the Dark Knight the joker uses a glock 17 converted to fire full auto.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:44, 21 January 2012 (CST)

== Glocks in shooters ==

hey yall i was just wondering if you knew if their were any FPS games that included a normal glock. when i say normal i mean all minus the 18, it is a ridiculous gun and has very little practical use. my preference is the Glock 21 but i would like to no if there is any notable games that have any model (minus 18) thanks. [[User:Dirtdiver6421|Dirtdiver6421]] 20:37, 17 October 2011 (CDT)
:Did you even try looking in the listings on the page? Because I see several listed there.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 21:31, 17 October 2011 (CDT)

::And the Glock 18 is not a ridiculous weapon and ''is'' practical if you know how to use it right (especially the "C" model). - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:44, 17 October 2011 (CDT)

== .380 ACP Glocks ==

Hey all. I edited the Glock 25 and 28 sections to say:

*The Glock 28/25 will very likely never be seen in an American produced film because it is illegal to import in the United States. Since that the ATF ruled it as having no sporting purpose, the only way it will be featured in a film is if the movie is completely produced in a foreign country that has maximum caliber restrictions.

These guns have a less than .01% chance of being seen in films. Just giving a heads up --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 08:04, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, or if the ATF changes the rules (I know, yeah right, but it's not impossible), or if it's an Airsoft gun or mock-up, or it's stock footage, or a dozen other ways you could probably think up. Try to avoid attempting to predict the future on a gun page. Also, "completely produced?" Haven't you ever heard of "on location?" [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 08:28, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

*Airsoft doesn't make Glock 25/28's, on top of the fact that it's now illegal to produce Glock mock ups now because Glock sued for patent infringement a year or two back. This includes the S&W Sigma series (Glock clones), Airsoft guns, and blank guns. Even if the gun could be used, do you know how hard it is to make a straight blowback gun fire blanks? It just isn't worth the effort. The ATF will not change the rules unless the supreme court miraculously changes the law, which is next to 0% unless people start voting with their brains. Lastly, "on location" filming still has American owned guns used, therefore those Glocks will not be seen. Trust me man, it ain't happening.

PS. I saw your edit on the Glock 25. The Glock 25 can't be imported no matter what. Law enforcement or not, they CAN'T. Also, Brazil has a maximum energy ban (nothing bigger than .380 for handguns,) not a "military caliber" ban. I'm going to fix those parts. --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 09:30, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:On location filming doesn't necessarily have American guns used. ''Rambo III'', for example, was American-produced but filmed partly in Israel and used stocks of weapons that would be impossible to get in the US, such as real DShK machine guns. The same arrangement (location filming with a local armourer) would make it far from impossible for these weapons to appear in a US-produced movie. Also, I'm fairly sure you're wrong. Here's the section of the relevant law:

:"If importing NFA and non-sporting weapons, please ensure an official government contract, purchase order, or letter typed on official law enforcement and/or government letterhead, bearing the original signature of the chief law enforcement official having jurisdiction over that area, is attached to the completed Form 6."

:The 25 is a "non-sporting weapon" because it fails the import test, but that doesn't stop a government or law enforcement ''agency'' buying it. It does mean ''individual'' officers can't import them, though.

:Also, IIRC didn't Glock do something weird like trademark the shape of their weapons rather than sue for patents? I think H&K did the same with the MP5 at about the same time. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 10:45, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Pretty much. They sued because the imitations were substantially identical to the iconic Glock shape. Just so you know, the Glock company is a bunch of jerks.

When it comes to using other country's armorers/weapons, it usually doesn't happen. Rambo can be the exception, but 99.99% of the time it's cheaper to mock up existing weapons and use your own armorer than to go out of the way for the real deal when usually no one will know the difference.

Also, that ATF letter is only true in name only. Regardless of signatures or agency, the request to import still has to be approved by the ATF, which it NEVER is. Look around. There are no post '86 machine guns or "non sporting" weapons used by ANY LE agency in the US (not talking about the ARMY/NAVY/Etc.) because the letters are NEVER approved. There's a couple A1 M16's with A2 uppers and MP5's with a pre '86 trigger group in use, but that's about it for LE agencies special guns usage, and all of those are pre '86 weapons.--[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 11:35, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, and a LE agency isn't going to be jumping through hoops to buy a .380 ACP pistol anyway, but it's enough to say that only LE and government could even ''theoretically'' import them according to the law for purposes of the page; it's ''not'' true to say they can't legally be imported when the law says they can be. I do agree with you that it's stunningly unlikely for a number of reasons, I just dislike terms like "impossible" being thrown around because I'm horribly pedantic. :) [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:40, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Agreed. Especially when they can pick up a just-as-good Beretta 84 without the blinking of an eye. I noticed you live in England. Here in America, there are a couple laws which supposedly make certain things allowable with the right approval, however approval never comes and those permits are deemed impossible to obtain.

Some states allow the carrying of a handgun at 18 years old, but Sheriffs won't sign off on it, well just because. In New Jersey, you are allowed to carry a handgun, but to get the permit you need a "justifiable cause," and it happens that the only justifiable one they see is carrying more than $500,000 a day for work. Apparently my self defense isn't important enough to them. It's the same with the ATF. They don't like it, you can't have it. Unfortunately it isn't constitutional, but the judges here don't quite have the guts to end their illegal rule right now. Thanks for reading my rant ;) --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 11:52, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, everywhere has laws that technically exist but aren't enforced properly. Though ours mostly tend to have more to do with extremely precise ways for it to be legal to murder the Welsh. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:56, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Bingo. Nice job with the edit too by the way --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 12:51, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Hollywood is not the only people that make Movies...In fact there are hundreds of movies made every year without america having anything to do with them...and most of the time they are better off for it. Just because a gun is outlawed in the USA does not mean that it cant be used by another country that might decide to make a movie that may some day grace the pages of IMFDB.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:40, 21 January 2012 (CST)

== Glock 18 selector switch ==

Is the slide mounted selector switch on the Glock 18 on both sides of the slide or just the left side? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 14:34, 8 January 2012 (CST)
:Left side only --[[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] 14:56, 8 January 2012 (CST)
::Well that complicates things. Thanks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 15:08, 8 January 2012 (CST)

== Naming of glocks ==

Does anyone know the story behind the naming of the Glocks? Why did they start with 17? --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 21:26, 20 January 2012 (CST)
:The Glock 17 holds 17 rounds, but where they went from there I have no idea.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 22:00, 20 January 2012 (CST)
::Is that REALLY why its called the Glock 17?!?! --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 22:01, 20 January 2012 (CST)

No its not. It came from one of these two things:
The Glock 17 was called the Glock 17 because it was Gaston Glock's 17th patent.
OR
There were 17 criteria the Austrian military had for their new pistol, that the Glock was made to meet.

Its pretty up in the air, and I've heard both stories from GLOCK reps.
-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 10:03, 21 January 2012 (CST)

all the other numbers are in order in which they where made and interduced...the 17 being the first production model followed by the 18 and so on. So the 10mm models where made and interduced before the .45acp models.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:43, 21 January 2012 (CST)

Talk:Glock pistol series

2012-01-22T01:43:24Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Naming of glocks */

2 Glocks (.45?) play prominet roles in the movie "Fracture" starring Anthony Hopkins. Don't know the model so I didn't edit the main page ([[Special:Contributions/80.121.38.199|80.121.38.199]] 18:10, 20 March 2008 (UTC))

__TOC__ 

==Other Glock Variations==
===Screen-Used===
[[Image:IMFDB P00261 Sopranos Tony Soprano Glock 19.jpg|thumb|none|350px|'''World IMFDB Exclusive:''' Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This blank firing weapon is verified as screen used by actor [[James Gandolfini]] in '''[[The Sopranos]]'''. More detailed images and purchasing information on this item can be found at [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/ The Golden Closet]; see [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/merchant/merchant.mvc?Session_ID=6ef04a13fbe759cbdcbdc6bc4c4b809f&Screen=PROD&Product_Code=P00261&Store_Code=TGC&search=Sopranos+Glock&offset=0&filter_cat=&PowerSearch_Begin_Only=&sort=&range_low=&range_high= here].]]
[[Image:P00650 Glock Full Left.jpg|thumb|350px|none|'''World IMFDB Exclusive:''' Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This non-firing prop weapon is verified as screen used from the film '''[[The Other Guys]]''', and was carried by [[Will Ferrell]] in the film. The gun is accompanied by the Galco belt holster also used in numerous scenes throughout the film.]]
[[Image:P00613.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This blank firing weapon is verified as screen used from the film ''[[Salt]]''. The gun has been modified to fire blank rounds only. This item is currently being sold by [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/ The Golden Closet]; see [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/merchant/merchant.mvc?Session_ID=6ef04a13fbe759cbdcbdc6bc4c4b809f&Screen=PROD&Product_Code=P00613&Store_Code=TGC&search=Salt&offset=0&filter_cat=&PowerSearch_Begin_Only=&sort=&range_low=&range_high= this link].]]
[[Image:MattDUlt.jpg|thumb|350px|none|The actual screen-used 3rd generation Glock 17 - 9mm from ''[[The Bourne Ultimatum]]''. This weapon was actually handled and fired by [[Matt Damon]]. Note the damage on the rail.]]

===Other Images===
[[File:Glock17ext.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 17 with 33 round magazine.]]
[[File:Glock17stainless ext.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 17 fitted with stainless slide and 33 round magazine.]]
[[Image:Glock_12892-1-.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 OD Green - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:Evolution.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Suppressed Glock 17 - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:BruniGAP-178mm.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Bruni GAP Glock 17 blank firing stage prop - 8mm blank]]
[[Image:Glock17RAM4.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 RAM - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:CAA.Tactical-RONI-G1.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 - 9x19mm mounted in a CAA Tactical RONI-G1.]]
[[Image:Pistol Austrian Glock 18 with 31 round magazine.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 18C with a 19 and 31 round magazine - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:Glock22left.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Glock 22 (2nd Generation) left side - .40 S&W.]]
[[Image:G17-1x400.JPG|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 3rd Generation with SureFire x400 attachment and extended 19-round magazine - 9x19mm. Similar to the gun used by [[Shemar Moore]] in ''[[Criminal Minds]]'']]
[[File:Saliant Arms glock 34.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Salient Arms International Glock 34 - 9x19mm]]

== Longslide versions get their own Glock Model Numbers? ==

It seems kind of odd to me as to why variations of Glock pistols available with longer barrels have their own unique model numbers. Many gun websites I've been to don't seem to list such customizations with their own unique model numbers (except maybe in inventory listings or the like), but rather just mention that a particular model of pistol has a longer barrel version available. Is such a practice just for convenient reference? To satisfy customer preferences? Or for some other reason?

By the way, I appreciate all the hard work the people here have done in identifying the various Glock pistols used in the media on this site. I'd find it pretty hard myself, since barring obvious visual differences like how to tell a full-size Glock from a subcompact one apart, I wouldn't be able to tell a G17 from a G22 without seeing the number on the slide in a movie, for instance, since they look substantially the same. Something like trying to tell a G22 from a G20 would also be quite difficult without hearing a character in a movie say its caliber out aloud or seeing the number on the slide, since they are chambered for similarly-sized cartridges. I don't think its entry on the date of this comment is correct--the real-life US Marshals use Glocks chambered for .40 S&W, not 10mm Auto.

About the only exception to the aforementioned practice on Glock's end is the Glock 20, which apparently now has a factory-made longslide version (not the aftermarket ones), but to my knowledge does not have a unique Glock model number. Can someone fill me in on this? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 06:15, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

== The "Glock invisible"-nonsense ==

Here's what [[Hugh Laurie]] (yes, the "House M. D."-guy) had to say about that in his novel "The gun seller":
"You may have read, at one time or another, some of the nonsense that’s been written about the Glock. The fact that its body is made from a fancy polymer material got one or two journalists very excited a while back about the possibility that the gun might not register on airport X-ray machines - which happens to be so much hooey. The slide, barrel, and a fair portion of its innards are metal, and if that weren’t enough, seventeen rounds of Parabellum ammunition are pretty hard to pass off as lipstick refills. What it does have is a high magazine capacity for a low weight, great accuracy, and virtually unequalled reliability. All of which have made the Glock 17 the choice of housewives everywhere."
Dr. House, I couldn't agree more.
--[[User:Lastgunslinger|Lastgunslinger]] 22:39, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

I have to admit that my whole perspective of Glock changed when they sued Smith & Wesson over the Sigma. I mean, they make more money from their handguns than any other company in the world and then they go and sue someone. The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all. I see the similarities but they are easily telled apart. Not a cool thing to do Glock, I wish you hadn't stooped down like that.

== 'Resembles Every Handgun' ==

"The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all."

It only resembles every handgun, because almost every brand has a Glock copy now. There wasn't anything like it back in 1982 when it was released. Back then its main competitors were the 1911, S&W 39, Berreta 92 and various wheel guns. Gunner313
Not to mention that S&W didn't just copy the Glock design they cloned it with parts that would fit into a Glock body, with potentially disastrous consequences.

A copy is a near exact of something. The S&W Sigma is the only Glock copy. The rest are just polymer pistols.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:29, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

I think he mans that is so genaric and non-descript in apperance that it has gained the status of being the genaric
icon for "pistol" among the populous, especially laymans.
An example being that I asked my parents (who know nothing of guns) to draw their interpretation of a pistol, what they drew was inescapeably a glock-like design.
I think this is because its basically just a rectangular prism with a very simple handguard on it, also its common use by police give it a good possition in the public eye even for those who avoid movies and other media for whatever reason.
Compaired to other self loading pistols the only competition I can see it having is the Beretta 92 serise of guns, also yes I think your point is very valad - other companies making sudo-glocks means that their image is even more common and that the layman will associate the image of a glock less with glocks and more with the term "pistol".
- annon

==Durability==
:Does anyone else find it ironic that Glock's are nigh indestructible but feel really fragile?-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 23:05, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
The Glocks I've fired, for the most part, don't feel extremely fragile. Sure, they don't have that 'all metal heft' that some other handguns have, which makes them lighter, and conceivably more fragile feeling, but none of mine have never felt like they would shatter if I dropped them. I might be misunderstanding what you mean, though. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 21:39, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
:It just about takes a nuclear blast to destroy one, but at the same time it feels like I could cruch it with my bare hands-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 20:45, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

I've never noticed them feeling fragille, but that could be because I can't get over how friggin' UNCOMFORTABLE they are to hold. I'm not trying bash glocks here, they just don't fit my hand. At all.--[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 00:48, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

==Catastrophic Failure ==
The Portland, Oregon police department stopped offering the .45 Glock 21 as an option for Officers to carry on duty after two incidents in which the weapons exploded in the hands of the range master during testing. Afterwards reports came in from across the country of similar incidents with the Glock 21. Do all Glocks chambered for powerful cartridges (.45, 10mm) have this problem or is it just the Glock 21? Furthermore do all Glock 21s have this issue or were these just a few rare accidents? I don't particularly like Glock pistols but never considered them dangerous (at least to the user) before hearing about these incidents.
-[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

Hmm. Given the problems that PPB has given Glock in the past (back in the early nineties they commented that "PBB is one of those customers we can't seem to ever make happy") I'm not surprised they blame the company rather than themselves. They also refused to fly to Smyrna to allow Glock to examine one of the pistols; they also refused to allow Glock to remove even one of the allegedly defective pistols for lab tests. The PPB also failed to submit either of the pistols for independent testing, despite stating that it would.

If there was a design flaw it would have shown up '''long''' before now. Glock has ~65% of the US LEA market, mostly in .40 and while the "Short and Weak" isn't nearly as powerful as 10mm Auto, it's generally loaded to higher pressures than .45 ACP

I've used the G20 and G29 (both chambered for the far more powerful 10mm Auto round) for years and haven't had a gun explode or do anything worse that FTE when used with poor ammunition. A few years back we torture tested one with 15,000rds in a single day, it didn't explode.

It's not just .45 and 10mm. I've personally seen a glock 17 explode with factory ammo. Not a pretty sight. --[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 00:55, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

== Portland Police and its standards ==

The Portland Police Bureau is a strange department. I've known experienced officers who have tried to get on with the PPB only to be told that they didn't meet Portland's criteria. In a couple cases they were experienced Oregon certified officers from neighboring cities. One of them spent a year in Kosovo with the U.N. civil police training task force. It's a strange city with an odd police administration. I've known a few good cops who work for Portland, but overall I'm glad that I never applied with the PPB.Ultimately I believe the politics of that part of Oregon would have driven me crazy.Very very LEFT WING. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 15:40, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

-----------------------------------------------------------------

It's only certain Glock models that do it. I've noticed it a lot on the .40 S&W models such as the 22 or 23. The problem is that in order to increase more reliable feeding as well as to make the gun cycle more reliably, Glocks have more of their chambers cut away, which leaves parts of the case unsupported. They count on the casing to hold in the powder load. I think it happens mostly on the larger cartridges such as 10mm Auto, .40 S&W or .45ACP. Haven't heard of it happening on any of the .45GAP models though. I'm personally not a big fan of Glock pistols. I don't find them very visually appealing and I hate the lack of a manual safety. And I really, really dislike the trigger they make on it. They need to take off the little lever in the trigger, and just go to a solid double action trigger and put a manual safety on it. I'm a 1911 man, but I think there are many other designs that are better than Glock's. For example, Sig Sauer or H&K. Or Springfield's XD series. S&W Sigma. I mean the list goes on and on. I won't buy a Glock for the reasons I mentioned above. Right now, all I own are 1911s and one H&K USP .45.

:I'm a bit confused. You say that you do not like Glock pistols because you find them unattractive and you prefer a manual safety, both of which are valid reasons. But then you claim that designs from SIG Sauer, H&K USP, the Springfield XD, and the S&W Sigma -- all of which, save for a few specialty models, do not have a manual safety -- are superior to the Glock design. That just doesn't make sense. It's perfectly fine to dislike Glock pistols, but to claim that they are inferior to other designs for lacking a manual safety, when those very other designs also lack manual safeties, is rather odd. [[Special:Contributions/68.39.83.179|68.39.83.179]] 22:07, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

::I've only had hands-on experience with the Glock 21 myself. Me and my sister shot one on my birthday this year, and she had the Glock malfunction on her too, albeit not nearly as severely as the incidents mentioned above. She pulled the trigger and the weapon failed to discharge. When I cleared the chamber, I found that the pin had missed the primer and struck the back of the casing. After that though we didn't have any further problems with the weapon, that being the only round out of 50 we put through the Glock 21 that had a misfire. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 03:19, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

Not sure on the Sigma, but the XD has a grip safety, and most sigs have de-cockers. I don't know if those meets your definition of 'manual safety', but they're certainly more than glock has.--[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 15:40, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

==Glock 18==
what would a fully automatic pistol be used for? VIPs protection and CQC
There was a fad for such machine pistols (VP-70 and M-93R for other examples).

But the Personal defense weapon have taken this firearm nitch and more. Rex095

Sort of like lasers when they first came out.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:24, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

what do you mean? about the lasers

Lasers were thought to be the end-all substitute for irons yet now they are just seen as a gimmick.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:32, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

It's not really a gimmick today. People still use lasers to aim, distract someone by aiming at their eyes and for small frame guns where the iron sights are bad, like a pocket gun [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 14:57, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

== Generation 4 Glocks ==

I realized that the page is laking the Gen 4 Glock 17 and Gen 4 Glock 22 --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 17:34, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Added the Gen 4 model for Glock 22--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 17:49, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

:The picture you posted is not a 4th Generation Glock; it is an RTF (Rough Texture Frame) model, which is not the same thing. The main difference between the 4th Gen Glocks and older models is that they now have removable backstraps. And anyway, we don't need the picture until we know they've appeared in movies (and at the rate armorers buy new pistols, no time soon.) IMFDB's policy is that we don't need a picture of every variant of a gun that has ever existed (at least not on the gun's page), and ''especially'' if it hasn't appeared in anything yet. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:23, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Well that and the fact that the 4th Generation also has a captive recoil spring, but of course how in the hell do you show that? Shot a 4th Gen G17 today at the range. Very nice. Recovery is all that much faster. I was impressed. The company will be coming out with the 4th Gen G19 in a month or so. However the 4th Gen G21SF isn't due out until next year. Sorry 45 acp mafia. I was talking to one of the corporate guys so I feel confident that he knows what he's talking about. Anyway just some nice to know trivia.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 05:11, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

== Glock 34 ==

Just looking at the section for the [[Glock 34]], only [[End of Days]] and [[Man on Fire]]. In both movies, It's used by the Main Character to attempt suicide. That's gonna be a good ad campaign: "''When You Can't Go On Anymore, Reach For Your Glock 34''"

==1st Generation==
Did the first generation of Glock pistols feature anything other than the Glock 17? I've seen second and third generation versions of nearly every model, but the only first generation pistols I've ever seen are Glock 17s. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

A small number of first generation Glock 19's were made. - [[User:Right Wing Gun Nut|Right Wing Gun Nut]]

It should have only been in the glock 17...and you shouldn't see one easily because they didn't meet ATF regulation until the generation 2.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 22:25, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

What reg did they not meet?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:34, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

:1st Gen Glock 19s do exist, but they're very rare, because Glock went to the checkered front/backstraps on all of its pistols shortly after production began. Also, the Glock 17L and Glock 18 both exist in 1st generation incarnations (though they're also pretty rare). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:04, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

::So there were other 1st generation models than the 17, but were all 1st generation guns 9mms? -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

To meet American ATF regulations, a steel plate with a stamped serial number was embedded into the dust cover in front of the trigger guard for generation 2. I have seen no evidence of a first generation glock being in any other model than the 17. Even the people that claim they have a generation 1 glock 19 still only show pictures of a generation 2...so i would need to see proof on anything other model being in generation 1. but my knowledge is limited to what's available in the normal U.S.A. for some glock models are not legal to have in the states.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:55, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

:Gen 1 Glock 19s do exist. Check out [http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=887305 this topic] from GlockTalk. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:26, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

==Other models==
Why were the models that were removed before put back? I thought IMFDB didn't allow sections for variants of a gun that haven't appeared in any media. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::See Stan's post below, and also the Glock 20 that was deleted actually WAS in something. When we went to link it, surprise, it wasn't there because it had been removed. Not a good thing. Any SERIES of guns, do not remove the interim gun series entries ever. They are there for continuity in the SERIES of models. The only guns we remove are the weird single gun entries that some member jacked off of google and won't appear in a movie, etc. ever, and if they do, only then do we create the page. The only exception is guns that are in active armorer inventory NOW. That means that there is a much HIGHER chance of them being seen, and we need the gun pics to help members positively ID them. Hope this helps. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 18:51, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::When the Glock variants were initially deleted I mentioned that having gaps in the list of different models seemed odd, yet those who deleted them responded that any weapons or variants of weapons that have not appeared in media are subject to deletion. I like that the different variants have been restored to the list, I was just curious as to what the procedure was for guns that are variants of weapons that have appeared in films though that specific variant had not since I had heard conflicting information. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::::- Yeah, that was me. I found it irksome to have several models (mainly new ones), that weren't listed or even linked to anything, it was annoying to me. I still think that in regards to the newest 30 model guns, but that's just me. BUT, as MPM said, they are still standard guns of the same series, and many are in inventory, so they'll be used in something eventually (If indeed they haven't already and we just don't have pages, etc). I think the main problem was getting rid of older guns like the 20 that are ''definitely'' in stuff already and should be there accordingly. A couple of the other guns are also linked to pages but just don't have them listed - I'll go ahead and add the listing(s) myself if they're listed on complete pages and/or positively ID'd. Otherwise, you could just say they're being proactive. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:23, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

-Original Reply- 
I replaced the sections I previously deleted by request of MoviePropMaster2008. Essentially they are for reference right now. However, there are also a sort of placeholder as well - MPM has stated on other pages that such guns are in movie inventory, so eventually they'll get listings/entries - As such, the sections are to remain so that they don't have to be re-created later. A couple of the guns are already linked on pages I believe, but the pages may not be complete or they may not be listed for some other reason. I did remove them because at the time they weren't featured in anything, but it really wasn't my call to remove them in the first place. (EDIT - removed MPM's paraphrased personal message to me, as he posted himself). [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 05:36, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::I should point that I am highly skeptical of some of the Glocks IDs that are supposedly [[Glock 20]]s. The episode of ''[[Psych]]'' in which [[John Cena]] supposedly uses a Glock 20 is wrong; I've seen that episode, and he uses a Glock 17L. I'm equally doubtful that the Glock 20 appears in Season 4 of ''[[24]]''. Since we know that (as a rule) movie armorers rarely use any Glocks that aren't 9x19mm, I can't help but wonder if people are going to be tempted to mis-identify Glocks if they see these other variants on the page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 20:39, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Fair enough, and I'm not defending some of these questionable attributions, but I had to replace a pic for a VIDEO game where the gun was a specific variant of weapon (and was specifically NAMED in the game as an off caliber variant), so we still needed the section. Also foreign helmed films don't have the ammo biases that we in the States do ;) the sheer CHANCE that folks will mis-identify the gun is not reason enough to NOT have the section. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 20:44, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

:::- Well, in the case of those shows, I'll remove the TV subsection until they're confirmed. I will put in the VG entries, though, as they aren't questionable. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:50, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::::Whoa whoa whoa STOP!!!!! Don't remove ANYTHING!!! IMFDB users should look long and hard and try to correctly ID guns, but for now just creating a BLANK space is unacceptable. What is WITH this rush to delete everything all of a sudden? If you don't have correct info to replace it with, DON'T DELETE IT! YOu can put a disclaimer on the various discussion pages (that there may be a question as to whether or not the gun ID is correct), but I dont' want to start seeing blocks of empty space. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 21:47, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::- Uh, wait a minute, the only thing I removed was the TV section for the Glock 20, and that's it. Nothing else. Most of the gun sections I replaced from the other day were '''already blank''' - they didn't have anything before. Again, the TV listing subsection for the Glock 20 section was the '''only''' thing I've removed since I put all the other guns back, and I've since already restored it. Outside of that and adding some subsections to a couple of the guns, I haven't touched the rest of the page. Not trying to give ya a headache MPM, but I really haven't done that much this time, honest. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 23:45, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Sorry, I was just reeling from the previous Glock debacle where I spent an entire morning rephotographing a Glock variant, only to realize later that it had been previously there, but deleted. My brain is still traumatized ;) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 00:53, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
::- Yeah, I still feel real bad about that.. I'll probably never live that down. Bah. ;b [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 00:59, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

==First appearance==
I remember one of our movie pages pointing out that that film was the first appearance of a Glock Pistol in a movie. Does anyone know which movie that was because I can't remember.

: Don't know. The earliest-set movie page I can immediately spot a Glock (Glock 17) on is [[To Live and Die in L.A.]] (1985), but I'm not certain if that is it. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 04:41, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

That's not it. We have a page of a movie from the early 80s where the page explicitly states that this is the first appearance of a Glock in film.

:
::I'm pretty skeptical that ''[[To Live and Die in L.A.]]'' features a Glock, because they were not being imported to this country for the civilian market at the time the movie was filmed. Though I guess I'd have to see the movie to be sure. Season 3 of ''[[Miami Vice - Season 3|Miami Vice]]'' featured a Glock 17 in one episode (which was used by [[Don Johnson]]), and that's the earliest documented appearance of a Glock that we have on this site so far besides ''To Live and Die in L.A.''.

::''We have a page of a movie from the early 80s where the page explicitly states that this is the first appearance of a Glock in film.''

::Which page? I just checked all of the pages which feature our 1st gen Glock 17 picture, and didn't see any movies from the early-80s. Also, I'm skeptical because the first Glock 17s available to civilians didn't start coming into the U.S. until 1985, so it's pretty much impossible for any movie/TV show filmed before that to feature a Glock (unless it was filmed in Europe or some other country where Glocks were available sooner). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 13:15, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::- Not to increase the load, but it might be worth checking under the second gen picture also. After all, not pages pages use the accurate gun picture, whether because they didn't know about the specific differences/generation release dates when they made the page or because the Gen 1 picture wasn't actually around and no one updated the thumbnail. Just a thought. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 16:49, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::I have tried watching To Live and Die in L.A. and get a better cap, it just looks like a black gun to me. [[Johnny Handsome]] featured a Glock, it was released in '89. There's got to be a film before that. That Miami Vice episode aired Jan '87. Good idea about checking the 2nd gen pic. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 16:47, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

::::Point taken on the 2nd Gen G17 pic, I forgot about that. But I don't envy the person who has to sort through all the pages on which it appears (nearly 250 in total, last I looked). But I can still tell y'all that you're highly unlikely to see a Glock in any movie made before 1985, for the reason I mentioned earlier. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:10, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:: That's not even counting those that ''don't'' have a gun image, or.. well, you get the point. Bah. I'm afraid we may not find out what page it is, unless Anon's memory gets better. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 22:44, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::I just checked all of the page links for all three Glock 17 images. So far, I can't find any movies or TV shows other than the ones mentioned previously that have featured Glocks. Of course, there is still the possibility that somebody forgot to put ''any'' image for some movie that featured a Glock, but I imagine we'd have caught that by now.

:::So, I have reached the following conclusion:

:::*Season 3 of ''[[Miami Vice - Season 3|Miami Vice]]'' is the first media appearance of a Glock 17, movie or TV.
:::*''[[Johnny Handsome]]'' is the first known movie to feature a Glock 17.

:::Unless someone finds any earlier appearances (and has the screencaps to prove it), these are the first media appearances of Glocks. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

: Well, it's a page done by Pred, and the section says 'one of the earliest appearances of a Glock', so that's probably what Anonymous was talking about. If not, then we need to kill him for even bringing this up. :b [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 00:54, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
Yes, that is the page I was talking about, I just couldn't remember it. Please don't kill me. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::: Sure, but only because you said please. Mystery solved then? [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 15:29, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

::Wow look at that, I don't even like Glocks. I don't know if either of you two have seen Johnny Handsome. The gun dealer gave a little explanation about the gun, made in Austria, plastic etc. I just glad it beat Die Hard 2. When I wrote the comment I figured another film had to have featured it before JH that's why I said one of the earliest uses not the first. Unless another comes up with an appearance before JH, [[Mickey Rourke]] has both the first usage of the Desert Eagle and Glock in a film.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 01:06, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Alright I changed both the pages. If someone has better wording to use, go for it. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 01:20, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

== Removal of Variants that have not been seen in media ==

I was just re-reading the [[Rules, Standards and Principles]] page and was wondering if anyone has a problem removing the Glock models 24, 28, 29, and 37 - 39 as they have yet to appear in any movies/anime/games. It looks like alot of effort was put into this page so I just want check before making any changes.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 06:08, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
::'''Good thing you asked, since I would have been pretty pissed at you if you made such a major change without checking first.''' We've had this come up before. A previous member took it upon himself to remove a Glock variant which has not listed, and then, BEHOLD! it was obviously apparent in some movie or tv listing, so ANOTHER member, seeing that we didn't have the section (it had been deleted) copied a jacked GOOGLE image of the gun and re-created the section. I, seeing a CRAP google image thought "hmmm, I could have sworn I photographed that type of Glock for this page already", so I spent the entire morning rephotographing that model of Glock for the Glock page. When I tried to re-upload the photo, IMFDB warned me that this photo already existed. I was "WTF?" By tracking down the history of the page, I tracked down the member who DELETED the glock section and admonished them that it was just creating problems, since a few days AFTER he deleted it, the model appeared in something. So the rule is: DON'T REMOVE ANY VARIANTS on ANY PAGE, ESPECIALLY IF THEY ARE MPM MOVIE ARMORY PHOTOGRAPHS (which were done specifically FOR IMFDB). Thanks for your attention in this matter :) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 06:56, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
:I would leave it, Glocks are hard to tell apart sometimes. So it's good to have all the models on the page for reference. It's not like a user creating an entire new page for a gun that hasn't appeared.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 06:26, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

:::Damn propmaster no need to yell man. There's a reason I asked in here first. Maybe you should add the blurb about not removing variants pictured by armorers in the rules section. That's the only reason I brought up the question in the first place.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 06:29, 27 November 2010 (UTC)
::::It's not yelling, it's emphasizing. And sorry if it seemed that way. As for the emphasis, it was for all members. You at least asked, but I must emphasize again, if any member MUST do something, try adding to lame pages, resist the temptation to delete other people's work. Leave that to the mods, unless its something ridiculous. MPM

== Numbers ==
Anyone know how Glock comes up with the numbers for their handguns?--[[User:MarineCorps1|MarineCorps1]] 21:18, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

They are in the order that they were released...starting with the model 17 for it was the 17th patient to get it what it is today. But some people say that the original name came because it holds 17rds then in the order they were released--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 22:15, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

:Another theory is, if Wikipedia is to be believed, that the Austrian army set out a list of 17 requirements when they were looking for a new pistol to replace the Walther P38. In order for any pistol to be considered for the trials, it had to pass all 17 requirements. The Glock was called the 17 because it was designed specifically with thes standards in mind. Even if this isn't the source of the name, it's still an amusing coincidence. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

== Glock 30 & Glock 36 ==

Can someone explain the Difference between the Glock 30 and Glock 36. They both look like Sub-Compact Glocks in 45. ACP. [[Image:Glock30.jpg|thumb|200px|none|Glock 30 .45 ACP]][[Image:Glock36.jpg|thumb|200px|none|Glock 36 .45 ACP]]
:Glock 36 is a single stack, Glock 30 is a double stack. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 03:21, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
:Not to mention the Glock 36, while subcompact like the 30, also sports a slimline frame, just 1.13 inches wide and roughly six inches long.--[[User:LordOfTheLocusts|LordOfTheLocusts]] 13:50, 18 December 2011 (CST)

== 18 vs 18C? ==

Just wondering, is there any difference between the Glock 18 and Glock 18C? I think the proper name is 18C, but correct me if I'm wrong.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 13:26, 14 June 2011 (CDT)
:The C models include a built-in compensator, noted by a rectangular slot cut out in the top-front section of the slide and the compensator ports in the barrel. And yes, 18C is the correct name. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:18, 14 June 2011 (CDT)

== Full Auto? ==

Can other Glock pistols be converted to fire in full-auto, like the Glock 17-impersonating-Glock 18? Specifically, the 19 and 21 models? [[User:MrOshimida27|MrOshimida27]] 18:21, 16 August 2011 (CDT)

:Probably yes. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:46, 17 October 2011 (CDT)
::I've seen FA conversions of the Glock 19, 20, 22, and 26. Also shot a FA conversion 17. Fun weapons but not quite as reliable as a factory conversion IMO. Then again the 17 had been shot all day.[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 02:35, 18 October 2011 (CDT)

== Glocks in shooters ==

hey yall i was just wondering if you knew if their were any FPS games that included a normal glock. when i say normal i mean all minus the 18, it is a ridiculous gun and has very little practical use. my preference is the Glock 21 but i would like to no if there is any notable games that have any model (minus 18) thanks. [[User:Dirtdiver6421|Dirtdiver6421]] 20:37, 17 October 2011 (CDT)
:Did you even try looking in the listings on the page? Because I see several listed there.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 21:31, 17 October 2011 (CDT)

::And the Glock 18 is not a ridiculous weapon and ''is'' practical if you know how to use it right (especially the "C" model). - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:44, 17 October 2011 (CDT)

== .380 ACP Glocks ==

Hey all. I edited the Glock 25 and 28 sections to say:

*The Glock 28/25 will very likely never be seen in an American produced film because it is illegal to import in the United States. Since that the ATF ruled it as having no sporting purpose, the only way it will be featured in a film is if the movie is completely produced in a foreign country that has maximum caliber restrictions.

These guns have a less than .01% chance of being seen in films. Just giving a heads up --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 08:04, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, or if the ATF changes the rules (I know, yeah right, but it's not impossible), or if it's an Airsoft gun or mock-up, or it's stock footage, or a dozen other ways you could probably think up. Try to avoid attempting to predict the future on a gun page. Also, "completely produced?" Haven't you ever heard of "on location?" [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 08:28, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

*Airsoft doesn't make Glock 25/28's, on top of the fact that it's now illegal to produce Glock mock ups now because Glock sued for patent infringement a year or two back. This includes the S&W Sigma series (Glock clones), Airsoft guns, and blank guns. Even if the gun could be used, do you know how hard it is to make a straight blowback gun fire blanks? It just isn't worth the effort. The ATF will not change the rules unless the supreme court miraculously changes the law, which is next to 0% unless people start voting with their brains. Lastly, "on location" filming still has American owned guns used, therefore those Glocks will not be seen. Trust me man, it ain't happening.

PS. I saw your edit on the Glock 25. The Glock 25 can't be imported no matter what. Law enforcement or not, they CAN'T. Also, Brazil has a maximum energy ban (nothing bigger than .380 for handguns,) not a "military caliber" ban. I'm going to fix those parts. --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 09:30, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:On location filming doesn't necessarily have American guns used. ''Rambo III'', for example, was American-produced but filmed partly in Israel and used stocks of weapons that would be impossible to get in the US, such as real DShK machine guns. The same arrangement (location filming with a local armourer) would make it far from impossible for these weapons to appear in a US-produced movie. Also, I'm fairly sure you're wrong. Here's the section of the relevant law:

:"If importing NFA and non-sporting weapons, please ensure an official government contract, purchase order, or letter typed on official law enforcement and/or government letterhead, bearing the original signature of the chief law enforcement official having jurisdiction over that area, is attached to the completed Form 6."

:The 25 is a "non-sporting weapon" because it fails the import test, but that doesn't stop a government or law enforcement ''agency'' buying it. It does mean ''individual'' officers can't import them, though.

:Also, IIRC didn't Glock do something weird like trademark the shape of their weapons rather than sue for patents? I think H&K did the same with the MP5 at about the same time. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 10:45, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Pretty much. They sued because the imitations were substantially identical to the iconic Glock shape. Just so you know, the Glock company is a bunch of jerks.

When it comes to using other country's armorers/weapons, it usually doesn't happen. Rambo can be the exception, but 99.99% of the time it's cheaper to mock up existing weapons and use your own armorer than to go out of the way for the real deal when usually no one will know the difference.

Also, that ATF letter is only true in name only. Regardless of signatures or agency, the request to import still has to be approved by the ATF, which it NEVER is. Look around. There are no post '86 machine guns or "non sporting" weapons used by ANY LE agency in the US (not talking about the ARMY/NAVY/Etc.) because the letters are NEVER approved. There's a couple A1 M16's with A2 uppers and MP5's with a pre '86 trigger group in use, but that's about it for LE agencies special guns usage, and all of those are pre '86 weapons.--[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 11:35, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, and a LE agency isn't going to be jumping through hoops to buy a .380 ACP pistol anyway, but it's enough to say that only LE and government could even ''theoretically'' import them according to the law for purposes of the page; it's ''not'' true to say they can't legally be imported when the law says they can be. I do agree with you that it's stunningly unlikely for a number of reasons, I just dislike terms like "impossible" being thrown around because I'm horribly pedantic. :) [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:40, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Agreed. Especially when they can pick up a just-as-good Beretta 84 without the blinking of an eye. I noticed you live in England. Here in America, there are a couple laws which supposedly make certain things allowable with the right approval, however approval never comes and those permits are deemed impossible to obtain.

Some states allow the carrying of a handgun at 18 years old, but Sheriffs won't sign off on it, well just because. In New Jersey, you are allowed to carry a handgun, but to get the permit you need a "justifiable cause," and it happens that the only justifiable one they see is carrying more than $500,000 a day for work. Apparently my self defense isn't important enough to them. It's the same with the ATF. They don't like it, you can't have it. Unfortunately it isn't constitutional, but the judges here don't quite have the guts to end their illegal rule right now. Thanks for reading my rant ;) --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 11:52, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, everywhere has laws that technically exist but aren't enforced properly. Though ours mostly tend to have more to do with extremely precise ways for it to be legal to murder the Welsh. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:56, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Bingo. Nice job with the edit too by the way --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 12:51, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Hollywood is not the only people that make Movies...In fact there are hundreds of movies made every year without america having anything to do with them...and most of the time they are better off for it. Just because a gun is outlawed in the USA does not mean that it cant be used by another country that might decide to make a movie that may some day grace the pages of IMFDB.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:40, 21 January 2012 (CST)

== Glock 18 selector switch ==

Is the slide mounted selector switch on the Glock 18 on both sides of the slide or just the left side? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 14:34, 8 January 2012 (CST)
:Left side only --[[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] 14:56, 8 January 2012 (CST)
::Well that complicates things. Thanks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 15:08, 8 January 2012 (CST)

== Naming of glocks ==

Does anyone know the story behind the naming of the Glocks? Why did they start with 17? --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 21:26, 20 January 2012 (CST)
:The Glock 17 holds 17 rounds, but where they went from there I have no idea.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 22:00, 20 January 2012 (CST)
::Is that REALLY why its called the Glock 17?!?! --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 22:01, 20 January 2012 (CST)

No its not. It came from one of these two things:
The Glock 17 was called the Glock 17 because it was Gaston Glock's 17th patent.
OR
There were 17 criteria the Austrian military had for their new pistol, that the Glock was made to meet.

Its pretty up in the air, and I've heard both stories from GLOCK reps.
-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 10:03, 21 January 2012 (CST)

all the other numbers are in order in which they where made and interduced...the 17 being the first production model followed by the 18 and so on. So the 10mm models where made and interduced before the .45acp models.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:43, 21 January 2012 (CST)

Talk:Glock pistol series

2012-01-22T01:40:55Z

Spades of Columbia: /* .380 ACP Glocks */

2 Glocks (.45?) play prominet roles in the movie "Fracture" starring Anthony Hopkins. Don't know the model so I didn't edit the main page ([[Special:Contributions/80.121.38.199|80.121.38.199]] 18:10, 20 March 2008 (UTC))

__TOC__ 

==Other Glock Variations==
===Screen-Used===
[[Image:IMFDB P00261 Sopranos Tony Soprano Glock 19.jpg|thumb|none|350px|'''World IMFDB Exclusive:''' Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This blank firing weapon is verified as screen used by actor [[James Gandolfini]] in '''[[The Sopranos]]'''. More detailed images and purchasing information on this item can be found at [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/ The Golden Closet]; see [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/merchant/merchant.mvc?Session_ID=6ef04a13fbe759cbdcbdc6bc4c4b809f&Screen=PROD&Product_Code=P00261&Store_Code=TGC&search=Sopranos+Glock&offset=0&filter_cat=&PowerSearch_Begin_Only=&sort=&range_low=&range_high= here].]]
[[Image:P00650 Glock Full Left.jpg|thumb|350px|none|'''World IMFDB Exclusive:''' Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This non-firing prop weapon is verified as screen used from the film '''[[The Other Guys]]''', and was carried by [[Will Ferrell]] in the film. The gun is accompanied by the Galco belt holster also used in numerous scenes throughout the film.]]
[[Image:P00613.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Screen used Glock 19 - 9x19mm. This blank firing weapon is verified as screen used from the film ''[[Salt]]''. The gun has been modified to fire blank rounds only. This item is currently being sold by [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/ The Golden Closet]; see [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/merchant/merchant.mvc?Session_ID=6ef04a13fbe759cbdcbdc6bc4c4b809f&Screen=PROD&Product_Code=P00613&Store_Code=TGC&search=Salt&offset=0&filter_cat=&PowerSearch_Begin_Only=&sort=&range_low=&range_high= this link].]]
[[Image:MattDUlt.jpg|thumb|350px|none|The actual screen-used 3rd generation Glock 17 - 9mm from ''[[The Bourne Ultimatum]]''. This weapon was actually handled and fired by [[Matt Damon]]. Note the damage on the rail.]]

===Other Images===
[[File:Glock17ext.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 17 with 33 round magazine.]]
[[File:Glock17stainless ext.jpg|thumb|none|300px|Glock 17 fitted with stainless slide and 33 round magazine.]]
[[Image:Glock_12892-1-.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 OD Green - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:Evolution.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Suppressed Glock 17 - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:BruniGAP-178mm.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Bruni GAP Glock 17 blank firing stage prop - 8mm blank]]
[[Image:Glock17RAM4.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 RAM - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:CAA.Tactical-RONI-G1.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 - 9x19mm mounted in a CAA Tactical RONI-G1.]]
[[Image:Pistol Austrian Glock 18 with 31 round magazine.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Glock 18C with a 19 and 31 round magazine - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:Glock22left.jpg|thumb|350px|none|Glock 22 (2nd Generation) left side - .40 S&W.]]
[[Image:G17-1x400.JPG|thumb|none|350px|Glock 17 3rd Generation with SureFire x400 attachment and extended 19-round magazine - 9x19mm. Similar to the gun used by [[Shemar Moore]] in ''[[Criminal Minds]]'']]
[[File:Saliant Arms glock 34.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Salient Arms International Glock 34 - 9x19mm]]

== Longslide versions get their own Glock Model Numbers? ==

It seems kind of odd to me as to why variations of Glock pistols available with longer barrels have their own unique model numbers. Many gun websites I've been to don't seem to list such customizations with their own unique model numbers (except maybe in inventory listings or the like), but rather just mention that a particular model of pistol has a longer barrel version available. Is such a practice just for convenient reference? To satisfy customer preferences? Or for some other reason?

By the way, I appreciate all the hard work the people here have done in identifying the various Glock pistols used in the media on this site. I'd find it pretty hard myself, since barring obvious visual differences like how to tell a full-size Glock from a subcompact one apart, I wouldn't be able to tell a G17 from a G22 without seeing the number on the slide in a movie, for instance, since they look substantially the same. Something like trying to tell a G22 from a G20 would also be quite difficult without hearing a character in a movie say its caliber out aloud or seeing the number on the slide, since they are chambered for similarly-sized cartridges. I don't think its entry on the date of this comment is correct--the real-life US Marshals use Glocks chambered for .40 S&W, not 10mm Auto.

About the only exception to the aforementioned practice on Glock's end is the Glock 20, which apparently now has a factory-made longslide version (not the aftermarket ones), but to my knowledge does not have a unique Glock model number. Can someone fill me in on this? --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 06:15, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

== The "Glock invisible"-nonsense ==

Here's what [[Hugh Laurie]] (yes, the "House M. D."-guy) had to say about that in his novel "The gun seller":
"You may have read, at one time or another, some of the nonsense that’s been written about the Glock. The fact that its body is made from a fancy polymer material got one or two journalists very excited a while back about the possibility that the gun might not register on airport X-ray machines - which happens to be so much hooey. The slide, barrel, and a fair portion of its innards are metal, and if that weren’t enough, seventeen rounds of Parabellum ammunition are pretty hard to pass off as lipstick refills. What it does have is a high magazine capacity for a low weight, great accuracy, and virtually unequalled reliability. All of which have made the Glock 17 the choice of housewives everywhere."
Dr. House, I couldn't agree more.
--[[User:Lastgunslinger|Lastgunslinger]] 22:39, 25 October 2009 (UTC)

I have to admit that my whole perspective of Glock changed when they sued Smith & Wesson over the Sigma. I mean, they make more money from their handguns than any other company in the world and then they go and sue someone. The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all. I see the similarities but they are easily telled apart. Not a cool thing to do Glock, I wish you hadn't stooped down like that.

== 'Resembles Every Handgun' ==

"The Glocks design is so simple it resembles every handgun, you might as well sue them all."

It only resembles every handgun, because almost every brand has a Glock copy now. There wasn't anything like it back in 1982 when it was released. Back then its main competitors were the 1911, S&W 39, Berreta 92 and various wheel guns. Gunner313
Not to mention that S&W didn't just copy the Glock design they cloned it with parts that would fit into a Glock body, with potentially disastrous consequences.

A copy is a near exact of something. The S&W Sigma is the only Glock copy. The rest are just polymer pistols.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:29, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

I think he mans that is so genaric and non-descript in apperance that it has gained the status of being the genaric
icon for "pistol" among the populous, especially laymans.
An example being that I asked my parents (who know nothing of guns) to draw their interpretation of a pistol, what they drew was inescapeably a glock-like design.
I think this is because its basically just a rectangular prism with a very simple handguard on it, also its common use by police give it a good possition in the public eye even for those who avoid movies and other media for whatever reason.
Compaired to other self loading pistols the only competition I can see it having is the Beretta 92 serise of guns, also yes I think your point is very valad - other companies making sudo-glocks means that their image is even more common and that the layman will associate the image of a glock less with glocks and more with the term "pistol".
- annon

==Durability==
:Does anyone else find it ironic that Glock's are nigh indestructible but feel really fragile?-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 23:05, 12 December 2009 (UTC)
The Glocks I've fired, for the most part, don't feel extremely fragile. Sure, they don't have that 'all metal heft' that some other handguns have, which makes them lighter, and conceivably more fragile feeling, but none of mine have never felt like they would shatter if I dropped them. I might be misunderstanding what you mean, though. [[User:Acora|Acora]] 21:39, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
:It just about takes a nuclear blast to destroy one, but at the same time it feels like I could cruch it with my bare hands-[[User:S&Wshooter|S&Wshooter]] 20:45, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

I've never noticed them feeling fragille, but that could be because I can't get over how friggin' UNCOMFORTABLE they are to hold. I'm not trying bash glocks here, they just don't fit my hand. At all.--[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 00:48, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

==Catastrophic Failure ==
The Portland, Oregon police department stopped offering the .45 Glock 21 as an option for Officers to carry on duty after two incidents in which the weapons exploded in the hands of the range master during testing. Afterwards reports came in from across the country of similar incidents with the Glock 21. Do all Glocks chambered for powerful cartridges (.45, 10mm) have this problem or is it just the Glock 21? Furthermore do all Glock 21s have this issue or were these just a few rare accidents? I don't particularly like Glock pistols but never considered them dangerous (at least to the user) before hearing about these incidents.
-[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

Hmm. Given the problems that PPB has given Glock in the past (back in the early nineties they commented that "PBB is one of those customers we can't seem to ever make happy") I'm not surprised they blame the company rather than themselves. They also refused to fly to Smyrna to allow Glock to examine one of the pistols; they also refused to allow Glock to remove even one of the allegedly defective pistols for lab tests. The PPB also failed to submit either of the pistols for independent testing, despite stating that it would.

If there was a design flaw it would have shown up '''long''' before now. Glock has ~65% of the US LEA market, mostly in .40 and while the "Short and Weak" isn't nearly as powerful as 10mm Auto, it's generally loaded to higher pressures than .45 ACP

I've used the G20 and G29 (both chambered for the far more powerful 10mm Auto round) for years and haven't had a gun explode or do anything worse that FTE when used with poor ammunition. A few years back we torture tested one with 15,000rds in a single day, it didn't explode.

It's not just .45 and 10mm. I've personally seen a glock 17 explode with factory ammo. Not a pretty sight. --[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 00:55, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

== Portland Police and its standards ==

The Portland Police Bureau is a strange department. I've known experienced officers who have tried to get on with the PPB only to be told that they didn't meet Portland's criteria. In a couple cases they were experienced Oregon certified officers from neighboring cities. One of them spent a year in Kosovo with the U.N. civil police training task force. It's a strange city with an odd police administration. I've known a few good cops who work for Portland, but overall I'm glad that I never applied with the PPB.Ultimately I believe the politics of that part of Oregon would have driven me crazy.Very very LEFT WING. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 15:40, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

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It's only certain Glock models that do it. I've noticed it a lot on the .40 S&W models such as the 22 or 23. The problem is that in order to increase more reliable feeding as well as to make the gun cycle more reliably, Glocks have more of their chambers cut away, which leaves parts of the case unsupported. They count on the casing to hold in the powder load. I think it happens mostly on the larger cartridges such as 10mm Auto, .40 S&W or .45ACP. Haven't heard of it happening on any of the .45GAP models though. I'm personally not a big fan of Glock pistols. I don't find them very visually appealing and I hate the lack of a manual safety. And I really, really dislike the trigger they make on it. They need to take off the little lever in the trigger, and just go to a solid double action trigger and put a manual safety on it. I'm a 1911 man, but I think there are many other designs that are better than Glock's. For example, Sig Sauer or H&K. Or Springfield's XD series. S&W Sigma. I mean the list goes on and on. I won't buy a Glock for the reasons I mentioned above. Right now, all I own are 1911s and one H&K USP .45.

:I'm a bit confused. You say that you do not like Glock pistols because you find them unattractive and you prefer a manual safety, both of which are valid reasons. But then you claim that designs from SIG Sauer, H&K USP, the Springfield XD, and the S&W Sigma -- all of which, save for a few specialty models, do not have a manual safety -- are superior to the Glock design. That just doesn't make sense. It's perfectly fine to dislike Glock pistols, but to claim that they are inferior to other designs for lacking a manual safety, when those very other designs also lack manual safeties, is rather odd. [[Special:Contributions/68.39.83.179|68.39.83.179]] 22:07, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

::I've only had hands-on experience with the Glock 21 myself. Me and my sister shot one on my birthday this year, and she had the Glock malfunction on her too, albeit not nearly as severely as the incidents mentioned above. She pulled the trigger and the weapon failed to discharge. When I cleared the chamber, I found that the pin had missed the primer and struck the back of the casing. After that though we didn't have any further problems with the weapon, that being the only round out of 50 we put through the Glock 21 that had a misfire. [[User:Orca1 9904|Orca1 9904]] 03:19, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

Not sure on the Sigma, but the XD has a grip safety, and most sigs have de-cockers. I don't know if those meets your definition of 'manual safety', but they're certainly more than glock has.--[[User:TheDon|TheDon]] 15:40, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

==Glock 18==
what would a fully automatic pistol be used for? VIPs protection and CQC
There was a fad for such machine pistols (VP-70 and M-93R for other examples).

But the Personal defense weapon have taken this firearm nitch and more. Rex095

Sort of like lasers when they first came out.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 20:24, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

what do you mean? about the lasers

Lasers were thought to be the end-all substitute for irons yet now they are just seen as a gimmick.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:32, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

It's not really a gimmick today. People still use lasers to aim, distract someone by aiming at their eyes and for small frame guns where the iron sights are bad, like a pocket gun [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 14:57, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

== Generation 4 Glocks ==

I realized that the page is laking the Gen 4 Glock 17 and Gen 4 Glock 22 --[[User:Yocapo32|Yocapo32]] 17:34, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Added the Gen 4 model for Glock 22--[[User:SB2296|SB2296]] 17:49, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

:The picture you posted is not a 4th Generation Glock; it is an RTF (Rough Texture Frame) model, which is not the same thing. The main difference between the 4th Gen Glocks and older models is that they now have removable backstraps. And anyway, we don't need the picture until we know they've appeared in movies (and at the rate armorers buy new pistols, no time soon.) IMFDB's policy is that we don't need a picture of every variant of a gun that has ever existed (at least not on the gun's page), and ''especially'' if it hasn't appeared in anything yet. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:23, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

Well that and the fact that the 4th Generation also has a captive recoil spring, but of course how in the hell do you show that? Shot a 4th Gen G17 today at the range. Very nice. Recovery is all that much faster. I was impressed. The company will be coming out with the 4th Gen G19 in a month or so. However the 4th Gen G21SF isn't due out until next year. Sorry 45 acp mafia. I was talking to one of the corporate guys so I feel confident that he knows what he's talking about. Anyway just some nice to know trivia.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 05:11, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

== Glock 34 ==

Just looking at the section for the [[Glock 34]], only [[End of Days]] and [[Man on Fire]]. In both movies, It's used by the Main Character to attempt suicide. That's gonna be a good ad campaign: "''When You Can't Go On Anymore, Reach For Your Glock 34''"

==1st Generation==
Did the first generation of Glock pistols feature anything other than the Glock 17? I've seen second and third generation versions of nearly every model, but the only first generation pistols I've ever seen are Glock 17s. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

A small number of first generation Glock 19's were made. - [[User:Right Wing Gun Nut|Right Wing Gun Nut]]

It should have only been in the glock 17...and you shouldn't see one easily because they didn't meet ATF regulation until the generation 2.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 22:25, 20 August 2010 (UTC)

What reg did they not meet?--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 18:34, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

:1st Gen Glock 19s do exist, but they're very rare, because Glock went to the checkered front/backstraps on all of its pistols shortly after production began. Also, the Glock 17L and Glock 18 both exist in 1st generation incarnations (though they're also pretty rare). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 19:04, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

::So there were other 1st generation models than the 17, but were all 1st generation guns 9mms? -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

To meet American ATF regulations, a steel plate with a stamped serial number was embedded into the dust cover in front of the trigger guard for generation 2. I have seen no evidence of a first generation glock being in any other model than the 17. Even the people that claim they have a generation 1 glock 19 still only show pictures of a generation 2...so i would need to see proof on anything other model being in generation 1. but my knowledge is limited to what's available in the normal U.S.A. for some glock models are not legal to have in the states.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:55, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

:Gen 1 Glock 19s do exist. Check out [http://www.glocktalk.com/forums/showthread.php?t=887305 this topic] from GlockTalk. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:26, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

==Other models==
Why were the models that were removed before put back? I thought IMFDB didn't allow sections for variants of a gun that haven't appeared in any media. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::See Stan's post below, and also the Glock 20 that was deleted actually WAS in something. When we went to link it, surprise, it wasn't there because it had been removed. Not a good thing. Any SERIES of guns, do not remove the interim gun series entries ever. They are there for continuity in the SERIES of models. The only guns we remove are the weird single gun entries that some member jacked off of google and won't appear in a movie, etc. ever, and if they do, only then do we create the page. The only exception is guns that are in active armorer inventory NOW. That means that there is a much HIGHER chance of them being seen, and we need the gun pics to help members positively ID them. Hope this helps. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 18:51, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::When the Glock variants were initially deleted I mentioned that having gaps in the list of different models seemed odd, yet those who deleted them responded that any weapons or variants of weapons that have not appeared in media are subject to deletion. I like that the different variants have been restored to the list, I was just curious as to what the procedure was for guns that are variants of weapons that have appeared in films though that specific variant had not since I had heard conflicting information. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::::- Yeah, that was me. I found it irksome to have several models (mainly new ones), that weren't listed or even linked to anything, it was annoying to me. I still think that in regards to the newest 30 model guns, but that's just me. BUT, as MPM said, they are still standard guns of the same series, and many are in inventory, so they'll be used in something eventually (If indeed they haven't already and we just don't have pages, etc). I think the main problem was getting rid of older guns like the 20 that are ''definitely'' in stuff already and should be there accordingly. A couple of the other guns are also linked to pages but just don't have them listed - I'll go ahead and add the listing(s) myself if they're listed on complete pages and/or positively ID'd. Otherwise, you could just say they're being proactive. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:23, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

-Original Reply- 
I replaced the sections I previously deleted by request of MoviePropMaster2008. Essentially they are for reference right now. However, there are also a sort of placeholder as well - MPM has stated on other pages that such guns are in movie inventory, so eventually they'll get listings/entries - As such, the sections are to remain so that they don't have to be re-created later. A couple of the guns are already linked on pages I believe, but the pages may not be complete or they may not be listed for some other reason. I did remove them because at the time they weren't featured in anything, but it really wasn't my call to remove them in the first place. (EDIT - removed MPM's paraphrased personal message to me, as he posted himself). [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 05:36, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::I should point that I am highly skeptical of some of the Glocks IDs that are supposedly [[Glock 20]]s. The episode of ''[[Psych]]'' in which [[John Cena]] supposedly uses a Glock 20 is wrong; I've seen that episode, and he uses a Glock 17L. I'm equally doubtful that the Glock 20 appears in Season 4 of ''[[24]]''. Since we know that (as a rule) movie armorers rarely use any Glocks that aren't 9x19mm, I can't help but wonder if people are going to be tempted to mis-identify Glocks if they see these other variants on the page. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 20:39, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Fair enough, and I'm not defending some of these questionable attributions, but I had to replace a pic for a VIDEO game where the gun was a specific variant of weapon (and was specifically NAMED in the game as an off caliber variant), so we still needed the section. Also foreign helmed films don't have the ammo biases that we in the States do ;) the sheer CHANCE that folks will mis-identify the gun is not reason enough to NOT have the section. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 20:44, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

:::- Well, in the case of those shows, I'll remove the TV subsection until they're confirmed. I will put in the VG entries, though, as they aren't questionable. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:50, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::::Whoa whoa whoa STOP!!!!! Don't remove ANYTHING!!! IMFDB users should look long and hard and try to correctly ID guns, but for now just creating a BLANK space is unacceptable. What is WITH this rush to delete everything all of a sudden? If you don't have correct info to replace it with, DON'T DELETE IT! YOu can put a disclaimer on the various discussion pages (that there may be a question as to whether or not the gun ID is correct), but I dont' want to start seeing blocks of empty space. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 21:47, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

::- Uh, wait a minute, the only thing I removed was the TV section for the Glock 20, and that's it. Nothing else. Most of the gun sections I replaced from the other day were '''already blank''' - they didn't have anything before. Again, the TV listing subsection for the Glock 20 section was the '''only''' thing I've removed since I put all the other guns back, and I've since already restored it. Outside of that and adding some subsections to a couple of the guns, I haven't touched the rest of the page. Not trying to give ya a headache MPM, but I really haven't done that much this time, honest. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 23:45, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Sorry, I was just reeling from the previous Glock debacle where I spent an entire morning rephotographing a Glock variant, only to realize later that it had been previously there, but deleted. My brain is still traumatized ;) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 00:53, 17 October 2010 (UTC)
::- Yeah, I still feel real bad about that.. I'll probably never live that down. Bah. ;b [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 00:59, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

==First appearance==
I remember one of our movie pages pointing out that that film was the first appearance of a Glock Pistol in a movie. Does anyone know which movie that was because I can't remember.

: Don't know. The earliest-set movie page I can immediately spot a Glock (Glock 17) on is [[To Live and Die in L.A.]] (1985), but I'm not certain if that is it. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 04:41, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

That's not it. We have a page of a movie from the early 80s where the page explicitly states that this is the first appearance of a Glock in film.

:
::I'm pretty skeptical that ''[[To Live and Die in L.A.]]'' features a Glock, because they were not being imported to this country for the civilian market at the time the movie was filmed. Though I guess I'd have to see the movie to be sure. Season 3 of ''[[Miami Vice - Season 3|Miami Vice]]'' featured a Glock 17 in one episode (which was used by [[Don Johnson]]), and that's the earliest documented appearance of a Glock that we have on this site so far besides ''To Live and Die in L.A.''.

::''We have a page of a movie from the early 80s where the page explicitly states that this is the first appearance of a Glock in film.''

::Which page? I just checked all of the pages which feature our 1st gen Glock 17 picture, and didn't see any movies from the early-80s. Also, I'm skeptical because the first Glock 17s available to civilians didn't start coming into the U.S. until 1985, so it's pretty much impossible for any movie/TV show filmed before that to feature a Glock (unless it was filmed in Europe or some other country where Glocks were available sooner). -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 13:15, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::- Not to increase the load, but it might be worth checking under the second gen picture also. After all, not pages pages use the accurate gun picture, whether because they didn't know about the specific differences/generation release dates when they made the page or because the Gen 1 picture wasn't actually around and no one updated the thumbnail. Just a thought. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 16:49, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::I have tried watching To Live and Die in L.A. and get a better cap, it just looks like a black gun to me. [[Johnny Handsome]] featured a Glock, it was released in '89. There's got to be a film before that. That Miami Vice episode aired Jan '87. Good idea about checking the 2nd gen pic. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 16:47, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

::::Point taken on the 2nd Gen G17 pic, I forgot about that. But I don't envy the person who has to sort through all the pages on which it appears (nearly 250 in total, last I looked). But I can still tell y'all that you're highly unlikely to see a Glock in any movie made before 1985, for the reason I mentioned earlier. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 18:10, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:: That's not even counting those that ''don't'' have a gun image, or.. well, you get the point. Bah. I'm afraid we may not find out what page it is, unless Anon's memory gets better. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 22:44, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

:::I just checked all of the page links for all three Glock 17 images. So far, I can't find any movies or TV shows other than the ones mentioned previously that have featured Glocks. Of course, there is still the possibility that somebody forgot to put ''any'' image for some movie that featured a Glock, but I imagine we'd have caught that by now.

:::So, I have reached the following conclusion:

:::*Season 3 of ''[[Miami Vice - Season 3|Miami Vice]]'' is the first media appearance of a Glock 17, movie or TV.
:::*''[[Johnny Handsome]]'' is the first known movie to feature a Glock 17.

:::Unless someone finds any earlier appearances (and has the screencaps to prove it), these are the first media appearances of Glocks. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]]

: Well, it's a page done by Pred, and the section says 'one of the earliest appearances of a Glock', so that's probably what Anonymous was talking about. If not, then we need to kill him for even bringing this up. :b [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 00:54, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
Yes, that is the page I was talking about, I just couldn't remember it. Please don't kill me. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]
::: Sure, but only because you said please. Mystery solved then? [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 15:29, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

::Wow look at that, I don't even like Glocks. I don't know if either of you two have seen Johnny Handsome. The gun dealer gave a little explanation about the gun, made in Austria, plastic etc. I just glad it beat Die Hard 2. When I wrote the comment I figured another film had to have featured it before JH that's why I said one of the earliest uses not the first. Unless another comes up with an appearance before JH, [[Mickey Rourke]] has both the first usage of the Desert Eagle and Glock in a film.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 01:06, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
:::Alright I changed both the pages. If someone has better wording to use, go for it. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 01:20, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

== Removal of Variants that have not been seen in media ==

I was just re-reading the [[Rules, Standards and Principles]] page and was wondering if anyone has a problem removing the Glock models 24, 28, 29, and 37 - 39 as they have yet to appear in any movies/anime/games. It looks like alot of effort was put into this page so I just want check before making any changes.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 06:08, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
::'''Good thing you asked, since I would have been pretty pissed at you if you made such a major change without checking first.''' We've had this come up before. A previous member took it upon himself to remove a Glock variant which has not listed, and then, BEHOLD! it was obviously apparent in some movie or tv listing, so ANOTHER member, seeing that we didn't have the section (it had been deleted) copied a jacked GOOGLE image of the gun and re-created the section. I, seeing a CRAP google image thought "hmmm, I could have sworn I photographed that type of Glock for this page already", so I spent the entire morning rephotographing that model of Glock for the Glock page. When I tried to re-upload the photo, IMFDB warned me that this photo already existed. I was "WTF?" By tracking down the history of the page, I tracked down the member who DELETED the glock section and admonished them that it was just creating problems, since a few days AFTER he deleted it, the model appeared in something. So the rule is: DON'T REMOVE ANY VARIANTS on ANY PAGE, ESPECIALLY IF THEY ARE MPM MOVIE ARMORY PHOTOGRAPHS (which were done specifically FOR IMFDB). Thanks for your attention in this matter :) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 06:56, 26 November 2010 (UTC)
:I would leave it, Glocks are hard to tell apart sometimes. So it's good to have all the models on the page for reference. It's not like a user creating an entire new page for a gun that hasn't appeared.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 06:26, 26 November 2010 (UTC)

:::Damn propmaster no need to yell man. There's a reason I asked in here first. Maybe you should add the blurb about not removing variants pictured by armorers in the rules section. That's the only reason I brought up the question in the first place.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 06:29, 27 November 2010 (UTC)
::::It's not yelling, it's emphasizing. And sorry if it seemed that way. As for the emphasis, it was for all members. You at least asked, but I must emphasize again, if any member MUST do something, try adding to lame pages, resist the temptation to delete other people's work. Leave that to the mods, unless its something ridiculous. MPM

== Numbers ==
Anyone know how Glock comes up with the numbers for their handguns?--[[User:MarineCorps1|MarineCorps1]] 21:18, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

They are in the order that they were released...starting with the model 17 for it was the 17th patient to get it what it is today. But some people say that the original name came because it holds 17rds then in the order they were released--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 22:15, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

:Another theory is, if Wikipedia is to be believed, that the Austrian army set out a list of 17 requirements when they were looking for a new pistol to replace the Walther P38. In order for any pistol to be considered for the trials, it had to pass all 17 requirements. The Glock was called the 17 because it was designed specifically with thes standards in mind. Even if this isn't the source of the name, it's still an amusing coincidence. -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

== Glock 30 & Glock 36 ==

Can someone explain the Difference between the Glock 30 and Glock 36. They both look like Sub-Compact Glocks in 45. ACP. [[Image:Glock30.jpg|thumb|200px|none|Glock 30 .45 ACP]][[Image:Glock36.jpg|thumb|200px|none|Glock 36 .45 ACP]]
:Glock 36 is a single stack, Glock 30 is a double stack. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 03:21, 18 December 2010 (UTC)
:Not to mention the Glock 36, while subcompact like the 30, also sports a slimline frame, just 1.13 inches wide and roughly six inches long.--[[User:LordOfTheLocusts|LordOfTheLocusts]] 13:50, 18 December 2011 (CST)

== 18 vs 18C? ==

Just wondering, is there any difference between the Glock 18 and Glock 18C? I think the proper name is 18C, but correct me if I'm wrong.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 13:26, 14 June 2011 (CDT)
:The C models include a built-in compensator, noted by a rectangular slot cut out in the top-front section of the slide and the compensator ports in the barrel. And yes, 18C is the correct name. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:18, 14 June 2011 (CDT)

== Full Auto? ==

Can other Glock pistols be converted to fire in full-auto, like the Glock 17-impersonating-Glock 18? Specifically, the 19 and 21 models? [[User:MrOshimida27|MrOshimida27]] 18:21, 16 August 2011 (CDT)

:Probably yes. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:46, 17 October 2011 (CDT)
::I've seen FA conversions of the Glock 19, 20, 22, and 26. Also shot a FA conversion 17. Fun weapons but not quite as reliable as a factory conversion IMO. Then again the 17 had been shot all day.[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 02:35, 18 October 2011 (CDT)

== Glocks in shooters ==

hey yall i was just wondering if you knew if their were any FPS games that included a normal glock. when i say normal i mean all minus the 18, it is a ridiculous gun and has very little practical use. my preference is the Glock 21 but i would like to no if there is any notable games that have any model (minus 18) thanks. [[User:Dirtdiver6421|Dirtdiver6421]] 20:37, 17 October 2011 (CDT)
:Did you even try looking in the listings on the page? Because I see several listed there.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 21:31, 17 October 2011 (CDT)

::And the Glock 18 is not a ridiculous weapon and ''is'' practical if you know how to use it right (especially the "C" model). - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:44, 17 October 2011 (CDT)

== .380 ACP Glocks ==

Hey all. I edited the Glock 25 and 28 sections to say:

*The Glock 28/25 will very likely never be seen in an American produced film because it is illegal to import in the United States. Since that the ATF ruled it as having no sporting purpose, the only way it will be featured in a film is if the movie is completely produced in a foreign country that has maximum caliber restrictions.

These guns have a less than .01% chance of being seen in films. Just giving a heads up --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 08:04, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, or if the ATF changes the rules (I know, yeah right, but it's not impossible), or if it's an Airsoft gun or mock-up, or it's stock footage, or a dozen other ways you could probably think up. Try to avoid attempting to predict the future on a gun page. Also, "completely produced?" Haven't you ever heard of "on location?" [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 08:28, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

*Airsoft doesn't make Glock 25/28's, on top of the fact that it's now illegal to produce Glock mock ups now because Glock sued for patent infringement a year or two back. This includes the S&W Sigma series (Glock clones), Airsoft guns, and blank guns. Even if the gun could be used, do you know how hard it is to make a straight blowback gun fire blanks? It just isn't worth the effort. The ATF will not change the rules unless the supreme court miraculously changes the law, which is next to 0% unless people start voting with their brains. Lastly, "on location" filming still has American owned guns used, therefore those Glocks will not be seen. Trust me man, it ain't happening.

PS. I saw your edit on the Glock 25. The Glock 25 can't be imported no matter what. Law enforcement or not, they CAN'T. Also, Brazil has a maximum energy ban (nothing bigger than .380 for handguns,) not a "military caliber" ban. I'm going to fix those parts. --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 09:30, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:On location filming doesn't necessarily have American guns used. ''Rambo III'', for example, was American-produced but filmed partly in Israel and used stocks of weapons that would be impossible to get in the US, such as real DShK machine guns. The same arrangement (location filming with a local armourer) would make it far from impossible for these weapons to appear in a US-produced movie. Also, I'm fairly sure you're wrong. Here's the section of the relevant law:

:"If importing NFA and non-sporting weapons, please ensure an official government contract, purchase order, or letter typed on official law enforcement and/or government letterhead, bearing the original signature of the chief law enforcement official having jurisdiction over that area, is attached to the completed Form 6."

:The 25 is a "non-sporting weapon" because it fails the import test, but that doesn't stop a government or law enforcement ''agency'' buying it. It does mean ''individual'' officers can't import them, though.

:Also, IIRC didn't Glock do something weird like trademark the shape of their weapons rather than sue for patents? I think H&K did the same with the MP5 at about the same time. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 10:45, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Pretty much. They sued because the imitations were substantially identical to the iconic Glock shape. Just so you know, the Glock company is a bunch of jerks.

When it comes to using other country's armorers/weapons, it usually doesn't happen. Rambo can be the exception, but 99.99% of the time it's cheaper to mock up existing weapons and use your own armorer than to go out of the way for the real deal when usually no one will know the difference.

Also, that ATF letter is only true in name only. Regardless of signatures or agency, the request to import still has to be approved by the ATF, which it NEVER is. Look around. There are no post '86 machine guns or "non sporting" weapons used by ANY LE agency in the US (not talking about the ARMY/NAVY/Etc.) because the letters are NEVER approved. There's a couple A1 M16's with A2 uppers and MP5's with a pre '86 trigger group in use, but that's about it for LE agencies special guns usage, and all of those are pre '86 weapons.--[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 11:35, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, and a LE agency isn't going to be jumping through hoops to buy a .380 ACP pistol anyway, but it's enough to say that only LE and government could even ''theoretically'' import them according to the law for purposes of the page; it's ''not'' true to say they can't legally be imported when the law says they can be. I do agree with you that it's stunningly unlikely for a number of reasons, I just dislike terms like "impossible" being thrown around because I'm horribly pedantic. :) [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:40, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Agreed. Especially when they can pick up a just-as-good Beretta 84 without the blinking of an eye. I noticed you live in England. Here in America, there are a couple laws which supposedly make certain things allowable with the right approval, however approval never comes and those permits are deemed impossible to obtain.

Some states allow the carrying of a handgun at 18 years old, but Sheriffs won't sign off on it, well just because. In New Jersey, you are allowed to carry a handgun, but to get the permit you need a "justifiable cause," and it happens that the only justifiable one they see is carrying more than $500,000 a day for work. Apparently my self defense isn't important enough to them. It's the same with the ATF. They don't like it, you can't have it. Unfortunately it isn't constitutional, but the judges here don't quite have the guts to end their illegal rule right now. Thanks for reading my rant ;) --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 11:52, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah, everywhere has laws that technically exist but aren't enforced properly. Though ours mostly tend to have more to do with extremely precise ways for it to be legal to murder the Welsh. :P [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 11:56, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Bingo. Nice job with the edit too by the way --[[User:Ranger12|Ranger12]] 12:51, 2 November 2011 (CDT)

Hollywood is not the only people that make Movies...In fact there are hundreds of movies made every year without america having anything to do with them...and most of the time they are better off for it. Just because a gun is outlawed in the USA does not mean that it cant be used by another country that might decide to make a movie that may some day grace the pages of IMFDB.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:40, 21 January 2012 (CST)

== Glock 18 selector switch ==

Is the slide mounted selector switch on the Glock 18 on both sides of the slide or just the left side? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 14:34, 8 January 2012 (CST)
:Left side only --[[User:Bozitojugg3rn4ut|bozitojugg3rn4ut]] 14:56, 8 January 2012 (CST)
::Well that complicates things. Thanks. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 15:08, 8 January 2012 (CST)

== Naming of glocks ==

Does anyone know the story behind the naming of the Glocks? Why did they start with 17? --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 21:26, 20 January 2012 (CST)
:The Glock 17 holds 17 rounds, but where they went from there I have no idea.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 22:00, 20 January 2012 (CST)
::Is that REALLY why its called the Glock 17?!?! --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 22:01, 20 January 2012 (CST)

No its not. It came from one of these two things:
The Glock 17 was called the Glock 17 because it was Gaston Glock's 17th patent.
OR
There were 17 criteria the Austrian military had for their new pistol, that the Glock was made to meet.

Its pretty up in the air, and I've heard both stories from GLOCK reps.
-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 10:03, 21 January 2012 (CST)

Talk:Breaking Bad

2012-01-22T00:45:29Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Need Help */

Hank's Glock is .40 cal as stated in the first episode so its a Glock 22 not a 17. Also here are the other guns from the first season: S&W4506, Ruger GP100, HK416, and in the first episode of season two jesse buys a snub nosed 5 shot revolver.

== M4 ==

The M4 claimed to be used by Tuco seems to be a CAR-15

Yeah I don't know what the make and model of the snub nosed revolver is yet. Thanks for the tip on the Glock situation, though.

==Negro Y Azul==
I'll have the caps for it by tonight [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 18:03, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

== Screencappin' ==

I going to screencap this series when the DVDs come out.[[User:Oliveira|Oliveira]] 22:46, 14 May 2009 (UTC)

== Screencaps ==

I'm not a member of IMFDB, but how would I go about providing screens? I have the first season on DVD and on the day of the second season's release, I plan on purchasing it.

You can use VLC player to capture screenshots. It will capture them as PNG files, so you'll have to use a Batch image converter to convert to JPG before you upload your shots. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 07:55, 12 March 2010 (UTC)

:You can set up the VLC player so it will capture them as jpg. Go to Tools, Preferences, then video and change the format from png to jpg.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 17:30, 12 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, though my issue wasn't so much with getting the screencaps, as it was with uploading them. I '''have''' to be a member to upload files. It isn't a problem, I just didn't want to join with plans to only contribute to one page.

== Need Help ==

After going through both the first and second season, I do believe I have captured every instance of a gun on screen. I have a lot of screenshots of guns that aren't even mentioned or pointed out on the page. I don't know much about guns myself, so if I posted these extra images here, could I get some assistance with ID's please?--[[User:NinetyNineCent|NinetyNineCent]] 10:38, 21 March 2010 (UTC)

The Unknown revolver that Jesse gets is a taurus ultra light .38 spcl snub nose.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 18:45, 21 January 2012 (CST)

== Season 3 Episode 7 ==

I was wonndering, shouldn't we include the guns that appear in the truk scene where "the Cousins" are dealing with the gun-dealer. I believe that there are several Ingrams a TEC-9 and a M4 that can be included. Just a suggestion.

== Shotgun? ==

The tow truck guy threatened Jesse with a shotgun when he found him sleeping in his RV, just noticed it wasn't on the page. [[User:Diego Wolfwood|Diego Wolfwood]] 07:40, 6 October 2011 (CDT)
:I'm on that, if I just get the code to do what it's supposed to... --[[User:Euromutt|Euromutt]] 07:05, 14 December 2011 (CST)

== DEA's assault rifles in the pilot ==

Can anyone ID the weapons used by the DEA to raid the meth lab in the pilot episode? They don't look like M4s... But I may be wrong. -[[User:Sentient6|Sentient6]] 09:20, 9 January 2012 (CST)

== More pics on AMC's website ==
[http://polls.amctv.com//chart/data/1737-question-1.html A gun quiz] on the official AMC website has some nice close-up images of the guns. [[User:Barnabas Hale|Barnabas Hale]] 17:15, 21 January 2012 (CST)

Talk:Play Dirty

2012-01-20T00:49:22Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Unknown Pistol */

==Unknown Pistol==
I'm still capping, but I might as well get started with this. I have a feeling it's some sort of Star pistol, since there's no grip safety and they're filming in Spain. It's definitely not a Star BM, since it wasn't produced until 1972, and the film was released in 1969. Besides, the bore looks a bit big for 9mm. Did they make a compact Star Model P? --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 17:27, 19 January 2012 (CST)
[[File:PlayDirty_M1911_01.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Captain Douglas cocks his pistol. Notice the lack of a grip safety.]]
[[File:PlayDirty_M1911_02.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Captain Douglas' pistol in Captain Leech's belt.]]

It looks like one of those smaller Llama's in the .380 caliber...they're like a scaled down 1911.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 18:49, 19 January 2012 (CST)

Talk:M1911 pistol series

2011-12-29T16:23:20Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Difference between Kimber and Colt. */

==Additional Variants==
===Screen Used===
[[Image:EnemyofState1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Screen-used original Colt M1911 pistol wielded by [[Gene Hackman]]'s character Brill in ''[[Enemy of the State]]'', serial #357414 (photo from Long Mountain Outfitters).]]
[[Image:M1911WeWereSoldiers.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Screen used M1911 pistol (Hero Gun) carried and used by [[Sam Elliott]] as Command Sergeant Major Basil Plumley in ''[[We Were Soldiers]]'' - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:M1911A1WeWereSoldiers.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Screen Used Hero Gun M1911A1, carried by [[Mel Gibson]] as Lt. Col. Hal Moore in the film ''[[We Were Soldiers]]'' - .45 ACP. Provided by Cinema Weaponry.]]
[[Image:ColtMkIVSilver DeNiro Machete.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Custom engraved nickel plated Colt MKIV Series 80 with pearl grips - .45 ACP. This is the screen used pistol for [[Robert De Niro]] playing Senator McLaughlin in the upcoming Robert Rodriguez film [[Machete]] (scheduled for release on April 16, 2010). ]]
[[Image:ColtCustomXXX.jpg‎|thumb|450px|none|This is the screen used Colt XSE M1911 Pistol, wielded, carried (and lost) by August Gibbons ([[Samuel L. Jackson]]) in the film ''[[XXX 2: State of the Union]]''. This pistol has a customized slide with the initials "A G" etched (for "Augustus Gibbons") and also has the logo for SEAL TEAM 4 in the center - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:T2M1911detonicsprop.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The Colt/Detonics M1911A1 Series 70 hybrid pistol used in the film ''[[Terminator 2: Judgment Day]]'' - 9x19mm.]]
[[File:Saradet.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Detonics 1911 used in the film ''[[Terminator 2: Judgment Day]]''. Image courtesy of ScreeUsed.com]]
[[Image:SCM1911A1-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The stainless Springfield Armory M1911A1 used by [[Benicio del Toro|Benico Del Toro]] as Detective Jack Rafferty in the film ''[[Sin City]]'' - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:TitanicM1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|A Nickel-Plated ''[[Titanic]]'' M1911 from Stembridge Gun Rentals - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:P1010522ig5.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Actual D&L Sports Professional Model Longslides - .45 ACP movie props used by the Comedian [[Jeffrey Dean Morgan]] in ''[[Watchmen]]''.]]
[[Image:Wanted_21.JPG|thumb|none|450px|The Safari Arms Matchmaster used by [[Angelina Jolie]] in the film ''[[Wanted]]'' - .45 ACP. Note Safari Arms Lion logo.]]
[[Image:IMG 1666.JPG|thumb|none|450px|A Kimber Warrior - .45 ACP used on ''[[The Unit]]''. The weapon pictured here was the actual Warrior carried and fired by Dennis Haysbert in the last season.]]
[[Image:IMG 1534.JPG|thumb|none|450px|Another Kimber Warrior - .45 ACP was used in the most recent season of ''[[The Unit]]''. This was Dennis Haysbert's backup weapon in case the first failed (it is customary in Hollywood for each "hero" gun use to have at least one backup on set).]]
[[Image:BDSIIParas-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|A pair of Para-Ordnance SSPs (.45 ACP) as used in ''[[The Boondock Saints II: All Saints Day]]''. The weapons pictured here were the actual screen-used guns handled and fired by Clifton Collins, Jr. in the film; note the custom grips, golden suppressors, and "El Jefe" engraved into the slides. ''(Big thanks to [[Al Vrkljan]] at Movie Armaments Group for this IMFDB Exclusive image!)'']]
[[Image:ShootEmUp-HammersonNiteTac-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|A Para-Ordnance Nite-Tac (.45 ACP) used in ''[[Shoot 'Em Up]]''. The weapon pictured here is one of the actual screen-used guns from the film; note the engraved Hammerson logo. ''(Big thanks to [[Al Vrkljan]] at Movie Armaments Group for this IMFDB Exclusive image!)'']]
[[Image:1911-The Getaway.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt Government Commercial M1911 - .45 ACP used by [[Steve McQueen]] in the film ''[[Getaway, The (1972)]]''.]]
[[Image:M&MSColtXSEusedinfilm.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The Colt M1911A1 XSE - .45 ACP used in the film ''[[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]]''.]]
[[Image:ColtM1911A1PunisherProps.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The two blank firing prop custom Colt M1911A1s used in the film ''[[Punisher, The (2004)]]'' - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:NashBridges1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Nash Bridges' Custom 1911 - .38 Super. This is the actual pistol that was used by [[Don Johnson]] in the show ''[[Nash Bridges]]''.]]
[[Image:Colt-M1911A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The actual M1911A1 [[Pierce Brosnan]] used in ''[[The World Is Not Enough]]'' - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:SerenityM191A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Jayne Cobb's Mocked-Up Custom M1911A1 - .45 ACP used in the film ''[[Serenity]]''.]]
[[Image:P00654 1911 Full Left.jpg|thumb|none|450px|'''World IMFDB Exclusive:''' Screen used Colt M1911 with Nickel-plated and pearl grips - .45 ACP pistol. This non-firing prop weapon is verified as screen used from the film '''[[The Other Guys]]'''. The gun is accompanied by the Galco shoulder holster and clip pouch also used in numerous scenes from the film. This item is currently being sold by [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/ The Golden Closet]; see [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/merchant/merchant.mvc?Session_ID=6ef04a13fbe759cbdcbdc6bc4c4b809f&Screen=PROD&Store_Code=TGC&Product_Code=P00654&Category_Code=OtherGuys here].]]
[[Image:IMG 1509.JPG|thumb|none|450px|A Strayer Voight Infinity - .45 ACP. This is one of the actual guns that has been used by The Company henchmen on ''[[Heroes]]''; this weapon was supplied to the show by Independent Studio Services and has been used on every season.]]
[[Image:Expendable-kimber-b.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Modified Kimber Gold Combat II used by [[Sylvester Stallone‎]] in ''[[Expendables, The|The Expendables]]'' - .45 ACP]]

[[Image:IMG 0444.JPG|thumb|none|450px|[[M1911|Colt MK IV Series 80]] - .45 ACP This was used in the film ''[[Street Kings]]'' and the series ''[[Chase]]'' and ''[[Dark Blue]]''.]]

===Airsoft Variants===
[[Image:GP WE M1911Peral lg.jpg|thumb|none|450px|An airsoft reproduction of the Springfield Armory M1911-A1 made by J-Armoury (Western Arms) used in the film ''[[Se7en]]''.]]
[[Image:CobrGold1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Perfect airsoft replica of [[Cobra]]'s Colt GC National Match - 9mm Pistol made by Western Arms.]]
[[Image:Htk1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft replica of Storm's M1911A1 from ''[[Hard to Kill]]'' - made by Western Arms.]]
[[Image:WA-WLUF_2_mark.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft Replica of Castor Troy's custom Springfield Armory M1911-A1 - .45 ACP from the film ''[[Face/Off]]''.]]
[[Image:WA490 4 mark.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft Long Slide Jim Hoag M1911A1 replica - .45 ACP, very similar to what Frank ([[James Caan]]) used in the film ''[[Thief]]''.]]
[[Image:Snake_.45-2.JPG|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft Sheriff Co. "Custom M1911" Airsoft Gun - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:SAProTac.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Airsoft replica of a Springfield Armory Loaded - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:Baby1.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Airsoft WE HiCapa 5.1 Full Metal Dragon Custom M1911 (Type B) Black Model with blue LED lights in the grip - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Detonics CombatMaster M1911 airsoft.jpg|450px|thumb|none|WE "Caspian Arms" M1911 replica of a Detonics CombatMaster M1911 or a Colt Officer's ACP - .45ACP]]
[[Image:Colt M1911.jpg|450px|thumb|none|Yu Teng 'YT385' replica of the original Colt M1911A1 model - .45ACP]]

===Other Replicas===
[[Image:Snake_.45.JPG|thumb|none|450px|CGI rendering of the Springfield Operator from the game [[Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots]] - .45 ACP]]

===Other Variants===
[[File:M1911A1PreWar.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Detailed screenshot of prewar M1911A1]]
[[Image:Kimber_Ultra_Crimson_Carry_II.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Kimber Ultra Carry Crimson II - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Kongsberg M1914.JPG|thumb|450px|none|Kongsberg M1914 - .45 ACP. The Kongsberg M/1914 is a Colt M1911 pistol produced under license by the Norwegian factory Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk, with a minor modification to the slide stop and stock.]]
[[Image:.38Super1911MachinePistol.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The real-life Dillinger's .38 Super M1911A1 Machine Pistol, for comparison purposes.]]
[[Image:SPRINGFIELD ARMORY 1911 PISTOL.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory M1911A1 mil-spec stainless - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:SpringfieldArmoryM1911A1stainless.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory M1911A1 "Mil-Spec" - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:ED 45.jpg|thumb|none|450px|AMT Hardballer Longslide with laserlock sight as used in the film ''[[The Terminator]]'' - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:AMT_Hardballer_Hitman_Replica.jpg|390px|thumb|none|A near-perfect, firing, replica of the "Silverballers" from the Hitman series.]]

[[Image:MilSpec-1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory Mil-spec M1911A1 - .45 ACP. This was one of the most commonly seen .45s used by LAPD SWAT before the Kimber Custom TLE II.]]
[[Image:0862731R.jpg|thumb|none|450px|M1911A1 Commercial (Same marks of the movie's pistol) - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:PC9111.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory Professional 1911 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:M1911A1ithaca.jpg|thumb|none|450px|World War II Ithaca made M1911A1 with light grey finish - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:PublicEnemies1.JPG|thumb|none|450px|Pre-War Colt M1911A1 - .45 ACP used on ''[[Public Enemies]]'' (2009)]]
[[Image:SW1911pd.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson SW1911PD Tactical Rail - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:1911 Longslide.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Custom Colt M1911A1 - .45 ACP. This model is very similar to the one in the episode on the ''[[Miami Vice (TV Series)]]''.]]
[[Image:Colt45.jpg|thumb|none|450px|M1911A1 .45 ACP with Pachymar grips]]
[[Image:Taurus PT1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Taurus PT1911 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Bruni8mm.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Bruni M1911A1-style blank firing stage prop - 8mm blank.]]
[[Image:Para1911G.I..jpg|thumb|none|450px|Para 1911 G.I. Expert - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:SA_loaded_m1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory Loaded M1911A1 - .45 ACP similar to the one used by Sydney Bristow from ''[[Alias]]''.]]
[[Image:Peter-1-5006-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Federal Ordnance PSP-07 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:TIKI.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Strayer Voight Infinity TIKI - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:CustomM1911A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Custom Colt Series 80 M1911A1 pistol similair to one in the film ''[[Street Kings]]'' - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:LaserAimSeriesIIIPistol.jpg|thumb|none|450px|LaserAim Series III Pistol - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:KimberUltraRaptor.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Kimber Stainless Ultra Raptor - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Para645LDA.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Para-Ordnance 6.45 LDA with spare magazines - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:ColtDefenderRIGHT83.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt Defender - .45 ACP was similar to the one used in the game ''[[Uncharted 2: Among Thieves]]''.]]
[[Image:GM45M1911A1-3.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Hybrid 1911 "Gladys" fitted with a nickel plated three cut compensator - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Delta 001.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt Delta Elite - 10mm Auto]]
[[Image:SM178017.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson SW1911 Pro Series - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:SW108282.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson SW1911 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:KimberWarrior.jpg|450px|thumb|none|Kimber Warrior - .45 ACP like the one in the show ''[[24 - Season 8|24]]''.]]
[[Image:FLX 2.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Nighthawk FLX - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Triple_Tap_IMM_Open_pistol.jpg|thumb|none|450px|This SVI 1911 - .45 ACP is almost exactly like the one used in the film ''[[Triple Tap]]''. The description on the website reads, "IMM Open pistol made of carbon steel with Titanium compensator." (Picture supplied by sviguns.com)]]
[[Image:NiteTac.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Para-Ordnance Nite-Tac - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:1911WideSpur.png|thumb|none|450px|Springfield GI 1911 A1 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:ColtM1991A1L.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M1991A1 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:The Veteran Colt 1991A1 Series 80.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M1991A1 Series 80 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:M1911A1USAF.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Black Colt M1911A1 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Springfield_ultra_compact.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Springfield Armory Ultra Compact - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:PX9105MLP.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory Loaded MC Operator - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Springfield Armory 1911 Lightweight Operator.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Springfield Armory 1911 Lightweight Operator - .45 ACP]]
[[image:Razorcat.jpg|thumb|none|401px|Limcat Custom 2011 RazorCat - .45 ACP]]
[[File:Sight-Tracker.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Strayer Voigt Infinity Sight Tracker - .40 S&W. This is one of 10 pistols custom made by SVI for the television show ''[[Top Shot - Season 3|Top Shot]]''.]]
[[File:Para P14 Limited.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Para Ordnance P14 Limited, early model with vertical slide serrations - .45 ACP]]

==Video game appearances of this pistol series==

Why is it that the "Video Game appearances" tables have a column named "Passwords"? I don't think it's for passwords to unlock them, because to my knowledge very few video games actually have a password system to unlock weapons. Wouldn't it make more sense to have a "Notes" after the "Mods" section where certain pertinent but miscellaneous information can be written, such as what copyright-infringement-avoiding name it goes under in the game, or whether it is chambered in a non-standard caliber?

I'd like this cleared up. Oh, and someone needs to include a note saying that "mods" is short for "modifications/customizations for the weapon," not "downloadable modifications to the game itself."--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 06:20, 23 February 2010 (UTC)

:I agree. Frankly I think both the "Mods" and "Passwords" sections can go, since the latter is pointless and the former's purpose can be adequately served by "Notes". --[[User:MattyDienhoff|MattyDienhoff]] 15:17, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

==Colt Government Model Section==
With regard to the following sentence:

''"Aside from Colt selling the M1911A1 to the US military, the gun was also sold under the name "Colt Government Model" to the civilian market, and called the "Pre-Series 70" guns today."''

First, the Colt Government Model was introduced in 1912, and as such, it was originally in the M1911 configuration. When the U.S. Military switched to the M1911A1 configuration in the mid 1920s, Colt began manufacturing their Government Models in the M1911A1 configuration as well. So early Government Models parallel the military's M1911 configuration, while later Government Models (after the mid 1920s) parallel the military's M1911A1 configuration. Additionally, not only pre-Series 70 guns are Government Models. Series 70 and Series 80 guns are both Government Models. In fact, Colt still makes the Government Model to this day in various configurations.

With regard to the following sentence:

''"For IMFDB purposes, this can also be referred to as an M1911A1. In this manner, there is no need to list film, television, anime, video games in this section."''

It is sloppy to refer to a Colt Government Model as an M1911A1. "M1911A1" is the U.S. Military designation for a particular type of gun, and most of them were not even made by Colt (Remington Rand [the typewriter company] made most of them). I can see referring to a gun as an "M1911 type" or "M1911A1 type" if the manufacturer can't be determined, but when you simply type "M1911" or "M1911A1" you are referring to a U.S. Military contract pistol.

On top of that, the pictured gun in the Colt Government Model section is not even a "Pre-Series 70", it is a pre-enhanced Series 80 Government Model.

--[[User:MaximRecoil|MaximRecoil]] 21:44, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

:So it's like how we don't call it the Beretta M9, we call it the Beretta 92FS. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 03:52, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

::With the M9 vs. 92FS situation, it is next to impossible to tell the difference between the two onscreen, unless there is a closeup allowing one to read the markings. In such cases I would say, if a civilian character is using the gun, it is probably intended to be a 92F or 92FS. If a military character is using it, it is probably intended to be an M9, regardless of what the actual prop is. I would assume that most—if not all—movie and TV props are actually 92Fs or 92FSs, because I don't believe that actual M9s have ever been made available for civilian sale.

::With the M1911 or M1911A1 vs. the Colt Government Model (or other brands of 1911-type guns), it is usually possible to tell the difference onscreen without being able to read the markings. For example, the Colt Government Model does not have a lanyard loop. Most M1911A1s were parkerized, while no Government Models were parkerized. When dealing with more modern Government Models, there are even more differences. For example, starting in 1950, Government Models started coming with a full-shelf thumb safety; while all M1911[A1]s had partial-shelf thumb safeties. Also at this time, Government Models started being given a finish with polished flats and matte radiuses, while blued and Du-Lite (similar to bluing in appearance) M1911A1s had polished radiuses and brushed flats or entirely polished (depending on the manufacturer and/or time of manufacture); and of course the more common parkerized M1911A1s were simply all matte.

::Additionally, the newer Government Models as mentioned above have narrow hammers with polished sides left "in the white", and polished chamber hoods also left "in the white". Many M1911A1s had wide-spur hammers, and the ones that had narrow hammers were fully finished (no polished "in the white" sides) and they all had fully blued barrels, including the otherwise parkerized ones (no polished "in the white" chamber hoods).

::Most of the Government Models you see onscreen from the early 70s to the mid-to-late '80s were actually 9mm versions, though they were usually representing a "forty-five" onscreen. This had to do with reliable functioning with readily available 9mm blanks. Colt introduced the 9mm version of the Government Model when they introduced the Series 70 in the early 1970s, and the 9mm version of the CGM had a lowered ejection port (while the .45 ACP version still had the standard military style ejection port). With the introduction of the Series 80 Government Model in 1983, the .45 ACP version also got a lowered ejection port. No M1911[A1] had a lowered ejection port.

::I'll give an example. In the show Magnum, P.I., his gun is blued with polished flats and matte radiuses; polished "in the white" chamber hood and hammer sides, and a lowered ejection port. It is clear from looking that the gun is a Series 70 Colt Government Model chambered for 9mm (though it was always addressed as a "forty-five" in the show's dialogue); and is definitely not an M1911A1. Recently the gun came up for auction and is now in the NRA's National Firearms Museum, and it has been confirmed that that is exactly what the main prop gun was (serial # 70L33101 to be exact).

::--[[User:MaximRecoil|MaximRecoil]] 21:58, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

==Primary M1911 description==
Who wrote this? The historical paragraph (on the background of the M1911) implies that the M1911 was replaced by the U.S. Military AFTER Operation Desert Storm (1991) which is not true. The Beretta M92 (M9) was already approved and adopted by 1985.

Well for a period of time both the 1911 and M9 were in use by the U.S. military,therefore just because the M9 was in service does'nt mean it replaced the 1911 by that time, and for awhile soldiers actualy got to choose which weapon they prefered :o [[User:Leadback|Leadback]]
======================================
The Beretta M9 officially replaced the M1911 in 1985. They still used the M1911, but they weren't buying anymore. They simply phased them out over the years. Now there are some units in the US military that still use the M1911. The M9 is really only used by conventional military nowadays. For example, the Navy SEALs don't even use the M9 or M1911 anymore. They have the H&K MK23 Mod 0. Which is a purpose-built USP .45. I've even heard of some SEALs using the Ruger Mk. II. It's a .22 target pistol with an integrated silencer on it.

Soldiers were never given the choice to choose. They were given the M9, but many didn't like it. It was big, many could not shoot it accurately, and lots contested the effectiveness of the 9x19 round. Lots of people I work with were in the military around the time of the switch, were given the M9, hated it, and decided just to keep carrying the M1911. It wasn't until they were given an official order that they were forced to carry the M9. And even there, there were times when they went back to the M1911s the military had stored up. For example, out in the deserts. The magazines the military bought were junk, got sand in them, and jammed. The M1911 functioned perfectly. Same thing is happening over there now.

wrong. Special Operations soldiers are given their choice of a sidearm( and assault rifle). 1stSFOD-D has been using 1911s since foundation. infact Larry Vickers (Nighthawk Customs) has worked very closely with Delta Force. Nighthawk 1911s are being used by Delta. 2- the Seals in Vietnam started out with the Ruger Mk II Suppressed. and know one still used the HK MK23. it was fazed out years ago because of how bulky it is. SEALs use the Sig Sauer P226 or USPs. but that is still a generalization. because all SOF have a choice in sidearm [[User:Dirtdiver6421|Dirtdiver6421]] 00:20, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

==Para-Ordance==
Shouldnt these guns get their own page? Sure they are a 1911 varients, but their made by a totally different company.[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]] 00:38, 25 February 2009 (UTC)
:Yeah, but they're 1911 variants. This is the M1911 pistol series page, and they are 1911s. That's why they are on here. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
::I would prefer the Para Ordnance series of pistols have their own page due PRIMARILY to the fact that the Paras have a whole slew of different calibers that other M1911 makes and models don't have [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 06:40, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

What calibers does para have that other 1911 manufactures do not have?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 01:22, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

On the main page, the LDA entry claims that some of the LDA models were made DA/SA with an exposed hammer, but that isnt true is it? I thought all the LDA were Double Action Only, with the exposed hammer simply for aesthetic reasons? -MissySummers-

== The M in the page title ==

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the M in the page title incorrect? These are Colt 1911s (or 1911a1s, etc.), not Colt M1911s, unless referred to by US military nomenclature, just the same way that a Beretta 92f is an M9 only to the US Army and a SIG Sauer P228 is an M11 only in USAF terms. Just because it's the model of 1911 doesn't make it an M1911, any more than a '67 Shelby GT500 is an M67 Shelby GT500.[[User:YourMessageHere|YourMessageHere]] 08:09, 1 April 2009 (UTC)
::No. The Colt pistol was formally adopted by the Army on March 29, 1911, thus gaining its designation, M1911 (Model of 1911). Only examples or prototypes prior to the year 1911 would NOT have the M designation (which is extremely rare). Between the years of 1907 and 1910 the Colt pistol was constantly being modified and re-designed to win the Army's trials for adoption of a new handgun. The gun was only mass produced AFTER winning the Army's pistol trials. The Beretta 92FS was already famous world wide and was commercially available as the 92F/FS for YEARS before the Army adopted it. Every 1911 design came AFTER the M1911 (aka Model of 1911) so it is the correct nomenclature. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 07:20, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Using "1911" to refer to any and all pistols based on the M1911 design has only been popular for about fifteen years. Prior to that, the vast majority of such pistols were Colts, and were usually called "Colt .45s", even if they were pistols made by wartime contractors like Remington Rand. Those commercial guns that weren't made by Colt, as made by Vega, Randall, Federal Ordnance, Essex, etc., were called "clones", as they were generally close copies of the Colt. When makers started adding previously "custom" features to production-line guns, and branching into areas that Colt hadn't, a new name was needed, and "1911" became popular. The problem that I have with the various names on the site is the mixing of military and commercial designations; a gun cannot be a "M1911A1 Government Model", as M1911A1 is a military designation, and Government Model is what Colt has always called the civilian version of the "M" military pistols. Colt has made M1911s (1912-circa 1924), M1911A1s (circa 1926-1945), and Government Models (1912-date), but you can't mix or combine those names without confusing the issue.

==Caliber question==
I thought I would ask permission before making this change considering how important this article is: in the specifications category the caliber is listed solely as .45 ACP. I was wondering whether or not that should be changed to include .380 ACP, .38 Super, 9mm, and .40 S&W?
:-[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

No, since the ORIGINAL Colt M1911 is .45 ACP Caliber, it should stay like that, since copies of the M1911 maybe have different calibers those should be put on the "copy" section

Agreed --[[PunisherDave]]

==M1991 Series==
I was wondering: what exactly is the difference between the 1911 series and the 1991 series? -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 17:18, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

Colt introduced (announced) the M1991A1 in 1991 as a sort of economy version of the Government Model, resembling the military M1911A1, and with the serial numbers picking up where the military gun left off after WWII. The gun was made in that form until about 2003, at which time the finish was changed to polished blue rather than matte blue, and the black rubber grips replaced with checkered wood.
:I heard a guy explain on youtube that 1991 got "extra safety feature" which blocked firing pin movement entirely when trigger was not pressed; allegedly this modification appeared after a incident involving police officer accidentally killing suspect while snapping him with the gun. However, this modification somehow managed to eject firing pin from the slide during decocking so only few people liked it --[[User:Cover72|Cover72]] 21:59, 20 January 2010 (UTC)
::The YouTube guy doesn't know what he's talking about. The Colt M1991A1 did have the Series 80 firing pin safety, but this was introduced on all Colt Government Models in the early 1980s when the Series 80 version replaced the Series 70. The modification has never caused any problems, aside from perhaps complicating the trigger pull slightly, making it a little more difficult to achieve a good "trigger job". Also, the Series 80 parts are easily removed (and normally a few other minor things are done), and the gun will function just fine, in the same manner as a pre-Series 80 gun. The Series 80 firing pin safety wasn't prompted by any specific accidental police shooting. The only thing a non-Series 80 1911-type gun can accidentally shoot due to the lack of a firing pin safety is the ground. In other words, if a non-Series 80 1911-type gun is dropped from a significantly high height (6 feet or so I believe) directly onto its muzzle, the firing pin can continue forward with enough inertia to dent the primer, thus firing the gun (into the ground of course).

::It is too bad that Colt went to the trouble of designing the Series 80 modifications back in the early '80s, because the remote risk of accidental discharge as I described above is more easily solved by simply using a titanium firing pin (rather than the usual steel firing pin) along with a different weight firing pin spring. Since the titanium firing pin weighs less than a steel one, it has less inertia, and a 1911 so-equipped will pass the drop test just fine. In fact, Colt now uses titanium firing pins on their Series 70 Government Models that they started reissuing several years ago. If Colt had thought of the titanium firing pin idea back in the early '80s, they wouldn't have had to make any actual changes to the legendary 1911 design (changes which annoyed a lot of people), and they might not have lost so much of the 1911 market.

::Now, about the M1991A1: it went through a few different incarnations, but it originally was simply an economy version of the Series 80 Colt Government Model. Instead of the polished blue finish of the Government Model (polished flats and matte radiuses), it had an all-matte blue finish. It also had really cheap plastic grips that didn't fit well (they fell short of the bottom of the grip frame by about 3/16"). It also had a big, ugly rollmark on the slide, with "M1991A1" emblazoned in huge block letters. Finally, it came with a flat mainspring housing and a long trigger (both plastic), which was like the original M1911 (pre-M1911A1), which was ironic considering it was named M1991'''A1'''. --[[User:MaximRecoil|MaximRecoil]] 09:13, 17 December 2011 (CST)

==Terminator 2==
It was my understanding that the 1911 used in the film was a custom Colt frame with a fitted Detonic slide. Was it a combatmaster slide? [[Special:Contributions/65.29.239.251|65.29.239.251]] 09:33, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

== blank firers / K911 ==

I've added/moved blank firing Kimar 911 to the bottom of page as told by MoviePropMaster2008 ''("Non-firing replicas of the M1911 belong on the bottom of the M1911 page. Thanks.")'' 
But I wonder, shouldn't there be an entire sub-category of blank firers (with K911 being sub-section of this) in order to distinguish blanks from the real ones? It ''might'' look confusing this way. And also, I made multiple photos of K911 for what I thought would be it's page here including disassembled weapon photo, so perhaps these unused ones might be deleted? --[[User:Cover72|Cover72]] 21:46, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

==Strayer Voigt Infinity ==
This gun is using a frame from STI, they call that frame the 2011, it's double stacked. And is made from steel and polymer.

:are Strayer Voigt Infinity custom built guns? or just have alot of models? Rex095

The modular frames look exactly like those used by STI. http://www.sviguns.com
Don't know if they collaborate or something. They (SVI) have more optional grips than STI.

Both companies reside in Texas.
::Read up: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strayer_Voigt_Inc http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strayer_Voigt_Inc]

Does anyone know the mag cap for a Strayer Voigt Infinity in 45acp? - captain snikt

==Police service pistols==

Before the 90s were American Police ever issued the M1911, or were they're only given to the FBI and SWAT team?

- Some regular state/county/municipal departments might have used a 1911 as a standard duty-weapon before semiautos came into heavy use following the eighties, but I imagine that's a very low number. I certainly don't know of any specific departments myself offhand. Not that many departments use 'em much today. As a 1911 generally was considered a large pistol with a fairly powerful round it wasn't considered easy to use and handle by regular officers. Same general reason why departments in older times stuck with .38s over .357s - The .357 was generally considered too powerful for standard-duty officers. As such, most police departments used 9mms when they first went to automatics in the eighties as there were few semiauto calibers with lower recoil impulse and power at the time than .45ACP.

Some other police units might have used 1911s when it suited them - Homicide detectives in our county's police dept. carried 1911 type pistols, though I don't think that was the county's standard sidearm for uniformed officers. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 02:04, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

:There's another reason, besides caliber, that the 1911 wouldn't have been too popular in the old days - it's a single-action. Before DA-only became more acceptable (i.e. Glocks), most LE departments preferred handguns that were SA/DA. Almost all police revolvers used prior to the 1980s, like the S&W Model 15 and 19, or the Colt Python, were single- or double-action. This bias continued into the 1980s when a lot of departments started adopting the Beretta 92F and the 3rd Generation Smith & Wesson autos. Now that Glocks have been around long enough, DA-only is finally becoming the standard. But SA-only is pretty much a no-go to any LE agency, and that's the way it was even before the 1980s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:30, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

Isn't Glocks SA-only? The firing pin is cocked by cambering a round?

Would a Smith and Wesson Model 39 or 639 or Colt Commander be more acceptable for police use back then?

- To MT, that's a good point as well. SA weapons do require a lot of training and familiarity to operate effectively and safely, and as such, again, weren't considered practical for regular police officers either. Very good to point out. If I'm not mistaken, that's one of the main reasons why the 1911 fell out of favor in the Armed Forces as well - the fact they required extensive training and familiarity to use and carry safely. DA weapons are easier to train and operate with. Very true.

As for the Glock question, no, Glocks are actually DA only.

As for actions - In a Single-Action (SA) firearm, the hammer must be manually cocked to a firing position prior to pulling the trigger. Just like revolvers of the old west. Double action firearms will both cock and release the hammer when the trigger is pulled. SA/DA firearms use double-action by default, but feature an externally accessible hammer to allow single-action style firing (by cocking the hammer back and then pulling the trigger). Modern revolvers are perhaps the simplest examples of this.

DAO (Double-Action-Only) firearms only fire by double-action as they don't have an accessible hammer for single-action cocking. Such as Glock and various other semiauto pistols.

So if you have empty casing in the chamber, an pull the trigger several times, you would hear a loud click every time because the firing pin would be cocked every time? That's what happens in a DAO gun. If not, it's a SAO.

And on the last question, yes the Smith 39/59 pistols were used by police departments back then. Illinois State Police used the 59 back in the 60s/70s if I remember my Jane's Gun Recognition book correctly. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 05:07, 12 April 2010 (UTC)
::::Correction, Glocks are not DAO. They fire from a half-cocked position. When you dry fire the gun, the hammer falls and must be recocked by racking the slide, it does not cock by double action springs. That's why the have a slightly heavy trigger pull, they are half cocked, and are brought to full cock and dropped by pulling the trigger. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
::::: Bah, how did I miss that.. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:05, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

i thought glocks were striker-fired?

I think I read that Tacoma, WA police carry 1911s as standard issue service weapons.

I read on another forum that the LAPD authorises 1911 varients to officers, however they have to go through an intense training program to be authorised for it and they have to re-qualify ever few months too. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 16:30, 28 March 2011 (CDT)

Yes. A Glock is a "striker-fired" weapon so technically it is not either double action or single action because a glock doesnt have a hammer but instead releases the firing pin inside the slide. However if you were going to have to compare it, Single Action would be the closest term. Because the firing pin is "cocked" when the slide is racked and then the trigger only releases it and firing the round. Additionally a Glock does not qualify as a double action because it in no way cocks anything with the trigger. The trigger on a Glock can not be pulled again without cycling the weapon, whereas on a gun that is a double action the trigger can be pulled and the hammer actuated multiple times without cycling the weapon. -[[User:Peejn8r|Peejn8r]]

==Versus modern pistols==

One thing I've noticed about this pistol is that almost everyone loves it, as though it were the best, most versatile handgun ever made. But really, what makes this thing, almost 100 years old now, any better than any modern pistols? Really, modern pistols can fire the same rounds, bigger clips, better design, picatinny rails, etc.--[[User:Zblayde|Zblayde]] 21:54, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Familiarity, accuracy, ease of getting parts, feel, simplicity (yes I know there are designs that are simpler, but for what this pistol is, it is simple), many different makes and models of the 1911, modularity, traditionalism. There are many makes and models of the 1911 style that have the same features as many modern "wonder guns". Want more ammo? Get a Para Ord P14, ditto for DA, and DA/SA. Want a 9mm/ 10mm/ etc? there are many types of 1911 platform pistols ranging from .22lr to .44 Magnum. A quote I heard about the 1911 a few years ago is "It's like a '32 Ford Hotrod, its cheap, reliable, powerful, fun, and is easy to make it your own. Just don't think you'll get much mileage out of a tank of gas." Now tell me can you put custom grips, barrels, sights, slides, frames, triggers, hammers, finishes, safeties, slide releases magazines, etc etc etc on a Glock, XD, SIG, Beretta, etc? Maby a few of those, but at what price, and can you do it all? -[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 08:51, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

: ''Really, modern pistols can fire the same rounds, bigger clips, better design, picatinny rails, etc.''

- Funny, several pistols I can think of that fit that criteria are little more than updated 1911 pistols. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:08, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

"bigger clips"
: Fail. I believe you meant Magazines. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 21:28, 22 April 2010 (UTC)
ya Unless your talkin about a Mauser broomhandle (which you're not) I would prefer if you said magazine instead of clip

::Actually, that's another thing I'm questioning. Really, what is the difference between the detaachable box magazines and clips? I mean, clips hold bullets for easy loading, right? SO wouldn't modern detachable magazines be classified as clips too?--[[User:Zblayde|Zblayde]] 20:17, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
:::Simplest way I can put this - a clip loads a magazine. The magazine is what the gun feeds from - NOT THE CLIP. It just so happens that on some guns, the magazine is affixed to the weapon (the M1 Garand and the Mauser, for example). Thus, users have to use clips to reload them. On, say, a M1911 or an M16, the magazine falls out, thus allowing the user to swap in a new one when needed. A magazine could hold a clip, if so designed...but that particular road is one-way only. --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 20:47, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

::The "clip vs. magazine" distinction is something that really needs to be clarified, and one of the reasons why I asked for the "general information" section in the first place. Hopefully someone can make a good article there showing the various type of bullet clips and why they should not be confused with magazines. By the way, revolvers when not loaded manually use bullet clips. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 05:03, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

considering that this page is dedicated to the 1911 which is generally made in .45 does anyone else find it somewhat stupid that our military and most police departments are using handguns that have been known for their lack of stopping power. there are better handguns out there that hold a generous amount of .45 ammunition anyway. for example the Nighthawk FLX holds 12-14. the HK USP/HK45, and the Infinity handgun line are double stacked. and even if most .45s hold 7-10 isnt that enough in most scenarios. 7 .45 slugs does the work of at least 20. [[User:Dirtdiver6421|Dirtdiver6421]] 00:26, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Its the same reason that police used the .38 Special for so many years even after the .357 came out. Politics, logistics, ability to handle the round, etc etc... -[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 20:30, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

:With regard to caliber, police need rounds that can penetrate car bodies, doors, walls, etc. .45 rounds are not known for penetration. Also, while the .45 round is more effective against soft tissue than 9mm and .40 S&W rounds, anyone who tries to claim that 7 .45 rounds can do the work of 20 9mm or .40 rounds is completely dillusional. Watch ballistic test videos. A .45 slug entering the body does more damage than a 9mm round entering the body. If you try to claim that one .45 wound is more damaging than 2 9mm wounds with any decent grouping than you clearly have no understanding of physics or human anatomy.

But the fact remains with a 9mm you dont want him dead in the half hour it will take for him to bleed out. you want him dead NOW. with the .45 hes going to feel it. he aint gunna get back up. with the 9mm he might just keep firing.
:Depending on shot placement. A 9mm slug to the heart or any of the major arteries surrounding it will cause death within several seconds. The same is true of a shot to most areas of the skull. .45 does have increased lethality over 9mm, but that degree of superiority has been greatly exaggerated.

Yeah but a 9mm can pass through a person and keep going, a .45 doesn't. I would imagine you wouldn't want those two 9mm rounds going through a person and hitting an innocent bystander. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 16:28, 28 March 2011 (CDT)

It all really comes down to preference. Honestly a body shot with any round is not guaranteed to kill or stop anyone. The only thing guaranteed to immediately incapacitate someone is to severing the brain from the rest of the body. Recoil is also a big factor. If you cant shoot it it doesnt matter what you carry. People and police departments have to find the weapon that will work best for them. Personally I like the .45 and I own a 1911. The most important feature on the 1911 for me is its thinness with the single stack mag. Honestly I think my Sig 229 .40 kicks more violently and is harder to shoot than my .45. I know a lot of people who do not like the .45 and much prefer their 9mm because they are better with it. -[[User:Peejn8r|Peejn8r]]

Modern 9mm JHP and .45 ACP JHP in ballestic gel create near equal wounds. I can post reference links if anyone wants them. The whole thing about magazine capacity isn't really a problem as 99% of the time, only three shots are fired at most. Even with police, most of the time, no more than 3 rounds are fired.

Carry what guns suits you best, whether its a .22LR or its a .45 ACP. Once I turn 21, I plan on getting a SIG 1911 with a 4" barrel in .45 ACP but for the time being, I have to stick with my XD40.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:01, 11 October 2011 (CDT)

==Variants NOT listed with any film/TV/game appearances==

- I've taken it upon myself to remove several listed variants that had no list of anything that they've appeared in. Guns posted that didn't say they were in anything - Not one movie, TV show episode, video game, nothing. A couple of which I don't think have appeared on anything and seem to have been put up just for the hell of it.

Now I know we have a lot of 1911 variants on the page, but the page is not intended to show/describe ''every'' variant of 1911 ever made, but only those ''that have actually appeared in something'', as quoted by some of the admins. I just find it a bit annoying to have to scroll down the page and see numerous 1911 pistols that have nothing listed under them (Again, with some looking like they were just added for the sake of being there), and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

Anyway, clearing said sections out now. If it seems like an unusual or otherwise noteworthy variant, I'll add it to the 'additional variants' section below. Bottom-line, if it ain't actually been in anything, ''don't add it'', no matter how cool it is or whatever. If it has been in something, then next time, don't half-ass - If you're going to bother with the effort of putting it up in the first place, do it 100% and say what it's appeared in. Thanks. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 03:18, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

==Kimber==
in the Kimber Warrior section it is listed as "Warrior II", which is wrong, the Warrior is built to full military specs and never got the "II" desinated saftey system...so it is just a Warrior because kimber only puts the II on the models they put their special saftey on.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:39, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

==Controversy igniter==
I am fully aware that what I am about to say will probably ignite the greatest firestorm of controversy this site has seen in a while. I have fired several 1911 pistols and found them to be a good, solid design. That said, it doesn’t change the fact that I think this is undoubtedly the most overrated firearm in history. Throughout the entire gun community there is the consensus that this is the absolute greatest thing ever conceived by the mind of man and anyone who says anything different is a blasphemer. Again, I am not saying it is a bad pistol, I just don’t think it is best (I won’t say what my top choice is for fear of causing even more indignation to come my way). Though even if it were the undisputed best pistol design around, I still don’t think it would be so significantly greater than other designs as to warrant being the object of the worship and masturbatory fantasies of every gun enthusiast in the world as it currently is. That’s my two cents, I await the fallout.

:I smell a troll.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 17:18, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

I'd say he's not because he seems to explain his point. At least his reasoning isn't 'this gun sukzz' [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 17:42, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

:My main reasoning is that the weapons are predominately single action only, which necessitates that they either be carried condition three (which makes the pistol slow to bring into action), or condition one (which many consider unsafe). The double/single action and double action only systems have become omnipresent in most modern combat pistols for good reason. Additionally, while a generally reliable design, many other pistols have surpassed 1911 models in ruggedness and reliability. Another thing that I find odd is the vast variety of weapons that are claimed to be “1911s.” For instance, I have seen subcompact, double action only, double-column “1911s” in many calibers other than .45acp. At this point the only common feature between these weapons and the original Colt 1911 design are a loose aesthetic resemblance. The internal mechanisms maybe similar as well, but many other pistols share a far greater functional similarity to 1911s yet do not bear the moniker. At what point does a gun cease being a “1911” and become something simply trying to cash in on a famous name sake?

It is human nature to emulate successful designs in the hopes of getting a piece of that pie, especially in the modern business world. Less-refined terms for this behaviour include "jumping on the bandwagon" or "riding a gravy train." It's nothing new now in the firearms industry, what with all the AR-15 variants, Glock knock-offs, and (of course) countless "1911-type" pistols around. What defines a "1911-type" pistol is really matter of personal preference.

I would, however, agree that it's foolish to fetishize a type of firearm or a firearms manufacturer just because of its track record or Public Relations budget. There is no such thing as the "perfect" weapon in the real world--every design involves tradeoffs, and that's even before you include the "human factor." Designs can always be improved. What matters most is what you can use the most effectively in a consistent manner. And if you can't, then you ought to get yourself another weapon or train more.

Speaking of "best pistol ever," I remember how H&K tried to label their 4.6x30mm pistol as "the Ultimate Combat Pistol," but it got unceremoniously cancelled, because of "inadequate ballistics in a handgun format." So much for "Ultimate Combat Pistol"--now it joins the legions of "Useless Cancelled Pistols" that came before it. Perhaps it could have had a chance if it were a machine pistol instead, dubbed the "MP7 UltraComPact," in essence an MP7 PDW in handgun format. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 00:34, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

:What I would like to know is what is it about the 1911 that supposedly makes it the best. I've heard people say it is the greatest pistol ever for more than a decade yet never explain what ''specific'' features or advantages it has that make it so good.

You should head on over to the forum and ask that question: "What makes the M1911 pistol so great compared to everything else, and when does an M1911 stop being one and start being a pistol just pretending to be one?" I'm sure there are more people there who could answer your questions better than what you could get here. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:24, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

What makes the 1911 the "best"? There are many reasons for the following it has. I am of course referring to the original 1911A1 model, not the double stack nor double action variants. For one, the single action trigger is extremely easy to train with and use by a lot of people. Second, it has redundant safety systems in place. Even with the manual safety off, it will not fire unless the grip safety is fully pressed, though this safety system is seen by a few as a con of the design. Third, it utilized a single stack design. That coupled with the angle of the grip is a very comfortable for a majority of the people. The degree of the grip angle was chosen because, for a lot of people, it is a natural point meaning that one could close ones eyes and bring the pistol up and have it pointing directly at the target. Fourth, it fired the .45 ACP. The .45ACP is a proven manstopper especially when compared to the other rounds utilized at the time of its adoption and until the development of reliable hollow point designs. Lastly, I would argue that compared to many other designs, such as the Mauser C96, Luger,etc..., the 1911 was easily field strip as the pieces of the pistol were designed to aid in the stripping down of the firearm. Compared to todays plethora of firearms, the 1911 is no longer the only pistol to chamber effective rounds or reliability. Why is it still popular then? Because some people still favor the 1911 design. Overrated, I don't think so. There is a reason why it is still chosen over other designs. Is it the end-all-be-all of pistol design? No, I would say it isn't. Anyway, from everything I've read, personal experience, and research that is what I have come up with. [[User:GaBoy45|GaBoy45]] 21:15, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

:Everything you have described establishes that the gun is a good design, perhaps the best gun around when it first came out, but does not explain it's enduring following. The grip may be confortable for many people, but that is far too subjective to explain why so many people (with so many different hand sizes) still favor this gun. It's single stack magazine make it a confortable target and practical concealed carry weapon, but the limited capacity it offers can be a death trap in a combat weapon (which many still claim the 1911 is the quintessential example of). The .45 ACP is a great round against soft targets, but does not offer very good penetration or long distance acuracy. And with the isistance on reliable "Soldier Proof" weapons in most of today's militaries, many modern pistols are more reliable and easier to strip than the original 1911s. I don't deny that the 1911 was most likely the best pistol in the world when it came out and for a few decades after, but I don't think it still warrents that praise anymore, yet almost every gun Television show, magazine, website, etc. seems to constantly proclaim its supremacy.

To answer your first point. The single stack, thin handgrip is easily usable by people of differing handtypes. You say its subjective but isn't how something feels in someones hand subjective? For example, the M9/Beretta 92FS has a thick grip. Bigger hands have no problem with the grip but smaller hands do. The slim 1911 grip can be used by big hands or little hands. The grip angle is something else that many people find comfortable. You second point that you made was the single stack "death trap". You say that the single stack is a liability. But capacity isn't everything. 7+ rounds of .45 ACP is good. The .45ACP has a well known reputation for one shot stops. The 9mm of the Beretta 92 or Glock 17 does not have that reputation. As for the .45ACP, it is not meant to penetrate body armor, neither is the standard 9mm, but it is accurate over long distances. There are very few pistol rounds that are meant to penetrate body armor of vehicle armor, which is what I think that you are getting at. If you draw a pistol in a combat zone, you are already in deep trouble or in a position where a high capacity is not needed, i.e. MP's. Anyway, a pistol is not meant to be accurate at long distances so the point is moot. As for the "Soldier Proof" weapons, that is just a cheap way out of training soldiers correctly, as they did with the A2 model of the M16. A milspec 1911 is just as reliable as newer designs. One such argument is that the 1911 was only tested for 6000 rounds with no failure before cleaning while Glock for example is tested at 30,000 rounds. What soldier won't clean his sidearm after 6000 rounds? What battle involves firing 6000 rounds out of a pistol? If you can't see why the 1911 design is praised and still being used then I can't help any further. The 1911 design has many good points that apparently many people still find better than other designs, and many still find the 1911 a proven and effective design.[[User:GaBoy45|GaBoy45]] 22:52, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

:Apparently I wasn't clear when I rebutted you last time. The single stack is confortable for people with small hands yes. However, people with larger hands, and even some small handed people, have no problem with thicker grips and so the capacity limiting single stack serves no purpose. The grip angle is a completely subjective feature and so it is imposible to argue that one style is better than another. What matters more is simply what one is used to. You are right that 7-9 rounds of ammunition and 6000 rounds before cleaning is more than adequate for most applications, however my point wasn't that the 1911 is bad (it is a good weapon) but simply that there are better guns out their. 7 or 8 rounds may be enough for most encounters, but having 12-17 rounds and being able to fire 30,000+ rounds before cleaning is an advantage, whether or not one will utalize those features often. Also, when I referenced penetration I had things like doors, walls, and car bodies in mind, not armor. The .38 Super cartridge was specifically developed because the .45 could not penetrate car bodies effectively. Your previous post all focuses on arguing that the 1911 is an ''adequate'' combat pistol which I completely agree with. My whole point is that the features you mentioned ''do not make it the best pistol around.'' When I first began this conversation I stated that the 1911 is not a bad gun, simply that with all the pistol designs that have emerged in the past century it is no longer the greatest pistol in the world, yet nearly everyone in the gun community (yourself clearly included) still claim it is for no other reason than people like its grip (which is subjective), its caliber (which is used in many much modern modern firearms), and its history (which can easily make it a favorite gun but can not be used as justification for it being the best).

::'''"You are right that 7-9 rounds of ammunition and 6000 rounds before cleaning is more than adequate for most applications"'''

::"Before cleaning"? What do you think; that it will malfunction on the 6001st round if you don't clean it? The gun is as dirty as it is going to get after a few hundred rounds. When you've fired a gun 6000 times in a row without cleaning and with no malfunctions, that means that when the gun finally does malfunction it won't be because it is dirty; it will most likely continue to function properly until something breaks.

::'''"but having 12-17 rounds and being able to fire 30,000+ rounds before cleaning is an advantage, whether or not one will utalize those features often."'''

::Just so you know, the M1911 didn't malfunction on the 6000th round. It didn't malfunction at all. They stopped after 6000 rounds because that is how many rounds they had decided beforehand would be adequate for a test. Any gun that can fire 6000 rounds without malfunctioning can most likely fire indefinitely without malfunctioning, until something breaks. And keep in mind that the M1911 did this 100 years ago, being built out of the relatively poor grades of steel of the day (steel was greatly improved after WWII, even though no U.S. military M1911 or M1911A1 ever got to take advantage of it, because none were bought after WWII). Also, those things you mentioned are ''potential'' advantages. A potential advantage that isn't used at all is not an actual advantage, obviously.

::30,000 rounds is overkill for a test. Most people will never fire anywhere near that many rounds through their handgun (especially without cleaning), and even if they did, who would want to trust their life to a gun that has 30,000 rounds worth of wear and tear on it? --[[User:MaximRecoil|MaximRecoil]] 13:18, 17 December 2011 (CST)

You were arguing the design flaws but it is the design that is one of the big reasons it has such a following. Since you are arguing one view against the other. Why a lot of people think that it is the best. The design is one reason, history is another, the round it fires is yet another reason. I actually don't think it is the best I was merely stating the reasons that it is popular and why people say it is the best. I like the Beretta 92fs for its grip and certain design attributes and the Glock 21sf for different reasons. Would I object to using the 1911 in combat. No. Would I use the Beretta 92fs in combat with FMJ ammo? Not if I didn't have to. With HP ammo, I wouldn't hesitate to use the Beretta. But even your view of other designs being better is subjective. If a pistol, rifle, shotgun, etc...is reliable and fires a moderately effective round then it is a good design. What makes it the best is subjective as far as it goes. What one pistol may be best at is what makes it worst at something else. There is no way to objectively define the "best" just what is better than something else.[[User:GaBoy45|GaBoy45]] 00:17, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

:I agree. I don't have any gun in mind that I think is indisputably better than all others. The features I pointed out I did so to demonstrate that in certain aspects the 1911 is inferior to other disigns, not that said other designs are the perfect weapon. Every design is a give and take of different features. Because of this, my main complaint was a pervaisive belief that the 1911 is unquestioningly the greatest gun ever (I have heard that phrase Verbatim in many issues of Guns & Ammo). Is it better in some aspects than double-collumn, double-action 9mm pistols? Yes. Is it better across the board? Absolutly not. I apologize if at any point I have come across as confrontational, it is just that I have heard so many people assert the 1911's complete supremacy so many times that it has really gotten on my nerves and I wanted to know what others thought.

Google "1911"...then google any other gun...now tell me which one has the most varieties...which one has the most after market parts and pieces for the specialist. Which one has the most surplus parts. Its so popular and so famous because if you wanted to you could make one look like no other one or you could make it look like that one in your favorite movie. Not only that but all the diffrent calibers from 45cal to the awesome and unbeatable 10mm. Plus they are sexy as hell. To sum up you can basically have a beautiful, functional, all steel combat pistol in your choice of caliber and its going to feel like a dream in your hands.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 00:48, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

:The madness of crowds surely knows few bounds--just look at how the various bottled water companies manage to make a killing selling what is essentially tap water, because people will do often do things just because enough other people tell them it's a good idea. Then again, I suppose the "cult following" that some pistol-types have over others is due in part to the following facts:

:*Pistols are rarely if ever primary combat weapons anymore, with the exception of law enforcement.
:*Few people who routinely carry pistols have to regularly use them in gun battles against opponents who are earnestly trying to kill them.

:Therefore there aren't many occasions for most pistol-carriers to test their assumptions in the most revealing field of all--life-or-death situations. So depending on your circumstances you can go a lifetime without ever putting the hype in the harsh light of real return-fire. I'd bet on the M1911-type (the "pure" single-stack .45 ACP M1911s) pistols selling so much mostly because of its hype and history, and that it is, at its heart, a serviceable (though hardly optimal) weapon. Given how many clones there are, however, I really must wonder what would have happened had Colt become the sole copyright holder for this pistol type--would we see more innovation that way, or just countless clones of some other pistol type? Perhaps a more revealing, specific question would be "How does the M1911 platform compare to the Glock platform or CZ-75 platform?" That could work because all three are successful pistol types offered in multiple calibers, including 9x19mm, .45 ACP, and 10mm Auto.

:Bottom line? The "pure" M1911 works, but we can certainly do better. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 04:07, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

::Exactly

Ok, well answer me this then. Why if the 1911 is all hype and legend does MEUSOC still issue 1911s? Why does Delta give out a stipend to have an operator buy his own custom 1911? Why does the FBI HRT use 1911s? and LAPD SWAT? and so many other groups that use pistols? The reasons the wonder 9s came into popularity are lower recoil (marginal), size (marginal) higher capacity (less training in marksmanship), weight (long since gone by the wayside), to match ammo with other NATO countries (Military), and hype/ cool factor (civilian). The 1911 has served admirably (in one capacity or another) with few major changes to the platform for almost 100 years. The Beretta, Glock, CZ-75, etc. have been redesigned and "improved" since they came out just to try and match the 1911s in popularity, reliability, etc.-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 17:30, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

:Sure thing. How many of these operators you mentioned fulfill the conditions I mentioned above, namely that they regularly use pistols as their primary combat weapons instead of SMGs/PDWs/Rifles and often engage in gunfights with earnest, aware opponents? And other combat platforms for the .45 ACP won out, such as the Mk. 23 SOCOM pistol which won out over Colt's version. The "improved" Beretta, Glock, CZ-75 you mentioned have done so to fit consumer demand and market competition, but national armed forces aren't that commercial and competitive most of the time because of how many contracts and vested interests are running the show. I simply said that the "Pure" M1911 platform works when used, but it can be improved, otherwise the Mk.23 SOCOM wouldn't have won the OHWS program. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 02:05, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

::A lot of Special Forces don't even use the Mk. 23 due to its bulky and awkward size. Many Navy SEALs opt to use 9mm SIG-Sauer Pistols

H&K won the competition because they strictly adhered to all of the requirements (some of which were asinine), and they put in the best bid. When USSOCOM received the Mk. 23 they got exactly what they asked for but not what they had actually wanted. The SEALS who used it complained about how it was too big, heavy, and its cons outweighed its pros. They tried to pawn them off on the ARMY but no one there would touch them, so most of them went back to H&K. As with all things military, big brass does not listen to the guys who actually have to use the equipment until its too late.-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 06:13, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

I would like to toss my thoughts into the mix. Being a Brit getting a hold of a real firearm is harder than getting away with stealing the Popes hat, but I am an avid airsofter and I have held and fired many different types of airsoft pistols ranging from HK USPs, to Glocks, to Berettas, to SIGs. But I still go back to my 1911s to which I have 2 (I'm awaiting delivery of a third). I don't have tiny hands but I don't have big bear hands and the 1911 design feels right in my hands. I use a weaver stance and the 1911 is the best pistol for hand placement in that stance, I had an issue with the Beretta that sometimes my thumb could slip onto the slide locking mechinism and prevent slide lock. With Glocks they felt too top heavy for me, maybe it's how the airsoft Glocks are designed and it's not like that on the Real steel. I used a SIG for quite a while as that felt pretty good, but as soon as I picked up a 1911 I needed one. After a little practice I can draw, remove the safety and bring the pistol up to the target in a little under 2 seconds. Why do I like the 1911 so much? It's all about the placement, the safety is right by your thumb so when you draw it you can use one motion to bring the pistol up and deactivate the safety. I found the Beretta to be a bit of a fumbling job deactivating the safety mid draw. Why the 1911 design is still praised isn't down to some cult following, it's down to simple ergonomics, it looks great, the functionality is great, the placement of everything on the pistol is perfect. I saw someone post that they would rather be able to fire 30,000 shots and not have to clean their pistol rather than 6000. I don't know about you but if I only fired off one shot from my pistol in a battle I would still clean it to make sure nothing is going to cause a problem next time. Better to be safe than sorry. --[[User:Cool-breeze|Cool-breeze]] 17:19, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

I think it depends by what you define as 'best', and what you need the gun for. In my mind, if you want an M1911 variant, get a Para-Ordnance LDA. Like the P14.45, but double action. If you want a cheap, reliable, accurate semi-auto, do what everybody else does, get a Glock 17 and stop moaning. Your moaning about not people liking 7-round magazines (we've moved on to higher-capacity ones-in my mind, if armies must use M1911 variants, use Para-Ordnance's. 7 or 8 rounds plus one in the chamber is just awful, and you'll run out quickly.) is making the world of semi-auto's remain stuck in the 20th century. Embrace the future! With pistols like the Caracal, FN Herstal Five-seveN, and many other great ones, it's not half bad.

== Ballester-Molina ==

The Ballester-Molina should not be included in the 1911 page. It's not a 1911, only the mags and barrel interchange. Internally it's based on the Star Model A, which has significant differences from the 1911 in terms of lockwork. Unless anyone objects I'm going to create a separate page for it. - [[User:Nyles|Nyles]]

== Link share ==

Hello there,

This is a question for the webmaster/admin here at www.imfdb.org.

Can I use part of the information from this blog post right above if I give a link back to your site?

Thanks,
Daniel

== Dreamworks Animation ==

When are you guys going to add animated films from Dreamworks like Monsters vs. Aliens and Megamind, because they have guns used by police and the military.

Just because there are guns in it doesn't mean it gets a page here. Are they recognisable as real guns, or are they stylised ones? [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 09:58, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

They are real guns in the animated films, like in Monsters vs Aliens, the soldiers used some M16 rifles to shoot at the alien, and in Megamind, the police uses rifles and pistols on aiming the villain, who is walking.

OK, I'm going to assume that you haven't read the [[Rules, Standards and Principles]] page, most notably [[Rules, Standards and Principles#Anime: Rules & Restrictions|this section]]. Read that, then check back. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 19:36, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

But wait, why do we have video game pages then? Firearms in them barely resemble real ones --[[User:Jackbel|Jackbel]] 19:47, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Ok sorry, no big deal, lets not add cartoons yet, because they have to wait.

:@Jackbel. Because in video games you can clearly identify the guns, and no the good ones do not just 'barely resemble real ones.' As a video game person you should know this, unless Australia has weird rules about depicting guns in video games. The reason cartoons are generally not allowed is because unlike anime, most cartoons have a generic silouette of a 'gun' while most animes have enough detail to be able to determine what guns was used. Think [[Ghost in the Shell]] or [[Cowboy Bebop]].--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 13:52, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

==.45 Blanks==

I've read a lot here that .45 blanks used to be unreliable. I was wondering when they started to become a bit more reliable and why they were unreliable? I can't find that anywhere.

I thought it wasn't really the blanks being unreliable so much as it just being easier to blank-convert a 9mm than a .45. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 10:29, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

.45 pistols require more recoil force to cycle their actions than 9mms. Since blank rounds have virtually no recoil, .45s are much harder to convert to use blanks.

Ah right. Is there some new way of converting them now because I've started to notice that in recent years there have been a lot of films using .45 ACP versions of pistols that are also chambered in 9mm. Die Hard 4.0 for example, McClane as a P220 in .45 ACP. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 17:37, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
:Is it explicitly stated that the prop gun was chambered in .45? [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 21:16, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
::''"Is it explicitly stated that the prop gun was chambered in .45"'' We have a pic of the actual screen used gun and is listed as .45 ACP. I think all newer P220s are chambered in .45, only some of the older ones were chambered in 9mm and .38 Super. Also the .45 being unreliable with blanks. I don't think it encompassed all .45 chambered pistols. I think it was only in the 1911 platform. With the 9mm being a much smaller blank and having the large ejection port made for the .45 it was easier to eject them.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 22:09, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
[[Image:SIGP220R LiveFreeDieHard.jpg|thumb|none|500px|SIG-Sauer P220R - .45 ACP. This is the screen used gun in the film and was carried and fired by ''[[Bruce Willis]]''.]]
::: Just checking. Especially after the whole issue with the Glocks. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 23:54, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Long (and detailed!)story short. For a 1911 to fire blanks reliably you must first drill and tap the barrel for a blank adapter, then taper the barrel hood, then grind off the locking lugs, and remove the barrel linkage. Once that is done, the testing for a reliable adapter and blank combo ensues (you may or may not need to enlarge the ejection port too). I figure its pretty much the same with other pistols...-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 19:11, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

That sounds like a very complex process. I'm assuming if you do that well though the 1911 will cycle blanks as well as 9mm blanks. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 01:28, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

I read an article in a gun magazine a few years back about blanks and it said that it comes down to the casings used. According to the article, blanks are made from rifle brass because it has to be long enough to be crimped and still be long enough to be the length of a real cartridge. The problem with .45 acp ammo is that until recently there was no rifle brass in .45 diameter that could be used for blanks. I remember reading back when "Miami Vice" was on that Timothy La France had brass custom manufactured in .45 for blanks. -- David, 3 December 2010 (well, its the 3rd where I live)

==Laseraim Series III?==

So what is this thing?
[[Image:LaserAimSeriesIIIPistol.jpg|thumb|none|450px|LaserAim Series III Pistol - .45 ACP]]
It looks more like a CZ derivative than a 1911 derivative to me... Alot like a mashup of CZ, S&W, Sig, STI, etc..-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 06:51, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
:It draws a little from the S&W series (namely the safety) and CZ-75 (in terms of grip shape), but technically it is a M1911 derivative, they just didn't make many of them.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 07:15, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Used to see these in tv shows during the late 80s. the later model was the first pistol I ever saw with an integral accessory rail on the dust cover, although that was in a catalog. David. 11 December 2010
:::Dust cover? What are you talking about? [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]]
I don't know what else to call it, it is the part of the frame extending in front of the trigger guard. I have seen it, in print referred to as a dust cover. David.

::THIS Laseraim was photographed for the [[Haunted (2002)]] page since it was used in an episode. If you guys read the Haunted (2002) page, for which this IMAGE was originally shot for, the description says: '''Laser Aim was yet another manufacturer who built ported .45 ACP pistol based on the original M1911 design, but incorporating elements of the BHP and the CZ-75 into a new design. The unique feature of the Laser Aim was a hole cut out of the trigger guard ahead of the trigger to mount a laser. Since the production ended for this pistol, smaller lasers with better battery life have been invented. By the late 1990s LaserAim had gone out of business and had sold their patents to AMT. ''' Hope this sheds some light on the piece. It is a new weapon influenced purportedly by M1911, BHP and CZ designs. :) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]]

Ah, that explains it. Could have saved myself about 2 hrs of google searching if I'd looked up the image uses hah.-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 23:13, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

== MEU(SOC) Pistol... ==
...has been given a new designation, ''M45''. [http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/09/24/m45-close-quarters-combat-pistol/] [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:24, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

We also need a better image for it, but I can't find one I can't be sure isn't an Airsoft gun. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 19:04, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

The big problem is there is no single model that is the M45/ MEUSOC Pistol. The "M-45s" in service are a mix and match of Kimbers, Springfields, Colts, etc. The "M-45" is a set of specs that any pistols built for MEUSOC have to comply with. There are SOME retrofitted M1911A1 pistols that were done by USMC Armorers at Quantico, but they are going to be near impossible to differentiate from the M1911A1 they were built from.
Here's a good thread from AR15.com (dear lord its hard to say that haha) about the M-45 MEUSOC pistol variants.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=5&f=49&t=86667
-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 08:46, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

== More proof of the M1911's greatness ==

According to the news, the M1911 is now the official state gun of Utah! This is kind of cool, since John Browning lived in Utah, and it's just in time for the great .45's centennial anniversary. [[Special:Contributions/74.192.58.206|74.192.58.206]] 21:16, 19 March 2011 (CDT)

== Happy 100th Anniversary to the Colt M1911! ==

Happy 100 years of service M1911! Thank you for providing some of the most nastiest knockdown power available to the armed forces and for providing an eternal name of badassery in motion pictures!

Here's looking forward to 100 years more! --[[User:ThatoneguyJosh|ThatoneguyJosh]] 15:40, 29 March 2011 (CDT)

My favorite semi-auto is the 1911. I've had affairs with others but I always come back to a good ole Colt .45. I didn't understand why until I did some research and figured out we shared a birthday. Still saving for an anniversary model... [[User:USGIMar29|USGIMar29]] 19:40, 2 September 2011 (CDT)

==9mm 1911s==
I'm not sure if this is an appropriate question to ask but could anyone recommend some good 9mm 1911s? I live in Australia and the maximum calibre you can get without doing competition shooting is .38 or 9mm rounds. --[[User:GunEnthusiast|GunEnthusiast]] 07:07, 21 July 2011 (CDT)

== Naming the MEU(SOC) pistol ==

On M1911's page (and correspondingly on pages that list the weapon) it is named "M-45 MEUSOC":

1) While calling it "M-45" wouldn't be incorrect, it should be changed to "M45" in line with other officially adopted names on IMFDB;

2) Using "MEUSOC" in conjunction with "M45" is incorrect. It is either "MEU(SOC) Pistol" or "M45 Close Quarters Battle Pistol" / "M45 Close Quarters Combat Pistol".

--[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 11:46, 2 October 2011 (CDT)

:Well, then go change it. ^3^ - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 14:59, 2 October 2011 (CDT)

::Will be done right now. --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 03:17, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

:::I think they are the same pistol. I remember seeing a story about how the MEU(SOC) was reclassified as the M45 Close Quarters Combat Pistol at some point, and have also seen documents that use the term M45 MEUSOC (no brackets). What do you think the differences are between the two? I think there is some confusing as there have been various different versions of the MEU(SOC) pistol built from various off the shelf parts. There are at least 5 versions that I know of, and main fetures are as follows. 1: original version with unflared ejection port and Springfield Armoury logo behind the ejection port. 2: newer slide with flared ejection port and logo in front of the ejection port. 3: front slide serrations. 4: wide slide serrations and Novak sights, with grip safety with "bumb" at the bottom. 5: 4th version with skeleton hammer rather than Commander type hammer. You also have the ICQB which is a Kimber made pistol with a railed frame. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 06:26, 3 October 2011 (CDT)
::::Sorry, just realised I totally misread your original post. Though you were saying that the MEU(SOC) and M45 were different pistols. However, the term M45 MEUSOC (without brackets) is also correct. [https://www.fbo.gov/?s=opportunity&mode=form&tab=core&id=df43476377acd40c0f409faa2ceffc9d&_cview=1] --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 07:52, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

:::::Notice the presence of comma between M-45 and MEUSOC. That would indicate the listing of different designations for the weapon. --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 09:27, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

::::::I really don't think the comma means that, but to satisfy you, here [http://www.fbodaily.com/archive/2010/03-March/19-Mar-2010/FBO-02095403.htm]. To be fair though, I have seen official documents that refer to the M45 being the MEUSOC, Close Quarters Battle or Close Quarters Combat pistol. I think this whole conversation is irrelevant however, as on looking into it, I think the M45 pistol and the MEU(SOC) pistol listed on this page are different weapons, with the M45 being a commercial of the shelf pistol made by either Colt, Sprinfield Armoury or Karl Lippard Designs. This article from the [http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/2011/01/marine-marsoc-pistol-45cal-012511w/ Marine Corps Times] seems to back this up (this time referring to it as the Close Quarter Battle Pistol) stating that the M45 is modelled on the MEU(SOC) but will be a COTS pistol, which is currently being evaluated. For the sake of simplicity, I think the pistol on this page should just be called the MEU(SOC). --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 11:19, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

:::::::MEUSCOC. Wonder what the first "C" stands for?
:::::::It would have been so much simpler if there was website that chronicles the history of MEU(SOC) pistol. Every variant along with pictures and how they were designated (to distinguish them)... Because currently sources are conflicting. In USMC's [http://www.quantico.usmc.mil/ MCB Quantico] section there is an article "[http://www.quantico.usmc.mil/Sentry/storyview.aspx?SID=4913 The Devil Dogs’ workshop]". There it says M45 Close Quarters Battle Pistol is being built by local armorers. --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 12:50, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

One more issue: sources vary on the year of adoption. Some say 1985[http://www.americanspecialops.com/special-ops-weapons/meusoc-pistol.php][http://www.forcerecon.com/strongmenarmed3.htm], other say 1986[http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/marinefacts/blsoc.htm][http://www.militaryfactory.com/smallarms/detail.asp?smallarms_id=16][http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/history/meusoc.htm]. Maybe change the part to "since the mid-1980s"? --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 01:53, 11 October 2011 (CDT)

:Done. --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 07:08, 13 October 2011 (CDT)

== A Location of Procuring ==
Does anyone know where you can get one of these great airsoft movie-1911 replicas namly the stunning and slender long-slide?

[[Image:WA490 4 mark.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft Long Slide Jim Hoag M1911A1 replica]]

-[[User:GladeTaylor]]

The image has a watermark from [http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/ ehobbyasia.com] on it, so I'd suggest looking there. The exact pistol is [http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/western-arms-colt-hoag-bianchi-special-gbb-pistol.html here.] [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 10:12, 14 December 2011 (CST)

== Organization. ==

Any objections to alphabetizing this page? I think it would make a bit more sense... --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 21:38, 6 December 2011 (CST)
:No don't do that. The M1911 and M1911A1 go first. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 21:52, 6 December 2011 (CST)
::Fair enough, I actually agree with that. But what about the less common ones. Seems weird to Kimber, Strayer, Inifinity, Detonics, Springfield, etc... What if we keep the most common ones at the top (M1911 & M1911A1) and put the rest in order? --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 21:58, 6 December 2011 (CST)

== Difference between Kimber and Colt. ==

In several medias, I discovered that Colt M1911 can sometimes be referred as the Kimber. Why is it so since the weapon manufacturer is Colt? And is there any difference in the mechanism of gun between the both companies? --[[User:S9771773G|S9771773G]] 21:31, 28 December 2011 (CST)

those medias are just being ignorant with their terminology. Colt makes 1911's and kimber makes 1911's...two diffrent companies that happen to make the same model. Any true diffrences in them will mostly be cosmetic in nature. The biggest diffrence between colt and kimber is that Kimber say Yonkers on it and colt say Hartford. Most people think that colt was the first and only maker of the 1911 and call all 1911's colts no matter of maker...for example someone saying "I own a colt 1911 made by springfield"...well no sir you have a Springfield 1911-A1 and colt has nothing to do with it.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 10:21, 29 December 2011 (CST)

Talk:M1911 pistol series

2011-12-29T16:21:39Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Difference between Kimber and Colt. */

==Additional Variants==
===Screen Used===
[[Image:EnemyofState1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Screen-used original Colt M1911 pistol wielded by [[Gene Hackman]]'s character Brill in ''[[Enemy of the State]]'', serial #357414 (photo from Long Mountain Outfitters).]]
[[Image:M1911WeWereSoldiers.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Screen used M1911 pistol (Hero Gun) carried and used by [[Sam Elliott]] as Command Sergeant Major Basil Plumley in ''[[We Were Soldiers]]'' - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:M1911A1WeWereSoldiers.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Screen Used Hero Gun M1911A1, carried by [[Mel Gibson]] as Lt. Col. Hal Moore in the film ''[[We Were Soldiers]]'' - .45 ACP. Provided by Cinema Weaponry.]]
[[Image:ColtMkIVSilver DeNiro Machete.jpg‎|thumb|none|450px|Custom engraved nickel plated Colt MKIV Series 80 with pearl grips - .45 ACP. This is the screen used pistol for [[Robert De Niro]] playing Senator McLaughlin in the upcoming Robert Rodriguez film [[Machete]] (scheduled for release on April 16, 2010). ]]
[[Image:ColtCustomXXX.jpg‎|thumb|450px|none|This is the screen used Colt XSE M1911 Pistol, wielded, carried (and lost) by August Gibbons ([[Samuel L. Jackson]]) in the film ''[[XXX 2: State of the Union]]''. This pistol has a customized slide with the initials "A G" etched (for "Augustus Gibbons") and also has the logo for SEAL TEAM 4 in the center - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:T2M1911detonicsprop.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The Colt/Detonics M1911A1 Series 70 hybrid pistol used in the film ''[[Terminator 2: Judgment Day]]'' - 9x19mm.]]
[[File:Saradet.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Detonics 1911 used in the film ''[[Terminator 2: Judgment Day]]''. Image courtesy of ScreeUsed.com]]
[[Image:SCM1911A1-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The stainless Springfield Armory M1911A1 used by [[Benicio del Toro|Benico Del Toro]] as Detective Jack Rafferty in the film ''[[Sin City]]'' - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:TitanicM1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|A Nickel-Plated ''[[Titanic]]'' M1911 from Stembridge Gun Rentals - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:P1010522ig5.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Actual D&L Sports Professional Model Longslides - .45 ACP movie props used by the Comedian [[Jeffrey Dean Morgan]] in ''[[Watchmen]]''.]]
[[Image:Wanted_21.JPG|thumb|none|450px|The Safari Arms Matchmaster used by [[Angelina Jolie]] in the film ''[[Wanted]]'' - .45 ACP. Note Safari Arms Lion logo.]]
[[Image:IMG 1666.JPG|thumb|none|450px|A Kimber Warrior - .45 ACP used on ''[[The Unit]]''. The weapon pictured here was the actual Warrior carried and fired by Dennis Haysbert in the last season.]]
[[Image:IMG 1534.JPG|thumb|none|450px|Another Kimber Warrior - .45 ACP was used in the most recent season of ''[[The Unit]]''. This was Dennis Haysbert's backup weapon in case the first failed (it is customary in Hollywood for each "hero" gun use to have at least one backup on set).]]
[[Image:BDSIIParas-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|A pair of Para-Ordnance SSPs (.45 ACP) as used in ''[[The Boondock Saints II: All Saints Day]]''. The weapons pictured here were the actual screen-used guns handled and fired by Clifton Collins, Jr. in the film; note the custom grips, golden suppressors, and "El Jefe" engraved into the slides. ''(Big thanks to [[Al Vrkljan]] at Movie Armaments Group for this IMFDB Exclusive image!)'']]
[[Image:ShootEmUp-HammersonNiteTac-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|A Para-Ordnance Nite-Tac (.45 ACP) used in ''[[Shoot 'Em Up]]''. The weapon pictured here is one of the actual screen-used guns from the film; note the engraved Hammerson logo. ''(Big thanks to [[Al Vrkljan]] at Movie Armaments Group for this IMFDB Exclusive image!)'']]
[[Image:1911-The Getaway.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt Government Commercial M1911 - .45 ACP used by [[Steve McQueen]] in the film ''[[Getaway, The (1972)]]''.]]
[[Image:M&MSColtXSEusedinfilm.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The Colt M1911A1 XSE - .45 ACP used in the film ''[[Mr. & Mrs. Smith]]''.]]
[[Image:ColtM1911A1PunisherProps.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The two blank firing prop custom Colt M1911A1s used in the film ''[[Punisher, The (2004)]]'' - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:NashBridges1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Nash Bridges' Custom 1911 - .38 Super. This is the actual pistol that was used by [[Don Johnson]] in the show ''[[Nash Bridges]]''.]]
[[Image:Colt-M1911A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The actual M1911A1 [[Pierce Brosnan]] used in ''[[The World Is Not Enough]]'' - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:SerenityM191A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Jayne Cobb's Mocked-Up Custom M1911A1 - .45 ACP used in the film ''[[Serenity]]''.]]
[[Image:P00654 1911 Full Left.jpg|thumb|none|450px|'''World IMFDB Exclusive:''' Screen used Colt M1911 with Nickel-plated and pearl grips - .45 ACP pistol. This non-firing prop weapon is verified as screen used from the film '''[[The Other Guys]]'''. The gun is accompanied by the Galco shoulder holster and clip pouch also used in numerous scenes from the film. This item is currently being sold by [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/ The Golden Closet]; see [http://www.thegoldencloset.com/merchant/merchant.mvc?Session_ID=6ef04a13fbe759cbdcbdc6bc4c4b809f&Screen=PROD&Store_Code=TGC&Product_Code=P00654&Category_Code=OtherGuys here].]]
[[Image:IMG 1509.JPG|thumb|none|450px|A Strayer Voight Infinity - .45 ACP. This is one of the actual guns that has been used by The Company henchmen on ''[[Heroes]]''; this weapon was supplied to the show by Independent Studio Services and has been used on every season.]]
[[Image:Expendable-kimber-b.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Modified Kimber Gold Combat II used by [[Sylvester Stallone‎]] in ''[[Expendables, The|The Expendables]]'' - .45 ACP]]

[[Image:IMG 0444.JPG|thumb|none|450px|[[M1911|Colt MK IV Series 80]] - .45 ACP This was used in the film ''[[Street Kings]]'' and the series ''[[Chase]]'' and ''[[Dark Blue]]''.]]

===Airsoft Variants===
[[Image:GP WE M1911Peral lg.jpg|thumb|none|450px|An airsoft reproduction of the Springfield Armory M1911-A1 made by J-Armoury (Western Arms) used in the film ''[[Se7en]]''.]]
[[Image:CobrGold1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Perfect airsoft replica of [[Cobra]]'s Colt GC National Match - 9mm Pistol made by Western Arms.]]
[[Image:Htk1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft replica of Storm's M1911A1 from ''[[Hard to Kill]]'' - made by Western Arms.]]
[[Image:WA-WLUF_2_mark.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft Replica of Castor Troy's custom Springfield Armory M1911-A1 - .45 ACP from the film ''[[Face/Off]]''.]]
[[Image:WA490 4 mark.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft Long Slide Jim Hoag M1911A1 replica - .45 ACP, very similar to what Frank ([[James Caan]]) used in the film ''[[Thief]]''.]]
[[Image:Snake_.45-2.JPG|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft Sheriff Co. "Custom M1911" Airsoft Gun - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:SAProTac.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Airsoft replica of a Springfield Armory Loaded - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:Baby1.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Airsoft WE HiCapa 5.1 Full Metal Dragon Custom M1911 (Type B) Black Model with blue LED lights in the grip - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Detonics CombatMaster M1911 airsoft.jpg|450px|thumb|none|WE "Caspian Arms" M1911 replica of a Detonics CombatMaster M1911 or a Colt Officer's ACP - .45ACP]]
[[Image:Colt M1911.jpg|450px|thumb|none|Yu Teng 'YT385' replica of the original Colt M1911A1 model - .45ACP]]

===Other Replicas===
[[Image:Snake_.45.JPG|thumb|none|450px|CGI rendering of the Springfield Operator from the game [[Metal Gear Solid 4: Guns of the Patriots]] - .45 ACP]]

===Other Variants===
[[File:M1911A1PreWar.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Detailed screenshot of prewar M1911A1]]
[[Image:Kimber_Ultra_Crimson_Carry_II.jpg|thumb|none|350px|Kimber Ultra Carry Crimson II - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Kongsberg M1914.JPG|thumb|450px|none|Kongsberg M1914 - .45 ACP. The Kongsberg M/1914 is a Colt M1911 pistol produced under license by the Norwegian factory Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk, with a minor modification to the slide stop and stock.]]
[[Image:.38Super1911MachinePistol.jpg|thumb|none|450px|The real-life Dillinger's .38 Super M1911A1 Machine Pistol, for comparison purposes.]]
[[Image:SPRINGFIELD ARMORY 1911 PISTOL.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory M1911A1 mil-spec stainless - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:SpringfieldArmoryM1911A1stainless.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory M1911A1 "Mil-Spec" - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:ED 45.jpg|thumb|none|450px|AMT Hardballer Longslide with laserlock sight as used in the film ''[[The Terminator]]'' - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:AMT_Hardballer_Hitman_Replica.jpg|390px|thumb|none|A near-perfect, firing, replica of the "Silverballers" from the Hitman series.]]

[[Image:MilSpec-1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory Mil-spec M1911A1 - .45 ACP. This was one of the most commonly seen .45s used by LAPD SWAT before the Kimber Custom TLE II.]]
[[Image:0862731R.jpg|thumb|none|450px|M1911A1 Commercial (Same marks of the movie's pistol) - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:PC9111.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory Professional 1911 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:M1911A1ithaca.jpg|thumb|none|450px|World War II Ithaca made M1911A1 with light grey finish - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:PublicEnemies1.JPG|thumb|none|450px|Pre-War Colt M1911A1 - .45 ACP used on ''[[Public Enemies]]'' (2009)]]
[[Image:SW1911pd.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson SW1911PD Tactical Rail - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:1911 Longslide.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Custom Colt M1911A1 - .45 ACP. This model is very similar to the one in the episode on the ''[[Miami Vice (TV Series)]]''.]]
[[Image:Colt45.jpg|thumb|none|450px|M1911A1 .45 ACP with Pachymar grips]]
[[Image:Taurus PT1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Taurus PT1911 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Bruni8mm.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Bruni M1911A1-style blank firing stage prop - 8mm blank.]]
[[Image:Para1911G.I..jpg|thumb|none|450px|Para 1911 G.I. Expert - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:SA_loaded_m1911.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory Loaded M1911A1 - .45 ACP similar to the one used by Sydney Bristow from ''[[Alias]]''.]]
[[Image:Peter-1-5006-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Federal Ordnance PSP-07 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:TIKI.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Strayer Voight Infinity TIKI - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:CustomM1911A1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Custom Colt Series 80 M1911A1 pistol similair to one in the film ''[[Street Kings]]'' - .45 ACP.]]
[[Image:LaserAimSeriesIIIPistol.jpg|thumb|none|450px|LaserAim Series III Pistol - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:KimberUltraRaptor.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Kimber Stainless Ultra Raptor - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Para645LDA.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Para-Ordnance 6.45 LDA with spare magazines - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:ColtDefenderRIGHT83.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt Defender - .45 ACP was similar to the one used in the game ''[[Uncharted 2: Among Thieves]]''.]]
[[Image:GM45M1911A1-3.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Hybrid 1911 "Gladys" fitted with a nickel plated three cut compensator - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Delta 001.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt Delta Elite - 10mm Auto]]
[[Image:SM178017.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson SW1911 Pro Series - 9x19mm]]
[[Image:SW108282.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Smith & Wesson SW1911 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:KimberWarrior.jpg|450px|thumb|none|Kimber Warrior - .45 ACP like the one in the show ''[[24 - Season 8|24]]''.]]
[[Image:FLX 2.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Nighthawk FLX - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Triple_Tap_IMM_Open_pistol.jpg|thumb|none|450px|This SVI 1911 - .45 ACP is almost exactly like the one used in the film ''[[Triple Tap]]''. The description on the website reads, "IMM Open pistol made of carbon steel with Titanium compensator." (Picture supplied by sviguns.com)]]
[[Image:NiteTac.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Para-Ordnance Nite-Tac - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:1911WideSpur.png|thumb|none|450px|Springfield GI 1911 A1 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:ColtM1991A1L.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M1991A1 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:The Veteran Colt 1991A1 Series 80.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Colt M1991A1 Series 80 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:M1911A1USAF.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Black Colt M1911A1 - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Springfield_ultra_compact.jpg|thumb|400px|none|Springfield Armory Ultra Compact - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:PX9105MLP.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Springfield Armory Loaded MC Operator - .45 ACP]]
[[Image:Springfield Armory 1911 Lightweight Operator.jpg|thumb|450px|none|Springfield Armory 1911 Lightweight Operator - .45 ACP]]
[[image:Razorcat.jpg|thumb|none|401px|Limcat Custom 2011 RazorCat - .45 ACP]]
[[File:Sight-Tracker.jpg|thumb|none|500px|Strayer Voigt Infinity Sight Tracker - .40 S&W. This is one of 10 pistols custom made by SVI for the television show ''[[Top Shot - Season 3|Top Shot]]''.]]
[[File:Para P14 Limited.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Para Ordnance P14 Limited, early model with vertical slide serrations - .45 ACP]]

==Video game appearances of this pistol series==

Why is it that the "Video Game appearances" tables have a column named "Passwords"? I don't think it's for passwords to unlock them, because to my knowledge very few video games actually have a password system to unlock weapons. Wouldn't it make more sense to have a "Notes" after the "Mods" section where certain pertinent but miscellaneous information can be written, such as what copyright-infringement-avoiding name it goes under in the game, or whether it is chambered in a non-standard caliber?

I'd like this cleared up. Oh, and someone needs to include a note saying that "mods" is short for "modifications/customizations for the weapon," not "downloadable modifications to the game itself."--[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 06:20, 23 February 2010 (UTC)

:I agree. Frankly I think both the "Mods" and "Passwords" sections can go, since the latter is pointless and the former's purpose can be adequately served by "Notes". --[[User:MattyDienhoff|MattyDienhoff]] 15:17, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

==Colt Government Model Section==
With regard to the following sentence:

''"Aside from Colt selling the M1911A1 to the US military, the gun was also sold under the name "Colt Government Model" to the civilian market, and called the "Pre-Series 70" guns today."''

First, the Colt Government Model was introduced in 1912, and as such, it was originally in the M1911 configuration. When the U.S. Military switched to the M1911A1 configuration in the mid 1920s, Colt began manufacturing their Government Models in the M1911A1 configuration as well. So early Government Models parallel the military's M1911 configuration, while later Government Models (after the mid 1920s) parallel the military's M1911A1 configuration. Additionally, not only pre-Series 70 guns are Government Models. Series 70 and Series 80 guns are both Government Models. In fact, Colt still makes the Government Model to this day in various configurations.

With regard to the following sentence:

''"For IMFDB purposes, this can also be referred to as an M1911A1. In this manner, there is no need to list film, television, anime, video games in this section."''

It is sloppy to refer to a Colt Government Model as an M1911A1. "M1911A1" is the U.S. Military designation for a particular type of gun, and most of them were not even made by Colt (Remington Rand [the typewriter company] made most of them). I can see referring to a gun as an "M1911 type" or "M1911A1 type" if the manufacturer can't be determined, but when you simply type "M1911" or "M1911A1" you are referring to a U.S. Military contract pistol.

On top of that, the pictured gun in the Colt Government Model section is not even a "Pre-Series 70", it is a pre-enhanced Series 80 Government Model.

--[[User:MaximRecoil|MaximRecoil]] 21:44, 22 October 2009 (UTC)

:So it's like how we don't call it the Beretta M9, we call it the Beretta 92FS. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 03:52, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

::With the M9 vs. 92FS situation, it is next to impossible to tell the difference between the two onscreen, unless there is a closeup allowing one to read the markings. In such cases I would say, if a civilian character is using the gun, it is probably intended to be a 92F or 92FS. If a military character is using it, it is probably intended to be an M9, regardless of what the actual prop is. I would assume that most—if not all—movie and TV props are actually 92Fs or 92FSs, because I don't believe that actual M9s have ever been made available for civilian sale.

::With the M1911 or M1911A1 vs. the Colt Government Model (or other brands of 1911-type guns), it is usually possible to tell the difference onscreen without being able to read the markings. For example, the Colt Government Model does not have a lanyard loop. Most M1911A1s were parkerized, while no Government Models were parkerized. When dealing with more modern Government Models, there are even more differences. For example, starting in 1950, Government Models started coming with a full-shelf thumb safety; while all M1911[A1]s had partial-shelf thumb safeties. Also at this time, Government Models started being given a finish with polished flats and matte radiuses, while blued and Du-Lite (similar to bluing in appearance) M1911A1s had polished radiuses and brushed flats or entirely polished (depending on the manufacturer and/or time of manufacture); and of course the more common parkerized M1911A1s were simply all matte.

::Additionally, the newer Government Models as mentioned above have narrow hammers with polished sides left "in the white", and polished chamber hoods also left "in the white". Many M1911A1s had wide-spur hammers, and the ones that had narrow hammers were fully finished (no polished "in the white" sides) and they all had fully blued barrels, including the otherwise parkerized ones (no polished "in the white" chamber hoods).

::Most of the Government Models you see onscreen from the early 70s to the mid-to-late '80s were actually 9mm versions, though they were usually representing a "forty-five" onscreen. This had to do with reliable functioning with readily available 9mm blanks. Colt introduced the 9mm version of the Government Model when they introduced the Series 70 in the early 1970s, and the 9mm version of the CGM had a lowered ejection port (while the .45 ACP version still had the standard military style ejection port). With the introduction of the Series 80 Government Model in 1983, the .45 ACP version also got a lowered ejection port. No M1911[A1] had a lowered ejection port.

::I'll give an example. In the show Magnum, P.I., his gun is blued with polished flats and matte radiuses; polished "in the white" chamber hood and hammer sides, and a lowered ejection port. It is clear from looking that the gun is a Series 70 Colt Government Model chambered for 9mm (though it was always addressed as a "forty-five" in the show's dialogue); and is definitely not an M1911A1. Recently the gun came up for auction and is now in the NRA's National Firearms Museum, and it has been confirmed that that is exactly what the main prop gun was (serial # 70L33101 to be exact).

::--[[User:MaximRecoil|MaximRecoil]] 21:58, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

==Primary M1911 description==
Who wrote this? The historical paragraph (on the background of the M1911) implies that the M1911 was replaced by the U.S. Military AFTER Operation Desert Storm (1991) which is not true. The Beretta M92 (M9) was already approved and adopted by 1985.

Well for a period of time both the 1911 and M9 were in use by the U.S. military,therefore just because the M9 was in service does'nt mean it replaced the 1911 by that time, and for awhile soldiers actualy got to choose which weapon they prefered :o [[User:Leadback|Leadback]]
======================================
The Beretta M9 officially replaced the M1911 in 1985. They still used the M1911, but they weren't buying anymore. They simply phased them out over the years. Now there are some units in the US military that still use the M1911. The M9 is really only used by conventional military nowadays. For example, the Navy SEALs don't even use the M9 or M1911 anymore. They have the H&K MK23 Mod 0. Which is a purpose-built USP .45. I've even heard of some SEALs using the Ruger Mk. II. It's a .22 target pistol with an integrated silencer on it.

Soldiers were never given the choice to choose. They were given the M9, but many didn't like it. It was big, many could not shoot it accurately, and lots contested the effectiveness of the 9x19 round. Lots of people I work with were in the military around the time of the switch, were given the M9, hated it, and decided just to keep carrying the M1911. It wasn't until they were given an official order that they were forced to carry the M9. And even there, there were times when they went back to the M1911s the military had stored up. For example, out in the deserts. The magazines the military bought were junk, got sand in them, and jammed. The M1911 functioned perfectly. Same thing is happening over there now.

wrong. Special Operations soldiers are given their choice of a sidearm( and assault rifle). 1stSFOD-D has been using 1911s since foundation. infact Larry Vickers (Nighthawk Customs) has worked very closely with Delta Force. Nighthawk 1911s are being used by Delta. 2- the Seals in Vietnam started out with the Ruger Mk II Suppressed. and know one still used the HK MK23. it was fazed out years ago because of how bulky it is. SEALs use the Sig Sauer P226 or USPs. but that is still a generalization. because all SOF have a choice in sidearm [[User:Dirtdiver6421|Dirtdiver6421]] 00:20, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

==Para-Ordance==
Shouldnt these guns get their own page? Sure they are a 1911 varients, but their made by a totally different company.[[User:The Winchester|The Winchester]] 00:38, 25 February 2009 (UTC)
:Yeah, but they're 1911 variants. This is the M1911 pistol series page, and they are 1911s. That's why they are on here. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
::I would prefer the Para Ordnance series of pistols have their own page due PRIMARILY to the fact that the Paras have a whole slew of different calibers that other M1911 makes and models don't have [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 06:40, 11 June 2009 (UTC)

What calibers does para have that other 1911 manufactures do not have?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 01:22, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

On the main page, the LDA entry claims that some of the LDA models were made DA/SA with an exposed hammer, but that isnt true is it? I thought all the LDA were Double Action Only, with the exposed hammer simply for aesthetic reasons? -MissySummers-

== The M in the page title ==

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the M in the page title incorrect? These are Colt 1911s (or 1911a1s, etc.), not Colt M1911s, unless referred to by US military nomenclature, just the same way that a Beretta 92f is an M9 only to the US Army and a SIG Sauer P228 is an M11 only in USAF terms. Just because it's the model of 1911 doesn't make it an M1911, any more than a '67 Shelby GT500 is an M67 Shelby GT500.[[User:YourMessageHere|YourMessageHere]] 08:09, 1 April 2009 (UTC)
::No. The Colt pistol was formally adopted by the Army on March 29, 1911, thus gaining its designation, M1911 (Model of 1911). Only examples or prototypes prior to the year 1911 would NOT have the M designation (which is extremely rare). Between the years of 1907 and 1910 the Colt pistol was constantly being modified and re-designed to win the Army's trials for adoption of a new handgun. The gun was only mass produced AFTER winning the Army's pistol trials. The Beretta 92FS was already famous world wide and was commercially available as the 92F/FS for YEARS before the Army adopted it. Every 1911 design came AFTER the M1911 (aka Model of 1911) so it is the correct nomenclature. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 07:20, 10 June 2009 (UTC)

Using "1911" to refer to any and all pistols based on the M1911 design has only been popular for about fifteen years. Prior to that, the vast majority of such pistols were Colts, and were usually called "Colt .45s", even if they were pistols made by wartime contractors like Remington Rand. Those commercial guns that weren't made by Colt, as made by Vega, Randall, Federal Ordnance, Essex, etc., were called "clones", as they were generally close copies of the Colt. When makers started adding previously "custom" features to production-line guns, and branching into areas that Colt hadn't, a new name was needed, and "1911" became popular. The problem that I have with the various names on the site is the mixing of military and commercial designations; a gun cannot be a "M1911A1 Government Model", as M1911A1 is a military designation, and Government Model is what Colt has always called the civilian version of the "M" military pistols. Colt has made M1911s (1912-circa 1924), M1911A1s (circa 1926-1945), and Government Models (1912-date), but you can't mix or combine those names without confusing the issue.

==Caliber question==
I thought I would ask permission before making this change considering how important this article is: in the specifications category the caliber is listed solely as .45 ACP. I was wondering whether or not that should be changed to include .380 ACP, .38 Super, 9mm, and .40 S&W?
:-[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

No, since the ORIGINAL Colt M1911 is .45 ACP Caliber, it should stay like that, since copies of the M1911 maybe have different calibers those should be put on the "copy" section

Agreed --[[PunisherDave]]

==M1991 Series==
I was wondering: what exactly is the difference between the 1911 series and the 1991 series? -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 17:18, 19 July 2009 (UTC)

Colt introduced (announced) the M1991A1 in 1991 as a sort of economy version of the Government Model, resembling the military M1911A1, and with the serial numbers picking up where the military gun left off after WWII. The gun was made in that form until about 2003, at which time the finish was changed to polished blue rather than matte blue, and the black rubber grips replaced with checkered wood.
:I heard a guy explain on youtube that 1991 got "extra safety feature" which blocked firing pin movement entirely when trigger was not pressed; allegedly this modification appeared after a incident involving police officer accidentally killing suspect while snapping him with the gun. However, this modification somehow managed to eject firing pin from the slide during decocking so only few people liked it --[[User:Cover72|Cover72]] 21:59, 20 January 2010 (UTC)
::The YouTube guy doesn't know what he's talking about. The Colt M1991A1 did have the Series 80 firing pin safety, but this was introduced on all Colt Government Models in the early 1980s when the Series 80 version replaced the Series 70. The modification has never caused any problems, aside from perhaps complicating the trigger pull slightly, making it a little more difficult to achieve a good "trigger job". Also, the Series 80 parts are easily removed (and normally a few other minor things are done), and the gun will function just fine, in the same manner as a pre-Series 80 gun. The Series 80 firing pin safety wasn't prompted by any specific accidental police shooting. The only thing a non-Series 80 1911-type gun can accidentally shoot due to the lack of a firing pin safety is the ground. In other words, if a non-Series 80 1911-type gun is dropped from a significantly high height (6 feet or so I believe) directly onto its muzzle, the firing pin can continue forward with enough inertia to dent the primer, thus firing the gun (into the ground of course).

::It is too bad that Colt went to the trouble of designing the Series 80 modifications back in the early '80s, because the remote risk of accidental discharge as I described above is more easily solved by simply using a titanium firing pin (rather than the usual steel firing pin) along with a different weight firing pin spring. Since the titanium firing pin weighs less than a steel one, it has less inertia, and a 1911 so-equipped will pass the drop test just fine. In fact, Colt now uses titanium firing pins on their Series 70 Government Models that they started reissuing several years ago. If Colt had thought of the titanium firing pin idea back in the early '80s, they wouldn't have had to make any actual changes to the legendary 1911 design (changes which annoyed a lot of people), and they might not have lost so much of the 1911 market.

::Now, about the M1991A1: it went through a few different incarnations, but it originally was simply an economy version of the Series 80 Colt Government Model. Instead of the polished blue finish of the Government Model (polished flats and matte radiuses), it had an all-matte blue finish. It also had really cheap plastic grips that didn't fit well (they fell short of the bottom of the grip frame by about 3/16"). It also had a big, ugly rollmark on the slide, with "M1991A1" emblazoned in huge block letters. Finally, it came with a flat mainspring housing and a long trigger (both plastic), which was like the original M1911 (pre-M1911A1), which was ironic considering it was named M1991'''A1'''. --[[User:MaximRecoil|MaximRecoil]] 09:13, 17 December 2011 (CST)

==Terminator 2==
It was my understanding that the 1911 used in the film was a custom Colt frame with a fitted Detonic slide. Was it a combatmaster slide? [[Special:Contributions/65.29.239.251|65.29.239.251]] 09:33, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

== blank firers / K911 ==

I've added/moved blank firing Kimar 911 to the bottom of page as told by MoviePropMaster2008 ''("Non-firing replicas of the M1911 belong on the bottom of the M1911 page. Thanks.")'' 
But I wonder, shouldn't there be an entire sub-category of blank firers (with K911 being sub-section of this) in order to distinguish blanks from the real ones? It ''might'' look confusing this way. And also, I made multiple photos of K911 for what I thought would be it's page here including disassembled weapon photo, so perhaps these unused ones might be deleted? --[[User:Cover72|Cover72]] 21:46, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

==Strayer Voigt Infinity ==
This gun is using a frame from STI, they call that frame the 2011, it's double stacked. And is made from steel and polymer.

:are Strayer Voigt Infinity custom built guns? or just have alot of models? Rex095

The modular frames look exactly like those used by STI. http://www.sviguns.com
Don't know if they collaborate or something. They (SVI) have more optional grips than STI.

Both companies reside in Texas.
::Read up: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strayer_Voigt_Inc http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strayer_Voigt_Inc]

Does anyone know the mag cap for a Strayer Voigt Infinity in 45acp? - captain snikt

==Police service pistols==

Before the 90s were American Police ever issued the M1911, or were they're only given to the FBI and SWAT team?

- Some regular state/county/municipal departments might have used a 1911 as a standard duty-weapon before semiautos came into heavy use following the eighties, but I imagine that's a very low number. I certainly don't know of any specific departments myself offhand. Not that many departments use 'em much today. As a 1911 generally was considered a large pistol with a fairly powerful round it wasn't considered easy to use and handle by regular officers. Same general reason why departments in older times stuck with .38s over .357s - The .357 was generally considered too powerful for standard-duty officers. As such, most police departments used 9mms when they first went to automatics in the eighties as there were few semiauto calibers with lower recoil impulse and power at the time than .45ACP.

Some other police units might have used 1911s when it suited them - Homicide detectives in our county's police dept. carried 1911 type pistols, though I don't think that was the county's standard sidearm for uniformed officers. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 02:04, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

:There's another reason, besides caliber, that the 1911 wouldn't have been too popular in the old days - it's a single-action. Before DA-only became more acceptable (i.e. Glocks), most LE departments preferred handguns that were SA/DA. Almost all police revolvers used prior to the 1980s, like the S&W Model 15 and 19, or the Colt Python, were single- or double-action. This bias continued into the 1980s when a lot of departments started adopting the Beretta 92F and the 3rd Generation Smith & Wesson autos. Now that Glocks have been around long enough, DA-only is finally becoming the standard. But SA-only is pretty much a no-go to any LE agency, and that's the way it was even before the 1980s. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:30, 11 April 2010 (UTC)

Isn't Glocks SA-only? The firing pin is cocked by cambering a round?

Would a Smith and Wesson Model 39 or 639 or Colt Commander be more acceptable for police use back then?

- To MT, that's a good point as well. SA weapons do require a lot of training and familiarity to operate effectively and safely, and as such, again, weren't considered practical for regular police officers either. Very good to point out. If I'm not mistaken, that's one of the main reasons why the 1911 fell out of favor in the Armed Forces as well - the fact they required extensive training and familiarity to use and carry safely. DA weapons are easier to train and operate with. Very true.

As for the Glock question, no, Glocks are actually DA only.

As for actions - In a Single-Action (SA) firearm, the hammer must be manually cocked to a firing position prior to pulling the trigger. Just like revolvers of the old west. Double action firearms will both cock and release the hammer when the trigger is pulled. SA/DA firearms use double-action by default, but feature an externally accessible hammer to allow single-action style firing (by cocking the hammer back and then pulling the trigger). Modern revolvers are perhaps the simplest examples of this.

DAO (Double-Action-Only) firearms only fire by double-action as they don't have an accessible hammer for single-action cocking. Such as Glock and various other semiauto pistols.

So if you have empty casing in the chamber, an pull the trigger several times, you would hear a loud click every time because the firing pin would be cocked every time? That's what happens in a DAO gun. If not, it's a SAO.

And on the last question, yes the Smith 39/59 pistols were used by police departments back then. Illinois State Police used the 59 back in the 60s/70s if I remember my Jane's Gun Recognition book correctly. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 05:07, 12 April 2010 (UTC)
::::Correction, Glocks are not DAO. They fire from a half-cocked position. When you dry fire the gun, the hammer falls and must be recocked by racking the slide, it does not cock by double action springs. That's why the have a slightly heavy trigger pull, they are half cocked, and are brought to full cock and dropped by pulling the trigger. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
::::: Bah, how did I miss that.. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:05, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

i thought glocks were striker-fired?

I think I read that Tacoma, WA police carry 1911s as standard issue service weapons.

I read on another forum that the LAPD authorises 1911 varients to officers, however they have to go through an intense training program to be authorised for it and they have to re-qualify ever few months too. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 16:30, 28 March 2011 (CDT)

Yes. A Glock is a "striker-fired" weapon so technically it is not either double action or single action because a glock doesnt have a hammer but instead releases the firing pin inside the slide. However if you were going to have to compare it, Single Action would be the closest term. Because the firing pin is "cocked" when the slide is racked and then the trigger only releases it and firing the round. Additionally a Glock does not qualify as a double action because it in no way cocks anything with the trigger. The trigger on a Glock can not be pulled again without cycling the weapon, whereas on a gun that is a double action the trigger can be pulled and the hammer actuated multiple times without cycling the weapon. -[[User:Peejn8r|Peejn8r]]

==Versus modern pistols==

One thing I've noticed about this pistol is that almost everyone loves it, as though it were the best, most versatile handgun ever made. But really, what makes this thing, almost 100 years old now, any better than any modern pistols? Really, modern pistols can fire the same rounds, bigger clips, better design, picatinny rails, etc.--[[User:Zblayde|Zblayde]] 21:54, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Familiarity, accuracy, ease of getting parts, feel, simplicity (yes I know there are designs that are simpler, but for what this pistol is, it is simple), many different makes and models of the 1911, modularity, traditionalism. There are many makes and models of the 1911 style that have the same features as many modern "wonder guns". Want more ammo? Get a Para Ord P14, ditto for DA, and DA/SA. Want a 9mm/ 10mm/ etc? there are many types of 1911 platform pistols ranging from .22lr to .44 Magnum. A quote I heard about the 1911 a few years ago is "It's like a '32 Ford Hotrod, its cheap, reliable, powerful, fun, and is easy to make it your own. Just don't think you'll get much mileage out of a tank of gas." Now tell me can you put custom grips, barrels, sights, slides, frames, triggers, hammers, finishes, safeties, slide releases magazines, etc etc etc on a Glock, XD, SIG, Beretta, etc? Maby a few of those, but at what price, and can you do it all? -[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 08:51, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

: ''Really, modern pistols can fire the same rounds, bigger clips, better design, picatinny rails, etc.''

- Funny, several pistols I can think of that fit that criteria are little more than updated 1911 pistols. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 20:08, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

"bigger clips"
: Fail. I believe you meant Magazines. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 21:28, 22 April 2010 (UTC)
ya Unless your talkin about a Mauser broomhandle (which you're not) I would prefer if you said magazine instead of clip

::Actually, that's another thing I'm questioning. Really, what is the difference between the detaachable box magazines and clips? I mean, clips hold bullets for easy loading, right? SO wouldn't modern detachable magazines be classified as clips too?--[[User:Zblayde|Zblayde]] 20:17, 6 May 2010 (UTC)
:::Simplest way I can put this - a clip loads a magazine. The magazine is what the gun feeds from - NOT THE CLIP. It just so happens that on some guns, the magazine is affixed to the weapon (the M1 Garand and the Mauser, for example). Thus, users have to use clips to reload them. On, say, a M1911 or an M16, the magazine falls out, thus allowing the user to swap in a new one when needed. A magazine could hold a clip, if so designed...but that particular road is one-way only. --[[User:Clutch|Clutch]] 20:47, 6 May 2010 (UTC)

::The "clip vs. magazine" distinction is something that really needs to be clarified, and one of the reasons why I asked for the "general information" section in the first place. Hopefully someone can make a good article there showing the various type of bullet clips and why they should not be confused with magazines. By the way, revolvers when not loaded manually use bullet clips. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 05:03, 7 May 2010 (UTC)

considering that this page is dedicated to the 1911 which is generally made in .45 does anyone else find it somewhat stupid that our military and most police departments are using handguns that have been known for their lack of stopping power. there are better handguns out there that hold a generous amount of .45 ammunition anyway. for example the Nighthawk FLX holds 12-14. the HK USP/HK45, and the Infinity handgun line are double stacked. and even if most .45s hold 7-10 isnt that enough in most scenarios. 7 .45 slugs does the work of at least 20. [[User:Dirtdiver6421|Dirtdiver6421]] 00:26, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

Its the same reason that police used the .38 Special for so many years even after the .357 came out. Politics, logistics, ability to handle the round, etc etc... -[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 20:30, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

:With regard to caliber, police need rounds that can penetrate car bodies, doors, walls, etc. .45 rounds are not known for penetration. Also, while the .45 round is more effective against soft tissue than 9mm and .40 S&W rounds, anyone who tries to claim that 7 .45 rounds can do the work of 20 9mm or .40 rounds is completely dillusional. Watch ballistic test videos. A .45 slug entering the body does more damage than a 9mm round entering the body. If you try to claim that one .45 wound is more damaging than 2 9mm wounds with any decent grouping than you clearly have no understanding of physics or human anatomy.

But the fact remains with a 9mm you dont want him dead in the half hour it will take for him to bleed out. you want him dead NOW. with the .45 hes going to feel it. he aint gunna get back up. with the 9mm he might just keep firing.
:Depending on shot placement. A 9mm slug to the heart or any of the major arteries surrounding it will cause death within several seconds. The same is true of a shot to most areas of the skull. .45 does have increased lethality over 9mm, but that degree of superiority has been greatly exaggerated.

Yeah but a 9mm can pass through a person and keep going, a .45 doesn't. I would imagine you wouldn't want those two 9mm rounds going through a person and hitting an innocent bystander. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 16:28, 28 March 2011 (CDT)

It all really comes down to preference. Honestly a body shot with any round is not guaranteed to kill or stop anyone. The only thing guaranteed to immediately incapacitate someone is to severing the brain from the rest of the body. Recoil is also a big factor. If you cant shoot it it doesnt matter what you carry. People and police departments have to find the weapon that will work best for them. Personally I like the .45 and I own a 1911. The most important feature on the 1911 for me is its thinness with the single stack mag. Honestly I think my Sig 229 .40 kicks more violently and is harder to shoot than my .45. I know a lot of people who do not like the .45 and much prefer their 9mm because they are better with it. -[[User:Peejn8r|Peejn8r]]

Modern 9mm JHP and .45 ACP JHP in ballestic gel create near equal wounds. I can post reference links if anyone wants them. The whole thing about magazine capacity isn't really a problem as 99% of the time, only three shots are fired at most. Even with police, most of the time, no more than 3 rounds are fired.

Carry what guns suits you best, whether its a .22LR or its a .45 ACP. Once I turn 21, I plan on getting a SIG 1911 with a 4" barrel in .45 ACP but for the time being, I have to stick with my XD40.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 22:01, 11 October 2011 (CDT)

==Variants NOT listed with any film/TV/game appearances==

- I've taken it upon myself to remove several listed variants that had no list of anything that they've appeared in. Guns posted that didn't say they were in anything - Not one movie, TV show episode, video game, nothing. A couple of which I don't think have appeared on anything and seem to have been put up just for the hell of it.

Now I know we have a lot of 1911 variants on the page, but the page is not intended to show/describe ''every'' variant of 1911 ever made, but only those ''that have actually appeared in something'', as quoted by some of the admins. I just find it a bit annoying to have to scroll down the page and see numerous 1911 pistols that have nothing listed under them (Again, with some looking like they were just added for the sake of being there), and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

Anyway, clearing said sections out now. If it seems like an unusual or otherwise noteworthy variant, I'll add it to the 'additional variants' section below. Bottom-line, if it ain't actually been in anything, ''don't add it'', no matter how cool it is or whatever. If it has been in something, then next time, don't half-ass - If you're going to bother with the effort of putting it up in the first place, do it 100% and say what it's appeared in. Thanks. [[User:StanTheMan|StanTheMan]] 03:18, 5 June 2010 (UTC)

==Kimber==
in the Kimber Warrior section it is listed as "Warrior II", which is wrong, the Warrior is built to full military specs and never got the "II" desinated saftey system...so it is just a Warrior because kimber only puts the II on the models they put their special saftey on.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:39, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

==Controversy igniter==
I am fully aware that what I am about to say will probably ignite the greatest firestorm of controversy this site has seen in a while. I have fired several 1911 pistols and found them to be a good, solid design. That said, it doesn’t change the fact that I think this is undoubtedly the most overrated firearm in history. Throughout the entire gun community there is the consensus that this is the absolute greatest thing ever conceived by the mind of man and anyone who says anything different is a blasphemer. Again, I am not saying it is a bad pistol, I just don’t think it is best (I won’t say what my top choice is for fear of causing even more indignation to come my way). Though even if it were the undisputed best pistol design around, I still don’t think it would be so significantly greater than other designs as to warrant being the object of the worship and masturbatory fantasies of every gun enthusiast in the world as it currently is. That’s my two cents, I await the fallout.

:I smell a troll.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 17:18, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

I'd say he's not because he seems to explain his point. At least his reasoning isn't 'this gun sukzz' [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 17:42, 27 July 2010 (UTC)

:My main reasoning is that the weapons are predominately single action only, which necessitates that they either be carried condition three (which makes the pistol slow to bring into action), or condition one (which many consider unsafe). The double/single action and double action only systems have become omnipresent in most modern combat pistols for good reason. Additionally, while a generally reliable design, many other pistols have surpassed 1911 models in ruggedness and reliability. Another thing that I find odd is the vast variety of weapons that are claimed to be “1911s.” For instance, I have seen subcompact, double action only, double-column “1911s” in many calibers other than .45acp. At this point the only common feature between these weapons and the original Colt 1911 design are a loose aesthetic resemblance. The internal mechanisms maybe similar as well, but many other pistols share a far greater functional similarity to 1911s yet do not bear the moniker. At what point does a gun cease being a “1911” and become something simply trying to cash in on a famous name sake?

It is human nature to emulate successful designs in the hopes of getting a piece of that pie, especially in the modern business world. Less-refined terms for this behaviour include "jumping on the bandwagon" or "riding a gravy train." It's nothing new now in the firearms industry, what with all the AR-15 variants, Glock knock-offs, and (of course) countless "1911-type" pistols around. What defines a "1911-type" pistol is really matter of personal preference.

I would, however, agree that it's foolish to fetishize a type of firearm or a firearms manufacturer just because of its track record or Public Relations budget. There is no such thing as the "perfect" weapon in the real world--every design involves tradeoffs, and that's even before you include the "human factor." Designs can always be improved. What matters most is what you can use the most effectively in a consistent manner. And if you can't, then you ought to get yourself another weapon or train more.

Speaking of "best pistol ever," I remember how H&K tried to label their 4.6x30mm pistol as "the Ultimate Combat Pistol," but it got unceremoniously cancelled, because of "inadequate ballistics in a handgun format." So much for "Ultimate Combat Pistol"--now it joins the legions of "Useless Cancelled Pistols" that came before it. Perhaps it could have had a chance if it were a machine pistol instead, dubbed the "MP7 UltraComPact," in essence an MP7 PDW in handgun format. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 00:34, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

:What I would like to know is what is it about the 1911 that supposedly makes it the best. I've heard people say it is the greatest pistol ever for more than a decade yet never explain what ''specific'' features or advantages it has that make it so good.

You should head on over to the forum and ask that question: "What makes the M1911 pistol so great compared to everything else, and when does an M1911 stop being one and start being a pistol just pretending to be one?" I'm sure there are more people there who could answer your questions better than what you could get here. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 22:24, 30 July 2010 (UTC)

What makes the 1911 the "best"? There are many reasons for the following it has. I am of course referring to the original 1911A1 model, not the double stack nor double action variants. For one, the single action trigger is extremely easy to train with and use by a lot of people. Second, it has redundant safety systems in place. Even with the manual safety off, it will not fire unless the grip safety is fully pressed, though this safety system is seen by a few as a con of the design. Third, it utilized a single stack design. That coupled with the angle of the grip is a very comfortable for a majority of the people. The degree of the grip angle was chosen because, for a lot of people, it is a natural point meaning that one could close ones eyes and bring the pistol up and have it pointing directly at the target. Fourth, it fired the .45 ACP. The .45ACP is a proven manstopper especially when compared to the other rounds utilized at the time of its adoption and until the development of reliable hollow point designs. Lastly, I would argue that compared to many other designs, such as the Mauser C96, Luger,etc..., the 1911 was easily field strip as the pieces of the pistol were designed to aid in the stripping down of the firearm. Compared to todays plethora of firearms, the 1911 is no longer the only pistol to chamber effective rounds or reliability. Why is it still popular then? Because some people still favor the 1911 design. Overrated, I don't think so. There is a reason why it is still chosen over other designs. Is it the end-all-be-all of pistol design? No, I would say it isn't. Anyway, from everything I've read, personal experience, and research that is what I have come up with. [[User:GaBoy45|GaBoy45]] 21:15, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

:Everything you have described establishes that the gun is a good design, perhaps the best gun around when it first came out, but does not explain it's enduring following. The grip may be confortable for many people, but that is far too subjective to explain why so many people (with so many different hand sizes) still favor this gun. It's single stack magazine make it a confortable target and practical concealed carry weapon, but the limited capacity it offers can be a death trap in a combat weapon (which many still claim the 1911 is the quintessential example of). The .45 ACP is a great round against soft targets, but does not offer very good penetration or long distance acuracy. And with the isistance on reliable "Soldier Proof" weapons in most of today's militaries, many modern pistols are more reliable and easier to strip than the original 1911s. I don't deny that the 1911 was most likely the best pistol in the world when it came out and for a few decades after, but I don't think it still warrents that praise anymore, yet almost every gun Television show, magazine, website, etc. seems to constantly proclaim its supremacy.

To answer your first point. The single stack, thin handgrip is easily usable by people of differing handtypes. You say its subjective but isn't how something feels in someones hand subjective? For example, the M9/Beretta 92FS has a thick grip. Bigger hands have no problem with the grip but smaller hands do. The slim 1911 grip can be used by big hands or little hands. The grip angle is something else that many people find comfortable. You second point that you made was the single stack "death trap". You say that the single stack is a liability. But capacity isn't everything. 7+ rounds of .45 ACP is good. The .45ACP has a well known reputation for one shot stops. The 9mm of the Beretta 92 or Glock 17 does not have that reputation. As for the .45ACP, it is not meant to penetrate body armor, neither is the standard 9mm, but it is accurate over long distances. There are very few pistol rounds that are meant to penetrate body armor of vehicle armor, which is what I think that you are getting at. If you draw a pistol in a combat zone, you are already in deep trouble or in a position where a high capacity is not needed, i.e. MP's. Anyway, a pistol is not meant to be accurate at long distances so the point is moot. As for the "Soldier Proof" weapons, that is just a cheap way out of training soldiers correctly, as they did with the A2 model of the M16. A milspec 1911 is just as reliable as newer designs. One such argument is that the 1911 was only tested for 6000 rounds with no failure before cleaning while Glock for example is tested at 30,000 rounds. What soldier won't clean his sidearm after 6000 rounds? What battle involves firing 6000 rounds out of a pistol? If you can't see why the 1911 design is praised and still being used then I can't help any further. The 1911 design has many good points that apparently many people still find better than other designs, and many still find the 1911 a proven and effective design.[[User:GaBoy45|GaBoy45]] 22:52, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

:Apparently I wasn't clear when I rebutted you last time. The single stack is confortable for people with small hands yes. However, people with larger hands, and even some small handed people, have no problem with thicker grips and so the capacity limiting single stack serves no purpose. The grip angle is a completely subjective feature and so it is imposible to argue that one style is better than another. What matters more is simply what one is used to. You are right that 7-9 rounds of ammunition and 6000 rounds before cleaning is more than adequate for most applications, however my point wasn't that the 1911 is bad (it is a good weapon) but simply that there are better guns out their. 7 or 8 rounds may be enough for most encounters, but having 12-17 rounds and being able to fire 30,000+ rounds before cleaning is an advantage, whether or not one will utalize those features often. Also, when I referenced penetration I had things like doors, walls, and car bodies in mind, not armor. The .38 Super cartridge was specifically developed because the .45 could not penetrate car bodies effectively. Your previous post all focuses on arguing that the 1911 is an ''adequate'' combat pistol which I completely agree with. My whole point is that the features you mentioned ''do not make it the best pistol around.'' When I first began this conversation I stated that the 1911 is not a bad gun, simply that with all the pistol designs that have emerged in the past century it is no longer the greatest pistol in the world, yet nearly everyone in the gun community (yourself clearly included) still claim it is for no other reason than people like its grip (which is subjective), its caliber (which is used in many much modern modern firearms), and its history (which can easily make it a favorite gun but can not be used as justification for it being the best).

::'''"You are right that 7-9 rounds of ammunition and 6000 rounds before cleaning is more than adequate for most applications"'''

::"Before cleaning"? What do you think; that it will malfunction on the 6001st round if you don't clean it? The gun is as dirty as it is going to get after a few hundred rounds. When you've fired a gun 6000 times in a row without cleaning and with no malfunctions, that means that when the gun finally does malfunction it won't be because it is dirty; it will most likely continue to function properly until something breaks.

::'''"but having 12-17 rounds and being able to fire 30,000+ rounds before cleaning is an advantage, whether or not one will utalize those features often."'''

::Just so you know, the M1911 didn't malfunction on the 6000th round. It didn't malfunction at all. They stopped after 6000 rounds because that is how many rounds they had decided beforehand would be adequate for a test. Any gun that can fire 6000 rounds without malfunctioning can most likely fire indefinitely without malfunctioning, until something breaks. And keep in mind that the M1911 did this 100 years ago, being built out of the relatively poor grades of steel of the day (steel was greatly improved after WWII, even though no U.S. military M1911 or M1911A1 ever got to take advantage of it, because none were bought after WWII). Also, those things you mentioned are ''potential'' advantages. A potential advantage that isn't used at all is not an actual advantage, obviously.

::30,000 rounds is overkill for a test. Most people will never fire anywhere near that many rounds through their handgun (especially without cleaning), and even if they did, who would want to trust their life to a gun that has 30,000 rounds worth of wear and tear on it? --[[User:MaximRecoil|MaximRecoil]] 13:18, 17 December 2011 (CST)

You were arguing the design flaws but it is the design that is one of the big reasons it has such a following. Since you are arguing one view against the other. Why a lot of people think that it is the best. The design is one reason, history is another, the round it fires is yet another reason. I actually don't think it is the best I was merely stating the reasons that it is popular and why people say it is the best. I like the Beretta 92fs for its grip and certain design attributes and the Glock 21sf for different reasons. Would I object to using the 1911 in combat. No. Would I use the Beretta 92fs in combat with FMJ ammo? Not if I didn't have to. With HP ammo, I wouldn't hesitate to use the Beretta. But even your view of other designs being better is subjective. If a pistol, rifle, shotgun, etc...is reliable and fires a moderately effective round then it is a good design. What makes it the best is subjective as far as it goes. What one pistol may be best at is what makes it worst at something else. There is no way to objectively define the "best" just what is better than something else.[[User:GaBoy45|GaBoy45]] 00:17, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

:I agree. I don't have any gun in mind that I think is indisputably better than all others. The features I pointed out I did so to demonstrate that in certain aspects the 1911 is inferior to other disigns, not that said other designs are the perfect weapon. Every design is a give and take of different features. Because of this, my main complaint was a pervaisive belief that the 1911 is unquestioningly the greatest gun ever (I have heard that phrase Verbatim in many issues of Guns & Ammo). Is it better in some aspects than double-collumn, double-action 9mm pistols? Yes. Is it better across the board? Absolutly not. I apologize if at any point I have come across as confrontational, it is just that I have heard so many people assert the 1911's complete supremacy so many times that it has really gotten on my nerves and I wanted to know what others thought.

Google "1911"...then google any other gun...now tell me which one has the most varieties...which one has the most after market parts and pieces for the specialist. Which one has the most surplus parts. Its so popular and so famous because if you wanted to you could make one look like no other one or you could make it look like that one in your favorite movie. Not only that but all the diffrent calibers from 45cal to the awesome and unbeatable 10mm. Plus they are sexy as hell. To sum up you can basically have a beautiful, functional, all steel combat pistol in your choice of caliber and its going to feel like a dream in your hands.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 00:48, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

:The madness of crowds surely knows few bounds--just look at how the various bottled water companies manage to make a killing selling what is essentially tap water, because people will do often do things just because enough other people tell them it's a good idea. Then again, I suppose the "cult following" that some pistol-types have over others is due in part to the following facts:

:*Pistols are rarely if ever primary combat weapons anymore, with the exception of law enforcement.
:*Few people who routinely carry pistols have to regularly use them in gun battles against opponents who are earnestly trying to kill them.

:Therefore there aren't many occasions for most pistol-carriers to test their assumptions in the most revealing field of all--life-or-death situations. So depending on your circumstances you can go a lifetime without ever putting the hype in the harsh light of real return-fire. I'd bet on the M1911-type (the "pure" single-stack .45 ACP M1911s) pistols selling so much mostly because of its hype and history, and that it is, at its heart, a serviceable (though hardly optimal) weapon. Given how many clones there are, however, I really must wonder what would have happened had Colt become the sole copyright holder for this pistol type--would we see more innovation that way, or just countless clones of some other pistol type? Perhaps a more revealing, specific question would be "How does the M1911 platform compare to the Glock platform or CZ-75 platform?" That could work because all three are successful pistol types offered in multiple calibers, including 9x19mm, .45 ACP, and 10mm Auto.

:Bottom line? The "pure" M1911 works, but we can certainly do better. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 04:07, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

::Exactly

Ok, well answer me this then. Why if the 1911 is all hype and legend does MEUSOC still issue 1911s? Why does Delta give out a stipend to have an operator buy his own custom 1911? Why does the FBI HRT use 1911s? and LAPD SWAT? and so many other groups that use pistols? The reasons the wonder 9s came into popularity are lower recoil (marginal), size (marginal) higher capacity (less training in marksmanship), weight (long since gone by the wayside), to match ammo with other NATO countries (Military), and hype/ cool factor (civilian). The 1911 has served admirably (in one capacity or another) with few major changes to the platform for almost 100 years. The Beretta, Glock, CZ-75, etc. have been redesigned and "improved" since they came out just to try and match the 1911s in popularity, reliability, etc.-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 17:30, 16 August 2010 (UTC)

:Sure thing. How many of these operators you mentioned fulfill the conditions I mentioned above, namely that they regularly use pistols as their primary combat weapons instead of SMGs/PDWs/Rifles and often engage in gunfights with earnest, aware opponents? And other combat platforms for the .45 ACP won out, such as the Mk. 23 SOCOM pistol which won out over Colt's version. The "improved" Beretta, Glock, CZ-75 you mentioned have done so to fit consumer demand and market competition, but national armed forces aren't that commercial and competitive most of the time because of how many contracts and vested interests are running the show. I simply said that the "Pure" M1911 platform works when used, but it can be improved, otherwise the Mk.23 SOCOM wouldn't have won the OHWS program. --[[User:Mazryonh|Mazryonh]] 02:05, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

::A lot of Special Forces don't even use the Mk. 23 due to its bulky and awkward size. Many Navy SEALs opt to use 9mm SIG-Sauer Pistols

H&K won the competition because they strictly adhered to all of the requirements (some of which were asinine), and they put in the best bid. When USSOCOM received the Mk. 23 they got exactly what they asked for but not what they had actually wanted. The SEALS who used it complained about how it was too big, heavy, and its cons outweighed its pros. They tried to pawn them off on the ARMY but no one there would touch them, so most of them went back to H&K. As with all things military, big brass does not listen to the guys who actually have to use the equipment until its too late.-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 06:13, 8 September 2010 (UTC)

I would like to toss my thoughts into the mix. Being a Brit getting a hold of a real firearm is harder than getting away with stealing the Popes hat, but I am an avid airsofter and I have held and fired many different types of airsoft pistols ranging from HK USPs, to Glocks, to Berettas, to SIGs. But I still go back to my 1911s to which I have 2 (I'm awaiting delivery of a third). I don't have tiny hands but I don't have big bear hands and the 1911 design feels right in my hands. I use a weaver stance and the 1911 is the best pistol for hand placement in that stance, I had an issue with the Beretta that sometimes my thumb could slip onto the slide locking mechinism and prevent slide lock. With Glocks they felt too top heavy for me, maybe it's how the airsoft Glocks are designed and it's not like that on the Real steel. I used a SIG for quite a while as that felt pretty good, but as soon as I picked up a 1911 I needed one. After a little practice I can draw, remove the safety and bring the pistol up to the target in a little under 2 seconds. Why do I like the 1911 so much? It's all about the placement, the safety is right by your thumb so when you draw it you can use one motion to bring the pistol up and deactivate the safety. I found the Beretta to be a bit of a fumbling job deactivating the safety mid draw. Why the 1911 design is still praised isn't down to some cult following, it's down to simple ergonomics, it looks great, the functionality is great, the placement of everything on the pistol is perfect. I saw someone post that they would rather be able to fire 30,000 shots and not have to clean their pistol rather than 6000. I don't know about you but if I only fired off one shot from my pistol in a battle I would still clean it to make sure nothing is going to cause a problem next time. Better to be safe than sorry. --[[User:Cool-breeze|Cool-breeze]] 17:19, 17 November 2010 (UTC)

I think it depends by what you define as 'best', and what you need the gun for. In my mind, if you want an M1911 variant, get a Para-Ordnance LDA. Like the P14.45, but double action. If you want a cheap, reliable, accurate semi-auto, do what everybody else does, get a Glock 17 and stop moaning. Your moaning about not people liking 7-round magazines (we've moved on to higher-capacity ones-in my mind, if armies must use M1911 variants, use Para-Ordnance's. 7 or 8 rounds plus one in the chamber is just awful, and you'll run out quickly.) is making the world of semi-auto's remain stuck in the 20th century. Embrace the future! With pistols like the Caracal, FN Herstal Five-seveN, and many other great ones, it's not half bad.

== Ballester-Molina ==

The Ballester-Molina should not be included in the 1911 page. It's not a 1911, only the mags and barrel interchange. Internally it's based on the Star Model A, which has significant differences from the 1911 in terms of lockwork. Unless anyone objects I'm going to create a separate page for it. - [[User:Nyles|Nyles]]

== Link share ==

Hello there,

This is a question for the webmaster/admin here at www.imfdb.org.

Can I use part of the information from this blog post right above if I give a link back to your site?

Thanks,
Daniel

== Dreamworks Animation ==

When are you guys going to add animated films from Dreamworks like Monsters vs. Aliens and Megamind, because they have guns used by police and the military.

Just because there are guns in it doesn't mean it gets a page here. Are they recognisable as real guns, or are they stylised ones? [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 09:58, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

They are real guns in the animated films, like in Monsters vs Aliens, the soldiers used some M16 rifles to shoot at the alien, and in Megamind, the police uses rifles and pistols on aiming the villain, who is walking.

OK, I'm going to assume that you haven't read the [[Rules, Standards and Principles]] page, most notably [[Rules, Standards and Principles#Anime: Rules & Restrictions|this section]]. Read that, then check back. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 19:36, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

But wait, why do we have video game pages then? Firearms in them barely resemble real ones --[[User:Jackbel|Jackbel]] 19:47, 14 November 2010 (UTC)

Ok sorry, no big deal, lets not add cartoons yet, because they have to wait.

:@Jackbel. Because in video games you can clearly identify the guns, and no the good ones do not just 'barely resemble real ones.' As a video game person you should know this, unless Australia has weird rules about depicting guns in video games. The reason cartoons are generally not allowed is because unlike anime, most cartoons have a generic silouette of a 'gun' while most animes have enough detail to be able to determine what guns was used. Think [[Ghost in the Shell]] or [[Cowboy Bebop]].--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 13:52, 15 November 2010 (UTC)

==.45 Blanks==

I've read a lot here that .45 blanks used to be unreliable. I was wondering when they started to become a bit more reliable and why they were unreliable? I can't find that anywhere.

I thought it wasn't really the blanks being unreliable so much as it just being easier to blank-convert a 9mm than a .45. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 10:29, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

.45 pistols require more recoil force to cycle their actions than 9mms. Since blank rounds have virtually no recoil, .45s are much harder to convert to use blanks.

Ah right. Is there some new way of converting them now because I've started to notice that in recent years there have been a lot of films using .45 ACP versions of pistols that are also chambered in 9mm. Die Hard 4.0 for example, McClane as a P220 in .45 ACP. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 17:37, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
:Is it explicitly stated that the prop gun was chambered in .45? [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 21:16, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
::''"Is it explicitly stated that the prop gun was chambered in .45"'' We have a pic of the actual screen used gun and is listed as .45 ACP. I think all newer P220s are chambered in .45, only some of the older ones were chambered in 9mm and .38 Super. Also the .45 being unreliable with blanks. I don't think it encompassed all .45 chambered pistols. I think it was only in the 1911 platform. With the 9mm being a much smaller blank and having the large ejection port made for the .45 it was easier to eject them.--[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 22:09, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
[[Image:SIGP220R LiveFreeDieHard.jpg|thumb|none|500px|SIG-Sauer P220R - .45 ACP. This is the screen used gun in the film and was carried and fired by ''[[Bruce Willis]]''.]]
::: Just checking. Especially after the whole issue with the Glocks. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 23:54, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Long (and detailed!)story short. For a 1911 to fire blanks reliably you must first drill and tap the barrel for a blank adapter, then taper the barrel hood, then grind off the locking lugs, and remove the barrel linkage. Once that is done, the testing for a reliable adapter and blank combo ensues (you may or may not need to enlarge the ejection port too). I figure its pretty much the same with other pistols...-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 19:11, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

That sounds like a very complex process. I'm assuming if you do that well though the 1911 will cycle blanks as well as 9mm blanks. --[[User:Cool-breeze|cool-breeze]] 01:28, 4 December 2010 (UTC)

I read an article in a gun magazine a few years back about blanks and it said that it comes down to the casings used. According to the article, blanks are made from rifle brass because it has to be long enough to be crimped and still be long enough to be the length of a real cartridge. The problem with .45 acp ammo is that until recently there was no rifle brass in .45 diameter that could be used for blanks. I remember reading back when "Miami Vice" was on that Timothy La France had brass custom manufactured in .45 for blanks. -- David, 3 December 2010 (well, its the 3rd where I live)

==Laseraim Series III?==

So what is this thing?
[[Image:LaserAimSeriesIIIPistol.jpg|thumb|none|450px|LaserAim Series III Pistol - .45 ACP]]
It looks more like a CZ derivative than a 1911 derivative to me... Alot like a mashup of CZ, S&W, Sig, STI, etc..-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 06:51, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
:It draws a little from the S&W series (namely the safety) and CZ-75 (in terms of grip shape), but technically it is a M1911 derivative, they just didn't make many of them.--[[User:PistolJunkie|PistolJunkie]] 07:15, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Used to see these in tv shows during the late 80s. the later model was the first pistol I ever saw with an integral accessory rail on the dust cover, although that was in a catalog. David. 11 December 2010
:::Dust cover? What are you talking about? [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]]
I don't know what else to call it, it is the part of the frame extending in front of the trigger guard. I have seen it, in print referred to as a dust cover. David.

::THIS Laseraim was photographed for the [[Haunted (2002)]] page since it was used in an episode. If you guys read the Haunted (2002) page, for which this IMAGE was originally shot for, the description says: '''Laser Aim was yet another manufacturer who built ported .45 ACP pistol based on the original M1911 design, but incorporating elements of the BHP and the CZ-75 into a new design. The unique feature of the Laser Aim was a hole cut out of the trigger guard ahead of the trigger to mount a laser. Since the production ended for this pistol, smaller lasers with better battery life have been invented. By the late 1990s LaserAim had gone out of business and had sold their patents to AMT. ''' Hope this sheds some light on the piece. It is a new weapon influenced purportedly by M1911, BHP and CZ designs. :) [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]]

Ah, that explains it. Could have saved myself about 2 hrs of google searching if I'd looked up the image uses hah.-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 23:13, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

== MEU(SOC) Pistol... ==
...has been given a new designation, ''M45''. [http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2009/09/24/m45-close-quarters-combat-pistol/] [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 02:24, 4 January 2011 (UTC)

We also need a better image for it, but I can't find one I can't be sure isn't an Airsoft gun. [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 19:04, 5 January 2011 (UTC)

The big problem is there is no single model that is the M45/ MEUSOC Pistol. The "M-45s" in service are a mix and match of Kimbers, Springfields, Colts, etc. The "M-45" is a set of specs that any pistols built for MEUSOC have to comply with. There are SOME retrofitted M1911A1 pistols that were done by USMC Armorers at Quantico, but they are going to be near impossible to differentiate from the M1911A1 they were built from.
Here's a good thread from AR15.com (dear lord its hard to say that haha) about the M-45 MEUSOC pistol variants.
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=5&f=49&t=86667
-[[User:Ranger01|Ranger01]] 08:46, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

== More proof of the M1911's greatness ==

According to the news, the M1911 is now the official state gun of Utah! This is kind of cool, since John Browning lived in Utah, and it's just in time for the great .45's centennial anniversary. [[Special:Contributions/74.192.58.206|74.192.58.206]] 21:16, 19 March 2011 (CDT)

== Happy 100th Anniversary to the Colt M1911! ==

Happy 100 years of service M1911! Thank you for providing some of the most nastiest knockdown power available to the armed forces and for providing an eternal name of badassery in motion pictures!

Here's looking forward to 100 years more! --[[User:ThatoneguyJosh|ThatoneguyJosh]] 15:40, 29 March 2011 (CDT)

My favorite semi-auto is the 1911. I've had affairs with others but I always come back to a good ole Colt .45. I didn't understand why until I did some research and figured out we shared a birthday. Still saving for an anniversary model... [[User:USGIMar29|USGIMar29]] 19:40, 2 September 2011 (CDT)

==9mm 1911s==
I'm not sure if this is an appropriate question to ask but could anyone recommend some good 9mm 1911s? I live in Australia and the maximum calibre you can get without doing competition shooting is .38 or 9mm rounds. --[[User:GunEnthusiast|GunEnthusiast]] 07:07, 21 July 2011 (CDT)

== Naming the MEU(SOC) pistol ==

On M1911's page (and correspondingly on pages that list the weapon) it is named "M-45 MEUSOC":

1) While calling it "M-45" wouldn't be incorrect, it should be changed to "M45" in line with other officially adopted names on IMFDB;

2) Using "MEUSOC" in conjunction with "M45" is incorrect. It is either "MEU(SOC) Pistol" or "M45 Close Quarters Battle Pistol" / "M45 Close Quarters Combat Pistol".

--[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 11:46, 2 October 2011 (CDT)

:Well, then go change it. ^3^ - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 14:59, 2 October 2011 (CDT)

::Will be done right now. --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 03:17, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

:::I think they are the same pistol. I remember seeing a story about how the MEU(SOC) was reclassified as the M45 Close Quarters Combat Pistol at some point, and have also seen documents that use the term M45 MEUSOC (no brackets). What do you think the differences are between the two? I think there is some confusing as there have been various different versions of the MEU(SOC) pistol built from various off the shelf parts. There are at least 5 versions that I know of, and main fetures are as follows. 1: original version with unflared ejection port and Springfield Armoury logo behind the ejection port. 2: newer slide with flared ejection port and logo in front of the ejection port. 3: front slide serrations. 4: wide slide serrations and Novak sights, with grip safety with "bumb" at the bottom. 5: 4th version with skeleton hammer rather than Commander type hammer. You also have the ICQB which is a Kimber made pistol with a railed frame. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 06:26, 3 October 2011 (CDT)
::::Sorry, just realised I totally misread your original post. Though you were saying that the MEU(SOC) and M45 were different pistols. However, the term M45 MEUSOC (without brackets) is also correct. [https://www.fbo.gov/?s=opportunity&mode=form&tab=core&id=df43476377acd40c0f409faa2ceffc9d&_cview=1] --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 07:52, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

:::::Notice the presence of comma between M-45 and MEUSOC. That would indicate the listing of different designations for the weapon. --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 09:27, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

::::::I really don't think the comma means that, but to satisfy you, here [http://www.fbodaily.com/archive/2010/03-March/19-Mar-2010/FBO-02095403.htm]. To be fair though, I have seen official documents that refer to the M45 being the MEUSOC, Close Quarters Battle or Close Quarters Combat pistol. I think this whole conversation is irrelevant however, as on looking into it, I think the M45 pistol and the MEU(SOC) pistol listed on this page are different weapons, with the M45 being a commercial of the shelf pistol made by either Colt, Sprinfield Armoury or Karl Lippard Designs. This article from the [http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/2011/01/marine-marsoc-pistol-45cal-012511w/ Marine Corps Times] seems to back this up (this time referring to it as the Close Quarter Battle Pistol) stating that the M45 is modelled on the MEU(SOC) but will be a COTS pistol, which is currently being evaluated. For the sake of simplicity, I think the pistol on this page should just be called the MEU(SOC). --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 11:19, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

:::::::MEUSCOC. Wonder what the first "C" stands for?
:::::::It would have been so much simpler if there was website that chronicles the history of MEU(SOC) pistol. Every variant along with pictures and how they were designated (to distinguish them)... Because currently sources are conflicting. In USMC's [http://www.quantico.usmc.mil/ MCB Quantico] section there is an article "[http://www.quantico.usmc.mil/Sentry/storyview.aspx?SID=4913 The Devil Dogs’ workshop]". There it says M45 Close Quarters Battle Pistol is being built by local armorers. --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 12:50, 3 October 2011 (CDT)

One more issue: sources vary on the year of adoption. Some say 1985[http://www.americanspecialops.com/special-ops-weapons/meusoc-pistol.php][http://www.forcerecon.com/strongmenarmed3.htm], other say 1986[http://usmilitary.about.com/library/milinfo/marinefacts/blsoc.htm][http://www.militaryfactory.com/smallarms/detail.asp?smallarms_id=16][http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/history/meusoc.htm]. Maybe change the part to "since the mid-1980s"? --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 01:53, 11 October 2011 (CDT)

:Done. --[[User:Masterius|Masterius]] 07:08, 13 October 2011 (CDT)

== A Location of Procuring ==
Does anyone know where you can get one of these great airsoft movie-1911 replicas namly the stunning and slender long-slide?

[[Image:WA490 4 mark.jpg|thumb|none|450px|Airsoft Long Slide Jim Hoag M1911A1 replica]]

-[[User:GladeTaylor]]

The image has a watermark from [http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/ ehobbyasia.com] on it, so I'd suggest looking there. The exact pistol is [http://shop.ehobbyasia.com/western-arms-colt-hoag-bianchi-special-gbb-pistol.html here.] [[User:The Wierd It|The Wierd It]] 10:12, 14 December 2011 (CST)

== Organization. ==

Any objections to alphabetizing this page? I think it would make a bit more sense... --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 21:38, 6 December 2011 (CST)
:No don't do that. The M1911 and M1911A1 go first. --[[User:Predator20|Predator20]] 21:52, 6 December 2011 (CST)
::Fair enough, I actually agree with that. But what about the less common ones. Seems weird to Kimber, Strayer, Inifinity, Detonics, Springfield, etc... What if we keep the most common ones at the top (M1911 & M1911A1) and put the rest in order? --[[User:Zackmann08|Zackmann08]] 21:58, 6 December 2011 (CST)

== Difference between Kimber and Colt. ==

In several medias, I discovered that Colt M1911 can sometimes be referred as the Kimber. Why is it so since the weapon manufacturer is Colt? And is there any difference in the mechanism of gun between the both companies? --[[User:S9771773G|S9771773G]] 21:31, 28 December 2011 (CST)

those medias are just being ignorant with their terminology. Colt makes 1911's and kimber makes 1911's...two diffrent companies that happen to make the same model. Any true diffrences in them will mostly be cosmetic in nature. Most people think that colt was the first and only maker of the 1911 and call all 1911's colts no matter of maker...for example someone saying "I own a colt 1911 made by springfield"...well no sir you have a Springfield 1911-A1 and colt has nothing to do with it.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 10:21, 29 December 2011 (CST)

Talk:Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol

2011-12-23T18:49:15Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Kremlin */

What is the pistol used by Simon Pegg in the 3rd SIG screenshot? Am fairly sure it isn't a P226 as stated. Might be a Glock 17, but the front profile looks too tall/narrow. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 16:37, 29 June 2011 (CDT)
:Has now been changed to say it is a Glock 17, which I admit is closer, but compare the pic of Renner with the Glock 17 to Pegg. They are both held at a similar angle, yet the front view of the guns looks drastically different, with Pegg's lookng much taller/thinner. Maybe it is just lighting though. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 16:33, 1 July 2011 (CDT)

Not a Glock - that's for sure. Though that front sight looks Glock, the bore-axis is all wrong. If I look quickly, I think P250, but then I waiver. Definitely Sig though.
--[[User:Gwhysow|Gwhysow]] 17:47, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

I don't know, if you look closely on the slide, it looks like it has Glock type markings.Plus the slide release appears to be the same as other Glocks. Possible Non Gun? [[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] 17:20, 19 December 2011 (CST)
[[File:MI4 513.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

I don't know why, but the gun is looking real CGI-ish to me. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 17:11, 22 December 2011 (CST)
: I saw this exact shot in an Empire magazine article and although it was only a tiny picture, it looked a lot like a SIG P226. However, this one doesn't so suspect it could have been messed around with. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 10:57, 23 December 2011 (CST)

== Some more screenshots ==

Some more weapons to be ID'ed. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 04:39, 4 July 2011 (CDT)

[[File:MI4 200.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
[[File:MI4 202.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

[[File:MI4 204.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

:Top one looks like it could be a USP compact. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 06:34, 4 July 2011 (CDT)
::It is. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 16:39, 4 July 2011 (CDT)

USP Compact, Five-seven?, ???--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 21:33, 14 August 2011 (CDT)

*The bottom one looks like a H&K P7 with a suppressor and the slide locked back. Yay, unrealistic sparking bullets! :D - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:28, 15 August 2011 (CDT)

::The second one is propably a 1911 variant --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 19:34, 9 September 2011 (CDT)

i saw it, the top one is indeed a usp compact, the middle is a makarov pm, and the bottom is an hk p7m13

Another two photos from the latest trailer:

[[File:MI4-pistol-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Brandt pulls the slide off a henchman's pistol.]]
[[File:MI4-pistol-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

:: A Cougar --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 17:11, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

== The sig p226r==
The bottom picture on the Sig p226r section is the P226 TACOPS. You can tell my the extended grip well.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:47, 10 September 2011 (CDT)

I don't think this pistol is a TACOPS as it lacks the beavertail. Closest thing I can come up with is that it is a P226 Super Capacity Tactical fitted with the "Magwell" grips the TACOPS has. Proof will really be in the trigger, as the SCT is an older model and has the traditional trigger, as opposed to the TACOPS (which seems to have replaced it in the current SIG line-up) which has the new short reset trigger. Trigger is not visible in the trailer though, so will have to wait for the movie to come out to be sure. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 18:04, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

:If we're not sure that it's a P226 TACOPS, who the hell changed it? Personally, I don't think it is one...the screencap is too blurry to tell if the grip is extended, and Paula Patton might just not have very big hands (which most women don't). Until the movie comes out and we can confirm the identity of the pistol, let's just call it a P226R for now. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 11:04, 1 December 2011 (CST)

The picture is crappy...watch the trailer it does for sure have the extended grip and you can tell it has the tritium truglow sight on the front as well...yes it is possible someone put the extended grips onto a SCT but what would be the point of doing that? Its a Sig with all the features of the Tacops...i personally didnt change it but i think it the right gun.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:16, 1 December 2011 (CST)
:It doesn't have all the features of a Tacops as it lacks the beavertail, meaning that it is either a P226R with the slide changed for a Tacops one and magwell grips fitted, or it is a SCT with the grips added. Or it is a variant I am not aware of. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 11:46, 1 December 2011 (CST)

Did some looking around and it seems like Sig did produce SCT models with the magwell grips on them...that would explain the lack of beavertail and why it has the tritium truglo sights.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:49, 2 December 2011 (CST)
:I'm not sure if SIG actually made SCTs with the magwell grips, but it was a common aftermarket mod as shown below:
:[[File:P3300159.jpg|thumb|400px|none|SIG-Sauer P226 Super Capacity Tactical fitted with Magwell grips - 9x19mm]]
::I've also photo shopped the Magwell grips onto an SCT, think this is a better picture:
::[[File:P226 SCT shopped.jpg|thumb||none|400px|]]
::--[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 12:50, 2 December 2011 (CST)

==Kremlin==

The Russian Guards at the Kremlin wouldnt use a SKS in real life would they?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:15, 30 November 2011 (CST)
:Ceremonial guards, which those soldiers are supposed to be, use the SKS while parading: [http://www.milsurps.com/images/imported/2009/12/phdstudent-1.jpg Kremlin Guards] --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 21:25, 30 November 2011 (CST)

Sad!...how embarrassing for them.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 09:28, 1 December 2011 (CST)

:!? - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:16, 1 December 2011 (CST)

What's embarassing? They are ceremonial guards much like the 3rd Infantry Regiment here in the U.S. at Arlington. The ones that the public sees are there for a specific purpose but the remainder of the unit is at the ready in case of an incident. Are you going to tell the guards at Arlington that you're embarrassed because they carry M1 Garands when on duty? --[[User:DeltaOne|DeltaOne]] 22:25, 19 December 2011 (CST)

Are you seriously comparing a M1 to a SKS?! Its embarrassing because its a SKS...SKSs suck, M1 garands are awesome. Sucky guns=embarrassing...Awesome guns=not embarrassing.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 17:49, 22 December 2011 (CST)

@spades of columbia: Only sad thing about this is your way of thinking. You're disgrace of your country... Because you're the embarassing one. --[[User:SilentwarriorX|SilentwarriorX]] 10:42, 23 December 2011 (CST)

Nitpick: The Arlington guards carry M14s, not M1s. The USMC drill team uses M1s.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 20:47, 22 December 2011 (CST)

Sad dude!...im a disgrace to my country because i think the SKS is the worst military weapon of all time?...what does my country even have to do with this? I am a Montana man myself and America never adopted the SKS, we only imported them and that was because they were sooooo cheap that even the poorest american could buy a gun...i mean come on the Hi point is more reliable and more accurate and even cost more then the sks...If i was a military guy myself i would carry a The Springfield Model 1892-99 or a Mosin before i would grab a SKS. Yes i am a little bit of a gun snob but a disgrace?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 12:49, 23 December 2011 (CST)

==Random thoughts from seeing the movie in IMAX==
Saw MI4 in IMAX this Saturday (the IMAX version was released a week early). It was an awesome visual treat, the 30 mins of IMAX footage look spectacular. The high-tech train car/safe-house that can be seen in the trailer had racks of what looked like G36Cs and and P226Rs, which have already been ID'd on the main page, and possibly the newest versions of the P229, not sure.

Question to you guys with real handgun service/repair experience, in the real world could some one reach over and remove the slide from a hand gun like Brandt does to the guard's Cougar? It seems to me that the slide should be much harder to get off, since wouldn't it fly off randomly in usage if it were as easily removed in the real world?

Also a kudos to the production team is that they seem to have gotten the actors (at least for Jeremy Renner) some decent firearms training because we see Brandt disarm Hunt of his handgun and then he releases the magazine from the gun AND releases the round in the chamber. Many actions movies seem to forget about the one already in the chamber when showing the hero removing the bullets from a handgun.

Also the fact that Jeremy Renner kept his finger off the trigger as he never intended on pulling the trigger.

:I think this is relatively easy to do with a Cougar as unlike other handguns you do not need to retract the slide at all. To remove it you just hold a button on the right side of the frame, flick the locking lever down and pull the slide forward. Not sure if you can do this with a loaded magazine in place though. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 17:42, 19 December 2011 (CST)

: Fixed something in that third paragraph --[[User:DeltaOne|DeltaOne]] 22:10, 19 December 2011 (CST)

:: I know that pulling forward on the slide use to allow it to be pulled off, as that was one of the reasons given for police to stick with revolvers for a long time, and was even taught somewhere as a disarmament technique (I do not remember where). I do not know if something more modern would still allow you to do this, or even if it is that easy to do (never tried it) but at least at some point in the not so distant past it was. [[User:Dover500|Dover500]] 08:16, 20 December 2011 (CST)

When they board the traincar, one agent was holding a sig 552.--[[User:James Woods|James Woods]] 15:43, 20 December 2011 (CST)

== Guns seen in movie (in theaters) ==

I definitely saw a Tokarev (or a copy) in the hands of one of the assassins in the river scene, the guy on the end. Also, Agent Carter was holding a Sig 552 when they enter the train. In the train armory, I saw some kind of Semi-Auto sniper rifle, possibly a Remington RSASS. It was too slim to be a Barrett. That gun that Dunn in holding in the above screenshot is definitely a Glock, for sure. The silenced pistol from the server room scene (and several scenes before that) looks like a .22, maybe a Browning Buckmark. Its trigger guard was angular, so that rules out a Ruger Mark III, and the slide was chrome. In the river scene I also saw an assassin with a modernized RPK with an under-folding bipod. -Cutter9792. 12/22/2011 17:54, two hours after seeing the movie.

Talk:Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol

2011-12-23T18:48:33Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Kremlin */

What is the pistol used by Simon Pegg in the 3rd SIG screenshot? Am fairly sure it isn't a P226 as stated. Might be a Glock 17, but the front profile looks too tall/narrow. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 16:37, 29 June 2011 (CDT)
:Has now been changed to say it is a Glock 17, which I admit is closer, but compare the pic of Renner with the Glock 17 to Pegg. They are both held at a similar angle, yet the front view of the guns looks drastically different, with Pegg's lookng much taller/thinner. Maybe it is just lighting though. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 16:33, 1 July 2011 (CDT)

Not a Glock - that's for sure. Though that front sight looks Glock, the bore-axis is all wrong. If I look quickly, I think P250, but then I waiver. Definitely Sig though.
--[[User:Gwhysow|Gwhysow]] 17:47, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

I don't know, if you look closely on the slide, it looks like it has Glock type markings.Plus the slide release appears to be the same as other Glocks. Possible Non Gun? [[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] 17:20, 19 December 2011 (CST)
[[File:MI4 513.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

I don't know why, but the gun is looking real CGI-ish to me. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 17:11, 22 December 2011 (CST)
: I saw this exact shot in an Empire magazine article and although it was only a tiny picture, it looked a lot like a SIG P226. However, this one doesn't so suspect it could have been messed around with. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 10:57, 23 December 2011 (CST)

== Some more screenshots ==

Some more weapons to be ID'ed. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 04:39, 4 July 2011 (CDT)

[[File:MI4 200.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
[[File:MI4 202.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

[[File:MI4 204.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

:Top one looks like it could be a USP compact. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 06:34, 4 July 2011 (CDT)
::It is. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 16:39, 4 July 2011 (CDT)

USP Compact, Five-seven?, ???--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 21:33, 14 August 2011 (CDT)

*The bottom one looks like a H&K P7 with a suppressor and the slide locked back. Yay, unrealistic sparking bullets! :D - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:28, 15 August 2011 (CDT)

::The second one is propably a 1911 variant --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 19:34, 9 September 2011 (CDT)

i saw it, the top one is indeed a usp compact, the middle is a makarov pm, and the bottom is an hk p7m13

Another two photos from the latest trailer:

[[File:MI4-pistol-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Brandt pulls the slide off a henchman's pistol.]]
[[File:MI4-pistol-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

:: A Cougar --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 17:11, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

== The sig p226r==
The bottom picture on the Sig p226r section is the P226 TACOPS. You can tell my the extended grip well.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:47, 10 September 2011 (CDT)

I don't think this pistol is a TACOPS as it lacks the beavertail. Closest thing I can come up with is that it is a P226 Super Capacity Tactical fitted with the "Magwell" grips the TACOPS has. Proof will really be in the trigger, as the SCT is an older model and has the traditional trigger, as opposed to the TACOPS (which seems to have replaced it in the current SIG line-up) which has the new short reset trigger. Trigger is not visible in the trailer though, so will have to wait for the movie to come out to be sure. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 18:04, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

:If we're not sure that it's a P226 TACOPS, who the hell changed it? Personally, I don't think it is one...the screencap is too blurry to tell if the grip is extended, and Paula Patton might just not have very big hands (which most women don't). Until the movie comes out and we can confirm the identity of the pistol, let's just call it a P226R for now. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 11:04, 1 December 2011 (CST)

The picture is crappy...watch the trailer it does for sure have the extended grip and you can tell it has the tritium truglow sight on the front as well...yes it is possible someone put the extended grips onto a SCT but what would be the point of doing that? Its a Sig with all the features of the Tacops...i personally didnt change it but i think it the right gun.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:16, 1 December 2011 (CST)
:It doesn't have all the features of a Tacops as it lacks the beavertail, meaning that it is either a P226R with the slide changed for a Tacops one and magwell grips fitted, or it is a SCT with the grips added. Or it is a variant I am not aware of. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 11:46, 1 December 2011 (CST)

Did some looking around and it seems like Sig did produce SCT models with the magwell grips on them...that would explain the lack of beavertail and why it has the tritium truglo sights.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:49, 2 December 2011 (CST)
:I'm not sure if SIG actually made SCTs with the magwell grips, but it was a common aftermarket mod as shown below:
:[[File:P3300159.jpg|thumb|400px|none|SIG-Sauer P226 Super Capacity Tactical fitted with Magwell grips - 9x19mm]]
::I've also photo shopped the Magwell grips onto an SCT, think this is a better picture:
::[[File:P226 SCT shopped.jpg|thumb||none|400px|]]
::--[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 12:50, 2 December 2011 (CST)

==Kremlin==

The Russian Guards at the Kremlin wouldnt use a SKS in real life would they?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:15, 30 November 2011 (CST)
:Ceremonial guards, which those soldiers are supposed to be, use the SKS while parading: [http://www.milsurps.com/images/imported/2009/12/phdstudent-1.jpg Kremlin Guards] --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 21:25, 30 November 2011 (CST)

Sad!...how embarrassing for them.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 09:28, 1 December 2011 (CST)

:!? - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:16, 1 December 2011 (CST)

What's embarassing? They are ceremonial guards much like the 3rd Infantry Regiment here in the U.S. at Arlington. The ones that the public sees are there for a specific purpose but the remainder of the unit is at the ready in case of an incident. Are you going to tell the guards at Arlington that you're embarrassed because they carry M1 Garands when on duty? --[[User:DeltaOne|DeltaOne]] 22:25, 19 December 2011 (CST)

Are you seriously comparing a M1 to a SKS?! Its embarrassing because its a SKS...SKSs suck, M1 garands are awesome. Sucky guns=embarrassing...Awesome guns=not embarrassing.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 17:49, 22 December 2011 (CST)

@spades of columbia: Only sad thing about this is your way of thinking. You're disgrace of your country... Because you're the embarassing one. --[[User:SilentwarriorX|SilentwarriorX]] 10:42, 23 December 2011 (CST)

Nitpick: The Arlington guards carry M14s, not M1s. The USMC drill team uses M1s.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 20:47, 22 December 2011 (CST)

Sad dude!...im a disgrace to my country because i think the SKS is the worst military weapon of all time?...what does my country even have to do with this? I am a Montana man myself and America never adopted the SKS, we only imported them and that was because they were sooooo cheap that even the poorest american could buy a gun...i mean come on the Hi point is more reliable and more accurate and even cost more then the sks...If i was a military guy myself i would carry a The Springfield Model 1892-99 or a Mosin before i would grab a SKS. Yes i am a little bit of a gun snob but a disgrace?

==Random thoughts from seeing the movie in IMAX==
Saw MI4 in IMAX this Saturday (the IMAX version was released a week early). It was an awesome visual treat, the 30 mins of IMAX footage look spectacular. The high-tech train car/safe-house that can be seen in the trailer had racks of what looked like G36Cs and and P226Rs, which have already been ID'd on the main page, and possibly the newest versions of the P229, not sure.

Question to you guys with real handgun service/repair experience, in the real world could some one reach over and remove the slide from a hand gun like Brandt does to the guard's Cougar? It seems to me that the slide should be much harder to get off, since wouldn't it fly off randomly in usage if it were as easily removed in the real world?

Also a kudos to the production team is that they seem to have gotten the actors (at least for Jeremy Renner) some decent firearms training because we see Brandt disarm Hunt of his handgun and then he releases the magazine from the gun AND releases the round in the chamber. Many actions movies seem to forget about the one already in the chamber when showing the hero removing the bullets from a handgun.

Also the fact that Jeremy Renner kept his finger off the trigger as he never intended on pulling the trigger.

:I think this is relatively easy to do with a Cougar as unlike other handguns you do not need to retract the slide at all. To remove it you just hold a button on the right side of the frame, flick the locking lever down and pull the slide forward. Not sure if you can do this with a loaded magazine in place though. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 17:42, 19 December 2011 (CST)

: Fixed something in that third paragraph --[[User:DeltaOne|DeltaOne]] 22:10, 19 December 2011 (CST)

:: I know that pulling forward on the slide use to allow it to be pulled off, as that was one of the reasons given for police to stick with revolvers for a long time, and was even taught somewhere as a disarmament technique (I do not remember where). I do not know if something more modern would still allow you to do this, or even if it is that easy to do (never tried it) but at least at some point in the not so distant past it was. [[User:Dover500|Dover500]] 08:16, 20 December 2011 (CST)

When they board the traincar, one agent was holding a sig 552.--[[User:James Woods|James Woods]] 15:43, 20 December 2011 (CST)

== Guns seen in movie (in theaters) ==

I definitely saw a Tokarev (or a copy) in the hands of one of the assassins in the river scene, the guy on the end. Also, Agent Carter was holding a Sig 552 when they enter the train. In the train armory, I saw some kind of Semi-Auto sniper rifle, possibly a Remington RSASS. It was too slim to be a Barrett. That gun that Dunn in holding in the above screenshot is definitely a Glock, for sure. The silenced pistol from the server room scene (and several scenes before that) looks like a .22, maybe a Browning Buckmark. Its trigger guard was angular, so that rules out a Ruger Mark III, and the slide was chrome. In the river scene I also saw an assassin with a modernized RPK with an under-folding bipod. -Cutter9792. 12/22/2011 17:54, two hours after seeing the movie.

Talk:Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol

2011-12-22T23:49:43Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Kremlin */

What is the pistol used by Simon Pegg in the 3rd SIG screenshot? Am fairly sure it isn't a P226 as stated. Might be a Glock 17, but the front profile looks too tall/narrow. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 16:37, 29 June 2011 (CDT)
:Has now been changed to say it is a Glock 17, which I admit is closer, but compare the pic of Renner with the Glock 17 to Pegg. They are both held at a similar angle, yet the front view of the guns looks drastically different, with Pegg's lookng much taller/thinner. Maybe it is just lighting though. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 16:33, 1 July 2011 (CDT)

Not a Glock - that's for sure. Though that front sight looks Glock, the bore-axis is all wrong. If I look quickly, I think P250, but then I waiver. Definitely Sig though.
--[[User:Gwhysow|Gwhysow]] 17:47, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

I don't know, if you look closely on the slide, it looks like it has Glock type markings.Plus the slide release appears to be the same as other Glocks. Possible Non Gun? [[User:Bristow8411|Bristow8411]] 17:20, 19 December 2011 (CST)
[[File:MI4 513.jpg|thumb|none|800px]]

I don't know why, but the gun is looking real CGI-ish to me. [[User:BeardedHoplite|BeardedHoplite]] 17:11, 22 December 2011 (CST)

== Some more screenshots ==

Some more weapons to be ID'ed. --[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 04:39, 4 July 2011 (CDT)

[[File:MI4 200.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]
[[File:MI4 202.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

[[File:MI4 204.jpg|thumb|none|600px]]

:Top one looks like it could be a USP compact. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 06:34, 4 July 2011 (CDT)
::It is. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 16:39, 4 July 2011 (CDT)

USP Compact, Five-seven?, ???--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 21:33, 14 August 2011 (CDT)

*The bottom one looks like a H&K P7 with a suppressor and the slide locked back. Yay, unrealistic sparking bullets! :D - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 17:28, 15 August 2011 (CDT)

::The second one is propably a 1911 variant --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 19:34, 9 September 2011 (CDT)

Another two photos from the latest trailer:

[[File:MI4-pistol-1.jpg|thumb|none|600px|Brandt pulls the slide off a henchman's pistol.]]
[[File:MI4-pistol-2.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

:: A Cougar --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 17:11, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

== The sig p226r==
The bottom picture on the Sig p226r section is the P226 TACOPS. You can tell my the extended grip well.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:47, 10 September 2011 (CDT)

I don't think this pistol is a TACOPS as it lacks the beavertail. Closest thing I can come up with is that it is a P226 Super Capacity Tactical fitted with the "Magwell" grips the TACOPS has. Proof will really be in the trigger, as the SCT is an older model and has the traditional trigger, as opposed to the TACOPS (which seems to have replaced it in the current SIG line-up) which has the new short reset trigger. Trigger is not visible in the trailer though, so will have to wait for the movie to come out to be sure. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 18:04, 31 October 2011 (CDT)

:If we're not sure that it's a P226 TACOPS, who the hell changed it? Personally, I don't think it is one...the screencap is too blurry to tell if the grip is extended, and Paula Patton might just not have very big hands (which most women don't). Until the movie comes out and we can confirm the identity of the pistol, let's just call it a P226R for now. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 11:04, 1 December 2011 (CST)

The picture is crappy...watch the trailer it does for sure have the extended grip and you can tell it has the tritium truglow sight on the front as well...yes it is possible someone put the extended grips onto a SCT but what would be the point of doing that? Its a Sig with all the features of the Tacops...i personally didnt change it but i think it the right gun.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:16, 1 December 2011 (CST)
:It doesn't have all the features of a Tacops as it lacks the beavertail, meaning that it is either a P226R with the slide changed for a Tacops one and magwell grips fitted, or it is a SCT with the grips added. Or it is a variant I am not aware of. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 11:46, 1 December 2011 (CST)

Did some looking around and it seems like Sig did produce SCT models with the magwell grips on them...that would explain the lack of beavertail and why it has the tritium truglo sights.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:49, 2 December 2011 (CST)
:I'm not sure if SIG actually made SCTs with the magwell grips, but it was a common aftermarket mod as shown below:
:[[File:P3300159.jpg|thumb|400px|none|SIG-Sauer P226 Super Capacity Tactical fitted with Magwell grips - 9x19mm]]
::I've also photo shopped the Magwell grips onto an SCT, think this is a better picture:
::[[File:P226 SCT shopped.jpg|thumb||none|400px|]]
::--[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 12:50, 2 December 2011 (CST)

==Kremlin==

The Russian Guards at the Kremlin wouldnt use a SKS in real life would they?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:15, 30 November 2011 (CST)
:Ceremonial guards, which those soldiers are supposed to be, use the SKS while parading: [http://www.milsurps.com/images/imported/2009/12/phdstudent-1.jpg Kremlin Guards] --[[User:Markit|Markit]] 21:25, 30 November 2011 (CST)

Sad!...how embarrassing for them.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 09:28, 1 December 2011 (CST)

:!? - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 21:16, 1 December 2011 (CST)

What's embarassing? They are ceremonial guards much like the 3rd Infantry Regiment here in the U.S. at Arlington. The ones that the public sees are there for a specific purpose but the remainder of the unit is at the ready in case of an incident. Are you going to tell the guards at Arlington that you're embarrassed because they carry M1 Garands when on duty? --[[User:DeltaOne|DeltaOne]] 22:25, 19 December 2011 (CST)

Are you seriously comparing a M1 to a SKS?! Its embarrassing because its a SKS...SKSs suck, M1 garands are awesome. Sucky guns=embarrassing...Awesome guns=not embarrassing.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 17:49, 22 December 2011 (CST)

==Random thoughts from seeing the movie in IMAX==
Saw MI4 in IMAX this Saturday (the IMAX version was released a week early). It was an awesome visual treat, the 30 mins of IMAX footage look spectacular. The high-tech train car/safe-house that can be seen in the trailer had racks of what looked like G36Cs and and P226Rs, which have already been ID'd on the main page, and possibly the newest versions of the P229, not sure.

Question to you guys with real handgun service/repair experience, in the real world could some one reach over and remove the slide from a hand gun like Brandt does to the guard's Cougar? It seems to me that the slide should be much harder to get off, since wouldn't it fly off randomly in usage if it were as easily removed in the real world?

Also a kudos to the production team is that they seem to have gotten the actors (at least for Jeremy Renner) some decent firearms training because we see Brandt disarm Hunt of his handgun and then he releases the magazine from the gun AND releases the round in the chamber. Many actions movies seem to forget about the one already in the chamber when showing the hero removing the bullets from a handgun.

Also the fact that Jeremy Renner kept his finger off the trigger as he never intended on pulling the trigger.

:I think this is relatively easy to do with a Cougar as unlike other handguns you do not need to retract the slide at all. To remove it you just hold a button on the right side of the frame, flick the locking lever down and pull the slide forward. Not sure if you can do this with a loaded magazine in place though. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 17:42, 19 December 2011 (CST)

: Fixed something in that third paragraph --[[User:DeltaOne|DeltaOne]] 22:10, 19 December 2011 (CST)

:: I know that pulling forward on the slide use to allow it to be pulled off, as that was one of the reasons given for police to stick with revolvers for a long time, and was even taught somewhere as a disarmament technique (I do not remember where). I do not know if something more modern would still allow you to do this, or even if it is that easy to do (never tried it) but at least at some point in the not so distant past it was. [[User:Dover500|Dover500]] 08:16, 20 December 2011 (CST)

When they board the traincar, one agent was holding a sig 552.--[[User:James Woods|James Woods]] 15:43, 20 December 2011 (CST)

== Guns seen in movie (in theaters) ==

I definitely saw a Tokarev (or a copy) in the hands of one of the assassins in the river scene, the guy on the end. Also, Agent Carter was holding a Sig 552 when they enter the train. In the train armory, I saw some kind of Semi-Auto sniper rifle, possibly a Remington RSASS. It was too slim to be a Barrett. That gun that Dunn in holding in the above screenshot is definitely a Glock, for sure. The silenced pistol from the server room scene (and several scenes before that) looks like a .22, maybe a Browning Buckmark. Its trigger guard was angular, so that rules out a Ruger Mark III, and the slide was chrome. In the river scene I also saw an assassin with a modernized RPK with an under-folding bipod. -Cutter9792. 12/22/2011 17:54, two hours after seeing the movie.

Talk:Rise of the Planet of the Apes

2011-12-15T17:33:06Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Apes vs guns */

== Took out gas can ==

It's not a weapon. It's not even a grenade of any kind, so I took it off. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:59, 26 June 2011 (CDT)

== Apes vs guns ==

Seriously, my problem with this movie is that they set it in a modern setting where the apes suddenly became smart and I guess demanded to be treated like intelligent beings...so their way to do this is to rise up, make weapons and attack honest cops? Sounds like they aren't so intelligent after all and more like well salvage animals that can write their names and read books. Seriously, the monkeys have sticks and the humans have guns...it's obvious who should win. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:59, 26 June 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah I don't know about this movie. :\ Anyways, the Unknown Firearm is a MP5 with the new UMP-type stock and a scope. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 22:14, 26 June 2011 (CDT)

:Somewhere in the mix of the movie should be a Glock 18C conversion mounted in an EMA Tactical RONI...unless they decided not to use it or the footage in which it was used was cut.

For some reason it really annoys me to see movie SWAT guys with the big "SWAT" printed on the back of their vest...(the new Batman series included, even though the movies are great...) Not to mention these guys even got the American flag on their shoulder backward...--[[User:Wildcards|Wildcards]] 18:10, 8 July 2011 (CDT)

Well we can forgive the universal POLICE or SWAT or FBI logo on vests. I'm still wondering why did they make this reboot like this. How will this really build up to the Planet of the Apes? There aren't enough monkeys and apes in the world to takes us over. Annoy the hell out of us and cause a lot of trouble the first couple weeks but it'll give every gun owner in America an excuse to shoot every ape they see because...they are breaking our shit. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:44, 10 July 2011 (CDT)
:This movie will FAIL. I mean, don't we have guns, jets, tanks, missiles, and such? - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:20, 15 July 2011 (CDT)
::We had that stuff in [[Conquest of the Planet of the Apes]] as well, yet the apes still won. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:31, 7 December 2011 (CST)

Aren't their vests supposed to say POLICE or SWAT on them
--[[User:Jd0554|Jd0554]] 00:06, 11 July 2011 (CDT)JD0554
:Is it me or is the M249 either the heat shield variant with a collapsible stock or a paratrooper variant with a heat shield? - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:09, 15 July 2011 (CDT)

I don't mind the POLICE or FBI tags, but I just can't stand the SWAT tags. Just like agents from FBI HRT will have FBI rather than HRT on their vests, police tactial teams should have POLICE or whatever PD they come from on the vest rather than SWAT... I know it seem a trivia matter, but it just really bothers me...--[[User:Wildcards|Wildcards]] 12:46, 15 July 2011 (CDT)

So how is it that the one guy says that "the flags are on backwards"? They look right to me.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:16, 14 December 2011 (CST)
:2nd and 3rd picture in the M4 section, you can see that the stars are on the right rather than the left. The reason this backwards patch exists is that in the US forces the flag is worn with the stars facing forwards regardless of which side it is on, so that it is a patch for the right arm. In this case however they are wearing it one left so it is wrong. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 04:37, 15 December 2011 (CST)

I see...the left arm is what confused me...thanks for the insight.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 11:33, 15 December 2011 (CST)

== How believable is the bridge scene? ==

Haven't seen the movie yet, but I do remember that in Conquest of the Planet of the Apes, it looked like the makers went out of their way to give the apes an advantage over the police/soldiers, which didn't impress me (honestly, apes standing pressed shoulder to shoulder in front of a literal firing squad and they don't drop like flies when the shooting starts?). So is the battle between the apes and the police a bit more based in reality?
:I don't know, but for some reason, they can manage to take multiple shots from a 5.56 mm assault rifles and a 7.62 mm machine guns. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 23:02, 12 August 2011 (CDT)
:It was a 3-prong attack from the front, below, and above. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:37, 7 December 2011 (CST)

== Police Marksman in Helicopter ==

I saw this film the other day, the police marksman in the helicopter in the bridge scene appeared to be using a scoped G36C, or a G36K with the top rail. I didn't get a good look, but it definitely wasn't an SL8 or a full sized G36. Could someone who got a better look put it into the article?

HK G36K "short" (Kurz) assault rifle; standard version with iron sights and Picatinny rail ? (4 vents, not 2 vents like G36C)... with big tac turrets scope.
[[File:G36_apes.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

==What is up with the uniforms?==
Who Identified the TAN uniforms as SFPD. They look nothing like SFPD, nor the SF Sheriff dept. Could be CHP but the patches look wrong. I have not seen this film, does anyone know? [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 02:27, 7 December 2011 (CST)
:The police are actually SFPD, but the ones on the Golden Gate Bridge in tan uniforms are members of the SFPD Highway Patrol. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 23:17, 12 December 2011 (CST)

==M249==

Can anyone tell if the "M249" is actually a [[Daewoo K3]]? The screencap provided isn't good enough for me to tell, but this movie was filmed mostly in British Columbia, and as I pointed out on the K3 page, the armorers over there always use K3s as M249 stand-ins. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 09:11, 7 December 2011 (CST)
:I think it is a K3. Firstly, the front sight post has a constant taper whereas the M249 sight steps in. Secondly the feed tray design seems to match the K3 (talking about the "ramp" part near the front). The gun also seems to be missing the carry handle that would be on an M249. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 06:53, 13 December 2011 (CST)

Talk:Rise of the Planet of the Apes

2011-12-15T02:16:49Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Apes vs guns */

== Took out gas can ==

It's not a weapon. It's not even a grenade of any kind, so I took it off. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:59, 26 June 2011 (CDT)

== Apes vs guns ==

Seriously, my problem with this movie is that they set it in a modern setting where the apes suddenly became smart and I guess demanded to be treated like intelligent beings...so their way to do this is to rise up, make weapons and attack honest cops? Sounds like they aren't so intelligent after all and more like well salvage animals that can write their names and read books. Seriously, the monkeys have sticks and the humans have guns...it's obvious who should win. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 21:59, 26 June 2011 (CDT)

:Yeah I don't know about this movie. :\ Anyways, the Unknown Firearm is a MP5 with the new UMP-type stock and a scope. - [[User:Mr. Wolf|Mr. Wolf]] 22:14, 26 June 2011 (CDT)

:Somewhere in the mix of the movie should be a Glock 18C conversion mounted in an EMA Tactical RONI...unless they decided not to use it or the footage in which it was used was cut.

For some reason it really annoys me to see movie SWAT guys with the big "SWAT" printed on the back of their vest...(the new Batman series included, even though the movies are great...) Not to mention these guys even got the American flag on their shoulder backward...--[[User:Wildcards|Wildcards]] 18:10, 8 July 2011 (CDT)

Well we can forgive the universal POLICE or SWAT or FBI logo on vests. I'm still wondering why did they make this reboot like this. How will this really build up to the Planet of the Apes? There aren't enough monkeys and apes in the world to takes us over. Annoy the hell out of us and cause a lot of trouble the first couple weeks but it'll give every gun owner in America an excuse to shoot every ape they see because...they are breaking our shit. [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 23:44, 10 July 2011 (CDT)
:This movie will FAIL. I mean, don't we have guns, jets, tanks, missiles, and such? - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:20, 15 July 2011 (CDT)
::We had that stuff in [[Conquest of the Planet of the Apes]] as well, yet the apes still won. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:31, 7 December 2011 (CST)

Aren't their vests supposed to say POLICE or SWAT on them
--[[User:Jd0554|Jd0554]] 00:06, 11 July 2011 (CDT)JD0554
:Is it me or is the M249 either the heat shield variant with a collapsible stock or a paratrooper variant with a heat shield? - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 01:09, 15 July 2011 (CDT)

I don't mind the POLICE or FBI tags, but I just can't stand the SWAT tags. Just like agents from FBI HRT will have FBI rather than HRT on their vests, police tactial teams should have POLICE or whatever PD they come from on the vest rather than SWAT... I know it seem a trivia matter, but it just really bothers me...--[[User:Wildcards|Wildcards]] 12:46, 15 July 2011 (CDT)

So how is it that the one guy says that "the flags are on backwards"? They look right to me.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:16, 14 December 2011 (CST)

== How believable is the bridge scene? ==

Haven't seen the movie yet, but I do remember that in Conquest of the Planet of the Apes, it looked like the makers went out of their way to give the apes an advantage over the police/soldiers, which didn't impress me (honestly, apes standing pressed shoulder to shoulder in front of a literal firing squad and they don't drop like flies when the shooting starts?). So is the battle between the apes and the police a bit more based in reality?
:I don't know, but for some reason, they can manage to take multiple shots from a 5.56 mm assault rifles and a 7.62 mm machine guns. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 23:02, 12 August 2011 (CDT)
:It was a 3-prong attack from the front, below, and above. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 01:37, 7 December 2011 (CST)

== Police Marksman in Helicopter ==

I saw this film the other day, the police marksman in the helicopter in the bridge scene appeared to be using a scoped G36C, or a G36K with the top rail. I didn't get a good look, but it definitely wasn't an SL8 or a full sized G36. Could someone who got a better look put it into the article?

HK G36K "short" (Kurz) assault rifle; standard version with iron sights and Picatinny rail ? (4 vents, not 2 vents like G36C)... with big tac turrets scope.
[[File:G36_apes.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

==What is up with the uniforms?==
Who Identified the TAN uniforms as SFPD. They look nothing like SFPD, nor the SF Sheriff dept. Could be CHP but the patches look wrong. I have not seen this film, does anyone know? [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 02:27, 7 December 2011 (CST)
:The police are actually SFPD, but the ones on the Golden Gate Bridge in tan uniforms are members of the SFPD Highway Patrol. - [[User:Kenny99|Kenny99]] 23:17, 12 December 2011 (CST)

==M249==

Can anyone tell if the "M249" is actually a [[Daewoo K3]]? The screencap provided isn't good enough for me to tell, but this movie was filmed mostly in British Columbia, and as I pointed out on the K3 page, the armorers over there always use K3s as M249 stand-ins. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 09:11, 7 December 2011 (CST)
:I think it is a K3. Firstly, the front sight post has a constant taper whereas the M249 sight steps in. Secondly the feed tray design seems to match the K3 (talking about the "ramp" part near the front). The gun also seems to be missing the carry handle that would be on an M249. --[[User:Commando552|commando552]] 06:53, 13 December 2011 (CST)

Talk:Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol

2011-12-02T17:49:58Z

Spades of Columbia: /* The sig p226r */

Talk:Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol

2011-12-01T17:16:33Z

Spades of Columbia: /* The sig p226r */

Talk:Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol

2011-12-01T15:28:44Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Kremlin */

Talk:Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol

2011-12-01T02:15:41Z

Spades of Columbia: /* The sig p226r */

Talk:The A-Team (2010)

2011-11-04T15:48:02Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Hannibal's sidearm */

== Bradley Cooper: Fully Automatic ==
If you purchase the Unrated Extended Edition on I-tunes it comes with a very cool extra feature about Bradley Cooper really taking well to the M4, and to guns in general. Joe Carnahan is a shooter and gun owner himself, and he seems to really get a kick out of Cooper becoming a shooter. It has a ton of behind the scenes material with the guys training, and it also has an unseen sequence of Cooper reloading and firing the M4 that HEAT fans will enjoy.

== Hannibal 1911 hi res pic ==

http://www.collider.com/wp-content/uploads/The-A-Team-movie-image-9.jpg

I just watched the trailer. Is that tank an XM8 Buford? Wow.

:As a note, the M8 AGS was never called the Buford. It's believed to have actually been coined by Tom Clancy in his book ''Armored Cav: A Guided Tour of an Armored Cavalry Regiment'' and picked up on by others. [[User:Evil Tim|Evil Tim]] 08:49, 4 November 2011 (CDT)

A-Team -- B-movie?

''-Implying B-movie is a bad thing.''--[[User:AlkoTanko|AlkoTanko]] 15:44, 18 January 2010 (UTC)

No shit. I mean come on, the trailer shows one of the team shooting down an F-18 with a mounted machine gun on a tank, WHILE THE TANK IS FALLING OUT OF THE GODDAMNED SKY!!! Even kicking your transmission of disbelief into high gear won't help that.[[User:StrikerDelta|StrikerDelta]]
:Consider the source material. You've got four special forces guys who expend thousands of rounds of ammo and yet manage to not even wound, much less kill, anyone in five years, all while somehow evading arrest while riding around in a VERY distinctive vehicle driven by an even more distinctive driver. --[[User:Funkychinaman|Funkychinaman]] 05:13, 17 March 2010 (UTC)
Well dude if you pay attention to the shows audience, it was a helluva a lot of kids on a friday night, they didn't want it to be to violent, but you have to give them this, of there was a tire to be shot it was shot.
I think the original was more believable cause it was back in the day no satellites and databases no APB's so its probably hard to catch them if they go all around, nowadays the show wouldn't work just to unrealistic.
it looked like a drone not a fighter
Yeah its a drone still stupid

it aspost to be an over the top action movies

It's an MQ-1 Predator which is a UAV. Also the film is Fictitious. Made for peoples enjoyment to get away from the real world by watching something impossible done on film. what's the problem with that.
[[User:moviemaster1993|moviemaster1993]]

also lately in films and tv show they have been showing UAV to by mounted with machine guns when they can only by fitted with missiles and bombs.

REMOVED FROM MAIN PAGE (Regarding Hannibal's 1911):
:It was definitely a Para-Ordnance model .45, you can see it has a wider grip, his mags are double stacked, and the logo is on the right side of the slide. - [[User:Gunmaster45|Gunmaster45]]
::And Hannibal obviously uses two different guns as his sidearms; first one in the film's first half, when Hannibal and his Team are still working for the government, and the second during the latter half. Most noticeable is the diffrence between the front slide serrations: the first one has six, and the second one has only three. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 23:39, 15 December 2010 (UTC)
::: The Special features on the Blu Ray give it as a "Para-Ordnance P14-45 Limited". Ten in the mag, one in the spout. .45 ACP, semi-auto. --[[User:Milkovich|Milkovich]] 17:13, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

== M4A1 ==

Can anyone post some links or pictures of these rifles used in the Movie?
I am really loving those Olive Foregrips and Stock.

UPDATE: Could the M4A1 actually be this?
[[Image:M6A1.jpg|thumb|right|500px|LWRC M6A1, 5.56x45mm NATO]]
:no, this is too expensive. Also note their rifles have step-down on the barrels for nubtube fixation.

::Armorers tend to mostly use what they have in inventory already. They're not going to go out and buy all-new ARs (since all such rifles are so similar). It's more likely that these are just regular M4A1s that have been fitted with the olive furniture. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 00:33, 7 April 2010 (UTC)

::And the M203 is ''not'' a "noob tube"... [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 10:24, 14 May 2010 (UTC)
:::Right, someone's been playing too much MW2 [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 15:24, 14 May 2010 (UTC)

The gun is in fact the LWRC M6A1.

: According to the Special features on the Blu Ray they are "Bushmaster XM15-E2S"--[[User:Milkovich|Milkovich]] 18:55, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

About these M4s. I actually saw a picture of the A-Team running away from an explosion, in IMDB, okay and I saw Hannibal's M4 had an EOTech sight on it. And Face's M4 must have been the only one with the Red Dot Sight on it. I didn't want to post the actual picture, due to me fearing copyright, but is it alright if I provide just the link to that picture? [[User:Shoockeye7665|Shoockeye7665]] 12:03, 16 June 2010 (UTC)

Why does it still say tan magpul furniture, looks FG to me. - skyrider

== Hannibal's sidearm ==

No doubt about it: Hannibal's 1911 is in fact a Para-ord. The slide serrations spell it all out on this one. 6 in back - offset under sights - with 3 in front. Looks like a P14 with front cocking serrations milled, or more likely an S14 with night sights. You even see the finish in the movie, and it almost looks like they've just sprayed over the stainless. Regardless, it's a Para. If not one specific, it could just be a mix-master hi-cap. --[[User:Gwhysow|Gwhysow]] 23:11, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I recently saw a production still in a magazine of Hannibal and he had a shoulder holster on with what appeared to carry a 1911 variant possibly a Kimber Custom II.

Any chance at someone identifing the brand/type of shoulder holster that Hannibal uses? [[Spades of Columbia]]

Just saw the movie last night; Hannibal's 1911 is most certainly not a Kimber of any sort. Slide serrations are way off, so who knows. Almost looked like a custom slide from Caspian, but still wouldn't bet on it.

As for the leather shoulder rig, it looked a lot like a DeSantis.

To me the 1911 looks like a Para p-14 or some sort of variant, take a look at one of the promo pics where you can see it in the shoulder holster. Looks like a double-stack grip to me, but maybe my eyes are playing tricks on me.

:I just saw this movie, and I agree that it's not a Kimber Warrior (lacks the Picatinny rail). My guess is Colt XSE. It's also likely that it was a custom 1911 assembled by the movie's armorers; the slide could be Colt, frame could be something else. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:49, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

No it's defiantly a Kimber possibly a Custom some don't have rails. Confirmed by the films armorer the same guy who confirmed Face's Glock as a 17 standard finish.

::I need to see that evidence before you change it back (link please). And if it's not a Warrior, then don't put down that it is. It's better to say "Unknown 1911" if we don't know the exact model. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 11:03, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

:: If I can find it I will post the link but I watched as a special on Sleuth or FX I forget.

It seems that Hannible uses multiply 1911's through out the movie...but it looked as if the 1911 that Lynch said was Hannibles personal weapon that he attempted to frame hannible with at the end of the movie was a Nighthawk GRP or even the enforcer model. But pretty sure he didn't use the same 1911 the whole time. [[Spades of Columbia]]

::The gun was heavily ruined to make it look more used by a Veteran. When Hannibal pulled a gun on Baracus I had seen a large logo (that not seen a trademark) on the right side of the slide near the front grooves (Can anyone confirm?). It is possible that this logo is of the Rangers, as was done with the logo of SEAL TEAM 4 on the Augustus Gibbons Colt XSE in [[XXX 2: State of the Union#Colt XSE M1911|XXX 2]]. [[User: Charly Driver|Charly Driver]]

it could be a Nickel Plated Nighthawk FLX. these are fairly new guns, but as stated on the page. are double stacked.

[[Image:FLX 2.jpg|thumb|none|400px|Nighthawk FLX - .45 ACP]]

I'd say thats probably a very accurate guess. -[[User:Gunman69|Gunman69]] 05:12, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

Good lookin piece but the front grip serrations are all kinds of diffrent.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 12:50, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

It can't be a double stack/para. In that last picture you see more than 3 serrations in the front and you can even imagine a single stack mag at the bottom. Also you can see in the grip/right above the trigger area that it is flat. Double stack guns have it widen for the wide magazine.
http://www.tactical-life.com/online/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/para1.jpg
look straight above the magazine catch
EDIT: Actually after rewatching, it is probably both and it is just switched throughout the movie- skyrider

Yeah, thats what i was saying. Hannible uses more then one 1911 in this movie.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 16:00, 18 July 2010 (UTC)

I love Nighthawk 1911's - and I would like to see one in a movie - but his 1911 doesn't run a 2011 frame.--[[User:Gwhysow|Gwhysow]] 18:33, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

its a shame. ud think with games like MW2 or Medal of Honor that has Elite units ud think theyd have Multiple Nighthawk variants. Delta Force uses them thanks to larry Vickers.

would the guns firing pin be removed or replanted so easily?

It would be that easy if his gun is based on a series 70...but if his gun had a firing pin saftey then no you couldnt do what he did as easy.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 10:48, 4 November 2011 (CDT)

== Not a lot of new guns ==

I am a bit disappointed that they didn't have a wide variety of weapons used int his movie [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 04:31, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

:I was a little more disappointed by the dialogue, the way in which the action scenes were directed, and the excessive cheese throughout. And I tend to think that kind of stuff matters a little more than the variety of weapons. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:56, 14 June 2010 (UTC)

I saw a guy with an Uzi at the bank, and I'm sure the Sig 552 isn't. It has a ful rail on top.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 18:28, 17 June 2010 (UTC)

:I don't think it was a 556; the receiver didn't look like it (mostly around the magazine well). Also, they make continuous rails for the 552. I think it's more likely that they just took a 552, removed the stock, and gave it the upper rail, though I could be wrong. We'll see when the Blu Ray becomes available. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 13:51, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

:I thought it was a 552 the first time. After viewing again I'm pretty sure it was the 556 pistol, it seemed to be using STANAG magazines. And for posterity, I enjoyed the stupid dialog and oozing cheese. C'mon its the A Team its not gonna be oscar worthy, its gonna be guns, explosions, stupidity and deus ex machina. =P [[User:Mercer|Mercer]] 15:50, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
:: The first thing that came to mind when I saw Pike carrying the "552" was (strangely enough) a KAC PDW or a Robinson XCR... though I admit I never paid that much attention to what he was using. :S (BTW, I also enjoyed it for it's over-the-top cheesiness. It's exactly what I was expecting out of an A-team movie.)*EDIT* just saw the movie again with my GF... when Pike first gets out of the car at the beginning of the scene I could clearly tell it was a Sig 552. No full-top rail, no forward vertical grip that I could see. Later the gun looks like it may have switched. This may be either an editing or continuity error.

It looks just like the Sig 556 pistol...[[Spades of Columbia]]

:Somebody added some new pictures:

:[[Image:A-TEAM_PIKE.jpg|thumb|none|600px|]]

:That is definitely a SIG 552 with the stock removed. Handguards, magwell, sights, etc. are totally wrong for a 556. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 02:41, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

you are correct...the front gas adjustment is a 552 design and not even close the 556.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:35, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

stock hasnt been removed its just folded to the left side of the gun. handy little touch that makes it a more concealable package, i do think they change the doctor sight though. [[User:fenris357|fenris357]]

:Actually, the stock on all SIG 550-series rifles folds to the right, not the left. His gun is clearly missing the stock. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 21:38, 12 September 2010 (UTC)

== Mini 14 ==
Hannibal was firing full auto, wouldn't that make it an AC-556? [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 12:32, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

He may have just been firing quickly, like they did in the original TV show.

In the picture we have, it looks like a Ruger Mini 14 stainless with a factory ruger folding stock. Look at the front sight. --[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 03:29, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

He was using a stainless semi-auto with the older front blade sight, and a factory folding stock. I didn't notice what I'd call full auto firing, just rapid fire semi-auto. I believe the pic on the main page is in fact an AC-556, and not representative of the one used in the film. The one in the film did NOT have the birdcage flash-hider or the mid-barrel mounted front sight. For reference, it was this gun: http://www.armco-guns.com/Mini%2014%20folder%20%202.JPG --[[User:Rugerlvr|Rugerlvr]] 00:46, 24 June 2010 (UTC)

:If he was firing semi-auto, then he had an impossibly fast trigger finger. [[User:Spartan198|Spartan198]] 11:56, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

The sound editing could have made it sound full auto. I'll need to watch the movie again [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 18:30, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

: I'm with Spartan, I'm pretty sure he was firing full-auto. [[User:That's One Angry Duck|That's One Angry Duck]] 19:35, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

Its definatly still a semi, he fires fairly fast, but its about one round per bad guy and is definatly not full auto --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 22:01, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. I just watch the movie last night; it's definitely semi. -SasquatchJim

== Nice Little Things ==

There were a few small things in this movie that made me smile, things you don't see in most movies, like when Pike was in the car and they were gonna shoot him, and the CIA guys were failing with the Beretta, and one called it a silencer and he muttered something about it being a suppressor. And I also noticed for once the Armorer was in the credits, as "Armorer/Firearms", and for the most part all the fights and reloading and such were very good, there were only a couple little things that seemed a ''little'' off, but it was almost perfect :)

Pike may have been a traitorous fink, but at least he wasn't stupid. Why is the CIA always inept, despite being super-evil? They can listen to your phone conversations half a world away but ''still'' can't pull of their evil schemes. 2 things I didn't like about the embassy scene: One, the CIA just walks through security. I was so wishing a dozen marines with M16s would stop them, and 2: the extradition order. If Sosa was a bright as she usually was, she would have maid sure it wasn't a fake. I wouldn't put it past the oh-so-evil CIA to do that.

== Mk 19 ==

wasnt there one at the end of the film?

When? I remember an M2, but no Mk19.--[[User:Mandolin|Mandolin]] 00:23, 17 July 2010 (UTC)

near the end, at the docks, where lynch is up on that crane. I could have sworn there was a Mk 19 sitting next to him.

== Frankfurt am Main skyscrapers ==

You can replace the "Koeniggs Bank" in the last section (where Baracus fires the M203 launcher) with "Königsbank". I am not sure if the "ö" causes problems with the code of this website, but you may give it a try. --Paul_Baeumer [[Special:Contributions/84.181.224.167|84.181.224.167]] 18:15, 23 July 2010 (UTC)

== Pikes SIG ==

Im sure pike was using a 228 not a 226 as it looked compact and for some reason i couted off his rounds he fired before reloading. 13, same mag cap as the 228 --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 18:01, 28 July 2010 (UTC)

:Nope, it was a 226. I saw the squared trigger guard myself. I also own a 226 and know SIGs pretty well, so I am pretty confident about this. Also, counting the rounds fired is a bad way to figure out the type of gun used; we all know movies never show reloading, making it look like actors fire hundreds of rounds from 30-shot mags. Same principle applies here. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:49, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

My mistake, I just streamed that scene and you are right its definatly too long to be a 228 --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 18:41, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

What is on the rail of pikes Sig SG 552? it doesnt look like a sight.[[User:Simmons 8492|Simmons 8492]]

== PX4 Compact ==

Is it just me, or does the Compact PX4 look HUGE in Jessica Biels' hands? I was looking at the [[Live Free or Die Hard]] page and it looks about the same size when it's in Bruce Willis' hands. Maybe he just has large hands.--[[User:Gunkatas|Gunkatas]] 15:10, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

:She's a woman. Of course she has smaller hands than Bruce Willis. I don't know very many women who have big hands. Every time I ever go to ranges, I notice that women there have trouble properly gripping most guns because their hands are so smaller than those of their boyfriends/husbands. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 15:50, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

It looks bigger than the px4. But it might just be that it is Berettas Px4 Storm Sub-Compact pistol. It's not suppost to be released untill 2011 they may have put it in the movie to per-mote the guns release. Here is a link goths gun.
http://www.berettausa.com/products/px4-storm-type-f-sub-compact/

:While it's possible that Beretta may have provided Px4 Sub-Compacts as a promotional deal with the producers, the guns in the movie look to me like Compacts, not Sub-Compacts. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 16:37, 27 December 2010 (UTC)

::We need to get some continuity because the page text says compact, but the pictures are of the subcompact.

==Face==

Ok a few things Face. Firstly on the bagdad mission face is carrying two side arms, what looks like a walther p99 on the left of his chest and a second (possibly his glock) on his thigh. On a seperaate not did anyone else think it was odd that he only had 4 rounds in his glock at the showdown at the docks? (Which he uses to shoot free the cables). Even if you include the 2 shots at the frankfurt station that makes for 6 total, why would you not take at least a full mag? That said I thought he was very proficent at weapons handling. --[[User:Captain Snikt|Captain Snikt]] 20:18, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

He's too busy chasing around Jessica Biel to worry about loading his gun.
:I find I can't fault him for that ;) Seriously though are you sure the slide locks back during the fight at the docks? I didn't notice myself, but is it possible the gun had a double feed, causing the slide to partially lock? If not it's probably just a goof, like they took multiple takes of that shot and didn't bother reloading the mag between takes.

It seems to be similar to in Shooter where there were only 4 rounds in the Beretta.

It was a Taurus, sign your posts.--[[User:FIVETWOSEVEN|FIVETWOSEVEN]] 21:56, 12 August 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, my mistake.
What do you mean, exactly? Like, put my name after it? 'Cause I'm not a member or anything.

Face has his Glock on his thigh holster in Bagdad. Im not 100% sure its a P99 on his vest, cant find a good picture of it and dont own the film yet, but it definately does look like one.

Is in fact a P99 on his vest. You get a good shot of it when they let B.A out of the container.

[[Image:Ateam-M4-prod-1.jpg|thumb|none|450px|[[Bradley Cooper]] as Face and [[Liam Neeson]] as Hannibal with M4A1 carbines in a production still. Glock in thigh holster. Possibly a P99 on left side of his vest.]]

Face still carries his Glock on his thigh in addition to the p99 on his vest in baghdad, whoever re did the page needs to re do the glock entry to represent this - Captain Snikt--[[Special:Contributions/86.148.97.195|86.148.97.195]] 01:37, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

I agree, this really needs to be changed --[[Special:Contributions/86.150.213.139|86.150.213.139]] 01:34, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

== Remington 870 ==

Is that a Remington 870? I don't know if it just the angle of the pic but somehow the receiver looks a little different as does the mag tube. As a side note btw they actually do refer to the tank in the C-130 as a "Buford". --[[User:Charon68|Charon68]] 10:19, 13 August 2010 (UTC)

=Screencaps=
I have the Blu-Ray (which is already out here in Finland, and in several other European countries) and I did some screencapping. I will finish the page and tidy it up tomorrow. --[[User:Warejaws|Warejaws]] 00:18, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
::'''Since we are a U.S. Based site, DO NOT upload anything until after the December 2010 release date. I am SERIOUS. ''' We have no way of verifying pre-release in ANY OTHER COUNTRY. (for example)(and unfortunately for our Asian members) we don't trust ANY pre release titles from Hong Kong, Singapore, Indonesia or China. With Europe, again we have no way of verifying this. This MAY be released in Finland, But of course I wonder why a major motion picture would be released in FINLAND before the U.S.? Regardless, you cannot upload images prior to the official release date. Since we can only verify the Studio's official DVD release date, IMFDB will stick to that. Sorry. Just stating that it is released in your country, sadly, in the past, has meant nothing, and it offers no legal protection for us if the member is mistaken and the images are indeed from a BOOTLEG of some sort. Thanks for your cooperation. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 00:49, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

== The Movie will be out on Video Dec.11,2010 ==

So please do not put up any screenshots that aren't from the trailers or clips.

--[[User:Ben41|Ben41]] 00:50, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

Talk:Coriolanus

2011-10-12T01:58:33Z

Spades of Columbia:

==Optics==

Can anyone tell what type of optics are fitted to the ARs? Looks like something from Insight Technologies, but I'm not sure.

On an unrelated note, this movie looks pretty exciting. [[Ralph Fiennes]] is one of my favorite actors; can't wait to see if he's just as talented behind the camera. -[[User:MT2008|MT2008]] 14:31, 24 August 2011 (CDT)

they look like Aimpoints. http://technorati.com/entertainment/film/article/gerard-butler-ralph-fiennes-in-coriolanus/ has a better pic.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:58, 11 October 2011 (CDT)

Talk:Person of Interest

2011-10-09T01:32:49Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Unknown pistol */

==I'm in love with the show and I need help==
I came across this show and I like what I see already. But as always I need help to get this page up to its full potential. So anyone is free to edit, change, add screenshots to make this page better.

== Ending Continuity Error - Pilot ==

At the end of the pilot episode Jim Caviezel tells the cop in the car that he had to shoot the cop in the trunk with his gun. During the shoot out he uses a Glock but when he tells the guy in the car that he used his gun he hands him the S&W. --[[User:Ram229|Ram229]] 19:00, 29 September 2011 (CDT)

It may not be an error, he could have just been lying to the Cop. It fits his other actions. --[[User:Krel|Krel]] 18:31, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

== P226 used by Lattimer ==

I don't think that is a P226, no takedown lever or decocker, no hammer. --[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 18:07, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

Looks like a Kahr to me in the screencap.

Regards,

Tecolote

:That's what I thought at first, but the grip looks a bit large.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 19:28, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

==Unknown pistol==

Sam's unknown pistol on the main page looks to be a Kahr K9.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:24, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

on a side note i do not believe that the Sig is a 556SBR because the 556 would take standard AR mags and not the clear ones like the 552 commandos have.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:31, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

Talk:Person of Interest

2011-10-09T01:31:22Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Unknown pistol */

==I'm in love with the show and I need help==
I came across this show and I like what I see already. But as always I need help to get this page up to its full potential. So anyone is free to edit, change, add screenshots to make this page better.

== Ending Continuity Error - Pilot ==

At the end of the pilot episode Jim Caviezel tells the cop in the car that he had to shoot the cop in the trunk with his gun. During the shoot out he uses a Glock but when he tells the guy in the car that he used his gun he hands him the S&W. --[[User:Ram229|Ram229]] 19:00, 29 September 2011 (CDT)

It may not be an error, he could have just been lying to the Cop. It fits his other actions. --[[User:Krel|Krel]] 18:31, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

== P226 used by Lattimer ==

I don't think that is a P226, no takedown lever or decocker, no hammer. --[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 18:07, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

Looks like a Kahr to me in the screencap.

Regards,

Tecolote

:That's what I thought at first, but the grip looks a bit large.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 19:28, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

==Unknown pistol==

Sam's unknown pistol on the main page looks to be a Kahr.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:24, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

on a side note i do not believe that the Sig is a 556SBR because the 556 would take standard AR mags and not the clear ones like the 552 commandos have.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:31, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

Talk:Person of Interest

2011-10-09T01:24:50Z

Spades of Columbia:

==I'm in love with the show and I need help==
I came across this show and I like what I see already. But as always I need help to get this page up to its full potential. So anyone is free to edit, change, add screenshots to make this page better.

== Ending Continuity Error - Pilot ==

At the end of the pilot episode Jim Caviezel tells the cop in the car that he had to shoot the cop in the trunk with his gun. During the shoot out he uses a Glock but when he tells the guy in the car that he used his gun he hands him the S&W. --[[User:Ram229|Ram229]] 19:00, 29 September 2011 (CDT)

It may not be an error, he could have just been lying to the Cop. It fits his other actions. --[[User:Krel|Krel]] 18:31, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

== P226 used by Lattimer ==

I don't think that is a P226, no takedown lever or decocker, no hammer. --[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 18:07, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

Looks like a Kahr to me in the screencap.

Regards,

Tecolote

:That's what I thought at first, but the grip looks a bit large.--[[User:--JazzBlackBelt--|--JazzBlackBelt--]] 19:28, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

==Unknown pistol==

Sam's unknown pistol on the main page looks to be a Kahr.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:24, 8 October 2011 (CDT)

Talk:Jay and Silent Bob Strike Back

2011-10-07T16:36:24Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Not PPKs */

User:Spades of Columbia

2011-09-27T19:09:08Z

Spades of Columbia: /* My Adventure Gear */

Name: Sean

Location: Flathead Valley of Montana (Gateway to Glacier)

Major: Business & Marketing

Occupation: Firearms Dealer/ Have Gun-Will Travel

Hobbies: Hunting, Rafting, Upriver Hiking, camping, shooting, and any other outdoor activity.

Age: 28

==Guns that I own and Build Up==
'''Smith & Wesson M&P15T 5.56x45'''
[[File:SOCM&P15.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*w/ Ziess 3-9x40mm Conquest with Rapid Z - *Ziess marked Warne rings on a GG&G QR base - *Mako Tactical Foregrip with Surefire 6P Defender - *Blackhawk single point sling & Adaptor.]]

'''Kimber Custom Eclipse II 10mm (It's name is Dark Aegis)'''
[[File:SOCkimber.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*Kimpro Black Finish on upper - *Ultra Thin resin coated laminate grips - *MR07 Surefire Rail - *Kimber Ambi-saftey - *Nighthawk Magazine well - *Tripp Research 10rd mags & 9rd mags.]]

'''Springfield Ultra Compact V10 Stainless 1911 .45ACP'''
*Nighthawk SS Magazine Well (it only added 1.5 pounds to my trigger:( )
*4-7rd Wilson Combat mags

'''Smith & Wesson 310NG 10mm'''
[[File:SOCNG10mm.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*soon to have Crimson Trace grips.]]

'''Glock M20C 10mm (I call it "The Hand of God")'''
*Back Grip plug
*Surefire X300 Weapon Light
*5-15rd mags

'''Glock M19 9mm'''
*w/ target sights
*2-33rd mags

'''Ruger Security Six 2 3/4" bbl .357 mag'''
[[File:SOCruger.jpg|thumb|none|700px|]]

'''Ruger Single Six 4 5/8" bbl .32 H&R Mag'''

'''ATI GSG-5 .22lr 16 1/2" bbl'''
*ITAC Holographic Sight

'''CZ 550 American .308 winchester'''
*w/ Sightron SI 3-9x40mm Mil-dot

'''Howa 1500 thumbhole laminate .338 Winchester Mag'''
*w/ Leupold VX-II 3-9x40

'''CZ 452 military Trainer .22lr'''

'''Savage 24 over/under 20ga/30-30win'''
*w/ customize Allen Jimmerson Art lasered into wood stock

'''Mossberg 500 Pistol Grip 18 1/2" bbl 12ga''' (More the Wife's gun then my own)

'''Magnum Research Micro Eagle .380 ACP'''

==My Adventure Gear==
'''2004 Subaru Forrister 2.5XT Turbo'''

'''1998 Land Rover Discovery V8'''

'''Arima Sea Hunter Duel Motor'''

'''13 1/2" Odyssey Sport River Raft'''
*w/ Hard Bottom Floor

Talk:The Postman

2011-09-22T01:19:48Z

Spades of Columbia: /* My thoughts */

==M14==
Isn't that an M1A in the picture? It looks like it was manufactured without a selector switch. The M14 has one above the trigger. It is visible in the pictures of the M14 on the Wikipedia page[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M14_rifle] (including pictures from Operation Iraqi Freedom.) Even if the weapons had their full automatic capability deactivated, there would still be a noticeable hole where the selector switch had been. [[User:Axeman|Axeman]] 04:18, 27 December 2008 (UTC)

== My thoughts ==

To be honest, I didn't think this movie was that bad. Seriously, this movie wasn't as all the negative reviews and the fact it got 5 razzie awards for worst movie of all time in 1997. I think it's an ok movie to watch [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]] 05:37, 4 February 2009 (UTC)

It isn't that bad of a movie. But I think it had the misfortune to come along at the wrong time. The economy was hopping and many people felt like times were great and were going to stay that way (ha!). People weren't in the mood for this type of story. Also Costner's star was setting and critics tend to get pretty nasty when a superstar is fading. In my opinion it's far better than the novel by David Brin.[[User:Jcordell]] 4 February 2009.

:I do however do find the plot to be subpar and not very engaging. It saids nothing on how the US fell, or even how it got rebuilt at the end of the movie. The action was ok for the most of it [[User:Excalibur01|Excalibur01]]

::As an Oregonian, I like the way the movie portrays our neck of the woods as being the center for the resurrection of society ;) -[[User:Anonymous|Anonymous]]

:::I have one question to add, if this film were re-released for today's audiences (given the changes to both our economic situation and the movie-going audiences' expectations as of late), how would it fare with today's audience compared to it's not so successful debut back in 1997? --[[User:ThatoneguyJosh|ThatoneguyJosh]] 14:34, 21 September 2011 (CDT)

I believe if it came out today it would be far more popular...it was just before its time.--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 20:19, 21 September 2011 (CDT)

== Organizing firearms by type ==

I'm just organizing some pages. I'm not changing the text or screencaps, but I'm anal and I am grouping the firearms by type. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 21:42, 9 May 2010 (UTC)

== Is it an M16 with M203 Grenade Launcher or an FAL with Grenade Launcher? ==
One of the Holnist soldiers is armed with what appears to be an M16 with M203 Grenade Launcher.--[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 15:14, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

This appears to be an FAL pattern rifle. You can see the flash suppressor/muzzle brake; it is much longer then the M16s. You can also see the FAL-pattern magazine. Also, there is no gas-block mounted front sight, but I can make out the FAL's front sight mounted at the front of the forward stock. If you examine it closely, I believe an experienced eye will notice these features as well. An M203 can be mounted to an FAL (the M203P1 model), and I assume a Cobray could be as well.SAWGunner89 04:14, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

So opinions. It could be an [[FN FAL]]. Opinions? --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 15:14, 24 July 2010 (UTC)
:I would say use [[Escape from LA]] as a referance but it does look like a FAL.[[User:Rockwolf66|Rockwolf66]] 15:24, 24 July 2010 (UTC)
Okay I'll change it. --[[User:Jcordell|Jcordell]] 15:40, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

== Missing a Shotgun ==

I remember in the scene where they set up an ambush at Elvis and the Old Man is the first to draw his shotgun from inside his coat. Someone should add it to the Shotgun category if they can idetify it.

Talk:Mission: Impossible - Ghost Protocol

2011-09-11T01:47:59Z

Spades of Columbia:

User talk:Toadvine

2011-08-28T00:36:36Z

Spades of Columbia:

==We endeavor to keep an encyclopedic tone==
But per your outburst on the Redacted page, you are reading posts from different members, many of which are from IMFDB members who are 14 years old. Unfortunately we don't have an age restriction, so we get all manners of bizarre posts from members, either foreigners or kids with attitudes. The best pages and words are from older IMFDB members and adults (though a few IMFDB kids are mature enough to be great contributors). Don't smear the entire site because you're reading bizarre comments from (in your words) Punks. Yes, I as a Mod don't approve, but this is a BIG Site with literally HUNDREDS of changes each day by dozens of members. We can't catch all the idiocy that goes on. Some of it isn't caught by Mods or veteran members unless someone points it out to us. Rather than insult the entire site, point out to us what is inappropriate. Be aware that discussion forums are the place for people to post their thoughts, regardless of how ridiculous it may seem. We don't delete that stuff unless it is old news about an already fixed problem, or it violates one of our rules of conduct (threats, vandalism, etc.). Point it out to us so we can delete it. Or edit it as a contributing member of the site. But shouting about what pisses you off about the site, won't help to correct what is wrong with it. [[User:MoviePropMaster2008|MoviePropMaster2008]] 06:50, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Just wondering if you happen to be a Cormac fan?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:36, 27 August 2011 (CDT)

Talk:Southland Tales

2011-08-21T00:36:31Z

Spades of Columbia: Created page with "So does anyone happen to know what kind of pistol that Martin Kefauver((Lou Taylor Pucci)) tried to commit suicide with?--~~~~"

So does anyone happen to know what kind of pistol that Martin Kefauver((Lou Taylor Pucci)) tried to commit suicide with?--[[User:Spades of Columbia|Spades of Columbia]] 19:36, 20 August 2011 (CDT)

User:Spades of Columbia

2011-07-02T19:13:14Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Guns that I own and Build Up */

Name: Sean

Location: Flathead Valley of Montana (Gateway to Glacier)

Major: Business & Marketing

Occupation: Firearms Dealer/ Have Gun-Will Travel

Hobbies: Hunting, Rafting, Upriver Hiking, camping, shooting, and any other outdoor activity.

Age: 28

==Guns that I own and Build Up==
'''Smith & Wesson M&P15T 5.56x45'''
[[File:SOCM&P15.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*w/ Ziess 3-9x40mm Conquest with Rapid Z - *Ziess marked Warne rings on a GG&G QR base - *Mako Tactical Foregrip with Surefire 6P Defender - *Blackhawk single point sling & Adaptor.]]

'''Kimber Custom Eclipse II 10mm (It's name is Dark Aegis)'''
[[File:SOCkimber.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*Kimpro Black Finish on upper - *Ultra Thin resin coated laminate grips - *MR07 Surefire Rail - *Kimber Ambi-saftey - *Nighthawk Magazine well - *Tripp Research 10rd mags & 9rd mags.]]

'''Springfield Ultra Compact V10 Stainless 1911 .45ACP'''
*Nighthawk SS Magazine Well (it only added 1.5 pounds to my trigger:( )
*4-7rd Wilson Combat mags

'''Smith & Wesson 310NG 10mm'''
[[File:SOCNG10mm.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*soon to have Crimson Trace grips.]]

'''Glock M20C 10mm (I call it "The Hand of God")'''
*Back Grip plug
*Surefire X300 Weapon Light
*5-15rd mags

'''Glock M19 9mm'''
*w/ target sights
*2-33rd mags

'''Ruger Security Six 2 3/4" bbl .357 mag'''
[[File:SOCruger.jpg|thumb|none|700px|]]

'''Ruger Single Six 4 5/8" bbl .32 H&R Mag'''

'''ATI GSG-5 .22lr 16 1/2" bbl'''
*ITAC Holographic Sight

'''CZ 550 American .308 winchester'''
*w/ Sightron SI 3-9x40mm Mil-dot

'''Howa 1500 thumbhole laminate .338 Winchester Mag'''
*w/ Leupold VX-II 3-9x40

'''CZ 452 military Trainer .22lr'''

'''Savage 24 over/under 20ga/30-30win'''
*w/ customize Allen Jimmerson Art lasered into wood stock

'''Mossberg 500 Pistol Grip 18 1/2" bbl 12ga''' (More the Wife's gun then my own)

'''Magnum Research Micro Eagle .380 ACP'''

==My Adventure Gear==
'''1998 Land Rover Discovery V8'''

'''Arima Sea Hunter Duel Motor'''

'''13 1/2" Odyssey Sport River Raft'''
*w/ Hard Bottom Floor

User:Spades of Columbia

2011-07-01T14:51:57Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Guns that I own and Build Up */

Name: Sean

Location: Flathead Valley of Montana (Gateway to Glacier)

Major: Business & Marketing

Occupation: Firearms Dealer/ Have Gun-Will Travel

Hobbies: Hunting, Rafting, Upriver Hiking, camping, shooting, and any other outdoor activity.

Age: 28

==Guns that I own and Build Up==
'''Smith & Wesson M&P15T 5.56x45'''
[[File:SOCM&P15.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*w/ Ziess 3-9x40mm Conquest with Rapid Z - *Ziess marked Warne rings on a GG&G QR base - *Mako Tactical Foregrip with Surefire 6P Defender - *Blackhawk single point sling & Adaptor.]]

'''Kimber Custom Eclipse II 10mm'''
[[File:SOCkimber.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*Kimpro Black Finish on upper - *Ultra Thin resin coated laminate grips - *MR07 Surefire Rail - *Kimber Ambi-saftey - *Nighthawk Magazine well - *Tripp Research 10rd mags & 9rd mags.]]

'''Springfield Ultra Compact V10 Stainless 1911 .45ACP'''
*Nighthawk SS Magazine Well (it only added 1.5 pounds to my trigger:( )
*4-7rd Wilson Combat mags

'''Smith & Wesson 310NG 10mm'''
[[File:SOCNG10mm.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*soon to have Crimson Trace grips.]]

'''Glock M20C 10mm'''
*Back Grip plug
*Surefire X300 Weapon Light
*5-15rd mags

'''Glock M19 9mm'''
*w/ target sights
*2-33rd mags

'''Ruger Security Six 2 3/4" bbl .357 mag'''
[[File:SOCruger.jpg|thumb|none|700px|]]

'''Ruger Single Six 4 5/8" bbl .32 H&R Mag'''

'''ATI GSG-5 .22lr 16 1/2" bbl'''
*ITAC Holographic Sight

'''CZ 550 American .308 winchester'''
*w/ Sightron SI 3-9x40mm Mil-dot

'''Howa 1500 thumbhole laminate .338 Winchester Mag'''
*w/ Leupold VX-II 3-9x40

'''CZ 452 military Trainer .22lr'''

'''Savage 24 over/under 20ga/30-30win'''
*w/ customize Allen Jimmerson Art lasered into wood stock

'''Mossberg 500 Pistol Grip 18 1/2" bbl 12ga''' (More the Wife's gun then my own)

'''Magnum Research Micro Eagle .380 ACP'''

==My Adventure Gear==
'''1998 Land Rover Discovery V8'''

'''Arima Sea Hunter Duel Motor'''

'''13 1/2" Odyssey Sport River Raft'''
*w/ Hard Bottom Floor

User:Spades of Columbia

2011-06-16T22:08:51Z

Spades of Columbia:

Name: Sean

Location: Flathead Valley of Montana (Gateway to Glacier)

Major: Business & Marketing

Occupation: Firearms Dealer/ Have Gun-Will Travel

Hobbies: Hunting, Rafting, Upriver Hiking, camping, shooting, and any other outdoor activity.

Age: 28

==Guns that I own and Build Up==
'''Smith & Wesson M&P15T 5.56x45'''
[[File:SOCM&P15.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*w/ Ziess 3-9x40mm Conquest with Rapid Z - *Ziess marked Warne rings on a GG&G QR base - *Mako Tactical Foregrip with Surefire 6P Defender - *Blackhawk single point sling & Adaptor.]]

'''Kimber Custom Eclipse II 10mm'''
[[File:SOCkimber.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*Kimpro Black Finish on upper - *Ultra Thin resin coated laminate grips - *MR07 Surefire Rail - *Kimber Ambi-saftey - *Nighthawk Magazine well - *Tripp Research 10rd mags & 9rd mags.]]

'''Springfield Ultra Compact V10 Stainless 1911 .45ACP'''
*Nighthawk SS Magazine Well (it only added 1.5 pounds to my trigger:( )
*4-7rd Wilson Combat mags

'''Smith & Wesson 310NG 10mm'''
[[File:SOCNG10mm.jpg|thumb|none|700px|*soon to have Crimson Trace grips.]]

'''Glock M29 10mm'''
*Exended Back Grip plug
*Surefire X300 Weapon Light
*4-15rd mags

'''Glock M19 9mm'''
*w/ target sights
*2-33rd mags

'''Ruger Security Six 2 3/4" bbl .357 mag'''
[[File:SOCruger.jpg|thumb|none|700px|]]

'''Ruger Single Six 4 5/8" bbl .32 H&R Mag'''

'''ATI GSG-5 .22lr 16 1/2" bbl'''
*ITAC Holographic Sight

'''CZ 550 American .308 winchester'''
*w/ Sightron SI 3-9x40mm Mil-dot

'''Howa 1500 thumbhole laminate .338 Winchester Mag'''
*w/ Leupold VX-II 3-9x40

'''CZ 452 military Trainer .22lr'''

'''Savage 24 over/under 20ga/30-30win'''
*w/ customize Allen Jimmerson Art lasered into wood stock

'''Mossberg 500 Pistol Grip 18 1/2" bbl 12ga''' (More the Wife's gun then my own)

'''Magnum Research Micro Eagle .380 ACP'''

==My Adventure Gear==
'''1998 Land Rover Discovery V8'''

'''Arima Sea Hunter Duel Motor'''

'''13 1/2" Odyssey Sport River Raft'''
*w/ Hard Bottom Floor

User:Spades of Columbia

2011-05-25T15:44:30Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Guns that I own and Build Up */

Name: Sean

Location: Flathead Valley of Montana (Gateway to Glacier)

Major: Business & Marketing

Occupation: Firearms Dealer/ Have Gun-Will Travel

Hobbies: Hunting, Rafting, Upriver Hiking, camping, shooting, and any other outdoor activity.

Age: 27

==Guns that I own and Build Up==
'''Smith & Wesson M&P15T 5.56x45'''
[[File:SOCM&P15.jpg]]
*w/ Ziess 3-9x40mm Conquest with Rapid Z
*Ziess marked Warne rings on a GG&G QR base
*Mako Tactical Foregrip with Surefire 6P Defender
*Blackhawk single point sling & Adaptor

'''Kimber Custom Eclipse II 10mm'''
[[File:SOCkimber.jpg]]
*Kimpro Black Finish on upper
*Ultra Thin resin coated laminate grips
*MR07 Surefire Rail
*Kimber Ambi-saftey
*Nighthawk Magazine well
*Tripp Research 10rd mags & 9rd mags

'''Springfield Ultra Compact V10 Stainless 1911 .45ACP'''
*Nighthawk SS Magazine Well (it only added 1.5 pounds to my trigger:( )
*4-7rd Wilson Combat mags

'''Smith & Wesson 310NG 10mm'''
[[File:SOCNG10mm.jpg]]
*soon to have Crimson Trace grips

'''Glock M29 10mm'''
*Exended Back Grip plug
*Surefire X300 Weapon Light
*4-15rd mags

'''Glock M19 9mm'''
*w/ target sights
*2-33rd mags

'''Ruger Security Six 2 3/4" bbl .357 mag'''
[[File:SOCruger.jpg]]
'''Ruger Single Six 4 5/8" bbl .32 H&R Mag'''

'''ATI GSG-5 .22lr 16 1/2" bbl'''
*ITAC Holographic Sight

'''CZ 550 American .308 winchester'''
*w/ Sightron SI 3-9x40mm Mil-dot

'''Howa 1500 thumbhole laminate .338 Winchester Mag'''
*w/ Leupold VX-II 3-9x40

'''CZ 452 military Trainer .22lr'''

'''Savage 24 over/under 20ga/30-30win'''
*w/ customize Allen Jimmerson Art lasered into wood stock

'''Mossberg 500 Pistol Grip 18 1/2" bbl 12ga''' (More the Wife's gun then my own)

'''Magnum Research Micro Eagle .380 ACP'''

==My Adventure Gear==
'''1998 Land Rover Discovery V8'''

'''Arima Sea Hunter Duel Motor'''

'''13 1/2" Odyssey Sport River Raft'''
*w/ Hard Bottom Floor

File:SOCNG10mm.jpg

2011-05-25T15:42:40Z

Spades of Columbia:

User:Spades of Columbia

2011-05-25T15:41:24Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Guns that I own and Build Up */

Name: Sean

Location: Flathead Valley of Montana (Gateway to Glacier)

Major: Business & Marketing

Occupation: Firearms Dealer/ Have Gun-Will Travel

Hobbies: Hunting, Rafting, Upriver Hiking, camping, shooting, and any other outdoor activity.

Age: 27

==Guns that I own and Build Up==
'''Smith & Wesson M&P15T 5.56x45'''
[[File:SOCM&P15.jpg]]
*w/ Ziess 3-9x40mm Conquest with Rapid Z
*Ziess marked Warne rings on a GG&G QR base
*Mako Tactical Foregrip with Surefire 6P Defender
*Blackhawk single point sling & Adaptor

'''Kimber Custom Eclipse II 10mm'''
[[File:SOCkimber.jpg]]
*Kimpro Black Finish on upper
*Ultra Thin resin coated laminate grips
*MR07 Surefire Rail
*Kimber Ambi-saftey
*Nighthawk Magazine well
*Tripp Research 10rd mags & 9rd mags

'''Springfield Ultra Compact V10 Stainless 1911 .45ACP'''
*Nighthawk SS Magazine Well (it only added 1.5 pounds to my trigger:( )
*4-7rd Wilson Combat mags

'''Smith & Wesson 310NG 10mm'''
*soon to have Crimson Trace grips

'''Glock M29 10mm'''
*Exended Back Grip plug
*Surefire X300 Weapon Light
*4-15rd mags

'''Glock M19 9mm'''
*w/ target sights
*2-33rd mags

'''Ruger Security Six 2 3/4" bbl .357 mag'''
[[File:SOCruger.jpg]]
'''Ruger Single Six 4 5/8" bbl .32 H&R Mag'''

'''ATI GSG-5 .22lr 16 1/2" bbl'''
*ITAC Holographic Sight

'''CZ 550 American .308 winchester'''
*w/ Sightron SI 3-9x40mm Mil-dot

'''Howa 1500 thumbhole laminate .338 Winchester Mag'''
*w/ Leupold VX-II 3-9x40

'''CZ 452 military Trainer .22lr'''

'''Savage 24 over/under 20ga/30-30win'''
*w/ customize Allen Jimmerson Art lasered into wood stock

'''Mossberg 500 Pistol Grip 18 1/2" bbl 12ga''' (More the Wife's gun then my own)

'''Magnum Research Micro Eagle .380 ACP'''

==My Adventure Gear==
'''1998 Land Rover Discovery V8'''

'''Arima Sea Hunter Duel Motor'''

'''13 1/2" Odyssey Sport River Raft'''
*w/ Hard Bottom Floor

File:SOCruger.jpg

2011-05-25T15:40:28Z

Spades of Columbia:

User:Spades of Columbia

2011-05-25T15:37:42Z

Spades of Columbia: /* Guns that I own and Build Up */

Name: Sean

Location: Flathead Valley of Montana (Gateway to Glacier)

Major: Business & Marketing

Occupation: Firearms Dealer/ Have Gun-Will Travel

Hobbies: Hunting, Rafting, Upriver Hiking, camping, shooting, and any other outdoor activity.

Age: 27

==Guns that I own and Build Up==
'''Smith & Wesson M&P15T 5.56x45'''
[[File:SOCM&P15.jpg]]
*w/ Ziess 3-9x40mm Conquest with Rapid Z
*Ziess marked Warne rings on a GG&G QR base
*Mako Tactical Foregrip with Surefire 6P Defender
*Blackhawk single point sling & Adaptor

'''Kimber Custom Eclipse II 10mm'''
[[File:SOCkimber.jpg]]
*Kimpro Black Finish on upper
*Ultra Thin resin coated laminate grips
*MR07 Surefire Rail
*Kimber Ambi-saftey
*Nighthawk Magazine well
*Tripp Research 10rd mags & 9rd mags

'''Springfield Ultra Compact V10 Stainless 1911 .45ACP'''
*Nighthawk SS Magazine Well (it only added 1.5 pounds to my trigger:( )
*4-7rd Wilson Combat mags

'''Smith & Wesson 310NG 10mm'''
*soon to have Crimson Trace grips

'''Glock M29 10mm'''
*Exended Back Grip plug
*Surefire X300 Weapon Light
*4-15rd mags

'''Glock M19 9mm'''
*w/ target sights
*2-33rd mags

'''Ruger Security Six 2 3/4" bbl .357 mag'''

'''Ruger Single Six 4 5/8" bbl .32 H&R Mag'''

'''ATI GSG-5 .22lr 16 1/2" bbl'''
*ITAC Holographic Sight

'''CZ 550 American .308 winchester'''
*w/ Sightron SI 3-9x40mm Mil-dot

'''Howa 1500 thumbhole laminate .338 Winchester Mag'''
*w/ Leupold VX-II 3-9x40

'''CZ 452 military Trainer .22lr'''

'''Savage 24 over/under 20ga/30-30win'''
*w/ customize Allen Jimmerson Art lasered into wood stock

'''Mossberg 500 Pistol Grip 18 1/2" bbl 12ga''' (More the Wife's gun then my own)

'''Magnum Research Micro Eagle .380 ACP'''

==My Adventure Gear==
'''1998 Land Rover Discovery V8'''

'''Arima Sea Hunter Duel Motor'''

'''13 1/2" Odyssey Sport River Raft'''
*w/ Hard Bottom Floor